Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

Should of bought a Grizzly. LOL
At least you would have a cool grand in your pocket for your troubles.

It is frustrating to spend that amount of money for something that is
suppose to be superior, only to find it is no better than what you could of
had for half the price.
I feel for you.

Roger

"LP" wrote in message
om...
Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

On 6 May 2004 09:34:10 -0700, (LP) wrote:

Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Interesting. I have long dreamed of buying a PM66 particularly since a
dealer I used to frequent told me that there was much more cast iron
in the trunnions than the Unisaw. I've probably spent ten years
planning on getting one. Then, within the last year I've seen and
heard more horror (well, maybe that's a little strong) stories about
Powermatic that I've been reconsidering.

My current thought is the General 650 at nearly $400 cheaper. I've had
my hand near the phone for a couple of weeks, now; I'm that close to
ordering.

Then a Woodworker's Supply catalog shows up in the mail yesterday and
on the inside cover is a Unisaw with 50" Biesemeyer and mobile base
for $1499. The rest of my shop is Delta (DP, DJ20, DC380) so this
would make sense.

But I don't know. I've heard horror (well, maybe that's a little
strong) stories about Unisaws recently, too, so I'm just a little
hesitant.

Man, this is tough: Powermatic, General, Delta, Powermatic, General,
Delta...

By the way, don't bother trying to sell me on Jet or Grizzly. Not
going to happen. Powermatic, General, Delta, Powermatic, General,
Delta...

- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

"LRod" wrote in message
news

Regardless of brand, I would strongly recomend buying from your local dealer
and have him deliver the equipment. Seems Delta gets more than its share of
broken trunions from shipping. Let the dealer take care of the headaches so
that you can sit back and enjoy the new equipment.

Sorry to hear of your problems.
I picked up a new 66 from the wood show in Pomona 2 weeks ago(great price).
Packaging was in excellent condition, bolted to oak pallet with oak frame
around it and cardboard box around that. Everything was boxed up properly
and fit and finish excellent. I agree about the cord strain relief and the
'missing wrench'. Love it so far cuts so smoothly


"LP" . wrote in message
om...
Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

On Thu, 06 May 2004 19:01:34 +0100, LRod
wrote:

On 6 May 2004 09:34:10 -0700, (LP) wrote:

Interesting. I have long dreamed of buying a PM66 particularly since a
dealer I used to frequent told me that there was much more cast iron
in the trunnions than the Unisaw. I've probably spent ten years
planning on getting one. Then, within the last year I've seen and
heard more horror (well, maybe that's a little strong) stories about
Powermatic that I've been reconsidering.


you might consider:

unisaw prior to 1970
powermatic prior to 1980

less money, better saw. you just have to look harder...

On Thu, 06 May 2004 14:20:30 -0700,
wrote:

you might consider:

unisaw prior to 1970
powermatic prior to 1980

less money, better saw. you just have to look harder...

There's no question about looking harder. I have been. I haven't run
across any killer deals anywhere, new or used. And the pre 1970 Unisaw
is disqualified because they're all right tilt. The left tilt Uni
didn't come into existence until about seven or eight years ago. I'm a
left tilt guy (in every sense of the phrase). Too old to change, gonna
have to live with the consequences.

Thanks for the input.

- -
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

(LP) wrote in message . com...
Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

Dear Larry;

Sorry that you had a problem with your new saw. I was a tool dealer
for years and have sold 100's of the pow 66 saws with never a problem
that I could not take care of myself. Sounds like freight damage and
trouble with the carrier. Why did youy buy it from Amazon and not
your local dealer? I used to be the "local dealer" and I took care of
my customers and at a fair price. Buying this large a product thru
Amazon might not be worth the savings?

Good luck,
Mike

"joey" wrote in message news:%Fvmc.33282$_41.2755276@attbi_s02...
Sorry to hear of your problems.
I picked up a new 66 from the wood show in Pomona 2 weeks ago(great price).
Packaging was in excellent condition, bolted to oak pallet with oak frame
around it and cardboard box around that. Everything was boxed up properly
and fit and finish excellent. I agree about the cord strain relief and the
'missing wrench'. Love it so far cuts so smoothly


Yup, went to that show and spent mucho money on accessories for the
new saw. I wanted the 30 inch fence, that's why I ordered it from
Amazon. Now I am going to grind a 1 inch wrench from sears to fit the
arbor, gotta get a blade on to test it. Still looking forward to
making sawdust!!!

Larry from Signal Hill

On 6 May 2004 09:34:10 -0700, (LP) wrote:

many snips....


I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com



Did you not have a local dealer?



As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

You are complaining because you got more than you expected?


The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
snips....
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

I wonder if you had one that was a "factory" rebuild? Or a display
saw, that was packed off to you, long after it left the factory?

One (small) advantage of buying stuff made in China- they have to pack
it well, to survive the voyage.



So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this


Every power tool I assemble makes the NEXT tool that much easier. Not
to defend their crappy manual- but the next time you assemble a PM66,
it will be easier. Not that there should be a next time.


insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.


whoops!! Now you have to re-align the insert. Not sure you should
blame them for that.



Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Borrow one from a buddy? I bet it is the same size as Delta supplies
with Unisaws. Of course, they should have sent you one. Not the end
of the world though, if you are short a wrench. I bet I'd find some
way to get that nut off, if I had me a new saw to play with. It
wouldn't have been put on all that tight at the factory, would it?

Hey, I wonder if a bike shop would have a wrench that would fit. Cone
wrenches, used to adjust bicycle wheel bearings, are very thin.




Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

No sympathy from me, here. What if you wanted to wire this with
conduit? or that armoured cable stuff (?RX?) the darn cable clamp
would be in the way. No, that part should be supplied by the
purchaser. What, you didn't have a handful in your toolbox? You just
bought a pack of 5- so you are good for next time.


I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

bolts is bolts. don't cuss it out until it breaks. You know, if you
go and buy a good grade 8 (automotive) bolt, you will have the best
thing around. But if you are tightening it into cast iron, you run
the risk of screwing up the saw. Maybe a cheaper bolt would break
before buggering up the threads cut into thin cast iron. I know, its'
a stretch, but it could happen.



I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are.

I bet Powermatic doesn't sell much to the aerospace industry. A
router is to a Bridgeport as a table saw is to a ....... ??


I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs


I fear you are right. they are resting on their laurels. Those
fellers in Tennessee must not think they have any chance of loosing
their jobs to a chinaman. As have many others in America.


manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.


Where was the Jet made? Just curious-



Feel free to delete this post- I'm in a crappy mood tonight. And you
ain't making it any better. I thought maybe one day I'd get me the
best of the best, a PM66. Guess I shouldn't have waited. Oh well, my
contractors saw (Delta, made in USA) works for me.


Please don't misunderstand my post- I feel bad for you, I feel bad
that an American product would be shipped badly. But there may be one
or two items here where you had unresonable expectations.


And one more related thought- why can't Amazon list the country of
manufacture on it's web pages?


-Dan V.

On 6 May 2004 09:34:10 -0700, (LP) wrote:

It sounds like you're experiencing a lot of frustration and
I'm sorry that you're having an unpleasant experience ... but
it sounds to me lilke you had some shipping problems that are
the carrier's fault and that your expectations were not set
correctly for buying an industrial tool.

I get the impression that you were stretching your knowledge
and experience in buying an industrial tool. An education
is always expensive and often painful, but I think once you
get this behind you, you'll love the saw.

I'm replying to our message because I hope that some other
newbie might be able to profit from the exchange - it's
pretty much too late to help you :-(.

Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.


That's pretty gung ho - mail ordering an industrial tool as your
first(?) stationary tool purchase. A local dealer would have
charged more but also could have provided some hand-holding and
protection from things like a brutal freight company. Choose
your poison! FWIW, I went cheap too.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

Yeah, it's exciting to receive a major purchase.

IIRC, Powermatic describes the motor cover an option ... however, I think
virtually everyone buys a package, which AFAIK always includes a motor
cover, fence, & etc. At least that's the way it was when
I bought mine. I don't think that I've ever seen a bare PM66 for sale.

For example, this 3 HP PM66 package at Amazon clearly includes a motor cover.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00005OQM4/qid=1083867077/sr=1-10/ref=sr_1_10__i10_xgl60/103-5539613-0208612?v=glance&s=home-garden

Remember, this is an industrial tool; For example,
http://www.powermatic.com/PMWood/Tools/Tablesaw/66.html
lists the motor pulley as standard equipment! Presumably, you could order
a non-standard motor pulley. I think Powermatic does do custom
modifications to their machines occasionally. It's hard to imagine a brand
like say, Ryobi listing a motor pulley as standard equipment! :-) How many
Ridgid buyers even know that they are buying a motor pulley as part
of their saws? This is just an indication of the target market.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.


It sounds like your saw was abused in transit. You did complain to
the delivery company and inspect the saw before you accepted it,
didn't you? You did get the damage noted on the delivery receipt?
Despite is weight and beefiness, your saw is a delicate
machine tool. Rough handling (as opposed to rough use) will
destroy it quickly. Imagine what would happen if one of those
satellites that your employer sells were treated roughly in transit.
For example: http://images.spaceref.com/news/2003/09.06.03.noaa-n.lrg.jpg

Is their any sign of more serious damage? Like a broken trunion?

I would expect that PM would replace the missing part, the dado insert
and send you a can of Powermatic Gold spray paint.

One of the small boxes that my saw was shipped in was damaged
during shipment (the motor cover box?). I opened it up at
the freight yard and inspected it before I accepted the saw. In
my case there was no damage, so there was no problem.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.


Powermatic's main market is knowledgable, mostly industrial, users. I'm
sorry if this sounds brutal but I couldn't come up with a gentle way to
say that it's mind-boggling to me that someone buying a PM66 wouldn't
know how to remove the table insert, or a least know how to figure out
how to remove it quickly. When buying this level of tool, there is a
certain level of knowledge assumed. (It's a fair to ask whether
this is the best business decision for the Wilton tool group to
make, but that's another discussion)

Did you look at the dado insert to see how it worked before
you took out the adjustment screws? Looking at the online manual,
on page 11 figure 16, those screws are clearly refered to as
adjustment screws.

I agree that the manual isn't great; actually it's pretty
useless; tho it did help me with figuring out how to mount the
fence. (I wonder why they don't standardize on eithter 1/4" or
5/16" bolts; doing that would reduce their inventory requirements
and simplify assembly) The manual would benefit greatly from
having someone at Powermatic try to follow it to assemble the saw.

But for me and, I expect, most Powermatic customers, the manual is
at most a Bott's Dot in the road; after all it's just a table saw
and who really needs a manual to assemble one?

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.


The two flats on the arbor are new; A good change. My saw
doesn't have them and I haven't really needed them; tho they would
have been handy once or twice. It does seem like they could spend
the 50 cents on a cheap, sheet metal wrench after they've gone thru
the trouble and expense of machining flats in the arbor.

I'd just carefully use a pair of water-pump pliers on the arbor - with
something to pad the jaws so they don't ding the arbor up. An industrial
user would probably just grind down a wrench till it fits.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.


Getting the right cable clamp and power plug was a PITA for me
too ... but how would Powermatic know what kind of plug, cable and
clamp to provide you? The size and length of cable is just
something the plant electrician would know. Many places would be
required to use armored cable or maybe even conduit.

For their main market, the plant electrician would just go to the
supply room (or reach into his tool box) and grab the right parts.

The manual also doesn't mention shimming the top to be flat either.
It's just "something you're expected to know". You're expected
to have shim stock on hand too. Maybe the manual should mention
it if Powermatic wants to target ordinary consumers.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

You're sure that low grade bolts wouldn't do the job better? It's much
better to break the bolt than to strip the table or break an extension.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.


Let's hope that Powermatic does improve their packaging and documentation;
you're right that the cost would be trivial (if not a net savings) and
would improve the experience for at least some customers.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

I hope this gets resolved to your satisfaction and please let us know how
Powermatic handles your problem.

Bob S

(Bob Summers) wrote in message ...
On 6 May 2004 09:34:10 -0700, (LP) wrote:

It sounds like you're experiencing a lot of frustration and
I'm sorry that you're having an unpleasant experience ... but
it sounds to me lilke you had some shipping problems that are
the carrier's fault and that your expectations were not set
correctly for buying an industrial tool.

Sounds to me like he got a machine that someone else had returned
and nobody had bothered to repack the thing properly.

I don't know what Powermatic do for packing but I'll bet they try to
at least do as good a job as Delta. My Unisaw came in a stout
cardboard box bolted to a pallet. Come to think of it I can't
think why any company would pack a saw any other way, the packing
described would not work with a forklift.

I don't know what expectations you have for buying industrial
machinery but I know what the expectations at Amazon are and
I don't think they were met. What happened when you called up
their customer service to complain?

Problem with something like a table saw is that the thing is
so damn heavy that replacement is a really inconvenient option.

These things are NOT sold as industrial tools, perhaps once but
these days the majority of buyers are 'prosumers'. If the market
was just the trade Delta would sell less than a quarter of what
it does today.

It is a pity that the manufacturers have yet to realize this.
They might clue into the fact that a designed for safety table
saw might have a higher WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) than the
baddly designed blade guards and splitters made to be thrown away.

Powermatic and Delta both seem to have an issue here. Thats
hardly surprising since the same distribution network will
distribute both. They need to get a clue and take control of
the distribution system. It makes no sense at all for them to
be shipping machines to Toolcrib to re-ship.

Phillip Hallam-Baker responds:

These things are NOT sold as industrial tools, perhaps once but
these days the majority of buyers are 'prosumers'. If the market
was just the trade Delta would sell less than a quarter of what
it does today.

Probably more like 10%. Most buyers are upscale woodworkers.

It is a pity that the manufacturers have yet to realize this.
They might clue into the fact that a designed for safety table
saw might have a higher WAF (Wife Acceptance Factor) than the
baddly designed blade guards and splitters made to be thrown away

Yeah. And the designs are right there spitting on them. The Biese splitter and
the European crown guard should not cost much more to make than the current POS
guards.

Charlie Self
"Don't let yesterday use up too much of today." Will Rogers

"Leon" writes:


"LRod" wrote in message
news


Regardless of brand, I would strongly recomend buying from your local dealer
and have him deliver the equipment. Seems Delta gets more than its share of
broken trunions from shipping. Let the dealer take care of the headaches so
that you can sit back and enjoy the new equipment.

The dealer still has to have the saw shipped from Delta or a distributor.
I don't think most dealers actually open the boxes to check the condition
of the trunnion.

Brian Elfert

Totally oposite experience here. Packaging was wood framed pallet with
heavy card board box, not even a dent in the box. Gaurd, miter gauge,
motor cover etc in seperate boxes. Picked it up my self from vendors
warehouse. Don't know why the concern over the bolts? mine work just
fine. Never seen a throat plate that didn't just snap in as I'm sure
you've figured out the allen screws are the leveling screws. It is
kind a dumb they don't include the extra wrench although you wouldn't
normally need it. Well I'm sure you will be happy when it is setup and
running


(LP) wrote in message . com...
Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

The fact this saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I
prefer to buy
American when possible.

Not to make a bad situation worse, but my dealer told me that Jet/Powermatic
is a Swiss company who manufactures their products in Taiwan. I don't know
if this is true or not?



"Yahoo" wrote in message
om...
Totally oposite experience here. Packaging was wood framed pallet with
heavy card board box, not even a dent in the box. Gaurd, miter gauge,
motor cover etc in seperate boxes. Picked it up my self from vendors
warehouse. Don't know why the concern over the bolts? mine work just
fine. Never seen a throat plate that didn't just snap in as I'm sure
you've figured out the allen screws are the leveling screws. It is
kind a dumb they don't include the extra wrench although you wouldn't
normally need it. Well I'm sure you will be happy when it is setup and
running


(LP) wrote in message
. com...
Hi, I'm a new guy to this forum, though I have been reading it for
several months. Here's a letter I sent to Powermatic and WMH tool
group. Sorta long...

Hi,

Here is a story I'd like to share with you.

I purchased a brand new Powermatic model 66 table saw from Amazon.com
after much deliberation and brand research. I read reviews on the
internet, checked news groups and talked to vendors at trade shows.
Your saw beat out the Unisaw, it was close, but the real deal maker
was the reputation of the customer support provided by powermatic. I
heard and read horror stories about delta's customer service and I
didn't want to chance needing them and being frustrated. The fact this
saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I prefer to buy
American when possible.

There I was Monday night waiting like a kid at Christmas, delivery to
be after work 6-9 PM. Well the truck pulls up at 9:30 and boy am I
excited to see this shinny new Expensive saw made in USA. By the way,
I also bought a Jet 14 inch bandsaw that was being delivered at the
same time.

As I began unloading the saw I noticed a motor cover, which you
description specifically says is not included, that's really nice
except I had purchased a cover before the saw arrived anticipating the
need for one. Now I'm out that $75.00.

The first thing I notice about this saw is the complete and totally
lousy way everything is packed. Surprisingly nothing appears
destroyed, even thought the saw's wood frame is bashed and broken. But
then again I have not completed the assembly yet, because I couldn't.
After I opened the box/crate for the saw I opened the saw door to look
inside and behold, the dado insert has not been wrapped and has
bounced around inside the saw during transport. Now the inside of my
brand new saw is scratched and the dado insert is nicked and scratched
up. Already looks old and beat up, new from the factory, plus
scratched for rust to start. Then there's another box with the blade
splitter/shield stuffed inside the saw. Upon opening this box, I find
no padding or protection of parts other than little plastic bags to
protect the heavy metal parts from rubbing and scratching on each
other. To add insult to the poor packing job, the tightening knob for
the arbor tilt handle has fallen out and gotten lost somewhere between
your place and mine. The other one was ready to fall out, as it had
backed completely out of its treads but held by the edge of the box.
Some tape would have prevented that lose.

How about that new motor cover. There was absolutely no padding or
protection for this plastic motor cover, and the two self tapping
screws were just thrown in the box, where they have managed to scratch
the cover while the shipment traveled from your factory to my house.

I haven't even started unwrapping the fence or table yet. I'm not
going to be surprised if they are as poorly packed as the rest of the
boxes, hopefully not damaged

So now I start trying to assemble this machine. Lets just say the
manual is quite inferior. I knew nothing about how to assemble this
saw prior to receiving it, so I must rely on the manual for guiding me
through assembly and setup. So I read through the manual and then
began the process. Well, first thing I must do is install the blade.
Sounds simple enough except there is no description of how to get the
insert out. So I unscrew all of the allen screws thinking they are
holding it down, nope they don't. Didn't see any description of that
in the manual.

Next the manual shows a guy using a piece of wood to hold the blade
still while loosening/tightening the arbor nut. Well that is fine and
dandy if there is a blade installed. I can't loosen the arbor nut
installed by the factory with the wrench provided because the arbor
shaft turns. I note there are two flat spots on the arbor shaft and
think to myself, "powermatic guys are smart enough to provide a wrench
to hold the shaft while I loosen the nut (my old cheap Delta saw did)"
so I look through the boxes and parts and find no more wrenches. Then
I look through my tools and no wrenches I have are thin enough to
access the flats on the shaft. So now I have a saw that I can't
install a blade till I find a tool that will hold the shaft. Useless
saw for sawing.

Well okay, lets move on. I'll install a power cable to the saw. Since
Powermatic doesn't provide one or even a guide to buying the right
size, I get one the same gauge as the motor cable 12/3 calculating
this will be big enough. I open the switch cover, looking at the
picture in the manual of how the power is routed (which is good
enough), but crap there is no cable clamp to hold the power cable into
the switch box. Not even a note in the manual that one is needed. So
off I go to Home Depot and buy a package of 5 (only comes in packages
of five) for $1.25 or 25 cents each. Come on guys, a 25 cent part you
know is needed and don't supply or even says it's needed. So I finally
get power and the motor runs (without a saw blade of course). Well one
small success.

I start looking at the bolts to hold the table wings to the saw. I
think these are the lowest grade bolts you could find, I think even
the cheap Delta saw I got rid of had better bolts holding the wings
on. I'm afraid if I use them, they will break off in the saw. So I'll
spend a couple more bucks on my two thousand dollar saw and replace
them with higher grade bolts.

I work in aerospace and I know what quality products, good
documentation and sound packaging are. I feel you people at Powermatic
are living on your reputation, falling short of doing what is
necessary to really make a great product. It's not that hard or costs
that much to make that final step. Maybe your quality department has
been laid of to save money? I don't know but I'll tell you this, the
quality of the product, documentation and packaging I received is
shamefully poor. I sure hope you can take this constructive criticism
and improve your product, after all, you are representatives of US
manufacturing. By the way the Jet bandsaw went together great and all
parts where there and well packaged.

Regards,
Larry Penners
Boeing Satellite Systems
310-416-9383

Gary responds:

The fact this saw is made in the USA was also very important to me, I
prefer to buy
American when possible.

Not to make a bad situation worse, but my dealer told me that Jet/Powermatic
is a Swiss company who manufactures their products in Taiwan. I don't know
if this is true or not?

WMH is a Swiss holding company that owns Jet, Wilton, Powermatic and Peformax
so that part's true. AFAIK, the model 66 is still made in the States, though
I'd hate to bet on how long that will hold true. Many of the other Powermatic
tools are made in Taiwan and China, as are Jet tools (Taiwan was where Jet
tools were first made).


Charlie Self
"In our civilization, and under our republican form of government, intelligence
is so highly honored that it is rewarded by exemption from the cares of
office." Ambrose Bierce