I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

I went to Batteries+ and talked to the people.
I got lots of "consumer speak", but no actual
technical guidance. They're more interested in rotating
stock than selling me a battery with a recent manufacturing date.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I have a bunch of old laptop batteries that I thought I'd
assemble into a starter battery. But even if I parallel
up enough cells, the protection circuit isn't likely to
tolerate that 46 amps. Then there's the charger...

There are lithium car jump starters for around the same
price as the lead acid. And that takes care of the protection
and charging and may have other uses beyond starting the
mower a few dozen times a year...looks like an option.

After some research, I realized that I don't know how they work.
Jump Starter specifications have gone the way of flashlight
brightness specifications. A typical EBAY listing has a
headline that says 20,000 mAh...but the fine print says
10,000 mAH...but it's in a package that might hold 2,000 mAH
of cells that are rated for 5% of the peak current required
to start a car.

If you sort the listings by price, you see page after page
of listings for ~$2, only to find that you get a cable for $2,
but if you select the battery, it's $89...or $2 plus $90
shipping.

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

On 4/13/18 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40.Â* And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years.Â* Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

Some cut.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

I have a Booster Pack ES2500. 12 volts, supposedly 900
peak amps. I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

I went to Batteries+ and talked to the people.
I got lots of "consumer speak", but no actual
technical guidance. They're more interested in rotating
stock than selling me a battery with a recent manufacturing date.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I have a bunch of old laptop batteries that I thought I'd
assemble into a starter battery. But even if I parallel
up enough cells, the protection circuit isn't likely to
tolerate that 46 amps. Then there's the charger...

There are lithium car jump starters for around the same
price as the lead acid. And that takes care of the protection
and charging and may have other uses beyond starting the
mower a few dozen times a year...looks like an option.

After some research, I realized that I don't know how they work.
Jump Starter specifications have gone the way of flashlight
brightness specifications. A typical EBAY listing has a
headline that says 20,000 mAh...but the fine print says
10,000 mAH...but it's in a package that might hold 2,000 mAH
of cells that are rated for 5% of the peak current required
to start a car.

If you sort the listings by price, you see page after page
of listings for ~$2, only to find that you get a cable for $2,
but if you select the battery, it's $89...or $2 plus $90
shipping.

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.

On 4/13/18 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40.Â* And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years.Â* Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

Do you have a vehicle you could use to jump start the
mower? It's an old trick to rig up a vehicle with welder
type female ends in the grill or somewhere handy. Those are
connected to the vehicles battery with welding cable. Attach
a set of male ends to a set of jumper cables. Plug them in
when you want to jump start the mower.

mike writes:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.

Very sorry to hear that.

When easy things like that become a problem, it's time to consider
a change in lifestyle. In this case, a new lifestyle where you don't
have to mow your own lawn.
Consider how long it will be before pushing the mower becomes too hard.
Pulling a starter cord on a mower is not all that hard.

Otherwise, buy one of those cordless electric mowers.

--
Dan Espen

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:05:56 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 4/13/18 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40.Â* And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years.Â* Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

Do you have a vehicle you could use to jump start the
mower? It's an old trick to rig up a vehicle with welder
type female ends in the grill or somewhere handy. Those are
connected to the vehicles battery with welding cable. Attach
a set of male ends to a set of jumper cables. Plug them in
when you want to jump start the mower.

I did that with my riding mower for a couple months, jumping it off
the golf cart until I found out why the battery was always dead.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I'm seeking suggestions.


My 20 hp riding mower starts on less than 20 amps -
what motor are you pull-starting that draws more ?
The riding mower batteries cost about $ 60. and
they last about 5 years. Just buy one.
John T.

On 4/13/2018 6:56 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I'm seeking suggestions.


My 20 hp riding mower starts on less than 20 amps -
What are you using to measure that?
The 46 amps came from a Fluke 337 that actually measures
peak inrush current. I think that's an important bit of info
when considering the design.

what motor are you pull-starting that draws more ?
The riding mower batteries cost about $ 60. and
they last about 5 years. Just buy one.
John T.

On 4/13/2018 3:58 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 4/13/18 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

Some cut.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

I have a Booster Pack ES2500. 12 volts, supposedly 900
peak amps. I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.


