I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook up to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do. What say
you?

On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 00:44:12 +0000, RMeyer1 wrote:

I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook
up to my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4"
collector pan that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to
block off air entry into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not
work unless I do. What say you?

Yup, and any other openings. This is what duct tape and that foam in a
bottle was made for :-)

-Doug

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

You can partially block the back. On my Delta, I cut a piece of `1/4"
plywood and made notches for the belt and motor bracket. It is leld on with
a couple of screws and four rare earth magnets. The top couple of inches is
open.

While you want to block off some of the openings, you still need air flow
for the DC to suck anything through it.

I have been pondering the same problem for a year now, and have decided to
do nothing.
Table saw dust is heavy enough that it just falls to the floor without
creating too much mess, so I don't think it is worth the effort. You will
have to get the saw almost airtight to be effective, and even then 75% will
be thrown forward by the blade. The only real solution is a over the blade
hood, and I can't justify that.

RMeyer1 wrote:
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook up to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do. What
say you?

I have a similar situation: a Ridgid contractor's saw and a Penn State DC.
Blocking it off will make it more effective but what is really the cat's meow is
to add an overhead guard. I've got Penn State's version but Excalibur makes one
also. You would not believe how little gets away now. If I had done this
earlier, I could have saved the money of an air cleaner (which is hanging from
the ceiling and is seldom needed).

If you don't have a cyclone yet be sure to add one. For the relatively few
bucks it costs, you'll save your impellor blades on the DC from wood chips.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

I have a Delta CS, and the 2 HP Horrible frieght dust collector. I have
tried it both ways using a 4" hose and decided there was not a noticable
differance.
A overarm collector in addition to the under the table collection would be
best.
Greg

On Sun 28 Nov 2004 08:13:55p, "Greg O" wrote
in :

I have a Delta CS, and the 2 HP Horrible frieght dust collector. I
have tried it both ways using a 4" hose and decided there was not a
noticable differance.
A overarm collector in addition to the under the table collection
would be best.
Greg


I have the same dc on a Griz 1022. The standard tablesaw dust hood i got
with a kit was too small so I made a plate out of some scrap wall
paneling that would accept it, ductaped the whole thing to the underside
of the saw, and taped a flexible 4'' metal dryer hose to it and taped the
other end to the saw frame. The DC hose fits over that. First I tried it
without blocking off anything on the saw.

It worked so well I didn't bother blocking anything else off. There's a
solid, feelable airflow into the saw from every opening. Above the zero
clearance insert, there's some dust. Everything I read says I won't be
able to suck it all in from the bottom. First project of spring will be
an overarm guard with dust collection. Maybe then I'll also block off
some of that big space at the motor. But like the guy said, if you block
it ALL off, it won't suck.

But in my opinion just putting a dust collection hood underneath the saw
will take care of 98% of your dust, as long as you've got something
stronger than a shop vac on it. Then you can work on upping your effect.
:-)

"Dan" wrote in message
.. .

But in my opinion just putting a dust collection hood underneath the saw
will take care of 98% of your dust, as long as you've got something
stronger than a shop vac on it.

On my saw, much more than 2% of the dust is on the top of the saw, since I
started using zero clearance inserts. In fact, I would say that 25-50% of
the dust is above the table. I built a separate pickup to handle that.

Bob

I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom, which just closes the bottom
of the saw cabinet, the back is wide open and it collects about 99% of the
dust. Look on your floor and I bet you will notice that very little dust
goes out the back now. Run the blade a tad high, I was taught years ago to
have the teeth hitting the wood at about 45 degrees, and there is very
little thrown forward of the top of the wood. If I set it to where the
blade just clears the wood there is considerably more thrown forward.

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

aah, interesting point

some say to keep the blade "just above" the surface as a safety
precaution; but this pt of view is interesting..


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 07:38:43 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom, which just closes the bottom
of the saw cabinet, the back is wide open and it collects about 99% of the
dust. Look on your floor and I bet you will notice that very little dust
goes out the back now. Run the blade a tad high, I was taught years ago to
have the teeth hitting the wood at about 45 degrees, and there is very
little thrown forward of the top of the wood. If I set it to where the
blade just clears the wood there is considerably more thrown forward.

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

"Bill B" wrote in message ...
I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom,

Does Ridgid make a dust collector specifically for the 3650 contractor
saw? DId you get it from HD, or where?

It's just a generic plastic pan that should fit most any saw. At HD.

"Tim" wrote in message
m...
"Bill B" wrote in message
...
I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom,

Does Ridgid make a dust collector specifically for the 3650 contractor
saw? DId you get it from HD, or where?

