Help Dubya save gas, don't buy anything from Exxon-Mobil! Pass this on
to everyone.

I totally agree with George Bush that we should all save gas and oil.

I think we should first save Exxon-Mobil gas since it's the largest oil
company and has the most to save right?
Let's show George just how much we can save just for him!

We all have to have gas, but we don't have to have ExxonMobil gas!

So if everyone will please purchase their fuel and oil from any other
company except for Exxon-Mobil, look how much Americans can save for
George. It's the least we can do for the depressed Oil Industry. Of
course this has nothing to do with the PRICE GOUGING BY MAJOR OIL
COMPANIES and the OIL COMPANY'S MONOPOLY

http://foxfiretechnology.com

Oil companies can manipulate their prices somewhat by controlling how much
gasoline they produce and where they sell it, but they can't alter the
basics of supply and demand: prices go down when people buy less of a good,
prices go up when people buy more of a good, and prices go way up when
demand outstrips available supply. The "gas out" schemes that propose to
alter the demand side of the equation by shunning one or two specific brands
of gasoline for a while won't work, however, because they're based on the
misconception that an oil company's only outlet for gasoline is its own
branded service stations. That isn't the case: gasoline is a fungible
commodity, so if one oil company's product isn't being bought up in one
particular market or outlet, it will simply sell its output to (or through)
other outlets:
Economics Prof. Pat Welch of St. Louis University says any boycott of "bad
guy" gasoline in favor of "good guy" brands would have some unintended (and
unhappy) results.

.. . . Welch says the law of supply and demand is set in stone. "To meet the
sudden demand," he says, "the good guys would have to buy gasoline wholesale
from the bad guys, who are suddenly stuck with unwanted gasoline."

So motorists would end up . . . paying more for it, because they'd be buying
it at fewer stations.

And yes, oil companies do buy and sell from one another. Mike Right of AAA
Missouri says, "If a company has a station that can be served more
economically by a competitor's refinery, they'll do it."

Right adds, "In some cases, gasoline retailers have no refinery at all. Some
convenience-store chains sell a lot of gasoline - and buy it all from
somebody else's refinery."
A boycott of a couple of brands of gasoline won't result in lower overall
prices. Prices at all the non-boycotted outlets would rise due to the
temporarily limited supply and increased demand, making the original prices
look cheap by comparison. The shunned outlets could then make a killing by
offering gasoline at its "normal" (i.e., pre-boycott) price or by selling
off their output to the non-boycotted companies, who will need the extra
supply to meet demand. The only person who really gets hurt in this proposed
scheme is the service station operator, who has almost no control over the
price of gasoline.

The only practical way of reducing gasoline prices is through the
straightforward means of buying less gasoline, not through a simple and
painless scheme of just shifting where we buy it. The inconvenience of
driving less is a hardship too many people apparently aren't willing to
endure, however.

Someone in a Cadillac Escalade SUV was complaining to me about the high
cost of gas. I said "You know why gas is so expensive?" He said
"Why?"

I said "BECAUSE OF YOU."

The more gas we use, the more expensive it gets. It's a limited
commodity, and we've already taken most of the cheap oil out of the
ground. So as we want more, the oil producers are forced to sell not
only the inexpensive oil, but also to search for expensive oil. In
addition, with limited capacity to refine oil into gasoline, the more
we use, the more expensive the refining gets.

Shaun Eli
Comedian and Award-winning Economist
http://www.BrainChampagne.com
Brain Champagne: Clever Comedy for the Smart Mind (sm)

Shaun Eli wrote:
Someone in a Cadillac Escalade SUV was complaining to me about the high
cost of gas. I said "You know why gas is so expensive?" He said
"Why?"

I said "BECAUSE OF YOU."


And you use public transit, right? STFU if you're part of the problem.

"G Henslee" wrote in message
...
Shaun Eli wrote:
Someone in a Cadillac Escalade SUV was complaining to me about the high
cost of gas. I said "You know why gas is so expensive?" He said
"Why?"

I said "BECAUSE OF YOU."


And you use public transit, right? STFU if you're part of the problem.

You know, "they" are talking about taxing SUV drivers or anyone with a
vehicle that gets less than 15 MPG. The way I look at it, they have to buy
more gas than me so the ARE paying more tax because of their vehicles.

Hey! If you can afford them, why the hell not???

Dr. Hardcrab wrote:
"G Henslee" wrote in message
...

Shaun Eli wrote:

Someone in a Cadillac Escalade SUV was complaining to me about the high
cost of gas. I said "You know why gas is so expensive?" He said
"Why?"

I said "BECAUSE OF YOU."


And you use public transit, right? STFU if you're part of the problem.


You know, "they" are talking about taxing SUV drivers or anyone with a
vehicle that gets less than 15 MPG. The way I look at it, they have to buy
more gas than me so the ARE paying more tax because of their vehicles.

Hey! If you can afford them, why the hell not???



I would love the oppurtunity to run over 2 or 3 idjuits like Eli with my
Navigator.

