What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

TIA

On Oct 21, 4:23*pm, Dave wrote:
What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

TIA

Best is a nice warm sweater. I just use a 2KW electric convector
heater to top up the warmth in my home office when the heating in the
rest of the house is off. I imagine an oil filled radiator would be an
even better choice.

As it is a very small room it only takes a couple of minutes to take
the edge off of the cold (and the IT equipment keeps it pretty warm
except when it is really cold outside).

Philip

In article
,
writes

Best is a nice warm sweater. I just use a 2KW electric convector
heater to top up the warmth in my home office when the heating in the
rest of the house is off. I imagine an oil filled radiator would be an
even better choice.

As it is a very small room it only takes a couple of minutes to take
the edge off of the cold (and the IT equipment keeps it pretty warm
except when it is really cold outside).

Agreed although I found 2kW a bit aggressive in a small room so I
disconnected one of the 2 x 1Kw elements in it. Get one with a
thermostat.

I've also found that convector heat can be a bit eye drying, so again I
agree that an oil filled thermostatic radiator could be better.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

wrote:

Best is a nice warm sweater...

And regular cups of hot tea, which encourgaes one to get away from the
screen and bend & stretch a bit.

Heat-wise I find that my feet tend to get cold down under a desk; last year
I bought a think like a cross between a furry wellington boot and an
electric blanket. It's a single boot into which you tuck both feet (so be
careful when you stand up and try to walk away!) and it's heated. On cold
days it's really good.

You do have to be careful if you've numb feet and can't tell how hot such a
device is.

--
Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Email sent to my from-address will be deleted. Instead, please reply
to replacing "aaa" by "284".

On 21/10/2011 16:23, Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

I use a thick pullover and a halogen radiant heater. It is me that needs
to be warm, not the room.

Colin Bignell

In article ,
Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

2KW Electric fan heater with a thermostat... Well, works for me until
it's properly cold enough to light the stove.

Just bought one from the local hardware store for a tenner. (well, £9.95)

Gordon

Jeremy Nicoll - news posts wrote:

wrote:

Best is a nice warm sweater...

And regular cups of hot tea, which encourgaes one to get away from the
screen and bend & stretch a bit.

And another advantage of that is that a room that feels chilly when you're
just sitting in it quite often feels warm if you've gone away and wandered
in a coller part of the house and come back to it - I've noticed this quite
often with eg the lounge after several hours in front of the TV with a gas
fire blazing away...

--
Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Email sent to my from-address will be deleted. Instead, please reply
to replacing "aaa" by "284".

Dave was thinking very hard :

What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

TIA

Cheapest would be an oil filled, thermostatically controlled, electric
radiator, or just a none oil filled one mounted on a wall - if floor
space is important.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

On 21/10/2011 16:57, Huge wrote:
On 2011-10-21, wrote:
On 21/10/2011 16:23, Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

I use a thick pullover and a halogen radiant heater. It is me that needs
to be warm, not the room.

I use a thick pullover and a cheapo 2kW fan heater from Sainsers, if
required. Which it isn't at the moment. Radiant heaters are all very
well on average, but half of you is scorched and half cold.

You need a swivel chair and a laptop ;-)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Dave wrote:
I assume that the
way NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn
down (or off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

Why not?

--
Adam

In article ,
Dave writes:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

As just mentioned in the "Reverse Air con" thread, I use an aircon
unit in heating mode. It will have the cheapest running costs, but
probably the most expensive installation costs. Also, they tend to
be quite powerful, so might not suit a small room.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.

--
*That's it! I‘m calling grandma!

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 21/10/2011 19:05, ARWadsworth wrote:
Dave wrote:
I assume that the
way NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn
down (or off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?
Why not?

Guessing the boiler would be cycling on and off a lot if just heating
one radiator, our boiler modulates down to 12kw and if it runs just one
radiator it goes on/off/on/off a lot.

--
David

In article ,
says...

In article ,
Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.

Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)

On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 16:23:25 +0100, Dave wrote:

What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room?

More clothes...