The shop teacher, high school, many, many years ago, insisted that having
the blade high reduced kickbacks as his claim was the teeth were moving at a
more downwards angle when they hit the wood, instead of trying to push the
wood back at you. It's always worked for me.

wrote in message
...
aah, interesting point

some say to keep the blade "just above" the surface as a safety
precaution; but this pt of view is interesting..


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 07:38:43 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom, which just closes the
bottom
of the saw cabinet, the back is wide open and it collects about 99% of the
dust. Look on your floor and I bet you will notice that very little dust
goes out the back now. Run the blade a tad high, I was taught years ago
to
have the teeth hitting the wood at about 45 degrees, and there is very
little thrown forward of the top of the wood. If I set it to where the
blade just clears the wood there is considerably more thrown forward.

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook
up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

On Mon 29 Nov 2004 12:04:25a, "Bob"
wrote in ink.net:

On my saw, much more than 2% of the dust is on the top of the saw,
since I started using zero clearance inserts. In fact, I would say
that 25-50% of the dust is above the table. I built a separate pickup
to handle that.

Wow. I guess I should have qualified it a bit. :-)
But I really don't get much dust up there, except when I'm actually shaving
less than a bladewidth off a piece.

Wonder what the difference is. Blade, maybe? I'm using a Forrest or a
Freud. Or maybe I'm getting more suction off that HFDC than I thought.

On Sun 28 Nov 2004 09:44:50p, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in
. com:

Try it and you may be surprised. No, you don't want the saw airtight.
If it was, how would the DC get enough air to draw the dust? Yes, an
over the blade hood would be nice too, but I only clean up under my
saw maybe every two or three months now.

What struck me most was that the dust cloud was gone. I was going to just
get one of those canvas bag things when simultaneously I had an extra
hundred bucks and Harbor Freight had that DC on sale. With the bag, I think
there'd still be a hanging cloud of dust around the saw, but with the DC,
it's just gone. I can feel the difference when I start a cut and forget to
turn on the DC. Hey, what's all this dust... Oh. Walk over to DC. Click.
There we go.

After the overarm guard, a long ranger might be nice...

Not sure I'd buy this argument for kickback. KB is when the wood
binds at the rear of the blade and is lifted, turned slightly, and
then projected out over the top of the blade. Whether it's high or
low seems to me it's going to KB if the back end of the piece gets
into the line of the blade. High, to me, might even be worse.


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 19:34:35 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

The shop teacher, high school, many, many years ago, insisted that having
the blade high reduced kickbacks as his claim was the teeth were moving at a
more downwards angle when they hit the wood, instead of trying to push the
wood back at you. It's always worked for me.

wrote in message
.. .
aah, interesting point

some say to keep the blade "just above" the surface as a safety
precaution; but this pt of view is interesting..


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 07:38:43 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom, which just closes the
bottom
of the saw cabinet, the back is wide open and it collects about 99% of the
dust. Look on your floor and I bet you will notice that very little dust
goes out the back now. Run the blade a tad high, I was taught years ago
to
have the teeth hitting the wood at about 45 degrees, and there is very
little thrown forward of the top of the wood. If I set it to where the
blade just clears the wood there is considerably more thrown forward.

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook
up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 00:02:10 -0700,
wrote:

logic (not usually applied to my thoughts) would say that a higher
blade that had more teeth moving downwards in front would also have
more teeth moving UP in back, right?

Not sure I'd buy this argument for kickback. KB is when the wood
binds at the rear of the blade and is lifted, turned slightly, and
then projected out over the top of the blade. Whether it's high or
low seems to me it's going to KB if the back end of the piece gets
into the line of the blade. High, to me, might even be worse.


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 19:34:35 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

The shop teacher, high school, many, many years ago, insisted that having
the blade high reduced kickbacks as his claim was the teeth were moving at a
more downwards angle when they hit the wood, instead of trying to push the
wood back at you. It's always worked for me.

wrote in message
. ..
aah, interesting point

some say to keep the blade "just above" the surface as a safety
precaution; but this pt of view is interesting..


On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 07:38:43 -0700, "Bill B"
wrote:

I put the Ridgid dust collector on the bottom, which just closes the
bottom
of the saw cabinet, the back is wide open and it collects about 99% of the
dust. Look on your floor and I bet you will notice that very little dust
goes out the back now. Run the blade a tad high, I was taught years ago
to
have the teeth hitting the wood at about 45 degrees, and there is very
little thrown forward of the top of the wood. If I set it to where the
blade just clears the wood there is considerably more thrown forward.

