This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and not
care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written. thankyall

wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and
not care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written.
thankyall

Hello Yank
pmsl, while you're saving 2 gallons a week, the water board is fixing leaks
thats gushing out 20 gallons an hour.
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

Hello Yank
pmsl, while you're saving 2 gallons a week, the water board is fixing
leaks
thats gushing out 20 gallons an hour.

Where is the yank, I cant see one!?!?

Paul Herber wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:33:22 GMT, "The3rd Earl Of Derby"
wrote:

wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it

Hello Yank

Actually you might find the OP is an Aussie, unless Brisbane has moved
to the other side of the Pacific.

Could be a yank in Aussie. ;-)
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:33:22 GMT, "The3rd Earl Of Derby"
wrote:

wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it

Hello Yank

Actually you might find the OP is an Aussie, unless Brisbane has moved
to the other side of the Pacific.

--
Regards, Paul Herber, Sandrila Ltd. http://www.pherber.com/
Electronics for Visio http://www.electronics.sandrila.co.uk/

Sparks wrote:
Hello Yank
pmsl, while you're saving 2 gallons a week, the water board is fixing
leaks
thats gushing out 20 gallons an hour.

Where is the yank, I cant see one!?!?

Yank expression
"thankyall"
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

"The3rd Earl Of Derby" wrote in message
k...
wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and
not care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written.
thankyall

Hello Yank
pmsl, while you're saving 2 gallons a week, the water board is fixing
leaks
thats gushing out 20 gallons an hour.

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:49:16 UTC, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

You just waste oxygen.

--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
Avenue Supplies, http://avenuesupplies.co.uk

Doctor Drivel wrote:
"The3rd Earl Of Derby" wrote in message
k...
wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and
not care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering
and total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips
iv'e done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist
for a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent
evaporation from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written.
thankyall

Hello Yank
pmsl, while you're saving 2 gallons a week, the water board is fixing
leaks
thats gushing out 20 gallons an hour.

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

So long as there is cloud formation there will always be water,its the
energy resources that we have to worry about, you can only take so much out
of the ground and one day it'll run dry.
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

wrote in message
oups.com...
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and not
care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.

That's in lucky parts of the world where water is on tap. Many people have
to walk miles to collect dirty water and still only have as much for a day's
supply as many people here use to clean their teeth. And we're flushing our
waste with drinking water. It's not right.

Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun

If you use plants which are drought resistant that's even better.

We collect roof water in five butts to use for vegetables.

Lawns are a waste of space, time and energy as well as water.

Have a water meter fitted. If people pay directly for water they'll be more
caring.

- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on

I don't think that applies to dishwashers in UK.

- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

That's a good idea. I keep a bucket to fill with dead water when running the
first warm water of the morning. The water in the bucket is used to flush
the lavatory.

You don't need to shower every day as I've discovered recently, having had
toe surgery which has to be keptdry means that I've had to have a bowl wash.
It doesn't feel good but it's not the end of the world and has saved a lot
of water. It could be done every other day instead of having a daily shower.

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written. thankyall

Water is precious, we should value it and not waste it.

Our local water supplier is VERY concerned about leaks, both major and
minor. The inspector comes round regularly to check the stop tap for
domestic leaks, if he detects any he alerts the householder.

Mary

wrote in message
oups.com...
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and not
care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written. thankyall

What narks me about this whole water-saving thing is that there's this
little force called gravity. Gravity keeps all the water "in" (for want of a
better expression) and not one single drop of water has ever left this
planet (apart from the supplies that astronauts take with them) so why is
there a water shortage?

Mogweed.

wrote:
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and not
care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.
Many people care about the world and so do I. Here are some tips iv'e
done to save water for the future
- Most agents used for the soil , potting and plants keep it moist for
a period of time( at least not everyday)
- If you water in the morning or late dark it will prevent evaporation
from the sun
- Pull out roots to prevent them absorbing all the moisture
- Sweep rather hose to help reduce your water bills
- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on
- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

Those are some of the ideas that helped reduce the usage of water.
Please give all comments or tips on what I have just written. thankyall

While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and other
water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we need, so
much it doesnt need metering. People can water their gardens all they
want - and a few unfortuantely do - and we dont run out.