Thanks, I have a similar one. But it's too heavy to cart around
the yard. The lithium ones will fit in the space available and
won't self-discharge and be dead when you need 'em.

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

I went to Batteries+ and talked to the people.
I got lots of "consumer speak", but no actual
technical guidance. They're more interested in rotating
stock than selling me a battery with a recent manufacturing date.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I have a bunch of old laptop batteries that I thought I'd
assemble into a starter battery. But even if I parallel
up enough cells, the protection circuit isn't likely to
tolerate that 46 amps. Then there's the charger...

There are lithium car jump starters for around the same
price as the lead acid. And that takes care of the protection
and charging and may have other uses beyond starting the
mower a few dozen times a year...looks like an option.

After some research, I realized that I don't know how they work.
Jump Starter specifications have gone the way of flashlight
brightness specifications. A typical EBAY listing has a
headline that says 20,000 mAh...but the fine print says
10,000 mAH...but it's in a package that might hold 2,000 mAH
of cells that are rated for 5% of the peak current required
to start a car.

If you sort the listings by price, you see page after page
of listings for ~$2, only to find that you get a cable for $2,
but if you select the battery, it's $89...or $2 plus $90
shipping.

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

I went to Batteries+ and talked to the people.
I got lots of "consumer speak", but no actual
technical guidance. They're more interested in rotating
stock than selling me a battery with a recent manufacturing date.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I have a bunch of old laptop batteries that I thought I'd
assemble into a starter battery. But even if I parallel
up enough cells, the protection circuit isn't likely to
tolerate that 46 amps. Then there's the charger...

There are lithium car jump starters for around the same
price as the lead acid. And that takes care of the protection
and charging and may have other uses beyond starting the
mower a few dozen times a year...looks like an option.

After some research, I realized that I don't know how they work.
Jump Starter specifications have gone the way of flashlight
brightness specifications. A typical EBAY listing has a
headline that says 20,000 mAh...but the fine print says
10,000 mAH...but it's in a package that might hold 2,000 mAH
of cells that are rated for 5% of the peak current required
to start a car.

If you sort the listings by price, you see page after page
of listings for ~$2, only to find that you get a cable for $2,
but if you select the battery, it's $89...or $2 plus $90
shipping.

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.


Buy a good lead acid battery spec'd to fit from a high volume retailer
and it will NOT be more than 3 months old. It should last 5 or more
years (the one on my Yamaha blower has gone through 5 seasons)

That's $10 a yearf for dependable starting - and it's not dead yet --
-

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:05:56 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 4/13/18 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40.* And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years.* Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

Do you have a vehicle you could use to jump start the
mower? It's an old trick to rig up a vehicle with welder
type female ends in the grill or somewhere handy. Those are
connected to the vehicles battery with welding cable. Attach
a set of male ends to a set of jumper cables. Plug them in
when you want to jump start the mower.
Forget the welding cables - a good extension cord will crank the
lawnmower.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design. If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 23:46:43 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design. If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.


Actually pretty hard to find a real gel-cell today.

The majority are the MUCH better Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) VRLA battery
- also known as "starved electrolyte"

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 01:28:52 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.


Actually pretty hard to find a real gel-cell today.

The majority are the MUCH better Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) VRLA battery
- also known as "starved electrolyte"

They are still sold and called Gel Cells for the electric fencers. Back
in the 90s I used to get them at a place that sold overstock items and
they were cheap. I used them to power one of them big camcorders that
everyone had back then. (withe the vcr tape inside). It also doubled as
a battery for a portable CB radio made for temporary use in cars.

I simply mounted the gel cell in a strong canvas bag, and put a
cigarette lighter female socket on a wire that hung out of the bag. The
bag had a strap so I could hang it on my shoulder. I could run that
camcorder for many hours off that single 12V Gel Cell. Probably 5 times
the capacity of the internal battery pack made for that camcorder. The
CB radio ran a whole day on that battery. I would charge them with a
standard 2A car battery charger. Worked great.

The ones sold for the electric fencers are very expensive. I'd check
ebay.

On 4/13/2018 9:46 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design.

Isn't that what I'm trying to do?
Put in a lithium that will still be charged when I need it and maybe
have other applications.