I assume that the way NOT to do it is have the full house central
heating on and turn down (or off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

Is your current room stat a single temperature one? If so swapping it
for a programmable one and setting it to say 18C during the day, 12C
at night and 20C for the evenings. With an oil filled electric rad,
with a stat, to top up your work room. You'll never turn down TRVs in
every room, every working day and them back up again it'll be too
much of a chore. Let a programmable stat to it for you. B-)

Remember that you may be "working" but you will be using the rest of
the house a little, like the kitchen to make your lunch, dining or
living room to eat it or just have a break and the loo of course.
Having the rest of the house cool too much wouldn't be comfortable.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall

Not normally they don't produce enough fumes to be a problem but for
every kg of gas they burn they produce a kg of water vapour. So even
if they don't need a great deal of ventilation for combustion air
they need it to get rid of the moisture.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave wrote:
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then! *
:-)

Donkey's years ago I converted my cellar into a basement office, I
have
a small plug-in oil rad on it's almost lowest setting that I turn on
if
I need it. Usually, the computer kit keeps the place ticking over,
such
that I notice the bedroom is quite cold when I go in there.

JGH

Dave wrote:

What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

TIA

Dave: dont even try. If you have you, a couple of computers a router and
a printer in it a and a couple of lights on, provided its insulated it
will be the warmest room in the house.

Have a little electric fan heater for those -15c days that global
warming predicts will become more frequent.

Any attempt to use 'rest of house' heating will almost certainly use
MORE fuel than the cost of the electricity.

Another possibility is to install a wood burning stove to use up all the
waste paper people send you through the post marked 'HM customs and
Excise' 'Inland Revenue - Final demand'.

Make every day a red-letter day, burn all the post. If they cant email
you, they can **** off.

John Rumm wrote:
On 21/10/2011 16:57, Huge wrote:
On 2011-10-21, wrote:
On 21/10/2011 16:23, Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up
as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down
(or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

I use a thick pullover and a halogen radiant heater. It is me that needs
to be warm, not the room.

I use a thick pullover and a cheapo 2kW fan heater from Sainsers, if
required. Which it isn't at the moment. Radiant heaters are all very
well on average, but half of you is scorched and half cold.

You need a swivel chair and a laptop ;-)


****, if you have a laptop stay in bed!

On 22/10/2011 00:17, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
John Rumm wrote:
On 21/10/2011 16:57, Huge wrote:
On 2011-10-21, wrote:
On 21/10/2011 16:23, Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up
as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn
down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has
the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

I use a thick pullover and a halogen radiant heater. It is me that
needs
to be warm, not the room.

I use a thick pullover and a cheapo 2kW fan heater from Sainsers, if
required. Which it isn't at the moment. Radiant heaters are all very
well on average, but half of you is scorched and half cold.

You need a swivel chair and a laptop ;-)


****, if you have a laptop stay in bed!

If you are staying in bed, forget the laptop and do the other thing you
suggest ;-)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Oct 21, 8:44*pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2011 16:23:25 +0100, Dave wrote:
What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room?

More clothes...

I assume that the way NOT to do it is have the full house central
heating on and turn down (or off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

Is your current room stat a single temperature one? If so swapping it
for a programmable one and setting it to say 18C during the day, 12C
at night and 20C for the evenings. With an oil filled electric rad,
with a stat, to top up your work room. You'll never turn down TRVs in
every room, every working day and them back up again it'll be too
much of a chore. Let a programmable stat to it for you. *B-)

Remember that you may be "working" but you will be using the rest of
the house a little, like the kitchen to make your lunch, dining or
living room to eat it or just have a break and the loo of course.
Having the rest of the house cool too much wouldn't be comfortable.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall

Not normally they don't produce enough fumes to be a problem but for
every kg of gas they burn they produce a kg of water vapour. So even
if they don't need a great deal of ventilation for combustion air
they need it to get rid of the moisture.

The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat. Better still would be to
set the system up with a 2nd zone.


NT

On Oct 21, 8:39*pm, Dave wrote:
In article ,
says...





In article ,
* *Dave wrote:

What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.

Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then! *
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.


NT

NT wrote:

The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat.

So, just run me through what you would have to do during the
course of a typical day to achieve the differing temperatures
required throughout the house?

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.

In article
,
NT wrote:
The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat. Better still would be to
set the system up with a 2nd zone.

Very expensive mod to zone off this one room from the rest of the house.
And a normal boiler might run at reduced efficiency when just heating one
small room.

--
*Time is what keeps everything from happening at once.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article
,
NT wrote:
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.

The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

--
*Shin: a device for finding furniture in the dark *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Oct 22, 10:24*am, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:
In article
,
* *NT wrote:

Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then! *
:-)
Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.

The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

100% at 12p/unit versus gas with maybe 85% efficient at 3-4p/unit.


NT

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

fan heaters are also 100% efficient, all the input energy ends up as heat.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article
,
NT wrote:
The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat. Better still would be to
set the system up with a 2nd zone.

