cl wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 10:27:09 +0000:

Bad example! Have you looked at the tolerance on the trip current of a
circuit breaker? It may not trip below 40 amps but don't expect it to
trip at 41 amps, not for a very, very long time anyway!

But that was what I was trying to get at.
If a 40A breaker consistently tripped at 34 Amps, you'd likely be upset.

To me, when watts are not only expensive, but 5 Watts is the typical
output of *many* single USB ports out there, so, to mis-state the power
by 5 Watts is a big deal.

Do you ever wonder why they never underestimate the wattage?
For example, you'll almost never see it listed as 29 Watts.

Why is that the mistake is almost always an over statement?

tlvp wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 01:30:49 -0500:

Bought any resistors or capacitors lately? Resistors are commonly sold
with nominal values +/- 20%; capacitors, with +100/-50%. +/-15% may not
be high precision, but it's better than common precision .

And anyway, 35 isn't a whole 15% less than 40, it's only 12.5% less, if
we're going to try for highest arithmetic precision here . No big deal.

If I bought a precision resistor, and it was off by 15%, I'd be upset.

On Wednesday, December 2, 2015 at 11:16:27 AM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
tlvp wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 01:30:49 -0500:

Bought any resistors or capacitors lately? Resistors are commonly sold
with nominal values +/- 20%; capacitors, with +100/-50%. +/-15% may not
be high precision, but it's better than common precision .

And anyway, 35 isn't a whole 15% less than 40, it's only 12.5% less, if
we're going to try for highest arithmetic precision here . No big deal.

If I bought a precision resistor, and it was off by 15%, I'd be upset.

But you didn't buy a precision USB charger either. You bought a
typical made in China widget, marketed not by Apple, Sony, etc,
which typically vets those products, maintains some control over them,
but by a company called "Hype", which could be run out of someone's
bedroom for all we know. It's typical that these have documentation
errors, language translation errors, etc. And some of them are just
junk on top of that.

You said you bought over half a dozen. Have you tried another one?
If it works, send the bad one back. If it doesn't work, send them
all back and get another product.

In article , wrote:

but the odds are much better that you will get a safe, quality product.
The off-brand products tend to be made in little sweatshops, people's
kitchens, wherever, without the benefit of engineering knowledge or QC.

not only that, but with a name brand, you get a company to go to if
something does go wrong.

with a noname brand, you're screwed, and the magnitude of the problems
are bigger. see my other post for just how ****ty a noname charger can
actually be.

In the UK (and Europe in the main) your claim if something doesn't
work or isn't to specification is against the seller. You have no
rights against the manufacturer unless you bought it direct from them
(though in some cases they *may* offer service). Thus it doesn't
matter at all if something is branded or not, you still have a claim
against the seller.

that just changes who remedies the situation. it doesn't avoid the
failure.

the best way to avoid a failure is by buying quality parts. if you buy
noname crap, the chances of a failure are quite a bit higher.

"tlvp" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 1 Dec 2015 20:42:21 -0000 (UTC), Danny D. wrote:

tlvp wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 05:32:44 -0500:

In electronics, +/-15% isn't too far off . Cheers, -- tlvp

It depends.

Bought any resistors or capacitors lately? Resistors are commonly sold
with
nominal values +/- 20%; capacitors, with +100/-50%. +/-15% may not be high
precision, but it's better than common precision :-) .


Electronic components are more precise now than they were years ago. Thirty
years ago most resistors were 10% or beter. Now they are often 5 %.

The electrolytic capacitors may be +100/-50, but most of the others are
usually in the 10 % or less range. Even a cheep motor starter capacitor I
have is labled as 6 %.

Back when the Simpson 260 was the 'standard' test meter it was difficult to
measure many values very close. Now the 'free with purchse' Harbor Freight
digital meter will go to about 1 or 2 % and good meters much less.

"trader_4" wrote in message
...

But you didn't buy a precision USB charger either. You bought a
typical made in China widget, marketed not by Apple, Sony, etc,
which typically vets those products, maintains some control over them,
but by a company called "Hype", which could be run out of someone's
bedroom for all we know. It's typical that these have documentation
errors, language translation errors, etc. And some of them are just
junk on top of that.


