http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

On 11/22/2011 6:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...
Not in Oregon!

Paul

On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

That initiative is well under way nationwide.

The states have quietly joined together to create this entity (below),
whose purpose is to create a system to collect sales tax for your
state on all your purchases, no matter whose goods you buy:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/

Here's current legislation:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/i...t01returnid=74

It's coming, folks.

--
Cheers,
James Arthur

On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 21:14:04 -0800 (PST),
wrote Re OT Amazon to begin charging state sales tax:

On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

That initiative is well under way nationwide.

The states have quietly joined together to create this entity (below),
whose purpose is to create a system to collect sales tax for your
state on all your purchases, no matter whose goods you buy:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/

Here's current legislation:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/i...t01returnid=74

It's coming, folks.

Bricks & Mortar retailers are big supporters of that legislation. But
it won't matter. On-line retail merchants will still beat the B&M
sellers in price/selection/convenience.
--
Work is the curse of the drinking class.

On 11/23/2011 03:02 AM, Caesar Romano wrote:
On Tue, 22 Nov 2011 21:14:04 -0800 (PST),
wrote Re OT Amazon to begin charging state sales tax:

On Nov 22, 9:59 pm, John wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

That initiative is well under way nationwide.

The states have quietly joined together to create this entity (below),
whose purpose is to create a system to collect sales tax for your
state on all your purchases, no matter whose goods you buy:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/

Here's current legislation:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/i...t01returnid=74

It's coming, folks.

Bricks& Mortar retailers are big supporters of that legislation. But
it won't matter. On-line retail merchants will still beat the B&M
sellers in price/selection/convenience.

yup... whatever scheme they come up with I'm OK with so long as it's
fair and doesn't put anyone at a disadvantage. The only reason that
there's such a huge issue w/ sales taxes is because the B&M stores are
so incredibly overpriced that people are flocking to online merchants in
droves. Even if you add 5% or whatever to online prices to allow for
sales tax on many items it's still not worth driving to the store. Just
one example would be cables - I just bought a lot of HDMI, optical
S/PDIF, and RCA cables online for about what just three HDMI cables
would cost me in a store - and for the same cost as store prices...
alternately if I were going high end for about the same as what a B&M
store charges for generic stuff I could get the real high end stuff from
Blue Jeans Cable. This isn't a unique example... it's true for a lot of
items.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

wrote:

That initiative is well under way nationwide.

The states have quietly joined together to create this entity (below),
whose purpose is to create a system to collect sales tax for your
state on all your purchases, no matter whose goods you buy:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/

Here's current legislation:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/i...01,detail,0&c=
ntnt01articleid=3D121&cntnt01origid=3D15&cntnt01r eturnid=3D74

It's coming, folks.

**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?


--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 05:52:41 -0600, G. Morgan
wrote:

wrote:

That initiative is well under way nationwide.

The states have quietly joined together to create this entity (below),
whose purpose is to create a system to collect sales tax for your
state on all your purchases, no matter whose goods you buy:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/

Here's current legislation:
http://www.streamlinedsalestax.org/i...01,detail,0&c=
ntnt01articleid=3D121&cntnt01origid=3D15&cntnt01 returnid=3D74

It's coming, folks.

**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?

It'll be easy for the big outfits.
A minor hassle for small-timers.
Some will ignore it.
Some will charge the tax and pocket it, not sending it in.
Some will get caught, some won't.
"Cut-out" services might pop up in no-tax states..
Those will be squashed pretty quick.

When I plug my zip into this I get 9.5%.
http://zip2tax.com/

But I already knew that.
Probably won't make much difference in affecting on-line sales.
Even the tax hit doesn't stop me.
Already pay it with some on-line vendors.

It'll be a minor boon for locales that charge sales taxes.
Then where the local pols are corrupt they'll boost their salaries and
retirement benefits, and the same for public employees.
Cleaner areas will put it to better use.
Otherwise it won't make a hill of beans difference.
Just money being shuffled around like it always is.
Death and taxes.

--Vic

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

You know, "fair" is such a variable word. To liberals, it's
fair when millionaires and billionaires pay 60% income tax
rate, and the poor get tax credits. To a conservative, it's
fair when millionaires pay 15% income tax, billionaires pay
15% income tax, and the poor pays 15% income tax.

So, what's fair for sales tax? In your own words, please.
Lean into the microphone, and speak clearly.....

