I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

K Ludger wrote:
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks



Drill press be damned.

Punch!

"K Ludger" wrote in
:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in
some powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm
thick, probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using
my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then
spent almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much
like to avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved
with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change &
drill) any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I
should use?

thanks



If you absolutely *insist* upon drilling, get yourself a bunch of 1" bi-
metallic hole saws and the appropriate mandrel.

The mandrel has a drill bit that will let you precisely spot the hole,
drill a pilot hole, and keep the saw centered.

Practice on some scrap 'till you get used to the amount of pressure you'll
need to apply.

"K Ludger" wrote:

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

Well, looks like you need to use a hole saw. Wonder if they make them with brazed in
carbide teeth?

I'd drill for a green lee punch and punch. I'd also beg borrow or steal a hydraulic
model or have an air ratchet to drive a non-hydraulic punch.



Wes

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:14:20 +0900, "K Ludger"
wrote:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

===========
If drill you must, you might look at a hole saw.

I don't see a 25 m/m listed, but this will give you an idea.
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32
you will also need the driver
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=606&PMCTLG=00

As the metal is pretty thin you might want to consider an
adjustable hole cutter. These are dangerous.
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...&PARTPG=INLMK3

An other option if your drill chuck is big enough [3/4 inch] is
to use a rotobroch. Good but spendy
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PARTPG=INLMK32

http://www.rotabroach.co.uk/en/produ...s/default.aspx
shows an exact 25m/m their sku SRC250. They also show a morse
taper adapter to replace the chuck.

Most any good mill supply house should be able to order for you
if they don't have in stock. Enco items are exmples.

Let us know what you decide on and how it works


Unka' George [George McDuffee]
-------------------------------------------
He that will not apply new remedies,
must expect new evils:
for Time is the greatest innovator: and
if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:14:20 +0900, "K Ludger"
wrote:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

Rotabroach. Rotabroach is a brand name, annular cutter is the generic
description. Not cheap, but will make clean, accurate holes in thin
material without damaging the finish. Make sure your drill press will
turn slowly enough, around 300RPM for mild steel. You may need an
adapter, as they usually have a 3/4" shank for mounting in a mag
drill. I use them on control panels for installing oiltight switches
when I want something more accurate than a Greenlee punch.
http://www.imatech.com.au/images/products/28.jpg

--
Ned Simmons

You don't say what size or HP your drill press is. As you probably already
know, the correct time to make the holes would be before the finish coating
is applied.

How will you be locating the location of the center of the hole? Center
punch? That's about how long a punch would take to make the hole.
Any drilling or hole saw method will take considerably longer than punching.
Some odd/uncommon/custom carbide-tipped spade bit with a center pilot drill
may be faster if you could find, or make such a cutter.

You will most likely spend a considerable amount of time deburring the
holes, regardless of the method you use to make the holes.
Step drills will deburr the entry side of the hole if you just kiss the next
step on the hole.
If the hole is located in the back of a box (not the sides), the deburring
time could be quite a bit faster, by flipping the part over to deburr.

I would hate to attempt to make that number of the holes without any cutting
lubricant, maybe not liquid, but at least beeswax or even bar soap (not
highly effective, but not extremely messy).

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"K Ludger" wrote in message
...
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick,
probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill
press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to
avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the
enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

The ball thrust bearings make those bolted punches very easy to operate.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Wes" wrote in message
...
"K Ludger" wrote:

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

Well, looks like you need to use a hole saw. Wonder if they make them
with brazed in
carbide teeth?

I'd drill for a green lee punch and punch. I'd also beg borrow or steal
a hydraulic
model or have an air ratchet to drive a non-hydraulic punch.



Wes

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:14:20 +0900, "K Ludger"
wrote:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

If the enclosures are built, I don't have any advice, although
personally I'd punch them. If they are not built, design your
enclosures carefully, locating all holes, square round, large small,
doesn't matter. Send the drawing (I use email) to an enclosure
fabricator near you, and they'll plasma cut the holes in the flat
sheet, bend up, weld, and powder coat the boxes. Saves a lot of money
and hassle, plus hole edges are powder coated. That's about the only
way I'll do enclosures of any complexity any more. I've also done it
in 4X.

Pete Keillor

In article , "K Ludger" wrote:
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

The ideal thing for sheet metal is something that can remove a disk,
rather than having to chew out all or the material. I've never used a
RotaBroach, but if you can afford one, that may be your best bet. I'm
not sure how bad they are for burrs. If you don't like deburring, a hole
saw will probably be worse than a step drill. A trepanning tool might
also work if you can hold & support it well.

