I have been told that it is difficult to laser cut styrene as the plastic
will burn and curl up as the laser cuts through it.

I assume that this is due to the heat insulative properties of styrene.

The question, is there a plastic that will cut easily, is glueable,
bendable, and can be etched in a thickness down to .005 or .010 inch?

I have heard that acrylic that is laser cut is too thick.

I don't know about ABS, and heard that PVC fumes are too dangerous.

Thanks
Keith Walker

Think about a lid to a drink cup. That is made from HIPS or High Impact
Poly Styrene. As far as being easy to cut those are punched out by steel
rule dies.

What exactly are you trying to make?
--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.


"news.verizon.net" wrote in message
news:s5iZe.1053$qC4.330@trnddc02...
I have been told that it is difficult to laser cut styrene as the plastic
will burn and curl up as the laser cuts through it.

I assume that this is due to the heat insulative properties of styrene.

The question, is there a plastic that will cut easily, is glueable,
bendable, and can be etched in a thickness down to .005 or .010 inch?

I have heard that acrylic that is laser cut is too thick.

I don't know about ABS, and heard that PVC fumes are too dangerous.

Thanks
Keith Walker

"news.verizon.net" wrote in message
news:s5iZe.1053$qC4.330@trnddc02...
I have been told that it is difficult to laser cut styrene as the plastic
will burn and curl up as the laser cuts through it.

I assume that this is due to the heat insulative properties of styrene.

The question, is there a plastic that will cut easily, is glueable,
bendable, and can be etched in a thickness down to .005 or .010 inch?

I have heard that acrylic that is laser cut is too thick.

I don't know about ABS, and heard that PVC fumes are too dangerous.

Thanks
Keith Walker


The best (and cheapest) way to cut and engrave most plastics is with a CNC
router. The machines can cut as fast as laser and give an excellent finish
if the travel speed is kept at reasonable speed. Most cutting contractors
prefur a DXF format drawing as do the laser cutters. An alternative which is
slower and usually more expensive is water jet. I usually reserve that for
hard stuff like tungsten carbide or glass,but it will cut plastics very
nicely if that's all that's available in your area.

Tom

I've had fiberglass-epoxy, polycarbonate, and acrylic laser cut in
thicknesses down to 1/16 inch. The FRP and PC had charring on the edges,
but the cuts were otherwise OK. Acrylic had the cleanest finish - almost
polished. As for "etching" plastics, that's usually a thing I try to
avoid have happen, so I can't offer any advice there.

Some shops will not cut plastics at all anymore because of the fumes and
OSHA. Give these folks a call or email:

http://www.rontro.com/

They have no problems with prototype/small orders, and they're willing
to cut plastics.

news.verizon.net wrote:
I have been told that it is difficult to laser cut styrene as the plastic
will burn and curl up as the laser cuts through it.

I assume that this is due to the heat insulative properties of styrene.

The question, is there a plastic that will cut easily, is glueable,
bendable, and can be etched in a thickness down to .005 or .010 inch?

I have heard that acrylic that is laser cut is too thick.

I don't know about ABS, and heard that PVC fumes are too dangerous.

Thanks
Keith Walker

As for engraving, I am looking to scribe a very thin line, as in .00025"
I don't think a router will get me that.

Keith Walker

"Tom Miller" wrote in message
. ..
:
: "news.verizon.net" wrote in message
: news:s5iZe.1053$qC4.330@trnddc02...
: I have been told that it is difficult to laser cut styrene as the
plastic
: will burn and curl up as the laser cuts through it.
:
: I assume that this is due to the heat insulative properties of styrene.
:
: The question, is there a plastic that will cut easily, is glueable,
: bendable, and can be etched in a thickness down to .005 or .010 inch?
:
: I have heard that acrylic that is laser cut is too thick.
:
: I don't know about ABS, and heard that PVC fumes are too dangerous.
:
: Thanks
: Keith Walker
:
:
: The best (and cheapest) way to cut and engrave most plastics is with a CNC
: router. The machines can cut as fast as laser and give an excellent finish
: if the travel speed is kept at reasonable speed. Most cutting contractors
: prefur a DXF format drawing as do the laser cutters. An alternative which
is
: slower and usually more expensive is water jet. I usually reserve that for
: hard stuff like tungsten carbide or glass,but it will cut plastics very
: nicely if that's all that's available in your area.
:
: Tom
:
:
:

"news.verizon.net" wrote in message
news:4tNZe.3095$il4.2625@trnddc04...
As for engraving, I am looking to scribe a very thin line, as in .00025"
I don't think a router will get me that.


I am worried about your choice of material. Styrene is not going to be an
exact thickness so trying to hold that kind of accuracy is not going to
happen. Also if you try and do it with a laser, you are going to get some
heat deformation.

