We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. In our area (SE Kansas). Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, or just inside of the garage door. (In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

"RonB" wrote in message
...
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. In our area (SE Kansas). Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, or just inside of the garage door. (In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

It'll work, but it's kind of a Rube. Always a pia to have to drag cords out,
especially if it turns out to be a short outage. If you have a garden
variety circuit breaker panel, you can probably install an interlock kit,
which cost around $150. Personally, I'm pretty cheap, so I built my own.
Cost about a buck. Here's a link to the interlock kit:
http://www.interlockkit.com/?gclid=C...FYg65QodWSKgCA

On Apr 23, 3:22*pm, RonB wrote:
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. *In our area (SE Kansas). *Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. *Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. *A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. *Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; *but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. *Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, *or just inside of the garage door. *(In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, *will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. *This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. *The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. *The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? *I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. *But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

Cheapest way I know of for a safe system is to use Kirk locks. place
them on the main breaker and the breaker used to connect the
generator. The locks allow only one of the breakers to be ON at a
time.

Jimmie

"RonB" wrote in message
...
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. In our area (SE Kansas). Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, or just inside of the garage door. (In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

** Another fairly inexpensive method is a self contained generator transfer
switch like this one from Reliance. It's a complete kit, and only takes a
few hours to install:
http://www.amazon.com/Reliance-Contr...3587946&sr=1-1

On Apr 23, 3:22*pm, RonB wrote:
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. *In our area (SE Kansas). *Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. *Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. *A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. *Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; *but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. *Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, *or just inside of the garage door. *(In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, *will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. *This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. *The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. *The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? *I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. *But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

I made some long extention cords out of 12/3 wire. I put male plugs at
the generator end, where they plug into the generator outlets. They
end up in outlet boxes located so that I can unplug the refrigerator
and freezer from the wall outlet and plug them into the generator
outlet. I have plugs attached to the lines to the water pump, furnace,
etc., and just switch from house to generator when needed. Not elegant
but it's cheap and it works.

RonB wrote:
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. In our area (SE Kansas). Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, or just inside of the garage door. (In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

Whatever you decide, spend some quality time with the local electrical
inspector. You might find that an extension cord "bolted to the structure"
is no longer an extension cord. Even stuff that's not permanently
energized might be under the jurisdiction of the local authorities.
"Safe" and "Legal" may not be equivalent. YMMV

The disturbing part was that the inspector said he'd approve stuff
that appeared to be specifically prohibited by the NEC. Depending on
with whom I talked, if I messed with the breaker box, I may or may not
have to bring the whole primary side up to current code. That's
PROHIBITIVELY EXPENSIVE.

Last thing you want is for your fire insurance provider to find a
loophole. Better to have the inspection sticker.

I found a great deal on a generator at a garage sale. Found another
great deal on a Reliance DIY transfer switch. No doubt in my mind that
I could make a safe and reliable installation. By the time I talked with
the local electrical inspector and found out that the permit and
inspection fees cost more than the generator,
I scrapped the project.
Easier to put a doggie door in the wall and poke the extension cord thru
when needed. No muss, no fuss.

"RonB" wrote in message
...
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. In our area (SE Kansas). Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

(snip)



I am working on this problem also. Generator will be propane fueled. Remote
switch for starting..Will add outlets near freezer, refrigerator and heat
system. These will only be connected to the generator. Safe and easy to move
plugs from one outlet to others. WW

RonB wrote:

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.


A couple of people have mentioned interlock kits. Here's how and why they
work:

You add two breakers to your box. These breakers are connected to a 220v
male plug into which you connect the output of your generator.

Under normal conditions, these two new breakers are OFF. When the power
fails, you plug the extension cord from your generator into the male plug
attached to the two new breakers. You switch the MAIN to off and the two new
breakers to ON.

What an interlock switch does is guarantee that when the MAIN is ON, these
two new breakers must be OFF. When the two new breakers are ON, the MAIN
must be OFF.

All this is done to prevent your generator from backfeeding the distribution
system and presenting a safety hazard to the linemen.

You may dispense with the interlock switch is you're careful.

Your cost for this set-up is maybe $20 each for the breakers and $40 for the
male plug.

YOU GUYS DISCUSD THINGS LIKE EVERYONE HAS PURCHSING POWER AND ACCESS
TO A HOME DEPOT OR ELECTRICAL SUPPLY STORE.