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Nate Nagel" wrote in message
...


yup... whatever scheme they come up with I'm OK with so long
as it's
fair and doesn't put anyone at a disadvantage. The only
reason that

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

I think the legislators aren't allowed to consider
the cost of implementing. Just to consider the
revenue benfits from the taxes. So, the people
who write the law don't have any concern for
how much it costs private industry to comply
with their new law.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...


I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas.
What a bunch of convoluted nonsense. How
are online stores supposed to keep up with all
that?


--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on
nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill
us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

On 11/22/2011 10:24 PM, Paul Drahn wrote:
On 11/22/2011 6:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...
Not in Oregon!

Paul

Not in NH either!

--
I'm never going to grow up.

Peter wrote:
On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to
keep up with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

It's considerably more complicated than dropping in a sales tax calculator.
First, there are about 11,000 sales tax jurisdictions in the U.S. Second,
the boundaries of these jurisdictions change on an almost daily basis, for
example, when a city with a sales tax enlarges its corporate limits or
changes its tax rate. The "drop-in" software will require periodic updates.
It's not for nothing that tax lawyers are often called "loose-leaf lawyers."
Several hours a week their associates are tasked with updating the tax law
reference books with tax law changes that took place in just the past few
days.

But these confusions pale into insignificance when compared to two other
considerations:

1. What is taxed is highly variable. In New York, magazines are tax exempt
while newspapers are subject to the sales tax. It's the exact reverse in
California (that's why the NY Post has a staple - it's thereby permantly
bound, exempt from the tax, and has a 9% competitive advantage over its
competitors). Just in my state, a single donut is taxable, but six or more
are not! This oddity, alone, could require 11,000 possible taxing flags
(plus quantity modifiers) for each item the company sells. In some places,
prescription drugs are exempt while OTC drugs are taxed. What about an OTC
drug on a prescription? (See the recent changes to Medical Savings Accounts
regarding drug purchases.)

2. The reporting requirements are staggering. Imagine sending several
hundred or thousand reports - and checks - monthly, quarterly, semiannually,
or yearly depending on the reporting requirements of each taxing authority.

It's more than a body can bear!

Brick & Mortar stores have one competitive advantage: the convenience of
immediacy. Just like your neighborhood Stop & Rob, you can get your
merchandise right now. If the B&M stores can't make it with this advantage,
they should hire an 11-year old male as a web master and start selling
online.

Aside: There IS an alternative: Amazon, or whoever, could simply provide a
list of each purchaser's name, address, and amount to each state comptroller
and let the STATE struggle with trying to collect the taxes. If it's too big
a job, or financially imprudent, to do so, what makes anyone think that
putting that burden on hundreds of thousands of merchants is better?

In article , Peter
wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.
This is very similar to a vinter I was talking to. He said there
are counties where UPS refuses to accept wine shipments because a person
on one side of the road may be legal and the other side not.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Interesting thread.

Delaware has no sales tax, although there is a hidden 1% tax on
merchents.
In our shopping center's parking lots, half the cars are from out of
state, mostly MD, PA and NJ residents.

We do have a 4 cent bottle tax to support recycling and, as Stormin
points out, a merchant in letter to paper says it takes him 2-3 hours
per month of his time to comply. You also have to realize that for
every new law, it takes new government workers to enforce it.

In article ,
"HeyBub" wrote:


Aside: There IS an alternative: Amazon, or whoever, could simply provide a
list of each purchaser's name, address, and amount to each state comptroller
and let the STATE struggle with trying to collect the taxes. If it's too big
a job, or financially imprudent, to do so, what makes anyone think that
putting that burden on hundreds of thousands of merchants is better?

This usually the way it is SUPPOSED to be done. In Indiana, for
instance, I am supposed to pay a use tax for things I get out of state
that aren't taxable.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 07:57:41 -0600, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Peter wrote:
On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to
keep up with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

It's considerably more complicated than dropping in a sales tax calculator.
First, there are about 11,000 sales tax jurisdictions in the U.S. Second,
the boundaries of these jurisdictions change on an almost daily basis, for
example, when a city with a sales tax enlarges its corporate limits or
changes its tax rate. The "drop-in" software will require periodic updates.
It's not for nothing that tax lawyers are often called "loose-leaf lawyers."
Several hours a week their associates are tasked with updating the tax law
reference books with tax law changes that took place in just the past few
days.

