I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)
Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total
Maximum Power: 40W
Supercharge: maximum
Universal: 5V@1A maximum

Description:
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO
http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol.../6000193376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,
nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

"Danny D." writes:
I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.


Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm


Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

http://www.extremetech.com/computing...our-smartphone


Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

Ask the manufacturer.

Scott Lurndal wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:38:04 +0000:

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

Here is a better (bigger) picture of the unit:
https://i.imgur.com/8bl7ypU.jpg
And a better (bigger) picture of the package:
https://i.imgur.com/30qxupn.jpg

I thank you for the reference, but, after reading it, I don't
see how that article helps explain the *output* wattage
descrepancy between 6.8A x 5VDC and the stated output spec
of 40Watts.

That article explains how to convert Volt-Amps to Watts.
"How to convert VA to Watts and KVA to Kilowatts"
http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

The input voltage is AC so roughly the input wattage is:
110VAC RMS times 800mA (max) which is roughly 88VA

But it's the OUTPUT wattage that is stated to be 40Watts.
6.8Amps x 5.0VDC is only 34 Watts

Hence, a rather large 15% descrepancy (6 watts less than
40 watts).

I'm sure my math on the output wattage is wrong because
the package can't be wrong (that would be illegal), so,
I don't see where my math went wrong yet though.

So, any advice is welcome and I will check it out.

On 30/11/2015 17:55, Danny D. wrote:
Scott Lurndal wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:38:04 +0000:

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

Here is a better (bigger) picture of the unit:
https://i.imgur.com/8bl7ypU.jpg
And a better (bigger) picture of the package:
https://i.imgur.com/30qxupn.jpg

I thank you for the reference, but, after reading it, I don't
see how that article helps explain the *output* wattage
descrepancy between 6.8A x 5VDC and the stated output spec
of 40Watts.

That article explains how to convert Volt-Amps to Watts.
"How to convert VA to Watts and KVA to Kilowatts"
http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

The input voltage is AC so roughly the input wattage is:
110VAC RMS times 800mA (max) which is roughly 88VA

But it's the OUTPUT wattage that is stated to be 40Watts.
6.8Amps x 5.0VDC is only 34 Watts

No, I don't think it necessarily is, it just rather vaguely says
"Maximum power: 40W" on a separate line without any real clue as to what
it refers to.


Hence, a rather large 15% descrepancy (6 watts less than
40 watts).

I'm sure my math on the output wattage is wrong because
the package can't be wrong (that would be illegal), so,

In my experience many Chinese manufacturers wouldn't care about the
legality of giving a slightly wrong number. Many lie outright about
meeting safety standards.


I don't see where my math went wrong yet though.

So, any advice is welcome and I will check it out.


--

Brian Gregory (in the UK).
To email me please remove all the letter vee from my email address.

On Fri, 5 Feb 2016 01:39:54 +0000, Brian Gregory
wrote:

On 30/11/2015 17:55, Danny D. wrote:
Scott Lurndal wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:38:04 +0000:

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

Here is a better (bigger) picture of the unit:
https://i.imgur.com/8bl7ypU.jpg
And a better (bigger) picture of the package:
https://i.imgur.com/30qxupn.jpg

I thank you for the reference, but, after reading it, I don't
see how that article helps explain the *output* wattage
descrepancy between 6.8A x 5VDC and the stated output spec
of 40Watts.

That article explains how to convert Volt-Amps to Watts.
"How to convert VA to Watts and KVA to Kilowatts"
http://www.powerstream.com/VA-Watts.htm

The input voltage is AC so roughly the input wattage is:
110VAC RMS times 800mA (max) which is roughly 88VA

But it's the OUTPUT wattage that is stated to be 40Watts.
6.8Amps x 5.0VDC is only 34 Watts

No, I don't think it necessarily is, it just rather vaguely says
"Maximum power: 40W" on a separate line without any real clue as to what
it refers to.


Hence, a rather large 15% descrepancy (6 watts less than
40 watts).

I'm sure my math on the output wattage is wrong because
the package can't be wrong (that would be illegal), so,

In my experience many Chinese manufacturers wouldn't care about the
legality of giving a slightly wrong number. Many lie outright about
meeting safety standards.