I'm not entirely stupid.
I have motorcycles and batteries and computers and batteries
and power tools and batteries.
An an engineering degree.
Fire insurance.
I've got a battery tab welder.
A balance charger.
I've built computer controlled battery analyzers.
The hardest part of the whole project is the overdischarge
protection. 46A is a lot for the disconnect switch.
Available/affordable packaged cell monitors draw a lot of current doing
nothing.
It's conceptually trivial up until you have to start packaging it up
into a usable box.

My question was not about any of that.
The question was about a pointer to a specific cost effective
lithium jump starter (see the subject line). All the rest was
just context to stimulate...

If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.

On 4/13/2018 6:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.

I bought a battery for my 23hp walk-behind last week.
It's 275 CCA, and sells for $30 at Walmart.

The mower requires I buy a new one every 3-5 years,
depending on if I bring it inside during winter and
connect to my Battery Tender. I've done this for many
many years.

Don't take this wrong, but if you cannot pull-start a mower,
or afford a battery every few years... you probably shouldn't
own a mower. Even a self-propelled requires effort. Certainly
more than starting one usually requires.

Good luck.

On Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 7:09:54 AM UTC-4, 83LowRider wrote:
On 4/13/2018 6:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.

I bought a battery for my 23hp walk-behind last week.
It's 275 CCA, and sells for $30 at Walmart.

The mower requires I buy a new one every 3-5 years,
depending on if I bring it inside during winter and
connect to my Battery Tender. I've done this for many
many years.

Don't take this wrong, but if you cannot pull-start a mower,
or afford a battery every few years... you probably shouldn't
own a mower. Even a self-propelled requires effort. Certainly
more than starting one usually requires.

Good luck.

That's a good point. A properly working lawn mower should start with one or two easy pulls. Even my 5hp snowblower, which has electric start isn't hard to pull start. I opted for electric start there because it has to start in freezing temps, is used infrequently, is a larger engine, etc.

Best answer, go for an electric lawnmower. Everyone I know who ones one loves it. Quiet, no gas, low maintenance, always starts, does a good job. Not suitable for a huge lawn but fine for most.

Okay answer, buy a battery that doesn't die as quickly. The chemistry on modern batteries means they lose half their life every time you run one down.. Find an old style one - cop cars use them because with all the extra electric draw they go through batteries quick. They're expensive but at your age you might only have to buy one.

On 4/13/2018 5:42 PM, mike wrote:
I'm getting too old to pull-start my lawnmower.
I bought a used electric start, but the battery is shot.
A quality battery that actually has a specified internal
resistance is about $40. And even if I'm careful to keep it
charged over the winter, it's not likely to last more than
a couple of years. Depending on the source, it may have
been sitting on the shelf sulphating for years.

I went to Batteries+ and talked to the people.
I got lots of "consumer speak", but no actual
technical guidance. They're more interested in rotating
stock than selling me a battery with a recent manufacturing date.

The start surge current is 46 Amps, but settles to 15A or so
when cranking.

I have a bunch of old laptop batteries that I thought I'd
assemble into a starter battery. But even if I parallel
up enough cells, the protection circuit isn't likely to
tolerate that 46 amps. Then there's the charger...

There are lithium car jump starters for around the same
price as the lead acid. And that takes care of the protection
and charging and may have other uses beyond starting the
mower a few dozen times a year...looks like an option.

After some research, I realized that I don't know how they work.
Jump Starter specifications have gone the way of flashlight
brightness specifications. A typical EBAY listing has a
headline that says 20,000 mAh...but the fine print says
10,000 mAH...but it's in a package that might hold 2,000 mAH
of cells that are rated for 5% of the peak current required
to start a car.

If you sort the listings by price, you see page after page
of listings for ~$2, only to find that you get a cable for $2,
but if you select the battery, it's $89...or $2 plus $90
shipping.

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

A jump pack will work just fine if the mower is easy starting. I'd
cut the charging circuit since the lithium batteries in them are charged
differently than the original mower battery, and use the plug in charger
for the jump pack though. The jump packs are also handy for other
things.. usually a bright light with them and you can run a cell phone
for days on one. Now go forth and mow. BTW I saw a fat ass, and I mean
we're talking OBESE yesterday mowing a yard with a high dollar zero
turn riding mower that wouldn't take 20 minutes with a walk behind
mower. His wife is as big as he is, but he's a nice guy.