Some of the China stuff is junk, but some surprises me. I bought some DC
volt metes that were mainly a circuit board with a display on it. Good from
0 to 99.9 volts. Out of the 4 that I bought for about $ 6 total including
shipping all but 1 followed my Fluke meter up to about 30 volts which was
the limit of the poewr supply I used to test them and the other one was off
by the last digit most of the time which is often normal. That was reading
to the tenth of a volt.

My $ 27 ham band handy takey from China works as well as any other one form
Japan that costs 5 times as much.

trader_4 wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 08:27:32 -0800:

You said you bought over half a dozen. Have you tried another one?
If it works, send the bad one back. If it doesn't work, send them all
back and get another product.

The cable was what was bad.

Ralph Mowery wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 11:49:32 -0500:

Some of the China stuff is junk

Virtually everything like this is made in China.

nospam wrote, on Wed, 02 Dec 2015 11:38:00 -0500:

that just changes who remedies the situation. it doesn't avoid the
failure.

the best way to avoid a failure is by buying quality parts. if you buy
noname crap, the chances of a failure are quite a bit higher.

After a few days of testing, I'm positive it was a bad cable.
I'll return it to the store.

On Tuesday, December 1, 2015 at 2:20:06 PM UTC-6, Tekkie® wrote:
Uncle Monster posted for all of us...

On Monday, November 30, 2015 at 8:38:21 PM UTC-6, Bruce Sinclair wrote:
In article , "Danny D." wrote:
Bruce Sinclair wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 01:56:02 +0000:

And the difference between 35 and 40 W is so small as to be irrelevant too I
suggest.

Um, at 5 volts, wouldn't that be 1 amp? ?(???)?

[8~{} Uncle Amp Monster

Another one off the rails into the ravine and this one is burning...
--
Tekkie

5 watts divided by 5 volts = 1 amp. Correct me if I'm wrong. ＼（〇_�）�

[8~{} Uncle Amped Monster

On Tuesday, December 1, 2015 at 4:46:15 PM UTC-6, Bruce Sinclair wrote:
In article , nospam wrote:
In article , Davoud
wrote:

I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills...

You don't need to be an engineer, don't need all the technical details
and power formulae. You just need to know that you bought a cheap,
off-brand charger that was made in a country that is infamous for
producing shoddy and dangerous electrical devices--like the surge
protector that I bought that had the hot and ground wires soldered to
the same terminal. Be glad that it melted the the USB connector and
didn't set your house afire and kill your family. And next time, don't
be penny wise and pound foolish; buy the manufacturer's original
charger for each device.

based on what he's posted, it's more likely to be a ****ty cable than a
****ty charger.

either way, he did cheap out.

.. sadly these days, price is not an indication of quality. Neither is a
brand name. Particularly since high and low priced, and "brand" and non brand
products are largely made in the same factory.

I seem to recall a time long ago when amps and speakers were advertised to have a power rating that was equivalent to a lightning strike hitting the power supply. I remember holding a speaker that weighed a few ounces that was advertised as being a 25 watt speaker. The label didn't show how many milliseconds the speaker would last at that power level. The same sort of exaggeration seems to be going on with a lot of Chinese made USB chargers and power supplies. （〇_�）

[8~{} Uncle USB Monster

Uncle Monster posted for all of us...



On Tuesday, December 1, 2015 at 2:20:06 PM UTC-6, Tekkie® wrote:
Uncle Monster posted for all of us...

On Monday, November 30, 2015 at 8:38:21 PM UTC-6, Bruce Sinclair wrote:
In article , "Danny D." wrote:
Bruce Sinclair wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 01:56:02 +0000:

And the difference between 35 and 40 W is so small as to be irrelevant too I
suggest.

Um, at 5 volts, wouldn't that be 1 amp? ?(???)?