But these confusions pale into insignificance when compared to two other
considerations:

1. What is taxed is highly variable. In New York, magazines are tax exempt
while newspapers are subject to the sales tax. It's the exact reverse in
California (that's why the NY Post has a staple - it's thereby permantly
bound, exempt from the tax, and has a 9% competitive advantage over its
competitors). Just in my state, a single donut is taxable, but six or more
are not! This oddity, alone, could require 11,000 possible taxing flags
(plus quantity modifiers) for each item the company sells. In some places,
prescription drugs are exempt while OTC drugs are taxed. What about an OTC
drug on a prescription? (See the recent changes to Medical Savings Accounts
regarding drug purchases.)

2. The reporting requirements are staggering. Imagine sending several
hundred or thousand reports - and checks - monthly, quarterly, semiannually,
or yearly depending on the reporting requirements of each taxing authority.

It's more than a body can bear!

Brick & Mortar stores have one competitive advantage: the convenience of
immediacy. Just like your neighborhood Stop & Rob, you can get your
merchandise right now. If the B&M stores can't make it with this advantage,
they should hire an 11-year old male as a web master and start selling
online.

Aside: There IS an alternative: Amazon, or whoever, could simply provide a
list of each purchaser's name, address, and amount to each state comptroller
and let the STATE struggle with trying to collect the taxes. If it's too big
a job, or financially imprudent, to do so, what makes anyone think that
putting that burden on hundreds of thousands of merchants is better?


All of this is extremely simple on the software/comm side.
Already being done.
Ever think about the mechanics of walking a step?
You can write a thousand pages to make that look complicated too.
And it is. Sales tax is trivial in comparison.
Of course taxes are man-made.

--Vic

On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

George H.

On 11/23/2011 9:00 AM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.

But surely the additional local sales taxes aren't just arbitrary and
are defined with geographic boundaries? In my state the sales tax is 6%
with the counties of Allegheny and Philadelphia adding an additional 1%.


This is very similar to a vinter I was talking to. He said there
are counties where UPS refuses to accept wine shipments because a person
on one side of the road may be legal and the other side not.

On 11/23/2011 9:34 AM, George Herold wrote:
On Nov 22, 9:59 pm, John wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

George H.

PA has had the same self reporting requirement for as long as I can
remember.

On Nov 23, 9:34*am, George Herold wrote:
On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

George H.

PA sends revenue agents into DE and MD to stake out liquor stores for
PA buyers returning to PA.
While back, I recall liquor store owners in MD chasing them out of
their parking lots.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 06:46:23 -0800 (PST), Frank wrote:

On Nov 23, 9:34*am, George Herold wrote:
On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

I believe most states have this in their income tax forms. It doesn't cost
anything to put it there but likely gets just about as much in return. Have
you ever put anything there?

PA sends revenue agents into DE and MD to stake out liquor stores for
PA buyers returning to PA.

NY did that 20-30 years ago. They'd send agents to the malls in NJ, about
this time of year, and send "kindly" reminders to everyone with NY plates
parking there. I doubt that it generated any revenue but it did generate a lot
of bad press (can you say Scrooge?).

While back, I recall liquor store owners in MD chasing them out of
their parking lots.

The "Staties" should escort them to the border with a suggestion that they not
return.

On 11/23/2011 9:00 AM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.
This is very similar to a vinter I was talking to. He said there
are counties where UPS refuses to accept wine shipments because a person
on one side of the road may be legal and the other side not.


I'm amazed that so many technically sophisticated posters consider the
issue of automated software managing the sales tax calculation for
on-line business to be unworkable. We probably all have been exposed to
essentially real time updating of huge relational databases. We're not
computing in the 1980s folks. Look how long it takes google to
accomplish a search with their custom algorithms, even for arcane
keywords. I think you over-estimate the difficulty. I suspect some
company, maybe even a start-up, could make a bundle by developing the
software accompanied by a user subscription charge for ongoing
auto-updates of the database (analogous to the auto-updates of the
signature files for our anti-virus programs).

On 11/23/2011 8:14 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
You know, "fair" is such a variable word. To liberals, it's
fair when millionaires and billionaires pay 60% income tax
rate, and the poor get tax credits. To a conservative, it's
fair when millionaires pay 15% income tax, billionaires pay
15% income tax, and the poor pays 15% income tax.

So, what's fair for sales tax? In your own words, please.
Lean into the microphone, and speak clearly.....