On 4/14/18 7:29 AM, My 2 Cents wrote:

Â* A jump pack will work just fine if the mower is easy starting.Â* I'd
cut the charging circuit since the lithium batteries in them are charged
differently than the original mower battery, and use the plug in charger
for the jump pack though.Â* The jump packs are also handy for other
things.. usually a bright light with them and you can run a cell phone
for days on one.Â* Now go forth and mow.Â* BTW I saw a fat ass, and I mean
we're talking OBESE yesterday mowing a yard with a high dollarÂ* zero
turn riding mower that wouldn't take 20 minutes with a walk behind
mower.Â* His wife is as big as he is, but he's a nice guy.


What is it? Something like a third of the U.S. population is
overweight?
And yet shopping carts are full of soda pop and snacks of all sorts. People
park as close as possible to the store's front doors. They won't walk a
block
but drive instead.
There was a fitness center in Omaha, NE that bragged about their front
door parking in their radio ads. That always hit me as funny.

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 01:27:16 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 01:28:52 -0400, Clare Snyder
wrote:

car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.


Actually pretty hard to find a real gel-cell today.

The majority are the MUCH better Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) VRLA battery
- also known as "starved electrolyte"

They are still sold and called Gel Cells for the electric fencers. Back
in the 90s I used to get them at a place that sold overstock items and
they were cheap. I used them to power one of them big camcorders that
everyone had back then. (withe the vcr tape inside). It also doubled as
a battery for a portable CB radio made for temporary use in cars.

I simply mounted the gel cell in a strong canvas bag, and put a
cigarette lighter female socket on a wire that hung out of the bag. The
bag had a strap so I could hang it on my shoulder. I could run that
camcorder for many hours off that single 12V Gel Cell. Probably 5 times
the capacity of the internal battery pack made for that camcorder. The
CB radio ran a whole day on that battery. I would charge them with a
standard 2A car battery charger. Worked great.

The ones sold for the electric fencers are very expensive. I'd check
ebay.


Doesn't matter what the idiot selling them calls them, they are
virtually ALL AGM today.

Gell cells don't handle high currents and require special chargers and
are significantly more expensive - with no real advantage

AGM batteries can be charged with an automotive charger. Gel cells
charged with an automotive charger have a short lifespan.

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 00:11:53 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 9:46 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design.

Isn't that what I'm trying to do?
Put in a lithium that will still be charged when I need it and maybe
have other applications.

I'm not entirely stupid.
I have motorcycles and batteries and computers and batteries
and power tools and batteries.
An an engineering degree.
Fire insurance.
I've got a battery tab welder.
A balance charger.
I've built computer controlled battery analyzers.
The hardest part of the whole project is the overdischarge
protection. 46A is a lot for the disconnect switch.
Available/affordable packaged cell monitors draw a lot of current doing
nothing.
It's conceptually trivial up until you have to start packaging it up
into a usable box.

My question was not about any of that.
The question was about a pointer to a specific cost effective
lithium jump starter (see the subject line). All the rest was
just context to stimulate...

If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.



Is this another stupid engineer or the same idiot who has to align and
balance his own wheels and patch his own tires and source his brake
pads exclusively by the friction rating - because nobody else can do
anything as well as he can, or they are all out to rip him off - - -

Surely not ALL engineers are so thick

On Friday, April 13, 2018 at 11:48:13 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design. If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.


I prefer AGM batteries over Gel Cells. When I replace a Gel Cell in a UPS unit, I install the equivalent sized AGM battery. I've had pretty good luck with the AGM batteries. ^_^

http://batteryuniversity.com/index.p..._glass_mat_agm

http://www.dekabatteries.com/assets/...rdeepcycle.pdf

[8~{} Uncle Battered Monster

On Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 9:20:04 AM UTC-4, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 00:11:53 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 9:46 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:27:00 -0700, mike wrote:

On 4/13/2018 4:59 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 15:42:38 -0700, mike wrote:

I considered a cordless tool battery.
I have a 24V lithium drill battery with 6 18650 cells rated for 30A peak.
If I use 3 cells or parallel up 3x2=6 cells, I loose all the advantages
of protection and a working charger. And I'm thinking that 3-cells
may not be enough and 4 cells
in series might be a better option.

