As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)

On 02/02/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
....

I vote against Al because it tends to gall/stick worse than steel.

Other than that I have no real strong opinion although I am partial hard
maple as the material of choice simply 'cuz it's easiest to sneak up on
the prefect fit...even the purchased steel runners are typically a
little sloppy...

--

On 2/2/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)

Have a few TS sleds with both hardwood (oak) and aluminum runners over
ten years old, can only say there is no practical/noticeable difference
in accuracy over time thus far, the only thing I concern myself with.

The aluminum runners to be appear to be ever so slightly more subject to
the shop's ambient temperature (looses in cold, tighter in heat) but
that can easily be adjusted out.

For me it basically boils down to need and availability.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2/2/2015 2:09 PM, dpb wrote:
On 02/02/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
...

I vote against Al because it tends to gall/stick worse than steel.

Other than that I have no real strong opinion although I am partial hard
maple as the material of choice simply 'cuz it's easiest to sneak up on
the prefect fit...even the purchased steel runners are typically a
little sloppy...

UHMW (Ultra High Molecular Weight) polymer bar stock works well.
http://www.ttrackusa.com/UHMW.htm

On 2/2/2015 4:41 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
On 2/2/2015 2:09 PM, dpb wrote:
On 02/02/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
...

I vote against Al because it tends to gall/stick worse than steel.

Other than that I have no real strong opinion although I am partial hard
maple as the material of choice simply 'cuz it's easiest to sneak up on
the prefect fit...even the purchased steel runners are typically a
little sloppy...

UHMW (Ultra High Molecular Weight) polymer bar stock works well.
http://www.ttrackusa.com/UHMW.htm

Has any one used the miter gauge runner for sled runner. I replace of
on my Miter gauge with a longer one and still have the old one. As I
remember it did not cost that much

On 2/2/15 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled
runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple
of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests
a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd
like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not
automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)


I've used hardwood and the aftermarket adjustable aluminum runners
available from different tool suppliers. If you're using two runners
then a perfect fit in the slot isn't that necessary because as long as
each runner is pushing against its slot opposite of the other, the sled
runs true and stable. In other words, if they are both pushing inward
or both pushing outward against the slots, you're good.

When only one runner is used, it has to fit the slot very well and being
adjustable might be preferred, so an aluminum pre-made runner might work
better.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 02/02/2015 3:58 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
....

Has any one used the miter gauge runner for sled runner. I replace of on
my Miter gauge with a longer one and still have the old one. As I
remember it did not cost that much

Actually, was thinking after the previous I should've mentioned that --
I used one w/ my original Craftsman TS but it had unique slots that
didn't fit the PM when got it so let the sled go w/ the saw...

But, they make good stock albeit the size of sled is limited by their
length so for larger sleds may be short.

--

On Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:38:37 -0800 (PST), DerbyDad03
wrote:

As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)

How about UHMW or PTFE (plastic). I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?
2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 12:38:43 PM UTC-8, DerbyDad03 wrote:
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum

Hardwood, waxed, works fine. My saw lives in a shed, and dissimilar
metals in contact can be troublesome (so the aluminum idea bothers me).
Rather than glue, or predrill and screw, I used POP rivets (so
that's SOME aluminum content). A POP rivet head needs very little
countersink depth, and the sled was 1/4" plywood.

On 2/2/2015 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


Most the places I get rust are not in scratches, and who cares if it
does. Rust will come off very easily with simple use. If you have a
surface that is rusting you need to use the machine more. ;~)

On 2/2/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)


For a woodworker a double bar is probably over kill. My best luck has
always been with steel bars. Second to that is the steel bar setting in
a dado to keep it straight in the bottom of the sled.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is
hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that
use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter
gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to
hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not
automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)


Aluminum might react with the steel of the table top over time if left
unused for a while in a humid environment. Anodizing the aluminum would
virtually eliminate that. Anodizing has the advantage of creating a hard
wear resistant surface on the aluminum parts. So, the correct answer is
adult diapers. (It Depends.)

