on 10/12/2007 8:35 PM Nova said the following:
Swingman wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message


Simple.


If you use a debit card is used, payment is instantenous.

If something goes wrong, you are on your own.


You're a bit behind times, Lew ... there are Federal laws now in effect
protecting the consumer for debit transactions.



Consumer Reports.org September, 2007 article states:

"Under federal law, your liability for fraudulent charges on a debit
card can be greater than it is for a credit card. With a credit card,
you're only responsible for up to $50 in unauthorized purchases. But
with a debit card, you can lose up to $500 if you don't report the
theft or loss of your card or PIN within two business days of
discovering the problem. And if you fail to report the unauthorized
charges within 60 days of the date of the statement that lists them,
you could be held liable for any unauthorized withdrawals after that
date. Those include the full value of credit lines and funds in
savings linked to your checking account for overdraft protection."

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/m...f-debit-ov.htm



My bank policy is a little different

"We will reimburse you for funds transferred from your accounts up to
the amount of your loss when you notify the bank within 60 days of the
transaction first appearing on your statement."

They also send me an email whenever a Debit card or check purchase
exceeds an amount that I have set in my account on their website
(Minimum $100).

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message

I question this oft quoted yet misapplied analogy. If you grab a 10mm
socket and it's too small what do you do? You try to figure out if it's
one size, two sizes or whatever, too small. You don't really care about
11 or 12 or 22 for that matter. Same with fractional measurements.


Not saying the reasoning is good or bad, but put the following in sequence
by size:

13, 11, 12

29/64, 7/16, 9/32

Most experienced mechanics know by looking at a bolt head what to reach for
right off, but to the Saturday mechanic, it can be confusing.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in message
I question this oft quoted yet misapplied analogy. If you grab a 10mm
socket and it's too small what do you do? You try to figure out if it's
one size, two sizes or whatever, too small. You don't really care about
11 or 12 or 22 for that matter. Same with fractional measurements.


Not saying the reasoning is good or bad, but put the following in sequence
by size:

13, 11, 12

29/64, 7/16, 9/32

Most experienced mechanics know by looking at a bolt head what to reach for
right off, but to the Saturday mechanic, it can be confusing.

I recognize every inch bolt/nut from 1/4" to 1"+ by sight but I'll be
damned if I can _yet_ tell the difference between adjacent 1-mm sizes in
the 10-12 range. And the designers just seem hellbent to use every
daggone one of them in random profusion---it's my biggest complaint
about metric in general use although everything, even the Deere now is
almost universally metric...

--

"HeyBub" wrote in message

Hmm. Saw a report today that China is creeping up on $1 trillion in
exports. Much of that to the US and all in Imperial measure. Point is, if
countries want to export to the US, it better not be metric.

Reality check: Do Japanese autos imported to the US have speedometers in
KPH?

I have to wonder if China is making what we want to specification easier
than other countries because many of their workers have no real experience
with either one in an industrial work, thus adapting readily? Seems that
many of the opponents are more opposed to having to adapt and learn
something new rather that solid reasons why one is better than the other.

Can that Japanese car be made cheaper if they stocked only one model of
instrument? My Buick is changed on all gauges at the push of a button.
Handy when I go to Canada.

In article , says...
And the designers just seem hellbent to use every
daggone one of them in random profusion---it's my biggest complaint
about metric in general use although everything, even the Deere now is
almost universally metric...


Not really, at least not if you go to Europe. When I still used to stick my
head under the bonnets of Fiats, VWs and whatever virtually all the bolt heads
and nuts were 10-13-17; the bolts being 6mm, 8mm and 10mm respectively - it
took the Japanese to confuse the issue and start using 12mm, 14mm and what have
you ( I presume to save on steel but I am guessing there).

-P

--
=========================================
firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com

"Nova" wrote

Consumer Reports.org September, 2007 article states:

More "if's" in that article than Carter had pills ...

All their points are moot if you only transfer from an interest bearing
account, as needed, what you are willing to lose in the rare instance "****
happens", into an account accessible with a check/debit card.

You gotta pity the poor *******s who can't figure out how to make an out and
out convenience work for them, free of charge ... then again, many folks
today can't be trusted to use a butter knife responsibly.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 9/30/07
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Peter Huebner wrote:
In article , says...
And the designers just seem hellbent to use every
daggone one of them in random profusion---it's my biggest complaint
about metric in general use although everything, even the Deere now is
almost universally metric...


Not really, at least not if you go to Europe. ...

I only work on what is here...

--

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
...

"Swingman" wrote:

... and just how do you figure that, old man?

Simple.