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

* Batteries Plus is a ripoff place. DO NOT do business with them.


Walmart, Menards, and other places sell 12v garden tractor batteries for
around $20 (plus core). By one, and live with it till it dies. I've had
them last 5 or 6 years.

This thing is a 5AH battery with low volume/turnover.
They're not typically on the shelf. Even the local lawnmower place
had to order one and charge me for shipping.
Depending on where you buy it, it may have been in the distribution
chain for most of those 5 years.
It's also not as cheap as a 7AH alarm battery.

OR

Hire some kid to mow your lawn and pay them $20 every week,

OR

Go to a nursing home, where you dont have to mow, but you will pay $2000
every week for your care.

That's insightful. My trigger point for moving to an apartment is
when I can no longer take care of the yard. I plan to pull the plug
before I get to a nursing home.

OR

Screw around with all those laptop batteries, which may cause a fire and
burn down your house, costing you $200,000 (or more).


It's really more about the hobby than the $$.

Looking at these figures, I'd say the $20 battery is your best bet.



If it's a hobby, then do it right. Get a REAL mower battery, as I
suggested. Then modify that mower so you can mount the battery, and
connect that. I kind of know what sort of battery is in the mower and
they were never really useful. They are too small and too costly to
replace. It was a poor design right from the factory. Your job is to
IMPROVE their poor design.

Isn't that what I'm trying to do?
Put in a lithium that will still be charged when I need it and maybe
have other applications.

I'm not entirely stupid.
I have motorcycles and batteries and computers and batteries
and power tools and batteries.
An an engineering degree.
Fire insurance.
I've got a battery tab welder.
A balance charger.
I've built computer controlled battery analyzers.
The hardest part of the whole project is the overdischarge
protection. 46A is a lot for the disconnect switch.
Available/affordable packaged cell monitors draw a lot of current doing
nothing.
It's conceptually trivial up until you have to start packaging it up
into a usable box.

My question was not about any of that.
The question was about a pointer to a specific cost effective
lithium jump starter (see the subject line). All the rest was
just context to stimulate...

If the actual mower batteries are too large
to fit anywhere, motor cycle batteries are a bit smaller, or find a Gel
Cell on ebay and use that. The Gel Cells are typically 12V, but some are
also 6V. They are used in road barracades with flashing yellow lights,
and other things. They are just a small scale lead-acid battery like a
car battery, but the acid is a gel, not a liquid.

If you have a farm supply store nearby, these Gel Cells are also sold
for Solar-Charged Electric Livestock Fencers.



Is this another stupid engineer or the same idiot who has to align and
balance his own wheels and patch his own tires and source his brake
pads exclusively by the friction rating - because nobody else can do
anything as well as he can, or they are all out to rip him off - - -

Surely not ALL engineers are so thick

You might be on to something there.

On 04/14/2018 07:46 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

[snip]

Â*Â* There was a fitness center in Omaha, NE that bragged about their front
door parking in their radio ads.Â* That always hit me as funny.

One thing I found funny here, is a fitness center sharing a building
with a donut shop.

On 4/14/2018 8:46 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 4/14/18 7:29 AM, My 2 Cents wrote:

Â*Â* A jump pack will work just fine if the mower is easy starting.Â* I'd cut the charging circuit since the lithium batteries in them are charged differently than the original mower battery, and use the plug in charger for the jump pack though.Â* The
jump packs are also handy for other things.. usually a bright light with them and you can run a cell phone for days on one.Â* Now go forth and mow.Â* BTW I saw a fat ass, and I mean we're talking OBESE yesterday mowing a yard with a high dollarÂ* zero
turn riding mower that wouldn't take 20 minutes with a walk behind mower.Â* His wife is as big as he is, but he's a nice guy.


Â*Â*Â*Â* What is it?Â* Something like a third of the U.S. population is overweight?
And yet shopping carts are full of soda pop and snacks of all sorts.Â* People
park as close as possible to the store's front doors.Â* They won't walk a block
but drive instead.
Â*Â* There was a fitness center in Omaha, NE that bragged about their front
door parking in their radio ads.Â* That always hit me as funny.