I don't see where my math went wrong yet though.

So, any advice is welcome and I will check it out.

It's what you call (in)efficiency.

Scott Lurndal wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:38:04 +0000:

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

http://www.extremetech.com/computing...our-smartphone

Thanks for that article, titled:
How USB charging works, or how to avoid blowing up your smartphone

The article explained that USB 3.0 "cables" have 9 wires but when I
looked at the 6.8Amp charger, each USB slot seems to have only 4
gold pins on the white protruding tab. I presume the surrounding
metal is ground, so, that makes 5 electrical connections that I can
see in each USB slot of the 6.8Amp/40Watt "Smart" wall charger.

The article says there are three types of USB 3.0 ports:
1. Standard downstream port (900mA at 5VDC = 4.5Watts)
2. Charging downstream port (1.5A at 5VDC = 7.5Watts)
3. Dedicated charging port (1.5A at 5VDC = 7.5Watts)

The article did say "A regular USB 1.0 or 2.0 socket has four pins",
so, I wonder if they counted the ground shield because the sockets
on mine only have 4 gold strips on the white protruding tab, so,
I'm not sure which USB spec my sockets are.

While this is interesting, after reading that article, I didn't see
anything in there that explained the problem nor how to troubleshoot
it.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


The article explained that USB 3.0 "cables" have 9 wires but when I
looked at the 6.8Amp charger, each USB slot seems to have only 4
gold pins on the white protruding tab. I presume the surrounding
metal is ground, so, that makes 5 electrical connections that I can
see in each USB slot of the 6.8Amp/40Watt "Smart" wall charger.

charging only requires two wires, plus two to negotiate the power.

usb 3 makes *no* difference for a charger.

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 13:42:42 -0500:

charging only requires two wires, plus two to negotiate the power.

usb 3 makes *no* difference for a charger.

Thanks.

That explains why each USB socket only has four gold pins on the
white protruding tab.

I did call the company in Edison NJ at 718-499-1000, and, after going
through their operator, I spoke with "Bob", a salesman at the office.

I told him, nicely, that it must be true, otherwise it would
seem to me to be illegal to over represent the output power by 15%.

He didn't know the answer to why it says it outputs 40Watts but at
the same time it says the maximum is 6.8Amps at 5VDC, but Bob said
he'd try to find out and for me to call him back tomorrow.

Danny D. wrote:
nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 13:42:42 -0500:

charging only requires two wires, plus two to negotiate the power.

usb 3 makes *no* difference for a charger.

Thanks.

That explains why each USB socket only has four gold pins on the
white protruding tab.

I did call the company in Edison NJ at 718-499-1000, and, after going
through their operator, I spoke with "Bob", a salesman at the office.

I told him, nicely, that it must be true, otherwise it would
seem to me to be illegal to over represent the output power by 15%.

He didn't know the answer to why it says it outputs 40Watts but at
the same time it says the maximum is 6.8Amps at 5VDC, but Bob said
he'd try to find out and for me to call him back tomorrow.

It looks to me like it says "maximum power" 40 w. It doess not say that is
output power.

Scott Lurndal wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:38:04 +0000:

Ask the manufacturer.

Here are some more specs:
https://www.touchofmodern.com/sales/.../smart-adapter

The manufacturer is listed as "DLG Group LTD" on the package:
https://i.imgur.com/30qxupn.jpg

And, as "Hype Volt" on the device:
https://i.imgur.com/8bl7ypU.jpg

Looking for a phone number, I find this description which says
they're based out of "Edision, New Jersey" (with the USPTO
giving the HYPE VOLT trademark serial number of 86138884
which was subsequently "abandoned"):
http://www.trademarkia.com/hype-volt-86138884.html

The contact was provided as:
URI DALLAL
PO BOX 340256
BROOKLYN, NY 11234-0256

Googling further, the DGL Group seems to be located he
http://listings.findthecompany.com/l...d-in-Edison-NJ
195 Raritan Center Pkwy
Edison, New Jersey 08837-3650
(718) 499-1000
http://www.dglusa.com

Another phone number was listed he
https://start.cortera.com/company/re...l5p/dgl-group/
195 RARITAN CENTER PKWY
EDISON, NJ 08837-3650 | view map
(732) 692-5000
www.dglusa.com

Another site gives similar information:
http://www.yellowpages.com/edison-nj...roup-468058349
195 Raritan Center Pkwy, Edison, NJ 08837
(732) 379-6000
Primary Phone: (732) 225-1251
Phone: (732) 225-1251

This gives another number:
https://www.dandb.com/businessdirect...-14169289.html
195 RARITAN CENTER PKWY EDISON, NJ 08837 Get Directions
(718) 499-1000, www.dglusa.com

I'm calling them, as we speak.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:

I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

probably not.

