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#1
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TS keeps popping circuit
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple.
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#2
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. -- Froz.... |
#3
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:45:11 PM UTC-6, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. -- Froz.... It is 12 gauge. |
#4
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 1/3/17 4:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. As others have pointed out, it depends on the gauge of the wire. #12 wire will handle 20amps, but you need to make sure it's #12 all the way to the breaker. With one 15amp breaker for your whole shop, I would be hesitant to put a 20amp breaker in and then run the saw plus a dust collector at the same time. Sounds like a good excuse to run another circuit out there. :-) -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
#5
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 2017-01-03 5:52 PM, Gramps' shop wrote:
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:45:11 PM UTC-6, FrozenNorth wrote: On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. -- Froz.... It is 12 gauge. You should be good then, 10 might be better, depending on many factors I cannot see from here. -- Froz.... |
#6
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
Hey, Froz
Come on over and take a look. Just as cold here in Wisconsin 😀 |
#7
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 2017-01-03 6:31 PM, Gramps' shop wrote:
Hey, Froz Come on over and take a look. Just as cold here in Wisconsin 😀 No passport, I cannot get into the US legally, and it would be a bitch of a drive. :-) -- Froz.... |
#8
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 2:41:23 PM UTC-8, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Maple has sticky sap, and it doesn't improve with heat. Try cleaning the saw blade, maybe applying some wax, and if you have a rip blade, use that instead of a combination. |
#9
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 1/3/2017 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. From a long term prospective, you may wish to consider running a couple of new 20 amp circuits in your basement shop. With a saw motor the circuit usually goes with the initial high amp load when the motor starts. But as said if you are running a dust collection system and some other high load equipment, you may be safer with the higher amp circuits. My work shop (part of my garage) has only one 20 amp circuit. That is the circuit the runs the garage door openner. It is a pain to have to plug my saw into that outlet that is in the ceiling. I hope to add a couple other 20 amp circuits in other areas ie. where I keep my work bench and one to the freezer which is also in the garage. |
#10
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 6:09:36 PM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote:
On 1/3/17 4:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. As others have pointed out, it depends on the gauge of the wire. #12 wire will handle 20amps, but you need to make sure it's #12 all the way to the breaker. With one 15amp breaker for your whole shop, I would be hesitant to put a 20amp breaker in and then run the saw plus a dust collector at the same time. Sounds like a good excuse to run another circuit out there. :-) At least one more. I'd run a separate circuit just for the lights. It sucks having the lights go out at the same time the table saw stops, leaving you in the dark. |
#11
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 17:45:11 -0500, FrozenNorth
wrote: On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. +1 It's essentially the same as sticking a penny in the fuse box. |
#12
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 9:07:34 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 17:45:11 -0500, FrozenNorth wrote: On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. +1 It's essentially the same as sticking a penny in the fuse box. |
#13
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 14:52:47 -0800 (PST), "Gramps' shop"
wrote: On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:45:11 PM UTC-6, FrozenNorth wrote: On 2017-01-03 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Depends on the wire gauge from the panel, if it is 14 forget about it. -- Froz.... It is 12 gauge. Is it 240V? If the outlet the saw is plugged into is the only one on the circuit, it might be really easy to convert it to 240V. That'll help a lot more than going from 15A to 20A. |
#14
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 14:41:17 -0800 (PST), "Gramps' shop"
wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. What gauge extension cord used if any? Switching the circuit breaker at the box to a 20 amp, requires a wire change to 12 gauge. Where is the breaker box, if in the basement run a new 20 amp circuit same cost as changing the wire and breaker. |
#15
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 9:14:15 PM UTC-5, Markem wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 14:41:17 -0800 (PST), "Gramps' shop" wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. What gauge extension cord used if any? Switching the circuit breaker at the box to a 20 amp, requires a wire change to 12 gauge. Where is the breaker box, if in the basement run a new 20 amp circuit same cost as changing the wire and breaker. Of course, all of us who have suggested a new circuit are assuming there is room in the panel. |
#16
