On Sep 15, 11:02*am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

On Sep 15, 12:51*pm, Rico dJour wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:02*am, willshak wrote:

X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? *There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. *Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. *There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. *They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. *Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

I've seen them for sale on cl. They might have date stamps on them so
watch for that. I can't imagine a proane company not filling a tank
just because they don't own it. I own my grill tanks. I own my
actelene/oxygen tanks.

On Sep 15, 11:02*am, willshak wrote:

I want to own my own tank

http://tinyurl.com/100gtank
-----

- gpsman

Rico dJour wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R


Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Sep 15, 1:53*pm, willshak wrote:
Rico dJour wrote the following:









On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged..
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? *There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. *Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. *There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. *They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. *Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

Geez, Bill. I try to talk you out of something and I succeed on the
first attempt? Where's the fun in that?!

I really have no experience whatsoever with propane other than the
little tanks, and I have no idea of whether large tanks are available
for consumer purchase. I just raised some questions about potential
problems from the distributor's viewpoint and that those should be
addressed before running out an buying one.

Don't give up hope!

R

jamesgangnc wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 12:51 pm, Rico dJour wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:

X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair
I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?
I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

I've seen them for sale on cl. They might have date stamps on them so
watch for that. I can't imagine a proane company not filling a tank
just because they don't own it. I own my grill tanks. I own my
actelene/oxygen tanks.


I would guess that it depends upon the size of the tank.
Anyone can buy 4.25 lb. grill propane tanks.
I don't know about oxy/acetylene tanks since I haven't used them since
my Navy days 50 years ago, but I remember them having tanks the
thickness of some armored vehicle bodies (not Tanks).


--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

I think it is due to insurance issue. improper filling may cause fire
or leakage. either google more companies or ask some property
management service company. i think they should have experience with
that

On Sep 15, 2:09*pm, willshak wrote:
jamesgangnc wrote the following:





On Sep 15, 12:51 pm, Rico dJour wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:

X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair
I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?
I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? *There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. *Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. *There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. *They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. *Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

I've seen them for sale on cl. *They might have date stamps on them so
watch for that. *I can't imagine a proane company not filling a tank
just because they don't own it. *I own my grill tanks. *I own my
actelene/oxygen tanks.

I would guess that it depends upon the size of the tank.
Anyone can buy 4.25 lb. grill propane tanks.
I don't know about oxy/acetylene tanks since I haven't used them since
my Navy days 50 years ago, but I remember them having tanks the
thickness of some armored vehicle bodies (not Tanks).

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

RicodJour wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 1:53 pm, willshak wrote:
Rico dJour wrote the following:









On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair
I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?
I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.
I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.
R
Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

Geez, Bill. I try to talk you out of something and I succeed on the
first attempt? Where's the fun in that?!

I really have no experience whatsoever with propane other than the
little tanks, and I have no idea of whether large tanks are available
for consumer purchase. I just raised some questions about potential
problems from the distributor's viewpoint and that those should be
addressed before running out an buying one.

Don't give up hope!

R




Actually, propane scares the **** out of me. 2 incidents come to mind.
1. Back about 1963 I lived 2 streets up a hill from a small propane tank
farm on Rt. 9W in Congers, NY. I could see parts of the farm through the
trees from my house. One morning, my wife awakened me to tell me there
was a fire at the farm. From our front yard I watched grill sized
propane tanks spewing fire being launched in all directions, one coming
close to hitting my house. The larger tanks did not fly so far, but
their screw-on caps did.
There were also 100' tall pillars of fire coming from the fill tubes of
underground tanks. No one was killed or injured, and the highway had to
be closed. The cleanup took a long time afterwards. I think there are
still some tank missiles hiding in the wooded areas around the farm and
in the lake on the other side of the highway. It was never rebuilt.