[8~{} Uncle Amp Monster

Another one off the rails into the ravine and this one is burning...
--
Tekkie

5 watts divided by 5 volts = 1 amp. Correct me if I'm wrong. \(?_o)/

[8~{} Uncle Amped Monster

Correct, now I am all amped up (for what I don't know)

--
Tekkie

On Wed, 2 Dec 2015 16:13:58 -0000 (UTC), Danny D. wrote:

If I bought a precision resistor, and it was off by 15%, I'd be upset.

Natch. But did you buy precision USB chargers :-) ? Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

On Wed, 2 Dec 2015 11:42:59 -0500, Ralph Mowery wrote:

Electronic components are more precise now than they were years ago. Thirty
years ago most resistors were 10% or beter. Now they are often 5 %.

You could easily get 5% precision resistors 30 years ago, too. Even 2% or
1% ones. Often they cost a bit more, though.

The electrolytic capacitors may be +100/-50, but most of the others are
usually in the 10 % or less range. Even a cheep motor starter capacitor I
have is labled as 6 % .

I don't deny that higher precision devices are available. But the classic
"el cheepo" versions are only rarely higher precision :-) .

Back when the Simpson 260 was the 'standard' test meter it was difficult to
measure many values very close. Now the 'free with purchse' Harbor Freight
digital meter will go to about 1 or 2 % and good meters much less.

For real accuracy nothing tops the current $2 Chinese "Rolex" watches :-) .
Yet, a bargain 6.8A USB charger is unlikely to be a paradigm of precision.

Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

On 12/03/2015 08:48 PM, tlvp wrote:
On Wed, 2 Dec 2015 11:42:59 -0500, Ralph Mowery wrote:

Electronic components are more precise now than they were years ago. Thirty
years ago most resistors were 10% or beter. Now they are often 5 %.

You could easily get 5% precision resistors 30 years ago, too. Even 2% or
1% ones. Often they cost a bit more, though.

ALWAYS the cost quite a bit more! Somebody had to measure the
resistance and paint on those pretty little gold stripes.

The electrolytic capacitors may be +100/-50, but most of the others are
usually in the 10 % or less range. Even a cheep motor starter capacitor I
have is labled as 6 % .

I don't deny that higher precision devices are available. But the classic
"el cheepo" versions are only rarely higher precision :-) .

Back when the Simpson 260 was the 'standard' test meter it was difficult to
measure many values very close. Now the 'free with purchse' Harbor Freight
digital meter will go to about 1 or 2 % and good meters much less.

Simpsons are still nice when you need to see a reading with only your
peripheral vision.

For real accuracy nothing tops the current $2 Chinese "Rolex" watches :-) .
Yet, a bargain 6.8A USB charger is unlikely to be a paradigm of precision.

Cheers, -- tlvp


--
Cheers, Bev
-----------------------------------------
"Not everyone can be above average so why
shouldn't we be the ones to suck?"
--Anonymous School Board Member

On Thursday, December 3, 2015 at 1:37:32 PM UTC-6, Tekkie® wrote:
Uncle Monster posted for all of us...



On Tuesday, December 1, 2015 at 2:20:06 PM UTC-6, Tekkie® wrote:
Uncle Monster posted for all of us...

On Monday, November 30, 2015 at 8:38:21 PM UTC-6, Bruce Sinclair wrote:
In article , "Danny D." wrote:
Bruce Sinclair wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 01:56:02 +0000:

And the difference between 35 and 40 W is so small as to be irrelevant too I
suggest.

Um, at 5 volts, wouldn't that be 1 amp? ?(???)?

[8~{} Uncle Amp Monster

Another one off the rails into the ravine and this one is burning...
--
Tekkie

5 watts divided by 5 volts = 1 amp. Correct me if I'm wrong. \(?_o)/

[8~{} Uncle Amped Monster

Correct, now I am all amped up (for what I don't know)
--
Tekkie

A 5 watt charger would charge my 7 inch Android tablet with no problem. I now have a tiny wall wart meant to power another device charging my tablet via the USB connection because my buddy was unable to find the specific charger and bring it to me from my home. That's one of the things I like about the USB standard because I can charge a small device off any piece of gear that can supply 5 vdc from a USB port. ʘ€¿Ê˜

[8~{} Uncle Tablet Monster

tlvp wrote, on Thu, 03 Dec 2015 23:37:01 -0500:

Natch. But did you buy precision USB chargers ? Cheers, -- tlvp

I get your point.

