I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 21:00:27 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?


By Bog-Standard I expect you don't mean a TRV.
So given that, what do you mean by a "top" and how do they differ from
a knob. Is a "cap" the plastic part that makes a valve into a lock
shield valve?



--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

In message , Graham.
writes
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 21:00:27 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?


By Bog-Standard I expect you don't mean a TRV.

No, it's the simple, old-fashioned, turn-it-yourself valve.

So given that, what do you mean by a "top" and how do they differ from
a knob. Is a "cap" the plastic part that makes a valve into a lock
shield valve?

Most sites call caps 'caps', but I think I've seen one or two refer to
them as 'tops' or 'covers' (like this)
http://www.screwfix.com/p/universal-...te-finish-25mm
/35656
which isn't what I want. I want a knob (about a dozen), like the one on
this valve:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/angled-radiator-valve-chrome-15mm-x/33920
Hen's teeth seem two-a-penny compared with knobs.
--
Ian

I've been looking for one that is basically an outside plastic bit and an
inside plastic bit. the outer bit screws into the valve and the inner bit
has a serrated hole with a metal bit across that fits into a slot in the
valve.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Graham." wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 21:00:27 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?


By Bog-Standard I expect you don't mean a TRV.
So given that, what do you mean by a "top" and how do they differ from
a knob. Is a "cap" the plastic part that makes a valve into a lock
shield valve?



--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 21:48:03 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

In message , Graham.
writes
On Sat, 1 Dec 2012 21:00:27 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?


By Bog-Standard I expect you don't mean a TRV.

No, it's the simple, old-fashioned, turn-it-yourself valve.

So given that, what do you mean by a "top" and how do they differ from
a knob. Is a "cap" the plastic part that makes a valve into a lock
shield valve?

Most sites call caps 'caps', but I think I've seen one or two refer to
them as 'tops' or 'covers' (like this)
http://www.screwfix.com/p/universal-...te-finish-25mm
/35656
which isn't what I want. I want a knob (about a dozen), like the one on
this valve:
http://www.screwfix.com/p/angled-radiator-valve-chrome-15mm-x/33920
Hen's teeth seem two-a-penny compared with knobs.

Admittedly a few years ago, but I got some packs of two universal
knobs from Wilkinson's.
Each knob came with a selection of metal inserts to fit most valve
spindles.
I think I had to take a file to one of the inserts to make it fit my
valves.

--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On Dec 1, 9:00*pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

In message
,
harry writes
On Dec 1, 9:00*pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

My CH system is around 40 years old. The plastic radiator knobs are
hollow, and like many plastic mouldings, seem to be purposely designed
to break or split if extra force is needed to turn them - as will often
happen if a valve hasn't been used for some time, and is stiff (or even
completely seized).

The simple cure (preferably pre-emptive) is remove each knob, and make
it into a hard, solid lump by filling the void with resin. After that,
the knob is virtually bomb-proof (even for the most ham-fisted of us who
don't recognise a seized valve when they feel one).

However, some of my split knobs - although now repaired - are rather
tatty. While I could tart them up with resin, paint them, and make them
look like new, there's little point in doing this if I can get some
suitable replacements. I can't believe that it's so difficult (if not
impossible) to find a supplier. Surely I can't be the only one whose
radiator valve knobs are broken or missing?
--
Ian

On 02/12/2012 08:55, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message
,
harry writes
On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

The square ones are rare, most have a rectangular fitting maybe 2mm x 6mm?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

In message , The Medway Handyman
writes
On 02/12/2012 08:55, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message
,
harry writes
On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

The square ones are rare, most have a rectangular fitting maybe 2mm x 6mm?

Yes, you may be right (presumably like this one).
http://www.cnmonline.co.uk/product.p...d=30956&utm_so
urce=google&utm_medium=base&utm_campaign=froogle&g clid=CKHX1Ia3-7MCFebLtA
odTWgAqw
I'd assumed that 1/4" was the standard.