Actually, I'm surprised you have a problem with burrs with the step
drill. A good quality one (not a Chinese knock-off) has always cut a
pretty clean hole for me, and if you move up towards the next step, you
can deburr the top side in the same operation. For the backside, I use
soemthing like a Noga or a Royal with the "?" shaped blade to get the far
side of the hole.

With any approach, having a good hard backing surface will help with
burrs and safety. If the metal can flex, it can grab, expecially if you
you a single point adjustable cutter. A trepanning tool tends to scrape
more than dig in, so it's a bit safer.

Doug White

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 00:16:08 -0500, the infamous "Wild_Bill"
scrawled the following:

The ball thrust bearings make those bolted punches very easy to operate.

Unless you buy a truly cheaparse copy from HF, complete with
mismatched threads http://tinyurl.com/7cvcdl . This is one of the few
tools they got -entirely- wrong.

RUN AWAY! RUN AWAY!


--
It is pretty hard to tell what does bring happiness;
poverty and wealth have both failed.
-- Kin Hubbard

Annular cutter.

Jancy and Hougen are a couple of brands.

You will quickly get a feel for the pressure required,
and leave very little burr.

"Wild_Bill" wrote:

The ball thrust bearings make those bolted punches very easy to operate.

Yup, and the slugbuster profile on the newer ones seem to cut through easier too.

Wes

K Ludger wrote:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks



I would drill each hole location with a drill the same size as the pilot
drill of a good carbide tipped hole saw. I would remove the pilot
drill of the hole saw and in stead use a solid mandrel. A hole punch is
a pain for more than a couple of holes. A cheap hole saw will make a
mess after it starts to get a little dull.

John

On 2008-12-21, Wild_Bill wrote:
You don't say what size or HP your drill press is. As you probably already
know, the correct time to make the holes would be before the finish coating
is applied.

And -- before the metal is bent to make the box.

How will you be locating the location of the center of the hole? Center
punch? That's about how long a punch would take to make the hole.

Assuming a proper punch (e.g. a turret punch), though it is nice
to have a center punch mark to feel for with the pip on the center of
the punch.

Any drilling or hole saw method will take considerably longer than punching.

Agreed -- unless it is a case of:

1) Drill a pilot hole.

2) Assemble a Greenlee chassis punch.

3) Spend quite a bit of time cranking on the drive screw.

(this can be made easier by using a hydraulic drive for the
punch, but not as nice as a lever operated turret punch, or
even a floor standing single station punch of similar size.)

Some odd/uncommon/custom carbide-tipped spade bit with a center pilot drill
may be faster if you could find, or make such a cutter.

And firmly clamp down the sheet metal to keep it from spinning
and slicing open your wrists.

You will most likely spend a considerable amount of time deburring the
holes, regardless of the method you use to make the holes.

Yep -- except for perhaps a CNC water jet.

Step drills will deburr the entry side of the hole if you just kiss the next
step on the hole.

Except that I think that the largest step drill size is 1",
which is his target dimension -- so there *is* no next step to use for
the deburr operation.

If the hole is located in the back of a box (not the sides), the deburring
time could be quite a bit faster, by flipping the part over to deburr.

Or if it is done before the box is folded.

I would hate to attempt to make that number of the holes without any cutting
lubricant, maybe not liquid, but at least beeswax or even bar soap (not
highly effective, but not extremely messy).

Agreed. The only lubricant free method which I see as practical
is the above-mentioned CNC water jet -- which could probably cut several
stacked up at once.

Didn't he say that he was going to be cutting in Stainless?
That will make it more difficult for all methods except the waterjet.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"K Ludger" wrote:

On the topic of chassis punches, will a 1/2 drive air wrench similar to the
one at the link below drive a Green Lee or Bramley 1" punch?

http://www.toolstation.com/images/li...bbig/45203.jpg

Sure should. At the very minimum it will reduce a lot of the manual wrenching

Would using soap / beeswax aid the punching operation?

Never tried it.

I would take care to keep the screw threads lubed.

Wes

That tool is commonly referred to as an air ratchet. They spin fasteners
until the fastener gets snug, then the operator starts turning it as thae
would a normal ratchet.

I never liked using them, or even being around them being used. They're loud
and irritating. In close quarters, they can trap your hand or injure your
fingers.