2. I had a Member's Mark (Sam's Club) grill. It was a large grill with a
cabinet underneath to store stuff. I had two of the usual grill propane
tanks, one hooked up and the other stored under the grill in the cabinet.
During the grilling one time, the first tank ran out. I unhooked it and
reached into the cabinet for the spare tank and burned my hand grabbing
the tank. It was too hot to handle due to it being right under and close
to the grill bottom. I never stored a tank under there again. My next
and current grill has a full width heat shield in the cabinet attached a
few inches under the grill and the cabinet has a special construction in
the floor to prevent the tank from tipping when moving the grill, but I
never stored the extra tank in there anyway.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Sep 15, 3:09*pm, willshak wrote:
RicodJour wrote the following:









On Sep 15, 1:53 pm, willshak wrote:
Rico dJour wrote the following:

On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair
I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company..
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?
I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? *There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. *Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. *There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. *They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. *Changing customers
costs the company money.
I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping..
R
Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

Geez, Bill. *I try to talk you out of something and I succeed on the
first attempt? *Where's the fun in that?! *

I really have no experience whatsoever with propane other than the
little tanks, and I have no idea of whether large tanks are available
for consumer purchase. *I just raised some questions about potential
problems from the distributor's viewpoint and that those should be
addressed before running out an buying one.

Don't give up hope!

R

Actually, propane scares the **** out of me. 2 incidents come to mind.
1. Back about 1963 I lived 2 streets up a hill from a small propane tank
farm on Rt. 9W in Congers, NY. I could see parts of the farm through the
trees from my house. One morning, my wife awakened me to tell me there
was a fire at the farm. *From our front yard I watched grill sized
propane tanks spewing fire being launched in all directions, one coming
close to hitting my house. The larger tanks did not fly so far, but
their screw-on caps did.
There were also 100' tall pillars of fire coming from the fill tubes of
underground tanks. No one was killed or injured, and the highway had to
be closed. The cleanup took a long time afterwards. I think there are
still some tank missiles hiding in the wooded areas around the farm and
in the lake on the other side of the highway. It was never rebuilt.

2. I had a Member's Mark (Sam's Club) grill. It was a large grill with a
cabinet underneath to store stuff. I had two of the usual grill propane
tanks, one hooked up and the other stored under the grill in the cabinet.
During the grilling one time, the first tank ran out. I unhooked it and
reached into the cabinet for the spare tank and burned my hand grabbing
the tank. It was too hot to handle due to it being right under and close
to the grill bottom. I never stored a tank under there again. My next
and current grill has a full width heat shield in the cabinet attached a
few inches under the grill and the cabinet has a special construction in
the floor to prevent the tank from tipping when moving the grill, but I
never stored the extra tank in there anyway.

When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

R

willshak wrote:

I would guess that it depends upon the size of the tank.
Anyone can buy 4.25 lb. grill propane tanks.
I don't know about oxy/acetylene tanks since I haven't used them since
my Navy days 50 years ago, but I remember them having tanks the
thickness of some armored vehicle bodies (not Tanks).

Actually, you want a 120 gallon tank. No one will fill more than 80% full
so that gves you 96 gallons when full.

The tanks rean't cheap.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think nothing
about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of gasoline.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon

willshak wrote:

Rico dJour wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

You can buy tanks from the propane suppliers if you want. Most people
just lease the tanks and the propane company takes care of any
maintenance, replaces the tank if there is a problem, etc. If you own
the tank you will have to pay if there is a problem. Propane suppliers
will generally fill owner tanks as long as they pass inspection.

On 9/15/2011 12:51 PM, Rico dJour wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.

R

I've been through this with propane companies in the past. This may be a
regional thing, but in my area, downstate NY, any propane company will
sell you whatever tank you like. They will only fill your tank if they
did the inspection on it. If you want to shop prices, any new company
will charge for an inspection before they'll fill it. Needless to say, I
got away from using propane. I use oil for heating, and have a large
storage capacity that only needs one filling per year, so I shop around
and get the best cash price

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 12:37:18 -0700 (PDT), Rico dJour
wrote:

On Sep 15, 3:09Â*pm, willshak wrote:
RicodJour wrote the following:









On Sep 15, 1:53 pm, willshak wrote:
Rico dJour wrote the following:

On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair
I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?
I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? Â*There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. Â*Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. Â*There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. Â*They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. Â*Changing customers
costs the company money.
I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping.
R
Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

Geez, Bill. Â*I try to talk you out of something and I succeed on the
first attempt? Â*Where's the fun in that?! Â*

I really have no experience whatsoever with propane other than the
little tanks, and I have no idea of whether large tanks are available
for consumer purchase. Â*I just raised some questions about potential
problems from the distributor's viewpoint and that those should be
addressed before running out an buying one.