Also, I'm beginning to wonder if 'cap' is the correct name for what
ordinary mortals would call a 'knob'. I would have thought that a cap
went at the other end of the radiator from the end where the knob was -
but I see that some so-called 'caps' appear to be meant to be turned
(and not just cover the end of the spindle). What is correct?
--
Ian

On 02/12/2012 09:49, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , The Medway Handyman
writes
On 02/12/2012 08:55, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message
,
harry writes
On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog
standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete
valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

The square ones are rare, most have a rectangular fitting maybe 2mm x
6mm?

Yes, you may be right (presumably like this one).
http://www.cnmonline.co.uk/product.p...d=30956&utm_so
urce=google&utm_medium=base&utm_campaign=froogle&g clid=CKHX1Ia3-7MCFebLtA
odTWgAqw
I'd assumed that 1/4" was the standard.

Also, I'm beginning to wonder if 'cap' is the correct name for what
ordinary mortals would call a 'knob'. I would have thought that a cap
went at the other end of the radiator from the end where the knob was -
but I see that some so-called 'caps' appear to be meant to be turned
(and not just cover the end of the spindle). What is correct?

I would go see a plumber that does central heating and maybe he will get
you some when he does an install from the old stuff.

On Dec 2, 8:55*am, Ian Jackson
wrote:
In message
,
harry writes

On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

My CH system is around 40 years old. The plastic radiator knobs are
hollow, and like many plastic mouldings, seem to be purposely designed
to break or split if extra force is needed to turn them - as will often
happen if a valve hasn't been used for some time, and is stiff (or even
completely seized).

The simple cure (preferably pre-emptive) is remove each knob, and make
it into a hard, solid lump by filling the void with resin. After that,
the knob is virtually bomb-proof (even for the most ham-fisted of us who
don't recognise a seized valve when they feel one).

However, some of my split knobs - although now repaired - are rather
tatty. While I could tart them up with resin, paint them, and make them
look like new, there's little point in doing this if I can get some
suitable replacements. I can't believe that it's so difficult (if not
impossible) to find a supplier. Surely I can't be the only one whose
radiator valve knobs are broken or missing?
--
Ian

Well you should be thinking about getting thermostatic valves.
They are not perfect but better than nothing.
Stuff is not made to fix these days.
40 year old valves will long have been superceded by a cheaper and
nastier design.

On Dec 2, 9:49*am, Ian Jackson
wrote:
In message , The Medway Handyman
writes







On 02/12/2012 08:55, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message
,
harry writes
On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

The square ones are rare, most have a rectangular fitting maybe 2mm x 6mm?

Yes, you may be right (presumably like this one).
http://www.cnmonline.co.uk/product.p...d=30956&utm_so
urce=google&utm_medium=base&utm_campaign=froogle&g clid=CKHX1Ia3-7MCFebLtA
odTWgAqw
I'd assumed that 1/4" was the standard.

Also, I'm beginning to wonder if 'cap' is the correct name for what
ordinary mortals would call a 'knob'. I would have thought that a cap
went at the other end of the radiator from the end where the knob was -
but I see that some so-called 'caps' appear to be meant to be turned
(and not just cover the end of the spindle). What is correct?
--
Ian

The valve with the cap is a lockshield valve intended to balance the
system only not for general use.

In message
,
harry writes



The valve with the cap is a lockshield valve intended to balance the
system only not for general use.

I know. I want the knobs for the valve at t'other end of the radiator.
However, some of the website pictures of caps look as if they could
multitask as knobs.

As my 1/4"square spindles would appear to be old hat, I'll probably have
to resign myself to refurbishing the existing knobs. No great problem,
but I'm amazed at the non-availability of such mundane items.
--
Ian

"harry" wrote in message
...
On Dec 2, 8:55 am, Ian Jackson
wrote:
In message
,
harry writes

On Dec 1, 9:00 pm, Ian Jackson
wrote:
I'm having great difficulty in finding anywhere that sells bog standard
knobs for bog standard radiator valves. Caps/tops - loads of them, but
of knobs there is no sign. Surely you don't have to buy a complete
valve
in order to get a knob? Can anyone advise?
--
Ian

You'll probably have to make/modify one.
As many are imported, they are all different nowadays.
You will be lucky to find an identical valve to the one you've got
even to buy the whole thing.

I pretty sure that an 'ordinary' radiator valve is (or used to be)
pretty well standard, with a 1/4" square spindle. I think that most
'ordinary' knobs will fit.