I prefer to use an air impact wrench, and for small/medium fasteners, the
3/8" drive was very satisfying to use. I don't know that a 3/8" impact
wrench would operate the punch very well though.

Do you realize how slow that type of punch will be for 300 holes? As you
know, you'll need to drill all the locations first.
Then you assemble the punch thru the hole (quickly if you can), then you
need to crank it down fully to punch the 1" diameter and shear the slug free
of the box.

Then you disassemble the punch and clear the slug. Sometimes the slug comes
out easily, other times not so quickly.

This method is a lot of parts handling and it takes time. If you start
dropping the punch parts it goes even slower.

There will still be a sharp edge where the male die/punch part passes thru
the metal, and although the punches don't usually cause much distortion, the
hole edge might be flat, so a step drill might not work as well for
deburring the hole.

Since the metal isn't heavy gage, you might be able to use a drill motor
with some serious torque.

You might want to also have a smaller, lighter drill motor to run the bolt
into the die quickly, then change to the slower drill motor with high
torque.

The only way that I could see the punching portion of the 300 piece job
moving along quickly would be to have at least several punches and a helper.

The 1 cubic foot boxes will take up a lot of workbench space, so a helper
might be able to assemble the punches in holes, and handle moving the boxes.

I'd most likely try to find a shop with some sort of punch press to make the
1" holes.

Hole saws generally aren't fast (or accurate) and they dull quickly if
they're pushed hard. In thin metal, they are prone to snagging and pulling
the workpiece out of whatever is holding it.
They should always be run relatively slow and be used with a cutting
lubricant on metal, which gets messy.

If your drill press would stall while attempting to use a step drill,
rotabroach or hole saw up to 1", then you're probably faced with using a
bolt-type punch.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"K Ludger" wrote in message
...

"K Ludger" wrote in message
...
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in
some powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick,
probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill
press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to
avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the
enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks


Wow so many replies - thanks to all!

I'm leaning toward drilling a single hole then using a Green Lee or
Bramley punch (wrench driven unfortunately).

My drill press while substantial has been retrofitted with a 1/2 hp single
phase 240V motor and with the current chuck (not morse taper) would not
handle a rotabroach. The enclosures are an off the shelf prefabbed item my
customer uses regularly. They are around 1'x1'x1' and are difficult to
clamp/locate on the drill press. The hole location is not critical within
0.1" will be ok, its for a cable gland to be fitted into.


On the topic of chassis punches, will a 1/2 drive air wrench similar to
the one at the link below drive a Green Lee or Bramley 1" punch?

http://www.toolstation.com/images/li...bbig/45203.jpg

Would using soap / beeswax aid the punching operation?


Many thanks for all of the advice.


Seasons greetings to all.

"Wild_Bill" wrote:


I prefer to use an air impact wrench, and for small/medium fasteners, the
3/8" drive was very satisfying to use. I don't know that a 3/8" impact
wrench would operate the punch very well though.

The 3/8 impact would be a better choice. I've used one before for holes in this range.
Had no problem with the typical hoffman box.

Wes

Wes, I'm not surprised that the 3/8" drive impact wrench worked to punch
holes in sheet steel boxes, but I didn't have any first hand experience
doing that.

It will still be noisy, but I think it's a better solution than an air
ratchet.

The little 3/8" impact I have is USA Chicago Pneumatic from the 70s, and was
a great tool for auto repair. I have a right-angle head accessory that is
handy for reaching some obstructed fasteners, not quite as compact as an air
ratchet, but really handy at times.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Wes" wrote in message
...
"Wild_Bill" wrote:


I prefer to use an air impact wrench, and for small/medium fasteners, the
3/8" drive was very satisfying to use. I don't know that a 3/8" impact
wrench would operate the punch very well though.

The 3/8 impact would be a better choice. I've used one before for holes
in this range.
Had no problem with the typical hoffman box.

Wes

"Wild_Bill" wrote:

Wes, I'm not surprised that the 3/8" drive impact wrench worked to punch
holes in sheet steel boxes, but I didn't have any first hand experience
doing that.

It will still be noisy, but I think it's a better solution than an air
ratchet.

The little 3/8" impact I have is USA Chicago Pneumatic from the 70s, and was
a great tool for auto repair. I have a right-angle head accessory that is
handy for reaching some obstructed fasteners, not quite as compact as an air
ratchet, but really handy at times.

I was thinking that the 1/2" ratchet would have enough torque. The 3/8 impact or 3/8
butterfly impact will work just fine for sure. Small impacts have a purpose also.