To those who might argue about anodized aluminum, there are modestly decent
life desktop size CNC mills that have anodized aluminum wear surfaces.
Strictly hobby stuff, but still.

On 2/2/2015 4:41 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
On 2/2/2015 2:09 PM, dpb wrote:
On 02/02/2015 2:38 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
...

I vote against Al because it tends to gall/stick worse than steel.

Other than that I have no real strong opinion although I am partial hard
maple as the material of choice simply 'cuz it's easiest to sneak up on
the prefect fit...even the purchased steel runners are typically a
little sloppy...

UHMW (Ultra High Molecular Weight) polymer bar stock works well.
http://www.ttrackusa.com/UHMW.htm


That is what I prefer. I have a large commercial cutting board which I
stopped using in the kitchen because of the accrued nicks and cut but which
works great at providing UHMW stock in the shop. I've been cutting bits and
pieces from it for years and it isn't even half gone yet. My _unique_
Robland saw has a bizarre oddly-sized dovetail slot (along with the sliding
table of course) and no standard fixture fits it. I don't try to match the
dovetail but a well sized runner works fine.

On 2/3/2015 10:05 AM, Bob La Londe wrote:
"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners
is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans
that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single
miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled


I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd
like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not
automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)


Aluminum might react with the steel of the table top over time if left
unused for a while in a humid environment. Anodizing the aluminum would
virtually eliminate that. Anodizing has the advantage of creating a
hard wear resistant surface on the aluminum parts. So, the correct
answer is adult diapers. (It Depends.)

You can get electrolysis between aluminum and iron with the presence of
water, a good reason to insure that the coolant in your car engine bis
kept fresh, but Kreg miter gauges are 95% aluminum and I had one sitting
on top of my cast iron TS for years on end with out any problems. The
bar was silver so I am not sure if it was anodized, the blue upper part
of the gauge was certainly anodized. I did how ever encounter problems
with the Kreg miter gauge. Primarily the aluminum guide bar should have
not been made from aluminum, it flexed very easily and on wide panel
cuts the fence was less that steady because of the guide flex. Secondly
the brass indexing pin finally seized in the aluminum one morning and I
was unable to remove it after it had set in the sunlight for a few
hours. I then switched to an Incra miter gauge with steel guide bar and
anodize aluminum fence. FWIW the longer the guide bar the better the
accuracy especially when the fence is 12" shy of touching the front of
the saw table when cutting wide panels.




To those who might argue about anodized aluminum, there are modestly
decent life desktop size CNC mills that have anodized aluminum wear
surfaces. Strictly hobby stuff, but still.

On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.
2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.

On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 21:50:15 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 2/2/2015 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


Most the places I get rust are not in scratches, and who cares if it
does. Rust will come off very easily with simple use.

Rust goes a lot deeper than what you're going to take off with a
little wood.

If you have a
surface that is rusting you need to use the machine more. ;~)

Well... I haven't used it in at least three months and it'll be
another three months until I can again. :-(

On 2/3/15 6:01 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.

So is wood. So is plastic. So is my fingernail.


2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.


I think you need to be a little more gentle. :-p


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Tue, 03 Feb 2015 20:23:45 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/3/15 6:01 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.

So is wood. So is plastic. So is my fingernail.

I doubt you'll scrape off the Boeshield with your fingernail but I try
not to drag my fingernails across the top, too. Nah, wood and plastic
might push it around some but it's not going to plow through it.

2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.


I think you need to be a little more gentle. :-p

I guess I could put UHMW strips on the bottom but really, the miter
gauges do scratch the surface, in multiple places.

wrote in message

On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.
2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.

You have some remarkable aluminum (or wierd iron), aluminum is much softer
than iron. Here's a Moh's scale...

http://www.jewelrynotes.com/the-mohs...-is-important/

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

On 2/3/2015 8:49 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 03 Feb 2015 20:23:45 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/3/15 6:01 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.

