What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/in...nts-d_471.html

Even if I look deeper into the granularity, it still seems an odd size:
http://www.liming.org/InMoov/pics/decimalchart.jpg

So I simply ask you if you have experence with this problem.

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

On 12/6/2016 10:07 AM, Leon Schneider wrote:
What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*
[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch
[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/in...nts-d_471.html

Even if I look deeper into the granularity, it still seems an odd size:
http://www.liming.org/InMoov/pics/decimalchart.jpg

So I simply ask you if you have experence with this problem.

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

Can't you use a metal valve cap?
You need a cap anyway, so it's always there in an emergency.

On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 18:07:37 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*
[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch
[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/in...nts-d_471.html

Even if I look deeper into the granularity, it still seems an odd size:
http://www.liming.org/InMoov/pics/decimalchart.jpg

So I simply ask you if you have experence with this problem.

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

Can't you just use a stem puller tool; instead of the core tool or a
nut. Much easier.

https://www.amazon.com/Milton-S-449-Valve-Insertion-Tool/dp/B000K1PKFY/ref=sr_1_3/151-3094190-8516300?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1481049631&sr=1-3&keywords=valve+stem+puller#productDetails

or https://tinyurl.com/hve25mc

Sorry about not answering the thread size.

In article ,
says...

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*
[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch
[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/in...nts-d_471.html

Even if I look deeper into the granularity, it still seems an odd size:
http://www.liming.org/InMoov/pics/decimalchart.jpg

So I simply ask you if you have experence with this problem.

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?


There is no 'standard' nut to be found that will fit the tire valve.

The valve has been the same odd ball value for all tires US and others
from about the time of the first tires.

Standard automotive (car) Schrader valve dimension is

7.7 mm OD

32 tpi, or 0.794 mm pitch

Minor diameter is 6.9

Thread designation is .305-32 or 7.7-32

Nice mix of inches and millimetres!

If you want a nut, you are probably going to have to make your own or
have it made for you.

Leon Schneider posted for all of us...



What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg


You aren't going to able to do with out the tool. You may have a TPMS stem.

If you insist, I would get some extended metal valve caps and have at them
as you wish.

Remember the valve cap has a very large job of keeping the air in the tire
as schrader valves are dodgy.

--
Tekkie

Leon Schneider wrote:

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

It doesn't exist commercially but if you really want to go that way
Schrader thread taps are available (try ebay) so you could drill an
existing nut to the tapping diameter and make your own.

--
John H

In article , john4271
@hotmail.com says...

Leon Schneider wrote:

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

It doesn't exist commercially but if you really want to go that way
Schrader thread taps are available (try ebay) so you could drill an
existing nut to the tapping diameter and make your own.

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Slim...alve+Tool&rlz=
1C1GGGE_enUS434US449&oq=Slime+20088+4-Way+Valve+Tool&aqs=chrome..69i57
&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

--
RonNNN

Leon Schneider wrote:
What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*
[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch
[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

That sounds about right. Get yourself some brass stock, take ten minutes
to cut one on a good lathe.

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.

Sure isn't, that's deliberate.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On Tue, 6 Dec 2016 18:07:37 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?

To insert the tire valve, I know there is a ridiculously cheap cross-type
valve tool where you thread it on the outside of the tire valve to pull the
tire valve through the hole in the wheel rim, but for emergency use I just
want to stock a few nuts that I can thread on the outside of a new valve to
use as a ledge to pull the tire valve through the hole as shown he
https://d3vl3jxeh4ou3u.cloudfront.ne...e%20pliers.jpg

Looking for what nuts to purchase, the Wikipedia for Schrader valves says
the typical passenger brass & rubber tubeless tire pop-in Schrader valve
has OD threads of:

*TR 418, 0.453 in (11.5 mm) rim hole diam. 2 in (51 mm) long*
[*] Metric: 7.7 mm OD, thread root diameter is 6.9 mm ? 0.794 mm pitch
[*] Imperial: 0.305 in OD, thread root diameter 0.271 in ? 32 tpi (threads
per inch; thread density)

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/in...nts-d_471.html

Even if I look deeper into the granularity, it still seems an odd size:
http://www.liming.org/InMoov/pics/decimalchart.jpg

So I simply ask you if you have experence with this problem.