Most here think the difference between 34watts and 40 watts is in
the noise level.

My argument that it isn't is that you're *paying* only for watts
(there's nothing else they can change since it has to be 5 volts!).

Another argument is that they never seem to make the mistake in
the opposite direction (calling it a 29Watt device instead of 34).

But, in the end, you guys seem to think the 5 watt difference
isn't meaningful. I hear you. I understand you.

I just disagree but we can leave it at that as I understand that
you feel a 5 watt error is within the standard noise level.

tlvp wrote, on Thu, 03 Dec 2015 23:48:13 -0500:

Yet, a bargain 6.8A USB charger is unlikely to be a paradigm of
precision.

That "bargain" 40W USB charger is being offered for $60 online.
The more honest 35W USB charger is offered online for $15.

Which would you choose if you're buying watts?

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


Natch. But did you buy precision USB chargers ? Cheers, -- tlvp

I get your point.

Most here think the difference between 34watts and 40 watts is in
the noise level.

it doesn't actually matter.

My argument that it isn't is that you're *paying* only for watts
(there's nothing else they can change since it has to be 5 volts!).

the maximum wattage only comes into play if you use *all* ports, which
you won't be.

what matters is the capabilities of each port, which should be about
10-12w.

the difference in wattage is also not the cause of the cable failure.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


Yet, a bargain 6.8A USB charger is unlikely to be a paradigm of
precision.

That "bargain" 40W USB charger is being offered for $60 online.
The more honest 35W USB charger is offered online for $15.

the same product line from the same company, with the only difference
being 5w?

or are they actually two totally different products from different
companies (one a more well known brand) and with different specs and
different build quality??

in other words, your comparison of two unnamed products without any
links is completely bogus.

Which would you choose if you're buying watts?

why would anyone do that?

build quality and reliability should be a priority, not wattage.

if the charger fails, it could potentially fry the device, if not cause
a fire.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 14:35:19 -0500:

the maximum wattage only comes into play if you use *all* ports, which
you won't be.

what matters is the capabilities of each port, which should be about
10-12w.

This isn't even close to true based on the description of the part
on the package and on the web.

https://www.touchofmodern.com/sales/.../smart-adapter

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


the maximum wattage only comes into play if you use *all* ports, which
you won't be.

what matters is the capabilities of each port, which should be about
10-12w.

This isn't even close to true based on the description of the part
on the package and on the web.

https://www.touchofmodern.com/sales/.../smart-adapter

it's hard to read with that popup in the middle and no way to clear it
without an email address, but i didn't see anything that contradicts
what i said underneath, other than a nifty typo.

the point is that no single port is going to source 6.8a. fill all five
ports with 1a devices and it'll be fine. if one of the five is a tablet
that draws 2a, it'll still be fine. if the *total* goes past 6.8a, then
not so fine.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 21:33:02 -0500:

it's hard to read with that popup in the middle and no way to clear it
without an email address, but i didn't see anything that contradicts
what i said underneath, other than a nifty typo.

the point is that no single port is going to source 6.8a. fill all five
ports with 1a devices and it'll be fine. if one of the five is a tablet
that draws 2a, it'll still be fine. if the *total* goes past 6.8a, then
not so fine.

Sorry about that stupid popup.

If you google for "HC363-5U" you find the exact same part branded by
a different company with the EXACT same description EXCEPT that it's
correctly listed as a 35Watt device and not a 40W device.

$15
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-Charg.../dp/B00ORLR1X2

$60
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-35W-H.../dp/B00NUREFMO

Hausbell 35W HC363-5U UL Certified (UL No:E310745)
Family-Sized USB Wall Charger Plug Smart Charger,
Single USB Output 2.4A Max,Output total 6.8A Max,
5P-USB Output for Apple and Android Smartphones,Tablets and More(White)

Hausbell® HC363-5U：Products comply with the United States and national security certification.

product parameters
MODEL:Hausbell® HC363-5U
INPUT:100-240V 50/60Hz 800mA Max
Output:total 6800mA Max
Super Charger:5V-2400mA Max
Universal:5V-1000mA Max
size:8.9×7.3×3.3cm

characteristics
Hausbell USB smart charger, using multiple USB output, more convenient a
few products charging at the same time, can solve the charging trouble of
every family.