I used my brothers 18v drill recently. Two screws later, I was out to my car to get my
much nicer to use and hold 14.4 v drill.

Weight really matters if you have to do repetitive operations.

Wes

In article , "K Ludger" wrote:

"K Ludger" wrote in message
...
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick,
probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill
press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to
avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the
enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks


Wow so many replies - thanks to all!

I'm leaning toward drilling a single hole then using a Green Lee or Bramley
punch (wrench driven unfortunately).

My drill press while substantial has been retrofitted with a 1/2 hp single
phase 240V motor and with the current chuck (not morse taper) would not
handle a rotabroach. The enclosures are an off the shelf prefabbed item my
customer uses regularly. They are around 1'x1'x1' and are difficult to
clamp/locate on the drill press. The hole location is not critical within
0.1" will be ok, its for a cable gland to be fitted into.
snip

I would see if you can rent one of the hydraulic Greenley punch pullers.
They are designed for the job, and I would think it might be the sort of
thing one could rent someplace.

Doug White

(Doug White) wrote:

I would see if you can rent one of the hydraulic Greenley punch pullers.
They are designed for the job, and I would think it might be the sort of
thing one could rent someplace.


If I have to do two or three, I use my wrench set. More than that I get the hydraulic
tool from the tool crib.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:09:52 -0500, Wes wrote:

(Doug White) wrote:

I would see if you can rent one of the hydraulic Greenley punch pullers.
They are designed for the job, and I would think it might be the sort of
thing one could rent someplace.


If I have to do two or three, I use my wrench set. More than that I get the hydraulic
tool from the tool crib.

The Greenlee ball screw puller is the fastest and easiset I've used
for small punches. 2-3 turns with amazingly little effort for a 1/2"
(7/8 dia) knockout. But a crescent wrench is quicker to take out and
put away for just a couple holes.
http://www.toolup.com/Greenlee/1904.html

--
Ned Simmons

On 2008-12-22, K Ludger wrote:

[ ... ]

Wow so many replies - thanks to all!

I'm leaning toward drilling a single hole then using a Green Lee or Bramley
punch (wrench driven unfortunately).

Ouch! Get the ball-bearing screw for it, which will reduce the
required torque somewhat -- and use high pressure grease on the threads.
It is still going to be a lot of work going through matierial that
thick. (Hmm ... was it steel, or aluminum?) Steel will be stressing the
Greenlee punch nearly 1mm thick material. Aluminum you can probably do.

Put the punch on the outside, and the die on the inside, and
hold the punch in a heavy vise. (Or, I guess that you could get an
open-end wrench to fit the distance between flats on the punch side of
things.) Anyway -- the die goes on the inside because it will scuff the
surface of the panel, so put it where it can't be seen.

My drill press while substantial has been retrofitted with a 1/2 hp single
phase 240V motor and with the current chuck (not morse taper) would not
handle a rotabroach.

The chuck itself would not be Morse taper anyway. It might have
a female Jacobs taper in the back of the chuck to adapt it to a Morse
taper arbor -- or directly to the spindle if it is a cheap or small
drill press. Or -- the spindle might be threaded, and the chuck screwed
onto that.

The enclosures are an off the shelf prefabbed item my
customer uses regularly. They are around 1'x1'x1' and are difficult to
clamp/locate on the drill press. The hole location is not critical within
0.1" will be ok, its for a cable gland to be fitted into.

O.K. What about the diameter? You were mentioning either 1" or
25mm in the "Subject: " header, and they are not identical. 1" is
25.4mm, so is a difference of 0.4mm enough to be a problem for whatever
is going in the holes?

On the topic of chassis punches, will a 1/2 drive air wrench similar to the
one at the link below drive a Green Lee or Bramley 1" punch?

http://www.toolstation.com/images/li...bbig/45203.jpg

I doubt it. Those are good for quick screwing and unscrewing of
bolts before they tighten up, but they stall before you get to the
torque you need for the Greenlee punch. (At least, the one which I have
would.) You could use it for taking up the threads (those drive screws
are *long*, and for backing the screw back out, but you'll have to shift
to something manual for the serious part of the work. I would probably
use a ratchet torque wrench (if it is within the range of the torque
wrench's capacity) because it has a longer arm than the typical ratchet
wrench.

This probably means that you will want two sockets to fit the
Greenlee drive screw -- one for the air wrench, and one for the torque
wrench.

Would using soap / beeswax aid the punching operation?