WHAT IF ..... THE WORLD SHUT DOWN ..... NO ACCESS TO ANYWHERE LIKE
THAT... COULD YOU BUILD THE GENERATOR AND SUPPLY YOUR PREMISES WITH
WHAT YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE ADEQUATE POWER, TO YOUR COMPONENTS & SURVIVE
THE WORLD?

ARE YOU PREPARED TO SURVIVE, OR WILL YOU HAVE TO GO SHOPPING FOR
ELEMENTS?

JUST A THOUGHT

PAT ECUM

On 4/23/2011 5:05 PM, Pavel314 wrote:
On Apr 23, 3:22 pm, wrote:
(snip)

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

I made some long extention cords out of 12/3 wire. I put male plugs at
the generator end, where they plug into the generator outlets. They
end up in outlet boxes located so that I can unplug the refrigerator
and freezer from the wall outlet and plug them into the generator
outlet. I have plugs attached to the lines to the water pump, furnace,
etc., and just switch from house to generator when needed. Not elegant
but it's cheap and it works.

If I feel rich enough to buy a generator this year, that is how I plan
to do it.
Maybe put a piece of PVC with a threaded cap on it through the band
joist above the sill, so I have a ready-made hole to pass the extension
cord through.

--
aem sends...

On 4/23/2011 10:59 PM, HeyBub wrote:
RonB wrote:

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.


A couple of people have mentioned interlock kits. Here's how and why they
work:

You add two breakers to your box. These breakers are connected to a 220v
male plug into which you connect the output of your generator.

Under normal conditions, these two new breakers are OFF. When the power
fails, you plug the extension cord from your generator into the male plug
attached to the two new breakers. You switch the MAIN to off and the two new
breakers to ON.

What an interlock switch does is guarantee that when the MAIN is ON, these
two new breakers must be OFF. When the two new breakers are ON, the MAIN
must be OFF.

All this is done to prevent your generator from backfeeding the distribution
system and presenting a safety hazard to the linemen.

You may dispense with the interlock switch is you're careful.

Uh, NO! You aren't wiring for you, you are wiring for the next owner, or
the helpful neighbor that comes over to help while you are in the
hospital because of the tree limb that fell on you. Safety-critical
stuff has to fail safe, and be idiot proof, or as close as we humans can
get.

--
aem sends....

On Apr 23, 11:39*pm, aemeijers wrote:
On 4/23/2011 10:59 PM, HeyBub wrote:





RonB wrote:

Anyone else done something similar - or better? *I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. *But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

A couple of people have mentioned interlock kits. Here's how and why they
work:

You add two breakers to your box. These breakers are connected to a 220v
male plug into which you connect the output of your generator.

Under normal conditions, these two new breakers are OFF. When the power
fails, you plug the extension cord from your generator into the male plug
attached to the two new breakers. You switch the MAIN to off and the two new
breakers to ON.

What an interlock switch does is guarantee that when the MAIN is ON, these
two new breakers must be OFF. When the two new breakers are ON, the MAIN
must be OFF.

All this is done to prevent your generator from backfeeding the distribution
system and presenting a safety hazard to the linemen.

You may dispense with the interlock switch is you're careful.

Uh, NO! You aren't wiring for you, you are wiring for the next owner, or
the helpful neighbor that comes over to help while you are in the
hospital because of the tree limb that fell on you. Safety-critical
stuff has to fail safe, and be idiot proof, or as close as we humans can
get.

--
aem sends....

SOME FOOLS IDEA OF AN IDIOT IS A CHILD LEFT ALONE TO WANDER & TAMPER.,
YOU ALSO MUST KEEP IN MIND THAT EVEN AN ANIMAL HAVE ACCESS TO
ELECTRICAL SYSTEMS.

SAFETY FIRST..&.. DAMAGES MUST BE ADDRESSED EXPEDITIOUSLY

PAT ECUM

On Apr 23, 10:59*pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
RonB wrote:

Anyone else done something similar - or better? *I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. *But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

A couple of people have mentioned interlock kits. Here's how and why they
work:

You add two breakers to your box. These breakers are connected to a 220v
male plug into which you connect the output of your generator.

Under normal conditions, these two new breakers are OFF. When the power
fails, you plug the extension cord from your generator into the male plug
attached to the two new breakers. You switch the MAIN to off and the two new
breakers to ON.