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 17:55:32 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote: On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 6:09:36 PM UTC-5, -MIKE- wrote: On 1/3/17 4:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. As others have pointed out, it depends on the gauge of the wire. #12 wire will handle 20amps, but you need to make sure it's #12 all the way to the breaker. With one 15amp breaker for your whole shop, I would be hesitant to put a 20amp breaker in and then run the saw plus a dust collector at the same time. Sounds like a good excuse to run another circuit out there. :-) At least one more. I'd run a separate circuit just for the lights. It sucks having the lights go out at the same time the table saw stops, leaving you in the dark. I wired my shop with outlets on alternating circuits, so I can plug the tool in one outlet and a vac into the adjacent outlet. They're on opposite sides of the box, too. Lighting is also on separate circuits. |
#17
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 20:51:33 -0500, Keith Nuttle
wrote: On 1/3/2017 5:41 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. From a long term prospective, you may wish to consider running a couple of new 20 amp circuits in your basement shop. With a saw motor the circuit usually goes with the initial high amp load when the motor starts. But as said if you are running a dust collection system and some other high load equipment, you may be safer with the higher amp circuits. If you do run new circuits, make 'em 240V. The tools will appreciate it. My work shop (part of my garage) has only one 20 amp circuit. That is the circuit the runs the garage door openner. It is a pain to have to plug my saw into that outlet that is in the ceiling. I hope to add a couple other 20 amp circuits in other areas ie. where I keep my work bench and one to the freezer which is also in the garage. |
#18
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 1/3/2017 9:14 PM, Markem wrote:
What gauge extension cord used if any? From experience that is an interesting question. My table saw requires 20 amps to start the saw with a 1hp motor. There is a short cord on the motor that plugs into the switch at the front of the table. Over the period 40 years the cord from the switch to the wall became damaged, and I had to replace it. I struggled to find the right cord. I finally use a 14 gauge cord. Why because every cord I could find was 14 gauge, and when I went to Menards, Lowes and a couple of other places where there were saws on display with 1 hp motors, they all had 14 gauge wire into the motor. usually just a couple of feet long. We have all been giving advice that focused on the wire gauge and circuit. I don't believe the question was ever asked as to the size of the motor, and the start mechanism, ie capacitor start etc. Both would have bearing in the size of the cord required. Knowing the motor specs, it is possible that the saw is blowing the circuit not because the circuit is inadequate because there is some internal short in the system. If it were me I would check the short possibility before I purchased a new cord or installed additional circuits. (Even though my original post jumped to the circuit solution.) |
#19
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 18:21:47 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote: On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 9:14:15 PM UTC-5, Markem wrote: On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 14:41:17 -0800 (PST), "Gramps' shop" wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. What gauge extension cord used if any? Switching the circuit breaker at the box to a 20 amp, requires a wire change to 12 gauge. Where is the breaker box, if in the basement run a new 20 amp circuit same cost as changing the wire and breaker. Of course, all of us who have suggested a new circuit are assuming there is room in the panel. Even so, there are usually alternatives that aren't too difficult. Single breakers can be replaced with doubles and installing a sub-panel isn't usually all that difficult. If everything is sheetrocked, it'll be harder to run the wires than either solution above. If not, it's all pretty easy. |
#20
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tue, 3 Jan 2017 21:44:21 -0500, Keith Nuttle
wrote: On 1/3/2017 9:14 PM, Markem wrote: What gauge extension cord used if any? From experience that is an interesting question. My table saw requires 20 amps to start the saw with a 1hp motor. There is a short cord on the motor that plugs into the switch at the front of the table. Over the period 40 years the cord from the switch to the wall became damaged, and I had to replace it. I struggled to find the right cord. I finally use a 14 gauge cord. Why because every cord I could find was 14 gauge, and when I went to Menards, Lowes and a couple of other places where there were saws on display with 1 hp motors, they all had 14 gauge wire into the motor. usually just a couple of feet long. I made my own. We have all been giving advice that focused on the wire gauge and circuit. I don't believe the question was ever asked as to the size of the motor, and the start mechanism, ie capacitor start etc. Not really. The OP asked if he could go from a 15A to a 20A breaker. To do that, 12GA wiring is required. It has nothing to do with the motor. Both would have bearing in the size of the cord required. Larger wire is better, sure, but that wasn't what was asked. Knowing the motor specs, it is possible that the saw is blowing the circuit not because the circuit is inadequate because there is some internal short in the system. Or too the saw is too far from the panel. Again, we were asked if the breaker could be increased from 15A to 20A. If it were me I would check the short possibility before I purchased a new cord or installed additional circuits. (Even though my original post jumped to the circuit solution.) He's only having problems with 8/4 maple, which tells me that there isn't anything wrong with the saw. We're not talking about replacing the cord, rather the breaker (and, if necessary, the wiring). The best solution is to go to 240V but that takes a little more than was asked. |