What size nut goes onto a typical US passenger tire Schrader valve?
just use a metal valvecap and a washer.. The actual thread is a
..305X32 - which is NOT a standard fastener thread.

RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?

wrote on Tue, 06 Dec 2016 17:44:38 -0500:

just use a metal valvecap and a washer.. The actual thread is a
.305X32 - which is NOT a standard fastener thread.

The standard metal cap and a washer would work but I think I'll just buy
the right tool.

There are so many valve removal and replacement tools that it isn't funny.

This one has a screwdrover-hook to remove and a screwdriver-funnel to
replace for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgDzZIop_uw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9l4pJNg9k0I

This guy just broke the old valve off and used the 4-way tool to put the
new valve back on.
https://youtu.be/HZSvNRifTDw

Tekkie? wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:45:19 -0500:

You may have a TPMS stem.

It's the old style (1995) valve stem so there is no TPMS.
Sorry for not mentioning this in the OP.

Leon Schneider wrote:
RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?

Easily. To remove the old one you just cut the inside section off. That
keeps you from trying to reuse an old stem.
Next take the new stem, coat it with either tire lube or some very soapy
water and put it through the hole, then pull with the 4 way while moving
your hand in a circle (not turning the valve). It will pull right into
place.

--
Steve W.

In article ,
says...

RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?

Yes. And as you've posted the video's you now know you can change the
stem without removing the tire.

--
RonNNN

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 05:35:41 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?
Remove with a utility knife, install with the tool. Soap the stem
first.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 05:40:20 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

wrote on Tue, 06 Dec 2016 17:44:38 -0500:

just use a metal valvecap and a washer.. The actual thread is a
.305X32 - which is NOT a standard fastener thread.

The standard metal cap and a washer would work but I think I'll just buy
the right tool.

There are so many valve removal and replacement tools that it isn't funny.

This one has a screwdrover-hook to remove and a screwdriver-funnel to
replace for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgDzZIop_uw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9l4pJNg9k0I

This guy just broke the old valve off and used the 4-way tool to put the
new valve back on.
https://youtu.be/HZSvNRifTDw
pretty slick!! (the funnel type)

In article ,
says...

RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?

Yes, just lube it with something.

They do make valve stems that instead of a friction fit that have a nut
on the outside so the valve stem fits on like a bolt.

Ralph Mowery wrote on Wed, 7 Dec 2016 09:59:24 -0500:

Yes, just lube it with something.

They do make valve stems that instead of a friction fit that have a nut
on the outside so the valve stem fits on like a bolt.

I have seen those nut-type valve stems in the stores, and I read while I
looked this up that alloy wheels often use them.

I have steel wheels so I'll use the rubber but is the procedure the same
for the nut-type?

Or do you just unscrew them and they fall out and you screw them and they
go in (without any special tools)?

RonNNN wrote on Wed, 7 Dec 2016 06:35:52 -0600:

Yes. And as you've posted the video's you now know you can change the
stem without removing the tire.

Thanks for confirming that the cheap tool works just fine for my purpose,
where the tire is already off the rim.

The one hook-and-funnel tool works with the tire on the rim, whereas the
rest of the tools I found work with the bead broken at least well enough to
get your hand in there.

Since I've seen in the videos people replacing the valve by breaking the
bead while the tire is still on the car, one guy had a neat trick where he
tied a long string to a drywall screw and before he cut the old valve stem
in half, he screwed the screw into the backside (inside the tire) of the
rubber valve stem.

That way, if the inside cut-off rubber part fell, he could retrieve it
easily. For him, this was important because he was breaking the bead with
the wheel still mounted to the vehicle.

For me, the tire will always be off the rim so I don't need that
string-and-screw trick, but it's nice to know about in a pinch.

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 08:02:40 -0500:

Remove with a utility knife, install with the tool. Soap the stem
first.

