I am in the UK.

I have got a lampsocket hanging from the ceiling in the middle of a room
like this: http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

A single CFL is not bright enough so I want to hang two CFL lamps from
one lampsocket.

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

"Alex" wrote in message
...
I am in the UK.

I have got a lampsocket hanging from the ceiling in the middle of a room
like this: http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

A single CFL is not bright enough so I want to hang two CFL lamps from
one lampsocket.

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Never seen anything like that. Why not just change the fitting to a multiple
lamp holder that you like?

HTH

John

Alex wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Certainly used to be, I particularly remember lighting on market stalls
making use of them (often in scary looking ways) this was 20+ years ago
mind.

In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
Alex wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Certainly used to be, I particularly remember lighting on market stalls
making use of them (often in scary looking ways) this was 20+ years ago
mind.

They all vanished in the early 1970's when it became illegal
to sell electrical accessories which don't conform to the
relevant British Standard. It would appear that manufacturers
didn't think it worth the effort to get all the less common
electrical accessories included in the standards. You might
still find them at car boot and junk sales, but check them
over for any faults. Most accessories of that area were quite
well made and providing they haven't been badly handled, will
still be in good condition. They may not incorporate all the
safety features currently used though.

You could always make your own:
http://www.emanator.demon.co.uk/bigclive/hamster.htm

--
Andrew Gabriel

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 09:03:55 GMT someone who may be Alex
wrote this:-

I have got a lampsocket hanging from the ceiling in the middle of a room
like this: http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

A single CFL is not bright enough so I want to hang two CFL lamps from
one lampsocket.

Given that compact fluorescent lamps up to the equivalent of a GLS
bulb of over 100W are available, for example
http://www.lightbulbs-direct.com/var...l.asp?var=3939 this
looks like poor lighting design.

The answer is to install two or more light fittings in suitable
locations. Best would be fittings with built in control gear, for
example to take 2D lamps like
http://www.lightbulbs-direct.com/var...l.asp?var=2996

Adding separate switching is probably a good idea.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Alex wrote:

I am in the UK.

I have got a lampsocket hanging from the ceiling in the middle of a room
like this: http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

A single CFL is not bright enough so I want to hang two CFL lamps from
one lampsocket.

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Not any more, but its not hard to wire 2 pendants into 1 rose. Or to
buy a CFL, the come in powers over over 100w from a few suppliers, eg
http://www.eurobatteries.com/sitepag...entcompact.asp

NT

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
Alex wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Certainly used to be, I particularly remember lighting on market stalls
making use of them (often in scary looking ways) this was 20+ years ago
mind.

They all vanished in the early 1970's when it became illegal
to sell electrical accessories which don't conform to the
relevant British Standard. It would appear that manufacturers
didn't think it worth the effort to get all the less common
electrical accessories included in the standards. You might
still find them at car boot and junk sales, but check them
over for any faults. Most accessories of that area were quite
well made and providing they haven't been badly handled, will
still be in good condition. They may not incorporate all the
safety features currently used though.

You could always make your own:
http://www.emanator.demon.co.uk/bigclive/hamster.htm

--
Andrew Gabriel

Scary !!

I remember the old double lighting adaptors from the 1950's / 60's when
people used to use them and plug electric irons into them.
--
the_constructor

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Yes, and here it is in all it's bakelite glory:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/EDISWAN-BIJOU-...QQcmdZViewItem

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 09:19:07 +0000, Andy Burns
wrote:

Alex wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Certainly used to be, I particularly remember lighting on market stalls
making use of them (often in scary looking ways) this was 20+ years ago
mind.

Yeah .I remember them as well.. I'm sure fairgrounds used to use them as well
but they might have been for lower voltage use .


Stuart

Alex wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

I've got one in my 'useful box' but sorry you're not having it! ;-) As
others have said, I'm pretty sure you can't buy them any more.

David

On 10 Dec 2006 03:29:56 -0800, wrote:

Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Yes, and here it is in all it's bakelite glory:

Yep those are the devices, not seen any on retail sale for donkeys years.
Not sure if I still have a couple kicking about and the matching BC plugs
so you could power, say your electric iron, from the lighting circuit.