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)
Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total
Maximum Power: 40W
Supercharge: maximum
Universal: 5V@1A maximum

Description:

http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A...ter/dp/B00T3FQ
BHO

http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol...b-ports/600019
3376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,

from what you've said, it doesn't work.

nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

probably what it consumes, not what it outputs.

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

usb devices initially get 100ma and then request how much power they
really want. the charger responds with how much it can supply.

some non-compliant devices ignore the negotiation phase and either
output whatever power is needed and/or the device uses whatever is
available. that's probably the case here. however, that alone is not a
problem.

an easy way to think about this is a lightbulb. if you screw in a 15w
bulb, it will use 15w. if you screw in a 60w bulb, it will use 60w.
with a 200w bulb, it will use 200w. nothing about the light socket or
the house wiring has changed. it uses what it needs. a 15w bulb won't
be overloaded because the socket *can* supply more power.

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

a properly designed charger won't because it can't. it tells the device
"all you're getting is 1a" and the device says "ok".

a ****ty charger might, which can cause it to overheat.

Don't believe anything this ignorant and/or lying troll says...

--
nospam nospam nospam.invalid wrote in news:301120151245250051%nospam nospam.invalid:

Path: eternal-september.org!mx02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nospam nospam nospam.invalid
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.home.repa ir
Subject: Advice sought on why 6.8A USB charger melted USB cable today
Date: Mon, 30 Nov 2015 12:45:25 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 90
Message-ID: 301120151245250051%nospam nospam.invalid
References: n3hval$3af$1 dont-email.me
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Xref: mx02.eternal-september.org comp.mobile.android:24384 comp.mobile.ipad:64215 alt.home.repair:448557

In article n3hval$3af$1 dont-email.me, Danny D.
dannydiamico gmail.com wrote:

I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

probably not.

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)
Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total
Maximum Power: 40W
Supercharge: 5V 2.4A maximum
Universal: 5V 1A maximum

Description:

http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A...ter/dp/B00T3FQ
BHO

http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol...b-ports/600019
3376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,

from what you've said, it doesn't work.

nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

probably what it consumes, not what it outputs.

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

usb devices initially get 100ma and then request how much power they
really want. the charger responds with how much it can supply.

some non-compliant devices ignore the negotiation phase and either
output whatever power is needed and/or the device uses whatever is
available. that's probably the case here. however, that alone is not a
problem.

an easy way to think about this is a lightbulb. if you screw in a 15w
bulb, it will use 15w. if you screw in a 60w bulb, it will use 60w.
with a 200w bulb, it will use 200w. nothing about the light socket or
the house wiring has changed. it uses what it needs. a 15w bulb won't
be overloaded because the socket *can* supply more power.

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

a properly designed charger won't because it can't. it tells the device
"all you're getting is 1a" and the device says "ok".

a ****ty charger might, which can cause it to overheat.

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 12:45:25 -0500:

was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

How would I know by looking at it?

Here is a closeup picture of it:
https://i.imgur.com/Dy37Ek8.jpg

It has a USB symbol and that's about it for markings.

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

How would I know by looking at it?

where did you get it and how much did you pay?

if it's from apple, it's obviously mfi-compliant.

if it's a third party cable, it might be compliant. some are and some
aren't. generally, cheaper cables are not compliant. really cheap
cables are almost certainly not compliant.

the cable itself might not say but the packaging will. companies like
to brag that it's compliant.

non-compliant cables don't always melt. it simply means it doesn't meet
apple's standards of quality and construction and may not work
properly, notably with syncing (charging usually works but not always).