What an interlock switch does is guarantee that when the MAIN is ON, these
two new breakers must be OFF. When the two new breakers are ON, the MAIN
must be OFF.

All this is done to prevent your generator from backfeeding the distribution
system and presenting a safety hazard to the linemen.

You may dispense with the interlock switch is you're careful.

Your cost for this set-up is maybe $20 each for the breakers and $40 for the
male plug.

Nice thing about the Kirk locks is he would only need to install a
50amp 240 vac breaker for the generator the rest of the mod is just
fastening the Kirk locks to the panel. On a residential panel room for
the locks will be limited and the generator breaker will have to be
mounted at the bottom of the breaker column .

Jimmie

I am working on this problem also. Generator will be propane fueled. Remote
switch for starting..Will add outlets near freezer, refrigerator and heat
system. These will only be connected to the generator. Safe and easy to move
plugs from one outlet to others.

You will need a lot of propane, far more than 1 or 2 gas grill 20
pound tanks.

buy the smallest generator you can get away with, because big
generators use lots of fuel even at idle

aemeijers wrote:
On 4/23/2011 10:59 PM, HeyBub wrote:
RonB wrote:

Anyone else done something similar - or better? I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. But it is a solution that MIGHT get
used once every year or so.


A couple of people have mentioned interlock kits. Here's how and why
they work:

You add two breakers to your box. These breakers are connected to a
220v male plug into which you connect the output of your generator.

Under normal conditions, these two new breakers are OFF. When the
power fails, you plug the extension cord from your generator into
the male plug attached to the two new breakers. You switch the MAIN
to off and the two new breakers to ON.

What an interlock switch does is guarantee that when the MAIN is ON,
these two new breakers must be OFF. When the two new breakers are
ON, the MAIN must be OFF.

All this is done to prevent your generator from backfeeding the
distribution system and presenting a safety hazard to the linemen.

You may dispense with the interlock switch is you're careful.

Uh, NO! You aren't wiring for you, you are wiring for the next owner,
or the helpful neighbor that comes over to help while you are in the
hospital because of the tree limb that fell on you. Safety-critical
stuff has to fail safe, and be idiot proof, or as close as we humans
can get.

* Removing the contraption before selling the home will satisfy your concern
about the next owner.

* If a neighbor meddles with something on my house without knowing - or
figuring out - what's up, he owns the problem, not me.

The neighbor on one side of me is a granny-lady who can't figure out how to
open her mailbox. The dude on the other side keeps coming in my yard and
trimming my bushes (so he can see traffic when exiting his driveway). I've
already told him that if he comes in my yard one more time with the intent
to practice malicious mischief in the nighttime by destroying my property,
I'm gonna shoot him in his ****in' head !

In my case, instructions are written inside the panel door and the panel
door has a lock on it. I WOULD install an interlock if the flat piece of
six-inch square metal cost in the neighborhood of ten bucks.

But for $140? Forget it.

As for "fail safe" systems, I refer you to a quote from the book
"Systemantics": "Fail safe systems always fail by failing to fail safe."

* If a neighbor meddles with something on my house without knowing - or
figuring out - what's up, he owns the problem, not me.

The neighbor on one side of me is a granny-lady who can't figure out how to
open her mailbox. The dude on the other side keeps coming in my yard and
trimming my bushes (so he can see traffic when exiting his driveway). I've
already told him that if he comes in my yard one more time with the intent
to practice malicious mischief in the nighttime by destroying my property,
I'm gonna shoot him in his ****in' head !


Congrats natural selection hasnt already shortened your life

Anyone who has a visual hazard that may cause a traffic accident, and
refuses to prune or better remove the offender completely, and
threatens violence, needs serious help........

locally the town cites people like you, remove hazard or be fined and
ultimately be brought in before the magistrate.

one idiot failed to remove the hazard even after several accidents,
the town courts finally jailed him for a couple days, and had the road
crew remove the hazard, and billed him for the removal.

he didnt pay and had his home liened. It drug thru the courts for
years, he finally had to pay up at home sale time, rumors said it cost
him 10 grand in legal court, lawyers, road crew removal at union wage
rates. very expensive when 5 minutes with a chain saw would of saved
him 2 days in jail and lost wages. he countersued and lost for lost
wages.