Very expensive mod to zone off this one room from the rest of the house.
And a normal boiler might run at reduced efficiency when just heating one
small room.

Shh, don't tell mine, it runs six five zones as small as one room.
No it doesn't modulate, yes it is more efficient to cycle the boiler at full
power.

In article ,
"Dave Plowman (News)" writes:
In article
,
NT wrote:
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.

The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

and where do you think that extra energy ends up?

and you can only claim the 100% efficiency if you start measuring after
the 60% loss in the power stations and whatever it is in the supply
network. (I learned a few days ago that our overhead HV conductors run
at around 90-100C.)

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Dave Plowman (News)" writes:
In article
,
NT wrote:
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.

The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

and where do you think that extra energy ends up?

some of it is used to create air movement.

and you can only claim the 100% efficiency if you start measuring after
the 60% loss in the power stations and whatever it is in the supply
network. (I learned a few days ago that our overhead HV conductors run
at around 90-100C.)

the customer doesn't get involved in that part of the equation. He gets
100% use of his pennies.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.16

NT wrote:
On Oct 21, 8:39 pm, Dave wrote:
In article ,
says...





In article ,
Dave wrote:
What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?
It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.
In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.
Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.


Rubbish.
The BIG costs are heating HUGE spaces that is unavoidable unless you are
zoned to the hilt and even then running a whole house boiler to heat
just one room is crappily inefficient.

Its FAR cheaper to heat a smaller space with expensive electricity than
to try and modulate a whole house boiler down to do it and zone it
accordingly..

NT

dennis@home wrote:

fan heaters are also 100% efficient, all the input energy ends up as heat.

Really? Yours are totally silent are they?


--
Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Email sent to my from-address will be deleted. Instead, please reply
to replacing "aaa" by "284".

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Dave Plowman (News)" writes:
In article
,
NT wrote:
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)
Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.
The room is warmed by the central heating morning and evening when the
rest of the house is in use. All that's needed is to maintain that
temperature during the day. And all electric heaters are 100% efficient.
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

and where do you think that extra energy ends up?

and you can only claim the 100% efficiency if you start measuring after
the 60% loss in the power stations and whatever it is in the supply
network. (I learned a few days ago that our overhead HV conductors run
at around 90-100C.)

grid is in the 95-98% range overall.

power stations vary from 33% (coal) through OCGT (37%) to CCGT(60%+)

Nuclear about 33% but fuel usage is the least of all the costs, so who
cares?

(interesting thought is a combined cycle nuclear turbine, with a
compressor blowing air over white hod fuel rods driving a gas turbine,
and then a steam plant,.. efficient, but probably not very radiation
tight :-))

Jeremy Nicoll - news posts wrote:
dennis@home wrote:

fan heaters are also 100% efficient, all the input energy ends up as heat.

Really? Yours are totally silent are they?


sound energy ends up as heat, too.

On 21/10/2011 16:23, Dave wrote:


What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?

It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.

In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

For this application a heat pump aircon unit will make a good deal of
sense. The air handler can be high up on a wall out of the way. Running
costs comparable to using gas, quick warm up as with a fan heater, plus
the ability to cool in the summer for when the office get too warm from
computers etc.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Oct 22, 1:55*pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Oct 21, 8:39 pm, Dave wrote:
In article ,
says...

In article ,
* *Dave wrote:
What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?
It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.
In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.
Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then! *
:-)

Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.

Rubbish.
The BIG costs are heating HUGE spaces that is unavoidable unless you are
zoned to the hilt and even then running a whole house boiler to heat
just one room is crappily inefficient.

Its FAR cheaper to heat a smaller space with expensive electricity than
to try and modulate a whole house boiler down to do it and zone it
accordingly..

NT

How precisely is it more costly to heat one room with CH, with the
other rooms TRVs set to off? Where are you proposing a large amount of
heat is being lost?


NT

On Oct 22, 9:49*am, Chris J Dixon wrote:
NT wrote:
The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat.

So, just run me through what you would have to do during the
course of a typical day to achieve the differing temperatures
required throughout the house?

Chris

Depends how you set it up.


NT

On Oct 22, 10:22*am, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:
In article
,
* *NT wrote:

The central heating will be far cheaper for a given amount of heat
than any plugin or portable heater. Gas is about 1/3 the price of
electricity per kWh. If you're not working in the room with the
thermostat, you'd best get a wireless stat. Better still would be to
set the system up with a 2nd zone.

Very expensive mod to zone off this one room from the rest of the house.

