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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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Estimated cost of new upstairs floor?
I know this may be another 'How long is a piece of string' type question but
I thought I'd try to get a rough idea here before asking carpenters to come around. I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? Also, is there any risk of incurring damage to the downstairs artexed ceilings if I get a carpenter in to do this job? Money is real tight and I dont want to solve a problem upstairs only to face new ones downstairs. Help much appreciated. |
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In article ,
"Richard Blackwood" writes: I know this may be another 'How long is a piece of string' type question but I thought I'd try to get a rough idea here before asking carpenters to come around. It will be amazing if you get a carpenter to come round. If you do, it will be a miricle if you ever hear from them again. -- Andrew Gabriel |
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How many rooms and what size are they?
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... I know this may be another 'How long is a piece of string' type question but I thought I'd try to get a rough idea here before asking carpenters to come around. I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? Also, is there any risk of incurring damage to the downstairs artexed ceilings if I get a carpenter in to do this job? Money is real tight and I dont want to solve a problem upstairs only to face new ones downstairs. Help much appreciated. Replacing the floor boards won't cure the slope, this is caused by subsidence. The joists need realigning thats a big job as the rooms concerned will Need redecorating as well as some replastering etc. etc. we are talking thousands if the whole house needs this work you are talking about a major rebuild. On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. The above is for first floor, ground floor is different where you can remove the floor and start from scratch rebuilding the dwarf walls etc. realigning the floor would be simple but not cheap unless you could do the job yourself one room at a time even so it will cost money. you could get a small builder to do it one who can do rudimentary carpentry and brick laying a prerequisite I would have though. Get quotes before going any futher. MikeS |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... snip I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. Think about it: how would new floorboards (typical thickness 3/4") change the height of one end of the floor by 3.5 inches? Sure, you could level it by fastening packings to the tops of all the joists first, either tapering in thickness from 3.5" to zero or different thicknesses on each joist, depending on which way the joists run in relation to the slope, but it might have some interesting implications for doorways, stairs, bathroom fittings, fitted furniture, and so on. Then you'd need to move the skirting boards and re-decorate accordingly. I think I'd be rather more worried about how the structure of the house had accommodated such a massive distortion. Are the walls vertical or at right angles to the floor? Does the ground floor slope, too, and if not, how has the extra (or reduced) wall height downstairs been accommodated. Is it still moving? Can you run fast? -- Kevin Poole **Use current month and year to reply (e.g. )*** Car Transport by Tiltbed Trailer - based near Derby |
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In article ,
Richard Blackwood wrote: I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? If you do mean new floorboards, I doubt your 600 quid would even cover the cost of the materials. -- *Why is the third hand on the watch called a second hand? Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ...
I know this may be another 'How long is a piece of string' type question but I thought I'd try to get a rough idea here before asking carpenters to come around. I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? Also, is there any risk of incurring damage to the downstairs artexed ceilings if I get a carpenter in to do this job? Money is real tight and I dont want to solve a problem upstairs only to face new ones downstairs. Help much appreciated. the floor boards will be level already: the problem is either in the joists supporting the floorboards, or in the foundations supporting the walls supporting the joists supporting the floorboards. Simplest solution is usually to remove boards and pack the existing joists, ie fit more wood on top as necessary to make it all level, then relay boards. I cant imagine that getting done for 600, but its generally diyable for £100. NT |
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , Richard Blackwood wrote: I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? If you do mean new floorboards, I doubt your 600 quid would even cover the cost of the materials. I would say that about £60-£80 per sq meter would cover the cost of levelling a floor with new boards or chipboard laid over on sized battens. But as others have said, why is it not level? Deeply disturbing... |
#9
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I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches
over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. I was expecting much more but admit to being quite clueless wrt diy/houses etc. Is £600 roughly in the ball park? until you lift the current flooring to reveal the joists, and the reason for the fall, you can't possibly guestimate the cost. Also, is there any risk of incurring damage to the downstairs artexed ceilings if I get a carpenter in to do this job? Money is real tight and I dont want to solve a problem upstairs only to face new ones downstairs. we had a similar problem, 10cm drop into 1 corner of the back bedroom, turned out the joists at that end had been replaced (I say replaced, what I really mean is bodged) by John Wayne and his possy. take a look... http://www.mumsaway.com/floors.jpg note the joist on top of joist (scrap wood really) and lapped (rotten) joists held together with nails. I ended up replacing 5 joists and the entire bedroom floor and the ceiling downstairs. cost me (because I did all the work except plastering the ceiling) less than £500 LJ |