What exactly are you trying to make?

--

__
Roger Shoaf

Important factors in selecting a mate:
1] Depth of gene pool
2] Position on the food chain.

Roger,

I am thinking of designing an model airplane kit analogous to the way
paper airplane kits are designed.

Big difference is that if you make the kit out of styrene, you can bend,
glue, sand and paint it. With paper as your medium you can not do that!

Hence my requirement for thin line widths (within reason)

Here is a good example of paper kits:
http://www.papermodels.co.il/

Keith Walker

Roger Shoaf wrote:
I am worried about your choice of material. Styrene is not going to be an
exact thickness so trying to hold that kind of accuracy is not going to
happen. Also if you try and do it with a laser, you are going to get some
heat deformation.

What exactly are you trying to make?

"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:jo3_e.11951$TQ3.6949@trnddc05...

Roger,

I am thinking of designing an model airplane kit analogous to the way
paper airplane kits are designed.

Big difference is that if you make the kit out of styrene, you can bend,
glue, sand and paint it. With paper as your medium you can not do that!

Hence my requirement for thin line widths (within reason)

Here is a good example of paper kits:
http://www.papermodels.co.il/

Keith Walker

OK Keith, let's think about something here. .00025 inches is an
unreasonable quest for a line to be scribed on a chunk of plastic. You
would need the light just right and good magnification just to see it. If
you wanted to cut out pieces to assemble an airplane out of styrene like the
card model you showed you can cut them out with a pair of scissors or an
ex-acto knife.

If you wanted to make a bunch of them and pre-cut the model parts, then you
can get a steel rule die made up to cut them out of sheet stock. That is
low tech and cheep.

You may also wish to consider vacuum forming some of the more intricate
curves. This is also cheep but requires a certain degree of skill to make
the molds, but far less than injection molding.

Lasers a really great tools but you really don't need to go there to make
toys.

--
Roger Shoaf

If knowledge is power, and power corrupts, what does this say about the
Congress?

there are already manufacturers selling paper kits that are laser cut.
same goes for wood kits.
if you have ever built a complicated paper kit, you know that hundreds
of hours are spent just cutting the parts out with a scissors; a laser
would remove most of that work.
kww

Roger Shoaf wrote:
"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:jo3_e.11951$TQ3.6949@trnddc05...

Roger,

I am thinking of designing an model airplane kit analogous to the way
paper airplane kits are designed.

Big difference is that if you make the kit out of styrene, you can bend,
glue, sand and paint it. With paper as your medium you can not do that!

Hence my requirement for thin line widths (within reason)

Here is a good example of paper kits:
http://www.papermodels.co.il/

Keith Walker


OK Keith, let's think about something here. .00025 inches is an
unreasonable quest for a line to be scribed on a chunk of plastic. You
would need the light just right and good magnification just to see it. If
you wanted to cut out pieces to assemble an airplane out of styrene like the
card model you showed you can cut them out with a pair of scissors or an
ex-acto knife.

If you wanted to make a bunch of them and pre-cut the model parts, then you
can get a steel rule die made up to cut them out of sheet stock. That is
low tech and cheep.

You may also wish to consider vacuum forming some of the more intricate
curves. This is also cheep but requires a certain degree of skill to make
the molds, but far less than injection molding.

Lasers a really great tools but you really don't need to go there to make
toys.

"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:OHz%e.3054$UD6.2663@trnddc04...
there are already manufacturers selling paper kits that are laser cut.
same goes for wood kits.
if you have ever built a complicated paper kit, you know that hundreds
of hours are spent just cutting the parts out with a scissors; a laser
would remove most of that work.

So would a steel rule die. Lasers are neat tools but each tool has its
drawbacks. Lasers are expensive. Not an issue if you are putting serial
numbers on fine diamonds, or making 100,000 high speed disk drives, but when
you are making airplane models cost becomes a real issue. Think about this,
if one set of plastic cutouts is cut to a precision of +-.001" and then a
master model maker glues it together by hand is the end result going to be a
whole lot different than the same person working with parts that are
+-.010"?

There are some places where .0001 matters, and there are places where it
does not. Keep that in mind and you will not go nuts.

--

__
Roger Shoaf

Important factors in selecting a mate:
1] Depth of gene pool
2] Position on the food chain.





kww

Roger Shoaf wrote:
"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:jo3_e.11951$TQ3.6949@trnddc05...

Roger,

I am thinking of designing an model airplane kit analogous to the way
paper airplane kits are designed.

Big difference is that if you make the kit out of styrene, you can bend,
glue, sand and paint it. With paper as your medium you can not do that!