What workpiece material? There is a wax designed to help
cutting with a bandsaw (Castrol makes at least one version of it), and
it might help with the aluminum if applied to the cutting edges of the
punch -- but you want a good high pressure oil or grease on the threads
of the drive screw.

At least with the punch side on the o8utside, you can grip the
punch's flats with a good heavy bench vise (and you'll need a *heavy*
bench too if you are doing steel of that thickness).

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 23 Dec 2008 03:04:41 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

It is still going to be a lot of work going through matierial that
thick. (Hmm ... was it steel, or aluminum?) Steel will be stressing the
Greenlee punch nearly 1mm thick material. Aluminum you can probably do.

The capacity of a 1" slug-buster punch is 14ga (2.0mm) in steel. A 1"
slug-splitter is good up to 10ga (3.5mm) SS.

--
Ned Simmons

On 2008-12-23, Ned Simmons wrote:
On 23 Dec 2008 03:04:41 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

It is still going to be a lot of work going through material that
thick. (Hmm ... was it steel, or aluminum?) Steel will be stressing the
Greenlee punch nearly 1mm thick material. Aluminum you can probably do.

The capacity of a 1" slug-buster punch is 14ga (2.0mm) in steel. A 1"
slug-splitter is good up to 10ga (3.5mm) SS.

Good news. But he will still need a good solid vise to hold the
punch end while he turns the screw in the die end. What is the needed
torque for even 14 ga steel, let alone thicker stainless.

For that matter, how does it have greater capacity in stainless
steel (3.5mm) than in plain steel (2mm). (I presume we are talking
about mild steel.)

For that matter -- are those figures for turning the drive
screw, or for using a hydraulic puller?

I've never had a slug-buster (slug-splitter the same?) -- they
came out after I got my punches, but it would be nice to have that
feature.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

I know whatcha mean Wes. Drill motors have gotten surprisingly compact with
the use of permanent magnet motors, then tool designers get into a battery
voltage ****ing match, because they know that consumers are always chasing
bigger numbers, so the drills end up having 2 to 3 pound battery packs.

If I had to use drills a lot, I'd definitely make up a stretchy coiled cord
and a holster to hold the battery pack.

If you've seen Jai Alai players throwing arm compared to their other arm,
you should be able to spot the guys that use the 36V cordless tools all day
long.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Wes" wrote in message
...
"Wild_Bill" wrote:

Wes, I'm not surprised that the 3/8" drive impact wrench worked to punch
holes in sheet steel boxes, but I didn't have any first hand experience
doing that.

It will still be noisy, but I think it's a better solution than an air
ratchet.

The little 3/8" impact I have is USA Chicago Pneumatic from the 70s, and
was
a great tool for auto repair. I have a right-angle head accessory that is
handy for reaching some obstructed fasteners, not quite as compact as an
air
ratchet, but really handy at times.

I was thinking that the 1/2" ratchet would have enough torque. The 3/8
impact or 3/8
butterfly impact will work just fine for sure. Small impacts have a
purpose also.

I used my brothers 18v drill recently. Two screws later, I was out to my
car to get my
much nicer to use and hold 14.4 v drill.

Weight really matters if you have to do repetitive operations.

Wes

On 24 Dec 2008 02:10:37 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2008-12-23, Ned Simmons wrote:
On 23 Dec 2008 03:04:41 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

It is still going to be a lot of work going through material that
thick. (Hmm ... was it steel, or aluminum?) Steel will be stressing the
Greenlee punch nearly 1mm thick material. Aluminum you can probably do.

The capacity of a 1" slug-buster punch is 14ga (2.0mm) in steel. A 1"
slug-splitter is good up to 10ga (3.5mm) SS.

Good news. But he will still need a good solid vise to hold the
punch end while he turns the screw in the die end. What is the needed
torque for even 14 ga steel, let alone thicker stainless.

For that matter, how does it have greater capacity in stainless
steel (3.5mm) than in plain steel (2mm). (I presume we are talking
about mild steel.)

For that matter -- are those figures for turning the drive
screw, or for using a hydraulic puller?

I've never had a slug-buster (slug-splitter the same?) -- they
came out after I got my punches, but it would be nice to have that
feature.

Slug-busters and slug-splitters are different products. They both cut
the punched out slug in half so it doesn't get jammed around the draw
stud, and they look very similar. I'm not sure why the slug-splitters
will handle heavier material. Perhaps it's the material they're made
of. Slug-splitters are only for use with hydraulic or mechanical
pullers, not a wrench on the draw stud.