It would cost, but can be done quite cheaply. Portable heating would
add cost too, mainly in greater fuel cost.


And a normal boiler might run at reduced efficiency when just heating one
small room.

not by much


NT

NT wrote:
On Oct 22, 1:55 pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Oct 21, 8:39 pm, Dave wrote:
In article ,
says...
In article ,
Dave wrote:
What's the best way (and by that I think I mean the cheapest way) of
heating just one room? We have a box room that I'm going to set up as an
office as I'm now going to be working from home. I assume that the way
NOT to do it is have the full house central heating on and turn down (or
off?) the TRVs in all the other rooms?
It's a 1960s semi-detached dormer (chalet) bungalow with one external
wall being "normal" brick/cavity/brick, the other external wall has the
window and has (I think) inner plasterboard/wood frame/outer tile
construction and the other two walls are standard stud walls.
In case anyone was going to suggest one of those stand-alone gas
heaters, I assume it would have to go on the brick wall but due to the
room layout, that wall is the best choice for the desk and shelving so
I'm afraid that's a non-starter.
Assuming you heat the house morning and evening as with normal occupation
but out at work all day, a small electric fan heater on a thermostat
should have no trouble keeping it topped up. Or a similar oil filled rad
if you don't like the noise of a fan heater.
Thanks everyone - an oil-filled rad with thermostat I think it is then!
:-)
Thats nearly the worst of all options. Not only are plugin electrics
the most expensive to run, but the low power output and lack of fan
mean it'll need to be switched on a while before the room's used,
wasting even more money.
Rubbish.
The BIG costs are heating HUGE spaces that is unavoidable unless you are
zoned to the hilt and even then running a whole house boiler to heat
just one room is crappily inefficient.

Its FAR cheaper to heat a smaller space with expensive electricity than
to try and modulate a whole house boiler down to do it and zone it
accordingly..

NT

How precisely is it more costly to heat one room with CH, with the
other rooms TRVs set to off? Where are you proposing a large amount of
heat is being lost?

TRV set to off still means hot water going round pipes. Plenty of losses
there. even if lagged.



The boiler will inevitably short cycle leading to hugely reduced
efficiency - raw fuel chucked out the back before it fires... and heat
being lost in the boiler room itself as the boiler has to heat up, then
cool down, then heat up....

All about using systems in ways they were not designed to cope with.

Not to mention the fact that if the master stat is NOT in the office,
the boiler will stay pumping all the time.


If you consider that there is a fixed heat loss from the system via the
pipes, and a fixed amount of fuel lost when it starts up, you can see
that at very low outputs its nearly ALL being lost, and almost no output.

Of course unless the pipes run through the loft the heat will end up in
the house as a whole, but that is not what we are considering. We don't
want to heat the house, just one room.

Its a tsndar problem of modulating heat systems: There are fixed losses.
If iy wamp them by using high oputputs, they are insignificant. If you
throttle back they become very significant.

Guess why a 3 liter car no matter how efficient never returns the same
MPG even in a light body as a 1200 engine..the BIG engine has BIG
frictional losses. Its efficient enough at 100bhp but its woeful at 30bhp.



NT

charles wrote:
In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Dave Plowman (News)" writes:
Snip
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

and where do you think that extra energy ends up?

some of it is used to create air movement.

Which is slowed down by friction, so generating heat.

In a sealed room, *all* electrical energy used by *any* item in that
room ends up as heat in the room sooner or later. Even the energy used
by LED or flourescent lighting ends up as 100% heat, unless the
electronics are outside the room.

When my tower computer (250Watts) is running hard, it acts as a quite
effective space heater, and even a 60 Watt laptop can raise the
temperature slightly, enough to notice the change in the mark/ space
ratio of the official space heating.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

John Williamson wrote:
charles wrote:
In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
"Dave Plowman (News)" writes:
Snip
Apart from a fan heater where the fan uses extra energy. ;-)

and where do you think that extra energy ends up?

some of it is used to create air movement.

Which is slowed down by friction, so generating heat.

In a sealed room, *all* electrical energy used by *any* item in that
room ends up as heat in the room sooner or later. Even the energy used
by LED or flourescent lighting ends up as 100% heat, unless the
electronics are outside the room.

When my tower computer (250Watts) is running hard, it acts as a quite
effective space heater, and even a 60 Watt laptop can raise the
temperature slightly, enough to notice the change in the mark/ space
ratio of the official space heating.

things are better here since I junked the old pentium II server for one
with an Intel Atom. And switched off the old laser printer except when I
need it.