In message
Lobster wrote:

On 05/07/2011 13:46, wrote:
In whill.co.uk
"Dave wrote:

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 11:45:44 +0100, "Nightjar wrote:

With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint, not
on top, when you come to use it.

But how do you then stir the paint to get the oil back in without
breaking the skin and get loads of bits in the paint?

With sufficient air space in the tin the oil paint will skin over
anyway, this will protect the remaining paint and depending on
the type of paint you are supposed to either cut off and remove
the skin then thoroughly stir or stir in the skin

What's the deal there - I never know what to do for the best when
I come across skin on paint. I usually make a judgement on
whether it will actually ever stir in, and if not (eg if it's an
eighth of an inch of hard dry crust!) I remove it.

It depends how thick the skin is, if it is thin then usually the
oil has not separated and you can just lift the skin off, If it is
thick and sat on separated oil then this oil should be stirred
back in and then strained to remove the bits of skin, this way you
don't lose the integrity of the paint.

What does it do to the quality of the paint itself? Would the
underlying paint become more (or less?) concentrated from repeated
removal of skin? Or is the skin layer identical in quality/content to
the liquid?

Oil paint is not resoluble so you have to remove the skin but
sometimes the skin is so thick and hard the paint underneath will
need that bit of medium that's still stuck to the base of the
skin.
Oil paint will become concentrated during use anyway as the
solvents or oil evaporate.

You can however add a little boiled Linseed oil if the paint
appears far too thick to be satisfactorily usable.

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsular.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In message
Lobster wrote:

On 05/07/2011 15:30, Moonraker wrote:

Another thing I have found useful is if I use a paint brush then
need to continue the job the next day wiping any excess paint off then
firmly wrapping the paint brush in cling film, keeps the brush usable
until the morrow.

I find a couple of layers of Tesco bags does the trick equally well
actually - at least it's a use for the bloody things.

Embarrassing confession - I employed a pro decorator a few months ago
for the first time in my life. I was very intrigued that he had a new
Special Box which he stored all his used brushes in; only it wasn't one
of those where the bristles sit in turps, ISTR there was some form of
chemical vapour in there which prevented the brushes from drying out
indefinitely. He said it was the mutt's nuts and he'd pretty well given
up on turps and brush cleaner. Can't remember what the stuff was though...

David

Mineral Naphtha and Linseed oil was what we used to store our
paint brushes in, the oil stopped the naphtha from evaporating too
quickly, the naphtha will draw out paint completely from the brush
stock or bristle base.

Leaving a brush in a turpentine derivative will simply congeal the
remainder of paint left in the bristles.

Stephen.


--
http://www.stephen.hull.btinternet.co.uk
From the Wirral Peninsular.
Coach painting tips and techniques + Land Rover colour codes
"Whatever is rightly done, however humble, is noble". Henry Royce

In article ,
"Nightjar \"cpb\"@" "insertmysurnamehere writes:
On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint, not
on top, when you come to use it.

I've never had a skin form in any tin stored upside down.
Skin forms because refitted lid rarely seals perfectly and
you get slow air exchange, but it does seal much better if
you store the tin upside down (and is noticably harder to
open;-).

By the way, I noticed on the instructions on a tin it
said "do not open with a screwdriver". So what are you
supposed to use? I used a screwdriver...

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 21:11:59 +0100, Andrew Gabriel
wrote:

In article ,
"Nightjar \"cpb\"@" "insertmysurnamehere writes:
On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint, not
on top, when you come to use it.

I've never had a skin form in any tin stored upside down.
Skin forms because refitted lid rarely seals perfectly and
you get slow air exchange, but it does seal much better if
you store the tin upside down (and is noticably harder to
open;-).

By the way, I noticed on the instructions on a tin it
said "do not open with a screwdriver". So what are you
supposed to use? I used a screwdriver...


Smile. Get to know the staff. And ask nicely in a Johnstone's decorator
centre. And they might give you a special paint tin opener.

That's what I did. Unfortunately not one of the nice Johnstone's branded
ones as they had run out, but a not so nice old Dulux one. Can't win 'em
all.

Rod

"HeyBub" wrote
Oxygen is the enemy of unused paint. Here are some tips:

* Don't paint out of the can. Pour paint into another container and
re-seal the can.
* When finished painting, return the unused paint to the can, then - pay
attention here - EXHALE three times into the can. This replaces most of
the oxygen with carbon dioxide.
* Use a plastic bag as your friend suggested. It acts like a gasket around
the edges.
* Store the can upside down. Any remaining oxygen will cause a thin film
to form on what will be the bottom of the paint next time you open the
can.
* Make sure the lid is on tightly. Else some paint will leak out, firmly
attaching the lid to the shelf such that when you grab the can, the lid
stays on the shelf, the remaining paint plops to the floor, and you have
an empty can in your hand.

And be sure that a dumb blonde doesn't get a hold of these instructions.
;-)

Max

On Jul 5, 10:15*am, "john brook" wrote:
Someone I know puts a couple of very thin plastic sheets (cut up vegetable
bags from the supermarket)under the tin lids of tins of varnishes, paints
and glues that come stored in tins.

It makes the lids come on and off very easily and he claims they act like a
'washer' and hence give a more *airtight* seal. *But since air passes
through plastic bags (why long life bread is packaged in 'silvered' plastic
bags) albeit slowly, would this be worth doing?

Make sure lids are on tight and just store the tins upsiide down. End
of problem.

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:


New air or not the paint will skim over, better on bottom than on top.


Does this have the effect of creating an artificial bottom that keeps the
paint closer to the top when the lid is opened? I've noticed polyurethane
especially likes to create thick layers on top that must be broken through.

Puckdropper

On 05/07/2011 12:11, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 11:45:44 +0100, "Nightjar wrote:

With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint, not
on top, when you come to use it.

But how do you then stir the paint to get the oil back in without
breaking the skin and get loads of bits in the paint?


As the man says. If the skin is on the top you can cut it and remove it
.... if underneath it will be mixed, broken and you will have to sieve
the paint.

:-)

On 7/5/2011 5:02 PM, Puckdropper wrote:
Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:


New air or not the paint will skim over, better on bottom than on top.


Does this have the effect of creating an artificial bottom that keeps the
paint closer to the top when the lid is opened? I've noticed polyurethane
especially likes to create thick layers on top that must be broken through.

Puckdropper


It is a temp bottom, if it has skimmed over on the bottom it probably
needs to be stirred and there goes the bottom, but it is on the bottom.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:15:20 +0100, "john brook" wrote:

Someone I know puts a couple of very thin plastic sheets (cut up vegetable
bags from the supermarket)under the tin lids of tins of varnishes, paints
and glues that come stored in tins.

It makes the lids come on and off very easily and he claims they act like a
'washer' and hence give a more *airtight* seal.

Might be a good idea if you don't clean the rim...

But since air passes
through plastic bags (why long life bread is packaged in 'silvered' plastic
bags) albeit slowly, would this be worth doing?

Air passes through plastic sheet generally less than 4mm thick, but as a gasket
I don't think this applies.

I solve the "air in paint can" problem by filling the can up with glass marbles
to take up the space. I used to do this in my darkroom for my photo chemicals,
but thats long gone! Glass of course doesn't react with the paint, and they
stay on the bottom. A bonus is as you shake the can, they stir the paint! (Hold
the lid on...)

The only problem at the beginning was raiding enough toy stores to get a gallon
of marbles! The dollar store was a good find!

See the pic of my cleaned marbles drying on the stove top at
Alt.binaries.photos.original

On 5/07/2011 8:26 PM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the large
quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?


Yea right - every time I do that with compresses gas it usually blows
the lid off

On 6/07/2011 1:58 AM, Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , Mrcheerful
writes

so what is actually needed (dragon's den here I come) is a paint tin that
can be made shorter, perhaps collapsible corrugations ?

I've got a few concertina bottles in my darkroom for storing film
developer.
http://www.silverprint.co.uk/media/stock/000009EC.JPG

They will collapse from 1 litre down to about 1/2 litre. Works fine with
fluid but I'm not sure about gloss paint. Can you imagine trying to
whack the lid on an concertining paint container ;-)


Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:36:34 +0000 (UTC), "steve robinson"
wrote:

Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
steve robinson wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.
Fill the can with CO2 before closing - no oxygen to react with the
driers in the paint. CO2 is heavier than air, so displaces the air and
stays in the can.
Storing the can upside down just puts the "skin" on the bottom

wrote:
Air passes through plastic sheet generally less than 4mm thick, but
as a gasket I don't think this applies.

I solve the "air in paint can" problem by filling the can up with
glass marbles to take up the space. I used to do this in my darkroom
for my photo chemicals, but thats long gone! Glass of course doesn't
react with the paint, and they stay on the bottom. A bonus is as you
shake the can, they stir the paint! (Hold the lid on...)

The only problem at the beginning was raiding enough toy stores to
get a gallon of marbles! The dollar store was a good find!


You don't need to visit toy stores. Search the web for "marbles wholesale"

Here's one place that sells about 500 5/8" marbles for $28 (500=half-gallon)
(smaller assortments available).

http://www.landofmarbles.com/marble-...sortments.html

Apparently the marble business is highly competitive...

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 07:45:44 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 6:03 AM, steve robinson wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint,
not on top, when you come to use it.

Colin Bignell

The reason for rotating tins was to help keep the oils and pigments
mixed, otherwise they eventually seperate

Now that is a load, that will not keep the contents mixed.
It WILL help keep the paint from stratifying because the heavy parts
always sink to the bottom. Constantly changing where the "bottom" is
HELPS keep the paint from becoming a cake of pigment etc covered by
oil.

wrote in news:7af7179o3s8cq8fnprccdsvhql6hk58rl3@
4ax.com:

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 07:45:44 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

Now that is a load, that will not keep the contents mixed.
It WILL help keep the paint from stratifying because the heavy parts
always sink to the bottom. Constantly changing where the "bottom" is
HELPS keep the paint from becoming a cake of pigment etc covered by
oil.


My sister wanted to stain the deck with some 3 year old deck stain. ALL
the solids had settled on to the bottom, where it took some doing to get
them back in suspension again. (I used a paint mixer in the drill press.)

It may not keep the contents mixed, but perhaps it will make it easier to
mix the contents back together.

Puckdropper

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 19:45:51 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

Lobster wrote:

On 05/07/2011 15:30, Moonraker wrote:

firmly wrapping the paint brush in cling film, keeps the brush usable
until the morrow.

I find a couple of layers of Tesco bags does the trick equally well
actually - at least it's a use for the bloody things.

Tesco bags are probably the worst choice for that, especially if they're
more than a few weeks old, their bags bio/photo/oxi-degrade very quickly ...

I employed a pro decorator a few months ago
for the first time in my life. I was very intrigued that he had a new
Special Box which he stored all his used brushes in;

Been mentioned before, I think.

http://www.brushmate.co.uk/
A painter I know said "if you clean and re-use your brushes you don't
value your time highly enough"
Every job gets a new brush.

On 7/5/2011 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 07:45:44 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 6:03 AM, steve robinson wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint,
not on top, when you come to use it.

Colin Bignell

The reason for rotating tins was to help keep the oils and pigments
mixed, otherwise they eventually seperate

Now that is a load, that will not keep the contents mixed.
It WILL help keep the paint from stratifying because the heavy parts
always sink to the bottom. Constantly changing where the "bottom" is
HELPS keep the paint from becoming a cake of pigment etc covered by
oil.

Was "constant changing" mentioned??? I believe simply storing upside
down was what the conversation was all about. Sure constant changing
will help but not simply rotating to the upside down position.

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 22:32:45 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 07:45:44 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 6:03 AM, steve robinson wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint,
not on top, when you come to use it.

Colin Bignell

The reason for rotating tins was to help keep the oils and pigments
mixed, otherwise they eventually seperate

Now that is a load, that will not keep the contents mixed.
It WILL help keep the paint from stratifying because the heavy parts
always sink to the bottom. Constantly changing where the "bottom" is
HELPS keep the paint from becoming a cake of pigment etc covered by
oil.

Was "constant changing" mentioned??? I believe simply storing upside
down was what the conversation was all about. Sure constant changing
will help but not simply rotating to the upside down position.



Rotating is an action, so I assumed it was more than just turning it
over - which would be "inverting" it.