So is wood. So is plastic. So is my fingernail.

I doubt you'll scrape off the Boeshield with your fingernail but I try
not to drag my fingernails across the top, too. Nah, wood and plastic
might push it around some but it's not going to plow through it.

2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.


I think you need to be a little more gentle. :-p

I guess I could put UHMW strips on the bottom but really, the miter
gauges do scratch the surface, in multiple places.


If yu are using Boeshield to protect your TS top you don't have near the
rust problem you might think you have.
Boeshield absolutely would did not offer enough protection for me when I
first used it 15 years ago. TopKote and its successor is the only thing
that works for me.

On 2/4/2015 6:07 AM, dadiOH wrote:
wrote in message

On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.
2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.

You have some remarkable aluminum (or wierd iron), aluminum is much
softer than iron. Here's a Moh's scale...

http://www.jewelrynotes.com/the-mohs...-is-important/



I will say that with enough repeated passes most anything will cause a
wear pattern on cast iron. I have those all over the place running
parallel to the blade and perpendicular to the blade. Parallel marks
from the miter gauges/sleds/wood. Perpendicular marks from the fence
support pad that slides across the back of the TS top, that is the low
friction plastic stuff. Anyway the wear marks are only visible you
certainly can't feel them nor are they more susceptible to rust.

Leon wrote:


I will say that with enough repeated passes most anything will cause a
wear pattern on cast iron. I have those all over the place running
parallel to the blade and perpendicular to the blade. Parallel marks
from the miter gauges/sleds/wood. Perpendicular marks from the fence
support pad that slides across the back of the TS top, that is the low
friction plastic stuff. Anyway the wear marks are only visible you
certainly can't feel them nor are they more susceptible to rust.

What so many of these comments clearly miss is that most of those
"scratches" are not in the base material itself, but in the finish of the
base material. They are scratches in the sheen (shean?), and not noteworthy
scratches in the base material. Sometimes it seems there is way too much
focus on stuff that just does not matter...

--

-Mike-

On 2/4/15 10:08 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Sometimes it seems there is way too much
focus on stuff that just does not matter...


DING! DING! DING!


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/4/2015 9:08 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Leon wrote:


I will say that with enough repeated passes most anything will cause a
wear pattern on cast iron. I have those all over the place running
parallel to the blade and perpendicular to the blade. Parallel marks
from the miter gauges/sleds/wood. Perpendicular marks from the fence
support pad that slides across the back of the TS top, that is the low
friction plastic stuff. Anyway the wear marks are only visible you
certainly can't feel them nor are they more susceptible to rust.

What so many of these comments clearly miss is that most of those
"scratches" are not in the base material itself, but in the finish of the
base material. They are scratches in the sheen (shean?), and not noteworthy
scratches in the base material. Sometimes it seems there is way too much
focus on stuff that just does not matter...

The idea that hard materials can't be scratched by softer ones reminds
me of this story:
The congregation of a small stone church in England decided that the
stone which formed the step to the front door had become too worn down
by many years of use, and would have to be replaced. Unfortunately,
there were no funds available for a replacement. Someone came up with
the bright idea that the replacement could be postponed by simply
turning the block of stone over.
When they did it, they discovered that their great-great-grandparents
had beaten them to it.

On 2/4/15 1:44 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
On 2/4/2015 9:08 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Leon wrote:


I will say that with enough repeated passes most anything will
cause a wear pattern on cast iron. I have those all over the
place running parallel to the blade and perpendicular to the
blade. Parallel marks from the miter gauges/sleds/wood.
Perpendicular marks from the fence support pad that slides across
the back of the TS top, that is the low friction plastic stuff.
Anyway the wear marks are only visible you certainly can't feel
them nor are they more susceptible to rust.

What so many of these comments clearly miss is that most of those
"scratches" are not in the base material itself, but in the finish
of the base material. They are scratches in the sheen (shean?),
and not noteworthy scratches in the base material. Sometimes it
seems there is way too much focus on stuff that just does not
matter...