Hausbell® HC363-5U ideal for international travel,100-240 volt input,5
USB output:total 6800mA Max.，unibody design,size:8.9 ×7.3×3.3cm,
Industrial-grade materials and premium circuitry ensure lifetime reliability.

Description
Hausbell® HC363-5U, which possess USB smart charger products and adopt
the most advanced smart management chip under international brands,
can identify automatically the device and provide corresponding rated
charging current.

Automatic identification technology provide a solution to different
Consumer electronic products, which can not compatible under different
brands.It is the latest research of science and technology the newest
research technology in charger industry. Every family can benefit from it.

Smart chips can automatically identify the required current of charged
devices according to their brands or types and achieve quickly chargeable.
Hausbell USB smart charger, using multiple USB output, more convenient a
few products charging at the same time, can solve the charging trouble
of every family.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 14:35:20 -0500:

in other words, your comparison of two unnamed products without any
links is completely bogus.

Here is the EXACT SAME PART and BRAND and 40W price:

$30
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO

$15
http://www.frys.com/product/8423918

Here is the competitor, again, with exact same everything but the wattage
is correctly listed as 35 watts.

$15
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-Charg.../dp/B00ORLR1X2

$60
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-35W-H.../dp/B00NUREFMO

In article , Danny D.
wrote:

it's hard to read with that popup in the middle and no way to clear it
without an email address, but i didn't see anything that contradicts
what i said underneath, other than a nifty typo.

the point is that no single port is going to source 6.8a. fill all five
ports with 1a devices and it'll be fine. if one of the five is a tablet
that draws 2a, it'll still be fine. if the *total* goes past 6.8a, then
not so fine.

Sorry about that stupid popup.

it's not your fault. lots of web sites do that.

If you google for "HC363-5U" you find the exact same part branded by
a different company with the EXACT same description EXCEPT that it's
correctly listed as a 35Watt device and not a 40W device.

that means it's a generic device that gets rebranded, which usually
means it's cheap crap.

$15

http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-Charg...hones/dp/B00OR
LR1X2

$60

http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-35W-H...ed/dp/B00NUREF
MO

two different sellers with different prices. so what?

Hausbell 35W HC363-5U UL Certified (UL No:E310745)
Family-Sized USB Wall Charger Plug Smart Charger,
Single USB Output 2.4A Max,Output total 6.8A Max,
5P-USB Output for Apple and Android Smartphones,Tablets and More(White)
Output:total 6800mA Max
Super Charger:5V-2400mA Max
Universal:5V-1000mA Max

1 super charger port rated up to 2.4a, leaving 4.4a for the remaining
four ports (if you assume the 6.8a is correct), except those four ports
are rated up to 1a (not 1.1a), for a total of 6.4a (not 6.8a), or 32w.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 14:35:20 -0500:

build quality and reliability should be a priority, not wattage.

There is absolutely no way to tell the build quality.
Absolutely impossible without an oscilloscope which you can't
expect a consumer to have, and you can't even expect a consumer
to tell the build quality.

So what you suggest, while utopian, is impossible for a consumer.

They are all UL approved.

They are all of a "brand" name.
(What brand name would you choose anyway since Apple doesn't make them?)

They are all sold by brand name stores (Amazon, Frys, etc.)
http://www.frys.com/product/8423918
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-35W-H.../dp/B00NUREFMO

You suggest something that is patently impossible for a consumer to do.

This is all the consumer has for quality:
Guaranteed Safety:UL certified design(No:E310745).
Unibody design,size:8.9×7.3×3.3cm,Industrial-grade
materials and premium circuitry ensure lifetime reliability.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


build quality and reliability should be a priority, not wattage.

