Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

Not an expert on pole barns but IIRC the poles a sunk far enough so that
they provide the lateral shear strength. That means they have to go in
3' to 5' depending on how big your building is. Plus you may need to
pour a concrete 'collar' around each pole.

A good gravel base will work fine until you get enough extra $$$ to pour
the floor later. Make sure that you grade things, set the collars, set
the driveway, etc so that it all works out right for the later concrete.

There are lots of suppliers that will create a plan, sell the materials,
and deliever to your site. In the midwest Menards is one of the bigger
suppliers, each of their stores has a kiosk and computer to let you
design what you need.

For residiential area buildings, be sure to look into some of the
various colors. Pay the extra few bucks to get something other than pure
white. You will also want to design something with soffets and other
trim to make it match the house.

wrote:
Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

wrote in message
oups.com...
Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

That is indeed the first question, and the answer depends on your soil
conditions. Ask around.

FYI, I have been known to put fence posts deeper than that, but my soil is
pure sand.

Vaughn

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?


Your posts is what keep the building from blowing away in a wind storm. If
you live where there's no hurricanes, tornados, or severe thunderstorms you
might be OK. For my barn, the posts are four feet deep with a 12" concrete
cookie for the posts to rest on. The cookie has rebars in it that are
stapled down to the posts. The cookie will cost you $10 a pole extra, but
now the weak link is the building shaking apart, not coming out of the
ground.

There's tons of places that offer complete building kits. Much better than
buying the parts al la carte. Nearly every lumber yard and big box home
supply around offers a kit.

Karl

On 2 Jun 2005 13:11:23 -0700, the inscrutable
spake:

Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

Get thee to thy library and pick up Monte Burch's book. It's a great
resource.

Monte Burch's Pole building projects : over 25 low-cost plans
Book
Author: Burch, Monte
Publisher, Date: Pownal, Vt. : Storey Communications, c1993.
ISBN: 0882668609 - Description: vi, 200 p. : ill. ; 29 cm.

He also wrote a couple books on barns and outbuildings.

--
"Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein
-=-=-
http://www.diversify.com Wondrous Website Design

I live in Kentucky. Mostly line stone and clay around here. What I am
afraid of is running out of headroom by the time I put a 4x6x12 3 feet
deep plus the gravel to level it out plus the concrete later.

wrote:

Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

The pole barn my friend built some years ago was from a load of power poles.

Sold off the power company manufacturing lot. He dug 4' holes and hand set
the poles by himself! - No rigging.

He dug the hole. Then slotted in one side - long gentle slope to the bottom.
Then the pole is rolled so the end is near the hole - pole bumps down the
slot and starts to stand up - Once planted, he walked up the pole - standing
it up and then he tied it off to his tractor and filled/ packed the hole.

Typically the power poles are only 3-4 feet deep - once packed that is strong.

Martin

--
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lion's Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder

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wrote in message
oups.com...
Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?


Call your local power company and see where they are replacing poles. My
neighbor now is the proud owner of a stack of poles that were formerly
holding up the wires on our street. Can't beat free and you can cut them so
you have plenty of headroom.

Steve.

In article ,
"lionslair at consolidated dot net" "lionslair at consolidated dot
net" wrote:


He dug the hole. Then slotted in one side - long gentle slope to the bottom.
Then the pole is rolled so the end is near the hole - pole bumps down the
slot and starts to stand up - Once planted, he walked up the pole - standing
it up and then he tied it off to his tractor and filled/ packed the hole.

I use a slightly different technique. After I drill the hole I put the
pole across my carry-all. If you get the post positioned right on the
carry-all and the carry-all at the right height (experience), then it is
EZ to lift the pole since it is nearly balanced and when you flip it up
it falls down in the hole so neatly I usually don't need the board to
keep it from digging in the side as it goes down. I have erected
telephone poles over 20' high singlehanded.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article . com,
wrote:

I live in Kentucky. Mostly line stone and clay around here. What I am
afraid of is running out of headroom by the time I put a 4x6x12 3 feet
deep plus the gravel to level it out plus the concrete later.


Use 16' poats. You will never regret more headroom. I've got 15'
headroom in my pole shed and am thankful for every foot.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

Nick Hull wrote:

In article ,
"lionslair at consolidated dot net" "lionslair at consolidated dot
net" wrote:



He dug the hole. Then slotted in one side - long gentle slope to the bottom.
Then the pole is rolled so the end is near the hole - pole bumps down the
slot and starts to stand up - Once planted, he walked up the pole - standing
it up and then he tied it off to his tractor and filled/ packed the hole.


I use a slightly different technique. After I drill the hole I put the
pole across my carry-all. If you get the post positioned right on the
carry-all and the carry-all at the right height (experience), then it is
EZ to lift the pole since it is nearly balanced and when you flip it up
it falls down in the hole so neatly I usually don't need the board to
keep it from digging in the side as it goes down. I have erected
telephone poles over 20' high singlehanded.

Just invite a Scott - They topple poles for fun in the 'games' :-)

Martin

--
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lion's Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder

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On 2 Jun 2005 13:11:23 -0700, the inscrutable
spake:

Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

No. If the upper structure is properly braced, the 2-foot embedment might
survive horizontal wind loads. But it's not deep enough to provide the
uplift resistance you need.

Four to six feet is the convention.

LLoyd

On Mon, 06 Jun 2005 19:25:38 GMT, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
wrote:

On 2 Jun 2005 13:11:23 -0700, the inscrutable
spake:

Thinking of building a pole barn shop about 24x32. Have to do by
myself. has to have gravel as I am on a limited budget. Will be
adjacent to my house.