I wouldn't advise using such a device though, much better to fit extra
fittings in the right place(s) or up the wattage of your CFL.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 13:45:17 +0000 (GMT) someone who may be "Dave
Liquorice" wrote this:-

I wouldn't advise using such a device though,

They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.

much better to fit extra
fittings in the right place(s) or up the wattage of your CFL.

Indeed.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On 10 Dec 2006 03:29:56 -0800, " wrote:


Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Yes, and here it is in all it's bakelite glory:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/EDISWAN-BIJOU-...QQcmdZViewItem

Huh - that's a posh one, with a switch. The ones I have are
unswitched.

There was another variety where both lampholders came off at an angle,
to form a true "Y".

--
Frank Erskine

David Hansen wrote:
On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 13:45:17 +0000 (GMT) someone who may be "Dave
Liquorice" wrote this:-

I wouldn't advise using such a device though,

They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.

To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug. Pvc
flex should not be used in the BC plug, only rubber, since the flex
sits directly on the hot bulb. The worst part of these things wasnt the
adaptor/plug/cable, which was dodgy enough, but the fact that users
would handle the top end of the fitted bulb holder, which in the later
years of round pin wiring had frequently lost some if its (single)
insulation, so you were fumbling with bare uninsulated mains wires that
you couldnt see too much from below, with the bulb in your face, while
standing on a chair or bed.

Maybe thats why iron beds declined in popularity, darwin effect....


NT

wrote in message
oups.com...
David Hansen wrote:
On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 13:45:17 +0000 (GMT) someone who may be "Dave
Liquorice" wrote this:-

I wouldn't advise using such a device though,

They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.

To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug. Pvc
flex should not be used in the BC plug, only rubber, since the flex
sits directly on the hot bulb. The worst part of these things wasnt the
adaptor/plug/cable, which was dodgy enough, but the fact that users
would handle the top end of the fitted bulb holder, which in the later
years of round pin wiring had frequently lost some if its (single)
insulation, so you were fumbling with bare uninsulated mains wires that
you couldnt see too much from below, with the bulb in your face, while
standing on a chair or bed.

Maybe thats why iron beds declined in popularity, darwin effect....


NT


I have just had a look in my junk box and yes, I have just found a BC
adaptor that you can plug a 2pin plug into.
Think I might put it on ebay. should raise a couple of quid as a collectors
item.
It says on it, 3A max 250V and is made by Volex. Cream in colour.
I did have a brown BC adaptor that just took a cable but can't find that
yet.
--
the_constructor

the_constructor wrote...

Scary !!

I remember the old double lighting adaptors from the 1950's / 60's when
people used to use them and plug electric irons into them.

I still have a very useful Morphy-Richards 3A bayonet to two-pin shaver
socket adapter that came with my fathers old electric razor.

David

On 10 Dec 2006 07:23:03 -0800, wrote:

I wouldn't advise using such a device though,

They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.

To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug. Pvc
flex should not be used in the BC plug, only rubber, since the flex
sits directly on the hot bulb.

Twin twisted pair cotton covered rubber flex of course.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

On 10 Dec 2006, wrote:

Not any more, but its not hard to wire 2 pendants into 1 rose. Or to
buy a CFL, the come in powers over over 100w from a few suppliers, eg
http://www.eurobatteries.com/sitepag...entcompact.asp

NT


Jeeze. Didn't think the bayonet fitting CFL's went to such high powers.

But at £15 (about $29) they're not cheap. I imagine they are quite
heavy.

On 10 Dec 2006, wrote:

To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug. Pvc
flex should not be used in the BC plug, only rubber, since the flex
sits directly on the hot bulb. The worst part of these things wasnt
the adaptor/plug/cable, which was dodgy enough, but the fact that
users would handle the top end of the fitted bulb holder, which in
the later years of round pin wiring had frequently lost some if its
(single) insulation, so you were fumbling with bare uninsulated
mains wires that you couldnt see too much from below, with the bulb
in your face, while standing on a chair or bed.

Maybe thats why iron beds declined in popularity, darwin effect....