Thanks for confirming that the cheap tool works just fine.

As you probably know, experience in choosing tools is everything because
ometimes you don't want the cheap tool, and sometimes you do.

It all depends, usually, on three basic things for all tools:
1. Use the cheap tool if it does the job well enough to do it right
2. Buy the expensive "finesse" tools if you do it a lot
3. The smaller and easier stored the tool, the better (for storage reasons)

This 4-way cheap ubiquitous tool meets the standard tool's #1 and #3
criteria, and since I'm not doing the job a lot, I don't need to meet the
#2 criterion for "elegant" tools.

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 08:06:15 -0500:

This one has a screwdrover-hook to remove and a screwdriver-funnel to
replace for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgDzZIop_uw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9l4pJNg9k0I
pretty slick!! (the funnel type)

Last night I watched something like a score of tire-valve replacement
videos. One caveat is that a lot of videos use the same words for just
removing the inner schrader valve stem versus the complete removal and
replacement of the valve itself.

Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems they use basically these different
types of tools.

1. Traditional method:
2. Redneck method:
3. Fancy method:
4. Pro method:

*REMOVAL STYLES* AFAIK from my Youtube education last night:
1. The traditional method is apparently to cut the valve in half and
retrieve the pieces (sometimes tying a string to a screw and screwing that
screw into the inside of the ball on the inside of the rim if you haven't
removed the tire from the rim).

2. The redneck method is to simply band the valve stem from the ouside with
your finger until it breaks off and then just push the inside piece away
from the rim.

3. The fancy method is to use the hook part of the hook-and-funnel
combination, where you bend the valve to the side and shove a hook and
twist the hook until it catches on the inside hole and you pull the valve
out without needing to remove the bead.

4. The professionals seem to use a grooved levered long-handled tool that
screws onto the valve stem on the outside where the grooves seat on the rim
edge and they pop the valve out the front using sheer leverage force.


*INSTALLATION STYLES* AFAIK from my Youtube education last night:
1. The traditional method is apparently to place the valve loosely and then
screw on a small cheap 4-way crossbar tool on the outside and just pull it
through until it seats.

2. The redneck method is to use a nail as a substitute for your four-way
crossbar tool where you first remove the inside Schrader core and then you
shove a nail with the pointy side facing out through the valve tube, and
then you use vise grips to grab the nail and pull the valve out until it
seats.

3. The fancy method is to use the funnel part of the hook-and-funnel
combination, where you shove the valve forward into the rim until it seats.

4. The professionals seem to use that same grooved levered long-handled
tool that screws onto the valve stem on the outside where the grooves seat
on the rim edge and they push the valve in through the front using sheer
leverage force.

Is that a decent summary of the styles available to us for removing and
replacing a conventional rubber tubeless tire valve?

Steve W. wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 04:08:41 -0500:

Easily. To remove the old one you just cut the inside section off. That
keeps you from trying to reuse an old stem.
Next take the new stem, coat it with either tire lube or some very soapy
water and put it through the hole, then pull with the 4 way while moving
your hand in a circle (not turning the valve). It will pull right into
place.

Thank you for that advice as it's not obvious that the tiny $2 four-way
tool is good enough considering my searches found a bunch of tools for
removing and replacing automotive tubeless tire valve stems from
a. Cable pullers
b. Grooved hinged levers
c. Hook-and-funnel tools (these work without breaking the bead though)
d. And the inexpensive 4-way tool

I have the rubber and brass style but is it different for the style that
has metal nuts or similar?

Scott Dorsey wrote on 6 Dec 2016 16:45:21 -0500:

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.

Sure isn't, that's deliberate.

I keep seeing this *mix* of metric and what they seem to call "Imperial",
(which I guess is the USA?).

Are we really that imperial?

Anyway, I'm confused about this mix of metric and US measurements. I
realize that car tires have both at the same time but for different things.

For example, the P250/50R18 designation is a mix of units for different
measurements
1. P = passenger
2. 250 = millimeters of tread width
3. 50 = percent width being the height in millimeters
4. R = radial
5. 18 = diameter in inches

So they mix letters, percents, millimeters, and inches but each one
designates a different measurement.

