At the request of Forrest Manufacturing (maker of Forrest Saw Blades) I
recently made an evaluation of the "Magic Moulder" system to determine the
suitability for use on the Radial Arm Saw. I use the radial arm saw
exclusively in my production shop and I'm always looking for ways to add to
my shop capabilities so I jumped at the opportunity to do this test.



I currently use the original DeWalt moulding sets from the 50's, the Sears
and the Delta moulding head systems in the shop for edge shaping and face
moulding. I also use these moulding systems for out of position mouldings,
i.e. the RAS motor in the rip position and tilted to produce a moulding that
can't be made on the conventional shaper or router table.



I tested the "Advanced Starter Assortment Set", which is includes a 7"
diameter moulding head and four cutter "plugs", P-37, P-65, P-58, P-64. Also
included in the starter package are the Owners Manual and a short video that
shows installation and operation of the moulding set on a table saw. The
aluminum moulding head has a 5/8" bore and the center of the head is
recessed for use on short arbor saws, it is designed to operate at 3450 rpm.
The cutter plugs are steel and feature a 1" wide carbide tip. Also available
from Forrest is the "Magic Shaper" which has a steel molding head designed
to operate at 10,000 rpm for use on a shaper and uses the same Magic Molder
cutter plugs.



The Magic Moulder was tested on a DeWalt 7790 radial arm saw (17 amp 110
volt/8.5 amp 220 volt) and a DeWalt MB radial arm saw (9.8 amp 110 volt).
The Magic moulder installed on the 7790 with the hardware provided. Due to
the short arbor on the MB, the moulder head was installed without the
standard outside arbor collar and required a thin locally supplied flat 5/8"bore
washer under the arbor nut.



Various hardwoods were tested, including red oak, MDF, and hard maple. The
Magic Moulder performed well, and produced mouldings with a better finish
than the Delta, Sears and DeWalt systems. I was impressed with how "smooth"
the operation was; you could hardly hear it in use. The cut radius is
greater than the Delta, DeWalt or the Sears moulders, so the cutters are at
a higher tangential velocity, which also makes for a smoother cut. Virtually
no tear out was found on finished mouldings. Edge moulding/shaping was done
with the motor tilted arbor down and positioned behind the fence. The wood
remains safely flat on the table and pushed past the moulding head. Tests
were also made with the motor in the "in rip" and "out rip" positions where
the wood is pushed under the moulding head in the same way you rip wood on
the radial arm saw. Motor out of position tests were made with excellent
results. Again, smooth operation and little to no tear out was found. The
Magic Moulder performed equally as well on the lower power DeWalt MB radial
arm saw.



The Magic Moulder has received many accolades when used on the table saw,
but on the radial arm saw the Magic Moulder excels. You have the ability to
produce out of position mouldings far greater than the maximum tilt of the
table saw. The width, height, and length of mouldings made on the radial arm
saw are unlimited.



The Magic Moulder is a great option for the small or production shop and
offers the advantage of mouldings that can't be made with conventional
moulding bits used on a shaper or router table. Currently there are
approximately 80 standard cutter profiles. By changing cutters you have an
unlimited moulding library. The small shop or home builder will find the
Magic Moulder works well for producing, crown mouldings, casings, and base
board etc. on the job site. Custom profile cutter plugs are also available.



The Magic Moulder is available directly from Forrest Manufacturing in their
New Jersey Office: 800-733-7111 ext. 314, Ask for Charles, he is in charge
of the Magic Molder project. He has some introductory specials available.
Phone him at the above number or Fax him at 973-471-3333 attn. Charles, or
email him . Charles can send you sales information by
snail mail, fax, or email attachment.



If you have questions about my tests or are interested in using the RAS for
moulding, kindly place your questions on the Radial Saw Forum:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start Images of mouldings
produced during this test are posted on ABPW



Disclaimer: Other than being a Forrest Blade user, I have no connection to
Forrest Manufacturing. I received no compensation for performing this test.



Cheers,

Rumpty

Rumpty wrote:


The Magic Moulder is a great option for the small or production shop and
offers the advantage of mouldings that can't be made with conventional
moulding bits used on a shaper or router table. Currently there are
approximately 80 standard cutter profiles. By changing cutters you have an
unlimited moulding library. The small shop or home builder will find the
Magic Moulder works well for producing, crown mouldings, casings, and base
board etc. on the job site. Custom profile cutter plugs are also available.


Nice job on the report and thanks for the review.