NT


I have never understood how it is still permitted to have a
lampholder like in the OP
http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

The way the lampholder is suspended depends on the grip of the actual
screw-fittings on the bare wires.

If a moderately heavy lampshade is used then the whole thing seems to
be asking for trouble.

Does the US have ceiling pendant lampholders as dodgy as this?

There is so much safety in electrical products these days that I just
wonder how this sort of lampholder is not obliged to have a decent
flex grip in it.

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 18:08:47 GMT someone who may be Alex
wrote this:-

I have never understood how it is still permitted to have a
lampholder like in the OP
http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

Nothing wrong with them, provided they are installed and maintained
properly.

The way the lampholder is suspended depends on the grip of the actual
screw-fittings on the bare wires.

And also the strain relief channels fitted to the rose and lamp
holder. Older fittings may not have these and they may be worth
replacing.

If a moderately heavy lampshade is used then the whole thing seems to
be asking for trouble.

One should assess the maximum mass one may safely handle. There are
tables about such things.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

In message .com,
writes
so you were fumbling with bare uninsulated mains wires that you
couldnt see too much from below, with the bulb in your face, while
standing on a chair or bed.

Yeah, but velvet cushions and duvets have a high resistance value.
(Unless soaked in urine.)

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

In message , Alex
writes
I have never understood how it is still permitted to have a lampholder
like in the OP http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

The way the lampholder is suspended depends on the grip of the actual
screw-fittings on the bare wires.

It's not just relying on the wire being clamped. When assembled
correctly the wires are looped over strain relief hooks which remove a
lot of the pull force.

If a moderately heavy lampshade is used then the whole thing seems to
be asking for trouble.

Some excessive glass lampshades are just asking for trouble in any
scenario.

Does the US have ceiling pendant lampholders as dodgy as this?

No. ALL their wiring accessories are dodgy.

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

Owain wrote:

wrote:
David Hansen wrote:
They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.
To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug.

You really need a boiling ring plugged in - one of those made from a
spiral of bare resistance wire in a ceramic former, that came with a
little rack for making toast with.

It was once possible to buy replacement coiled elements for
radiant fires. You simply removed the failed one, used a piece
of string to get the length and stretched the new one to suit.
My dad told me that in his college days (1930s) they heated a
room by suspending such an element from the mantelpiece.

Mind you, his mains electric soil sterilisation kit was a bit of
an eye opener - wooden box, metal plate at each end, fill with
soil, add water until ammeter reaches desired level, leave to
simmer. I can smell it now.

Chris

--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.

Owain wrote:
wrote:
David Hansen wrote:

They are amusing if one wants to horrify a "safety" person.
To do that you need the full set, 2-way bulb adaptor & BC plug.

You really need a boiling ring plugged in - one of those made from a
spiral of bare resistance wire in a ceramic former, that came with a
little rack for making toast with.

Owain

Perfect! With overload illusion thrown in. For safety you cant beat
liquids boiling over onto those bare elements. And boiling off before
meeting the earthed case, thus making the panful of boiling stuff live
at some random proportion of mains voltage. Metal handles anyone? Mind
you in fairness I dont think I ever boiled mine over, 500w just isnt
enough power. Might work with milk though.

(Or a bowl heater, that adds a bit of mechanical instability into the
equation.)

Apparently they still use those bare wire cooking rings in Japan, on
110v.


Seriously, I wonder just how safe a setup like this would be today if
it were run off a CU with RCD or RCBO.


NT

In message , John
writes
Is it possible to get a "Y" adapter which plugs into the existing
lampsocket and then allows me to plug in two CFLs?

Never seen anything like that. Why not just change the fitting to a
multiple lamp holder that you like?

Look! I just made my own and you can plug kettles and washing machines
in too. I didn't know what to do with the green wire so I stuck it up
the hole and it went bang so I pulled it out again. I don't think it's
needed because everything works OK but the kettle makes me feel all
tingly when I pick it up.

http://www.emanator.demon.co.uk/sockets.jpg

--
Betty Fudgepacker.
DIY with the feminine touch.

I have never understood how it is still permitted to have a
lampholder like in the OP
http://www.toolstation.com/messages.html?closeUp=27046

The way the lampholder is suspended depends on the grip of the actual
screw-fittings on the bare wires.