Don't give up hope!

R

Actually, propane scares the **** out of me. 2 incidents come to mind.
1. Back about 1963 I lived 2 streets up a hill from a small propane tank
farm on Rt. 9W in Congers, NY. I could see parts of the farm through the
trees from my house. One morning, my wife awakened me to tell me there
was a fire at the farm. Â*From our front yard I watched grill sized
propane tanks spewing fire being launched in all directions, one coming
close to hitting my house. The larger tanks did not fly so far, but
their screw-on caps did.
There were also 100' tall pillars of fire coming from the fill tubes of
underground tanks. No one was killed or injured, and the highway had to
be closed. The cleanup took a long time afterwards. I think there are
still some tank missiles hiding in the wooded areas around the farm and
in the lake on the other side of the highway. It was never rebuilt.

2. I had a Member's Mark (Sam's Club) grill. It was a large grill with a
cabinet underneath to store stuff. I had two of the usual grill propane
tanks, one hooked up and the other stored under the grill in the cabinet.
During the grilling one time, the first tank ran out. I unhooked it and
reached into the cabinet for the spare tank and burned my hand grabbing
the tank. It was too hot to handle due to it being right under and close
to the grill bottom. I never stored a tank under there again. My next
and current grill has a full width heat shield in the cabinet attached a
few inches under the grill and the cabinet has a special construction in
the floor to prevent the tank from tipping when moving the grill, but I
never stored the extra tank in there anyway.

When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

R

I was getting some hope from these stories.
My wife has been pushing me for a few years to get a propane Weber.
Thought I could use these stories to shut her up.
But I just can't do that.
Too many using them with no problem.

--Vic

On Sep 15, 4:20*pm, "Pete C." wrote:
willshak wrote:

Rico dJour wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:
X-post to alt.building.construction and alt.home.repair

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company..
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

I can't help you with your quest, but have you asked the propane
companies if they'd have issues with filling a largish tank owned by
the customer? *There might be liability issues that would throw a
wrench in your plans. *Filling their own tanks keeps the liability
within their control. *There might be insurance issues that prevent
them from filling your tank. *They might also have issues with filling
a tank where there's no 'contract' or assurance of continuity.
Automatic delivery is the easiest thing for them. *Changing customers
costs the company money.

I think those questions have to be answered before you start shopping..

R

Yeah, I kinda assumed that when I couldn't find the tanks on line.
Propane is explosive, unlike fuel oil.
Maybe I should just abandon the idea.

You can buy tanks from the propane suppliers if you want. Most people
just lease the tanks and the propane company takes care of any
maintenance, replaces the tank if there is a problem, etc. If you own
the tank you will have to pay if there is a problem. Propane suppliers
will generally fill owner tanks as long as they pass inspection.

My parents bought a 500 gallon tank YEARS ago. Sold the house and land
a few years ago and the tank went with it.

In article ,
Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon



Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?


--
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation
with the average voter. (Winston Churchill)

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:52:21 -0700 (PDT), gpsman wrote:

On Sep 15, 11:02*am, willshak wrote:

I want to own my own tank

http://tinyurl.com/100gtank
-----

- gpsman

Except for the fact that those that are listed are designated in pounds,
not gallons.
http://www.google.com/search?q=100+g...w=1409&bih=801

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 13:18:03 -0700, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon

Actually, if propane had been the fuel of choice for cars for the last
60 years, gasoline wouldn't stand a chance of being approved as a
motor fuel today. - and thos bombs do NOT use gasoline, generally.
They use Kero, Diesel, or Jet fuel. (more energy per lb, for one
thing, and safer to handle)

On Sep 15, 3:34*pm, (Larry W) wrote:
In article ,









Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. *They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon

Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?