The queers, baloney ponies and carpet munchers have an ongoing boycott
against Exxon-Mobil because they don't provide their spousal benefits
to Sodomites. Don't help their action.-Jitney

"Hurricane Guy" wrote in message
ups.com...
Help Dubya save gas, don't buy anything from Exxon-Mobil! Pass this on
to everyone.

I totally agree with George Bush that we should all save gas and oil.

I think we should first save Exxon-Mobil gas since it's the largest oil
company and has the most to save right?


Won't work They will just sell the gas to another seller under their name.
the only way to save gas is to actually use less. The Tuesday boycotts
don't work either as you still buy the same amount, just on a different day.
If you are serious, drive less and/or buy a smaller car with better mileage.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

"Hurricane Guy" wrote in message
ups.com...
Help Dubya save gas, don't buy anything from Exxon-Mobil! Pass this on
to everyone.

I totally agree with George Bush that we should all save gas and oil.

I think we should first save Exxon-Mobil gas since it's the largest oil
company and has the most to save right?


Won't work They will just sell the gas to another seller under their
name. the only way to save gas is to actually use less. The Tuesday
boycotts don't work either as you still buy the same amount, just on a
different day. If you are serious, drive less and/or buy a smaller car
with better mileage.


And turn the A/C off, then drive like it costs a lot. Most anyone can
improve their own mileage, no matter what their own starting point is.

"k" wrote in message

And turn the A/C off, then drive like it costs a lot. Most anyone can
improve their own mileage, no matter what their own starting point is.

Turning off the AC can actually decrease mileage at higher speeds as the
aerodynamics change with the windows down. Older cars needed a lot of power
to drive the compressor, but today, it makes little difference.

A light foot certainly helps and I agree that we all can improve if we want
to.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
. ..

"k" wrote in message

And turn the A/C off, then drive like it costs a lot. Most anyone can
improve their own mileage, no matter what their own starting point is.

Turning off the AC can actually decrease mileage at higher speeds as the
aerodynamics change with the windows down. Older cars needed a lot of
power to drive the compressor, but today, it makes little difference.

A light foot certainly helps and I agree that we all can improve if we
want to.

Do you think driving 55 MPH instead of, say, 65 or 70 helps your gas
mileage? I have noticed when I go South (where the roads are 65 or 70 mph)
that I seem to get BETTER gas mileage....

Dr. Hardcrab wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
. ..

"k" wrote in message

And turn the A/C off, then drive like it costs a lot. Most anyone can
improve their own mileage, no matter what their own starting point is.

Turning off the AC can actually decrease mileage at higher speeds as the
aerodynamics change with the windows down. Older cars needed a lot of
power to drive the compressor, but today, it makes little difference.

A light foot certainly helps and I agree that we all can improve if we
want to.

Do you think driving 55 MPH instead of, say, 65 or 70 helps your gas
mileage? I have noticed when I go South (where the roads are 65 or 70 mph)
that I seem to get BETTER gas mileage....

Greetings,

People in the south do get better gas mileage... but it is because they
waste so much less energy breaking for toll booths, sitting in traffic
jams, etc.

Hope this helps,
William

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

Do you think driving 55 MPH instead of, say, 65 or 70 helps your gas
mileage? I have noticed when I go South (where the roads are 65 or 70 mph)
that I seem to get BETTER gas mileage....

I'm working on getting that information with my car. It has a computer that
gives "instant mile per gallon" so I noted the readings on three sections of
highway that I usually drive a 70 mph. Each section is relatively flat for
a long time so the reading is steady. At 70, the readings were 25, 24, 26.
At 65, the readings were 25, 25, 26. I've only been able to get one reading
at 60 and that is the middle one and it was 31.

I'm unable to get the lower reading yet as I'd be run over in the morning
driving that slow. I was quite startled to see the 31 mpg and I will repeat
it so verify it. At 70 mph, my engine is running at 2,000 rpm. This was
all done on cruise control so as to remove the human factor.

The readout is also a whole number and I don't know how the computer rounds
off. While it reads 25, the actual number may vary from 24.51 to 25.49.
Considering that temperature, more or less weight in the car can also be a
factor, that is close enough to see a big trend. Every car will vary a bit
between speeds depending on gearing. I have two cars that run 2,000 rpm at
70 mph. I drove a smaller rental car on a trip and at that speed it was
running 2500. My thought was it was a nice car, but I'd not expect the
engine to last as long since it had to crank out an extra 500 turns for each
mile driven and I keep cars for 150,000 miles or so. That could be an extra
75 million revolutions.

Gee, GH, how noble and neighborly of you to tell a stranger on the
internet to STFU.

First of all, it's a matter of degree. If you have ten people in a
large car, that makes sense. Some of us are more a part of the problem
than others.

Secondly, if you use more fuel, you drive the price up for everyone,
not just for you. But that's the price we all pay for using resources.
In talking to the person in the Escalade, I wasn't complaining, only
pointing out where the high prices come from. It's not like some space
alien landed and raised all the prices.