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 14:27:08 -0500:

How would I know by looking at it?
where did you get it and how much did you pay?

I have about a dozen of lightning cables so I don't really know,
as I don't save the packages.

But I think this one may have come from Office Depot as it
was about $10 and it's slightly more than 3 feet long.

Googling, I find this description:
http://www.officedepot.com/a/product...20-ChargeSync/

In article , Danny D.
wrote:

How would I know by looking at it?
where did you get it and how much did you pay?

I have about a dozen of lightning cables so I don't really know,
as I don't save the packages.

But I think this one may have come from Office Depot as it
was about $10 and it's slightly more than 3 feet long.

Googling, I find this description:
http://www.officedepot.com/a/product...20-ChargeSync/


here's the manufacturer's page:
https://www.visiontek.com/cables-acc...ontek-lightnin
g-to-usb-3-0-2-0-charge-sync-cable-detail.html

the fact that it says 'full compatibility with ios 7' rather than
saying it's 'mfi certified' which would guarantee compatibility no
matter what suggests that it's *not* mfi certified.

a cable that's mfi certified would say so, as it's a competitive
advantage over generic cables:
http://www.ianker.com/product/A7114011

apple has this to say about how to check the cables:
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204566

On 2015-11-30 18:48:43 +0000, "Danny D." said:

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 12:45:25 -0500:

was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

How would I know by looking at it?

Here is a closeup picture of it:
https://i.imgur.com/Dy37Ek8.jpg

It has a USB symbol and that's about it for markings.

Damn! Did you wear out your "Paul M. Cook" sock already?

At least you could have come up with something new and different rather
than one of your earlier well worn nyms.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2015-12-01, Savageduck wrote:
On 2015-11-30 18:48:43 +0000, "Danny D." said:

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 12:45:25 -0500:

was it an mfi-compliant cable or a noname one?

How would I know by looking at it?

Here is a closeup picture of it:
https://i.imgur.com/Dy37Ek8.jpg

It has a USB symbol and that's about it for markings.

Damn! Did you wear out your "Paul M. Cook" sock already?

At least you could have come up with something new and different rather
than one of your earlier well worn nyms.

He will, in time...

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

nospam wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 12:45:25 -0500:

probably what it consumes, not what it outputs.

It can't be the input because 100-220VAC times the maximum stated
800mA input current is 80 Watts (give or take) input, which would
be about right assuming 50% efficiency.

usb devices initially get 100ma and then request how much power they
really want. the charger responds with how much it can supply.

That is interesting. So, when I plugged in the iPad, it "asked" for
100mA, and then it asked for more, so the charger gave it more?

But, then, why did the cord melt?

some non-compliant devices ignore the negotiation phase and either
output whatever power is needed and/or the device uses whatever is
available. that's probably the case here. however, that alone is not a
problem.

I understand that a current "source", which is the charger, is just a
source of current (sort of like being a big tank of water); it's not
going to "push" that current into the current "sink", which is the
iPad at any rate more than what the iPad "asks" for.

So, I'm assuming that the cable is bad (maybe pins are shorted, for
example, between power and ground).

But that still doesn't explain why the device says it's both 40Watts
output and that its maximum output is 6.8Amps at 5VDC.

That's not even close to 40 Watts (it's 15% off).

In article , Danny D.
wrote:


probably what it consumes, not what it outputs.

It can't be the input because 100-220VAC times the maximum stated
800mA input current is 80 Watts (give or take) input, which would
be about right assuming 50% efficiency.

true.

note that the charger itself doesn't say 40w
https://i.imgur.com/8bl7ypU.jpg

usb devices initially get 100ma and then request how much power they
really want. the charger responds with how much it can supply.

That is interesting. So, when I plugged in the iPad, it "asked" for
100mA, and then it asked for more, so the charger gave it more?

100ma is guaranteed without doing anything.

if a device needs more (many do), they need to request more power, and
must do so using less than 100ma.

standard usb ports should be able to provide 500ma. a bus-powered hub,
such as a keyboard, can't supply 500ma to downstream devices (it could
only supply 500-whatever it takes) so it will decline any request,
which is what causes the 'this device uses too much power' warnings.

recent usb ports can source more current because of usb hard drives
that need 500ma to spin up the drive as well as phones and tablets
that want more to charge faster.

