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#1
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
I know this is OT for the DIYers but there's some brilliant computer
gurus in there and I need all the help I can get as I'm losing my hair on this one. Right, a friend rang me to say that there had been a burning smell from the computer (Packard Bell iMedia X2416 running Windows Vista). When I got it there were no signs of life whatsoever - no fans or drives spinning, no BIOS beeps, nothing. Previous experience led me to think the PSU had died but it tested OK with all voltages being within range. As a 'belt and braces' test I also put it into my own machine and it did indeed power up my computer and worked well. I also tried a known good PSU in his machine but still no life there at all. Next I took his RAM, put it in my machine, and ran Memtest86+. I let it complete one pass and there were no errors, so I let it continue to run (actually left it running overnight with no errors) while I hooked his hard drive to another spare computer I have here. It booted OK but of course it didn't have my motherboard (or any other) drivers installed so it complained about that but it did spin up and boot, so that's OK. So now it's either motherboard or processor and from what I know, processors very rarely give any trouble, so I plumped for a faulty motherboard. I found one available on Ebay, used but tested and with warranty (it's a MCP73PVT-PM by the way) so I got it. I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out :-) Cheers |
#2
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
First thing I would try is a LiveCD linux distro, doesn't really matter
which one (I like Ubuntu for this), and see if that boots without error. Had a couple of problems before with supposed quad core capable motherboards that actually weren't... Does this motherboard have the exact bios and hardware revision of the faulty one? ie does it properly support that CPU? Do you have the bios settings set correctly? Is the PSU up to the job? I know you said it is, but what is the rating of the 12v rail and is it clean... Lee |
#3
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 28/09/2011 22:24, Dave Headley wrote:
I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. ok, do you get the boot loop without a hard drive connected? i.e. is it actually failing in the BIOS itself? Or is it as I expect, that it fails very shortly after attempting to start windows? That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Do you have a bootable CD you can test it with? A linux live CD, a copy of the ultimate boot CD, or Bart PE etc. If not, download and burn one on a working machine, and set the BIOS to allow booting from CD and give it a go. If any of those work, then chances are the processor is fine. Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Those pictures are all too small to read anything useful... but the last two do look like windows kernel panics (i.e. BSODs) So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out :-) If you can boot ok from a CD, then I expect you have a basic hardware incompatibility (possibly even a HAL incompatibility) between the windows image on the hard drive, and the new motherboard. You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. This should leave all data and programs intact, but re-detect and install all the lower level drivers that can prevent a system from booting. IME, sometimes you can pull a fast one a swap a mobo under windows, and it does not complain, just notices stuff is new, and detects and reinstalls the right drivers. Other times it does what you are seeing at some stage in the boot process ranging from almost immediately, half way in... -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#4
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 28/09/11 22:24, Dave Headley wrote:
So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out :-) If it's Windows it may be refusing to boot on what it considers a new machine. Do you get as far as a blue screen with the system restore/reinstall from backup option. Try testing with a Linux live CD (eg Ubuntu) if that works then blame windows not the hardware. -- djc |
#5
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On Sep 28, 10:24*pm, Dave Headley wrote:
I know this is OT for the DIYers but there's some brilliant computer gurus in there and I need all the help I can get as I'm losing my hair on this one. Right, a friend rang me to say that there had been a burning smell from the computer (Packard Bell iMedia X2416 running Windows Vista). When I got it there were no signs of life whatsoever - no fans or drives spinning, no BIOS beeps, nothing. Previous experience led me to think the PSU had died but it tested OK with all voltages being within range. As a 'belt and braces' test I also put it into my own machine and it did indeed power up my computer and worked well. I also tried a known good PSU in his machine but still no life there at all. Next I took his RAM, put it in my machine, and ran Memtest86+. I let it complete one pass and there were no errors, so I let it continue to run (actually left it running overnight with no errors) while I hooked his hard drive to another spare computer I have here. It booted OK but of course it didn't have my motherboard (or any other) drivers installed so it complained about that but it did spin up and boot, so that's OK. So now it's either motherboard or processor and from what I know, processors very rarely give any trouble, so I plumped for a faulty motherboard. I found one available on Ebay, used but tested and with warranty (it's a MCP73PVT-PM by the way) so I got it. I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out *:-) Cheers The problem is with windows, not with the hardware. As said, fire it up with a linux cd, should work perfectly. Note not all linux cds run on al machines, if one wont boot try a couple of others. NT |
#6
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
En el artículo , Dave