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In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote: If you do mean new floorboards, I doubt your 600 quid would even cover the cost of the materials. I would say that about £60-£80 per sq meter would cover the cost of levelling a floor with new boards or chipboard laid over on sized battens. So say three bedrooms at an average of 4 x 4 metres? That's near 4000 quid - assuming floorboards being the more expensive option than chipboard. Perhaps the OP's cousin missed off a zero? Of course, I'd guess you could re-use most of the original boards -- *It's a thankless job, but I've got a lot of Karma to burn off Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
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cost me (because I did all the work except plastering the ceiling)
less than £500 forgot to mention, that was for... 5 joists 15 sq mitres T&G flooring 18 mitres mdf skirting 2 x 5 litre ronseal wood stain/varnish 6 12mm foilback plaster board 3 bags board finish plaster 18 mitres coving ? tubes of no more nails plasterer and other sundries that I can't remember it worked out roughly the same (within a few quid) to lay T&G as it would to lay chip board floor with either underlay and a quality carpet or underlay and laminate LJ |
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On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber
merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? |
#13
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"Autolycus" wrote in message
... "Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... snip I have a 3 bed terraced house with sloping floors - about 3.5 inches over roughly14 feet (the width of the house). My cousin who knows more than I about these things says it should cost no more than £600 for a carpenter to take the old floorboards up and put new, level ones down. Think about it: how would new floorboards (typical thickness 3/4") change the height of one end of the floor by 3.5 inches? Sure, you could level it by fastening packings to the tops of all the joists first, either tapering in thickness from 3.5" to zero or different thicknesses on each joist, depending on which way the joists run in relation to the slope, but it might have some interesting implications for doorways, stairs, bathroom fittings, fitted furniture, and so on. Then you'd need to move the skirting boards and re-decorate accordingly. I think I'd be rather more worried about how the structure of the house had accommodated such a massive distortion. Are the walls vertical or at right angles to the floor? Does the ground floor slope, too, and if not, how has the extra (or reduced) wall height downstairs been accommodated. Is it still moving? Can you run fast? The surveyor noted that movement had occured but was of the opinion that the movement had occured in the past and should not be an ongoing problem. I live in the ex-coalfields of SE Wales where subsidence is quite common. |
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The surveyor noted that movement had occured but was of the opinion
that the movement had occured in the past and should not be an ongoing problem. as did our surveyor and how wrong was he, the house hadn't moved at all, see my other reply LJ |
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The surveyor noted that movement had occured but was of the opinion
that the movement had occured in the past and should not be an ongoing problem. as did our surveyor and how wrong was he, the house hadn't moved at all, see my other reply Surely it was obvious from the fit of the skirting boards that it was the floor moving, rather than the wall? no, the previous owner had fixed the floor "in their own unique way" and installed fitted wardrobes along 1 wall and replaced the skirting along the short wall so it didn't look that far out of place especially with the bed in the way. it wasn't until we ripped out the hideous wardrobes that the extent of the fall became apparent. LJ |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ...
On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? yes but youd then have a step at the doorway. It may thus be preferable to do the whole floor. NT |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? Hi Richard, See in2minds post he has the tee shirt. Send the kids and Misses on holiday or to the M in Laws for a week get your pals round hire a skip etc this of course takes a lot of forward planning (thinking it through) arranging plasterer to come and do his stuff. When you put up the plaster board on the ceiling make sure to stagger them and use a good scrim on the joints(well make sure the plasterer does if he wont, some dont, sack him). Bear in mind you have to make a platform of scafold boards on cripple stands(hired) to cover the floor so that the plasterer can get the right hight to plaster as he has to have the ability to walk back and forth to get a fine finnish. Thats all I can think of at the moment as its some 15 years since I did anything like this as a diy project. Best of luck MikeS |
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"Mark" wrote in message ... MikeS typed: Bear in mind you have to make a platform of scafold boards on cripple stands(hired) to cover the floor so that the plasterer can get the right hight to plaster as he has to have the ability to walk back and forth to get a fine finnish. Professional plasters use Stilts these days. http://tinyurl.com/62p8y Mark, This is in a german accent, Very interesting but stupid. Seriosly how do they get the plaster on the hawk if they up up to 30 inches higher than the floor. MikeS |
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"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om... "Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? yes but youd then have a step at the doorway. It may thus be preferable to do the whole floor. 2 of the doors open into the slope i.e there is more of a gap under the doors when they are fully open than when they are shut. The 3rd door opens at a right angle to the other two. |
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MikeS wrote:
Seriosly how do they get the plaster on the hawk if they up up to 30 inches higher than the floor. By putting th'bucket up to 30 inches higher than the floor. Patented bucket-raising devices with a fetching "I'm A Spread With LOADSAMONEY" logo are available for 99.99 at Jewsons - 299.99 if you want the gold-plated variety. Spreads who haven't reached that state of bling-bling make do with everyday objects to bring t'bucket oop off t'flooer, such as the exotic "table", "chair", or - if we're really down-at-heel - "milk crate". The guy doing our ceilings using his strap-on manhood extenders (I mean plasterer's stilts, of course) didn't need to get nearly so high as 30 inches, mind - yer typical domestic ceiling is, what, 2.3m above t'flooer, and comfortable working height where your head isn't bumping the ceiling is maybe 30-40cm above t'flooer, meaning not much more than a fooot. Stefek |