Slug-busters have been around for at least 25 years, slug-splitters
are a more recent introduction.

--
Ned Simmons

What's that Lassie? You say that K Ludger fell down the old
rec.crafts.metalworking mine and will die if we don't mount a rescue
by Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:14:20 +0900:

I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick, probably
30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to avoid
using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill) any
recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

Can you use a plasma cutter. Make a template to locate and size your
hole. Very quick. You might need to protect the inside surfaces with
a piece of scrap or something.

Dan
--

Dan H.

K Ludger wrote:

"K Ludger" wrote in message
...
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick,
probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill
press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to
avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the
enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks


Wow so many replies - thanks to all!

I'm leaning toward drilling a single hole then using a Green Lee or Bramley
punch (wrench driven unfortunately).

My drill press while substantial has been retrofitted with a 1/2 hp single
phase 240V motor and with the current chuck (not morse taper) would not
handle a rotabroach. The enclosures are an off the shelf prefabbed item my
customer uses regularly. They are around 1'x1'x1' and are difficult to
clamp/locate on the drill press. The hole location is not critical within
0.1" will be ok, its for a cable gland to be fitted into.

On the topic of chassis punches, will a 1/2 drive air wrench similar to the
one at the link below drive a Green Lee or Bramley 1" punch?

http://www.toolstation.com/images/li...bbig/45203.jpg

Would using soap / beeswax aid the punching operation?

Many thanks for all of the advice.

Seasons greetings to all.

I may be a bit late to the party...

This 1' cube is more or less like an electrical pull box? One side
removable cover and a flange on that side the cover screws onto? If so,
consider the following:

1. Make an 18" square baseplate out of 3/4" plywood.

2. Screw down 1x3 hardwood cleats onto the plywood to form a 1' square
opening that the enclosures will snugly seat in.

3. Attach one toggle clamp to the cleat on the open side of the
enclosure and adjust it to solidly hold down the enclosure when clamped.

4. Attach this simple fixture to your drill press, positioned
appropriately so that the hole location lines up with the spindle.

5. Drill the holes with a suitable step bit, hitting it with one of the
dry lub sticks occasionally.

Refine this overall process as needed, upgrading the fixture to a three
sided corner is needed if the enclosures tend to twist. I expect this
method will let you do an enclosure every 60 seconds or so with minimal
fuss, expense and cleanup.

There are some carbide hole cutters and carbide tipped hole saws at McMaster
Carr page 2343.
http://www.mcmaster.com/

Copied from their catalog:
Carbide Hole Cutters

Great for cutting smooth, clean holes, these heavy duty hole cutters cut
sheet metal, stainless steel, and plastics up to 1/4" thick. Carbide teeth
are brazed into the cutter to leave smooth holes. Cutters have a
spring-ejector system for easy slug removal. Shank is 1/2" dia. Pilot drill
is 1/4" dia.

RogerN

"K Ludger" wrote in message
...
I've got a job coming up to drill around 300 x 25mm diameter holes in some
powder coated steel electrical enclosures. The metal is 1mm thick,
probably 30 - 35 thou. Punching is out, I need to do this using my drill
press.

I've done a bunch of holes in the past using a step drill, and then spent
almost as much time again deburring the holes. I'de very much like to
avoid using coolant or Trefolex due to the cleanup involved with the
enclosures.

I'd like to drill the holes in one go (ie not pilot then change & drill)
any recommendations as to the best approach or tool that I should use?

thanks

On 2008-12-24, Ned Simmons wrote:
On 24 Dec 2008 02:10:37 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2008-12-23, Ned Simmons wrote:
On 23 Dec 2008 03:04:41 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

[ ... ]

I've never had a slug-buster (slug-splitter the same?) -- they
came out after I got my punches, but it would be nice to have that
feature.

Slug-busters and slug-splitters are different products. They both cut
the punched out slug in half so it doesn't get jammed around the draw
stud, and they look very similar. I'm not sure why the slug-splitters
will handle heavier material. Perhaps it's the material they're made
of. Slug-splitters are only for use with hydraulic or mechanical
pullers, not a wrench on the draw stud.

Slug-busters have been around for at least 25 years, slug-splitters
are a more recent introduction.

Well ... I got my first chassis punch back around 1958 or so.
By 25 years ago, I had all the sizes that I needed, and didn't have
money to play the game of replacing them just for a new feature. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

In article ,
Richard wrote:

Drill press be damned.

Punch!

Seconded.
--
-Ed Falk,
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/