The most exercise the demofats get is when they hobble from their cars to the obesecycle parking area in the store.

On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

I have a Booster Pack ES2500. 12 volts, supposedly 900
peak amps. I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

+1 I have this same exact booster pack. A good product that works
well. Had a battery in a previous truck, the negative battery post
would twist, obviously broken in some manner. I bought the booster
used, only used once. Less than the cost on Amazon.

Ground to the engine, connected to the positive -- shazzam she
started. Even the + cable was dirty. I was selling the truck so
didn't want to spend more money.

The unit comes with a USB cable that supports charging cell phones.
Bet I could drive across country...

BTW -- per the manual keep it plugged in while not in use.

On Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 1:10:55 PM UTC-4, Sam E wrote:
On 04/14/2018 07:46 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

[snip]

Â*Â* There was a fitness center in Omaha, NE that bragged about their front
door parking in their radio ads.Â* That always hit me as funny.

One thing I found funny here, is a fitness center sharing a building
with a donut shop.

Well doh. Cops have to stay fit too you know.

On 04/14/2018 01:51 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

I have a Booster Pack ES2500. 12 volts, supposedly 900
peak amps. I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

+1 I have this same exact booster pack. A good product that works
well. Had a battery in a previous truck, the negative battery post
would twist, obviously broken in some manner. I bought the booster
used, only used once. Less than the cost on Amazon.

Ground to the engine, connected to the positive -- shazzam she
started. Even the + cable was dirty. I was selling the truck so
didn't want to spend more money.

The unit comes with a USB cable that supports charging cell phones.
Bet I could drive across country...

BTW -- per the manual keep it plugged in while not in use.


That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of 20
miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at home
plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in the
trunk thing.

On 4/14/18 8:24 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 04/14/2018 01:51 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

**** I have a Booster Pack ES2500.** 12 volts,* supposedly 900
peak amps.* I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

+1* I have this same exact booster pack. A good product that works
well. Had a battery in a previous truck, the negative battery post
would twist, obviously broken in some manner. I bought the booster
used, only used once. Less than the cost on Amazon.

Ground to the engine, connected to the positive -- shazzam she
started. Even the + cable was dirty.* I was selling the truck so
didn't want to spend more money.

The unit comes with a USB cable that supports charging cell phones.
Bet I could drive across country...

BTW -- per the manual keep it plugged in while not in use.


That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of 20
miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at home
plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in the
trunk thing.

This company claims one can go a year between charges:
https://no.co/products/power/jumpstarters

On 04/14/2018 08:24 PM, rbowman wrote:

[snip]

That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of 20
miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at home
plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in the
trunk thing.

You can use the lighter plug in the vehicle.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"My faith is strong I don't need proofs, but every time a new fact comes
along it simply confirms my faith." Palmer Joss in Carl Sagan's Contact
(New York: Pocket Books, 1985), p. 172.

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 21:07:52 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

On 4/14/18 8:24 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 04/14/2018 01:51 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

**** I have a Booster Pack ES2500.** 12 volts,* supposedly 900
peak amps.* I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

+1* I have this same exact booster pack. A good product that works
well. Had a battery in a previous truck, the negative battery post
would twist, obviously broken in some manner. I bought the booster
used, only used once. Less than the cost on Amazon.

Ground to the engine, connected to the positive -- shazzam she
started. Even the + cable was dirty.* I was selling the truck so
didn't want to spend more money.

The unit comes with a USB cable that supports charging cell phones.
Bet I could drive across country...

BTW -- per the manual keep it plugged in while not in use.


That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of 20
miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at home
plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in the
trunk thing.

This company claims one can go a year between charges:
https://no.co/products/power/jumpstarters
The lithiums are good for over a year (theoretically) while the lead
acid jobs are iffy at 6 months in warm climate.

On 04/14/2018 08:32 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 04/14/2018 08:24 PM, rbowman wrote:

[snip]

That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of
20 miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at
home plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in
the trunk thing.

You can use the lighter plug in the vehicle.


That might be the straw... In the 21st century car manufacturers could
add a row of USB ports on the dash to power all the usual crap.

On Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 9:07:57 PM UTC-5, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 4/14/18 8:24 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 04/14/2018 01:51 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

Â*Â*Â*Â* I have a Booster Pack ES2500.Â*Â* 12 volts,Â* supposedly 900
peak amps.Â* I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

On Sat, 14 Apr 2018 19:24:31 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

On 04/14/2018 01:51 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 13 Apr 2018 17:58:39 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote:

I'm seeking suggestions.
Maybe a pointer to a good value on a jump starter that may not
be crap.

I have a Booster Pack ES2500. 12 volts, supposedly 900
peak amps. I've never had to use it so can't comment beyond that.

+1 I have this same exact booster pack. A good product that works
well. Had a battery in a previous truck, the negative battery post
would twist, obviously broken in some manner. I bought the booster
used, only used once. Less than the cost on Amazon.

Ground to the engine, connected to the positive -- shazzam she
started. Even the + cable was dirty. I was selling the truck so
didn't want to spend more money.

The unit comes with a USB cable that supports charging cell phones.
Bet I could drive across country...

BTW -- per the manual keep it plugged in while not in use.


That's a show-stopper for me. There I am at a trailhead at the end of 20
miles of bad road with a dead battery and the booster pack is at home
plugged into the wall. I thought they were more of a throw it in the
trunk thing.

Silly you. Load it up before you go, if fin ya got a bad cell and a
twisty negative post.

Point being -- the Booster Pack ES2500 is a dang good product. Think
you can get larger units to start heavy stuff. I'd venture to say you
can start a car without a battery at all. If you connect it the right
way

Clare Snyder posted for all of us...


Is this another stupid engineer or the same idiot who has to align and
balance his own wheels and patch his own tires and source his brake
pads exclusively by the friction rating - because nobody else can do
anything as well as he can, or they are all out to rip him off - - -

Surely not ALL engineers are so thick


I haven't caught that whiff but it's possible. The things that dissuade me
are no pix and quotes fro9m suppliers.

--
Tekkie

TimR posted for all of us...



Best answer, go for an electric lawnmower. Everyone I know who ones one loves it. Quiet, no gas, low maintenance, always starts, does a good job. Not suitable for a huge lawn but fine for most.

Okay answer, buy a battery that doesn't die as quickly. The chemistry on modern batteries means they lose half their life every time you run one down. Find an old style one - cop cars use them because with all the extra electric draw they go through batteries quick. They're expensive but at your age you might only have to buy one.

No they don't. Emergency vehicles have power management systems on them
along with extra batteries under the rear seats of the Explorers.

--
Tekkie

On Monday, April 16, 2018 at 4:58:08 PM UTC-4, Tekkie® wrote:
TimR posted for all of us...



Best answer, go for an electric lawnmower. Everyone I know who ones one loves it. Quiet, no gas, low maintenance, always starts, does a good job.. Not suitable for a huge lawn but fine for most.

Okay answer, buy a battery that doesn't die as quickly. The chemistry on modern batteries means they lose half their life every time you run one down. Find an old style one - cop cars use them because with all the extra electric draw they go through batteries quick. They're expensive but at your age you might only have to buy one.

No they don't. Emergency vehicles have power management systems on them
along with extra batteries under the rear seats of the Explorers.

--
Tekkie

Read this:
http://www.hendonpub.com/resources/a...etails?id=5355

On Mon, 16 Apr 2018 14:43:42 -0700 (PDT), TimR
wrote:

On Monday, April 16, 2018 at 4:58:08 PM UTC-4, Tekkie® wrote:
TimR posted for all of us...



Best answer, go for an electric lawnmower. Everyone I know who ones one loves it. Quiet, no gas, low maintenance, always starts, does a good job. Not suitable for a huge lawn but fine for most.

Okay answer, buy a battery that doesn't die as quickly. The chemistry on modern batteries means they lose half their life every time you run one down. Find an old style one - cop cars use them because with all the extra electric draw they go through batteries quick. They're expensive but at your age you might only have to buy one.

No they don't. Emergency vehicles have power management systems on them
along with extra batteries under the rear seats of the Explorers.

--
Tekkie

Read this:
http://www.hendonpub.com/resources/a...etails?id=5355



The AGM is NOT the old style battery. It is one of the newer style
and is DEFINITELY superior. I have AGM batteries in both of my
vehicles - neither of which ius a cruiser or taxi cab.