If a moderately heavy lampshade is used then the whole thing seems to
be asking for trouble.

Does the US have ceiling pendant lampholders as dodgy as this?

There is so much safety in electrical products these days that I just
wonder how this sort of lampholder is not obliged to have a decent
flex grip in it.

Lampholders are the only electrical accessories where access to live
terminals without using tools is considered safe. Anybody know why?

In message , Chris J Dixon
writes
Mind you, his mains electric soil sterilisation kit was a bit of an eye
opener - wooden box, metal plate at each end, fill with soil, add water
until ammeter reaches desired level, leave to simmer. I can smell it
now.

EYE OPENER! Not half!!!!!! They only just "rediscovered" not long
ago that passing electric current through blood would sterilise it by
killing the bacteria and viruses without causing apparent damage to the
blood. Subsequent experiments have been carried out involving in situ
sterilisation of human blood by passing low DC currents through a human
body. If claims are to be believed, it deactivated the AIDs virus
giving "low T-cell counts" whatever they are.

I wonder where he discovered the soil sterilisation technique.

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

In message .com,
dcbwhaley writes
Lampholders are the only electrical accessories where access to live
terminals without using tools is considered safe. Anybody know why?

It's just been Grandfathered through because it would have been too hard
to change every single lampholder in the world to comply. The newer
GU10 style lampholder is good though. It would be nice if they started
phasing the older BC and ES holders out.

Here in the UK we can get safety lamp holders which only connect the
power once the lamp is inserted and locked in position.

OK. Put your hand up if you ever stuck your finger in a lamp holder!


(Did it on a fairground ride when I was a kid! DC apparently.)

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 15:55:49 +0000, Owain wrote:

You really need a boiling ring plugged in - one of those made from a
spiral of bare resistance wire in a ceramic former, that came with a
little rack for making toast with.

Oh yeah. I took one of those and several similar electric fires to the
dump when clearing out my fathers loft. Can you still get electric fires
with exposed resistance wire wound around a ceramic former? Can't say I
seen any recently, they all seem to be "ceramic", fan, convector or oil
filled these days.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

In message om, Dave
Liquorice writes
Oh yeah. I took one of those and several similar electric fires to the
dump when clearing out my fathers loft. Can you still get electric
fires with exposed resistance wire wound around a ceramic former? Can't
say I seen any recently, they all seem to be "ceramic", fan, convector
or oil filled these days.

Nah, you need to poke a key or screwdriver through a plastic grill to
get a decent shock these days.

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

In article .com,
"dcbwhaley" writes:

Lampholders are the only electrical accessories where access to live
terminals without using tools is considered safe. Anybody know why?

B22d (bayonet cap) lampholders are grandfathered and exempt from
IP2X requirements because there are no recorded deaths from them
(at least, not due to touching the live pins).

--
Andrew Gabriel

Clive Mitchell wrote:

OK. Put your hand up if you ever stuck your finger in a lamp holder!

Yeah, been there done that, aged about 7 or 8 I suppose. And it really
makes me shudder to recall that after having got a reasonable belt from
it, my immediate reaction was to fetch my little sister and get her to
stick hers in there too. Ha ha ha. Got another belt - much worse -
when my old man found out...

David

Lobster wrote:
Clive Mitchell wrote:

OK. Put your hand up if you ever stuck your finger in a lamp holder!

Yeah, been there done that, aged about 7 or 8 I suppose. And it really
makes me shudder to recall that after having got a reasonable belt from
it, my immediate reaction was to fetch my little sister and get her to
stick hers in there too. Ha ha ha. Got another belt - much worse -
when my old man found out...


Well, as kids we all do silly things. Aged 10, with absolutely no sense
at all, I puffed the garage's compressed air nozzle in the direction of
my sister's ear. Thankfully I missed ;-)

--
Adrian C

"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
[snip]

Well, as kids we all do silly things. Aged 10, with absolutely no sense
at all, I puffed the garage's compressed air nozzle in the direction of
my sister's ear. Thankfully I missed ;-)

When I was around 14, I climbed up an AC 20kV square tower, one that has a
3-phase stepdown transformer, just to get hold of a 160W blended light lamp.