The idea that hard materials can't be scratched by softer ones
reminds me of this story: The congregation of a small stone church in
England decided that the stone which formed the step to the front
door had become too worn down by many years of use, and would have to
be replaced. Unfortunately, there were no funds available for a
replacement. Someone came up with the bright idea that the
replacement could be postponed by simply turning the block of stone
over. When they did it, they discovered that their
great-great-grandparents had beaten them to it.

It is said that the shoes aren't wearing down the stone, but in fact,
the stone is... or tiny pieces of it, along with all the tiny rock
fragments that are on people's shoes, already, from walking around.
When walked upon, the dirt on shoes break off tiny pieces of the rock,
pieces the size of and smaller than grains of sand. Those tiny grains
and the stuff already on shoes are then pushed across the surface of the
rock, "sanding" it away over time.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Wednesday, February 4, 2015 at 4:07:33 AM UTC-8, dadiOH wrote:
wrote in message


... My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.

You have some remarkable aluminum (or wierd iron), aluminum is much softer
than iron. Here's a Moh's scale...

http://www.jewelrynotes.com/the-mohs...-is-important/

Anodized aluminum (aluminum oxide in a transparent form on the metal surface)
is also called corundum. Mohs scale, corundum is #9, and is quite a bit harder
than steel (4.5 or so).

On 2/4/2015 10:08 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Leon wrote:


I will say that with enough repeated passes most anything will cause a
wear pattern on cast iron. I have those all over the place running
parallel to the blade and perpendicular to the blade. Parallel marks
from the miter gauges/sleds/wood. Perpendicular marks from the fence
support pad that slides across the back of the TS top, that is the low
friction plastic stuff. Anyway the wear marks are only visible you
certainly can't feel them nor are they more susceptible to rust.

What so many of these comments clearly miss is that most of those
"scratches" are not in the base material itself, but in the finish of the
base material.


They are scratches in the sheen (shean?), and not noteworthy
scratches in the base material. Sometimes it seems there is way too much
focus on stuff that just does not matter...


Can you expand on that a bit, the finish of the material? I have no
sheen so to speak. Buy yes rust only matters if you let it get out of hand.

On another note, I once had a cast iron Craftsman TS. The top had
obvious mill marks and you could feel them. That surface, with an
application of TopKote, was the absolute best surface I have ever had on
any of my TS's as far as low friction is concerned. It is better if the
top is not flat like glass as this can cause more friction. MiniMax
saws pruposely grind the tops of their better equipment with similar
effects to cut down on the contact area with the wood.

On 2/4/2015 4:55 PM, whit3rd wrote:
On Wednesday, February 4, 2015 at 4:07:33 AM UTC-8, dadiOH wrote:
wrote in message


... My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.

You have some remarkable aluminum (or wierd iron), aluminum is much softer
than iron. Here's a Moh's scale...

http://www.jewelrynotes.com/the-mohs...-is-important/

Anodized aluminum (aluminum oxide in a transparent form on the metal surface)
is also called corundum. Mohs scale, corundum is #9, and is quite a bit harder
than steel (4.5 or so).



And whether it matters or not, most of the equipment we are talking
about, that might be scratched, is cast iron, not steel. And cast iron
TS top are pretty soft.

On Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:38:37 -0800 (PST)
DerbyDad03 wrote:

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd
like to hear your opinions.

what happens to that sled when you start cutting angles
it's not going to be great

do tablesaws come with sleds now or is it all diy and aftermarket?
are they intended for just 90s?
what problem do they solve?

On 2/4/2015 5:22 PM, Electric Comet wrote:
On Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:38:37 -0800 (PST)
DerbyDad03 wrote:

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd
like to hear your opinions.

what happens to that sled when you start cutting angles
it's not going to be great

do tablesaws come with sleds now or is it all diy and aftermarket?
are they intended for just 90s?
what problem do they solve?

If you look in the right places table saws come with sliding tables.
SawStop offers one now.