#21
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On 1/3/2017 6:49 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 2017-01-03 6:31 PM, Gramps' shop wrote: Hey, Froz Come on over and take a look. Just as cold here in Wisconsin 😀 No passport, I cannot get into the US legally, and it would be a bitch of a drive. :-) There are roughly 11 million illegal aliens in the US, who's gonna know. |
#22
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
"Gramps' shop" writes:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. You haven't provided enough information. The breaker protects the wiring and any attached devices (e.g. receptacles). What AWG is the wire from the breaker to the receptacle for the table saw? Is the receptacle rated for 20A? |
#23
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:41:23 PM UTC-6, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. The simple truth is, you need to rewire your shop and have, at the minimum, two 20amp breakers and all 12ga wire. If that means putting in a new breaker box, its not all that expensive, especially when compared to either burning out the motor on your saw or burning the house down. |
#24
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 10:26:21 AM UTC-5, Dr. Deb wrote:
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:41:23 PM UTC-6, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. The simple truth is, you need to rewire your shop and have, at the minimum, two 20amp breakers and all 12ga wire. If that means putting in a new breaker box, its not all that expensive, especially when compared to either burning out the motor on your saw or burning the house down. A dedicated 15A lighting circuit is a requirement in my opinion. 20A if you like, but certainly not necessary. IMO it's the dedicated part that is most important. Plunging the shop into darkness when a power tool trips the breaker isn't safe. |
#25
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. -- GW Ross I hate to repeat gossip, so I'll only say this once. |
#26
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. Has it always tripped easily? How old is the breaker? They do age. I have had to replace a couple in the past that started tripping easily. Not to negate the advice others have given. -- GW Ross I hate to repeat gossip, so I'll only say this once. |
#27
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
Keith Nuttle wrote in
news My table saw requires 20 amps to start the saw with a 1hp motor. There is a short cord on the motor that plugs into the switch at the front of the table. Over the period 40 years the cord from the switch to the wall became damaged, and I had to replace it. I struggled to find the right cord. I finally use a 14 gauge cord. Why because every cord I could find was 14 gauge, and when I went to Menards, Lowes and a couple of other places where there were saws on display with 1 hp motors, they all had 14 gauge wire into the motor. usually just a couple of feet long. We have all been giving advice that focused on the wire gauge and circuit. I don't believe the question was ever asked as to the size of the motor, and the start mechanism, ie capacitor start etc. Both would have bearing in the size of the cord required. There's a bit of fuzzy understanding in these statements. The gauge of wire required is a function of both the current drawn (i.e. horsepower of the motor) and the length of the wire. 4 feet of 14 gauge to a 1hp motor is fine, 40 feet of 14 gauge is not. In this case the OP wants to run a 20A circuit of some considerable length (we don't know how far, but breaker panel to basement is likely to be on the order of 40 or more feet). A 20A circuit of that length needs 12 gauge, regardless of what's on the end of it. Knowing the motor specs, it is possible that the saw is blowing the circuit not because the circuit is inadequate because there is some internal short in the system. From the OP's comments, the saw runs OK on lighter cuts, it just trips with the 6/4 lumber. That says there is no short or other problem in the circuit, it simply needs more current for the thicker wood. John |
#28
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 19:55:33 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy
wrote: Keith Nuttle wrote in news My table saw requires 20 amps to start the saw with a 1hp motor. There is a short cord on the motor that plugs into the switch at the front of the table. Over the period 40 years the cord from the switch to the wall became damaged, and I had to replace it. I struggled to find the right cord. I finally use a 14 gauge cord. Why because every cord I could find was 14 gauge, and when I went to Menards, Lowes and a couple of other places where there were saws on display with 1 hp motors, they all had 14 gauge wire into the motor. usually just a couple of feet long. We have all been giving advice that focused on the wire gauge and circuit. I don't believe the question was ever asked as to the size of the motor, and the start mechanism, ie capacitor start etc. Both would have bearing in the size of the cord required. There's a bit of fuzzy understanding in these statements. The gauge of wire required is a function of both the current drawn (i.e. horsepower of the motor) and the length of the wire. 4 feet of 14 gauge to a 1hp motor is fine, 40 feet of 14 gauge is not. 14 gauge on a 20A breaker is not. In this case the OP wants to run a 20A circuit of some considerable length (we don't know how far, but breaker panel to basement is likely to be on the order of 40 or more feet). A 20A circuit of that length needs 12 gauge, regardless of what's on the end of it. A 20A circuit of *any* length requires 12ga (or larger), no matter what's on the end of it. Period. Knowing the motor specs, it is possible that the saw is blowing the circuit not because the circuit is inadequate because there is some internal short in the system. From the OP's comments, the saw runs OK on lighter cuts, it just trips with the 6/4 lumber. That says there is no short or other problem in the circuit, it simply needs more current for the thicker wood. John |