I got the lamp, but was later notified that I could have easily been killed
being so close to the high voltage transformer, which occasionally closes
airgaps using electric sparks, particularly on wet nights.

A really stupid thing to do :-(

--
Adrian C
--
Ioannis
-------
The best way to predict reality, is to know exactly what you DON'T want.

The message
from Lobster contains these words:

OK. Put your hand up if you ever stuck your finger in a lamp holder!

Yeah, been there done that, aged about 7 or 8 I suppose.

I was about five and clearly remember pretending I'd stuck my finger
with a drawing pin to explain the loud shout and sudden anguish. I can
picture the lamp fitting now, conical spun metal with a gold finish and
small star-shaped perforations round the end for ventilation, mounted on
a bendy stalk. Very late 50s early 60s.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

Ioannis wrote:
"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
[snip]

Well, as kids we all do silly things. Aged 10, with absolutely no sense
at all, I puffed the garage's compressed air nozzle in the direction of
my sister's ear. Thankfully I missed ;-)

When I was around 14, I climbed up an AC 20kV square tower, one that has a
3-phase stepdown transformer, just to get hold of a 160W blended light lamp.

I got the lamp, but was later notified that I could have easily been killed
being so close to the high voltage transformer, which occasionally closes
airgaps using electric sparks, particularly on wet nights.

A really stupid thing to do :-(

So didn't you have a sister, then? ;-)

David

"Lobster" wrote in message
...

Ioannis wrote:
"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
[snip]

Well, as kids we all do silly things. Aged 10, with absolutely no sense
at all, I puffed the garage's compressed air nozzle in the direction of
my sister's ear. Thankfully I missed ;-)

When I was around 14, I climbed up an AC 20kV square tower, one that has a
3-phase stepdown transformer, just to get hold of a 160W blended light
lamp.

I got the lamp, but was later notified that I could have easily been
killed
being so close to the high voltage transformer, which occasionally closes
airgaps using electric sparks, particularly on wet nights.

A really stupid thing to do :-(

So didn't you have a sister, then? ;-)

No, but I had a cousin, one year younger, whom I had waiting on the pavement
to catch the lamp, me throwing it from up high.

This was actually a very serious tactical mistake: I should have instructed
him to climb the tower instead :-P

David
--
Ioannis
-------
The best way to predict reality, is to know exactly what you DON'T want.

On Sun, 10 Dec 2006 22:46:11 GMT, Lobster wrote:

OK. Put your hand up if you ever stuck your finger in a lamp holder!

Yeah, been there done that, aged about 7 or 8 I suppose.

About that age for me as well and a bayonet lamp holder. I knew that
getting a blet from the mains wasn't a good idea but that didn't stop me
accidentally sticking a finger up the holder. Blooming hurt, I guess bulb
holder shocks are less likley to be fatal as the chances are you'll pick
up the neutral on the same finger so most of the current travels in the
finger rather than through/across your chest.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes
B22d (bayonet cap) lampholders are grandfathered and exempt from IP2X
requirements because there are no recorded deaths from them (at least,
not due to touching the live pins).

Lots of burnt fingertips though apparently.

--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com

In article ,
writes:
I remember an 'off peak' heatbank/storage heater at work about 30 years ago.
It comprised a large tank insulated with about 30 cm of asbestos. It was
heated by 'electrode' boilers, where the element was the water circulating
through the tank (and central heating radiators as well, but they may have
been on a secondary circulation). The instructions included adding salt to
the water if the 'electrodes' didn't draw enough power (to earth, the boiler
casing) with the electrode shields fully retracted. You added salt until the
boiler sucked enough power from the mains to give full power with 80% of the
electrodes exposed. A servo system (which didn't work, automagically adjusted
the electrode shields to achieve this.

The system was installed in the 1930s I wonder what current HSE peeps would
think of it.

Such systems are still used for electric water heaters.
Look up elecrode boilers on google. They tend to need
3-phase supplies which rules them out for most of the
UK domestic market, but they are used both domestically
and commercially elsewhere.

--
Andrew Gabriel