Headley escribió: I know this is OT for the DIYers but there's some brilliant computer gurus in there a There's plenty of on-topic groups with "brilliant computer gurus" out there if you could be arsed to find them, it's only like a couple of mouse clicks. Right, a friend rang me to say that there had been a burning smell from the computer (Packard Bell iMedia X2416 running Windows Vista) If it's a Bestec PSU, it's a well known fault. The -5v line goes way overvoltage and destroys the motherboard. Had you bothered to google, you would have discovered this for yourself before putting the PSU in your own computer. Finally, there's no point whinging about BSODs without giving the STOP errors that accompany them. The number following the STOP is needed for any meaningful diagnosis. -- (\__/) (='.'=) (")_(") |
#8
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote:
... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". -- Reentrant |
#9
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 04:47:05 +0100, Mike Tomlinson
wrote: En el artículo , Dave Headley escribió: I know this is OT for the DIYers but there's some brilliant computer gurus in there a There's plenty of on-topic groups with "brilliant computer gurus" out there if you could be arsed to find them, it's only like a couple of mouse clicks. Right. But this is a DIY ng and fixing a computer is DIY. Right, a friend rang me to say that there had been a burning smell from the computer (Packard Bell iMedia X2416 running Windows Vista) If it's a Bestec PSU, it's a well known fault. The -5v line goes way overvoltage and destroys the motherboard. Had you bothered to google, you would have discovered this for yourself before putting the PSU in your own computer. Finally, there's no point whinging about BSODs without giving the STOP errors that accompany them. The number following the STOP is needed for any meaningful diagnosis. The error messages don't always help either. -- (\__/) M. (='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and (")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by everyone you will need use a different method of posting. |
#10
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote:
On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There are some guides here that might help: http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/88...t-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/19...y-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/91...up-repair.html -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#11
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On Sep 29, 12:48*pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There are some guides here that might help: http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/88...up-repair.html Linux is so much easier. Mint is easy for people with no linux experience. Its Ubuntu with its niggles fixed. NT |
#12
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 12:54, NT wrote:
On Sep 29, 12:48 pm, John wrote: On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There are some guides here that might help: http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/88...up-repair.html Linux is so much easier. Mint is easy for people with no linux experience. Its Ubuntu with its niggles fixed. I think this is the computing equivalent of sucking air in through your teeth, and suggesting you should have bought a different car rather than fixing the broken one! The live CDs are handy for checking the fault boundary between hardware and OS, and also possibly for data recovery from a non bootable drive (assuming you can mount the file system). However that is not the same as getting windows working again. You may well want to argue its "better", but if that then means you can't access the applications you need to do what you need to do, or work with your existing files, then that is doubtful. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#13
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article 03f7f96e-809f-49b1-868f-
, says... On Sep 28, 10:24*pm, Dave Headley wrote: I know this is OT for the DIYers but there's some brilliant computer gurus in there and I need all the help I can get as I'm losing my hair on this one. Right, a friend rang me to say that there had been a burning smell from the computer (Packard Bell iMedia X2416 running Windows Vista). When I got it there were no signs of life whatsoever - no fans or drives spinning, no BIOS beeps, nothing. Previous experience led me to think the PSU had died but it tested OK with all voltages being within range. As a 'belt and braces' test I also put it into my own machine and it did indeed power up my computer and worked well. I also tried a known good PSU in his machine but still no life there at all. Next I took his RAM, put it in my machine, and ran Memtest86+. I let it complete one pass and there were no errors, so I let it continue to run (actually left it running overnight with no errors) while I hooked his hard drive to another spare computer I have here. It booted OK but of course it didn't have my motherboard (or any other) drivers installed so it complained about that but it did spin up and boot, so that's OK. So now it's either motherboard or processor and from what I know, processors very rarely give any trouble, so I plumped for a faulty motherboard. I found one available on Ebay, used but tested and with warranty (it's a MCP73PVT-PM by the way) so I got it. I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out *:-) The problem is with windows, not with the hardware. As said, fire it up with a linux cd, should work perfectly. Note not all linux cds run on al machines, if one wont boot try a couple of others. Hmm, well I've downloaded and burned an Ubuntu LiveCD then booted my own machine with it to see what I could expect. It worked well and I got to the Ubuntu desktop. However, when I tried it on the suspect machine it doesn't work - I get a screen with two symbols at the bottom then the screen goes black with a (system caret? cursor?) flashing in the top left corner and does nothing else. Photo can be seen he http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Currently downloading a Knoppix image and will try with that given that you said that not all Linux CDs will run on all machines. Thanks for your input mate. |
#14
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article , says...