The town upgraded its line of site laws, the next idiot will be paying
a thousand dollar a day fine..So the jerk left his legacy

You his brother or uncle?

On 4/23/2011 2:22 PM, RonB wrote:

Main Needs a

3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)

You need a way to connect the furnace to an extension cord. One of the
better ways is to install an "inlet" (a male plug that mounts like an
outlet) at the furnace. An added double pole switch connects the furnace
to either normal wiring or the inlet. An extension cord connects the
inlet to your emergency receptacles.


3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

If your generator circuit breaker is not 20A you need 20A protection for
the basement receptacles.


I like the interlock from RBM. You would have to make sure the loads you
want are balanced on both legs of the panel. Check the cost and
convenience of different methods.

--
bud--

"bud--" wrote in message
...
On 4/23/2011 2:22 PM, RonB wrote:

Main Needs a

3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)

You need a way to connect the furnace to an extension cord. One of the
better ways is to install an "inlet" (a male plug that mounts like an
outlet) at the furnace.

**I know you know this, and just mis-typed (double throw switch)

An added double pole switch connects the furnace
to either normal wiring or the inlet.


An extension cord connects the
inlet to your emergency receptacles.


3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

If your generator circuit breaker is not 20A you need 20A protection for
the basement receptacles.


I like the interlock from RBM. You would have to make sure the loads you
want are balanced on both legs of the panel. Check the cost and
convenience of different methods.

--
bud--

On Apr 23, 2:22*pm, RonB wrote:
We own a 5000/6260 Watt generator that is used for temporary emergency
service during electrical outages. *In our area (SE Kansas). *Outages
related to thunderstorms and ice storms are fairly common. *Outages
can last from a couple of hours to more than a day.

Being a lot Irish, I really don't want to spring for the full $600 -
$1,000+ plus for a full up transfer switch installation. *A am also
opposed to the old Dryer Plug approach. *Remembering to isolate the
house with main breakers might work now; *but as our brains age it
looks like a good way to kill a lineman. *Here are needs and a
proposed approach:

Main Needs a
1) Sump Pump main control circuit (basement)
2) Backup Sump Pump battery charger circuit (basement)
3) Furnace (central heat NOT air conditioning - basement)
4) Freezer (basement)
5) Refrigerator (main floor)

These five items are well within normal and surge capacity of the
generator so I should have some capacity to run a few lamps.

Planned Approach:

1) Install a standard four prong female generator connection box so
that 10/4 wire passes directly through the sill plate of the house.
This will be done outside, *or just inside of the garage door. *(In
either case the generator will, of course, be located well away from
the house).

2) The 10/4 wire, from the box, *will enter the basement and be routed
down to about four feet above the floor via conduit.

3) At the bottom of the wire/conduit I will install a fourplex box and
split the circuit into two 120v circuits with a standard two-plug
receptacle on each. *This will serve items 1) through 4) above via
direct connection or extension cords. *The longest cord run will be
15-20'

This circuit will be "dumb" and will not be hooked to the main house
circuit.

When needed, we will move the generator outside of the garage and use
a standard 4-blade, 30 amp, 30' generator cord to connect the
generator to the dumb circuit which will serve basement needs. *The
fridge and lights will be served by a couple of the four standard 120v
circuits on the generator.

Anyone else done something similar - or better? *I do want to keep
cost down and keep it safe. *But it is a solution that MIGHT get used
once every year or so.

Thanks
RonB

A transfer kit is easy to install you can do it yourself. I got a
complete kit like the one RBM shows mine is a Generac kit from lowes
and includes everything. it it safe and has built in amp meters so you
can monitor the load. You might get one for 2-300.

bob haller wrote:
* If a neighbor meddles with something on my house without knowing -
or figuring out - what's up, he owns the problem, not me.

The neighbor on one side of me is a granny-lady who can't figure out
how to open her mailbox. The dude on the other side keeps coming in
my yard and trimming my bushes (so he can see traffic when exiting
his driveway). I've already told him that if he comes in my yard one
more time with the intent to practice malicious mischief in the
nighttime by destroying my property, I'm gonna shoot him in his
****in' head !