The sole reason for water saving _in Britain_ is cost reduction. If and
when there is a pipeline long enough to carry this water to dry
countries, that will change, but not today. For now the scare stories
about water reservoirs falling to 50% capacity are simply cost
reduction measures. Cost cutting is fair enough, and sensible, but the
talk of water crises in UK is simple hogwash. We are very wasteful of
water, and still have plenty.

Should we conserve water? Yes, but not for the reasons often offered.


NT

"Roger Mills (aka Set Square)" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Mary Fisher wrote:


- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on

I don't think that applies to dishwashers in UK.

I think he means fill with dishes (as opposed to half-filling it) rather
than with water.

AH - of course! Thank you :-) I did wonder how a dishwasher could fill with
water before the door is closed, it might have been a top loader - if there
is such a thing.


Mary

On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:49:16 -0000, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

There is no shortage of water.

If everyone used water as they wished the water companies would have
to invest £££££s in new infrastructure and obviously we can't have
that as it'll impact profits and pay-outs to shareholders.

Far better to tell people there is a shortage and put off upgrading
the water mains for a few more years..

sponix

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:49:16 UTC, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

You just waste oxygen.

You must be from Essex with that sort of wit.

In article ,
Mary Fisher wrote:
AH - of course! Thank you :-) I did wonder how a dishwasher could fill
with water before the door is closed, it might have been a top loader -
if there is such a thing.

Years ago a rented flat I lived in had an American top loading washing
machine. You could also use it for dishes by inserting the provided rack.
Didn't work too well on dirty dishes. ;-)

--
*Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Mary Fisher" wrote in message
t...

wrote in message
oups.com...
This topic is about water and saving it


As it used to be in the past, people used to use ample of water and not
care what will happen in the future. Today , my world , water is
declining and now most people are only allowed hand held watering and
total band of sprinklers.

That's in lucky parts of the world where water is on tap. Many people have
to walk miles to collect dirty water and still only have as much for a
day's supply as many people here use to clean their teeth. And we're
flushing our waste with drinking water. It's not right.

Only 5% of water is used for human consumption. Most is used for sanitary
usages. In the Benelux countries new home are required to have a rain water
tank in the garden using rain water for toilet flushing and garden watering.
Even in the UK these are financially feasible and they can be retrofitted to
existing homes. When fitted you water tariff is lowered.

Many people care about the world and so do I.

We are an island surrounded by water. Water covers 2/3 of the planet. We
are in a country which has an abundance of rain. WE can afford to liberally
use water. We just need the water infrastructure in place instead of relying
of a Victorian legacy. Because others are short of water does not mean have
to conserve to their levels.

Have a water meter fitted. If people pay directly for water they'll be
more caring.

In "most" cases it is cheaper on a meter. Simple and cheap measures can be
done to reduce water consumption: low flush toilets (have the cistern in the
loft and the flush pipes in the walls, then only a few l;litres will flush a
toilet), aerated taps (champagne type of taps), restrictors on taps to
reduce unnecessary flow. High flows waste water. A secondary hot water
citrculation loop reduces water wastage as water is instant at the taps.
Lower flows can be at the hot taps (restrict flow in the pipe). People will
not mind lower flows in basins as long hot water is instantly available at
the taps.

- Fill up your dishwasher before you turn it on

I don't think that applies to dishwashers in UK.

Do ours have to be empty of dishes to use?

- Keep a bucket inside your shower to water your plant

That's a good idea.

You will not get me with a bucket in the shower!!!

Water is precious,

Only in some parts of the world, not in the UK where we have an abundance of
it.

we should value it and not waste it.

Yep. But not go to silly lengths.

Our local water supplier is VERY concerned about leaks, both major and
minor. The inspector comes round regularly to check the stop tap for
domestic leaks, if he detects any he alerts the householder.

About time too.

wrote in message
oups.com...

The sole reason for water saving _in Britain_ is cost reduction. If and
when there is a pipeline long enough to carry this water to dry
countries, that will change, but not today. For now the scare stories
about water reservoirs falling to 50% capacity are simply cost
reduction measures. Cost cutting is fair enough, and sensible, but the
talk of water crises in UK is simple hogwash. We are very wasteful of
water, and still have plenty.

