On 2016-03-30, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

Actually so has the automotive industry. Hole saws were used with a
hand held drill to add AC systems to vehicles as a retrofit many years
ago. Refrigerant lines had to be run from under the hood through the
firewall into the evaporator unit.

Note I never sed, "it can not be done". Also note the U2B video speaks
of the problems of drilling metal with the tools shown and even shows
the tools binding, stalling, etc.

I might (but, prolly not) try this with my DW portable battery drill
motor, with sed clutch mechanism, but definitely not with my Milwaukee
1/2" drill motor w/o clutch mechanism (400rpm). The first time that
Milwaukee caught, it'd probably almost break my wrist (BTDT!).

You wanna try it? Be my guest. I'll use a stepped-bit or a drill
press, thank you.

As fer "the automotive industry", I've frequented those sound-system
chop shops. Their "hole saws" were defeated by my '66 Dodge van
dashboard. Perhaps they were using "old school" hole saws.

Yes, I AM "old school". Not all my drill motors are battery pwrd and
have clutches. NOT all my pwr tools are StopSaws or Festools. Funny
that a hobby like woodworking, which so highly prizes "old school"
hand craftmanship, takes me to task fer not having the newest
technology. That's OK. I unnerstan.

BTW, my 1/4" paring chisel finally arrived. Yay!

nb

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 4:41:34 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, DerbyDad03 wrote:

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

Sorry, but I gotta disagree on that one.

Please refrain from snipping relevant material from posts when replying.

I will repeat what you said once again so that you can see why you are
are wrong:

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal. "

Note your use of the words "Never happen in metal."

That is the first place you where you are wrong. As stated by me, and as has
been backed up by others, using a hole saw in a hand held drill in metal is
commonplace.

You were wrong to use the word "never".


Not only can the drill press be brought to the work, I've done it
dozens of times. It's called a magnetic drill press and all one needs
is to provide a sheet of megnetic metal near the drill point. No
doubt you have a great collection of clamps.

I never said the drill press can't be brought to the work but since you
snipped so much of my post, I'll put it back in for you.

I said:

"The only "fact" we can state is that not everything can be brought to
a drill press. Some work must be done on site regardless of whether
it's wood, metal, glass, plastic, whatever."

It is an undeniable fact that not everything can be brought to the
drill press. I will now add that the portable drill press cannot be
brought to everything. Oh, sure, you can *bring* it, you just can't
always *use* it.

Leon has already given one example of a situation where a portable drill
press...

1 - Will not work
2 - Is not needed

I could list so many more situations where that is the case.


https://www.milwaukeetool.com/power-...corded/4270-20

Any volunteers to cut a doorknob hole using this anda hand drill
motor?:

http://tinyurl.com/zqsws54

I've used one ona Bridgeport and it still wasn't pretty, but I got it
to work at molasses-in-Jan feeds/speeds.

I'd love to see anyone here try and cut a 1-1/2" dia hole in 2 inches of
T6 alum or acrylic plastic with a hand drill motor and a hole saw.
Bring yer own EMT.

nb

That's a lame example.

We can all find examples of situations where a hole saw in a hand held
drill is not going to work. Those situations are not limited to metal,
there are also situations where a hole saw in a hand held drill will not
work in wood, plastic, glass, whatever. Who cares?

The fact is, your use of the words "*Never* in metal" are flat out wrong.

You said "Never in metal". I'll repeat that, with emphasis "*Never* in
metal." *Never*

Are you really going to continue to defend that statement?

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 6:20:12 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

Actually so has the automotive industry. Hole saws were used with a
hand held drill to add AC systems to vehicles as a retrofit many years
ago. Refrigerant lines had to be run from under the hood through the
firewall into the evaporator unit.

Note I never sed, "it can not be done".

Why does it appear that you just keep forgetting that you said:

"Never happen in metal."

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal."

Also note the U2B video speaks
of the problems of drilling metal with the tools shown and even shows
the tools binding, stalling, etc.

I might (but, prolly not) try this with my DW portable battery drill
motor, with sed clutch mechanism, but definitely not with my Milwaukee
1/2" drill motor w/o clutch mechanism (400rpm). The first time that
Milwaukee caught, it'd probably almost break my wrist (BTDT!).

You wanna try it? Be my guest. I'll use a stepped-bit or a drill
press, thank you.

As fer "the automotive industry", I've frequented those sound-system
chop shops. Their "hole saws" were defeated by my '66 Dodge van
dashboard. Perhaps they were using "old school" hole saws.