And third, yes, I take public transit to work.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote

I'm working on getting that information with my car. It has a computer
that gives "instant mile per gallon" so I noted the readings on three
sections of highway that I usually drive a 70 mph. Each section is
relatively flat for a long time so the reading is steady. At 70, the
readings were 25, 24, 26. At 65, the readings were 25, 25, 26. I've only
been able to get one reading at 60 and that is the middle one and it was
31.

SNIP

So cruising speed doesn't really have a lot to do with gas mileage (in your
opinion....O.K., mine too).

I think it's more driving habits and upkeep.

Shaun Eli wrote:


And third, yes, I take public transit to work.


Then you should STFU because you're not paying for gasoline.

wrote:



Greetings,

People in the south do get better gas mileage... but it is because they
waste so much less energy breaking for toll booths, sitting in traffic
jams, etc.


What a dumb ass theory. You've never driven in or around Atlanta.

Again a brilliant comment, GH.

First of all, people have a right to voice opinions. Last I checked
this was still the U.S.A.

Secondly, I have a car that I do use, just not to drive to work. I
wasn't the one who first raised the issue of public transit.

Thirdly, if you read what has already been previously stated, the more
energy that gets used the more expensive it gets for everybody, so even
if I didn't have a car, I still buy products delivered by truck, I
still heat my house, I still buy things made of petroleum products,
etc.

But judging from a random assortment of your more than one thousand
usenet postings, it's clear to me that you're more interested in
calling people names than in either helping to solve problems or having
a discussion of issues.

Shaun Eli wrote:
Again a brilliant comment, GH.

First of all, people have a right to voice opinions. Last I checked
this was still the U.S.A.

Okay, you're an ass that likes to hear himself talk.


Secondly, I have a car that I do use, just not to drive to work. I
wasn't the one who first raised the issue of public transit.

Thirdly, if you read what has already been previously stated, the more
energy that gets used the more expensive it gets for everybody, so even
if I didn't have a car, I still buy products delivered by truck, I
still heat my house, I still buy things made of petroleum products,
etc.

But judging from a random assortment of your more than one thousand
usenet postings, it's clear to me that you're more interested in
calling people names than in either helping to solve problems or having
a discussion of issues.


If you don't like it, there are choices. Regardless of the one you
choose, STFU.

"G Henslee" wrote in message
People in the south do get better gas mileage... but it is because they
waste so much less energy breaking for toll booths, sitting in traffic
jams, etc.


What a dumb ass theory. You've never driven in or around Atlanta.

To generalize like that is dumb, but tolls booths do take up a lot of gas.
EZ Pass helps a lot. When we had tolls in CT, I recall sitting in traffic
for some long periods of time due to congestion.

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

So cruising speed doesn't really have a lot to do with gas mileage (in
your opinion....O.K., mine too).

I think it's more driving habits and upkeep.

Depends. At about 60, the wind resistance come more into play that road
resistance. Cars today are much more aerodynamic. I'm not done with my
"testing" yet so I'm not going to draw a complete conclusion. Again, what
my model car does is not necessarily the same as another due to differences
in gearing and engine size. So far, the difference between 65 and 70 is
negligible.

Hey HG,

I love boycotts when they make since. We need to all plan trips to the
store better, takes a few less longs trips and keep our cars, trucks,
vans and SUV's tuned-up, clean air filters and an oil and transmission
additives like AMSoil, synthetic oil or QMI etc.

SUV's get a bit hit today from everything from running people over,
gobbling up too much gas, or voting for the wrong candidate.

Have you seen the latest headlines:
Florida: SUV survives fire
Texas: SUV runs over 4 people
California: SUV causes major traffic jam
Oregon: SUV causes major power failure

I AM TIRED OF PEOPLE SLAMMING SUV's! I have a Ford F150 that gets 16-17
mpg. I usually drive it alone everywhere. No one ever questions a man
and his truck that sucks gas as well as any SUV. Don't mess with a guy
and his beloved truck. Yet who drives most SUV's? Mom's that shuttle
kids to school, sports events, and trips. I wishj they would quit
slamming the Mama. At least she is not driving those old ugly station
wagons!

Thanks,

Sozoman

====================
Hurricane Guy wrote:
Help Dubya save gas, don't buy anything from Exxon-Mobil! Pass this on
to everyone.

I totally agree with George Bush that we should all save gas and oil.

I think we should first save Exxon-Mobil gas since it's the largest oil
company and has the most to save right?
Let's show George just how much we can save just for him!

We all have to have gas, but we don't have to have ExxonMobil gas!

So if everyone will please purchase their fuel and oil from any other
company except for Exxon-Mobil, look how much Americans can save for
George. It's the least we can do for the depressed Oil Industry. Of
course this has nothing to do with the PRICE GOUGING BY MAJOR OIL
COMPANIES and the OIL COMPANY'S MONOPOLY

http://foxfiretechnology.com

"Sozoman" wrote in message

I AM TIRED OF PEOPLE SLAMMING SUV's! I have a Ford F150 that gets 16-17
mpg. I usually drive it alone everywhere. No one ever questions a man
and his truck that sucks gas as well as any SUV. Don't mess with a guy
and his beloved truck. Yet who drives most SUV's? Mom's that shuttle
kids to school, sports events, and trips.

