This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

In article ,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
in.local...
In article ,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

JC:

And there's the rub. I'd have to see it in action or go hunting for
reviews.
Another thing meriting mention is it is not cheap. 760 was the lowest
price encountered.

If anyone has it or beats me schedule's opportunity for prowling the
commentaries, it
would be interesting to hear the outfall.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

"Edward Hennessey" wrote in message
m...
This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx


Reminds me of when I saw a Festool miter saw up close and personal.

I wanted one. I didn't need one. I already had a miter saw. And I couldn't
afford it.

But I still wanted one.

It looks like great engineering. It also looks expensive. I wonder how well
those articulating arms would hold up in the field.

On 10/23/2010 3:07 AM, Lee Michaels wrote:

Reminds me of when I saw a Festool miter saw up close and personal.

I wanted one. I didn't need one. I already had a miter saw. And I
couldn't afford it.

But I still wanted one.

Know the feeling well. If I were a trim carpenter, I'd have one in a
heartbeat ... along with the MFT table, and the ...

ITMT, the Makita LS1013 perfectly fills any need.

But I still want one ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Oct 23, 3:59*am, "Edward Hennessey"
wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote in message

in.local...

In article ,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...s/bosch-axial-....

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

JC:

And there's the rub. I'd have to see it in action or go hunting for
reviews.
Another thing meriting mention is it is not cheap. 760 was the lowest
price encountered.

If anyone has it or beats me schedule's opportunity for prowling the
commentaries, it
would be interesting to hear the outfall.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

This CMS definitely appeals to wreckers with a severe case of tool
lust.

JoeG

On Oct 23, 1:42*am, "J. Clarke" wrote:

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

Sheesh.

R

On Oct 23, 4:07*am, "Lee Michaels" leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast
dot net wrote:
"Edward *Hennessey" wrote in messagenews:1qSdnTVPdPas7F_RnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@earth link.com... This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...s/bosch-axial-...

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

Reminds me of when I saw a Festool miter saw up close and personal.

I wanted one. I didn't need one. I already had a miter saw. *And I couldn't
afford it.

But I still wanted one.

It looks like great engineering. *It also looks expensive. I wonder how well
those articulating arms would hold up in the field.

That's the question. More joints, more freedom of movement, more
potential play in the mechanism. The Festool "reclaimed that real
estate" by moving the rails forward. Bosch can't do a direct copy of
the Festool design, whether or not it's patented, because there's
German pride on the line.

R

On 10/23/10 12:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article1qSdnTVPdPas7F_RnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@earthlink .com,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Fri, 22 Oct 2010 22:22:51 -0700, "Edward Hennessey"
wrote:

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

Sweet! Beats the hell out of my HF 12-incher, but the price reflects
it. I'm glad I don't need the extra precision.

--
I am an old man, but in many senses a very young man.
And this is what I want you to be, young, young all
your life. -- Pablo Casals

In m,
Edward Hennessey spewed forth:
This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

If it works as well as their other tools, I'd say it's a keeper
But I'm partial to Bosch and Milwakee

In article ,
says...

On 10/23/10 12:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article1qSdnTVPdPas7F_RnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@earthlink .com,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 12:42:17 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?

That was my concern after watching the video. There's a lot of joints
there - a lot of room for slop.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On 10/23/10 11:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In ,
says...

On 10/23/10 12:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article1qSdnTVPdPas7F_RnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@earthlink .com,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?



Who said it wasn't rigid enough? I haven't used one, so I don't know.
But I have used some tube sliders that had way too much play for the
price.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

In article ,
says...

On 10/23/10 11:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In ,
says...

On 10/23/10 12:42 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In article1qSdnTVPdPas7F_RnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@earthlink .com,
says...

This is different:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...-products-2010

http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?



Who said it wasn't rigid enough?

Who said it was?

I haven't used one, so I don't know.
But I have used some tube sliders that had way too much play for the
price.