I considered buying this one, but chose the SawStop.

http://www.lagunatools.com/tablesaws/tablesaw-tssws#

On Wed, 04 Feb 2015 09:55:56 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 2/3/2015 8:49 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 03 Feb 2015 20:23:45 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/3/15 6:01 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.

So is wood. So is plastic. So is my fingernail.

I doubt you'll scrape off the Boeshield with your fingernail but I try
not to drag my fingernails across the top, too. Nah, wood and plastic
might push it around some but it's not going to plow through it.

2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.


I think you need to be a little more gentle. :-p

I guess I could put UHMW strips on the bottom but really, the miter
gauges do scratch the surface, in multiple places.


If yu are using Boeshield to protect your TS top you don't have near the
rust problem you might think you have.
Boeshield absolutely would did not offer enough protection for me when I
first used it 15 years ago. TopKote and its successor is the only thing
that works for me.

Rust *is* a problem. I used to have the saw in the garage when I
lived in Alabama. I now have a basement but it's still very humid. I
keep one of the magnetic covers on the saw, and a beach towel on top
of that.

I've been thinking of trying TopKote (or whatever it's called these
days) and even bought a can but it doesn't say anything about
preventing rust. Did they change the formula? I really don't like
Boeshield but I like rust a lot less.

On 2/4/2015 6:34 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 04 Feb 2015 09:55:56 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 2/3/2015 8:49 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 03 Feb 2015 20:23:45 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/3/15 6:01 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:40:28 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:46 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 02 Feb 2015 18:42:13 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

On 2/2/15 6:35 PM, wrote:
I certainly wouldn't use (any)
metal runners on my cast saw table.


Why?

scratches = rust

Kinda defeats the purpose of coating the cast iron.


1. Isn't cast iron much harder than aluminum?

Than anodized aluminum? Aluminum is certainly harder than Boeshield.

So is wood. So is plastic. So is my fingernail.

I doubt you'll scrape off the Boeshield with your fingernail but I try
not to drag my fingernails across the top, too. Nah, wood and plastic
might push it around some but it's not going to plow through it.

2. How is one smoothly polished, soft metal going to scratch anything
let alone a much harder metal?

It does. My aluminum miter gauge certainly scratches the top.


I think you need to be a little more gentle. :-p

I guess I could put UHMW strips on the bottom but really, the miter
gauges do scratch the surface, in multiple places.


If yu are using Boeshield to protect your TS top you don't have near the
rust problem you might think you have.
Boeshield absolutely would did not offer enough protection for me when I
first used it 15 years ago. TopKote and its successor is the only thing
that works for me.

Rust *is* a problem. I used to have the saw in the garage when I
lived in Alabama. I now have a basement but it's still very humid. I
keep one of the magnetic covers on the saw, and a beach towel on top
of that.

I've been thinking of trying TopKote (or whatever it's called these
days) and even bought a can but it doesn't say anything about
preventing rust. Did they change the formula? I really don't like
Boeshield but I like rust a lot less.


Way back when, when Topcote was originally made by Empire, I bought it
to only slick up my TS Top, that is what it was made for. It was great
for that but after about 6 months I noticed that I was no longer having
an issue with rust.
You need to put on a lot the first time, a few coats and the more you
use it the better it protects. It is not guaranteed to prevent rust but
as a bonus it works better for me than any thing else I have tried.

On 2/4/2015 7:04 PM, Leon wrote:

of that.

I've been thinking of trying TopKote (or whatever it's called these
days) and even bought a can but it doesn't say anything about
preventing rust. Did they change the formula? I really don't like
Boeshield but I like rust a lot less.


Way back when, when Topcote was originally made by Empire, I bought it
to only slick up my TS Top, that is what it was made for. It was great
for that but after about 6 months I noticed that I was no longer having
an issue with rust.
You need to put on a lot the first time, a few coats and the more you
use it the better it protects. It is not guaranteed to prevent rust but
as a bonus it works better for me than any thing else I have tried.