Perception is much of the battle. Many pickups are used as real life
working tools. Most are not. The perception, though, is that the guy has a
legitimate reason to drive his truck.

Many SUV's really do transport a bunch of kids to school. Most don't. The
perception is one little woman going to the grocery store for a loaf of
bread.

The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. The arguments for safety, better
handling on secondary roads, etc, just don't measure up either. Very few 4
x 4's ever go off road.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

....
The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. ...

The reality is it's not for you to choose/decree...

Duane Bozarth wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

...

The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. ...


The reality is it's not for you to choose/decree...

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

George wrote:

Duane Bozarth wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

...

The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. ...


The reality is it's not for you to choose/decree...

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me...

Point is, it ain't my job (nor yours) to say.

UPDATE:

The Bush family depends on a certain type of mentality to exist or they
couldn't survive the way they do. The point was to make the ExxonMobil
stores less profitable. If the stores remain open they would cause a
huge drain on the company times the number of stores would make a
significant impact and yes they would take notice. They will pay an
ungodly price for P.R. work to show the public that they are rolling in
tall cotton even when their in poison ivy. They are not as stupid as
the people on the other side. They would hurt and they would suffer
because these people are used to getting ever blood sucking penny from
us and when they don't, they get infuriated. I have lots of experience
with all of the big oil companies and big corporations. The real point
is, not to close them down, but to show them an intelligent show of
force which in your mind, is an impossibility. I know you are wrong, I
think the apple is right to pick and it's time to shake the tree. See
the real problem is just like with Saddam Hussein, one has to ask how
can one man, no brighter than Saddam, and no brighter than the Bush
family, position themselves in a position to control the masses of
people like they have. The answer seems to be "the collective
mentality" of the people v. the collective mentality of the other side,
the elite's, the corporations, the institutions the government. See
we have brilliant people on our side of the line but they have all been
given a task to keep their minds occupied and off the important things
like democracy. Democracy has been stolen from us and nobody has even
noticed, they have been too busy following the leader. When people are
busy working they have no time for problems, raise the price of fuel
and nobody has time to think or research it, they take the easy excuse
given to them: supply and demand. Then there are those who have plenty
of time on their hands and still can't see the light.

We can see the reason Bush was able to stage his own terrorist attack
on 911 and then switch labels from "War on Terror" (his perceived
threat), to "War against Iraq". He practically telegraphed Osama Bin
Laden a message so he didn't get hurt in his escape, then went in and
bombed the hell out of some remote, vacant, uninhabited, mountains as a
way of proving his manhood to the American people, something he
couldn't do in the guard under daddy's protection. Next he again
changed the agenda completely to a non-threat country, IRAQ, for the
benefit of old Mom and Dads who f...d up the job the first time. Then
he concocted the excuse to escalate oil prices and the people still
don't get it and don't want to get it. The incidental disasters like
Katrina, brought on by mans abuse and lack of regard for Nature, are
just frosting on his cake. Him and his friends profit going and coming,
up or down, good times or bad. It was called "the new world order" and
"global governance" by old daddy Bush 41. Now its a perceived threat
and shortage.

Some of the less fortunate people can't see it today, they still think
"Supply and demand" is a real and viable excuse but it's not when you
apply the same excuse to other areas equally. It's strange because
when someone takes the time to think about it, supply and demand
doesn't work for wage earners, it only works on the corporate side of
the line with their profits margin. On the working poor side of the
line, the same action is called "price gouging" when a working man asks
for a fair wage, it's called gouging and the corporation is allowed to
outsource his work. If his wage is converted to gallons of gas one can
see the lop-sided-ness. It just depends on the pocket it's going into
and some people just refuse to see it and admit it.

No one can change the behavior of a large corporation if one already
has a defeatus mentality. There is no modern example of anything like
this because the people are so confused and scrambled but the
government and it's corporate buddies know exactly what to do, run over
the American people and keep them busy, and get all you can get. You
present a good example of how this is achieved without anyone so much
as lifting a hand against them. All I can say is hopefully people will
catch on and if they don't, no matter. Just so they don't interfere
because they already feel defeated.

Now for those who feel saving fuel is going to decrease the price of
gas, dream on. If they don't sell the fuel here, they will sell it
elsewhere but they don't get as much elsewhere. I live in Las Vegas
where water is in short supply due to over development. They said the
same thing about water as gas, you residents are evil people for using
so much water. So people conserved and cut back. This made it easier
for the developers to develop more and more. The elite's never
participated and never cut back, all their water falls and streams were
what made them important and stand out from the rest. Only the working
class people bought the phony guilt trip and changed to the elite could
waste more.