If water was scarce they would make mandatory water saving measures:
rainwater harvesting, as in BenNeLux, aerated taps, low flush toilets, DHW
secondary circulation loops, etc. We do not. Most new installations have
taps that gush out water, toilets that use water excessively, etc.

I am in favour of water preserving measures, like taps, toilets, etc.
rainwater harvesting? We probably don't really need it.

On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 12:40:13 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Mary Fisher wrote:
AH - of course! Thank you :-) I did wonder how a dishwasher could fill
with water before the door is closed, it might have been a top loader -
if there is such a thing.

Years ago a rented flat I lived in had an American top loading washing
machine. You could also use it for dishes by inserting the provided rack.
Didn't work too well on dirty dishes. ;-)


What even in the spin part of the cycle?

I thought that that was called a centrifuge


--

..andy

Mogweed wrote:
What narks me about this whole water-saving thing is that there's this
little force called gravity. Gravity keeps all the water "in" (for want of a
better expression) and not one single drop of water has ever left this
planet (apart from the supplies that astronauts take with them) so why is
there a water shortage?

Well you can split water into hydrogen and oxygen. However the problem
is that the water is in the wrong place, not that there's a shortage
overall.

Alex.

--
Alex Meaden
Technical Support Officer
Computing Service
University of Kent

wrote:
While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and other
water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we need, so
much it doesnt need metering. People can water their gardens all they
want - and a few unfortuantely do - and we dont run out.

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our
reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we will
run out. See the front page here for information:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/

Alex

--
Alex Meaden
Technical Support Officer
Computing Service
University of Kent

Sponix wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:49:16 -0000, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:


So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.


There is no shortage of water.

Right on! And Global Warming is a myth put about by anti-American
weenies, there's a superabundance of oil down there, we can dispose
easily of all our waste by digging bigger and bigger holes, the Third
World isn't really poor, and AIDS and avian flu are all in the mind.

Dream on, brother.

Douglas de Lacey.

Alex wrote:
wrote:
While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and
other water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we
need, so much it doesnt need metering. People can water their
gardens all they want - and a few unfortuantely do - and we dont run
out.

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our
reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we
will run out. See the front page here for information:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/

Alex

The swimming pools in the garden must go. ;-)

--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

"Doctor Drivel" wrote

A secondary hot water citrculation loop reduces water wastage as water is
instant at the taps. People will not mind lower flows in basins as long
hot water is instantly available at the taps.

How does the energy requirement of a pump to provide the circulation compare
to the cost of water saving?

Sounds like more of a luxury than a cost saving feature!

Phil

wrote:

While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and other
water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we need,

Sadly this is not true. Indeed, paradoxicaly here in East Anglia we are
promised standpipes in the street this summer, together with significant
flooding in over-populated parts (eg where the gummint is forcing us to
build huge housing estates on known flood-plains). The (UK) problem is
largely water *management*, but we cannot just build ever-larger
reservoirs to get out of trouble. And as the globe heats up
precipitation patterns will change (and presumably more water will stay
in vapour form).

Should we conserve water? Yes, but not for the reasons often offered.

The only reason given was "water is declining". That's not an
unreasonable way of looking at it.

Douglas de Lacey

"Douglas de Lacey" wrote in message
...
Sponix wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 00:49:16 -0000, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:

So two wrongs make a right and we should all waste water then.

There is no shortage of water.

Right on! And Global Warming is a myth put about by anti-American weenies,

It is? Strange in that al the world's major scientists on the topic say
global warming is happening, even the US ones too.

there's a superabundance of oil down there,

And we can choke opurselves to death in burning it too.

we can dispose easily of all our waste by digging bigger and bigger holes,

We can?

the Third World isn't really poor,

It isn't?

and AIDS and avian flu are all in the mind.

It is?

And he is posting from a snotty uni too. That says it all.

Dream on, brother.

What cloud are you bouncing from?

"Alex" wrote in message
...

However the problem is that the water is in the wrong place, not that
there's a shortage overall.

Water is the right place. People decide to live in the wrong places. Takes
your choice.

"Alex" wrote in message
...
wrote:
While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and other
water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we need, so
much it doesnt need metering. People can water their gardens all they
want - and a few unfortuantely do - and we dont run out.