But, then, why did the cord melt?

it's hard to say without looking at it.

one possibility is a defective cord but there could be other reasons.

if you have a continuity tester, try checking the cable for shorts.

On 11/30/2015 2:00 PM, Danny D. wrote:
It can't be the input because 100-220VAC times the maximum stated
800mA input current is 80 Watts (give or take) input, which would
be about right assuming 50% efficiency.

AC watts calculation adds a Power Factor of less than one W = PF x V x A

Your cable probably had some of its twisted wire strands broken causing
the excess heat generation.

Zaidy036 wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 16:30:59 -0500:

AC watts calculation adds a Power Factor of less than one W = PF x V x A

That power factor is only for peak to peak voltage, isn't it?
Do they use the power factor for RMS voltage?

Danny D. wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 21:37:43 +0000:

That power factor is only for peak to peak voltage, isn't it?
Do they use the power factor for RMS voltage?

I just read up on the power factor and I don't think it applies he
http://electronicdesign.com/energy/w...d-volt-amperes

On Mon, 30 Nov 2015 19:00:30 -0000 (UTC), Danny D. wrote:

That's not even close to 40 Watts (it's 15% off).

In electronics, +/-15% isn't too far off :-) . Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

tlvp wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 05:32:44 -0500:

In electronics, +/-15% isn't too far off . Cheers, -- tlvp

It depends.
In this case, you compare the exact same model number to
a part that says it's 35 watts and another that says it's
40 watts.

Given they sell for about the same price, which would you
choose if you did not know that the 40Watts was a lie?

On Tue, 1 Dec 2015 20:42:21 -0000 (UTC), Danny D. wrote:

tlvp wrote, on Tue, 01 Dec 2015 05:32:44 -0500:

In electronics, +/-15% isn't too far off . Cheers, -- tlvp

It depends.

Bought any resistors or capacitors lately? Resistors are commonly sold with
nominal values +/- 20%; capacitors, with +100/-50%. +/-15% may not be high
precision, but it's better than common precision :-) .

And anyway, 35 isn't a whole 15% less than 40, it's only 12.5% less, if
we're going to try for highest arithmetic precision here :-) . No big deal.

Cheers, -- tlvp
--
Avant de repondre, jeter la poubelle, SVP.

On 11/30/2015 10:00 AM, Danny D. wrote:
I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)

The device can be powered by 110V at 60Hz (US market) *or*
220V at 50Hz (european). Internally, the device can be thought of
as "autosensing" the input and adjusting, accordingly. (in practice,
there's no real "sensing" involved; it will also work at 190V/53Hz
as well as a multitude of other combinations! Possibly even DC!)

In those conditions, it will not draw more than 800mA.

Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total

The output will be 5V (nominally... it may actually be 5.1V, etc.)
The TOTAL current available is 6.8A. Think of current as water
flowing through a pipe -- at a particular RATE (amps). This
says that the "pipe" can supply water (current) at a rate of 6.8A.

Maximum Power: 40W

The power supply/charger will consume a maximum of 40W. As it
will only DELIVER 34W (6.8A x 5V) to your "loads", this suggests
the device is ~75% efficient (34/40). The extra "power" drawn from
the AC mains is lost -- as heat.

Supercharge: maximum

Each connector in "supercharge mode" can deliver 2.4A at the stated 5V.

Universal: 5V@1A maximum

This is what a "regular" USB connector delivers

Description:
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO
http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol.../6000193376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,
nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

That would depend on what's inside the tablet. The short answer is:
there was a potential (voltage) drop across the cable (i.e., from the
charger end to the tablet end) *and* current flowing through the
cable. The drop at that current rate expresses a power (heat) that
is dissipated *in* the cable.

Hook a *stiff* car battery charger to a *good* battery (in techno-speak,
both devices want to have low apparent impedances... not easily "pulled"
from their desired state). Charger puts out X volts. Battery is *at*
Y volts. X Y causes current to flow TOWARDS the battery; Y X causes
current to flow FROM the battery.