People had better get wise to politics, it's corrupt and dirty and
getting dirtier by the minute. The American corporations are just
another branch, another arm of the government just like NASA and NOAA
and FEMA, DOE and all the rest. You and I and the rest of American
people are the minorities now, our vote doesn't count if you haven't
noticed. If we just happened to vote for the guy that won the election,
we think the system worked but it didn't. Ever wonder how much gas we'd
save by getting our asses out of the Iraq war? Or are you one of the
few believers in the Iraq war? How about making all "Federal
Employees" walk or ride a bike to work, move closer to work after all
because they will be there for the rest of their life. Especially the
IRS, it may put them in a better mood. How about boycotting the junk
cars and trucks that Detroit produces that are now deemed to be "Gas
Guzzling Junk". You think its real supply and demand? Why was that
junk car designed and built in the first place, and why is it now
deemed as gas guzzling junk, can it one day be worth forty thousand
dollars and no more than a couple years later we are guilty for buying
the damned piece of crap. If it's junk, and I cannot agree more that it
is, then Detroit should be forced to recall them and replace them free
of charge with a worthy car.

Now you probably think that purchasing a hybrid car will make you a
hero of sorts, but far from it. It takes a lot of energy to build a car
from scratch whether you drive it or not. Plus they lied to everyone
about most of the hybrids. See most of them take a big expensive
special battery. As soon as one changes title into their name, it
becomes extremely hazardous waste. When it is no longer functional, you
will have to buy a new battery plus pay again to get rid of the old
one. It's insanity to think a person can trade in your old 2005 gas
guzzling junkard for a new hybrid and save gas and energy, just add up
the build process or use the sticker price for calculation. That is an
absurd fantasy. And then if you didn't take the loss of your junkard
by scrapping it out, and you instead traded or sold it, you are still
contributing to keeping the Junk Guzzler in service and sucking gas
because it's still out on the road. Now, there are two cars out there
rather than the one gas guzzler so explain how this saved any gas and
did the world a big favor?

See the real solution is really very simple, so simple that anyone,
even you can do this. You yourself can put together a retrofit kit to
replace your present gas engine and transmission and brake system, with
a new, off the shelf, nothing special, diesel engine of your choice of
horse power with a matching generator (called a Diesel Generator Set
like a welding machine or train power unit), replacing the complete
engine-transmission-driveline-differential and brake assemblies in your
present car with a new bio diesel, motor generator set which runs at an
efficient constant speed except at idle. You wouldn't have to scrap out
your other wise junkard, and you would wind up with a real retro fit
hybrid at a small percentage of the cost of a new car. In place of your
brake system you would replace them with 2 or 4 "wheel motors" which
ever you choose. If you selected 4 you would have an "all wheel drive".
Wheel motors are electric motors designed to fit on the spindles and
inside the wheels. They are as easy to replace as changing a tire. Your
vehicle drive can be virtually overhauled or replaced very simply. The
wheel motors have brakes built in but even better, they have
regenerative braking (They turn into generators rather than motors on
deceleration and breaking) so by releasing the throttle, it first
begins slowing you down buy recharging a capacitor, not a battery. A
capacitor is much cheaper, non hazardous waste, and quick to charge and
discharge on demand unlike a battery. Now this isn't rocket science,
all these items can be purchased off the shelf today and you can do it
yourself, or pay some one, or even start a business doing it for
everyone. I feel that Detroit should have to build these retrofit kits
and do the retrofit free of charge because they and the Federal
Government have scammed all Americans for many years now. By the way I
don't know if you know what bio-diesel is but it's corn oil, cotton
seed oil, replenishable oils etc. that can be produced by American
farmers and used in place of fossil diesel fuel. (check it out on the
internet as well as "wheel motors". Stepping motors.) We would have
never had to be dependent on fossilized oil if we had true leadership.
We are dependent because our leadership has failed us for many years
and wanted us dependent so the money would flow to certain corporations
of their choice and not to the working man or the American farmer. See
the farmer has to be under some perceived threat as well or he won't
sell his land to the real-estate developers so more and more people can
come here to exploit America. Wouldn't you rather buy your fuel from a
deserving American farmer rather than some big huge oil conglomerates
that's in bed with the auto companies and our leaders and leaders of
other countries? I surely would, even if I have to pay the same or
more for the fuel I would at least know where my money was going and we
wouldn't have to have these phony "Wars over Oil" killing our children
like Iraq. Notice it is "our children" the spoiled Bush Children are
not expected to pay their fair shares.

Now if you think what I'm telling you is far fetched or for some reason
not true, look at the common diesel locomotives on the railroad that
have run on the same concept for many years now very successfully
except they haven't switched to bio-diesel for political reasons.
Let's say we take the semi truck trailer which happens to be a perfect
candidate for this bio diesel generator modification. Why? well you
already have the diesel engine, you add a generator or two, wheel
driver motors all the way around (10), on the tractor and trailer so
now you have an 18 wheel drive system when you need it. (with low
maintenance and easy replacement) The beauty of this concept for
commercial vehicles is that a master computer (easy replaceable)
controls the speed of all wheels at all times unless the motor is out
of service which it can be. In a high speed turn for instance, all
wheels will turn at their appropriate speed preventing jackknifes,
skids and accidents in general. How long are we going to drive the same
old cast iron heavy junk before someone brings it up to the 21 century
technology? Again compare this to space travel, do you see the
inequity?