#29
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TS keeps popping circuit
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#32
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Fri, 6 Jan 2017 15:38:39 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy
wrote: wrote in : On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 13:43:23 GMT, (Scott Lurndal) wrote: writes: On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 19:55:33 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy wrote: 4 feet of 14 gauge to a 1hp motor is fine, 40 feet of 14 gauge is not. 14 gauge on a 20A breaker is not. AWG 12 to the receptacle then AWG 14 from the receptacle to the saw _is_. Sure but that was not what was said. How now? How else would you read "4 feet to a 1hp motor is fine"? How abou tthe 40 feet from the box to the outlet? I'm beginning to think "that was not what was said" has become a code for "I didn't actually read what I'm responding to" (not to pick on krw, I'm seeing people in other forums use the same excuse). Open your eyes. |
#33
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
wrote in
: On Fri, 6 Jan 2017 15:38:39 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy wrote: wrote in m: On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 13:43:23 GMT, (Scott Lurndal) wrote: writes: On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 19:55:33 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy wrote: 4 feet of 14 gauge to a 1hp motor is fine, 40 feet of 14 gauge is not. 14 gauge on a 20A breaker is not. AWG 12 to the receptacle then AWG 14 from the receptacle to the saw _is_. Sure but that was not what was said. How now? How else would you read "4 feet to a 1hp motor is fine"? How abou tthe 40 feet from the box to the outlet? Which I said 14ga was not suitable for. I'm beginning to think "that was not what was said" has become a code for "I didn't actually read what I'm responding to" (not to pick on krw, I'm seeing people in other forums use the same excuse). Open your eyes. Aha, here's the other code - the one that means "I know I'm wrong, so I'll just pretend the other guy isn't paying attention". John |
#34
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Sat, 7 Jan 2017 22:22:22 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy
wrote: wrote in : On Fri, 6 Jan 2017 15:38:39 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy wrote: wrote in : On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 13:43:23 GMT, (Scott Lurndal) wrote: writes: On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 19:55:33 +0000 (UTC), John McCoy wrote: 4 feet of 14 gauge to a 1hp motor is fine, 40 feet of 14 gauge is not. 14 gauge on a 20A breaker is not. AWG 12 to the receptacle then AWG 14 from the receptacle to the saw _is_. Sure but that was not what was said. How now? How else would you read "4 feet to a 1hp motor is fine"? How abou tthe 40 feet from the box to the outlet? Which I said 14ga was not suitable for. I'm beginning to think "that was not what was said" has become a code for "I didn't actually read what I'm responding to" (not to pick on krw, I'm seeing people in other forums use the same excuse). Open your eyes. Aha, here's the other code - the one that means "I know I'm wrong, so I'll just pretend the other guy isn't paying attention". Good Lord, you're an asshole. |
#35
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:41:23 PM UTC-6, Gramps' shop wrote:
I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. I would like to know what is going on with the voltage. If you have 120 volts and it drops to say 90 volts when you cut the maple you have a problem and changing a breaker is not the fix. |
#36
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
Mark H writes:
On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:41:23 PM UTC-6, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. I would like to know what is going on with the voltage. If you have 120 volts and it drops to say 90 volts when you cut the maple you have a problem and changing a breaker is not the fix. V = IR? |
#37
Posted to rec.woodworking
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TS keeps popping circuit
The power wires between the saw and the socket might be to light.
Simple as that. Or - the power wires to the socket from the breaker is to small in diameter and out of spec. Might be a spliced one with other service tied on to it. What is the HP of the saw ? Martin On 1/17/2017 8:42 AM, Mark H wrote: On Tuesday, January 3, 2017 at 4:41:23 PM UTC-6, Gramps' shop wrote: I have one 15-amp circuit serving my basement shop. Can I switch the breaker to 20 amps? TS is tripping when ripping 6/4 maple. I would like to know what is going on with the voltage. If you have 120 volts and it drops to say 90 volts when you cut the maple you have a problem and changing a breaker is not the fix. |
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