If you use a credit card and something goes wrong, you dispute it and
retain the use of your money while the dispute.

If your credit card gets stolen and unauthorized charges are made, it
is the credit card companies responsibility to clean it up.

If you use a debit card is used, payment is instantenous.

If something goes wrong, you are on your own.

If the debit card is stolen and they drain your account, it's your
problem.

As I said, just another way for the credit card company to screw you.

Lew

Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story. Most of your statement
is completely wrong.

In article , "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:

Not saying the reasoning is good or bad, but put the following in sequence
by size:

13, 11, 12

29/64, 7/16, 9/32

Most experienced mechanics know by looking at a bolt head what to reach for
right off, but to the Saturday mechanic, it can be confusing.

With the right mindset, it doesn't have to be.

Suboptimal mindset: "Hmmm, bolt head looks like about a 9/16..." [look through
rack for 9/16 socket] "Nope, too big, guess I'd better go to 1/2..."

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what fits.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what
fits.


Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me

On Oct 13, 5:25 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"Doug Miller" wrote in message

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what
fits.

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me

****... you beat me to it.

In article , "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what
fits.


Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me

Did I *really* need to specify "repeat as needed until the proper size is
found"?? I thought that went without saying, but apparently I was mistaken.
The point is, use the socket that's the right size, and never mind what
numbers are etched on the side of it.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

In article . com, Robatoy wrote:
On Oct 13, 5:25 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"Doug Miller" wrote in message

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what
fits.

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me

****... you beat me to it.

Shifted nyms, I see.

plonk again.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

"Doug Miller" wrote

The point is, use the socket that's the right size, and never mind what
numbers are etched on the side of it.


That is a given.

Since the eyes are not what they used to be, it is damn near impossible to
read the socket size etched in the side.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

Did I *really* need to specify "repeat as needed until the proper size is
found"?? I thought that went without saying, but apparently I was
mistaken.

It was a JOKE. Yes, we understood and yes, you are correct.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me


My approach is to have many wrenches.

This includes both fixed size and adjustable.

As well as metric, imperial, etc.

"Lee Michaels" wrote in message
...

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me


My approach is to have many wrenches.

This includes both fixed size and adjustable.

As well as metric, imperial, etc.

Is it too subtle? Metric ADJUSTABLE Imperial ADJUSTABLE No wonder you
guys are so reluctant to change.

On Oct 11, 7:47 pm, "Lee" wrote:
Your missing my point. I am talking about using metric in the current time
for measuring...not replacing what we have now when it comes to tools
"Nova" wrote in I will as soon as I can buy a
11.90625 millimeter and 5.159375

millimeter socket (respectively).



I don't understand your point. How are you going to work in metric
without replacing measuring tools, at the very least? You also can't
work in metric when you're drilling inch measured holes, cutting inch
measured dadoes, and so on. Those two things alone mean tool
replacement, because every dado set I've ever seen is calibrated in
fractions of an inch. Drilling a 3/4" hole in a 30 cm x 40 cm board
works fine, until...how close is the nearest edge to the edge of the
hole and how close does it need to be? I got hold of the Craftsman
version of the currently touted Triton/Grizzly planer/moulder a couple
of years ago, and almost went nuts trying to work to metric
measurements for the base board, while using standard plywood. I don't
have metric measuring tools; rather, I don't have them where they are
accessible for instant (or within the week) use.

I expect to die the same way.

It just gets overly complicated to swing both ways (unless you're a
politician). And just think what it would do to male porn stars...no,
wait, they'd probably love it.

In article , "Lee Michaels" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote

The point is, use the socket that's the right size, and never mind what
numbers are etched on the side of it.


That is a given.

Since the eyes are not what they used to be, it is damn near impossible to
read the socket size etched in the side.

LOL -- I know exactly what you mean!

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

In article , "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

Did I *really* need to specify "repeat as needed until the proper size is
found"?? I thought that went without saying, but apparently I was
mistaken.

It was a JOKE. Yes, we understood and yes, you are correct.

Ok, sorry, Ed, my sense of humor has been malfunctioning all week.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

On Oct 13, 5:44 pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article . com, Robatoy wrote:On Oct 13, 5:25 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"Doug Miller" wrote in message

More effective mindset: "This socket looks about the right size for this
bolt... nope, too big, better go one size smaller."

IOW, never mind the *numbers* on the side of the socket. Just use what
fits.

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me

****... you beat me to it.

Shifted nyms, I see.

plonk again.

I wasn't talking to you, asshole!

On Oct 13, 7:26 pm, (Doug Miller) wrote:
In article , "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:

"Doug Miller" wrote in message

Did I *really* need to specify "repeat as needed until the proper size is
found"?? I thought that went without saying, but apparently I was
mistaken.