The word "no" and "impossible" are not in my vocabulary. If we can
spend trillions on space travel, we can improve our own country, our
leadership and our transportation without fear of ridicule and
negativity. Agreed? What say you?

Thanks, and good luck.

Hurricane Guy.

SUV's

Everyone should quit beating each other up over buying SUV's, it was a
viable option not long ago. Nothing has changed except for blaim. You
didn't build it, I didn't build, Detroit built it and they should have
to recall it or convert it to a bio-diesel with wheelmotors as I
explained in my other posting. Every car and truck can be converted but
who should pay? I say Detroit.

Has anyone thought of what to do with the one traded in? Someone will
be driving it unless you plan on scrapping it to the scrap metal yard
in which case you will take a big loss. I suggest the conversion to
bio-diesel-electric- capacitor not battery. There will be a
conventional battery for starting but that capacitors will do the rest.

*YAWN*


"Hurricane Guy" wrote in message
oups.com...

UPDATE:

The Bush family depends on a certain type of mentality to exist or they
couldn't survive the way they do. The point was to make the ExxonMobil
stores less profitable. If the stores remain open they would cause a
huge drain on the company times the number of stores would make a
significant impact and yes they would take notice. They will pay an
ungodly price for P.R. work to show the public that they are rolling in
tall cotton even when their in poison ivy. They are not as stupid as
the people on the other side. They would hurt and they would suffer
because these people are used to getting ever blood sucking penny from
us and when they don't, they get infuriated. I have lots of experience
with all of the big oil companies and big corporations. The real point
is, not to close them down, but to show them an intelligent show of
force which in your mind, is an impossibility. I know you are wrong, I
think the apple is right to pick and it's time to shake the tree. See
the real problem is just like with Saddam Hussein, one has to ask how
can one man, no brighter than Saddam, and no brighter than the Bush
family, position themselves in a position to control the masses of
people like they have. The answer seems to be "the collective
mentality" of the people v. the collective mentality of the other side,
the elite's, the corporations, the institutions the government. See
we have brilliant people on our side of the line but they have all been
given a task to keep their minds occupied and off the important things
like democracy. Democracy has been stolen from us and nobody has even
noticed, they have been too busy following the leader. When people are
busy working they have no time for problems, raise the price of fuel
and nobody has time to think or research it, they take the easy excuse
given to them: supply and demand. Then there are those who have plenty
of time on their hands and still can't see the light.

We can see the reason Bush was able to stage his own terrorist attack
on 911 and then switch labels from "War on Terror" (his perceived
threat), to "War against Iraq". He practically telegraphed Osama Bin
Laden a message so he didn't get hurt in his escape, then went in and
bombed the hell out of some remote, vacant, uninhabited, mountains as a
way of proving his manhood to the American people, something he
couldn't do in the guard under daddy's protection. Next he again
changed the agenda completely to a non-threat country, IRAQ, for the
benefit of old Mom and Dads who f...d up the job the first time. Then
he concocted the excuse to escalate oil prices and the people still
don't get it and don't want to get it. The incidental disasters like
Katrina, brought on by mans abuse and lack of regard for Nature, are
just frosting on his cake. Him and his friends profit going and coming,
up or down, good times or bad. It was called "the new world order" and
"global governance" by old daddy Bush 41. Now its a perceived threat
and shortage.

Some of the less fortunate people can't see it today, they still think
"Supply and demand" is a real and viable excuse but it's not when you
apply the same excuse to other areas equally. It's strange because
when someone takes the time to think about it, supply and demand
doesn't work for wage earners, it only works on the corporate side of
the line with their profits margin. On the working poor side of the
line, the same action is called "price gouging" when a working man asks
for a fair wage, it's called gouging and the corporation is allowed to
outsource his work. If his wage is converted to gallons of gas one can
see the lop-sided-ness. It just depends on the pocket it's going into
and some people just refuse to see it and admit it.

No one can change the behavior of a large corporation if one already
has a defeatus mentality. There is no modern example of anything like
this because the people are so confused and scrambled but the
government and it's corporate buddies know exactly what to do, run over
the American people and keep them busy, and get all you can get. You
present a good example of how this is achieved without anyone so much
as lifting a hand against them. All I can say is hopefully people will
catch on and if they don't, no matter. Just so they don't interfere
because they already feel defeated.

Now for those who feel saving fuel is going to decrease the price of
gas, dream on. If they don't sell the fuel here, they will sell it
elsewhere but they don't get as much elsewhere. I live in Las Vegas
where water is in short supply due to over development. They said the
same thing about water as gas, you residents are evil people for using
so much water. So people conserved and cut back. This made it easier
for the developers to develop more and more. The elite's never
participated and never cut back, all their water falls and streams were
what made them important and stand out from the rest. Only the working
class people bought the phony guilt trip and changed to the elite could
waste more.

People had better get wise to politics, it's corrupt and dirty and
getting dirtier by the minute. The American corporations are just
another branch, another arm of the government just like NASA and NOAA
and FEMA, DOE and all the rest. You and I and the rest of American
people are the minorities now, our vote doesn't count if you haven't
noticed. If we just happened to vote for the guy that won the election,
we think the system worked but it didn't. Ever wonder how much gas we'd
save by getting our asses out of the Iraq war? Or are you one of the
few believers in the Iraq war? How about making all "Federal
Employees" walk or ride a bike to work, move closer to work after all
because they will be there for the rest of their life. Especially the
IRS, it may put them in a better mood. How about boycotting the junk
cars and trucks that Detroit produces that are now deemed to be "Gas
Guzzling Junk". You think its real supply and demand? Why was that
junk car designed and built in the first place, and why is it now
deemed as gas guzzling junk, can it one day be worth forty thousand
dollars and no more than a couple years later we are guilty for buying
the damned piece of crap. If it's junk, and I cannot agree more that it
is, then Detroit should be forced to recall them and replace them free
of charge with a worthy car.

Now you probably think that purchasing a hybrid car will make you a
hero of sorts, but far from it. It takes a lot of energy to build a car
from scratch whether you drive it or not. Plus they lied to everyone
about most of the hybrids. See most of them take a big expensive
special battery. As soon as one changes title into their name, it
becomes extremely hazardous waste. When it is no longer functional, you
will have to buy a new battery plus pay again to get rid of the old
one. It's insanity to think a person can trade in your old 2005 gas
guzzling junkard for a new hybrid and save gas and energy, just add up
the build process or use the sticker price for calculation. That is an
absurd fantasy. And then if you didn't take the loss of your junkard
by scrapping it out, and you instead traded or sold it, you are still
contributing to keeping the Junk Guzzler in service and sucking gas
because it's still out on the road. Now, there are two cars out there
rather than the one gas guzzler so explain how this saved any gas and
did the world a big favor?

See the real solution is really very simple, so simple that anyone,
even you can do this. You yourself can put together a retrofit kit to
replace your present gas engine and transmission and brake system, with
a new, off the shelf, nothing special, diesel engine of your choice of
horse power with a matching generator (called a Diesel Generator Set
like a welding machine or train power unit), replacing the complete
engine-transmission-driveline-differential and brake assemblies in your
present car with a new bio diesel, motor generator set which runs at an
efficient constant speed except at idle. You wouldn't have to scrap out
your other wise junkard, and you would wind up with a real retro fit
hybrid at a small percentage of the cost of a new car. In place of your
brake system you would replace them with 2 or 4 "wheel motors" which
ever you choose. If you selected 4 you would have an "all wheel drive".
Wheel motors are electric motors designed to fit on the spindles and
inside the wheels. They are as easy to replace as changing a tire. Your
vehicle drive can be virtually overhauled or replaced very simply. The
wheel motors have brakes built in but even better, they have
regenerative braking (They turn into generators rather than motors on
deceleration and breaking) so by releasing the throttle, it first
begins slowing you down buy recharging a capacitor, not a battery. A
capacitor is much cheaper, non hazardous waste, and quick to charge and
discharge on demand unlike a battery. Now this isn't rocket science,
all these items can be purchased off the shelf today and you can do it
yourself, or pay some one, or even start a business doing it for
everyone. I feel that Detroit should have to build these retrofit kits
and do the retrofit free of charge because they and the Federal
Government have scammed all Americans for many years now. By the way I
don't know if you know what bio-diesel is but it's corn oil, cotton
seed oil, replenishable oils etc. that can be produced by American
farmers and used in place of fossil diesel fuel. (check it out on the
internet as well as "wheel motors". Stepping motors.) We would have
never had to be dependent on fossilized oil if we had true leadership.
We are dependent because our leadership has failed us for many years
and wanted us dependent so the money would flow to certain corporations
of their choice and not to the working man or the American farmer. See
the farmer has to be under some perceived threat as well or he won't
sell his land to the real-estate developers so more and more people can
come here to exploit America. Wouldn't you rather buy your fuel from a
deserving American farmer rather than some big huge oil conglomerates
that's in bed with the auto companies and our leaders and leaders of
other countries? I surely would, even if I have to pay the same or
more for the fuel I would at least know where my money was going and we
wouldn't have to have these phony "Wars over Oil" killing our children
like Iraq. Notice it is "our children" the spoiled Bush Children are
not expected to pay their fair shares.