But, neither the battery nor the charger are "moving" -- so, the difference
(X-Y) is appearing across the length of the wire connecting them. I.e.,
the *wire* is handling the mismatch -- by getting hot! :

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

See above. You consume foodstuffs every day. If you don't gain
weight, AND, don't sh*t, you are 100% efficient in your utilization
of those calories (hand-waving as not everything you "take in"
CAN be "burned").

The 40W is what you are consuming; what the electric company is billing
you for [sic]. The 34W is what you are actually able to *use* (in
your tablet, etc.) from that. An "ideal" device would consume
exactly as much as your tablet requires -- no "insertion/conversion"
losses.

You'll note that the device gets warmer as your load increases -- cuz
the losses tend to increase (in absolute terms -- power/heat) as your
demand increases.

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

A USB device can "negotiate" it's power requirements. The socket
(charger) can only deliver what it can deliver. A conforming
device will not ask for more than can be delivered.

E.g., I can connect an iPod to a low power USB connector on a
*keyboard* (notoriously low power because THEY use some of the
LIMITED power available to them on *their* USB connection to
the computer!) and access the contents of the iPod as well
as transfer files to/from.

But, I can't *charge* the iPod over that connection -- because
there isn't enough AVAILABLE power to do so (at least, not quickly)

USB ports (on computers) have sensors in them that will sense if
a connected device has drawn more power than it should. In
that case, the USB port will shutdown -- like tripping a circuit
breaker -- until the device is removed. At that point, the
circuit will (should) reset so another PROPERLY BEHAVING device
can be connected -- without having to replace any real fuses
(which was a problem with old PS/2 and XT keyboards) or
having to "reboot".

Not all USB sockets are well behaved -- as loads *or* supplies!
Caveat emptor.

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

On 2015-11-30, Danny D. wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

Jolly Roger wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 20:12:47 +0000:

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

I've always been Danny D.

My Google+ page is
https://plus.google.com/112608173732813956628

My Flickr page is
https://www.flickr.com/photos/982871...th/9329893219/

I have been posting mostly to alt.home.repair for years,
and they all know me as a reliable and detailed poster.

On 2015-11-30 21:05:58 +0000, "Danny D." said:

Jolly Roger wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 20:12:47 +0000:

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

I've always been Danny D.

My Google+ page is
https://plus.google.com/112608173732813956628

My Flickr page is
https://www.flickr.com/photos/982871...th/9329893219/

I have been posting mostly to alt.home.repair for years,
and they all know me as a reliable and detailed poster.

Then you have a PIA, nymshifting doppelgänger who uses a particular
posting style.
Hmmm...

--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 2015-11-30 20:12:47 +0000, Jolly Roger said:

On 2015-11-30, Danny D. wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

Aah! You also noticed that.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

Off-topic troll...

--
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On 2015-11-30 20:12:47 +0000, Jolly Roger jollyroger pobox.com said:

On 2015-11-30, Danny D. dannydiamico gmail.com wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

Aah! You also noticed that.

--
Regards,

Savageduck

On 12/2/2015 4:37 AM, John Doe wrote:
Off-topic troll...

-- Savageduck savageduck1 {REMOVESPAM}me.com wrote in
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On 2015-11-30 20:12:47 +0000, Jolly Roger jollyroger pobox.com said:

On 2015-11-30, Danny D. dannydiamico gmail.com wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

Aah! You also noticed that.

--
Regards,

Savageduck




Full quoting top poster.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

Off-topic troll...

--
Jolly Roger jollyroger pobox.com wrote in news:dc3otvFfatU1 mid.individual.net:

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From: Jolly Roger jollyroger pobox.com
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android,comp.mobile.ipad,alt.home.repa ir
Subject: Advice sought on why 6.8A USB charger melted USB cable today
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On 2015-11-30, Danny D. dannydiamico gmail.com wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 12/2/2015 4:37 AM, John Doe wrote:
Off-topic troll...

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From: Jolly Roger jollyroger pobox.com
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On 2015-11-30, Danny D. dannydiamico gmail.com wrote:
I would just like some advice

Back to "Danny D." again eh?

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR




Full quoting top poster.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

Danny D. posted for all of us...



