wrote:
On Oct 9, 11:36 am, Steve Turner
wrote:
Interesting; you and I both have two posts only seconds apart to the
same server (eternal-september.org), and the NNTP-Posting-Date in the
headers reflect this:

mine: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 16:17:53 +0000 (UTC)
yours: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 16:17:04 +0000 (UTC)

Yet the dates displayed by my newsreader (Thunderbird) a

mine: 11:17am
yours: 12:16pm


On Google: Jack's: 12:16PM
Yours" 11:36AM !!!

You're looking at the wrong post. The one in which I made these
comments is stamped 11:36; the one (of mine) to which I was referring is
stamped 11:17. I couldn't really know how mine was going to be stamped
before I sent, could I? :-)

That sounds like your newsreader is set up improperly. Threading
should overrule time stamps.

No. There is no setting in Thunderbird for this kind of stuff, and the
information we're talking about is right there in the message headers.
And threading will only overrule time stamps if I'm looking at the
threaded view. If I sort by timestamp then threading plays no part in
the sort order, and that's where the problem shows up. Recall that I'm
not the only one seeing this problem.

--
"Our beer goes through thousands of quality Czechs every day."
(From a Shiner Bock billboard I saw in Austin some years ago)
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On Oct 9, 2:15*pm, Steve Turner
wrote:
wrote:
On Oct 9, 11:36 am, Steve Turner
wrote:
Interesting; you and I both have two posts only seconds apart to the
same server (eternal-september.org), and the NNTP-Posting-Date in the
headers reflect this:

* *mine: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 16:17:53 +0000 (UTC)
* yours: Fri, 9 Oct 2009 16:17:04 +0000 (UTC)

Yet the dates displayed by my newsreader (Thunderbird) a

* *mine: 11:17am
* yours: 12:16pm

On Google: * *Jack's: *12:16PM
* * * * * * * Yours" * 11:36AM !!!

You're looking at the wrong post. *The one in which I made these
comments is stamped 11:36; the one (of mine) to which I was referring is
stamped 11:17. *I couldn't really know how mine was going to be stamped
before I sent, could I? *:-)

You're right, of course. Going back that far in Google is too painful
now.

That sounds like your newsreader is set up improperly. *Threading
should overrule time stamps.

No. *There is no setting in Thunderbird for this kind of stuff, and the
information we're talking about is right there in the message headers.

So is the threading info.

And threading will only overrule time stamps if I'm looking at the
threaded view. *If I sort by timestamp then threading plays no part in
the sort order, and that's where the problem shows up. *Recall that I'm
not the only one seeing this problem.

Then don't do that. ;-)

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 14:15:15 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
the sort order, and that's where the problem shows up. Recall that I'm
not the only one seeing this problem.

Give it up Steve. Jack is much too arrogant to even consider that the
problem is at his end. Even though he can see the hour difference
between a message posted from his own computer is different than the
time posted on the newsgroup, it's far beyond his capability to even
acknowledge there might be a clock problem, much less that he's
responsible for it.

You cordially told him how to fix it and all he wants to do is argue.

wrote:
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 14:15:15 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
the sort order, and that's where the problem shows up. Recall that I'm
not the only one seeing this problem.

Give it up Steve. Jack is much too arrogant to even consider that the
problem is at his end. Even though he can see the hour difference
between a message posted from his own computer is different than the
time posted on the newsgroup, it's far beyond his capability to even
acknowledge there might be a clock problem, much less that he's
responsible for it.

You cordially told him how to fix it and all he wants to do is argue.

Well now I have a different guy arguing with me, but I'm not going to
spend much more energy on it. :-) I am curious though about whether
Jack has his daylight saving time flag turned on; for me it's been the
bug that keeps on biting.

--
See Nad. See Nad go. Go Nad!
To reply, eat the taco.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bbqboyee/

On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:39:55 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
spend much more energy on it. :-) I am curious though about whether
Jack has his daylight saving time flag turned on; for me it's been the
bug that keeps on biting.

There's a good chance it is. I had the same problem several months
back. Turned the time flag on and the problem went away. Can't
remember exactly why I turned it off in the first place, but I do
remember turning it off on purpose for some reason.

wrote:
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:39:55 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
spend much more energy on it. :-) I am curious though about whether
Jack has his daylight saving time flag turned on; for me it's been the
bug that keeps on biting.

There's a good chance it is. I had the same problem several months
back. Turned the time flag on and the problem went away. Can't
remember exactly why I turned it off in the first place, but I do
remember turning it off on purpose for some reason.

The hour offset when his local time seems ok is probably indicative the
mail client is picking up some setting and adjusting or not when it
shouldn't/should.

W/ the switch in dates, perhaps he's got an old OS that doesn't know the
right day _to_ switch, maybe???

--

Steve Turner wrote:
Jack Stein wrote:

Hey, you got me. My end *seems* correct to me. I took a cursory look
at things and everything appears correct on my end, so it's probably
me:-) It's 1:04 right as I'm posting...

I just looked at a BUNCH of different headers from a bunch of different
groups and posters (some whom I know to be in your time zone), posting
to a variety of news servers (including eternal-september) and they all
show time stamps with a 5-hour delta from the NNTP-Posting-Date entry,
except for yours; yours is 6 hours.

Yet my time zone is set correctly, at 5 hours, not 6 hours...

In the "Time Zone" tab of your "Date and Time Properties" (assuming
you're running Windows, of course) do you have the "Automatically adjust
clock for daylight saving changes" checked? (I do) I'm a programmer by
trade, and I've done a lot of messing around with time values in code,
and it's my considered opinion that this feature of Windows is *broken*.
If you have that turned off you might try turning it on to see what the
effect is. If it's already turned on, then I'm lost again. :-)

I think you nailed it. I have mine turned off, because I don't want
windows adjusting my clock. I turned it off because it was fussing with
the time changes on the wrong dates. When they changed the dates, I
found a fix and installed the patch. Then one fine day I had to
reinstall windows and lost the fix. I never bothered to find the patch,
and re fix it, instead, I just turned off the auto time change crap. My
clocks are all correct though, and the time stamps on my messages I send
show correctly here, and the times showing on your messages are showing
correctly here. I guess because I don't have windows automagically
screwing with the times:-)

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

On Oct 10, 12:50*pm, Jack Stein wrote:
dpb wrote:
wrote:
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:39:55 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
spend much more energy on it. *:-) *I am curious though about whether
Jack has his daylight saving time flag turned on; for me it's been
the bug that keeps on biting.
There's a good chance it is. I had the same problem several months
back. Turned the time flag on and the problem went away. Can't
remember exactly why I turned it off in the first place, but I do
remember turning it off on purpose for some reason.

The hour offset when his local time seems ok is probably indicative the
mail client is picking up some setting and adjusting or not when it
shouldn't/should.

W/ the switch in dates, perhaps he's got an old OS that doesn't know the
right day _to_ switch, maybe???

Right, that is the source of the problem. *My fix is to set the clock
manually, 2x a year. *It is 11:50 am as I send this message. *That is
the correct time from where I am sitting:-). *It will also be the
correct time showing up on my message when it comes back to me. *It will
be wrong when the time changes back to EST, whenever that might happen,
then, I will have to fix it again.

I know of the hearing-impaired, the sight-impaired, impaired
driving...never, ran across a chronologically impaired person until
you showed up.

You do understand that the time setting is not for your benefit, it is
for the benefit of others, right? Whatever it is that you and/or your
machine is doing, is wrong. Why don't you change the setting and let
Windows adjust the time for you. Then switch back if you believe
there is a benefit. That might correct the situation...at least until
you human-error adjust it back to the way it was.

R

dpb wrote:
wrote:
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 15:39:55 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
spend much more energy on it. :-) I am curious though about whether
Jack has his daylight saving time flag turned on; for me it's been
the bug that keeps on biting.


There's a good chance it is. I had the same problem several months
back. Turned the time flag on and the problem went away. Can't
remember exactly why I turned it off in the first place, but I do
remember turning it off on purpose for some reason.

The hour offset when his local time seems ok is probably indicative the
mail client is picking up some setting and adjusting or not when it
shouldn't/should.

W/ the switch in dates, perhaps he's got an old OS that doesn't know the
right day _to_ switch, maybe???

Right, that is the source of the problem. My fix is to set the clock
manually, 2x a year. It is 11:50 am as I send this message. That is
the correct time from where I am sitting:-). It will also be the
correct time showing up on my message when it comes back to me. It will
be wrong when the time changes back to EST, whenever that might happen,
then, I will have to fix it again.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

On Sat, 10 Oct 2009 13:07:01 -0500, Jack Stein
wrote:

my clock is wrong, and my clock is right, I ignore it. When Steve says
my time zones are showing up wrong and asks if I have windows
automatically adjusting for time zones, I pay attention.

Then you're still an idiot of massive proportions, because your time
as posted on the newsgroup is still an hour in the future. Obviously,
you didn't pay attention and have decided that what you choose to do
has to be right if you stamp your feet hard enough. Perhaps in the
shadow of your one man clown show, no one will notice that it's
actually wrong.

You're so arrogant, it's laughable. Keep playing an ignorant newsgroup
twit. It fits you perfectly.

wrote:
On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 14:15:15 -0500, Steve Turner
wrote:
the sort order, and that's where the problem shows up. Recall that I'm
not the only one seeing this problem.

Give it up Steve. Jack is much too arrogant to even consider that the
problem is at his end. Even though he can see the hour difference
between a message posted from his own computer is different than the
time posted on the newsgroup, it's far beyond his capability to even
acknowledge there might be a clock problem, much less that he's
responsible for it.

Really? The time posted that I sent the message is exactly correct on
my newsreader, it goes out with the correct time, and it comes in with
the correct time. Steve's messages come in showing the correct time.

You cordially told him how to fix it and all he wants to do is argue.

Yes, Steve is not an idiot, like you are... I guess I should have known
when I thought Sweetnothing or whatever fake name of the day you were
using was not a troll, but just, simple you... When an idiot tells me
my clock is wrong, and my clock is right, I ignore it. When Steve says
my time zones are showing up wrong and asks if I have windows
automatically adjusting for time zones, I pay attention.

Anyway, the correct time where I'm sitting is 1:07 pm, and the correct
time zone where I'm sitting is Eastern. Obviously something between me
and you is incorrectly adjusting my [correct] time into daylight savings
time, and it does not need adjusted, because it is already manually
correctly adjusted for that.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

Jack Stein wrote:

I think you nailed it. I have mine turned off, because I don't want
windows adjusting my clock. I turned it off because it was fussing with
the time changes on the wrong dates. When they changed the dates, I
found a fix and installed the patch. Then one fine day I had to
reinstall windows and lost the fix. I never bothered to find the patch,
and re fix it, instead, I just turned off the auto time change crap. My
clocks are all correct though, and the time stamps on my messages I send
show correctly here, and the times showing on your messages are showing
correctly here. I guess because I don't have windows automagically
screwing with the times:-)

Jack,

Been a while, but IIRC, the time stamp is made by(function)a system call
to the OS and no amount of futzing above that level in Windows is going
to solve the underlying DST problem. BTDT. If you reapply the patch that
should fix the problem. Try the below:

http://www.intelliadmin.com/DaylightSavingFix.exe

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 10/22/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

RicodJour wrote:

I know of the hearing-impaired, the sight-impaired, impaired
driving...never, ran across a chronologically impaired person until
you showed up.

Really? You think my Windows OS is the only one that doesn't know when
to adjust for daylight savings time?

You do understand that the time setting is not for your benefit, it is
for the benefit of others, right?

No, I didn't know that.

Whatever it is that you and/or your
machine is doing, is wrong.

What would you like me to do? My clock is correct, my time zone is
correct, my dates are correct.

Why don't you change the setting and let
Windows adjust the time for you. Then switch back if you believe
there is a benefit.

I explained why. Auto change doesn't work on my system so I manually
set the clock to the CORRECT TIME. I didn't know it was screwing up
everyone else's day, I knew my computer showed the correct time, and my
mail, and everyone else's mail was showing the correct time when it
comes here.

That might correct the situation...at least until
you human-error adjust it back to the way it was.

I've re-applied the patch, but if you actually thought I was going to
set my clock to the wrong time to make a few people here happy, you are
wrong. It's 10:50 am, so the patch should make your day. If not, tough
beans.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

Swingman wrote:

Been a while, but IIRC, the time stamp is made by(function)a system call
to the OS and no amount of futzing above that level in Windows is going
to solve the underlying DST problem. BTDT. If you reapply the patch that
should fix the problem. Try the below:

http://www.intelliadmin.com/DaylightSavingFix.exe

Thanks Swingman, patch re-applied, so all should be well in usenet land.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 09:50:21 -0500, Jack Stein
wrote:

Really? You think my Windows OS is the only one that doesn't know when
to adjust for daylight savings time?

The problem isn't that your Windows doesn't know when to adjust to
DST, it's that you don't know when to turn Windows DST on. And if your
Windows OS doesn't work properly in the first place, then you were the
one that screwed it up.

You do understand that the time setting is not for your benefit, it is
for the benefit of others, right?

No, I didn't know that.

Understandable. There's many, many things you don't know and refuse to
even acknowledge for some strange reason.