--
* * *The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation
* * *with the average voter. * * * * * * * * (Winston Churchill)

* Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

This topic has come up before on a.h.r

FAE is well know in military circles.

All one needs is the mixture of air (oxygen) and a suitable fuel and
an ignition source.

Fuel can be any combustible liquid or combustible solid of fine enough
particles
(hence the danger of empty grain silos or fine wood dust in your shop)

FAE is why the 100ml (3 oz) liquid limit for airline carry on and why
they want to be able to see the stuff.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/dumb/fae.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9xCgNdZPKk
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermobaric_weapon
http://www.bordeninstitute.army.mil/..._monograph.pdf

cheers
Bob

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:34:52 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon



Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?
Google FAE and Thermobaric weapon.

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:34:52 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon



Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?
Ever hear of MOAB?

On Sep 15, 7:33*pm, John Smith wrote:
On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:52:21 -0700 (PDT), gpsman wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:02 am, willshak wrote:

I want to own my own tank

http://tinyurl.com/100gtank

Except for the fact that those that are listed are designated in pounds,
not gallons.http://www.google.com/search?q=100+g...ie=utf-8&oe=ut...

Huh...

Well, that the first time that ever happened!
-----

- gpsman

RBM wrote:

-snip-

I've been through this with propane companies in the past. This may be a
regional thing, but in my area, downstate NY, any propane company will
sell you whatever tank you like.

That blows my theory, then. I thought it was NY law that the company
had to own the tank. I'm a couple hours north of you, near
Schenectady. I've had 3 suppliers in the last 25 years and none
would sell me a tank.

All have been real good about running new supply lines to any
appliances I put in. [and only charge for the material- and less than
I could get it at the borg]

Jim

On Sep 15, 3:37*pm, Rico dJour wrote:
When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. *A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. *The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 19:58:31 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:34:52 +0000 (UTC),
(Larry W) wrote:

In article ,
Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon



Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?
Ever hear of MOAB?

MOAB isn't an FAE, rather a 21,000lb HE bomb (GBU-43/B).

"Jim Elbrecht" wrote in message
...
RBM wrote:

-snip-

I've been through this with propane companies in the past. This may be a
regional thing, but in my area, downstate NY, any propane company will
sell you whatever tank you like.

That blows my theory, then. I thought it was NY law that the company
had to own the tank. I'm a couple hours north of you, near
Schenectady. I've had 3 suppliers in the last 25 years and none
would sell me a tank.

All have been real good about running new supply lines to any
appliances I put in. [and only charge for the material- and less than
I could get it at the borg]

Jim

Propane dealers are the sleaziest bunch ever. The won't touch a tank that
is not theirs. I've not kept up, but some states have changed the laws to
make it better for the consumer to shop around.

I've seen 100 gallon tanks for sale. I've also seen people taking them to
be filled to save money. I'd have considered it in the past, but I'm not
about to start hauling around the tanks and setting them up when full. Yes,
I pay a high price for the privilege of having them deliver once a year.

"willshak" wrote in message

stuff snipped

Actually, propane scares the **** out of me. 2 incidents come to mind.
1. Back about 1963 I lived 2 streets up a hill from a small propane tank
farm on Rt. 9W in Congers, NY. I could see parts of the farm through the
trees from my house. One morning, my wife awakened me to tell me there
was a fire at the farm. From our front yard I watched grill sized
propane tanks spewing fire being launched in all directions, one coming
close to hitting my house. The larger tanks did not fly so far, but
their screw-on caps did.