Congrats natural selection hasnt already shortened your life

Anyone who has a visual hazard that may cause a traffic accident, and
refuses to prune or better remove the offender completely, and
threatens violence, needs serious help........

locally the town cites people like you, remove hazard or be fined and
ultimately be brought in before the magistrate.

one idiot failed to remove the hazard even after several accidents,
the town courts finally jailed him for a couple days, and had the road
crew remove the hazard, and billed him for the removal.

he didnt pay and had his home liened. It drug thru the courts for
years, he finally had to pay up at home sale time, rumors said it cost
him 10 grand in legal court, lawyers, road crew removal at union wage
rates. very expensive when 5 minutes with a chain saw would of saved
him 2 days in jail and lost wages. he countersued and lost for lost
wages.

The town upgraded its line of site laws, the next idiot will be paying
a thousand dollar a day fine..So the jerk left his legacy

You his brother or uncle?

Points:

* Shows what you know. The bushes in question are no more than 2-1/2' high.
He chops them to the ground.

* I may agree with the point about a visual hazard, but that's not the case
here. I also pity those who would live in such a benighted area. In fact I
PLANTED the goddamn bushes to keep the neighbors from driving across the
15'-wide grassy strip and using MY driveway to get to the street (the
passage in the street's median is in front of my driveway).

* I'm not "threatening violence," my state's penal code is.

Texas Penal Code 9.42

A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land
or tangible, moveable property
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is
immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary,
robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal
mischief during the nighttime, ...

* I'm neither his brother nor his uncle. To the best of my knowledge, we are
not related (different races, he's an enlightened Yankee (but evidently not
sufficiently enlightened), he votes Democratic, etc.). My dad has passed on
so I can't ask him how frisky he was some 45 years ago.

* He's got a 50' tall cottonwood tree between his house and the street. I've
considered chopping it down because each fall my front yard is armpit-deep
in leaves and I would think the principle to which he harkens would
similarily apply. I haven't done so because of fear that the tree would land
in the street and contribute to an INNOCENT person having an accident.

You need a way to connect the furnace to an extension
cord. One of the
better ways is to install an "inlet" (a male plug that
mounts like an
outlet) at the furnace.

**I know you know this, and just mis-typed (double throw
switch)

An added double pole switch connects the furnace

CY: Actually, a double pole double throw switch would be
wise. So that the generator neutral doesn't get connected to
the house neutral.

to either normal wiring or the inlet.


An extension cord connects the
inlet to your emergency receptacles.

CY: Sounds good, cord to the inlet.


I like the interlock from RBM. You would have to make sure
the loads you
want are balanced on both legs of the panel. Check the
cost and
convenience of different methods.

CY: The interlock sounds like a good idea, if the panel
supports it.

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...


CY: Actually, a double pole double throw switch would be
wise. So that the generator neutral doesn't get connected to
the house neutral.


The transfer switch having to be single pole or double pole depends
completely on the neutral/ground bonding system of the particular generator
being used. In either case it needs to be double throw

On Apr 23, 2:42*pm, "RBM" wrote:

It'll work, but it's kind of a Rube. Always a pia to have to drag cords out,
especially if it turns out to be a short outage. If you have a garden
variety circuit breaker panel, you can probably install an interlock kit,
which cost around $150. Personally, I'm pretty cheap, so I built my own.
Cost about a buck. Here's a link to the interlock kit:http://www.interlockkit.com/?gclid=C...FYg65QodWSKgCA

It is an infrequent enough event that dragging cords is not an issue.
I am just trying to control the cord tangle. This approach lets me
hit all of the basement items with short runs; and a relatively short
run from the generator to the upstairs fridge. Otherwise I would have
to run into the house, down a stairway, and then nearly the length of
the house to get to the basement. There is a basement window near the
basement items but that requires removing a window bubble -- not
exactly what I have enjoyed doing during a downpour.

Regarding other comments:

1) The next owner is not an immediate concern. This is our retirement
house and I don't plan on selling it --- Our Kid's issue :^)
2) Inspection and building standards are not a real issue. I want it
safe, but in our rural community there are no inspectors. The
electrician who wired our home 2-3 years ago originally lived in KC
and is KC code conscious and I was happy with that.

Actually, I considered boring a big enough hole in the garage wall,
through the sill, to accept a direct routing of a standard generator
plug to the basement. The cord would be fed to the basement when
needed; and then use an octopus plug from there. The hole would be
covered with a simple, sealed cover to keep bugs out. However that
requires boring a 3" hole and I am not comfortable with putting that
large of a hole in the sill.

RonB