My CH system is around 40 years old. The plastic radiator knobs are
hollow, and like many plastic mouldings, seem to be purposely designed
to break or split if extra force is needed to turn them - as will often
happen if a valve hasn't been used for some time, and is stiff (or even
completely seized).

The simple cure (preferably pre-emptive) is remove each knob, and make
it into a hard, solid lump by filling the void with resin. After that,
the knob is virtually bomb-proof (even for the most ham-fisted of us who
don't recognise a seized valve when they feel one).

However, some of my split knobs - although now repaired - are rather
tatty. While I could tart them up with resin, paint them, and make them
look like new, there's little point in doing this if I can get some
suitable replacements. I can't believe that it's so difficult (if not
impossible) to find a supplier. Surely I can't be the only one whose
radiator valve knobs are broken or missing?
--
Ian

Well you should be thinking about getting thermostatic valves.
They are not perfect but better than nothing.
Stuff is not made to fix these days.
40 year old valves will long have been superceded by a cheaper and
nastier design.

It this what you're looking for
http://www.radiatorcaps.org.uk/shop/...EE&shop_param=

In message
,
harry writes




Well you should be thinking about getting thermostatic valves.
They are not perfect but better than nothing.

I do have one (in an extension containing a toilet and shower). It seems
to work OK. As for the others, the system seems satisfactory as it is.
It's a case of 'if it ain't broke' etc.

Stuff is not made to fix these days.

Replacing tatty radiator knobs hardly counts as 'fixing'. It should be a
two-minute job.

40 year old valves will long have been superceded by a cheaper and
nastier design.

Apart from occasionally checking that they haven't seized, and aren't
weeping (which a bit of re-packing with hemp garden string fixes), the
valves are probably just as good as the day they were made. All they
could do with is a few new knobs! Maybe Santa Claus knows where to get
some?
--
Ian

In message , Wesley
writes





It this what you're looking for
http://www.radiatorcaps.org.uk/shop/...B5zn0owADeqMXk
kARlPi1lDSFJ6lMI0QZw7e2vjrqdXPvD0UVXm3viEE&shop_p aram=

Ummmmmm....

Thanks for the info. That was one of the sites I saw a reference to
yesterday. I was trying to find it but, for some reason, it didn't come
up.

I have to admit that I'm a little confused between the differences
between 'Lockshield' and 'Wheelhead'. Do these terms refer to two
different types of valves - or is it just their function? I'm pretty
sure that my valves are both the exactly same, with one being used
essentially as a day-to-day, manually adjustable 'on-off' valve, and the
other being permanently set so as to limit the maximum flow of water.
With the latter, the cap is just a dome which just sits on top of the
spindle, and doesn't engage the square part. It if you slightly slacken
the screw which holds it on, it simply rotates, and doesn't turn the
spindle. Any adjustments must be made with a 1/4" spanner on the
spindle, before the cap is fitted.

The instructions for the Radcaps caps are a bit strange, but reading
between the lines, it would seem that the only difference between the
ends of the radiator is that you don't use the screw and allen key on
the Lockshield end. I wonder what keeps the cap at the Lockshield end
on?

I also note that the cap has a 8mm x 5mm slot. I suppose that this might
be OK for a 1/4" square spindle - although it would be gripped only on
the two opposing 5mm sides - and as 5mm = only 0.196", it would
certainly be a pretty firm grip (possibly guaranteed to crack hard
plastic).

To be honest, I'm simply not sure about these caps.
--
Ian

En el artículo , Ian Jackson
escribió:

which isn't what I want. I want a knob (about a dozen), like the one on
this valve:

My local independent DIY store does them, so they can't be that rare.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 17:44:39 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

snip
The instructions for the Radcaps caps are a bit strange,

agreed

I also note that the cap has a 8mm x 5mm slot. I suppose that this might
be OK for a 1/4" square spindle - although it would be gripped only on
the two opposing 5mm sides - and as 5mm = only 0.196", it would
certainly be a pretty firm grip (possibly guaranteed to crack hard
plastic).