There is absolutely no way to tell the build quality.

yes there is. stick with reputable companies, not noname crap.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 21:56:21 -0500:

1 super charger port rated up to 2.4a, leaving 4.4a for the remaining
four ports (if you assume the 6.8a is correct), except those four ports
are rated up to 1a (not 1.1a), for a total of 6.4a (not 6.8a), or 32w.

32 Watts is even worse then, for the 40 watt claims.

The UL test report doesn't look right though.
http://umbraco-ljprodukter.utv2.toxi...20UL%2060W.pdf

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 21:56:21 -0500:

it's not your fault. lots of web sites do that.

I found a way around that stupid Facebook popup!

1. Visit that page in Firefox:
https://www.touchofmodern.com/sales/.../smart-adapter

2. Notice the unremovable popup to create a Facebook account or log in.
https://i.imgur.com/jV63Aaf.jpg

3. Type "about:config" into the URL field of Firefox:
Then type "javascript.enabled".

Toggle from:
javascript.enabled;true
Toggle to:
javascript.enabled;false

4. Press the reload button in Firefox.
Voila!

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


it's not your fault. lots of web sites do that.

I found a way around that stupid Facebook popup!

1. Visit that page in Firefox:
https://www.touchofmodern.com/sales/.../smart-adapter

2. Notice the unremovable popup to create a Facebook account or log in.
https://i.imgur.com/jV63Aaf.jpg

3. Type "about:config" into the URL field of Firefox:
Then type "javascript.enabled".

Toggle from:
javascript.enabled;true
Toggle to:
javascript.enabled;false

4. Press the reload button in Firefox.
Voila!


a much easier solution is simply click the close box.

On Fri, 4 Dec 2015 18:48:56 -0000 (UTC), Danny D. wrote:

Which would you choose if you're buying watts?

Not the more expensive of the two, that's for sure. But not the cheaper
one, either, *unless* I had reason to believe that at least one of the
vendor, the manufacturer, or the marketplace in which the offering was made
could be relied upon to guarantee my reasonable satisfaction.

Case in point: I just had delivered via USPS a CaseLogic 3-port USB
charging device, described as having Output 5V, 4.1A, 20 W.

Translation: the nominal output potential is 5V (probably +/- 10%);
the USB port markings show two ports marked 1A and one marked 2.1A.
I wouldn't want to push those to the limit, either, btw. Anyway, those
figures add up to -- are consistent with -- 4.1A total output); and the 20W
rating probably should be read as "don't try to push your luck, 'cuz 5V at
4.1A will result in 20.5W of power, and this device isn't good for that
much -- keep the output well under 20W, and you'll be OK".

IOW, individually, each USB port *may* be good for sourcing up to the
current printed alongside it (1A, 1A, 2.1A), but certainly don't expect all
three to deliver full current at the same time :-) .

(BTW, that was under $10 postpaid, tax included, from a vendor I trust.
CaseLogic I see lots of vendors offering, over a very broad price-spectrum,
so neither brand nor price was in any way a selling point, pro or con.)

HTH. Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

On Fri, 04 Dec 2015 14:35:20 -0500, nospam wrote:

the same product line from the same company, with the only difference
being 5w?

or are they actually two totally different products from different
companies (one a more well known brand) and with different specs and
different build quality??

in other words, your comparison of two unnamed products without any
links is completely bogus.

Don't be too quick to bogle at that discrepancy -- I too have seen exactly
the same item being offered by a variety of Amazon Marketplace vendors at
prices ranging from the ridiculous through the sublime to the astronomical.
Not all that often ... but recurrently, all the same.

Books; automated cat feeders; BlackBerry PlayBook leatherette covers; ... .
(For the cat feeder, the best price turned out to be the single unit price
direct from the factory itself. One amazon vendor wanted double that :-) .)

Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 22:39:05 -0500:

a much easier solution is simply click the close box.

There isn't any way to close it by clicking.
At least not in Firefox.
I've tested this with others and they agree.

In article , tlvp
wrote:


the same product line from the same company, with the only difference
being 5w?

or are they actually two totally different products from different
companies (one a more well known brand) and with different specs and
different build quality??

in other words, your comparison of two unnamed products without any
links is completely bogus.