Windows adjust the time for you. Then switch back if you believe
there is a benefit.

I've re-applied the patch, but if you actually thought I was going to
set my clock to the wrong time to make a few people here happy, you are
wrong.

That's where your problem lies. You weren't being asked to set the
wrong time, you were being told that your time setting wasn't working
properly. As usual though, your arrogance got in the way. The time
thing was for everybody's use (everyone on newsgroups anyway) and not
just the few people you happened to be arguing with at the time. But,
you're too self centered to understand that.

God, it's so much fun razzing you. You're such an easy target. Guess
that shows what kind of insignificant life I have, eagerly waiting to
respond to your self deceiving posts every morning.

You have a good day now, Jack.

On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:22:56 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

Instead of arguing that there's nothing wrong with your settings/
system, when _everybody_ is telling you there is, learn from this
experience. People aren't kicking your cage for no reason. Most are
just pointing something out and helping you.

It was mostly my fault, you have to give Jack some leeway here. He was
so caught up in our 'discussion' that it was impossible for him see
past the invectives to comprehend the comments about time posting.

Of course, having the troll-like nature that I do, I took advantage of
his anger and pushed his buttons some more, additionally clouding the
issue.

On Oct 11, 11:30*am, wrote:
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:22:56 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour

wrote:
Instead of arguing that there's nothing wrong with your settings/
system, when _everybody_ is telling you there is, learn from this
experience. *People aren't kicking your cage for no reason. *Most are
just pointing something out and helping you.

It was mostly my fault, you have to give Jack some leeway here. He was
so caught up in our 'discussion' that it was impossible for him see
past the invectives to comprehend the comments about time posting.

Of course, having the troll-like nature that I do, I took advantage of
his anger and pushed his buttons some more, additionally clouding the
issue.

As a friends of mine likes to say: "it only takes minutes of my time
to **** off somebody's whole day..."
UseNet is not for thin-skinned, humourless douche-nozzles...oops..
..
..
..
*smirk*

wrote:
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:22:56 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

Instead of arguing that there's nothing wrong with your settings/
system, when _everybody_ is telling you there is, learn from this
experience. People aren't kicking your cage for no reason. Most are
just pointing something out and helping you.

It was mostly my fault, you have to give Jack some leeway here. He was
so caught up in our 'discussion' that it was impossible for him see
past the invectives to comprehend the comments about time posting.

Of course, having the troll-like nature that I do, I took advantage of
his anger and pushed his buttons some more, additionally clouding the
issue.

You really are stupid.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com

wrote:
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 09:50:21 -0500, Jack Stein
wrote:

Really? You think my Windows OS is the only one that doesn't know when
to adjust for daylight savings time?

The problem isn't that your Windows doesn't know when to adjust to
DST, it's that you don't know when to turn Windows DST on.

Hardly!

And if your
Windows OS doesn't work properly in the first place, then you were the
one that screwed it up.

Wrong, camel breath.

You do understand that the time setting is not for your benefit, it is
for the benefit of others, right?
No, I didn't know that.

Understandable. There's many, many things you don't know and refuse to
even acknowledge for some strange reason.

Right, my time settings don't mean beans to me, why would I care what
the time stamps on my files are as long as you can see what time I
posted a message. You really are clueless!

Windows adjust the time for you. Then switch back if you believe
there is a benefit.

I've re-applied the patch, but if you actually thought I was going to
set my clock to the wrong time to make a few people here happy, you are
wrong.

That's where your problem lies. You weren't being asked to set the
wrong time, you were being told that your time setting wasn't working
properly.

No, I was told my clock was wrong, it wasn't. My time setting also works
fine here, it is only the windows automatic setting that doesn't work
right. Windows may be junk, but there is no way they could know the
government was going to change when DST should start and stop. They put
a manual setting so it could be used if needed. I needed it, I used it,
my system was working fine, time was correct.

As usual though, your arrogance got in the way. The time
thing was for everybody's use (everyone on newsgroups anyway) and not
just the few people you happened to be arguing with at the time. But,
you're too self centered to understand that.

I really don't care what time stamps my messages have when they get on
your system. I've added a patch solely to correct others systems that
were incorrectly adjusting my clock for DST, which did not need adjusted.

God, it's so much fun razzing you.

Glad to entertain you.

You're such an easy target. Guess
that shows what kind of insignificant life I have, eagerly waiting to
respond to your self deceiving posts every morning.



You have a good day now, Jack.


--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://www.eternal-september.org/
http://jbstein.com