First thing I would try is a LiveCD linux distro, doesn't really matter which one (I like Ubuntu for this), and see if that boots without error. Tried an Ubuntu LiveCD first in my own machine and it worked well but it would not boot in the suspect machine. I get a screen with two icons at the bottom but nothing else except a flashing cursor in the top left corner, picture here (just click on the photos to zoom in) http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Had a couple of problems before with supposed quad core capable motherboards that actually weren't... Does this motherboard have the exact bios and hardware revision of the faulty one? ie does it properly support that CPU? Do you have the bios settings set correctly? Is the PSU up to the job? I know you said it is, but what is the rating of the 12v rail and is it clean... Yes, to all of the above. |
#15
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article ,
says... On 28/09/2011 22:24, Dave Headley wrote: I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. ok, do you get the boot loop without a hard drive connected? i.e. is it actually failing in the BIOS itself? With no hard drive connected I just get a message onscreen saying to reboot and select proper boot device, ie, no BSOD boot loop. Or is it as I expect, that it fails very shortly after attempting to start windows? That would appear to be the case. That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Do you have a bootable CD you can test it with? A linux live CD, a copy of the ultimate boot CD, or Bart PE etc. If not, download and burn one on a working machine, and set the BIOS to allow booting from CD and give it a go. If any of those work, then chances are the processor is fine. Tried an Ubuntu LiveCD but it just shows two icons at the bottom of the screen then they disappear aand the screen goes black with a flashing cursor at top left then goes no further - photo here but see below http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Those pictures are all too small to read anything useful... but the last two do look like windows kernel panics (i.e. BSODs) Sorry John, I never thought to mention it but if you click on the photos it zooms in - keep clicking and it'll zoom to 100% and is easily readable then starts to zoom out. So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out :-) If you can boot ok from a CD, then I expect you have a basic hardware incompatibility (possibly even a HAL incompatibility) between the windows image on the hard drive, and the new motherboard. You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. This should leave all data and programs intact, but re-detect and install all the lower level drivers that can prevent a system from booting. IME, sometimes you can pull a fast one a swap a mobo under windows, and it does not complain, just notices stuff is new, and detects and and reinstalls the right drivers. Other times it does what you are seeing at some stage in the boot process ranging from almost immediately, half way in... Yes, whenever I've fitted a new motherboard I've always just fired it up and done a repair install and everything has been fine but it doesn't seem to be working that way this time - maybe just a Packard Bell thing. |
#16
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
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#17
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article ,
says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. There are some guides here that might help: http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/88...t-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/19...y-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/91...up-repair.html Thanks very much John. |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
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#19
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
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#20
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote:
In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. There are some guides here that might help: http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/88...t-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/19...y-options.html http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/91...up-repair.html Thanks very much John. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#21
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 14:06, Dave Headley wrote:
In articlew4ydnZtgws_ABh7TnZ2dnUVZ8qadnZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 28/09/2011 22:24, Dave Headley wrote: I put it all together on the bench, powered up, and we now have signs of life - but it's now in a BSOD loop. It POSTs OK and it gives one BIOS beep as it normally would but then blue screens and reboots ad infinitum, with an odd different BSOD thrown in for good measure. I sent that mobo back under warranty and got another one, but this one also displays EXACTLY the same symptoms, leading me to believe that the first mobo I got from him wasn't actually faulty after all. ok, do you get the boot loop without a hard drive connected? i.e. is it actually failing in the BIOS itself? With no hard drive connected I just get a message onscreen saying to reboot and select proper boot device, ie, no BSOD boot loop. Or is it as I expect, that it fails very shortly after attempting to start windows? That would appear to be the case. That would imply that it's the CPU at fault but I don't have a spare Intel Core 2 Quad Q8200 lying around to test it with, and the cheapest I can find is 65 quid for a used one on Ebay (brand new ones are over 100) so I don't particularly want to go down that route. Do you have a bootable CD you can test it with? A linux live CD, a copy of the ultimate boot CD, or Bart PE etc. If not, download and burn one on a working machine, and set the BIOS to allow booting from CD and give it a go. If any of those work, then chances are the processor is fine. Tried an Ubuntu LiveCD but it just shows two icons at the bottom of the screen then they disappear aand the screen goes black with a flashing cursor at top left then goes no further - photo here but see below http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Try with something simpler like UBCD4 (you can download an ISO ready to burn) Plus the fact that I've now got some diagnostic software (PC Check) and, as you'll see in these photos here, the motherboard and processor pass all tests http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Those pictures are all too small to read anything useful... but the last two do look like windows kernel panics (i.e. BSODs) Sorry John, I never thought to mention it but if you click on the photos it zooms in - keep clicking and it'll zoom to 100% and is easily readable then starts to zoom out. Doh! I clicked once, and just got extra file info. Did not think to keep clicking! So, where do I go from here? Is the diagnostic software accurate or could there still be problems with mobo/CPU? What can I do now? Please help before I tear all my hair out :-) If you can boot ok from a CD, then I expect you have a basic hardware incompatibility (possibly even a HAL incompatibility) between the windows image on the hard drive, and the new motherboard. You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. This should leave all data and programs intact, but re-detect and install all the lower level drivers that can prevent a system from booting. IME, sometimes you can pull a fast one a swap a mobo under windows, and it does not complain, just notices stuff is new, and detects and and reinstalls the right drivers. Other times it does what you are seeing at some stage in the boot process ranging from almost immediately, half way in... Yes, whenever I've fitted a new motherboard I've always just fired it up and done a repair install and everything has been fine but it doesn't seem to be working that way this time - maybe just a Packard Bell thing. More likely a Vista thing... -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article ,
says... On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote: In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. Thanks John, I think you're right there. Just tried with a Knoppix CD and it shows "Decompressing Linux..... Parsing ELF....Done.....Booting kernel....." and then it goes no further, just sticks there. Thanks for your help. |
#23
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 13:53, Dave Headley wrote:
In , says... First thing I would try is a LiveCD linux distro, doesn't really matter which one (I like Ubuntu for this), and see if that boots without error. Tried an Ubuntu LiveCD first in my own machine and it worked well but it would not boot in the suspect machine. I get a screen with two icons at the bottom but nothing else except a flashing cursor in the top left corner, picture here (just click on the photos to zoom in) http://s137.photobucket.com/albums/q...ackard%20Bell/ Had a couple of problems before with supposed quad core capable motherboards that actually weren't... Does this motherboard have the exact bios and hardware revision of the faulty one? ie does it properly support that CPU? Do you have the bios settings set correctly? Is the PSU up to the job? I know you said it is, but what is the rating of the 12v rail and is it clean... Yes, to all of the above. If this is the same revision board, and same BIOS version, then that (in theory) ought to boot from the old hard drive. This is starting to look like either the new board is in some way faulty, or you have a corrupted drive image. Try the more extensive test suite on UBCD4/5 http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/ -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#24
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
Dave Headley wrote:
In article , says... On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote: In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. Thanks John, I think you're right there. Just tried with a Knoppix CD and it shows "Decompressing Linux..... Parsing ELF....Done.....Booting kernel....." and then it goes no further, just sticks there. Hmm. Sugggets some mighty borked hardware to me..RAM good? Thanks for your help. |
#25
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article , lid says...