Yes, I AM "old school". Not all my drill motors are battery pwrd and
have clutches. NOT all my pwr tools are StopSaws or Festools. Funny
that a hobby like woodworking, which so highly prizes "old school"
hand craftmanship, takes me to task fer not having the newest
technology. That's OK. I unnerstan.

BTW, my 1/4" paring chisel finally arrived. Yay!

nb

notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

Actually so has the automotive industry. Hole saws were used with a
hand held drill to add AC systems to vehicles as a retrofit many years
ago. Refrigerant lines had to be run from under the hood through the
firewall into the evaporator unit.

Note I never sed, "it can not be done". Also note the U2B video speaks
of the problems of drilling metal with the tools shown and even shows
the tools binding, stalling, etc.

I might (but, prolly not) try this with my DW portable battery drill
motor, with sed clutch mechanism, but definitely not with my Milwaukee
1/2" drill motor w/o clutch mechanism (400rpm). The first time that
Milwaukee caught, it'd probably almost break my wrist (BTDT!).

You wanna try it? Be my guest. I'll use a stepped-bit or a drill
press, thank you.

As fer "the automotive industry", I've frequented those sound-system
chop shops. Their "hole saws" were defeated by my '66 Dodge van
dashboard. Perhaps they were using "old school" hole saws.

Yes, I AM "old school". Not all my drill motors are battery pwrd and
have clutches. NOT all my pwr tools are StopSaws or Festools. Funny
that a hobby like woodworking, which so highly prizes "old school"
hand craftmanship, takes me to task fer not having the newest
technology. That's OK. I unnerstan.

BTW, my 1/4" paring chisel finally arrived. Yay!


Man - you are one contentious person who is bent on going off on
tangents that have nothing to do with comments that have previously been
made. Bet you don't really have a lot of friends in life...


--
-Mike-

DerbyDad03 wrote:


Why does it appear that you just keep forgetting that you said:

"Never happen in metal."

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal."


Don't waste your time with this guy. He's just a contentious person who
is bent on proving everyone else wrong in life. Let the idiot just go away.



--
-Mike-

On 2016-03-30, Mike Marlow wrote:

Man - you are one contentious person who is bent on going off on
tangents that have nothing to do with comments that have previously been
made. Bet you don't really have a lot of friends in life...

Yeah, I suck. 8|

But! ....I have faith that all you perfect people will set me
straight and will eventually mold me into the exact person you want me
to be. I'll jes sit here in the corner and think precisely what you
instruct me to think.

Jinkies! We having fun, yet?

nb

On 3/30/2016 6:20 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 4:41:34 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, DerbyDad03 wrote:

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

Sorry, but I gotta disagree on that one.

Please refrain from snipping relevant material from posts when replying.

I will repeat what you said once again so that you can see why you are
are wrong:

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal. "

Note your use of the words "Never happen in metal."

That is the first place you where you are wrong. As stated by me, and as has
been backed up by others, using a hole saw in a hand held drill in metal is
commonplace.

You were wrong to use the word "never".


Sheeese, I'm not going to nitpick such things, but I agree with notbob,
I'm not using a big hole saw in metal with that 1/2" drill of his.
Well, not a second time. I've used a drill like that.

notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Mike Marlow wrote:

Man - you are one contentious person who is bent on going off on
tangents that have nothing to do with comments that have previously been
made. Bet you don't really have a lot of friends in life...

Yeah, I suck. 8|

But! ....I have faith that all you perfect people will set me
straight and will eventually mold me into the exact person you want me
to be. I'll jes sit here in the corner and think precisely what you
instruct me to think.

Nobody perfect here, but dude - just take a look at yourself and the way
you interact here. Says it all.


Jinkies! We having fun, yet?


Apparently you are...



--
-Mike-

On 2016-03-30, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Sheeese, I'm not going to nitpick such things, but I agree with notbob,
I'm not using a big hole saw in metal with that 1/2" drill of his.
Well, not a second time. I've used a drill like that.

Thanks, Ed.

Ya' know I'm usually not this "contentious" (Mike's words). OTOH, I'm
not gonna jes lie down and act like I know nothing! I didn't get my
experience from FWW magazine. I got it from actually doing it!
Working ina machine shop in one of our country's most reknown govt
labs. And I'm not adverse to admitting I'm wrong. I've already done
it. Here! But, I'll be damned if I'll pretend I'm wrong jes cuz
someone sez I am.