Now if you think what I'm telling you is far fetched or for some reason
not true, look at the common diesel locomotives on the railroad that
have run on the same concept for many years now very successfully
except they haven't switched to bio-diesel for political reasons.
Let's say we take the semi truck trailer which happens to be a perfect
candidate for this bio diesel generator modification. Why? well you
already have the diesel engine, you add a generator or two, wheel
driver motors all the way around (10), on the tractor and trailer so
now you have an 18 wheel drive system when you need it. (with low
maintenance and easy replacement) The beauty of this concept for
commercial vehicles is that a master computer (easy replaceable)
controls the speed of all wheels at all times unless the motor is out
of service which it can be. In a high speed turn for instance, all
wheels will turn at their appropriate speed preventing jackknifes,
skids and accidents in general. How long are we going to drive the same
old cast iron heavy junk before someone brings it up to the 21 century
technology? Again compare this to space travel, do you see the
inequity?

The word "no" and "impossible" are not in my vocabulary. If we can
spend trillions on space travel, we can improve our own country, our
leadership and our transportation without fear of ridicule and
negativity. Agreed? What say you?

Thanks, and good luck.

Hurricane Guy.

George wrote:
Duane Bozarth wrote:

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

...

The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller
vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. ...



The reality is it's not for you to choose/decree...


Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

Now they're 'giant' vehicles? LOL I'm one of them. But, I have MY
reasons. FU

Dr. Hardcrab wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
. ..

"k" wrote in message

And turn the A/C off, then drive like it costs a lot. Most anyone can
improve their own mileage, no matter what their own starting point is.

Turning off the AC can actually decrease mileage at higher speeds as the
aerodynamics change with the windows down. Older cars needed a lot of
power to drive the compressor, but today, it makes little difference.

A light foot certainly helps and I agree that we all can improve if we
want to.


Do you think driving 55 MPH instead of, say, 65 or 70 helps your gas
mileage? I have noticed when I go South (where the roads are 65 or 70 mph)
that I seem to get BETTER gas mileage....



According the the guys at Car Talk, you get something like 50% better
gas mileage at 55 than you do at 70 mph. Wind resistance, aerodynamics,
and all that.

A

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

"I want to" is a perfectly good reason.

George wrote:
Duane Bozarth wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

...

The reality is that 95% of us can get away with a much smaller vehicle that
gets better mileage, but we just don't. ...


The reality is it's not for you to choose/decree...

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

Since when is "need" required to exercise freedom of choice?

I would love the oppurtunity to run over 2 or 3 idjuits like Eli with my
Navigator.

I would love the opportunity to sleep with more SUV owners' wives than
I already do. I only have so much semen to offer.

Interesting, it seems the general consensus, at least of this group, is
that the government is right, you should save gas by cutting down on
your recreation and working more and you folks think that makes sense.
Could this be why this country is in the fix it's in?

I fully agree that gouging, er "supply and demand" is an acceptable
practice to pull over on on you all. End the boycott today!

You convinced me, I agree and you are right. end the Boycott now,
however short lived it was and raise the gas prices today. It's
beginning to make sense, in fact if it will keep your type off the road
and inside where others are safe, it is a factor I admit I just had
not considered. $10 $20 per gallon is cheap compared to the
alternative.

Rather than institutionalize you people and pay for your food, housing,
and nurses to wipe your A.....s , raising the gas prices is a far
better way to keep them off the streets and in their own homes. One can
now justify the price by saying "it's almost like buying insurance
against "stupidity" - can you imagine how much safer the roads will be
now? Traffic will be less and 90% of this "your type" of people will be
off the road and staying in your house rather than out messing up my
vacation.

This is a brilliant idea, raising gas prices! I wish I would have
thought of it. I don't know why I couldn't see what Bush was doing for
us. He's such a nice man, that Bush fellow. And as it turns out,
Cheney and Haliburton were actually looking out for us all that time.

I feel like such a fool now, Thank you for setting me straight ..... is
it Dr. Hardcrab?

Please keep saving gas until the price goes down. No wonder you are a
Doctor, you are so smart . . .

Bye now

Goedjn wrote:

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

"I want to" is a perfectly good reason.

That's nice. What if your neighbor "wanted to" sleep with your wife?
I suppose it's cool if he does it then?

Since when is "need" required to exercise freedom of choice?

Look, we're at war. We all have to make sacrifices. That means not
driving your SUV.

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

"I want to" is a perfectly good reason.

That's nice. What if your neighbor "wanted to" sleep with your wife?
I suppose it's cool if he does it then?


He can WANT to all he wants.

wrote:


Since when is "need" required to exercise freedom of choice?

Look, we're at war. We all have to make sacrifices. That means not
driving your SUV.

I was unaware there was a problem getting enough fuel in the Middle
East????

Goedjn wrote:

Seems to have struck a nerve? There are lots of people driving giant
vehicles for no good reason.

"I want to" is a perfectly good reason.

That's nice. What if your neighbor "wanted to" sleep with your wife?
I suppose it's cool if he does it then?


He can WANT to all he wants.

And some people get what they want. Someone make be taking your wife
willingly for all you know. Do you think your wife would admit it to
you? After all, I make a hobby out of doing that, and the vast
majority of those wives are, beknownst to me, married to SUV owners.
Must be the demographic...conservative, Christian (acting), etc.