"RMeyer1" wrote in message
...
I have an old Craftsman 10 inch contractor tablesaw which I want to hook
up
to
my PennState Dust collector 1250CMF. I have a large plastic 4" collector
pan
that will sit under the saw to collect dust. Do I need to block off air
entry
into the open back of the saw? I imagine it will not work unless I do.
What say
you?

sounds good to me ;-)

I can see the argument about having the blade 1/16" above the stock
and more of the force being horizontal rather than vertical. Makes
sense. The cutting would seem to be occuring at a different angle
than if the blade was 1/2" or more above. I've seen WW show demos
where they lift the blade a bit; to presumably get a better cut.
Seems to me we have an interesting theory on our hands. Cut quality
vs safety vs dust expelsion.

mac davis wrote:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 00:02:10 -0700,
wrote:

logic (not usually applied to my thoughts) would say that a higher
blade that had more teeth moving downwards in front would also have
more teeth moving UP in back, right?

I *think* the logic is that, with the blade at just above the level of
the wood, if you "hook" the wood on the back just a little - enough to
lift it like 1/4" - the wood will lift into the horizontally-moving part
of the blade, which will throw the wood at you. If the blade is all the
way up, lifting the piece off the table a little bit won't cause a kickback.

I'm not saying I *buy* that, I'm just explaining the reasoning.

I always liked Kelly Mehler's line on it, which I mentioned the last
time I participated in this thread, in May, 2002 - thread he

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...vel3.net#link1

Mehler's line answers the qeustion "How high above my workpiece should
the sawblade be?" with "How much do you want to cut into your fingers?"

Of course, that's kind of a cute answer for him, since if you're
following his advice, you're using a splitter and a guard, and neither
kickback nor touching your blade should be much of a risk for you. The
most compelling answer I've heard for running the blade high is that
it's supposed to run cooler. In the thread I reference above one poster
claims that the instructions with his Forrest blade said to run it at
full height - I don't recall that with mine, but it's been years since I
read the instructions - if I ever did . I usually shoot for having
the teeth completely clear the workpiece, but I certainly don't know
better than anyone else - and probably worse than many.

-BAT

Have read Mehler's book and also talked w/ him in person at the WW
shows. Yeah, put some kind of splitter in there. Mine is real
simple. I just took a piece of metal, dilled a hole, but a slot and
use the screw that held the blade guard to hold this "splitte". It
sits pretty far back from the blade (more than the 1/4" recommended),
but it's better than nothing, and once the stock passes by it, it's
pretty good at keeping the stock off the back teeth. Actually, by
raising my blade, I can get the blade closer to my splitter ;-)

I guess we could take some styrofoam and test KB with a high vs low
blade??

I still am curious about the DC impacts. Seems to me a higher blade
would throw dust down and into the saw box. The cutting action would
be nearly straight down, wheras a low blade is going to be more
towards the operator. With a high blade, the dust would have to stay
in the gullets all around the blade and get ejected one the teeth
emerge from the saw.

Hmm... next time out, we'll run some experiments.


On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 10:55:41 -0800, "Brett A. Thomas"
wrote:

mac davis wrote:
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 00:02:10 -0700,
wrote:

logic (not usually applied to my thoughts) would say that a higher
blade that had more teeth moving downwards in front would also have
more teeth moving UP in back, right?

I *think* the logic is that, with the blade at just above the level of
the wood, if you "hook" the wood on the back just a little - enough to
lift it like 1/4" - the wood will lift into the horizontally-moving part
of the blade, which will throw the wood at you. If the blade is all the
way up, lifting the piece off the table a little bit won't cause a kickback.

I'm not saying I *buy* that, I'm just explaining the reasoning.

I always liked Kelly Mehler's line on it, which I mentioned the last
time I participated in this thread, in May, 2002 - thread he

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...vel3.net#link1

Mehler's line answers the qeustion "How high above my workpiece should
the sawblade be?" with "How much do you want to cut into your fingers?"

Of course, that's kind of a cute answer for him, since if you're
following his advice, you're using a splitter and a guard, and neither
kickback nor touching your blade should be much of a risk for you. The
most compelling answer I've heard for running the blade high is that
it's supposed to run cooler. In the thread I reference above one poster
claims that the instructions with his Forrest blade said to run it at
full height - I don't recall that with mine, but it's been years since I
read the instructions - if I ever did . I usually shoot for having
the teeth completely clear the workpiece, but I certainly don't know
better than anyone else - and probably worse than many.

-BAT