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MikeS typed:
"Mark" wrote in message ... MikeS typed: Bear in mind you have to make a platform of scafold boards on cripple stands(hired) to cover the floor so that the plasterer can get the right hight to plaster as he has to have the ability to walk back and forth to get a fine finnish. Professional plasters use Stilts these days. http://tinyurl.com/62p8y Mark, This is in a german accent, Very interesting but stupid. Seriosly how do they get the plaster on the hawk if they up up to 30 inches higher than the floor. MikeS Umm raise the spot board by 31 ins perhaps But I see someone has already covered this. :-) Personally I cant use them, I have enough trouble standing on my own twofeet looking up, without the added complication of wooden legs. |
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On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 22:55:43 +0000, Stefek Zaba
wrote: ". The guy doing our ceilings using his strap-on manhood extenders (I mean plasterer's stilts, of course) didn't need to get nearly so high as 30 inches, mind - yer typical domestic ceiling is, what, 2.3m above t'flooer, and comfortable working height where your head isn't bumping the ceiling is maybe 30-40cm above t'flooer, meaning not much more than a fooot. Stefek Those things have always struck me as bloody dangerous. You strap these stilts to your leg and then climb up. Presumably if you fall off, it's instant broken leg? -- ..andy To email, substitute .nospam with .gl |
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"MikeS" wrote in message . uk...
"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ... On the other hand you could take up the floor boards and have a timber merchant make tapered pieces of wood to fit on top of the joists and level the floor this way ( same as the tapered wood on flat roofs to give fall). But, a big but, this OK if the slope is away from the door if this is the case go for it, if not forget it. Hi Mike, This is what I had in mind. Why do the doors make a difference? Couldnt they just be planed if they need to be? Hi Richard, See in2minds post he has the tee shirt. Send the kids and Misses on holiday or to the M in Laws for a week get your pals round hire a skip etc this of course takes a lot of forward planning (thinking it through) arranging plasterer to come and do his stuff. When you put up the plaster board on the ceiling make sure to stagger them and use a good scrim on the joints(well make sure the plasterer does if he wont, some dont, sack him). Bear in mind you have to make a platform of scafold boards on cripple stands(hired) to cover the floor so that the plasterer can get the right hight to plaster as he has to have the ability to walk back and forth to get a fine finnish. Thats all I can think of at the moment as its some 15 years since I did anything like this as a diy project. Best of luck MikeS I'm puzzled, as I cant think of any possible need for a plasterer. You lift the floorboards, cut and fit 2x4 to the joists to level them, and refit the boards. Number the boards and they can go back in the same places without any cutting. Shouldnt need a skip either. NT |
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#28
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"Rob Morley" wrote in message
t... In article , "N. Thornton" says... snip See in2minds post he has the tee shirt. Send the kids and Misses on holiday or to the M in Laws for a week get your pals round hire a skip etc this of course takes a lot of forward planning (thinking it through) arranging plasterer to come and do his stuff. When you put up the plaster board on the ceiling make sure to stagger them and use a good scrim on the joints(well make sure the plasterer does if he wont, some dont, sack him). Bear in mind you have to make a platform of scafold boards on cripple stands(hired) to cover the floor so that the plasterer can get the right hight to plaster as he has to have the ability to walk back and forth to get a fine finnish. Thats all I can think of at the moment as its some 15 years since I did anything like this as a diy project. Best of luck MikeS I'm puzzled, as I cant think of any possible need for a plasterer. You lift the floorboards, cut and fit 2x4 to the joists to level them, and refit the boards. Number the boards and they can go back in the same places without any cutting. Shouldnt need a skip either. in2minds had to replace rotten joists, and therefore the ceiling below as well. But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, progressively adding thinner strips as you come away from the lower part of the room as the room levels off, relay floorboards, which seemed mostly ok before I put new carpet down (damn), if necessary replacing the skirting boards with new ones? Would replacing the skirting boards necessitate any replastering? Have I got the gist of NT's post and am I right in thinking that this is the /best/ case scenario? Otherwise it sounds like I'm in a lot of ****. |
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But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT
says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, progressively adding thinner strips as you come away from the lower part of the room as the room levels off, relay floorboards, which seemed mostly ok before I put new carpet down (damn), if necessary replacing the skirting boards with new ones? Would replacing the skirting boards necessitate any replastering? Have I got the gist of NT's post and am I right in thinking that this is the /best/ case scenario? Otherwise it sounds like I'm in a lot of ****. best thing you can do now is pull up a couple of floor boards, take a look at the condition and possible cause and report back... when I started (before I lifted the floor boards) I was expecting to lap new joists to the old, coach bolts with star washers between, to level the floor and strengthen the old joists in the process... how optimistic was I ? (c; LJ |
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In article ,
Richard Blackwood wrote: But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, progressively adding thinner strips as you come away from the lower part of the room as the room levels off, relay floorboards, which seemed mostly ok before I put new carpet down (damn), if necessary replacing the skirting boards with new ones? Normal way would be with firring strips - tapered wood which goes from one end of the joist to the other. They're normally made off site as cutting them isn't easy without the correct machine. Both the floorboards and skirting could be re-used with care. -- *Two wrongs are only the beginning * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ...