Paying it when it is legally due.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 08:12:09 -0500, Peter wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

Zip codes don't follow municipal lines (tax rates). I know it's used, but
they're often wrong.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 08:25:11 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 07:57:41 -0600, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Peter wrote:
On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to
keep up with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

It's considerably more complicated than dropping in a sales tax calculator.
First, there are about 11,000 sales tax jurisdictions in the U.S. Second,
the boundaries of these jurisdictions change on an almost daily basis, for
example, when a city with a sales tax enlarges its corporate limits or
changes its tax rate. The "drop-in" software will require periodic updates.
It's not for nothing that tax lawyers are often called "loose-leaf lawyers."
Several hours a week their associates are tasked with updating the tax law
reference books with tax law changes that took place in just the past few
days.

But these confusions pale into insignificance when compared to two other
considerations:

1. What is taxed is highly variable. In New York, magazines are tax exempt
while newspapers are subject to the sales tax. It's the exact reverse in
California (that's why the NY Post has a staple - it's thereby permantly
bound, exempt from the tax, and has a 9% competitive advantage over its
competitors). Just in my state, a single donut is taxable, but six or more
are not! This oddity, alone, could require 11,000 possible taxing flags
(plus quantity modifiers) for each item the company sells. In some places,
prescription drugs are exempt while OTC drugs are taxed. What about an OTC
drug on a prescription? (See the recent changes to Medical Savings Accounts
regarding drug purchases.)

2. The reporting requirements are staggering. Imagine sending several
hundred or thousand reports - and checks - monthly, quarterly, semiannually,
or yearly depending on the reporting requirements of each taxing authority.

It's more than a body can bear!

Brick & Mortar stores have one competitive advantage: the convenience of
immediacy. Just like your neighborhood Stop & Rob, you can get your
merchandise right now. If the B&M stores can't make it with this advantage,
they should hire an 11-year old male as a web master and start selling
online.

Aside: There IS an alternative: Amazon, or whoever, could simply provide a
list of each purchaser's name, address, and amount to each state comptroller
and let the STATE struggle with trying to collect the taxes. If it's too big
a job, or financially imprudent, to do so, what makes anyone think that
putting that burden on hundreds of thousands of merchants is better?


All of this is extremely simple on the software/comm side.
Already being done.

Huh? If this is so easy, why do I always get directed to web pages for a city
fifty miles from here?

Ever think about the mechanics of walking a step?
You can write a thousand pages to make that look complicated too.
And it is. Sales tax is trivial in comparison.

Bull****.

Of course taxes are man-made.

....and made as complicated as man can.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 09:41:39 -0500, George wrote:

On 11/23/2011 9:00 AM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.

But surely the additional local sales taxes aren't just arbitrary and
are defined with geographic boundaries? In my state the sales tax is 6%
with the counties of Allegheny and Philadelphia adding an additional 1%.

A friend lived in one town but had an address for the city next to it. I
lived a couple of blocks closer to the city (same subdivision) but had a town
address. The tax rates were substantially different. How does your simple
model handle this?

This is very similar to a vinter I was talking to. He said there
are counties where UPS refuses to accept wine shipments because a person
on one side of the road may be legal and the other side not.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 08:16:33 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I think the legislators aren't allowed to consider
the cost of implementing. Just to consider the
revenue benfits from the taxes. So, the people
who write the law don't have any concern for
how much it costs private industry to comply
with their new law.

No, it's really simpler than that. If they don't see it, it doesn't exist.
IOW, legislators are stupid, but you knew that.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 10:40:16 -0500, Peter wrote:

On 11/23/2011 9:00 AM, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In ,
wrote:

On 11/23/2011 6:52 AM, G. Morgan wrote:


**** 'em. I'm in Texas and will only collect tax for Texas. What a
bunch of convoluted nonsense. How are online stores supposed to keep up
with all that?



It's called software. It will be automatic, similar to the way the
on-line web sites calculate shipping costs based on destination zip
code, package weight, and choice of shipping method.

But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.
This is very similar to a vinter I was talking to. He said there
are counties where UPS refuses to accept wine shipments because a person
on one side of the road may be legal and the other side not.


I'm amazed that so many technically sophisticated posters consider the
issue of automated software managing the sales tax calculation for
on-line business to be unworkable.

No one has ever figured out how to do it, so it does seem to be unworkable.

We probably all have been exposed to
essentially real time updating of huge relational databases. We're not
computing in the 1980s folks.

There were "huge relational databases" in the 1980s, kid.

Look how long it takes google to
accomplish a search with their custom algorithms, even for arcane
keywords.

....and that's relevant, how?

I think you over-estimate the difficulty.

I *know* you underestimate the problem, as do most kids.