I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)
Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total
Maximum Power: 40W
Supercharge: maximum
Universal: 5V@1A maximum

Description:
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO
http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol.../6000193376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,
nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

Call the CPSC and put them on *RED ALERT* for a recall. The problem is that
it is not an Apple product so therefore you are bleeped. Sound the klaxton.

--
Tekkie

On Monday, November 30, 2015 at 3:54:06 PM UTC-5, Tekkie® wrote:
Danny D. posted for all of us...



I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

Here are all the specs off the package and off the device:
DGL Group Ltd. Hype Volt HV-6PT
Model: HC363-5U (also listed as HV-6PT-WHT)
Input: AC 110VAC/60Hz - 220VAC/50Hz (800mA max)
Output: DC 5V, 6.8A total
Maximum Power: 40W
Supercharge: maximum
Universal: 5V@1A maximum

Description:
http://www.amazon.com/Hype-Compact-A.../dp/B00T3FQBHO
http://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hype-vol.../6000193376994

My questions are varied, because I don't understand how it works,
nor how it could have overheated the cable to the tablet.

Here's what it says on the package:
"Smart USB Technology: This adapter automatically adjusts power
output to fit your charging device. Tablets and e-readers require
2 Amp charging, and this adapter will reroute power to the
appropriate USB port you use."

"Charging Combinations:
- 2 tablets + 3 mobile devices
- 1 tablet + 4 mobile devices
- 5 mobile devices
- 3 tablets"

I am confused about both the pure math and how this operates.

Q1: Since 6.8A times 5VDC is only 34Watts (not 40 Watts), how
can they very clearly label it as a 40Watt device?

Q2: How does the device "know" to give tablets 2.4 Amps
(12 Watts) but a "mobile device" only 1Amp (5 Watts).

Q3: What if a mobile device "wants" more than 1 amp?
Does the charger give more than 1A to the device?

Call the CPSC and put them on *RED ALERT* for a recall. The problem is that
it is not an Apple product so therefore you are bleeped. Sound the klaxton.

trader_4 wrote, on Mon, 30 Nov 2015 16:44:45 -0800:

My guess is that part of the answer to this is that this is a cheap,
Chinese no-name product. It probably has all the typical confusing
specs, specs lost in translation, etc. Why it burned up the cable,
who knows. What kind of support is there for this? I'm betting not
much.

Hey Trader,

I know you mean "cheap" as in cheaply made, but, try to find a
USB multi-port charger that isn't made in China.

Besides, it's sold for $60 here, so, that's not cheap (if anyone is
dumb enough to pay that much for it that is):
http://www.amazon.com/Hausbell-35W-H.../dp/B00NUREFMO

On Mon, 30 Nov 2015 17:00:06 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills.

I bought over a half-dozen "Hype Volt" 6.8Amp USB chargers for
stuffing the Christmas stockings:
https://i.imgur.com/Zavgm4B.jpg

I kept one for myself, but, when I used it last night on an iPad
and on an Android phone, the iPad lightning cable melted!

When I pulled it off the iPad, it was noticeably extremely hot,
but it doesn't seem to have damaged the iPad (AFAIK).

So, I'm just wondering what happened, and, more importantly, when
I look at the specs for this device, they don't make sense to me,
so, I have difficulty troubleshooting what the problem is/was.

I dont know why your cable melted, but a neighbor bought one of those
car cigarette lighter adaptors for his hunting cabin, which has no
electricity. He rigged up a cig lighter socket with clips on it, and
brings a charged battery to the cabin, and clips this thing on to it to
charge his cellphone.

One day he connected the clips backwards on the battery and that adaptor
went up in smoke.

I guess I never thought about that, so if someone has a vehicle with
POSITIVE ground, those adaptors would not work!

Danny D:
I would just like some advice since I melted a USB cable today
and I realized I don't have the proper troubleshooting skills...

You don't need to be an engineer, don't need all the technical details
and power formulae. You just need to know that you bought a cheap,
off-brand charger that was made in a country that is infamous for
producing shoddy and dangerous electrical devices--like the surge
protector that I bought that had the hot and ground wires soldered to
the same terminal. Be glad that it melted the the USB connector and
didn't set your house afire and kill your family. And next time, don't
be penny wise and pound foolish; buy the manufacturer's original
charger for each device.

--
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm