On 08/15/2010 09:07 PM, Steve Turner wrote:
On 8/15/2010 6:25 PM, Josepi wrote:
Yeah. A simple DPDT switch to dynamically brake that blade would make that
long blafe wind-down wait much shorter and probably more done (waited) by
more users.

1

(get it?)

I was pressing "1" for English... (ba-dop, PSSSHH!)

--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

Perhaps we have less time to suffer from the injury so the safety aspect
becomes less paramount??

I remember a time people fought seat belts in the cars but, after having
them forced on us, they became "second nature". Now we feel insecure without
one on. All about habits.


"Jack Stein" wrote in message
...
.... and, the older I get, the more
dangerous I get!

--
Jack
Don't worry about your health... It'll go away!
http://jbstein.com

On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 18:25:52 -0500, Leon wrote:

IIRC there are 2 switches, the main that powers the safety device and
also powers the switch to turn the saw on. Also IIRC the system has to
power up so to speak before you can turn the saw on. If during the
initial power up a fault is detected you can not turn the saw on.

OTOH, there is an override switch for use if you're cutting really green
wood. I'm still waiting for an accident report where someone forgot
they'd used that switch and left it in override.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

"tiredofspam" nospam.nospam.com wrote in message
...
8 years ago. The saw only hit the market 2 years ago.

The saw has been on the market at least 4-5 years, probably closer to 6.


8 years ago it was still being demoed to the other manufacturers.

Still being demoed to the manufactureres did not mean that you could not ask
questions.

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 17:45:58 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:


That is correct in some instances. Will your guard set up properly,
when
ripping stock to 1/8" widths, or when cutting dado's?

"By the book" you're supposed to rip it with the wide piece between the
fence and the blade and move the fence for every cut or use the off-cut
as a spacer rather than just setting the fence and cutting. Here's a
video (not mine--it's amazing what you can find by searching youtube)
showing the "safe" way to rip 1/8" widths:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FullQWi2ZwM

Extra credit: What safety rules does _he_ violate in that video?

Not sure if this is your point but he likes to reach around the blade as
its
winding down. I've seen that it a few of his videos.


Actually the video illustrates a way to more safely cut the thin strips up
to the point that your remaining stock becomes thin it self. Basically if
you want to use all of your material to make thin stock you are going to end
up with the fence close to the blade eventually. The video and the keeper
pieces on the opposite side of the blade does not address cutting 3/4" wide
stock into 3~4, 1/8" wide pieces.

The Gripper and "their" splitter addresses this.

On 8/16/2010 2:11 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 18:25:52 -0500, Leon wrote:

IIRC there are 2 switches, the main that powers the safety device and
also powers the switch to turn the saw on. Also IIRC the system has to
power up so to speak before you can turn the saw on. If during the
initial power up a fault is detected you can not turn the saw on.

OTOH, there is an override switch for use if you're cutting really green
wood. I'm still waiting for an accident report where someone forgot
they'd used that switch and left it in override.

The override resets when you turn the motor off, so there's no way to
leave it in override.

On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:43:13 -0400, Nova wrote:

tiredofspam wrote:

8 years ago. The saw only hit the market 2 years ago.
8 years ago it was still being demoed to the other manufacturers.


From Sawatop web site at:

http://www.sawstop.com/company/story.php

"As a long-time woodworker, Steve committed himself to designing a
cabinet saw with all the precision and features he had ever wanted in a
table saw. By 2003, plans and designs were drafted. The first prototypes
were completed and the first production models came off of the
manufacturing line in late 2004. By the beginning of 2005 SawStop the
company, had became a reality.

And voila!, the product didn't sell worth a **** because they were
TWICE the price of regular saws. He could have had his product in
every saw in the world if he'd been reasonable. Instead of licensing
it for a decent price, he wanted full boat for each device. (would you
call him a greedy bastid?) You see, as I understand it, he was a
speaking weasel (patent atty) first, a woodworker second. deep sigh

He apparently chose gold and infamy over worldwide saw safety.

And the horse he rode in on...

--
Invest in America: Buy a CONgresscritter today!

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:43:13 -0400, Nova wrote:


tiredofspam wrote:


8 years ago. The saw only hit the market 2 years ago.
8 years ago it was still being demoed to the other manufacturers.


From Sawatop web site at:

http://www.sawstop.com/company/story.php

"As a long-time woodworker, Steve committed himself to designing a
cabinet saw with all the precision and features he had ever wanted in a
table saw. By 2003, plans and designs were drafted. The first prototypes
were completed and the first production models came off of the
manufacturing line in late 2004. By the beginning of 2005 SawStop the
company, had became a reality.


And voila!, the product didn't sell worth a **** because they were
TWICE the price of regular saws. He could have had his product in
every saw in the world if he'd been reasonable. Instead of licensing
it for a decent price, he wanted full boat for each device. (would you
call him a greedy bastid?) You see, as I understand it, he was a
speaking weasel (patent atty) first, a woodworker second. deep sigh

He apparently chose gold and infamy over worldwide saw safety.

And the horse he rode in on...

--
Invest in America: Buy a CONgresscritter today!

IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:43:13 -0400, Nova wrote:

tiredofspam wrote:

8 years ago. The saw only hit the market 2 years ago.
8 years ago it was still being demoed to the other manufacturers.


From Sawatop web site at:

http://www.sawstop.com/company/story.php

"As a long-time woodworker, Steve committed himself to designing a
cabinet saw with all the precision and features he had ever wanted in a
table saw. By 2003, plans and designs were drafted. The first prototypes
were completed and the first production models came off of the
manufacturing line in late 2004. By the beginning of 2005 SawStop the
company, had became a reality.

And voila!, the product didn't sell worth a **** because they were
TWICE the price of regular saws.

I don't know where you live but the SawStop out sells Jet, Unisaw, and
Powermatic combined at our local Woodcraft in Houston.



He could have had his product in
every saw in the world if he'd been reasonable. Instead of licensing
it for a decent price, he wanted full boat for each device. (would you
call him a greedy bastid?) You see, as I understand it, he was a
speaking weasel (patent atty) first, a woodworker second. deep sigh

Does any one really know what the license would have cost? On the flip side
of the coin, IIRC he was not even going to build the saw or compete with the
other companies. They chose to not buy the license figuring no one would
pay that much for their own safety. Now those other manufacturers are
loosing sales to SawStop.


He apparently chose gold and infamy over worldwide saw safety.

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it would
naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

"J. Clarke" wrote

Seems to be a religion for some people. For me the RAS has never been as
scary as the table saw. I'm happy to have both--gives me options, and if
I have one set up for an operation I can use the other one for other work.

The only thing I will not do in a shop is rip with a radial arm saw.

THAT should be outlawed, IMHO. A board with some internal grain stress can
cause a bad situation if it is ripped on a RAS.
--
Jim in NC

"Nova" wrote in message
...


IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

IIRC he offered the license and when he was turned down went to the
government. Now I am guessing that most the manufacturers wish that they
had done otherwise. Anyway probably as a result most manufacturers began
offering riving knives and marginally better guards. Now I believe all saws
have to have the riving knives.

Imagine the controversy way back when, when the current style guard was
introduced and mandated by the government to be use on all saws.... I
wonder who the SOB was that came up with that absurd thing ;~)

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 18:32:15 -0400, "Morgans"
wrote:


"J. Clarke" wrote

Seems to be a religion for some people. For me the RAS has never been as
scary as the table saw. I'm happy to have both--gives me options, and if
I have one set up for an operation I can use the other one for other work.

The only thing I will not do in a shop is rip with a radial arm saw.

THAT should be outlawed, IMHO. A board with some internal grain stress can
cause a bad situation if it is ripped on a RAS.

I had a piece of cedar cause the blade to jump on top and come at me on a
cross cut. Scary thing that. I had another piece from the same lot stop the
saw dead; also a cross cut. The thing threw a couple of pieces when ripping,
too. I trust the table saw a *lot* more. At least the table doesn't flex.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:42:39 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


"Nova" wrote in message
.. .


IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

IIRC he offered the license and when he was turned down went to the
government. Now I am guessing that most the manufacturers wish that they
had done otherwise. Anyway probably as a result most manufacturers began
offering riving knives and marginally better guards. Now I believe all saws
have to have the riving knives.

Since when? My 18-month-old Unisaur doesn't have a riving knife. They're
still selling them.

Imagine the controversy way back when, when the current style guard was
introduced and mandated by the government to be use on all saws.... I
wonder who the SOB was that came up with that absurd thing ;~)

Got a cite for the "mandate"?

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 09:07:51 -0400, Jack Stein wrote:

Leon wrote:
"Jack Stein" wrote in message
Leon wrote:
My injury was also after the cut and
after the saw was turned off. SawStop would have prevented my injury.
Not sure, but my guess is after the saw is turned off, saw stop will no
longer work?

Nope, I confirmed this about 8 years ago. Turning the SawStop motor off
does not turn off its ability to dectct flesh while the blade is still
spinning. Until the blade stops spinning the brake works as it would when
cutting wood.

IIRC there are 2 switches, the main that powers the safety device and also
powers the switch to turn the saw on. Also IIRC the system has to power up
so to speak before you can turn the saw on. If during the initial power up
a fault is detected you can not turn the saw on.

Sounds like a winner... Sounded pretty good before. My next saw will
probably be a sawstop or similar. My saw is barely broke in though,
it's only about 56 years old and should have that much left in her...

Lemme see.... 114. Nope, I don't think that'll be a good time to replace my
saw. ;-)

I
did look at a saw stop a few years ago and it looks great, Over priced
perhaps, but still looked like a nice saw, even w/o the saw stop stuff.
If I were buying a new saw, I'd probably buy one so my kid wouldn't cut
off an arm after he inherits my tools... and, the older I get, the more
dangerous I get!

As I've said, I just bought a Unisaur last year. I looked at the SawStop but
there was no way I was going to spend that sort of money. Perhaps in ten
years, when the patent runs out (guessing by the dates thrown around here),
I'll buy a new saw with the SawStop feature.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:52:45 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 17:45:58 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:


That is correct in some instances. Will your guard set up properly,
when
ripping stock to 1/8" widths, or when cutting dado's?

"By the book" you're supposed to rip it with the wide piece between the
fence and the blade and move the fence for every cut or use the off-cut
as a spacer rather than just setting the fence and cutting. Here's a
video (not mine--it's amazing what you can find by searching youtube)
showing the "safe" way to rip 1/8" widths:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FullQWi2ZwM

Extra credit: What safety rules does _he_ violate in that video?

Not sure if this is your point but he likes to reach around the blade as
its
winding down. I've seen that it a few of his videos.


Actually the video illustrates a way to more safely cut the thin strips up
to the point that your remaining stock becomes thin it self. Basically if
you want to use all of your material to make thin stock you are going to end
up with the fence close to the blade eventually.

Of course. That was the whole point of the video. I have a mag-switch thingy
with a roller on the pointy end for this purpose.

The question was: "What safety rules does _he_ violate in that video?"
Reaching around behind the blade was the only thing I saw.

The video and the keeper
pieces on the opposite side of the blade does not address cutting 3/4" wide
stock into 3~4, 1/8" wide pieces.

Sure it did; "don't do that!".

The Gripper and "their" splitter addresses this.

We'll see. I ordered a pair. The price was right.

On 8/16/2010 6:32 PM, Morgans wrote:
"J. wrote

Seems to be a religion for some people. For me the RAS has never been as
scary as the table saw. I'm happy to have both--gives me options, and if
I have one set up for an operation I can use the other one for other work.

The only thing I will not do in a shop is rip with a radial arm saw.

THAT should be outlawed, IMHO. A board with some internal grain stress can
cause a bad situation if it is ripped on a RAS.

If it's one of the big ones maybe. My 1.5 horse Craftsman just stalls
and pops the overload in that situation.

On 8/16/2010 6:29 PM, Leon wrote:
"Larry wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Aug 2010 21:43:13 -0400, wrote:

tiredofspam wrote:

8 years ago. The saw only hit the market 2 years ago.
8 years ago it was still being demoed to the other manufacturers.


From Sawatop web site at:

http://www.sawstop.com/company/story.php

"As a long-time woodworker, Steve committed himself to designing a
cabinet saw with all the precision and features he had ever wanted in a
table saw. By 2003, plans and designs were drafted. The first prototypes
were completed and the first production models came off of the
manufacturing line in late 2004. By the beginning of 2005 SawStop the
company, had became a reality.

And voila!, the product didn't sell worth a **** because they were
TWICE the price of regular saws.

I don't know where you live but the SawStop out sells Jet, Unisaw, and
Powermatic combined at our local Woodcraft in Houston.



He could have had his product in
every saw in the world if he'd been reasonable. Instead of licensing
it for a decent price, he wanted full boat for each device. (would you
call him a greedy bastid?) You see, as I understand it, he was a
speaking weasel (patent atty) first, a woodworker second.deep sigh

Does any one really know what the license would have cost? On the flip side
of the coin, IIRC he was not even going to build the saw or compete with the
other companies. They chose to not buy the license figuring no one would
pay that much for their own safety. Now those other manufacturers are
loosing sales to SawStop.


He apparently chose gold and infamy over worldwide saw safety.

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it would
naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

The guy who invented it is a lawyer and he doesn't seem to be able to
get out of that mindset.

zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:42:39 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


"Nova" wrote in message
. ..



IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

IIRC he offered the license and when he was turned down went to the
government. Now I am guessing that most the manufacturers wish that they
had done otherwise. Anyway probably as a result most manufacturers began
offering riving knives and marginally better guards. Now I believe all saws
have to have the riving knives.


Since when? My 18-month-old Unisaur doesn't have a riving knife. They're
still selling them.


Imagine the controversy way back when, when the current style guard was
introduced and mandated by the government to be use on all saws.... I
wonder who the SOB was that came up with that absurd thing ;~)


Got a cite for the "mandate"?

I don't think a riving knife is mandatory but I believe in 2009
Underwriters Laboratories required a table saw to be equipped with a
riving knife to obtain certification under UL 987 Section 42.3.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:42:39 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


"Nova" wrote in message
. ..


IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

IIRC he offered the license and when he was turned down went to the
government. Now I am guessing that most the manufacturers wish that they
had done otherwise. Anyway probably as a result most manufacturers began
offering riving knives and marginally better guards. Now I believe all
saws
have to have the riving knives.

Since when? My 18-month-old Unisaur doesn't have a riving knife. They're
still selling them.

"Now" is not 18 months ago. ;~) And perhaps what I should have mentioned
was that that TS being manufacutred "now" whould have the riving knife, as I
have been told. Basically it is very easy to buy a new saw with a riving
knife now with out having to go to a specific brand in particular. There
may be exceptions to the rule.
BTY the "latest" Unisaw that appeared last year, the one with 2 controll
wheels on the front, has a riving knife. Jet has had one for about 2-3
years, Powermatic introduced it with the 2000 model.



Imagine the controversy way back when, when the current style guard was
introduced and mandated by the government to be use on all saws.... I
wonder who the SOB was that came up with that absurd thing ;~)

Got a cite for the "mandate"?

No. Is there an option to buy a saw with out the guard? I highly suspect
the government has been involved in some way.
As a majority of users do not use the guard....

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 09:07:51 -0400, Jack Stein
wrote:

As I've said, I just bought a Unisaur last year. I looked at the SawStop
but
there was no way I was going to spend that sort of money. Perhaps in ten
years, when the patent runs out (guessing by the dates thrown around
here),
I'll buy a new saw with the SawStop feature.

Might be a good plan, to wait..... But this guy being a patent attourney...
He may pull the same thing that DuPond did with Freon 12. their patent ran
out and they lobbied to out law the old Freon 12 in favor for their new
freon that would not harme the ozone.

The current SawStop may be too "flawed" compared to the new 2020 model. LOL

So safe is the new automotive freon that they want all freon to be
evacuated, captured, and reused instead of exposing the mechanics to the
gas...... Toungue in cheek.

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 14:52:45 -0500, "Leon" wrote:
The Gripper and "their" splitter addresses this.

We'll see. I ordered a pair. The price was right.


Seriously I too was skeptical for some time but now I would not want to be
with out them. I truly think you will be happy with them. If you can get
your hands on their DVD it has a world of suggested uses that make certain
things possible.

I have not see all of the on-line videos on the site, perhaps they cover the
gambit.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 16:38:56 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

On 8/16/2010 2:11 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:


OTOH, there is an override switch for use if you're cutting really
green wood. I'm still waiting for an accident report where someone
forgot they'd used that switch and left it in override.

The override resets when you turn the motor off, so there's no way to
leave it in override.

Thanks - that's good to know. I *should* have known it, since I used to
work for Woodcraft - must be my senility showing :-).

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.


--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Less than 10%, that's all??

To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was going
to add 25% to the cost of the saw.



Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.

Profit percentage would remain the same, you don't eat the added cost, Mark
it up the same percentage and the profit margin remains the same. We could
only wish that equipment did not increase in cost 10% every few yers.

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Less than 10%, that's all??

That's just for the Right to use the patent. Then you add on the cost to
manufacture the hardware and electronics. NTM, the cost of changing
production methods, etc.


To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was
going to add 25% to the cost of the saw.

Probably more like 40%.




Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.

Profit percentage would remain the same, you don't eat the added cost,

Assuming you can sell an added 40%+ to the customers.

Mark it up the same percentage and the profit margin remains the same. We
could only wish that equipment did not increase in cost 10% every few
yers.

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
...
"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially
increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Less than 10%, that's all??

That's just for the Right to use the patent. Then you add on the cost to
manufacture the hardware and electronics. NTM, the cost of changing
production methods, etc.

Yeah,,, IIRC the additional cost was going to average $275 per unit. So now
you sell the saw for $750 more. But wait they are already doing that with
out the SawStop technology, eh Delta?



To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was
going to add 25% to the cost of the saw.

Probably more like 40%.

No it was not that high.





Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.

Profit percentage would remain the same, you don't eat the added cost,

Assuming you can sell an added 40%+ to the customers.

SawStop seems to be doing great despite the big difference in cost.
When compairing sales at the local Woodcraft the majority are paying the
extra price for the extra piece of mind, safety, and better quality.

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
...
"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose
now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially
increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Less than 10%, that's all??

That's just for the Right to use the patent. Then you add on the cost to
manufacture the hardware and electronics. NTM, the cost of changing
production methods, etc.

Yeah,,, IIRC the additional cost was going to average $275 per unit. So
now you sell the saw for $750 more. But wait they are already doing that
with out the SawStop technology, eh Delta?



To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was
going to add 25% to the cost of the saw.

Probably more like 40%.

No it was not that high.





Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.

Profit percentage would remain the same, you don't eat the added cost,

Assuming you can sell an added 40%+ to the customers.

SawStop seems to be doing great despite the big difference in cost.
When compairing sales at the local Woodcraft the majority are paying the
extra price for the extra piece of mind, safety, and better quality.

If I were in the market for a saw and the price between the SawStop and the
major brands was less than 50% or so, I'd go SawStop. The quality Appears
better and there is that peace of mind ...

"Leon" wrote

Less than 10%, that's all??

To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was
going to add 25% to the cost of the saw.


I would be happy to pay 6% extra for the saw stop function.

I would not buy the saw stop company saw because of the features it is
lacking.

I want at minnimum a 12" blade, and at least 5 HP motor.

Also, my school is wired with 208 voltage. If the saw motor is not wound
for 208 instead of 230, you get a motor that does not put out rated power
and overheats pretty fast, because it runs drawing many more amps that it is
supposed to. Not good for those projects where students are waiting in a
line to use the table saw. Constant use with the wrong voltage motor will
cause the thermal protection to trip at the drop of a hat.
--
Jim in NC

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

If I were in the market for a saw and the price between the SawStop and
the major brands was less than 50% or so, I'd go SawStop. The quality
Appears better and there is that peace of mind ...
You are the second to say that the quality of sawstop is better. I am
surprised at that.

What other saws are you comparing sawstop to, saying the quality is
superior?
--
Jim in NC

"Lew Hodgett" wrote

Todays motors are usually wired to handle 208V.

Humm. I have to respectfully disagree. Ever put a meter on a saw in
operation, to see how much it draws while under heavy load? I put one on a
230 volt motor running on 208 and was amazed. Amazed that a motor could
draw that much over specs, for one.

If not, a simple buck-boost transformer solves the problem.

More cost and something else for students to tear up. Much better to get
the right motor to start with.
--
Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

If I were in the market for a saw and the price between the SawStop and
the major brands was less than 50% or so, I'd go SawStop. The quality
Appears better and there is that peace of mind ...
You are the second to say that the quality of sawstop is better. I am
surprised at that.

What other saws are you comparing sawstop to, saying the quality is
superior?


I'm just saying it Appears better, side to side with Delta and Jet.

--
National Socialism showed what can happen when very ordinary people get
control of a state and the merely opportunistic are regarded as
intellectuals.

Anthony Burgess

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

I'm just saying it Appears better, side to side with Delta and Jet.

Interesting. How would you rank Jet vs. Delta, and Delta vs Powermatic?
--
Jim in NC

On Aug 15, 7:25*pm, "Leon" wrote:
"Jack Stein" wrote in message

...

Leon wrote:
*My injury was also after the cut and
after the saw was turned off. *SawStop would have prevented my injury.

Not sure, but my guess is after the saw is turned off, saw stop will no
longer work?

Nope, I confirmed this about 8 years ago. *Turning the SawStop motor off
does not turn off its ability to dectct flesh while the blade is still
spinning. *Until the blade stops spinning the brake works as it would when
cutting wood.

IIRC there are 2 switches, the main that powers the safety device and also
powers the switch to turn the saw on. *Also IIRC the system has to power up
so to speak before you can turn the saw on. *If during the initial power up
a fault is detected you can not turn the saw on.

Yep. I just used one today and had that issue. Saw wouldn't start
until I cleaned it off - dust everywhere cuz it's on a jobsite with no
DC. Blew it off, restarted it and it worked fine. There are two
switches - one for the stop mech and one for the blade spin. Nice
saw. Well built. Pricey though.

JP

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

I'm just saying it Appears better, side to side with Delta and Jet.

Interesting. How would you rank Jet vs. Delta, and Delta vs Powermatic?

Never had my mitts on a Powermatic saw and the only reason I mention SawStop
was I spent some time looking at the other three last week. On Appearance -
which has a lot to do with how well they were put together by store staff -
I'd say SawStop, Delta, then Jet.

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

I'm just saying it Appears better, side to side with Delta and Jet.

Interesting. How would you rank Jet vs. Delta, and Delta vs Powermatic?
--

You know, just thinking about it I wonder how much price has to do with the
Appearance of quality. The price sets some expectations and perhaps one sees
that which is not visible ...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
...

SawStop seems to be doing great despite the big difference in cost.
When compairing sales at the local Woodcraft the majority are paying the
extra price for the extra piece of mind, safety, and better quality.

If I were in the market for a saw and the price between the SawStop and
the major brands was less than 50% or so, I'd go SawStop. The quality
Appears better and there is that peace of mind ...

But darn I am not in the market either....otherwise I'd be on it.

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

If I were in the market for a saw and the price between the SawStop and
the major brands was less than 50% or so, I'd go SawStop. The quality
Appears better and there is that peace of mind ...
You are the second to say that the quality of sawstop is better. I am
surprised at that.

What other saws are you comparing sawstop to, saying the quality is
superior?


With out question I would say "current latest models" from Delta, Jet,
Powermatic...

On Tue, 17 Aug 2010 08:31:25 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 17:42:39 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


"Nova" wrote in message
...


IIRC, he first tried to get the government to pass legislation requiring
his device on all table saw sold in the US. When that failed he started
producing his own table saws.

IIRC he offered the license and when he was turned down went to the
government. Now I am guessing that most the manufacturers wish that they
had done otherwise. Anyway probably as a result most manufacturers began
offering riving knives and marginally better guards. Now I believe all
saws
have to have the riving knives.

Since when? My 18-month-old Unisaur doesn't have a riving knife. They're
still selling them.

"Now" is not 18 months ago. ;~) And perhaps what I should have mentioned
was that that TS being manufacutred "now" whould have the riving knife, as I
have been told. Basically it is very easy to buy a new saw with a riving
knife now with out having to go to a specific brand in particular. There
may be exceptions to the rule.
BTY the "latest" Unisaw that appeared last year, the one with 2 controll
wheels on the front, has a riving knife. Jet has had one for about 2-3
years, Powermatic introduced it with the 2000 model.

Yes, but they're still selling the older Unisaurs. I don't believe they've
retrofitted a riving knife. I don't see one, anyway:

http://www.deltaportercable.com/Prod...roductID=11143


Imagine the controversy way back when, when the current style guard was
introduced and mandated by the government to be use on all saws.... I
wonder who the SOB was that came up with that absurd thing ;~)

Got a cite for the "mandate"?

No. Is there an option to buy a saw with out the guard? I highly suspect
the government has been involved in some way.
As a majority of users do not use the guard....

My bet is that it's their lawyers who have made this decision, not a
government mandate.

On Tue, 17 Aug 2010 16:07:20 -0500, "Leon" wrote:


"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 20:41:37 -0400, J. Clarke wrote:

I suspect that the industry could still buy the license however it
would naturally be more expensive since SawStop has more to loose now.

According to one account he wants 3 percent per saw initially increasing
to 8 percent as sales increase--I can't see any company in their right
mind agreeing to that--normally it's a high charge up front decreasing
with volume.

Less than 10%, that's all??

To be compeditive I would certanly bite. I thought initiallly it was going
to add 25% to the cost of the saw.



Not to mention that the markup on most stationary power tools is pretty
low to start with.

Profit percentage would remain the same, you don't eat the added cost, Mark
it up the same percentage and the profit margin remains the same. We could
only wish that equipment did not increase in cost 10% every few yers.

That's only true if a competitor doesn't have that cost.

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
...
"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Lobby Dosser" wrote

I'm just saying it Appears better, side to side with Delta and Jet.

Interesting. How would you rank Jet vs. Delta, and Delta vs Powermatic?
--

You know, just thinking about it I wonder how much price has to do with
the Appearance of quality. The price sets some expectations and perhaps
one sees that which is not visible ...

Powermatic has in the past had a superior arbor and trunion, IIRC SawStop
has equal if not stronger.