You're right to be wary: Those were BLEVE's - Boiling Liquid Expanding
Vapor Explosions. Depending on the circumstances, they can fly pretty far.
Firemen really dislike fighting such fires because of the danger of tanks
and parts becoming mini-rocketships, propelled by superhot gas exiting the
relief valve (or sometimes the hole where the relief valve used to be after
the relief valve has rocketed off).

http://www.firenuggets.com/dunnsdisp...sdispatch3.htm

says:

The distance that a piece of steel can be blown away from the explosion
depends, in part, on the size of the container and the amount of liquid
petroleum gas stored inside. BLEVEs of large tanks have blown metal pieces
up half a mile away from the explosion. Firefighters who were 800 feet away
from such a BLEVE have been killed by hurtling tank parts. Obviously, a
small cylinder will not cause shrapnel to travel as far as will a large
propane tank; however, firefighters directing a 30- or 50-foot hose stream
to cool down exposures are within the range of rocketing projectiles and
could be killed or seriously injured.

The distance covered by metal shrapnel from an exploding propane cylinder is
also dependent on which section of the cylinder fails. If the cylinder
remains in one piece and only the control mechanism and valve blow off, that
cylinder will travel farther than if the tank splits into two large
sections. A small piece of rocketing cylinder such as a control handle
mechanism is not unlike a bullet or cannon ball. If, on the other hand, the
propane cylinder splits apart or tears open at the seam, the large chunks of
metal may not travel as far away from the explosion site; however, this type
of cylinder rupture creates a larger fireball . . . In Brooklyn, New York,
one 20-pound propane cylinder exploded in the cellar of a plumbing supply
company. The explosion and ensuing shock wave collapsed three two-story
buildings, killing four people. Five years ago, in Buffalo, New York, the
shock waves of an explosion caused by a leaking propane cylinder collapsed a
200- by 100-foot brick building, killing five firefighters; propane gas was
a suspected cause of the 2001 explosion and building collapse that killed
FDNY firefighters Harry Ford, John Downing and Brian Fahey.

I think I might look into storing my 20 pound bottle somewhere safer than it
is now. I'd keep it in the shed except I use it only to melt ice from the
steps. Putting it in the shed means carrying it up an icy hill. Hmmm.

--
Bobby G.

Larry Fishel wrote the following:
On Sep 15, 3:37 pm, Rico dJour wrote:
When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.


I have both a fridge and a chest freezer in my attached garage, so
either could be a source of ignition of propane fumes. The only fuel I
keep in the garage is a 5 gallon plastic gasoline can, and then only in
the winter when I keep my garden tractor equipped with a snow blower
attachment in there, which also contains gasoline. I have to keep the
tractor in there in the winter because I can't leave it out in the shed,
like I can do in the summer when it has a mower attached, because the
throttle and choke cables freeze up to where they are useless and the
tractor won't start.
It's a two car garage but a car was only parked in there when the house
was new. There's no room for a car in there anymore. I have to move
stuff around just to get the tractor in there. :-)


--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

I currently have a 100 gal propane tank owned by the propane company.
It is refilled by automatic delivery and the price is set by the company.
At one time I had a tank owned by another propane supplier.
I switched from that company to the company I currently use. This
required that the old company had to come and remove their tank. I was
reimbursed for the propane left in the old tank. The new company
installed their tank and I was locked into whatever price they charged.
I want to own my own tank so I can shop around for the best price when
having my tank refilled, much like I do with my fuel oil tank.
Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

You must ask in your own location, Grasshoppah. Some states may have
statutes that eliminate private ownership. Liability is a big issue, even
if you have everything right, and have the tank inspected, yada yada. I can
buy one in my state, Utah, but I would have to live a very long time for it
to be a deal. Plus, as the nice propane lady told me, if I have any problem
with the tank, they just bring me another one, no charge, no repair. I
don't believe that would be the case with a privately owned tank.

If your issue is finding the cheapest propane, and the costs vary enough to
make it mathematically justifiable, they by all means, shop around. First,
though, ask the basic questions where YOU live, as some of the answers here
will be worth the paper they are written on, as they won't be valid where
YOU live.