--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

(Remove -SPAM- to send email)

Pardon my ignorance of the capabilities of a RAS, but wouldn't a molder
hanging from a RAS head create vibration, movement and CHATTER because
the head can never be made rigid enough to remain 100% motionless in
relation to the table? A table saw's arbor doesn't move in relation to
the table and consequently I get superb results from a Sears molder when
used on my Unisaw. Also the Sears molder is a 3 cutter unit; the Magic
molder, if I'm not mistaken has only 2 cutters.

This is a serious post; please don't be flip. g

Dave

An associate dropped me an email with the following comments:

"Just to set things straight the Magic Molder is a product
manufactured by and available from LRH Enterprises Inc. in
Chatsworth, Ca. While Forrest may be selling them, LRH was the
creator/designer manufacture. Just think credit should be given to
the correct people. As I recall this has been on the market for quite
awhile and proved itself well for the small or home shop.
"

Indeed the Magic Moulder is manufactured by LRH. I performed this test for
Forrest since they did notwant to sell it as a tool for use on the RAS
without proper evaluation.

Rumpty

"Rumpty" wrote in message
...
At the request of Forrest Manufacturing (maker of Forrest Saw Blades) I
recently made an evaluation of the "Magic Moulder" system to determine the
suitability for use on the Radial Arm Saw.

No. You DO need an education on the RAS.


"David" wrote in message
...
Pardon my ignorance of the capabilities of a RAS, but wouldn't a molder
hanging from a RAS head create vibration, movement and CHATTER because
the head can never be made rigid enough to remain 100% motionless in
relation to the table?

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:25:13 GMT, "CW" wrote:

No. You DO need an education on the RAS.

So educate us.

When I use a spindle moulder (shaper in the US) it's a great big hefty
cast-iron thing. I still have to worry about rigidity.

With a RAS, then the beefiest I can think of is a Wadkin BRA - big
cast-iron thing. Now these are pretty solid machines and not prone to
the "alloy extrusion and undamped wobble" problems that give most RAS
such a bad name. All the same though, there's about three foot of
distance through the column and the arm, and a couple of movable
adjustments or slides, that you just don't have on a spindle moulder. So
concerns over a RAS' lack of rigidity are far from unreasonable.

"David" wrote in message
...
Pardon my ignorance of the capabilities of a RAS, but wouldn't a molder
hanging from a RAS head create vibration, movement and CHATTER because the
head can never be made rigid enough to remain 100% motionless in relation
to the table?

The flywheel action of the Magic Moulder produces a very smooth finish.
Take a look at the hard maple sample I put on ABPW, do you see any chatter
there? It produced the best finish of the 3 systems I tested against. The
poorest finish BTW was the "Sears" set up because there isn't enough mass
there to eliminate chatter.

A table saw's arbor doesn't move in relation to the table and consequently
I get superb results from a Sears molder when used on my Unisaw.

Perhaps for moulding on a board face, but you really can't tilt the arbor
very far on the TS to produce out of position moulding. The RAS can be
positioned anywhere for many many profiles. For edge shaping on the TS the
board needs to remain vertical to the table and you have lousy control of
your board. On the RAS the board remains flat and you can see the cut in
progress.

Keep in mind, foks have been making moulding of the RAS for years, it's a
great tool for moulding that can't be produced any way else with out
expensive machinery. If you are interested in using the RAS for moulding,
join us on the RAS forum http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start
and purchase a copy of the Mr. Sawdust book "How To Master The Radial Saw"
http://mrsawdust.com it's a superb book for using the RAS for moulding.

This is a serious post; please don't be flip. g

Dave

You do have quite a reputation David.

R.

Andy, for "most" moulding shaping operations on the RAS the motor is
positioned at the post so you don't have a 3' lever swaying in the breeze.

Regards,
Rumpty

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
With a RAS, then the beefiest I can think of is a Wadkin BRA - big
cast-iron thing. Now these are pretty solid machines and not prone to
the "alloy extrusion and undamped wobble" problems that give most RAS
such a bad name. All the same though, there's about three foot of
distance through the column and the arm, and a couple of movable
adjustments or slides, that you just don't have on a spindle moulder. So
concerns over a RAS' lack of rigidity are far from unreasonable.

Rumpty wrote:

You do have quite a reputation David.

R.


As do you, if we're talking about RAS's! g

Thanks for all the info. The rigidity of the RAS must far exceed my
ignorant expectation. Bear in mind I've never used one or inspected one
close up.

Dave