Is it the same with the mix of units on the Schrader valve threads?
The reason I ask is that there are only two measurements:
1. Nominal diameter (thread root & thread crown)
2. Threads per measurement unit

Given there are only really two measurements on a valve stem nut selection,
I thought the two lines in the Wikipedia weren't a mix but just two ways of
measuring the same thing?

Aren't these two different measurements measuring the same thing?
1. Metric: 7.7 mm OD, 6.9 mm thread root, 0.794 mm pitch
2. USA: 0.305 in OD, 0.271 in thread root, 32 TPI pitch

Right?
That means it's *not* a mix.
It's just like measuring a 5/32 and 4mm bolt, where both use the same
wrech.

My question is:
Isn't the tire valve NOT a mix of measurement standards?

Leon Schneider wrote:
wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 08:02:40 -0500:

Remove with a utility knife, install with the tool. Soap the stem
first.

Thanks for confirming that the cheap tool works just fine.

As you probably know, experience in choosing tools is everything because
ometimes you don't want the cheap tool, and sometimes you do.

It all depends, usually, on three basic things for all tools:
1. Use the cheap tool if it does the job well enough to do it right
2. Buy the expensive "finesse" tools if you do it a lot
3. The smaller and easier stored the tool, the better (for storage reasons)

This 4-way cheap ubiquitous tool meets the standard tool's #1 and #3
criteria, and since I'm not doing the job a lot, I don't need to meet the
#2 criterion for "elegant" tools.

If you're going to be doing tens, hundreds, or thousands of wheels then
get the best tool that you can afford. Usually that means the most expensive.

Leon Schneider wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote on Wed, 7 Dec 2016 09:59:24 -0500:

Yes, just lube it with something.

They do make valve stems that instead of a friction fit that have a nut
on the outside so the valve stem fits on like a bolt.

I have seen those nut-type valve stems in the stores, and I read while I
looked this up that alloy wheels often use them.

I have steel wheels so I'll use the rubber but is the procedure the same
for the nut-type?

Or do you just unscrew them and they fall out and you screw them and they
go in (without any special tools)?

Some alloy wheels and all large trucks use the nut type.
They just unscrew, but they rarely need replacing unless obviously damaged.

Leon Schneider wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote on 6 Dec 2016 16:45:21 -0500:

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.

Sure isn't, that's deliberate.

I keep seeing this *mix* of metric and what they seem to call "Imperial",
(which I guess is the USA?).

Are we really that imperial?

No, Imperial measures are not the same as US measures. An Imperial pint is
0.57 litres, while a US liquid pint is 0.47 litres.

US measures, Imperial measures, and English measures are all different.

So they mix letters, percents, millimeters, and inches but each one
designates a different measurement.

That's how it goes. I've seen pressure gauges in pounds/cm2, even. We
live in that kind of world.

Aren't these two different measurements measuring the same thing?
1. Metric: 7.7 mm OD, 6.9 mm thread root, 0.794 mm pitch
2. USA: 0.305 in OD, 0.271 in thread root, 32 TPI pitch

Right?
That means it's *not* a mix.

It depends how the original document specifies it. But you could think about
it either way if you were setting a lathe up.

My question is:
Isn't the tire valve NOT a mix of measurement standards?

I don't know, I haven't read the original specification document. It's
likely written in terms of ordinary US standards, given when and where it
came about.

It's not a standard SAE thread, but then there are an infinite number of
possible threads and only a very few of them are standard SAE threads.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 12/7/2016 12:33 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Leon Schneider wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote on 6 Dec 2016 16:45:21 -0500:

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.

Sure isn't, that's deliberate.

I keep seeing this *mix* of metric and what they seem to call "Imperial",
(which I guess is the USA?).

Are we really that imperial?

No, Imperial measures are not the same as US measures. An Imperial pint is
0.57 litres, while a US liquid pint is 0.47 litres.

US measures, Imperial measures, and English measures are all different.

So they mix letters, percents, millimeters, and inches but each one
designates a different measurement.