"Rob Morley" wrote in message t... In article , "N. Thornton" says... snip I'm puzzled, as I cant think of any possible need for a plasterer. You lift the floorboards, cut and fit 2x4 to the joists to level them, and refit the boards. Number the boards and they can go back in the same places without any cutting. Shouldnt need a skip either. in2minds had to replace rotten joists, and therefore the ceiling below as well. But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, the top side of the existing joists. progressively adding thinner strips as you come away from the lower part of the room as the room levels off, you'd lay one strip on each joist, the strip would be tapered to give a level top surface. Establish a level using a laser, temporarily clamp the 2x4 to the existing joist, exactly level, and run a pencil line along top of old joist to mark the 2x4. Cut the 2x4 along the line and it will fit on perfectly. Bench mounted circ saw. It is also possible to use wood a bit bigger and not cut it, but just screw it to the side of the old joists, either works. relay floorboards, which seemed mostly ok before I put new carpet down (damn), if necessary replacing the skirting boards with new ones? Would replacing the skirting boards necessitate any replastering? no, as your new skirting will be higher up or same level. If you want to make the job bigger by using new skirting, pick something as big as the present stuff to avoid plaster work. Have I got the gist of NT's post and am I right in thinking that this is the /best/ case scenario? Otherwise it sounds like I'm in a lot of ****. I dont remember any reason to think your joists are rotten: is there such a reason? Having a look will tell for sure. NT |
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"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om... But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, the top side of the existing joists. Yes, sorry. I shouldve been clearer, I mean the side of the house which is lower is where the strip of wood would go to increase its height. progressively adding thinner strips as you come away from the lower part of the room as the room levels off, you'd lay one strip on each joist, the strip would be tapered to give a level top surface. Establish a level using a laser, temporarily clamp the 2x4 to the existing joist, exactly level, and run a pencil line along top of old joist to mark the 2x4. Cut the 2x4 along the line and it will fit on perfectly. Bench mounted circ saw. It is also possible to use wood a bit bigger and not cut it, but just screw it to the side of the old joists, either works. relay floorboards, which seemed mostly ok before I put new carpet down (damn), if necessary replacing the skirting boards with new ones? Would replacing the skirting boards necessitate any replastering? no, as your new skirting will be higher up or same level. If you want to make the job bigger by using new skirting, pick something as big as the present stuff to avoid plaster work. Have I got the gist of NT's post and am I right in thinking that this is the /best/ case scenario? Otherwise it sounds like I'm in a lot of ****. I dont remember any reason to think your joists are rotten: is there such a reason? Having a look will tell for sure. Some electricians did take up a length of floorboards when doing some work before I moved in and they didnt mention anything about rotten joists or anything. The surveyor (and I'm having increasingly less faith in them) found no signs of damp in the house, so I am a little more optimistic about that. |
#33
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"Richard Blackwood" wrote in message ...
"N. Thornton" wrote in message om... But if the joists in my house are ok then a carpenter could do as NT says? - add a strip of wood to the lower side to raise it, the top side of the existing joists. Yes, sorry. I shouldve been clearer, I mean the side of the house which is lower is where the strip of wood would go to increase its height. your new wood strips will cover the whole of the area, but will taper down to nothing at one end or side. You realise each existing joist will be bent a little, so the strip you cut to go onto it will not quite be straight, but have a slightly curved cut. Hence you need to use the pencil against joist method, not just draw a straight line. If youre clear about that then it sounds to me like youve got it all figured out. Good luck. NT |
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