Dave Headley wrote: In article , says... On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote: In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. Thanks John, I think you're right there. Just tried with a Knoppix CD and it shows "Decompressing Linux..... Parsing ELF....Done.....Booting kernel....." and then it goes no further, just sticks there. Hmm. Sugggets some mighty borked hardware to me..RAM good? Yep, I put it into my machine and ran Memtest86+ overnight without errors. |
#26
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
Dave Headley wrote:
In article , lid says... Dave Headley wrote: In article , says... On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote: In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. Thanks John, I think you're right there. Just tried with a Knoppix CD and it shows "Decompressing Linux..... Parsing ELF....Done.....Booting kernel....." and then it goes no further, just sticks there. Hmm. Sugggets some mighty borked hardware to me..RAM good? Yep, I put it into my machine and ran Memtest86+ overnight without errors. OK..then what its is probably having issues with is that it needs drivers for the hardware that are not in the live CD. At which point you are off the 'simply boot a live CD' and into hackers paradise. May I make a pragmatic suggestion? Buy a new disk and either install a FULL linux or a FULL windows on it, and then jumper the old disk as a slave to get the data off it. This will get your old data back, and you will have to reinstall all the programs. I am tempted to say go Linux, and reinstall windows and its programs in a virtual machine: After crashing several times a week ago my VM windows refused to boot in under 45 minutes. I went back to an earlier snapshot, and now its fine. Sine no use data is actually held in the windows area whatsoever, by deliberate choice - I regard windows as an unstable OS and will only use it as a program launcher for three programs I need - this is no big deal for me. Unless your favourite windows programs are gaes, which are a bit sick in a VM, this is definitely the way to get stability - move email, browsing, word processing and the like to Linux, and leave - in my case Rhino CAD and Corel suite running on a virtual machine.. Or dual boot the thing and use a local server to hold all the important data. |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 15:22, John Rumm wrote:
This is starting to look like either the new board is in some way faulty, or you have a corrupted drive image. Try the more extensive test suite on UBCD4/5 http://www.ultimatebootcd.com/ Good suggestion. I'm still thinking a bios or settings conflict... @OP, I'd suggest removing everything non-essential, including anything USB especially disconnect the front panel memory card reader, if it has one, doing a bios reset and load optimized defaults and try again... Then put things back one at a time. Lee |
#28
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 29/09/2011 15:19, Dave Headley wrote:
In , says... On 29/09/2011 14:16, Dave Headley wrote: In articlewbednVxgMaaUxhnTnZ2dnUVZ8hednZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk, says... On 29/09/2011 11:56, Reentrant wrote: On 28/09/2011 23:10, John Rumm wrote: ... You can usually fix this by booting from the windows CD and doing an inplace repair install. For XP, yes - done it loads of times. But I don't think that's available for Vista (or Win7); you have to do a clean OS install and then reinstall all applications. User Data is preserved in "windows.old". Good point, did not spot the vista bit... A repair install is still in theory possible, but under more restrictive conditions. The conditions: You must have a full install DVD and not a product recovery DVD, it must be the same or a later version than the product installed. So for example if your system has been patched to SP2 and your DVD predates that, then you have to burn yourself a slipstreamed SP2 DVD first. Ideally you need to start the process from being already logged into an admin privileged account, rather than from booting from the DVD. So if you can't boot that far then this particular route is not much use! Having said that, I would suggest doing a F8 boot (i.e. hitting F8 early in the boot sequence as the BIOS is coming to the end of its bit). To get to the Advanced Boot Options. See if there is a "Repair your Computer" option there. You should then be able to get as far as the system recovery options and choose startup repair. There is indeed a "Repair your computer" option but selecting that just leads to a black screen for about 2 seconds then it reboots, sometimes blue-screening for a fraction of a second (enough to know it's a BSOD but not long enough to read it). Just spoken to my mate and he only has a recovery DVD anyway, not a full install DVD. You might be able to turn off the auto restart from the advanced boot options screen. That may give you a chance to read the error message. After that you may have to resort to lower level file repairs etc under Bart PE. It sounds like the best bet may be to do a fresh install onto a new hard drive, and then set about recovery of files from the old. Thanks John, I think you're right there. Just tried with a Knoppix CD and it shows "Decompressing Linux..... Parsing ELF....Done.....Booting kernel....." and then it goes no further, just sticks there. Since that is two live CDs that have failed, it could point at a hardware problem... -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 13:48:53 +0100, Dave Headley wrote:
Hmm, well I've downloaded and burned an Ubuntu LiveCD then booted my own machine with it to see what I could expect. It worked well and I got to the Ubuntu desktop. However, when I tried it on the suspect machine it doesn't work - I get a screen with two symbols at the bottom then the screen goes black I'm wondering if your CPU isn't hosed - although you don't have a spare CPU, can you perhaps lay your hands on a known-good board supporting that particular CPU in which to try the one that you have? Perhaps there was some problem which caused the machine to overheat severely - e.g. failing fan, dust build-up, something jamming (PSU wires are good for that) the fan, PSU glitch (possibly due to marginal PSU). That could account for the burning smell reported. I've seen severely- overheated CPUs fail in ways where they still semi-work, but problems subsequently manifest in all sorts of odd ways. cheers Jules |
#30
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
Jules Richardson wrote:
On Thu, 29 Sep 2011 13:48:53 +0100, Dave Headley wrote: Hmm, well I've downloaded and burned an Ubuntu LiveCD then booted my own machine with it to see what I could expect. It worked well and I got to the Ubuntu desktop. However, when I tried it on the suspect machine it doesn't work - I get a screen with two symbols at the bottom then the screen goes black I'm wondering if your CPU isn't hosed - although you don't have a spare CPU, can you perhaps lay your hands on a known-good board supporting that particular CPU in which to try the one that you have? Perhaps there was some problem which caused the machine to overheat severely - e.g. failing fan, dust build-up, something jamming (PSU wires are good for that) the fan, PSU glitch (possibly due to marginal PSU). That could account for the burning smell reported. I've seen severely- overheated CPUs fail in ways where they still semi-work, but problems subsequently manifest in all sorts of odd ways. yes. bus timings go way out of spec. cheers Jules |
#31
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
En el artículo , Mark
escribió: Right. But this is a DIY ng and fixing a computer is DIY. from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. The error messages don't always help either. You're clueless. They can at the very least help differentiate between software (device driver) and hardware issues. -- (\__/) (='.'=) (")_(") |
#32
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
En el artículo , Dave
Headley escribió: Yes, plenty of computer newsgroups but most suffer from spammers or don't get the volume of traffic that this group does. I don't think you even bothered to look. Would you walk into a plumber's merchant with a query about a car problem? I could have been waiting for days to get even one reply in those other groups - plus there's some VERY knowledgeable people here. Brown-nosing will get you everywhere. Yes, I'm well aware of the problems Bestec PSUs suffer from thank you very much, but this is not a Bestec PSU Which you didn't mention in your original post. I gave up mind-reading years ago. If you're so knowledgeable, what are you doing posting here for help? Had you been arsed to look at the link I posted you'd have seen four or five photos. Why should I? Post to usenet, read the reply in usenet is the convention (as well as posting in an appropriate group) had you been arsed, you could have read them yourself. Had you been arsed, you could have included the error codes in your OP. You're the one asking for help. after all, prat. -- (\__/) (='.'=) (")_(") |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
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#34
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
In article , Mike Tomlinson
scribeth thus En el artículo , Mark escribió: Right. But this is a DIY ng and fixing a computer is DIY. from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. The error messages don't always help either. You're clueless. They can at the very least help differentiate between software (device driver) and hardware issues. Try a posting on alt.computer -- Tony Sayer |
#35
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 30/09/2011 08:53, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." That excludes Matty's fascinating posts about the inside of trams. And wood splitting. And chainsaws. And bikes. Personally I do do my own computers, so they're no further OT than many topics we have. Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. That however may well be true. Andy |
#36
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
NOTE: Newsgroups have been altered from those specified by the OP.
Original newsgroups: uk.d-i-y Added newsgroups: alt.computer The original thread can be viewed in Google Groups at: http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...a795fc0e0d0ecd rant This is to add the notice that Tony chose to omit. Whenever the list of newsgroups is changed, make notice of that fact. Place a note at the top of your reply that the Newsgroups were changed (added or removed) from the original list so others are aware of the change. Optionally state in the notice why the change was considered appropriate if not so stated in the body of your reply. Notice of change is optional but appreciated if your Usenet provider does not carry one, or more, of the original newsgroups (that is, you cannot post there). Users should not have to ferret out or happen to notice the attempt to redirect a thread (to move it elsewhere or remove it). Tell them you did it. Redirection without notification is a troll maneuver. /rant NOTE: The uk.d-i-y newsgroup (for my NNTP server) requires use of the FollowUp-To header (which is a ridiculous requirement if the poster intends to NOT be rude by yanking the discussion away from where it originally appeared). As such, the FollowUp-To header was used to move/retain this discussion under the following newsgroup that I monitor: alt.computer As such, replies will go to alt.computer unless you change (and politely notify of such) the Newsgroups header for your reply. tony sayer wrote: In article , Mike Tomlinson scribeth thus En el artículo , Mark escribió: Right. But this is a DIY ng and fixing a computer is DIY. from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. The error messages don't always help either. You're clueless. They can at the very least help differentiate between