I suspect some
company, maybe even a start-up, could make a bundle by developing the
software accompanied by a user subscription charge for ongoing
auto-updates of the database (analogous to the auto-updates of the
signature files for our anti-virus programs).

....and that's free (if it were possible)?

On 11/23/11 09:34 am, George Herold wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

In MI, one is required to report out-of-state purchases in excess of
$1000 (per item). Purchases for lesser amounts may either be itemized if
one has the receipts or else assessed automatically on the basis of the
taxable income (I *think* that's the basis). But one is supposed to pay
only the difference between the sales tax actually paid elsewhere (if
any) and the MI tax. So we don't pay MI "use tax" on the items that we
bought in IL where the tax rate is 8.xx (varies from county to county).

Perce

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 11:32:28 -0500, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:

On 11/23/11 09:34 am, George Herold wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

In MI, one is required to report out-of-state purchases in excess of
$1000 (per item). Purchases for lesser amounts may either be itemized if
one has the receipts or else assessed automatically on the basis of the
taxable income (I *think* that's the basis). But one is supposed to pay
only the difference between the sales tax actually paid elsewhere (if
any) and the MI tax. So we don't pay MI "use tax" on the items that we
bought in IL where the tax rate is 8.xx (varies from county to county).

Perce

These states are missing an opportunity to charge double sales tax.
What *were* they thinking?

John

On Nov 23, 10:28*am, "
wrote:
On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 06:46:23 -0800 (PST), Frank wrote:
On Nov 23, 9:34*am, George Herold wrote:
On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

I believe most states have this in their income tax forms. *It doesn't cost
anything to put it there but likely gets just about as much in return. *Have
you ever put anything there?

Yup, I always put down a little something ~$10-20. All internet
purchases, but less in recent years since I've just been checking the
box on the order form to have the vendor pay my sales tax.
(But remember I'm a liberal weenie, I also pay ~$100 a year extra to
get all my electricity from the local wind farm.)

George H.


PA sends revenue agents into DE and MD to stake out liquor stores for
PA buyers returning to PA.

NY did that 20-30 years ago. *They'd send agents to the malls in NJ, about
this time of year, and send "kindly" reminders to everyone with NY plates
parking there. I doubt that it generated any revenue but it did generate a lot
of bad press (can you say Scrooge?).

While back, I recall liquor store owners in MD chasing them out of
their parking lots.

The "Staties" should escort them to the border with a suggestion that they not
return.

John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Years ago, the US Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional for
states to collect sales tax on out of state sales. I wonder what has
changed?

Sales tax is complicated in that different places (states, counties,
cities, etc.) have different rates and different definitions of what can
be taxed. I know in Ohio, there is a use tax, identical to the sales
tax, that people have to pay themselves when they buy something out of
state, but because of complexity and ignorance, I think few people pay
it. The states lose a ton of revenue because they can't effectively
collect the sales or use tax on out of state purchases. It would
certainly be fairer to all to have the same tax for in-state and out of
state purchases.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 08:59:55 -0800 (PST), George Herold
wrote:

On Nov 23, 10:28*am, "
wrote:
On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 06:46:23 -0800 (PST), Frank wrote:
On Nov 23, 9:34*am, George Herold wrote:
On Nov 22, 9:59*pm, John Doe wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

I believe most states have this in their income tax forms. *It doesn't cost
anything to put it there but likely gets just about as much in return. *Have
you ever put anything there?

Yup, I always put down a little something ~$10-20. All internet
purchases, but less in recent years since I've just been checking the
box on the order form to have the vendor pay my sales tax.
(But remember I'm a liberal weenie, I also pay ~$100 a year extra to
get all my electricity from the local wind farm.)

I guess you make perfect sense. ...to someone.

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 08:41:14 -0800, John Larkin
wrote:

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 11:32:28 -0500, "Percival P. Cassidy"
wrote:

On 11/23/11 09:34 am, George Herold wrote:

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Hmm, here in 'tax-happy' New York State there is a line on the state
tax return where you are 'required' to add in all the state tax that
you did not
pay on 'out of state' purchases.

In MI, one is required to report out-of-state purchases in excess of
$1000 (per item). Purchases for lesser amounts may either be itemized if
one has the receipts or else assessed automatically on the basis of the
taxable income (I *think* that's the basis). But one is supposed to pay
only the difference between the sales tax actually paid elsewhere (if
any) and the MI tax. So we don't pay MI "use tax" on the items that we
bought in IL where the tax rate is 8.xx (varies from county to county).

Perce

These states are missing an opportunity to charge double sales tax.
What *were* they thinking?

SCotUS had something to say about that. They also tried taxing retirement
income in the state where the income was earned. SCotUS took a dim view on
that one, too.

Notat Home wrote:

John Doe wrote:
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/InternetSalesTa

They are "not raising taxes" they are "just helping to collect
taxes". There is a big difference...

Years ago, the US Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional for
states to collect sales tax on out of state sales. I wonder what has
changed?

Sales tax is complicated in that different places (states, counties,
cities, etc.) have different rates and different definitions of what can
be taxed. I know in Ohio, there is a use tax, identical to the sales
tax, that people have to pay themselves when they buy something out of
state, but because of complexity and ignorance, I think few people pay
it. The states lose a ton of revenue because they can't effectively
collect the sales or use tax on out of state purchases. It would
certainly be fairer to all to have the same tax for in-state and out of
state purchases.


The 'Use tax' was first used for businesses to pay taxes on items
they used for their operation, in place of sales tax. I used to collect
sales tax, and pay use tax for my electronics business.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

On 11/23/2011 12:11 PM, Notat Home wrote:
ifference...

Years ago, the US Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional for
states to collect sales tax on out of state sales. I wonder what has
changed?


What has changed is your understanding of sales tax, the law, and the
ruling by the courts.


--
I'm never going to grow up.

On Nov 23, 9:21*am, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,

*"HeyBub" wrote:

Aside: There IS an alternative: Amazon, or whoever, could simply provide a
list of each purchaser's name, address, and amount to each state comptroller
and let the STATE struggle with trying to collect the taxes. If it's too big
a job, or financially imprudent, to do so, what makes anyone think that
putting that burden on hundreds of thousands of merchants is better?

This usually the way it is SUPPOSED to be done. In Indiana, for
instance, I am supposed to pay a use tax for things I get out of state
that aren't taxable.


Same in NYS.

When I helped my daughter with her 2010 taxes, TaxAct estimated her
"NYS Use Tax" at $8 based on her earned income. (I think that might be
the minimum.)

She's a college student with a part time job and she does indeed buy
most of her stuff on-line, so we opted to leave the $8 tax on her
form.

Soon after we e-filed it, we got a notification that the state had
"fixed an error" on her form. They removed the $8 tax and increased
her refund by that amount.

Who were we to argue?

"PeterD" wrote in message ...

On 11/23/2011 12:11 PM, Notat Home wrote:
ifference...

Years ago, the US Supreme Court ruled that it was unconstitutional for
states to collect sales tax on out of state sales. I wonder what has
changed?


What has changed is your understanding of sales tax, the law, and the
ruling by the courts.

The Supreme Court did NOT rule it unconstitutional for states to collect
sales taxes on sales made from out-of-state vendors. What the Court did
(Quill v. North Dakota, 1992) was to prevent states from collecting from the
*vendor*. They can still collect from the buyer -- or they can try, which
doesn't work very well. g

--
Ed Huntress

PeterD peter2 hipson.net wrote:

Notat Home wrote:

Years ago, the US Supreme Court ruled that it was
unconstitutional for states to collect sales tax on out of
state sales. I wonder what has changed?


What has changed is your understanding of sales tax, the law,
and the ruling by the courts.

And WTF is that supposed to mean?

I'm never going to grow up.

Please grow up at least enough to post coherently.
--















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Subject: OT Amazon to begin charging state sales tax
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In article , George
wrote:


But taxes don't work like that, especially sales taxes. YOu have state
taxes, but many places also have local sales taxes, and often more than
one. There was an area around O'Hare at one point (don't know if it
still exists) where there was state, city, airport authority and some
other entity sales tax.

But surely the additional local sales taxes aren't just arbitrary and
are defined with geographic boundaries? In my state the sales tax is 6%
with the counties of Allegheny and Philadelphia adding an additional 1%.

Not always. For instance in some areas the mass transport system is a
separate governmental entity that actually crosses municipal borders.
Also, how do you decide which of the multiple districts a person resides
under these circumstances? You can't rely on addresses since on the
ongoing hoohas in this county is that Carmel people have Indy addresses
and Fishers people may have a Noblesville address. It isn't as cut and
dried as municipal boundaries.

--
People thought cybersex was a safe alternative,
until patients started presenting with sexually
acquired carpal tunnel syndrome.-Howard Berkowitz