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our
reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we will
run out. See the front page here for information:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/

Other regions have more than enough. It is a matter of having a pipeline
infrastructure to pump from one region to another. Then the hardness may
vary throughout the year. Also they should repair the leaks in their
underground pipes instated of paying dividends.

"Alex" wrote in message
...
Mogweed wrote:
What narks me about this whole water-saving thing is that there's this
little force called gravity. Gravity keeps all the water "in" (for want
of a better expression) and not one single drop of water has ever left
this planet (apart from the supplies that astronauts take with them) so
why is there a water shortage?

Well you can split water into hydrogen and oxygen. However the problem is
that the water is in the wrong place, not that there's a shortage overall.

Well said.

Mary

Alex.

--
Alex Meaden
Technical Support Officer
Computing Service
University of Kent

Here in Gibraltar water has always been an issue. Our mains water is
now desalinated - tastes foul but at least we don't run out in summer.
It's metered and billed monthly. Some of the locals are such tightwads
that, having worked out that a minimum flow of water is needed to
register on the meter, they set up taps to drip overnight into buckets
so that they can have some "free" water! We also have a separate,
unmetered, strained salt water network for flushing lavatories.

Pen

TheScullster wrote:
"Doctor Drivel" wrote

A secondary hot water citrculation loop reduces water wastage as water is
instant at the taps. People will not mind lower flows in basins as long
hot water is instantly available at the taps.

How does the energy requirement of a pump to provide the circulation compare
to the cost of water saving?


Not half as much as the loss of heat circulating how water through a
cold roof does.

Sounds like more of a luxury than a cost saving feature!

It is.

Phil

On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 14:14:16 -0000 Doctor Drivel wrote :
Firstly it "saves" water and reduces the water bill. The longer the
dead-leg DHW pipe runs the more the saving.

I don't deny the amenity value, but would challenge you to show how
this will save money.

The last time I checked metered water was 90p per cubic metre (1000
litres): assume it's doubled since. 10m of 15mm copper tube contains
about 1/8 litre - 8000 draw-offs saves £1.80. If you can do your
timer, return leg and pump for £100 you'd be doing well. So by the
time you get to 450,000 draw-offs you'll have recovered the
installation cost by the water saved. It's just that in the meantime
those pipes have continuously been losing expensive heat for x hours a
day instead of just once between each use. Yes you'd save money on
water more quickly on a longer dead leg but then you'd be spending
even more keeping the water hot - Google wouldn't quickly give me a
figure for the heat loss from an insulated copper pipe.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk
Free SEDBUK boiler database browser http://www.sda.co.uk/qsedbuk.htm
[Latest version QSEDBUK 1.12 released 8 Dec 2005]

Alex wrote:
wrote:

While this water saving drive may be a serious matter in Aus and other
water-problem territories, in UK we have more water than we need, so
much it doesnt need metering. People can water their gardens all they
want - and a few unfortuantely do - and we dont run out.

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our
reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we will
run out. See the front page here for information:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/

Alex

That page offered nothing at all to substantiate the alleged water
shortage. The reality is we have such an excess of water we can water
our gardens all day any day we want. We have masses more than we need.

Do you not notice these stories help to keep water prices as high as
poss, help to get politicos on the side of water metering and price
hikes, and condition the public to accept ever rising prices?

The day water gets short we'll adopt the aussie methods of
conservation. Aerators on taps, dangly things that only let water out
when your hand is right under the tap, "If its yellow its mellow, if
its brown flush it down" and so on.

We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day.


NT

"Tony Bryer" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 14:14:16 -0000 Doctor Drivel wrote :
Firstly it "saves" water and reduces the water bill. The longer the
dead-leg DHW pipe runs the more the saving.

I don't deny the amenity value, but would challenge you to show how
this will save money.

The last time I checked metered water was 90p per cubic metre (1000
litres): assume it's doubled since.

Actually ....; even with the base price quoted it is (approximately)
double : 'they' sting you for the water supplied _and_ for the
waste removed [my supplier 'allows' five percent off the quantity
presumably 'they' reckon I perspire and/or urinate outside the house!]