Bingo. So does this thing address that problem or does it make that
worse to gain something else?

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 12:42:17 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:
[...snip....

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?

I went looking for reviews. Here's one:

http://www.protoolreviews.com/review...e-12-miter-saw

And some snips:

The result? Unbelievably smooth travel and much better control
over your cuts. Bosch has made a precision machine that
is capable, in our opinion, as being labeled the first saw
that can consistently handle 1/32" accuracy every time.

Given the sealed
ball bearing construction, the other great thing is
that it won't degrade over time, and the robust nature
of the cast aluminum arms means that even at extreme
bevels the system retains its perfectly smooth action

Their dual purpose dust port adapts, right out of the box
to standard 1-1/4" (33 mm) vacuum hoses and offers up to
90% dust efficiency when cutting 2x material with an attached
vacuum. We tried it out and the reduction in dust was remarkable.

Upfront
Control system to eliminate the need to reach your arm behind the saw
to make bevel adjustments. All of the bevel lock lever and range
selector controls are located right in front and are all-metal
construction. Bosch also kept its easy-to-use Squarelock Quick-Release
fence system.

The saw comes with a full 3 horsepower (HP), 15 amp
motor and provides 3,800 rpm.

Bosch's GCM12SD Glide Miter Saw doesn't feature an integrated laser.

No laser? How can that be???

Anyway, sounds promising to me. Beyond my budget, but in the range of
other top end miter saws.

On Oct 23, 2:11*pm, Jim Weisgram
wrote:
On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 12:42:17 -0400, "J. wrote:

[...snip....

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?

I went looking for reviews. Here's one:

http://www.protoolreviews.com/review...d/saws-routers...

And some snips:

{and one of mine!}

The saw comes with a full 3 horsepower (HP), 15 amp
motor and provides 3,800 rpm.
Bosch's GCM12SD Glide Miter Saw doesn't feature an integrated laser.

No laser? How can that be???

Anyway, sounds promising to me. Beyond my budget, but in the range of
other top end miter saws.

Well, that certainly is a glowing review, but I'd never heard of that
web site, so I wanted to see what sort of review they gave to the
Festool CMS. Umm, they didn't. They haven't reviewed a single
Festool item, other than the new Systainer and a 3rd party saw blade.
How can that be?

That's kind of an odd omission, no? Maybe that's one of the Mercury
News type of review sites that always give glowing reviews to movies,
even the ones that suck. I know the Bosch doesn't suck, but they just
bought right into whatever Bosch fed them, have no on the job
experience with the saw, and, well, it's not even on the market yet.
Time will tell if the linkage stands up to use and abuse.

R

On 10/23/10 1:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?



Who said it wasn't rigid enough?

Who said it was?


You like to assume the worst, don't you? :-)
I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well.
And you know, what? If it's not, I take it back for a refund.


I haven't used one, so I don't know.
But I have used some tube sliders that had way too much play for the
price.

Bingo. So does this thing address that problem or does it make that
worse to gain something else?


I guess we'll find out.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

In article ,
says...

On 10/23/10 1:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?



Who said it wasn't rigid enough?

Who said it was?


You like to assume the worst, don't you? :-)

I'm an engineer. We don't just go rah-rah at every new "innovation"
that comes down the pike.

I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well.
And you know, what? If it's not, I take it back for a refund.

I don't take anything for granted.

I haven't used one, so I don't know.
But I have used some tube sliders that had way too much play for the
price.

Bingo. So does this thing address that problem or does it make that
worse to gain something else?


I guess we'll find out.

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 11:11:10 -0700, Jim Weisgram quoted:

Given the sealed
ball bearing construction, the other great thing is that it won't
degrade over time, and the robust nature of the cast aluminum arms means
that even at extreme bevels the system retains its perfectly smooth
action

I'd have to argue with that. Sealed ball bearings do degrade over time,
although in this case "time" may be long enough to not matter.

I have worn out a couple of sets in the steering stems of motorcycles :-).

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

"-MIKE-" wrote in message
...

You like to assume the worst, don't you? :-)
I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well.
And you know, what? If it's not, I take it back for a refund.

I have yet to buy a Bosch power tool that disappointed me. I won't buy this
one without hearing the market's reaction, but it's sure on my list.

Sure looks good to me and I need a new one.

The short back stroke looks handy.
I wonder if they put softstart into it. One of them had it years
ago...either Bosch or Ryobi??




"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...
I have yet to buy a Bosch power tool that disappointed me. I won't buy this
one without hearing the market's reaction, but it's sure on my list.


"-MIKE-" wrote in message
...

You like to assume the worst, don't you? :-)
I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well.
And you know, what? If it's not, I take it back for a refund.

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 23:20:30 +0000 (UTC), Larry Blanchard
wrote:

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 11:11:10 -0700, Jim Weisgram quoted:

Given the sealed
ball bearing construction, the other great thing is that it won't
degrade over time, and the robust nature of the cast aluminum arms means
that even at extreme bevels the system retains its perfectly smooth
action

I'd have to argue with that. Sealed ball bearings do degrade over time,
although in this case "time" may be long enough to not matter.

I have worn out a couple of sets in the steering stems of motorcycles :-).

Perhaps there is a wee bit more action on those steering bearings?

--
I am an old man, but in many senses a very young man.
And this is what I want you to be, young, young all
your life. -- Pablo Casals

About $700? Well, the tool needs to last for more than 5 years for
industrial use and longer for personal use. These types of tools
should not have to be replaced as often as updating or purchasing new
computers... are we getting into that mindset?

When Delta first came out with the Sawbuck, I thought is was the cat's
meow. I bought a second generation Sawbuck (the table was upgraded),
for about $500, back in the early 1980s, I think. I still use it and
it still works very well. It's been a good investment, IMO. About
80% of its use has been personal/hobby, I suppose.

$700 shouldn't be a negative, if the tool will stand up to time of
good rugged, non-abusive use and remain accurate with its performance.

Sonny

On Oct 23, 5:32*pm, "J. Clarke" wrote:
In article ,
says...







On 10/23/10 1:04 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
http://www.boschtools.com/Innovation...Miter-Saw.aspx

But is it really a better design or just typical modern German
engineering for the sake of engineering?

I say, yes, it's better, if only to save the space behind the saw.

Even if it isn't rigid enough to maintain accurate angles?

Who said it wasn't rigid enough?

Who said it was?

You like to assume the worst, don't you? * :-)

I'm an engineer. *We don't just go rah-rah at every new "innovation"
that comes down the pike.

I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well..
And you know, what? *If it's not, I take it back for a refund.

I don't take anything for granted.



I haven't used one, so I don't know.
But I have used some tube sliders that had way too much play for the
price.

Bingo. So does this thing address that problem or does it make that
worse to gain something else?

I guess we'll find out.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'm not an engineer but I do have a lot of background in how things
work or wear (Machine Tool Rebuilder in another lifetime) and I have
to say that the more moving parts or joints the more chance for
"slop". I have the Bosch 12" slider that I bought when they first came
out and it's still real accurate but the tubes are just a c hair
sloppy. I haven't looked in the manual but I think I can take up the
slop some...
I look forward to more reviews by "wreckers" who have hands on
experience then I might sell mine and upgrade. It looks real cool too.

RP

On Sat, 23 Oct 2010 16:38:16 -0700, "DGDevin" wrote:


"-MIKE-" wrote in message
...

You like to assume the worst, don't you? :-)
I take for granted that a $700 Bosch saw is going to be built very well.
And you know, what? If it's not, I take it back for a refund.

I have yet to buy a Bosch power tool that disappointed me. I won't buy this
one without hearing the market's reaction, but it's sure on my list.

I just bought a 5312 and am rather disappointed in its dust collection, or
lack thereof.