That's how it goes. I've seen pressure gauges in pounds/cm2, even. We
live in that kind of world.

Aren't these two different measurements measuring the same thing?
1. Metric: 7.7 mm OD, 6.9 mm thread root, 0.794 mm pitch
2. USA: 0.305 in OD, 0.271 in thread root, 32 TPI pitch

Right?
That means it's *not* a mix.

It depends how the original document specifies it. But you could think about
it either way if you were setting a lathe up.

My question is:
Isn't the tire valve NOT a mix of measurement standards?

I don't know, I haven't read the original specification document. It's
likely written in terms of ordinary US standards, given when and where it
came about.

It's not a standard SAE thread, but then there are an infinite number of
possible threads and only a very few of them are standard SAE threads.
--scott


Right and Schrader (1890-ish) predates SAE anyway. Prior
standards were UNC/UNF, before that NC/NF and before that
Whitworth 55 degree threads in an era when many
manufacturers of many things made up thread formats as they
went along.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 09:59:24 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

RonNNN wrote on Tue, 6 Dec 2016 15:39:37 -0600:

4-way valve stem tools cost less than $2. It amazes me why some people
want to reinvent some things.

Assuming the tire is off the rim, can I both remove an old valve and
replace it with a new valve using that cheap 4-way tool?

Yes, just lube it with something.

They do make valve stems that instead of a friction fit that have a nut
on the outside so the valve stem fits on like a bolt.

I use "bolt in" stems on all of my vehicles now since I lost 4 stems
in one trip on my PT Cruiser. That was Kitchener to PEI and back.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 16:59:12 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

Ralph Mowery wrote on Wed, 7 Dec 2016 09:59:24 -0500:

Yes, just lube it with something.

They do make valve stems that instead of a friction fit that have a nut
on the outside so the valve stem fits on like a bolt.

I have seen those nut-type valve stems in the stores, and I read while I
looked this up that alloy wheels often use them.

I have steel wheels so I'll use the rubber but is the procedure the same
for the nut-type?

Or do you just unscrew them and they fall out and you screw them and they
go in (without any special tools)?
You got'er Cotter. Just tighten with a socket wrench.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 16:59:34 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote on 6 Dec 2016 16:45:21 -0500:

Assuming "Imperial" means "USA", that would mean I need a 32 TPI nut
somewhere between 0.271 inches and 0.305 inches in iD, but that doesn't
seem to be a standard size for a USA nut.

Sure isn't, that's deliberate.

I keep seeing this *mix* of metric and what they seem to call "Imperial",
(which I guess is the USA?).

Are we really that imperial?

Imperial is referring to the british system, which you yanks have hung
onto with so much love since the revolution, and the britts have
pretrty much replaced with Metric.

wrote:

Imperial is referring to the british system, which you yanks have hung
onto with so much love since the revolution, and the britts have
pretrty much replaced with Metric.

We did not hang onto it, we created totally new standards based only vaguely
on the British standards. So a pint of beer here gives you substantially
less beer than it does in London.

It's true that the US is the only country left in the world still using the
British Thermal Unit.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 14:56:28 -0500:

I use "bolt in" stems on all of my vehicles now since I lost 4 stems
in one trip on my PT Cruiser. That was Kitchener to PEI and back.

How do you *lose* stems?

I would think what gets most stems is curb damage, which is gonna happen no
matter what type of stem (I'm guessing).

The second thing that I would guess gets most stems is ozone damage, which,
again, is gonna happen to all rubber stems.

I guess they can use better rubber (something better than buna anyway), and
I guess they can use more steel and/or brass (but then it's heavier).

So it seems to be a tradeoff.

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 14:57:20 -0500:

You got'er Cotter. Just tighten with a socket wrench.

Thanks.

I wonder which is better *quality*?

I suspect neither is better than the other.

I would "guess" (ASSume) that the one with nuts is *heavier* (which is a
bad thing) and more expensive (another bad thing).

I doubt it seals any better on a steel wheel (guessing again though).

Does it seal better on an alloy wheel?