10m of 15mm copper tube contains
about 1/8 litre - 8000 draw-offs saves £1.80. If you can do your
timer, return leg and pump for £100 you'd be doing well. So by the
time you get to 450,000 draw-offs you'll have recovered the
installation cost by the water saved. It's just that in the meantime
those pipes have continuously been losing expensive heat for x hours a
day instead of just once between each use. Yes you'd save money on
water more quickly on a longer dead leg but then you'd be spending
even more keeping the water hot - Google wouldn't quickly give me a
figure for the heat loss from an insulated copper pipe.


Concur with the economics.argument Saving water while wasting heat
isn't too good.

--

Brian

wrote in message
ups.com...


We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day.

You might.

On 20 Feb 2006 11:12:35 -0800, wrote:

Sorry, but that's really not the case, at least in the south east. Our
reservoirs are getting very low, and there's a very real chance we will
run out. See the front page here for information:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/

Alex

That page offered nothing at all to substantiate the alleged water
shortage.

See:
http://www.southernwater.co.uk/pdfs/educationAndEnviro/waterResources/DroughtLeaflet.pdf

The reality is we have such an excess of water we can water
our gardens all day any day we want.

Not in certain areas, to do so would mean reservoirs and boreholes
running dry, then there will be no water for essential uses.

We have masses more than we need.

Not where it's needed, it's a regional problem.

Do you not notice these stories help to keep water prices as high as
poss, help to get politicos on the side of water metering and price
hikes, and condition the public to accept ever rising prices?

Prices will rise to some extent, due to increasing plant, machinery
and employee costs. Should the employees go without a pay rise for the
next 10 years?

The day water gets short we'll adopt the aussie methods of
conservation. Aerators on taps, dangly things that only let water out
when your hand is right under the tap, "If its yellow its mellow, if
its brown flush it down" and so on.

It's already short in certain areas.

We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day.

This is why meters make sense, should the low user pay the same
towards investment as idiots want to waste as much as they want?

cheers,
Pete.

"Tony Bryer" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 20 Feb 2006 14:14:16 -0000 Doctor Drivel wrote :
Firstly it "saves" water and reduces the water bill. The longer the
dead-leg DHW pipe runs the more the saving.

I don't deny the amenity value, but would
challenge you to show how this will save
money.

The last time I checked metered water was 90p per cubic metre (1000
litres): assume it's doubled since. 10m of 15mm copper tube contains
about 1/8 litre - 8000 draw-offs saves £1.80.

Most dead-legs waste about 2 litres of water, and in larger homes even more,
and you may have a number of them around the house. Large parts of the
dead-legs are 22mm pipe. With a large family the water wastage from
dead-legs is substantial.

It's just that in the meantime
those pipes have continuously
been losing expensive heat for x hours a
day instead of just once between each use.

Yes you'd save money on
water more quickly on a longer
dead leg but then you'd be spending
even more keeping the water hot

Not if they are fully insulated they will not.

A secondary loop is one of those things that once you have one you would
always have another.............and it saves you money on water bills too.
A sort of win, win.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
TheScullster wrote:
"Doctor Drivel" wrote

A secondary hot water citrculation loop reduces water wastage as water
is instant at the taps. People will not mind lower flows in basins as
long hot water is instantly available at the taps.

How does the energy requirement of a pump to provide the circulation
compare to the cost of water saving?


Not half as much as the loss of heat circulating how water through a cold
roof does.

Sounds like more of a luxury than a cost saving feature!

It is.

There is such a thing as heavy pipe insulation.

wrote in message
ups.com...

Do you not notice these stories help to keep water prices as high as
poss, help to get politicos on the side of water metering and price
hikes, and condition the public to accept ever rising prices?

You are dead right. They want to keep paying dividends, when they should be
uprating the water infrastructure. Their view is stop them using lost of
water and tell them we don't have much at all.

They do the same with land, another natural resource. They tell us we don't
have land in the UK, when we have a land surplus. In a country of 60
million, only 7.5% is settled, and when green spaces are taken into account
only 2.5% is paved. Ramming us all into a small sector of the land hikes up
house prices as land is about 2/3 of the price of the average house. Just
what they want, a nice little (er massive) earner on our behalf.

"Mary Fisher" wrote in message
t...

wrote in message
ups.com...


We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day.

You might.

He said "We have so much we can and do throw lots away every day". If you
are foolish to go to desert restrictions on water, when there is no need to,
then that is your problem.

I believe further water conserving legislation should be in place, but there
is no need to treat water as if it is gold.