Hence my requirement for thin line widths (within reason)

Here is a good example of paper kits:
http://www.papermodels.co.il/

Keith Walker


OK Keith, let's think about something here. .00025 inches is an
unreasonable quest for a line to be scribed on a chunk of plastic. You
would need the light just right and good magnification just to see it.
If
you wanted to cut out pieces to assemble an airplane out of styrene like
the
card model you showed you can cut them out with a pair of scissors or an
ex-acto knife.

If you wanted to make a bunch of them and pre-cut the model parts, then
you
can get a steel rule die made up to cut them out of sheet stock. That
is
low tech and cheep.

You may also wish to consider vacuum forming some of the more intricate
curves. This is also cheep but requires a certain degree of skill to
make
the molds, but far less than injection molding.

Lasers a really great tools but you really don't need to go there to
make
toys.

Roger

Low power desktop lasers cost around ~$10k.
To make a steel rule die with multiple curvatures would cost more.

Keith Walker

Roger Shoaf wrote:
"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:OHz%e.3054$UD6.2663@trnddc04...


So would a steel rule die. Lasers are neat tools but each tool has its
drawbacks. Lasers are expensive. Not an issue if you are putting serial
numbers on fine diamonds, or making 100,000 high speed disk drives, but when
you are making airplane models cost becomes a real issue. Think about this,
if one set of plastic cutouts is cut to a precision of +-.001" and then a
master model maker glues it together by hand is the end result going to be a
whole lot different than the same person working with parts that are
+-.010"?

There are some places where .0001 matters, and there are places where it
does not. Keep that in mind and you will not go nuts.

Google is your friend. Do a search on "steel rule die" and educate
yourself.

Then you can send me all the money you save, shucks I will be tickled if you
send me half the money you save.

--
Roger Shoaf
If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent.

"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:f6%0f.7198$BU1.647@trnddc06...
Roger

Low power desktop lasers cost around ~$10k.
To make a steel rule die with multiple curvatures would cost more.

Keith Walker

Roger Shoaf wrote:
"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:OHz%e.3054$UD6.2663@trnddc04...


So would a steel rule die. Lasers are neat tools but each tool has its
drawbacks. Lasers are expensive. Not an issue if you are putting
serial
numbers on fine diamonds, or making 100,000 high speed disk drives, but
when
you are making airplane models cost becomes a real issue. Think about
this,
if one set of plastic cutouts is cut to a precision of +-.001" and then
a
master model maker glues it together by hand is the end result going to
be a
whole lot different than the same person working with parts that are
+-.010"?

There are some places where .0001 matters, and there are places where it
does not. Keep that in mind and you will not go nuts.

I know what a steel rule die is, I have used them at work, and I know
thier limitations.

Time for your education,
lets see you do steel rule dies on this stuff:

http://www.papermodels.co.il/Files/Sphere.pdf

compound curves, now that one is not too difficult, but how about this one:

http://www.ne.jp/asahi/paper-m/yasu/...t_ap03_sh1.pdf
http://www.ne.jp/asahi/paper-m/yasu/...t_ap03_sh2.pdf

or this:

http://www.digitalnavy.com/Admirable1.pdf
http://www.digitalnavy.com/Admirable2.pdf

or:
http://www.mtp-studio.de/epr-online/sheet-01.jpg
http://www.mtp-studio.de/epr-online/sheet-02.jpg

face it, there is a level of complexity where a laser cutter would save
money just in tooling costs.
And then there is other factors such as a steel die would destroy
delicate parts such as these satellite paper kits (which ARE laser cut):

http://countdowncreations.com/modelgal.htm

I don't think a delicate part like the preforated satellite dish can be
done without a laser.

And just in case you do have the skills to do a steel die on one of
those difficult applications, aw shucks, my foot will be in my mouth -
but the proof is in the pudding, so PROVE it.

Keith Walker


Roger Shoaf wrote:
Google is your friend. Do a search on "steel rule die" and educate
yourself.

Then you can send me all the money you save, shucks I will be tickled if you
send me half the money you save.

"Keith Walker" wrote in message
news:E7l1f.16057$C51.9165@trnddc07...

And just in case you do have the skills to do a steel die on one of those
difficult applications, aw shucks, my foot will be in my mouth - but the
proof is in the pudding, so PROVE it.

Very nice. Very intricate. Shouldn't this be in rec.crafts.paperdolls?

I thought I would get some useful information here as there is no
rec.crafts.laser and lasers are used in metalworking, both high end work
and at the craftsman level.

Instead I got a bunch of trolls and losers....

Mike Young wrote:


Very nice. Very intricate. Shouldn't this be in rec.crafts.paperdolls?