What is the cheapest way to go about this and make it look nice?

Is it ok to use 4x6x12 posts 2 feet in the ground?

No. If the upper structure is properly braced, the 2-foot embedment might
survive horizontal wind loads. But it's not deep enough to provide the
uplift resistance you need.

Four to six feet is the convention.

LLoyd

Unless you use deadmen and a bit of concrete.

Gunner


"Considering the events of recent years,
the world has a long way to go to regain
its credibility and reputation with the US."
unknown

"Gunner" wrote in message
...

Unless you use deadmen and a bit of concrete.

Yeahbut... (my life is dedicated to the "yeahbut"), because of unfortunate
indiscretions by owner-contractors over the years (like burying posts only
2' deep), most juridictions' code now requires more than just a "bit" of
concrete for pole collars.

My next-door neighbor screwed the code for the whole county. He basically
built a barn on hinges (metal post anchors screwed down to his slab). One
fat downburst later, the barn was on the ground (with the roof in entirely
one piece!), and the county revised the code for all agricultural builders.

Now, we have to go through engineering to even build a two-horse pasture
shelter! Our local code requires posts no smaller than 6" and no less
buried than 4' - regardless of the size of the barn - and a minimum 18"
diameter by 12" deep collar with cross-pinning in the collar and through the
post of #5 re-bar or equivalent.

That's WAY overkill; but because too many people did it half-assed, we all
have to follow a code that is unreasonable (not to mention expensive, to get
engineered, certified drawings from an architect).

LLoyd

I plan on digginh the hole with a tractor auger and using rebar and
concrete. Is this ok for 2 feet? What is a "deadman"?

I am not so crazy about trying to roof this thing myself and geting up
that high! Plus, dont know what to do to get the trusses that high.

wrote in message
oups.com...
I plan on digginh the hole with a tractor auger and using rebar and
concrete. Is this ok for 2 feet? What is a "deadman"?

Nope, not unless the concrete footer is at least another two feet deeper.
You _NEED_ at least four feet in the ground to give you the lateral load
resistance required. (unless you're talking about a continuous footer
around the whole periphery of the barn. But then it's not _quite_ a "pole
barn" anymore.)

LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote in message
ink.net...

wrote in message
oups.com...
I plan on digginh the hole with a tractor auger and using rebar and
concrete. Is this ok for 2 feet? What is a "deadman"?

Nope, not unless the concrete footer is at least another two feet deeper.
You _NEED_ at least four feet in the ground to give you the lateral load
resistance required. (unless you're talking about a continuous footer
around the whole periphery of the barn. But then it's not _quite_ a "pole
barn" anymore.)

LLoyd



What Lloyd said. When mine was built, the holes were about 5' deep and the
contractor just poured a bag of dry ready mix concrete into each hole before
the poles went in. He said the moisture in the ground would set it up and
it would be plenty of foundation for the bottom of the poles. Had no reason
to doubt his method, as he'd built many, many poles barns in that part of
Southern Indiana with no history of problems.

Garrett

No. Rule of thumb is at least 1/3 of the pole buried for a fence. I
have similar soil. Heavy black dirt/clay.

Something with the loads you are talking, I would think this would be
the minimum. So, as others have suggested get 16' poles and around
4-5' deep.

JW

Garrett Fulton wrote:


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" wrote in message
ink.net...

wrote in message
oups.com...
I plan on digginh the hole with a tractor auger and using rebar and
concrete. Is this ok for 2 feet? What is a "deadman"?

Nope, not unless the concrete footer is at least another two feet deeper.
You _NEED_ at least four feet in the ground to give you the lateral load
resistance required. (unless you're talking about a continuous footer
around the whole periphery of the barn. But then it's not _quite_ a
"pole barn" anymore.)

LLoyd



What Lloyd said. When mine was built, the holes were about 5' deep and
the contractor just poured a bag of dry ready mix concrete into each hole
before
the poles went in. He said the moisture in the ground would set it up and
it would be plenty of foundation for the bottom of the poles. Had no
reason to doubt his method, as he'd built many, many poles barns in that
part of Southern Indiana with no history of problems.

Garrett
My Morton building used pressure treated 6x6s made up from three 2x6s nailed
together with a with about 12" of rebar crossways IIRC 6" from the bottom.
They used a tractor-mounted auger to punch holes about 18" in diameter and
5' deep for each "pole". They dumped one bag of Sakrete in the bottom of
the hole, then placed the pole and added a second bag. The hole was then
filled with dirt. Ground moisture did the rest. Then there was the 5"
concrete pad that held them all down 8o). Take great care to tie things
together to prevent wind from lifting the shed off/out of the ground.
Thunderstorms/microbursts can really suck things up out of the ground.
--
Keith Bowers - Thomasville, NC

jw wrote:

No. Rule of thumb is at least 1/3 of the pole buried for a fence. I
have similar soil. Heavy black dirt/clay.

Something with the loads you are talking, I would think this would be
the minimum. So, as others have suggested get 16' poles and around
4-5' deep.

JW

I think the depth depends on the soil type, the perma-frost line, the heaving of soil...
Northern clim's need deeper for the frost and heaving more than the south.

The south has some bad (to build in) clays that tend to heave or just give way.

SO many variables.

Martin

--
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lion's Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder

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Fair enough. In my location, SE MN, the OP depth would not be adequate.