Some suppliers, particularly of propane have been known to have wildly
fluctuating prices, taking advantage of some people they have captive by a
lease, etc.

Good luck.

Steve

"Larry Fishel" wrote in message
...
On Sep 15, 3:37 pm, Rico dJour wrote:
When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.

reply: My in-law's house was destroyed like that while they were away. The
blast blew bricks for a long distance. Blew out windows a good ways away,
too. Sabotage was suspected, as my FIL was involved in a nasty lawsuit at
the time, but nothing was ever proven. In his case, he had natural gas
appliances. Pilot lights. It would not be hard for someone to enter,
loosen a nut, and be gone. The explosion would be many hours later.

Steve

Robert Green wrote the following:
"willshak" wrote in message

stuff snipped

Actually, propane scares the **** out of me. 2 incidents come to mind.
1. Back about 1963 I lived 2 streets up a hill from a small propane tank
farm on Rt. 9W in Congers, NY. I could see parts of the farm through the
trees from my house. One morning, my wife awakened me to tell me there
was a fire at the farm. From our front yard I watched grill sized
propane tanks spewing fire being launched in all directions, one coming
close to hitting my house. The larger tanks did not fly so far, but
their screw-on caps did.

You're right to be wary: Those were BLEVE's - Boiling Liquid Expanding
Vapor Explosions. Depending on the circumstances, they can fly pretty far.
Firemen really dislike fighting such fires because of the danger of tanks
and parts becoming mini-rocketships, propelled by superhot gas exiting the
relief valve (or sometimes the hole where the relief valve used to be after
the relief valve has rocketed off).

http://www.firenuggets.com/dunnsdisp...sdispatch3.htm

says:

The distance that a piece of steel can be blown away from the explosion
depends, in part, on the size of the container and the amount of liquid
petroleum gas stored inside. BLEVEs of large tanks have blown metal pieces
up half a mile away from the explosion. Firefighters who were 800 feet away
from such a BLEVE have been killed by hurtling tank parts. Obviously, a
small cylinder will not cause shrapnel to travel as far as will a large
propane tank; however, firefighters directing a 30- or 50-foot hose stream
to cool down exposures are within the range of rocketing projectiles and
could be killed or seriously injured.

The distance covered by metal shrapnel from an exploding propane cylinder is
also dependent on which section of the cylinder fails. If the cylinder
remains in one piece and only the control mechanism and valve blow off, that
cylinder will travel farther than if the tank splits into two large
sections. A small piece of rocketing cylinder such as a control handle
mechanism is not unlike a bullet or cannon ball. If, on the other hand, the
propane cylinder splits apart or tears open at the seam, the large chunks of
metal may not travel as far away from the explosion site; however, this type
of cylinder rupture creates a larger fireball . . . In Brooklyn, New York,
one 20-pound propane cylinder exploded in the cellar of a plumbing supply
company. The explosion and ensuing shock wave collapsed three two-story
buildings, killing four people. Five years ago, in Buffalo, New York, the
shock waves of an explosion caused by a leaking propane cylinder collapsed a
200- by 100-foot brick building, killing five firefighters; propane gas was
a suspected cause of the 2001 explosion and building collapse that killed
FDNY firefighters Harry Ford, John Downing and Brian Fahey.

I think I might look into storing my 20 pound bottle somewhere safer than it
is now. I'd keep it in the shed except I use it only to melt ice from the
steps. Putting it in the shed means carrying it up an icy hill. Hmmm.

Mine are stored outside in the back yard all year round next to the
grill. I use salt or sodium chloride for ice.

Propane tank farm fire in Dallas, TX.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n85R3OXK3bs
The 10 minute video was taken from a mile or two away, but the flying
tanks can be seen. Note the fires started by the flying tanks all over
the highway.




Jufor

--
Bobby G.




--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

Actually, you want a 120 gallon tank. No one will fill more than 80% full
so that gves you 96 gallons when full.

The tanks rean't cheap.