These show "assorted spindle drivers" but are dearer than complete
valves.
http://www.inest.co.uk/products/Orac...ator_Cap.a sp

In message , Geo
writes
On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 17:44:39 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

snip
The instructions for the Radcaps caps are a bit strange,

agreed

I also note that the cap has a 8mm x 5mm slot. I suppose that this might
be OK for a 1/4" square spindle - although it would be gripped only on
the two opposing 5mm sides - and as 5mm = only 0.196", it would
certainly be a pretty firm grip (possibly guaranteed to crack hard
plastic).

These show "assorted spindle drivers" but are dearer than complete
valves.
http://www.inest.co.uk/products/Orac...placement_Radi
ator_Cap.asp

Dearer indeed. You can nearly get a new radiator for what they are
charging!

Thanks to all for the advice and information, but it looks like I've got
myself a nice, gentle Christmas project, repairing and tarting up the
old knobs one by one.
--
Ian

On Monday, December 3, 2012 at 10:20:26 PM UTC, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , Geo
writes
On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 17:44:39 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

snip
The instructions for the Radcaps caps are a bit strange,

agreed

I also note that the cap has a 8mm x 5mm slot. I suppose that this might
be OK for a 1/4" square spindle - although it would be gripped only on
the two opposing 5mm sides - and as 5mm = only 0.196", it would
certainly be a pretty firm grip (possibly guaranteed to crack hard
plastic).

These show "assorted spindle drivers" but are dearer than complete
valves.
http://www.inest.co.uk/products/Orac...placement_Radi
ator_Cap.asp

Dearer indeed. You can nearly get a new radiator for what they are
charging!

Thanks to all for the advice and information, but it looks like I've got
myself a nice, gentle Christmas project, repairing and tarting up the
old knobs one by one.
--
Ian

I know what you mean. How can it be so difficult to find these things?

On Sat, 21 Nov 2015 12:43:45 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Monday, December 3, 2012 at 10:20:26 PM UTC, Ian Jackson wrote:
In message , Geo
writes
On Sun, 2 Dec 2012 17:44:39 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:

snip
The instructions for the Radcaps caps are a bit strange,

agreed

I also note that the cap has a 8mm x 5mm slot. I suppose that this might
be OK for a 1/4" square spindle - although it would be gripped only on
the two opposing 5mm sides - and as 5mm = only 0.196", it would
certainly be a pretty firm grip (possibly guaranteed to crack hard
plastic).

These show "assorted spindle drivers" but are dearer than complete
valves.
http://www.inest.co.uk/products/Orac...placement_Radi
ator_Cap.asp

Dearer indeed. You can nearly get a new radiator for what they are
charging!

Thanks to all for the advice and information, but it looks like I've got
myself a nice, gentle Christmas project, repairing and tarting up the
old knobs one by one.
--
Ian

I know what you mean. How can it be so difficult to find these things?

That "Oracstar" product looks identical to the Wilco branded product a
bought in Wikinsons that I mentioned in this thread three years ago(!)
The Wilkinsons price was nothing like that of course.



--

Graham.

%Profound_observation%

For the record Wheelhead and Lockshield have identical valves, normally have different caps (Wheelhead designed to turn, Lockshield design not to).

The Wheelhead valve is the one on the pipe that gets hot first when you turn the system on.

Replacement caps do seem to be exorbitantly expensive.

On 05/11/2017 16:40, Phil wrote:
The Wheelhead valve is the one on the pipe that gets hot first when you turn the system on.

That is not always the case.

--
Mike Clarke

Mike Clarke wrote in
news
On 05/11/2017 16:40, Phil wrote:
The Wheelhead valve is the one on the pipe that gets hot first when
you turn the system on.

That is not always the case.


Should be - perhaps the knobs have been wrongly fitted. Lockshield
adjustment should be on the return.

On 06/11/2017 09:43, DerbyBorn wrote:
Should be - perhaps the knobs have been wrongly fitted. Lockshield
adjustment should be on the return.

Is there any reason other than that it's the conventional way?

--
Mike Clarke

DerbyBorn wrote:

Lockshield adjustment should be on the return.

That's the usual way, but does the water care? Even some TRVs allow
"reverse" flow, though they might be a bit noisier that way.