On 7/5/2011 10:43 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 22:32:45 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 07:45:44 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 7/5/2011 6:03 AM, steve robinson wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

On 05/07/2011 11:36, steve robinson wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.


With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint,
not on top, when you come to use it.

Colin Bignell

The reason for rotating tins was to help keep the oils and pigments
mixed, otherwise they eventually seperate

Now that is a load, that will not keep the contents mixed.
It WILL help keep the paint from stratifying because the heavy parts
always sink to the bottom. Constantly changing where the "bottom" is
HELPS keep the paint from becoming a cake of pigment etc covered by
oil.

Was "constant changing" mentioned??? I believe simply storing upside
down was what the conversation was all about. Sure constant changing
will help but not simply rotating to the upside down position.



Rotating is an action, so I assumed it was more than just turning it
over - which would be "inverting" it.



Go up a few posts, the one that states, "store the tins upside down".
Then rotating was mentioned as to the reason to store upside down.

Now throw into the mix that new paint in cases is stored upside down.
Open a case that is right side up and you find upside down paint cans.

On 7/6/2011 6:42 AM, Andy Champ wrote:
On 05/07/2011 11:33, Huge wrote:
Store the tins upside down.


You don't need to store them upside down (which as others have pointed
out means any skin is under the paint and hard to deal with) simply
inverting them once so paint seals the edge of the lid seems to make a
difference to me.

Andy

Makes sense.

On 7/5/11 9:39 AM, RobertL wrote:

Surely the place to put the plastic sheet is lying on top of the
paint. this separates it from the air.

Robert


This is the only good advice you've gotten. The air inside the can is
enough to skin over the paint. Kitchen plastic wrap pushed down into the
can, touching the entire surface of the paint will keep air away from
the paint... then cap the can with the lid.

Works great on ice cream, too, to keep it from crystallizing or getting
freezer burn on the surface.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

Rob wrote:
On 6/07/2011 1:58 AM, Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , Mrcheerful
writes

so what is actually needed (dragon's den here I come) is a paint tin
that
can be made shorter, perhaps collapsible corrugations ?

I've got a few concertina bottles in my darkroom for storing film
developer.
http://www.silverprint.co.uk/media/stock/000009EC.JPG

They will collapse from 1 litre down to about 1/2 litre. Works fine with
fluid but I'm not sure about gloss paint. Can you imagine trying to
whack the lid on an concertining paint container ;-)


Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Ah, now, I'm hoping to move within the next few weeks. The place I
intend moving to has a large, windowless area just the right size for an
enlarger and the associated bits, and I do enjoy messing about with
proper B&W film. Much more satisfying than manipulating bits, IMO.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:36:34 +0000 (UTC), "steve robinson"
wrote:

Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
steve robinson wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.

Just make sure you use a paint strainer after opening a can the second
time.

--
Just getting back after a farkin' virus ate my computer.
I'm still without any email or usenet archives. sigh

On Wed, 06 Jul 2011 00:02:04 +0100, Charles
wrote:

On 05/07/2011 12:11, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 11:45:44 +0100, "Nightjar wrote:

With oil based paints, it ensures that the skin is under the paint, not
on top, when you come to use it.

But how do you then stir the paint to get the oil back in without
breaking the skin and get loads of bits in the paint?


As the man says. If the skin is on the top you can cut it and remove it
... if underneath it will be mixed, broken and you will have to sieve
the paint. :-)

Straining is necessary in either instance. Once my can of Bloxygen is
gone, I'll start using argon from my TIG welder to keep stop skinning.

--
Just getting back after a farkin' virus ate my computer.
I'm still without any email or usenet archives. sigh

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 20:11:59 +0000 (UTC),
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote:

I've never had a skin form in any tin stored upside down.
Skin forms because refitted lid rarely seals perfectly and
you get slow air exchange, but it does seal much better if
you store the tin upside down (and is noticably harder to
open;-).

Skins form with the can in any orientation, trust me.


By the way, I noticed on the instructions on a tin it
said "do not open with a screwdriver". So what are you
supposed to use? I used a screwdriver...

http://goo.gl/0UizX The proper tool. Buy one with the widest, longest
tip for the best results. Paint stores usually have a can of 100 or so
on the checkout counter.

--
Just getting back after a farkin' virus ate my computer.
I'm still without any email or usenet archives. sigh

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:36:34 +0000 (UTC), "steve robinson"
wrote:

Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.

Just make sure you use a paint strainer after opening a can the second
time.


This reminds of a question I did not quickly locate the answer to on the
web. I have never bought bought paint in greater than 1 gallon units.
They are easy to shake and pour into paint trays, etc. What is the
usual process for using a *5 gallon* container of paint? I assume it
has to be mixed really well (practical to do by hand?) and that a "paint
ladle" of some sort would be handy.

Bill

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 20:11:59 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Gabriel wrote:

By the way, I noticed on the instructions on a tin it
said "do not open with a screwdriver". So what are you
supposed to use? I used a screwdriver...

The tin of emulsion from TS was so thin that a screwdriver would have opened
it - like a can opener!
The best tool I found for the job was an old metal tyre lever (push-bike
size) that id rounded and smoothed about 40 years ago. Plenty of area and no
sharp edges.
Then "stir thoroughly": even a plastic kitchen thingy (overgrown spoon,
metal handle) deformed the can, so a metal stirrer... )h, also about 5mm of
freeboard in a 5 litre can...
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

In message , Rob
writes
On 6/07/2011 1:58 AM, Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , Mrcheerful
writes

so what is actually needed (dragon's den here I come) is a paint tin that
can be made shorter, perhaps collapsible corrugations ?

I've got a few concertina bottles in my darkroom for storing film
developer.
http://www.silverprint.co.uk/media/stock/000009EC.JPG

They will collapse from 1 litre down to about 1/2 litre. Works fine with
fluid but I'm not sure about gloss paint. Can you imagine trying to
whack the lid on an concertining paint container ;-)


Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Yebbut you can't escape to your desktop and lock the door for the
afternoon.

--
Paul Giverin

My Photos:- www.pbase.com/vendee

In message , John Williamson
writes
Rob wrote:

Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Ah, now, I'm hoping to move within the next few weeks. The place I
intend moving to has a large, windowless area just the right size for
an enlarger and the associated bits,

Don't forget the kettle and biscuit tin.

and I do enjoy messing about with proper B&W film. Much more
satisfying than manipulating bits, IMO.

Absolutely! Watching that image appear in the developer tray is still a
magic moment. Beats clicking the "OK" button in Photoshop.

--
Paul Giverin

My Photos:- www.pbase.com/vendee

Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , John Williamson
writes
Rob wrote:

Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Ah, now, I'm hoping to move within the next few weeks. The place I
intend moving to has a large, windowless area just the right size for
an enlarger and the associated bits,

Don't forget the kettle and biscuit tin.

Biscuits are banned due to crumbs. I *hate* spotting prints.


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 23:30:02 -0400, wrote:

A painter I know said "if you clean and re-use your brushes you don't
value your time highly enough" Every job gets a new brush.

I use the cling film trick when a job needs to go from one day to the
next. Also a couple of supermarket bags one from each end and tucked
down over paint trays and rollers.

Cleaning non-water soluable paints etc is a PITA. I'd go for the new
brush everytime if I could find a source of decent brushes at a
sensible price that aren't part of a various sized set.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 14:00:08 +0100, Ian Jackson wrote:

But how do you then stir the paint to get the oil back in without
breaking the skin and get loads of bits in the paint?

Without stirring it (or maybe after first stirring very carefully,
without breaking the skin), you decant most of the paint off into
another container. You then scrape off the sludge from the inside of the
lid, add it to the paint you have decanted, and stir it in well.

After you have used the paint, if there's still some left, you can pour
it back unto the original tin until the next time you need it.

Gawd what a faff and lots of containers all mucky with paint...

Once opened, I suspect that a re-sealed tin often allows small amounts
of air to get in. Storing it upside down probably helps the lid to be
absolutely air-tight - just make sure it doesn't leak!

See other comments about tins stuck to shelves. Think I'll stick with
cleaning lid rim and can carefully and tapping the lid fully home.
With maybe an inversion to get paint around the inner edges but store
the right way up.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 23:30:02 -0400, wrote:

A painter I know said "if you clean and re-use your brushes you don't
value your time highly enough" Every job gets a new brush.

I use the cling film trick when a job needs to go from one day to the
next. Also a couple of supermarket bags one from each end and tucked
down over paint trays and rollers.

Cleaning non-water soluable paints etc is a PITA. I'd go for the new
brush everytime if I could find a source of decent brushes at a
sensible price that aren't part of a various sized set.

You can get one size packs from screwfix and the like. I tend to get
cheapies and throw them for all undercoats and a Harris or something like
that for finishing and then immediately clean it.

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 19:45:51 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

Lobster wrote:

On 05/07/2011 15:30, Moonraker wrote:

firmly wrapping the paint brush in cling film, keeps the brush usable
until the morrow.

I find a couple of layers of Tesco bags does the trick equally well
actually - at least it's a use for the bloody things.

Tesco bags are probably the worst choice for that, especially if they're
more than a few weeks old, their bags bio/photo/oxi-degrade very quickly
...

I employed a pro decorator a few months ago
for the first time in my life. I was very intrigued that he had a new
Special Box which he stored all his used brushes in;

Been mentioned before, I think.

http://www.brushmate.co.uk/
A painter I know said "if you clean and re-use your brushes you don't
value your time highly enough"
Every job gets a new brush.

Hmm!
£12 per brush @ 5 minutes to clean = £144 per hour, what does he paint or
does he use cr@p brushes?
I have some I paid about 15p each for but they ain't for putting gloss on
doors.

In message o.uk, Dave
Liquorice writes
On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 14:00:08 +0100, Ian Jackson wrote:

But how do you then stir the paint to get the oil back in without
breaking the skin and get loads of bits in the paint?

Without stirring it (or maybe after first stirring very carefully,
without breaking the skin), you decant most of the paint off into
another container. You then scrape off the sludge from the inside of the
lid, add it to the paint you have decanted, and stir it in well.

After you have used the paint, if there's still some left, you can pour
it back unto the original tin until the next time you need it.

Gawd what a faff and lots of containers all mucky with paint...

That's the container (a large ex-pickled cabbage glass jar works for me)
you use to give your brush its first clean with white spirit. You then
leave the contents for a week or two, until the paint settles into a
sludge, then decant off the white spirit for re-use. Put the jar away
for a few months, until the sludge solidifies, then remove the sludge,
and dispose of it as a solid lump. Re-use the jar for brush cleaning
etc.

Once opened, I suspect that a re-sealed tin often allows small amounts
of air to get in. Storing it upside down probably helps the lid to be
absolutely air-tight - just make sure it doesn't leak!

See other comments about tins stuck to shelves.

Don't you line your shelves with sheets of newspaper?

Think I'll stick with
cleaning lid rim and can carefully and tapping the lid fully home.
With maybe an inversion to get paint around the inner edges but store
the right way up.


--
Ian

On 6/07/2011 3:35 PM, John Williamson wrote:
Rob wrote:
On 6/07/2011 1:58 AM, Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , Mrcheerful
writes

so what is actually needed (dragon's den here I come) is a paint tin
that
can be made shorter, perhaps collapsible corrugations ?

I've got a few concertina bottles in my darkroom for storing film
developer.
http://www.silverprint.co.uk/media/stock/000009EC.JPG

They will collapse from 1 litre down to about 1/2 litre. Works fine with
fluid but I'm not sure about gloss paint. Can you imagine trying to
whack the lid on an concertining paint container ;-)


Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Ah, now, I'm hoping to move within the next few weeks. The place I
intend moving to has a large, windowless area just the right size for an
enlarger and the associated bits, and I do enjoy messing about with
proper B&W film. Much more satisfying than manipulating bits, IMO.


But will it take a 8"x10" enlarger?

I changed in 2003 (shot my last film), my enlargers(2) are still in the
darkroom with a wet bench, colour processor and film processor.

I haven't looked back, better for my health not breathing or touching
chemicals.

I can digitize old film formats, manipulate to any film texture and
print to 24" wide on the Epson printer.

But I'm thinking of resurrecting my 120 panoramic cameras and the E6
processor. i don't like the feel of digital images.

r

Rob wrote:
On 6/07/2011 3:35 PM, John Williamson wrote:
Rob wrote:
On 6/07/2011 1:58 AM, Paul Giverin wrote:
In message , Mrcheerful
writes

so what is actually needed (dragon's den here I come) is a paint tin
that
can be made shorter, perhaps collapsible corrugations ?

I've got a few concertina bottles in my darkroom for storing film
developer.
http://www.silverprint.co.uk/media/stock/000009EC.JPG

They will collapse from 1 litre down to about 1/2 litre. Works fine
with
fluid but I'm not sure about gloss paint. Can you imagine trying to
whack the lid on an concertining paint container ;-)


Darkroom - that's on the desktop nowdays.

Ah, now, I'm hoping to move within the next few weeks. The place I
intend moving to has a large, windowless area just the right size for an
enlarger and the associated bits, and I do enjoy messing about with
proper B&W film. Much more satisfying than manipulating bits, IMO.


But will it take a 8"x10" enlarger?

Possibly not, but I don't use bigger than 120 rollfilm, anyway.

I changed in 2003 (shot my last film), my enlargers(2) are still in the
darkroom with a wet bench, colour processor and film processor.

I haven't looked back, better for my health not breathing or touching
chemicals.

I can digitize old film formats, manipulate to any film texture and
print to 24" wide on the Epson printer.

But I'm thinking of resurrecting my 120 panoramic cameras and the E6
processor. i don't like the feel of digital images.

Another excellent reason. Which reminds me...
Takes down Cibachrome print of a windmill in silhouette, and carefully
packs it away for the move later today

I know for a fact that the detail inside the silhouette couldn't
possibly be reproduce on *any* digital printout. Black on darker black,
it is, and *very* subtle.


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 7/6/2011 2:02 AM, Bill wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Tue, 5 Jul 2011 10:36:34 +0000 (UTC), "steve robinson"
wrote:

Huge wrote:

On 2011-07-05, Dave Plowman wrote:
In ,
steve wrote:
The reason paint goes off after being opened and used is the
large quantity of new air when you replace the lid.

Your better dropping a peace of plastic in the bottom

Or fill the space with some inert gas?

Store the tins upside down.

Makes no difference once the tin is opened and new air introduced.

Just make sure you use a paint strainer after opening a can the second
time.


This reminds of a question I did not quickly locate the answer to on the
web. I have never bought bought paint in greater than 1 gallon units.
They are easy to shake and pour into paint trays, etc. What is the usual
process for using a *5 gallon* container of paint? I assume it has to be
mixed really well (practical to do by hand?) and that a "paint ladle" of
some sort would be handy.

Bill



The 5 gallons get mixed if you pick a non stock color, but we get them
shook regardless. You pour out of them just as you would a 1 gallon
container, you just have to be more careful and have a paint brush handy
to clean up the drips down the sides. The biggest problem with the 5
gallon buckets is getting the lid off. A 5 in 1 comes in handy for
that. also consider switching from a roller tray to a roller bucket.
With the waste basket style paint buckets for rollers you can easily
dump a gallon of paint into them and not waste time refilling all day
long. We typically refill our roller paint buckets a couple times a day
maybe three times on a long day. Plus they are much easier to carry around.

On 7/6/2011 3:49 AM, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 05 Jul 2011 23:30:02 -0400, wrote:

A painter I know said "if you clean and re-use your brushes you don't
value your time highly enough" Every job gets a new brush.

I use the cling film trick when a job needs to go from one day to the
next. Also a couple of supermarket bags one from each end and tucked
down over paint trays and rollers.

Cleaning non-water soluable paints etc is a PITA. I'd go for the new
brush everytime if I could find a source of decent brushes at a
sensible price that aren't part of a various sized set.



Jeez learn to clean the brush. I would much much rather clean an oil
based paint or stain than water based. If you use mineral spirits, the
kind that comes in a metal container vs the plastic contain, you can
clean varnish out of a brush in a matter of seconds.

Keep in mind that is a good practice to clean the brush several times a
day even with water based, don't use paint thinner to clean the brush,
it dries much more slowly than mineral spirits and if you are painting
above your head you will get thinned paint running down the handle.