--

dadiOH

Check with local regs. In my case, my tank is one gallon short of being a
size that has to be located a long distance from the house. Running a pipe
from a tank to the house isn't THAT expensive, but it does incur additional
expense. Find out what the laws are where YOU live. What someone suggests
here for you to do may be illegal where you are.

Steve

--
Please go to my facebook page, Heart Surgery Survival Guide and LIKE me so I
can get my domain name.

Heart surgery pending?
www.heartsurgerysurvivalguide.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide
Now on facebook, too.

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote

Propane dealers are the sleaziest bunch ever. The won't touch a tank that
is not theirs. I've not kept up, but some states have changed the laws to
make it better for the consumer to shop around.

I've seen 100 gallon tanks for sale. I've also seen people taking them to
be filled to save money. I'd have considered it in the past, but I'm not
about to start hauling around the tanks and setting them up when full.
Yes, I pay a high price for the privilege of having them deliver once a
year.

Ed, it is different for every planet. Here where I live, I can take any
tank into a supplier, and so long as it is within test dates, and does not
have any damage or deterioration that disqualifies it from service, they
will fill it.

Steve

On Thu, 15 Sep 2011 20:06:17 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:


"Larry Fishel" wrote in message
...
On Sep 15, 3:37 pm, Rico dJour wrote:
When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.

reply: My in-law's house was destroyed like that while they were away. The
blast blew bricks for a long distance. Blew out windows a good ways away,
too. Sabotage was suspected, as my FIL was involved in a nasty lawsuit at
the time, but nothing was ever proven. In his case, he had natural gas
appliances. Pilot lights. It would not be hard for someone to enter,
loosen a nut, and be gone. The explosion would be many hours later.

Steve

Difference between NG and Propane is propane is heavier than air - so
it pools in low spots - while NG is slighly lighter than air, so it
rises and mixes EVERYWHERE

On Sep 15, 11:06*pm, "Steve B" wrote:
"Larry Fishel" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 3:37 pm, Rico dJour wrote:

When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.

reply: *My in-law's house was destroyed like that while they were away. *The
blast blew bricks for a long distance. *Blew out windows a good ways away,
too. *Sabotage was suspected, as my FIL was involved in a nasty lawsuit at
the time, but nothing was ever proven. *In his case, he had natural gas
appliances. *Pilot lights. *It would not be hard for someone to enter,
loosen a nut, and be gone. *The explosion would be many hours later.

Steve

*OR* a more plausible explanation is a combination of older gas
appliances
which had primitive safety devices in them with a sudden spike or dip
in
the natural gas pressure in the area of your in-laws house blew out a
pilot
light in one of those appliances and the gas built up in the house
until one
of the other pilot lights still lit or a spark from some automatic
electrical
appliance ignited the gas in the house...

Anyone who immediately jumps to assume sabotage without having actual
evidence of that being likely (reports of strange people/vehicles near
a house
that soon after goes BOOM! by impartial witnesses) is a paranoid
idiot...

~~ Evan

On Sep 16, 3:25*pm, Evan wrote:
On Sep 15, 11:06*pm, "Steve B" wrote:
"Larry Fishel" wrote in message
On Sep 15, 3:37 pm, Rico dJour wrote:

When I was a middling lad a neighbor's house blew up like someone
dropped a bomb on it. A propane tank in the garage somehow went off.
No idea of the size of the tank, but it's an area that the only
propane used is for gas grills. The wife died, the husband lived, and
parts of the house were found hundreds of yards away.

Home made (accidentally) FAE. The tank "going off" would likely have
just burned the house down. If the house was blown into little pieces,
then what most likely happened was that a leaking tank filled the
garage with just the right mixture of propane and air, and some
ignition source detonated that.

reply: *My in-law's house was destroyed like that while they were away. *The
blast blew bricks for a long distance. *Blew out windows a good ways away,
too. *Sabotage was suspected, as my FIL was involved in a nasty lawsuit at
the time, but nothing was ever proven. *In his case, he had natural gas
appliances. *Pilot lights. *It would not be hard for someone to enter,
loosen a nut, and be gone. *The explosion would be many hours later.

Steve

*OR* a more plausible explanation is a combination of older gas
appliances
which had primitive safety devices in them with a sudden spike or dip
in
the natural gas pressure in the area of your in-laws house blew out a
pilot
light in one of those appliances and the gas built up in the house
until one
of the other pilot lights still lit or a spark from some automatic
electrical
appliance ignited the gas in the house...

Anyone who immediately jumps to assume sabotage without having actual
evidence of that being likely (reports of strange people/vehicles near
a house
that soon after goes BOOM! by impartial witnesses) is a paranoid
idiot...

Steve said sabotage was suspected, not assumed. That's a big
difference and I'm surprised you missed it. The investigator would be
the idiot if they did not investigate fully - even the improbable
causes.

R

On Fri, 16 Sep 2011 12:25:28 -0700 (PDT), Evan
wrote:


*OR* a more plausible explanation is a combination of older gas
appliances
which had primitive safety devices in them with a sudden spike or dip
in
the natural gas pressure in the area of your in-laws house blew out a
pilot
light in one of those appliances and the gas built up in the house
until one
of the other pilot lights still lit or a spark from some automatic
electrical
appliance ignited the gas in the house...


Don't know if this was discussed here before I was around.
Worth mentioning.
There were a bunch of defective flex NG hoses on the market.
Those hoses are most common on ranges and clothes dryers.
I replaced the ones in this house with new hoses because I didn't know
how old the hoses were.
Can't find anything about it now.
About 10 years ago.
I'll bet there's plenty of those bad hoses out there waiting to fail.

--Vic

In article ,
DD_BobK wrote:
On Sep 15, 3:34*pm, (Larry W) wrote:
In article ,









Jon Danniken wrote:
dadiOH wrote:
willshak wrote:
Actually, propane scares the **** out of me.

It does the same to a lot of people and yet all those people think
nothing about riding around for hours on top of 10-20 gallons of
gasoline.

The gasoline itself isn't that dangerous, it's the air and fuel vapor
mixture in the tank that is the explosive part. *They build bombs using that
concept, and they are the most powerful bombs made short of a nuke.

Jon

Who is "They" and can you give an example of a powerful bomb that uses
an "air and fuel vapor mixture" as the explosive?

--
* * *The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation
* * *with the average voter. * * * * * * * * (Winston Churchill)

* Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

This topic has come up before on a.h.r

FAE is well know in military circles.

All one needs is the mixture of air (oxygen) and a suitable fuel and
an ignition source.

Fuel can be any combustible liquid or combustible solid of fine enough
particles
(hence the danger of empty grain silos or fine wood dust in your shop)

FAE is why the 100ml (3 oz) liquid limit for airline carry on and why
they want to be able to see the stuff.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/dumb/fae.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9xCgNdZPKk
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermobaric_weapon
http://www.bordeninstitute.army.mil/..._monograph.pdf

cheers
Bob

I'm not disputing that. But I have never heard of a bomb that used a
grain silo or wood shop as one if its parts.



--
Make it as simple as possible, but not simpler. (Albert Einstein)

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

Having googled for 100 gal propane tanks, it seems that no one sells
these large tanks to the general public. Even eBay does not have any new
or used tanks for sale (Your search returned 0 items).
Anyone have any ideas?

You might try an RV dealer. There's also this post that suggests that
manufacturers don't want to sell 100 gallon or larger tanks to consumers.
http://www.cga.ct.gov/2009/rpt/2009-R-0296.htm

Most of the propane dealers around here will sell you a tank outright and it
does indeed allow you to shop for refills. The tanks have to be recertified
every 10 years, so there's no liability issue with refilling a customer owned
tank.

The problem is that although you can buy a tank, there's not a lot of incentive
for the dealers to sell you one unless they price it quite high. Not so
coincidentally, the payback when compared against renting the tank was about 15
years on a 500 gallon tank ($72/year rent vs. $1000 to buy).