It was a JOKE. Yes, we understood and yes, you are correct.

Ok, sorry, Ed, my sense of humor has been malfunctioning all week.

You don't HAVE a sense of humour! ------see? NOW I am talking to you.
Get it straight, you sad sack, you!

"HeyBub" wrote in
:

*snip*


Reality check: Do Japanese autos imported to the US have speedometers
in KPH?


My Japanese-made Prius switches when you press the button. The good
stuff from Japan (Nintendo and Toyota are my primary reference points) do
an excellent job of making the fact they use different measurements
transparent.

Puckdropper
--
Wise is the man who attempts to answer his question before asking it.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

In article ,
(Doug Miller) finally admitted:

Ok, sorry, Ed, my sense of humor has been malfunctioning all week.

You don't HAVE a sense of humour. You're too busy insisting that you're
right, even when you're not...which is often.

Did you honestly think that I changed my e-mail so I could play with you?

I think you're due for an ego adjustment.

B A R R Y wrote:
J. Clarke wrote:

Edwin, are _you_ going to buy me a new planer, new saw fences, a
full
set of twist, brad point, and Forstner bits, new wrenches and
sockets, new tape measures and rulers, and redimension all my
drawings?

Saws, planers, and other stuff can care less about units. At worst,
it's a new decal.

So are you going to make these decals and give them to me?

And on the planer, the thickness screw is calibrated in inches--a full
turn of the screw will never work out to any even number of
millimeters unless you replace the screw with one that has a different
thread pitch.

Most of us already have metric sockets, as even my Jeep Wrangler has
metric bolts.

So?

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote in message
Edwin, are _you_ going to buy me a new planer, new saw fences, a
full
set of twist, brad point, and Forstner bits, new wrenches and
sockets, new tape measures and rulers, and redimension all my
drawings? If not, are you going to pay me the the cost of all of
this? If not, then why should I be in favor of something that puts
me out of pocket a quite large amount of money and confers to me no
benefit that I can discern.

So tell me, exactly, why you need a new planer and saw fences?
Mine
not only do metric, they do Witworth too.

Mine don't. At least not unless I take a meter stick to them or set
the thickness by trial and error.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

In article ,
says...

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an Imperial
adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me


I'm surprised no-one has mentioned it yet: there is a brand of spanners called
Metrinch. The name says it all. What's more, these spanners attach the centre
of the sides of the nut, rather than the edges, meaning you can also use them
on badly degraded nuts and bolts, without ripping off the corners. And they do
all sizes. My set is made in USA ;-) Father in law told me about them 25 years
ago, apparently Peugot used to include them in their toolkits way back then.
I've got a socket set and a spanner set, they're brilliant if you have to deal
with rusted farm machinery from time to time, as well as both metric and
imperial nuts and bolts constantly.

-P.

--
=========================================
firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com

On 14 Oct 2007 01:25:03 GMT, Puckdropper
wrote:

"HeyBub" wrote in
:

*snip*


Reality check: Do Japanese autos imported to the US have speedometers
in KPH?


My Japanese-made Prius switches when you press the button.

As does my in-law's first generation Prius and the new Mazda 5
mini-minivan they just bought.

Reality check... We have new US-built Chevy Malibu's at work, that
can display in Kilometers or Miles, as well as a dash display that
speaks at least four languages. In a Chevy! We have gobs of fun
setting the display to other choices. G

Both of my personal vehicles, a Jeep TJ and a Toyota pickup have
analog meters with dual scales. As do most of my stationary and
benchtop tools.

The only big tool I own that dosen't have dual scales is my Performax
22-44 drum sander. Performax thoughtfully included the metric version
for the user to install.

To tune, adjust, and repair my tools, as well as all of the cars I've
owned in the last 10-15 years, will require both metric and SAE tools.

---------------------------------------------
** http://www.bburke.com/woodworking.html **
---------------------------------------------

dpb wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"dpb" wrote in message
Meanwhile, still knowing that a gallon of paint covers about 350
sq-ft...

So will 4 liters That is the same as what you get in two of those
big 67.6 ounce soda bottles.

Wouldn't that be 3.8 l?

--
Would that be an Imperial gallon or US gallon?

Ralph wrote in news:rppQi.10257$GO5.992@edtnps90:

dpb wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"dpb" wrote in message
Meanwhile, still knowing that a gallon of paint covers about 350
sq-ft...

So will 4 liters That is the same as what you get in two of those
big 67.6 ounce soda bottles.

Wouldn't that be 3.8 l?

--
Would that be an Imperial gallon or US gallon?



Let's keep things in perspective.

1 liter lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs about Euro 1,35 in Wageningen, the
Netherlands

1 Euro = US $1.418 as of 10/14/07
1 gallon (US, liquid) = 3.78 liter

So lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs:
3.78*1.418*1.35= US $7.24/gallon
Near here in New Jersey, a cheap station (Woroco) sells unleaded regular
for $2.45/gallon

Happy driving in Europe!

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"dpb" wrote in message

I know of no company that doesn't make metric products for the
export
market if that is their target. It's a strawman argument. US
automakers have switched, for example.

Since you don't know of them they don't exist? I know of two
companies that have not had success in Europe because they don't
want
to change to metric.

Then they don't _really_ want the European market.

One no longer tries, the other is going to make
the change.

So they've decided that they really want the export market and the
other company has decided that it doesn't. None of this negates the
original point.

It may be a strawman argument today because the auto
industry finally figured out it would be wise to change. They are
still fighting right hand drive.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Peter Huebner wrote:
In article ,
says...

Using your logic, you only need two wrenches in the toolbox, an
Imperial adjustable and a metric adjustable. Works for me


I'm surprised no-one has mentioned it yet: there is a brand of
spanners called Metrinch. The name says it all. What's more, these
spanners attach the centre of the sides of the nut, rather than the
edges, meaning you can also use them on badly degraded nuts and
bolts, without ripping off the corners. And they do all sizes. My
set
is made in USA ;-) Father in law told me about them 25 years ago,
apparently Peugot used to include them in their toolkits way back
then. I've got a socket set and a spanner set, they're brilliant if
you have to deal with rusted farm machinery from time to time, as
well as both metric and imperial nuts and bolts constantly.

According to their Web site they're made in Taiwan. Might be really
good but selling them using infomercials has pretty well shot their
credibility. I googled them and the consensus among users seems to be
that they actually work as advertised but have a lot of slop which
makes wrenching in tight quarters problematical.

-P.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

on 10/12/2007 11:29 PM Mark & Juanita said the following:
Lee wrote:


Thought I asked a simple question and it ended up with the "love it or
leave
it" crap(don't ask an American native about that ) and mail / credit
cards. big grin
Seems to be even anger being expressed.
Oh well At least I got everyone thinking


Well, it has been a couple of years since rec.ww has had a metric thread.
Used to be one of these every couple of months. As you can see, it can
generate a few comments. :-)


If metric ever comes to this country (US), we should dress up as
Amerinds and toss the whole lot into the harbor. :-)

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

on 10/13/2007 6:52 AM charlieb said the following:
Lee wrote:

I am getting a bit fed-up with the 15/32...13/64... and the rest of the crap
measurements we use here. Why shouldn't I go to what the rest of the world
uses? Metric. Please no political BS. Seems like using 10's is a lot
easier.No I'm not too old to change (62).G


Getting a Festool DOMINO forced me into metric. Thinking in metric took
a while - 25.4 mm/inch a became one of those numbers to add to my
instant recall list - which includes much harder to remember 7 and 10
digit phone numbers, PIN numbers, drivers license number, license plate
numbers etc. No big deal.


Lucky for you. With my CRS, I can't remember a 4 digit phone number
between looking it up in the phone book and picking up the telephone
handset.

After a while I thought and calculated in metric when using the DOMINO.
And calculating mainly in integers is a LOT easier than with mixed
fractions.
The DOMINO cuts mortises for loose/floating tenon joinery. When
you're playing with mortise and tenons joinery, lets say for a table
apron
to leg joint, you want "outside faces" either flush or "set back" some
specific distance. Working out where the center of the mortise in the
leg should be, and where the center of the tenon, or the center of the
mortise, in the end of the apron should be - in order to get the outside
face flush, or set back a desired distance - can be "challenging if you
use "imperial". MUCH easier using metric. Here's a link to a page
that shows what I'm trying to describe.

http://web.hypersurf.com/~charlie2/D...O_Reveals.html

If you do ply "case work", there are several metric systems - and tools
- to make producing parts quickly, accurately and efficiently. The
"32 mm System" has been around for quite a while - for a reason.

If you do solid wood furniture, and mill your own stock you don't need
imperial or metric. If you need something to be "this tall" - you mark
a stick for "this tall" and cut the needed parts "that long". If you
need something to fit "between here and there" you use slip sticks
to get "this wide" or "this long" and cut your parts "this wide" and
"this long". No numbers at all required. And it's easy to find the
centerline of a board. All that colonial furniture was done without
measuring tapes or rulers, divided into 32nds or 64ths.

I'm still using imperial, but the DOMINO is changing that.

charlie b



--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

"willshak" wrote in message


If metric ever comes to this country (US), we should dress up as Amerinds
and toss the whole lot into the harbor. :-)


Better get dressed. Metric has been here for decades and is becoming more
prominent all the time.

On Oct 14, 7:06 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"willshak" wrote in message

If metric ever comes to this country (US), we should dress up as Amerinds
and toss the whole lot into the harbor. :-)

Better get dressed. Metric has been here for decades and is becoming more
prominent all the time.

What metric really is, is a transfer from design lab to fabrication
floor.
If the boys designed it in mm, they expect the quotes and subsequent
samples to be all metric.
It is not some kind of secret language, as you know, but a preferred
method to some. Not all. Some.

It is the close-minded "it's the USA-thereore BEST" crowd that hinders
flexibility and advancements in adaptation to world markets. IOW...
arrogance. Like Doug Miller.

Han wrote in
:

*snip*



Let's keep things in perspective.

1 liter lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs about Euro 1,35 in Wageningen,
the Netherlands

1 Euro = US $1.418 as of 10/14/07
1 gallon (US, liquid) = 3.78 liter

So lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs:
3.78*1.418*1.35= US $7.24/gallon
Near here in New Jersey, a cheap station (Woroco) sells unleaded
regular for $2.45/gallon

Happy driving in Europe!


What's the change in price over the last 5 years been in Europe?

Puckdropper
--
Wise is the man who attempts to answer his question before asking it.

To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm

Puckdropper wrote in news:4712b8d5$0$47128
:

fHan wrote in
:

*snip*



Let's keep things in perspective.

1 liter lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs about Euro 1,35 in Wageningen,
the Netherlands

1 Euro = US $1.418 as of 10/14/07
1 gallon (US, liquid) = 3.78 liter

So lead-free gas (Euro 95) costs:
3.78*1.418*1.35= US $7.24/gallon
Near here in New Jersey, a cheap station (Woroco) sells unleaded
regular for $2.45/gallon

Happy driving in Europe!


What's the change in price over the last 5 years been in Europe?

Puckdropper

Using the official exchange rate of $ vs euro, gas used to be twice as
expensive in Europe as here in Jersey. Now it is a 3-fold difference.
In part because the US$ has devalued so much. About 5 years ago, a euro
was $0.85 or so. Now it is $1.42. From the perspective of worldwide
competition, it is "good" for the US manufacturer and worker in the
export fields. Eventually, it'll be rather bad for the ordinary
consumer.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

"Robatoy" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Oct 14, 7:06 pm, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:
"willshak" wrote in message

If metric ever comes to this country (US), we should dress up as
Amerinds
and toss the whole lot into the harbor. :-)

Better get dressed. Metric has been here for decades and is becoming
more
prominent all the time.

What metric really is, is a transfer from design lab to fabrication
floor.
If the boys designed it in mm, they expect the quotes and subsequent
samples to be all metric.
It is not some kind of secret language, as you know, but a preferred
method to some. Not all. Some.

It is the close-minded "it's the USA-thereore BEST" crowd that hinders
flexibility and advancements in adaptation to world markets. IOW...
arrogance. Like Doug Miller.

It's not just the USA crowd. A lot of the people that make much loud noise
against metric never use any measurement system of any kind. Those that
absolutely need to use measurements every day, all day, are in the minority.
When I was in university I heard some pretty heated arguments against metric
from my musician friends, a very noisy lot indeed. Me and my physics
buddies were just crying inside, since no amount of logic worked any kind of
magic, and we just didn't have the volume needed to convince anyone of
anything.

I've been bitter every since.

- Owen -

"Robatoy" wrote in message

What metric really is, is a transfer from design lab to fabrication
floor.
If the boys designed it in mm, they expect the quotes and subsequent
samples to be all metric.

At work we make custom molded parts both to customer specification and our
designs to their finished product. I don't recall ever seeing a drawing
with metric dimension until sometime maybe in the mid '80s. Now more than
half are metric.

Used to be too, drawings had dimensions like 12 5/8" that later became
12.625 with the advent of drawing programs, but now it is likely to be
12.62.

I used to buy hydrauling supplies, hoses, etc from a local comapny. Whenw e
go imported machines, they could not suppoy us. They told me "if it's
metric, you're on your own" Five years later they were out of business, but
my new supplier has everything I need.


It is the close-minded "it's the USA-thereore BEST" crowd that hinders
flexibility and advancements in adaptation to world markets. IOW...
arrogance.

I have to wonder where they will be in five, ten, fifteen years. Remember
when the local gas station would not work on imported cars because they did
not have the tools?
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/