Paul in Houston TX wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:13:43 -0600:

Some alloy wheels and all large trucks use the nut type.
They just unscrew, but they rarely need replacing unless obviously damaged.

Thanks for letting me know. I've never removed a tire valve before, so,
this is a first (I'm repairing a tire that has a hole in the middle of the
terad).

Paul in Houston TX wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:11:05 -0600:

If you're going to be doing tens, hundreds, or thousands of wheels then
get the best tool that you can afford. Usually that means the most expensive.

I appreciate the insight but you hit a sore point with me so please don't
take my diatribe below personally - but I've heard too many people say what
you just said, which I think is the wrong approach entirely.

You don't approach a tool from a cost perspective; you approach a tool from
the quality of results perspective.

I realize you said "usually", so, I agree that you're already on board,
when I say that choosing tool-quality by cost is entirely the wrong logic,
but the other half of what you said is the correct logic, which is to use
the best tool if you need it.

Whether or not it is expensive is completly meaningless (most people simply
*assume* expensive stuff is better becuase it's a simple number and they
can handle numbers but they can't handle myriad technical details when
comparing two different tools).

For example, a 100K dollar alignment system may not be any more accurate
than a $500 alignment system, but it does stuff that the shop needs, e.g.,
it allows dumber people to operate it and it allows hands-free measurements
and it allows cars to be easily ramped on and off and it allows printing of
the results, etc.

None of that has any bearing on the quality of the results and all of that
raises the expense of the machine such that the local morons down the
street think you have to buy an alignment tool for 100K dollars just to get
a "good" alignment.

You can get a good alignment for probably 100 dollars in tools, and
certainly for 500 dollars in tools; but it won't have all that time-saving
stuff (where for a mechanic, time is money).

In contrast to your point, it may very well be that a $100 cellphone gets
you as good an alignment as a $100K alignment tool.

The only thing that matters is the quality of the results.
The cost of the tool isn't a factor in the quality of the results.

To the point, I'm not positive yet because I haven't done it, but I would
bet that the quality of results from using a nail inside the tire valve
when seating it is as good as the quality of results from using that $25
grooved swivel-head lever tool just as the quality of results when removing
the valve with a utility knife is probably as good as the quality of
results when using that fancy tool.

PS: I didn't aim this *at* you, but at the team becuase too many people use
"cost" of things as a "quality" measurement - and it's never the case.
People just use "cost" because they don't understand quality but they
understand numbers such as numbers of dollars. But it's the wrong way of
looking at tools (it's a factor though).

On 7 Dec 2016 15:33:19 -0500, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

wrote:

Imperial is referring to the british system, which you yanks have hung
onto with so much love since the revolution, and the britts have
pretrty much replaced with Metric.

We did not hang onto it, we created totally new standards based only vaguely
on the British standards. So a pint of beer here gives you substantially
less beer than it does in London.

It's true that the US is the only country left in the world still using the
British Thermal Unit.
--scott
and the inch, foot, mile, fehrenheit temperatures, lbs and ounces and
tons (as compared to tonnes)and a whole lot of other measurements you
did NOT change.. Your fluid measure was changed to short-change the
brits.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 21:35:19 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 14:56:28 -0500:

I use "bolt in" stems on all of my vehicles now since I lost 4 stems
in one trip on my PT Cruiser. That was Kitchener to PEI and back.

How do you *lose* stems?

I would think what gets most stems is curb damage, which is gonna happen no
matter what type of stem (I'm guessing).

The second thing that I would guess gets most stems is ozone damage, which,
again, is gonna happen to all rubber stems.

I guess they can use better rubber (something better than buna anyway), and
I guess they can use more steel and/or brass (but then it's heavier).

So it seems to be a tradeoff.
I had 4 stems crack and loose air on the trip. They were all nice
short stems less than a year old, installed with the new tires by the
tire shop. It ends up they were crappy chinese crap stems, but 4 for 4
is BAD. I have alloy rims for summer and winter wheels on the truck -
all with bolt-ins. I have bolt-ins on the summer alloys for the
Tautus. I bought a set of used snows on alloys for the Taurus this
fall. They stiull have the rubber cores, but I have a set of bolt-ins
sitting in the wings - ready to go in.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 21:35:20 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 14:57:20 -0500:

You got'er Cotter. Just tighten with a socket wrench.

Thanks.

I wonder which is better *quality*?

I suspect neither is better than the other.

I would "guess" (ASSume) that the one with nuts is *heavier* (which is a
bad thing) and more expensive (another bad thing).

I doubt it seals any better on a steel wheel (guessing again though).

Does it seal better on an alloy wheel?
The aluminum bolt ins are, if anything, only a few gramms heavier
than the rubber ones. They do seal better on boyh steel and alloy
because the rubber seal is compressed much more positively than the
rubber stem, forming a VERY tight seal.They are a bit more expensive -
I think I paid something like $1.50 each for the bolt-ins. Rubber
ones are about $1.30 on e-bay and $2.00 at the tire shop - so it's
pretty much a toss-up - and they last for years.

Curb damage is not an issue with either if you use short stems - and
with expensive alloy rims I stay well away from curbs anyway.

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 21:35:22 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

Paul in Houston TX wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:13:43 -0600:

Some alloy wheels and all large trucks use the nut type.
They just unscrew, but they rarely need replacing unless obviously damaged.

Thanks for letting me know. I've never removed a tire valve before, so,
this is a first (I'm repairing a tire that has a hole in the middle of the
terad).
Just make sure the repair is done properly. Anything bigger than a
nail hole I consider to be NOT REPAIRABLE on today's radial tires.
(and I spent many years in the auto repair and tire businesses)

On Wed, 7 Dec 2016 21:35:23 -0000 (UTC), Leon Schneider
wrote:

Paul in Houston TX wrote on Wed, 07 Dec 2016 12:11:05 -0600:

If you're going to be doing tens, hundreds, or thousands of wheels then
get the best tool that you can afford. Usually that means the most expensive.

I appreciate the insight but you hit a sore point with me so please don't
take my diatribe below personally - but I've heard too many people say what
you just said, which I think is the wrong approach entirely.

You don't approach a tool from a cost perspective; you approach a tool from
the quality of results perspective.

I realize you said "usually", so, I agree that you're already on board,
when I say that choosing tool-quality by cost is entirely the wrong logic,
but the other half of what you said is the correct logic, which is to use
the best tool if you need it.

Whether or not it is expensive is completly meaningless (most people simply
*assume* expensive stuff is better becuase it's a simple number and they
can handle numbers but they can't handle myriad technical details when
comparing two different tools).

For example, a 100K dollar alignment system may not be any more accurate
than a $500 alignment system, but it does stuff that the shop needs, e.g.,
it allows dumber people to operate it and it allows hands-free measurements
and it allows cars to be easily ramped on and off and it allows printing of
the results, etc.

None of that has any bearing on the quality of the results and all of that
raises the expense of the machine such that the local morons down the
street think you have to buy an alignment tool for 100K dollars just to get
a "good" alignment.

You can get a good alignment for probably 100 dollars in tools, and
certainly for 500 dollars in tools; but it won't have all that time-saving
stuff (where for a mechanic, time is money).

In contrast to your point, it may very well be that a $100 cellphone gets
you as good an alignment as a $100K alignment tool.

The only thing that matters is the quality of the results.
The cost of the tool isn't a factor in the quality of the results.

To the point, I'm not positive yet because I haven't done it, but I would
bet that the quality of results from using a nail inside the tire valve
when seating it is as good as the quality of results from using that $25
grooved swivel-head lever tool just as the quality of results when removing
the valve with a utility knife is probably as good as the quality of
results when using that fancy tool.

PS: I didn't aim this *at* you, but at the team becuase too many people use
"cost" of things as a "quality" measurement - and it's never the case.
People just use "cost" because they don't understand quality but they
understand numbers such as numbers of dollars. But it's the wrong way of
looking at tools (it's a factor though).
I have long held to the position "never buy the cheapest or the most
expensive, because you will be overpaying for either one"