Don't be too quick to bogle at that discrepancy -- I too have seen exactly
the same item being offered by a variety of Amazon Marketplace vendors at
prices ranging from the ridiculous through the sublime to the astronomical.
Not all that often ... but recurrently, all the same.

sure, but that's not the same thing. a seller can ask for whatever they
want and buyers can choose to pay or not pay.

he didn't say it was the same product. often, people compare products
that they think are similar, but it turns out to be different products
with different specs, so it's no surprise that the price is different.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


a much easier solution is simply click the close box.

There isn't any way to close it by clicking.
At least not in Firefox.
I've tested this with others and they agree.

every browser window has a close box, including firefox. one click and
the page (not the popup) is gone.

any website that makes things difficult to read is not worth bothering
with. there are zillions of other sites from companies that treat users
with respect, along with products that don't have discrepancies in
their specs.

nospam wrote, on Sat, 05 Dec 2015 07:16:49 -0500:

he didn't say it was the same product. often, people compare products
that they think are similar, but it turns out to be different products
with different specs, so it's no surprise that the price is different.

All the links I provided at various wattages and prices were the same
product exactly (other than the name on the outside).

Most consumers aren't detail oriented, so, if they see only the $60
40 Watt part and the $15 35Watt part, they're likely to overspend to
get the extra Watts which don't exist.

nospam wrote, on Sat, 05 Dec 2015 07:16:50 -0500:

any website that makes things difficult to read is not worth bothering
with. there are zillions of other sites from companies that treat users
with respect, along with products that don't have discrepancies in their
specs.

In this case, I showed how to turn off javascript so that /you/ could
see the site so that I would answer /your/ questions.

Anyway, it's pretty clear that it's a lie by now.
I'm trying to find out how to send that by mail to consumers union.

Does anyone have a valid complaint mail for consumer's union?

nospam wrote, on Fri, 04 Dec 2015 22:39:05 -0500:

a much easier solution is simply click the close box.

That won't work if what I was showing you was the text of
the web page (which, let's remember, was why).

Bruce Sinclair wrote:
In article , nospam wrote:
In article , wrote:

but the odds are much better that you will get a safe, quality product.
The off-brand products tend to be made in little sweatshops, people's
kitchens, wherever, without the benefit of engineering knowledge or QC.

not only that, but with a name brand, you get a company to go to if
something does go wrong.

with a noname brand, you're screwed, and the magnitude of the problems
are bigger. see my other post for just how ****ty a noname charger can
actually be.

In the UK (and Europe in the main) your claim if something doesn't
work or isn't to specification is against the seller. You have no
rights against the manufacturer unless you bought it direct from them
(though in some cases they *may* offer service). Thus it doesn't
matter at all if something is branded or not, you still have a claim
against the seller.

that just changes who remedies the situation. it doesn't avoid the
failure.

the best way to avoid a failure is by buying quality parts. if you buy
noname crap, the chances of a failure are quite a bit higher.

I still disagree here about this.

IME, you are better to buy from somewhere that has great service, than a great
brand. Things fail. Great service will fix/replace them.
Manufacturers/"brands" won't care.

You mean Apple won't care if you buy a stuff from Apple store?
Thunderbolt cable is very, tiny if pumping 6 Amp. of current non-stop
it'll charge battery for sure but because El cheapo one is just a power
supply without smartness there is no tapering back of current when
battery is nearing fully charged causing over heat and even melt the
tiny stranded wires in the cable. 6 Amp is quite a current. iPAD is not
a cheap device, my family only uses Apple charger came with iPAD.

In article , wrote:
In article , Davoud:
It ain't necessarily so. In my 10 years living in Asia I found that the
quality products were designed by U.S. engineers and manufactured in
high-end facilities. The cheap junk was often farmed out by
packagers/exporters to family workshops, forced child labor in schools,
etc. The maker got a crude diagram and boxes of the cheapest available
parts, and assembled the items without oversight or QC.

Bruce Sinclair:
Then your experience differs from mine.

How long did you live/travel in Asia, and where did you live? That
could explain our differing experiences.

Never. It could indeed.