With respect to woodworking cabinetry, I pretty much am clueless.
Admittedly! That's not to say I know nada! I put in a year as an
apprentice carpenter. I've got my late brother's tools and a few more
I've picked up, over the yrs. Now, I'm learning cabinetry cuz I
have to. I inherited my mom's home and the kitchen is falling apart and
I gotta fix it. I may not be a master woodworker, but I'm far from a
being a total neophyte.

nb

notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Sheeese, I'm not going to nitpick such things, but I agree with notbob,
I'm not using a big hole saw in metal with that 1/2" drill of his.
Well, not a second time. I've used a drill like that.

Thanks, Ed.

Ya' know I'm usually not this "contentious" (Mike's words). OTOH, I'm
not gonna jes lie down and act like I know nothing! I didn't get my
experience from FWW magazine. I got it from actually doing it!
Working ina machine shop in one of our country's most reknown govt
labs. And I'm not adverse to admitting I'm wrong. I've already done
it. Here! But, I'll be damned if I'll pretend I'm wrong jes cuz
someone sez I am.

With respect to woodworking cabinetry, I pretty much am clueless.
Admittedly! That's not to say I know nada! I put in a year as an
apprentice carpenter. I've got my late brother's tools and a few more
I've picked up, over the yrs. Now, I'm learning cabinetry cuz I
have to. I inherited my mom's home and the kitchen is falling apart and
I gotta fix it. I may not be a master woodworker, but I'm far from a
being a total neophyte.

nb


Look guy - I'm not saying you have nothing to offer or that your
questions are silly. I think a guy like you actually does have a lot to
offer just like a guy like me has things to offer that may even be off
to the side of actual woodworking. You seem to very knowledgeable in
certain areas and I think that knowledge can be of great value to a
group like this which is wider reaching than just woodworking. Believe
it or not (your choice), I actually do genuinely respect the kind of
knowledge a guy like you brings.

For me - it's all about the delivery. Most here would tell you that my
delivery can be a bit on the harsh side from time to time, so that may
sound a little ironic coming from me.

Tell you what - I'm willing to bury the hatchet and start from the
beginning, if you are. Chock it up to just the way **** flows
sometimes, and put it behind us.

Does that work for you?


--
-Mike-

On 2016-03-30, Mike Marlow wrote:

Tell you what - I'm willing to bury the hatchet and start from the
beginning, if you are. Chock it up to just the way **** flows
sometimes, and put it behind us.

Does that work for you?

Like WD40! (jes kidding)

I'll try and ameliorate my delivery, too. No more "anal" remarks
--which I'm sure didn't thrill the true WW masters in this group-- and
I'll try and never say "never", again.

We're good ....and thank you for the peace offering.

nb

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 8:08:18 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Mike Marlow wrote:

Tell you what - I'm willing to bury the hatchet and start from the
beginning, if you are. Chock it up to just the way **** flows
sometimes, and put it behind us.

Does that work for you?

Like WD40! (jes kidding)

I'll try and ameliorate my delivery, too. No more "anal" remarks
--which I'm sure didn't thrill the true WW masters in this group-- and
I'll try and never say "never", again.

We're good ....and thank you for the peace offering.

nb

Same here...

notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Mike Marlow wrote:

Tell you what - I'm willing to bury the hatchet and start from the
beginning, if you are. Chock it up to just the way **** flows
sometimes, and put it behind us.

Does that work for you?

Like WD40! (jes kidding)

I'll try and ameliorate my delivery, too. No more "anal" remarks
--which I'm sure didn't thrill the true WW masters in this group-- and
I'll try and never say "never", again.

We're good ....and thank you for the peace offering.


Good to go brother. Thanks for your cooperation. I've had to go
through my share of ameliorating my comments over time in this group.
There are many here who could attest to that.


--
-Mike-

Darnist thing I saw was a Satellite tech do is drill through a metal
building with a high speed flat drill used for wood. I thought I'd see
metal snagging easy. Cut nice. I figure a toothed Forstner drill instead.

Martin

On 3/30/2016 3:09 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 12:40:58 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Swingman wrote:
On 3/29/2016 12:57 PM, notbob wrote:
Things like forstner bits and hole saws should NOT be used with a hand
held drill motor. That I know, for a fact!

"FACT": know what you're talking before showing your ignorance.