This place is the leas expensive that I have found for TopCote/GlideCote.

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Searc...Search=topcote

On 2/4/15 5:22 PM, Electric Comet wrote:
On Mon, 2 Feb 2015 12:38:37 -0800 (PST) DerbyDad03
wrote:

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd
like to hear your opinions.

what happens to that sled when you start cutting angles it's not
going to be great


Which angles? Miter or bevel? I've cut both using mine and they are
extremely accurate and repeatable.
I put a miter gauge on mine with an adjustable stop for repeated cuts.
http://youtu.be/DPg5xdeyCQk


do tablesaws come with sleds now or is it all diy and aftermarket?
are they intended for just 90s? what problem do they solve?


I guess if there's a problem it's wanting to cut wider boards or longer
panels with extreme accuracy and safety. Most miter gauges are not very
wide and while you can add a longer fence to them, they are not good for
panels because their runners are so short.

They are quick and cheap to make, too, so it's really a no-brainer
decision. Once you have one and see how accurate and versatile they
are, you wonder why you didn't build it sooner.

I have a sacrificial bottom on mine that repositions to close the gap
created by the saw kerf of different blades. This creates a
zero-clearance insert affect that eliminates tear-out yielding a very
clean cut.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 3:38:43 PM UTC-5, DerbyDad03 wrote:
As far as I can tell, the standard material for Cross Cut Sled runners is hardwood and typically 2 are used. However, I saw a couple of plans that use aluminum as the runners and even one that suggests a single miter gauge bar as the only runner.

http://www.finewoodworking.com/item/...-crosscut-sled

I think I see advantages and disadvantages of all options, but I'd like to hear your opinions.

"2 hardwood runners is the way that it's always been done" will not automatically be considered an "advantage". ;-)

I decided to go with maple. I cut the runners tonight, the rest of the sled will have to wait until tomorrow.

On Wed, 04 Feb 2015 19:20:45 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 2/4/2015 7:04 PM, Leon wrote:

of that.

I've been thinking of trying TopKote (or whatever it's called these
days) and even bought a can but it doesn't say anything about
preventing rust. Did they change the formula? I really don't like
Boeshield but I like rust a lot less.


Way back when, when Topcote was originally made by Empire, I bought it
to only slick up my TS Top, that is what it was made for. It was great
for that but after about 6 months I noticed that I was no longer having
an issue with rust.
You need to put on a lot the first time, a few coats and the more you
use it the better it protects. It is not guaranteed to prevent rust but
as a bonus it works better for me than any thing else I have tried.




This place is the leas expensive that I have found for TopCote/GlideCote.

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Searc...Search=topcote

Wow! Free shipping, too. I've seen prices like that but they don't
tell you that they charge $15-$20 shipping and handling.

On 2/4/2015 9:03 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 04 Feb 2015 19:20:45 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 2/4/2015 7:04 PM, Leon wrote:

of that.

I've been thinking of trying TopKote (or whatever it's called these
days) and even bought a can but it doesn't say anything about
preventing rust. Did they change the formula? I really don't like
Boeshield but I like rust a lot less.


Way back when, when Topcote was originally made by Empire, I bought it
to only slick up my TS Top, that is what it was made for. It was great
for that but after about 6 months I noticed that I was no longer having
an issue with rust.
You need to put on a lot the first time, a few coats and the more you
use it the better it protects. It is not guaranteed to prevent rust but
as a bonus it works better for me than any thing else I have tried.




This place is the leas expensive that I have found for TopCote/GlideCote.

http://www.cabinethardware.com/Searc...Search=topcote

Wow! Free shipping, too. I've seen prices like that but they don't
tell you that they charge $15-$20 shipping and handling.



Fortunately they are a local place for me that I have been doing
business with for 20+ years. I would suspect their web site not
determining a correct shipping price.... Seems if there were free
shipping there would not be an input location for destination.
This store is top notch with very helpful people and they typically beat
the pants off of the competition prices.

Either way the average price, elsewhere, for a can is around $18-19.