software (device driver) and hardware issues. Try a posting on alt.computer Original newsgroups: uk.d-i-y Added newsgroups: alt.computer Effector/Respondent: tony sayer This is to warn that Effector has copied [only their subthread of] an existing discussion to other groups by cross-posting their reply to groups not originally specified by the OP (original post[er]). There may be additional replies back under the original post in its original group(s) than just those shown under the subthread for the Effector's cross-posted reply. If the OP and others wish to ensure that they see ALL replies then they must visit the original groups to check if there are subthreads *other* than just under the Effector's reply. rant If the OP wishes to move or copy their discussion to another group, that should be *their* choice and not as an UNSOLICITED action enforced by another *user*. Despite his pretense, the Effector is not a moderator or admin but just another user who is propagating the OP's discussion to different group(s) that he has divined are more appropriate and to possibly enlarge the audience or hopefully provide a more focused community on the topic but which may not be a correct or best choice for the OP. The actual source of the problem may turn out not to be relevant to those other groups simply based on what the OP reported as the symptoms and upon what the Respondent based their decision to forcibly redirect someone else's discussion. If the OP wants to move or copy their discussion to another group, that should be THEIR choice and not of the Respondent. The Respondent should only recommend to the OP that there may be more appropriate or useful groups to which the OP should repost or cross-post their message, not enforce the propagation of the OP's discussion to other groups. A misguided urge to enlarge or change exposure for a discussion based on the Respondent's biases or presumptions is not an adequate reason to alter the Newsgroups header. Recommend the OP should move. Do not SHOVE them over. It should be the OP's choice as to where they focus their discussion, not a forced change made by the Respondent. Despite trying to help, forcing a redirection of someone else's discussion is troll-like behavior. Suggest the change. Don't force it. /rant RECOMMENDING the discussion move to a more narrowly focused newsgroup that may better address the topic is laudable. SHOVING someone over there without their permission and without notification is despicable and smacks of behavior typical of trolls, spammers, and malevolents. |
#37
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 30/09/2011 20:57, Andy Champ wrote:
On 30/09/2011 08:53, Mike Tomlinson wrote: from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." That excludes Matty's fascinating posts about the inside of trams. And wood splitting. And chainsaws. And bikes. Personally I do do my own computers, so they're no further OT than many topics we have. Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. That however may well be true. I don't know, I can't imaging a house without a computer these days, or for that matter building one without the aid of a computer. So its as much a valid tool as a screwdriver! -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#38
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 20:57, Andy Champ wrote: On 30/09/2011 08:53, Mike Tomlinson wrote: from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." That excludes Matty's fascinating posts about the inside of trams. And wood splitting. And chainsaws. And bikes. Personally I do do my own computers, so they're no further OT than many topics we have. Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. That however may well be true. I don't know, I can't imaging a house without a computer these days, or for that matter building one without the aid of a computer. So its as much a valid tool as a screwdriver! All my design work is done on one now. apart from rough sketches on A4 scrap, I get a computer model going ASAP so I can see how it will look in 3D.... |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On 01/10/2011 01:15, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
John Rumm wrote: On 30/09/2011 20:57, Andy Champ wrote: On 30/09/2011 08:53, Mike Tomlinson wrote: from the FAQ: "DIY stands for Do It Yourself, Plumbing, wiring, building, decorating, furniture making, and in fact anything and everything to do with maintaining, running, and improving your home, from putting up shelves to building a house." That excludes Matty's fascinating posts about the inside of trams. And wood splitting. And chainsaws. And bikes. Personally I do do my own computers, so they're no further OT than many topics we have. Nothing there about fixing computers, and there are other, more suitable, more targeted, groups where the OP would receive excellent advice. That however may well be true. I don't know, I can't imaging a house without a computer these days, or for that matter building one without the aid of a computer. So its as much a valid tool as a screwdriver! All my design work is done on one now. apart from rough sketches on A4 scrap, I get a computer model going ASAP so I can see how it will look in 3D.... Yup, same here for any furniture projects (bar the simplest) generally. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
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Packard Bell computer driving me crazy!!!! Help!
On Sat, 01 Oct 2011 17:38:12 +0100, John Rumm wrote:
apart from rough sketches on A4 scrap, I get a computer model going ASAP so I can see how it will look in 3D.... Yup, same here for any furniture projects (bar the simplest) generally. But furniture is just something you have in the home, and generally isn't physically attached to it - so presumably falls foul of the same rules which prohibit mention on this group of building/maintaining computers without professional help. ;-) |
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