I apologize fer applying my knowledge of metalworking to your world of
woodworking. I spoke too soon and spoke from having very little
real-world knowledge of woodworking. Obviously, they are not the same
and I was wrong. But, I am trying to learn. Patience, please.

As fer "showing ... ignorance", hey, I can stand proud with the best
of 'em.

nb

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

You said:

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal. "

I have used hole saws in a hand held drill to bore holes in metal countless
times. I even posted a video of a guy using a cordless drill to bore a hole
in a fairly thick piece of steel.

The only "fact" we can state is that not everything can be brought to
a drill press. Some work must be done on site regardless of whether
it's wood, metal, glass, plastic, whatever.

On 3/30/16 3:41 PM, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, DerbyDad03 wrote:

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

Sorry, but I gotta disagree on that one.

Not only can the drill press be brought to the work, I've done it
dozens of times. It's called a magnetic drill press and all one needs
is to provide a sheet of megnetic metal near the drill point. No
doubt you have a great collection of clamps.

https://www.milwaukeetool.com/power-...corded/4270-20

Any volunteers to cut a doorknob hole using this anda hand drill
motor?:

http://tinyurl.com/zqsws54

I've used one ona Bridgeport and it still wasn't pretty, but I got it
to work at molasses-in-Jan feeds/speeds.

I'd love to see anyone here try and cut a 1-1/2" dia hole in 2 inches of
T6 alum or acrylic plastic with a hand drill motor and a hole saw.
Bring yer own EMT.

nb


Just stop. Stop digging the hole. It's embarrassing.
I've drilled hundreds, yes, hundreds of holes that size and larger with
a handheld battery and corded drills with holes saws. That thing you
showed is antiquated.

Sit back and learn from those with experience. Not googlectuals.

Peanut gallery. Wow.

Sheesh.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 3/30/2016 7:19 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
notbob wrote:

We're good ....and thank you for the peace offering.

Good to go brother.

Same here

.... and welcome to the forum notbob.

Thanks for your cooperation. I've had to go
through my share of ameliorating my comments over time in this group.
There are many here who could attest to that.

LOL ... we love you anyway, Mike, even if you do talk funny.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
https://www.facebook.com/eWoodShop-206166666122228
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2016-03-31, Swingman wrote:

... and welcome to the forum notbob.

Thank you, Swingman.

nb

On Wed, 30 Mar 2016 13:09:22 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 12:40:58 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, Swingman wrote:
On 3/29/2016 12:57 PM, notbob wrote:
Things like forstner bits and hole saws should NOT be used with a hand
held drill motor. That I know, for a fact!

"FACT": know what you're talking before showing your ignorance.

I apologize fer applying my knowledge of metalworking to your world of
woodworking. I spoke too soon and spoke from having very little
real-world knowledge of woodworking. Obviously, they are not the same
and I was wrong. But, I am trying to learn. Patience, please.

As fer "showing ... ignorance", hey, I can stand proud with the best
of 'em.

nb

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

You said:

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal. "

I have used hole saws in a hand held drill to bore holes in metal countless
times. I even posted a video of a guy using a cordless drill to bore a hole
in a fairly thick piece of steel.

The only "fact" we can state is that not everything can be brought to
a drill press. Some work must be done on site regardless of whether
it's wood, metal, glass, plastic, whatever.

Considering they sell Bimetal holes saws for making holes is see his
problem, but do not think notbob will.

On Wed, 30 Mar 2016 18:50:54 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 3/30/2016 6:20 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, March 30, 2016 at 4:41:34 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
On 2016-03-30, DerbyDad03 wrote:

The problem is that your statement does not apply to metal working either.

Sorry, but I gotta disagree on that one.

Please refrain from snipping relevant material from posts when replying.

I will repeat what you said once again so that you can see why you are
are wrong:

"Using a hole saw to make a doorknob hole ina door. I see yer point
about using the hole saw in wood. Never happen in metal. "

Note your use of the words "Never happen in metal."

That is the first place you where you are wrong. As stated by me, and as has
been backed up by others, using a hole saw in a hand held drill in metal is
commonplace.

You were wrong to use the word "never".


Sheeese, I'm not going to nitpick such things, but I agree with notbob,
I'm not using a big hole saw in metal with that 1/2" drill of his.
Well, not a second time. I've used a drill like that.

Air drill is the solution for metal less torque when it bites and
stops, I have done through steel up to a 1/4 inch with bimetal hole
saws, used a lot of WD40. You do what you need to do to do the job
with what you have.