jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

Try PTFE tape as a seal?

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil myself.

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

Try PTFE tape as a seal?

--
Condoms aren't completely safe. A friend of mine was wearing one and got hit by a bus.

Mr Pounder Esquire was thinking very hard :
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

Try PTFE tape as a seal?

+1 It will take up the wear in the thread and help to form a seal. A
last resort would be a thread sealer, providing you don't mind having
the old oil sucked out via the dip stick hole at service time.

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 15/12/16 19:18, jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

I was warned my VW sump plug might need helicoiling next time.
Luckily I am trading it in...

Pretty stupid design, seeing as copper washers have been fine, for what,
like 100 years!

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

Not a sump - the thread can be helicoiled.

I wonder if some liquid engine gasket would work? Or PTFE tape?


TIA

Fibre washer?

Would that stand the heat? I'd be more thinking of central heating sealant
but whether it would work for oil is another matter. I do know many years
ago a problem like this was fixed by draining it, fit cleaning out thread
and plug and using some horrible stuff called engenamel or similar when it
was put in then left to dry and oil replaced.
I would imagine it would make said plug almost impossible to get out
afterwards though. i always thought that stuff needed highish heat to go off
properly but I'm no mechanic and it is used inside some gearboxes.
brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"Mr Pounder Esquire" wrote in message
news
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

Try PTFE tape as a seal?

On Friday, 16 December 2016 05:57:01 UTC, Brian-Gaff wrote:
Would that stand the heat? I'd be more thinking of central heating sealant
but whether it would work for oil is another matter. I do know


PTFE tape is commonly usd on steam and fuel lines, so no problem there.

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the saying
'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for tightening a
sump nut (especially where they are known to be 'fragile') or testing
a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would be
beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then it may
be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

Re the sump plug ... depending on the age, value and general condition
of the vehicle and the lack of any 'better' solutions and based on the
idea the thread is stripping in the sump itself ... I might get a new
sump plug (nice fresh thread) and drill and tap the middle as large as
possible (on my lathe g) to take a bolt and copper washer and then
bond the plug back into the chemically cleaned sump hole using
something like 'Liquid metal' epoxy.

You could first drain the sump with the drain hole at the lowest point
then jack the car to raise the hole and leave it a while before
cleaning the sump threads out with some acetone on a cotton rag.

Cheers, T i m

Brian-Gaff wrote

Would that stand the heat?

Yep, PTFE survives frypans fine.

I'd be more thinking of central heating sealant but
whether it would work for oil is another matter.

I do know many years ago a problem like this was
fixed by draining it, fit cleaning out thread and plug
and using some horrible stuff called engenamel or
similar when it was put in then left to dry and oil replaced.

I would imagine it would make said plug almost impossible to get out
afterwards though. i always thought that stuff needed highish heat to go
off properly but I'm no mechanic and it is used inside some gearboxes.

"Mr Pounder Esquire" wrote in message
news
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

Try PTFE tape as a seal?

On 16/12/16 10:24, T i m wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the saying
'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for tightening a
sump nut (especially where they are known to be 'fragile') or testing
a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would be
beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then it may
be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

Re the sump plug ... depending on the age, value and general condition
of the vehicle and the lack of any 'better' solutions and based on the
idea the thread is stripping in the sump itself ... I might get a new
sump plug (nice fresh thread) and drill and tap the middle as large as
possible (on my lathe g) to take a bolt and copper washer and then
bond the plug back into the chemically cleaned sump hole using
something like 'Liquid metal' epoxy.

You could first drain the sump with the drain hole at the lowest point
then jack the car to raise the hole and leave it a while before
cleaning the sump threads out with some acetone on a cotton rag.

Cheers, T i m


Novel solution that should actually work.

T i m presented the following explanation :
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the saying
'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for tightening a
sump nut (especially where they are known to be 'fragile') or testing
a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would be
beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

For tightening a fixing, you are best avoiding using sockets and a
ratchet - better to use a correct sized spanner. A correctly sized
spanner will normally be shorter for the smaller sizes, at least giving
some protection from applying to much torque.

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 11:02:31 +0200, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

snip

Re the sump plug ... depending on the age, value and general condition
of the vehicle and the lack of any 'better' solutions and based on the
idea the thread is stripping in the sump itself ... I might get a new
sump plug (nice fresh thread) and drill and tap the middle as large as
possible (on my lathe g) to take a bolt and copper washer and then
bond the plug back into the chemically cleaned sump hole using
something like 'Liquid metal' epoxy.

You could first drain the sump with the drain hole at the lowest point
then jack the car to raise the hole and leave it a while before
cleaning the sump threads out with some acetone on a cotton rag.


Novel solution that should actually work.

Thanks and yes, I wouldn't offer it as a solution if I wasn't pretty
sure it would work (all things considered). As it happens I have done
similar a couple of times where no better solution was available and
both have lasted and functioned as long as was required.

Not that long ago I 'repaired' the splits in the bottom of a steel
sump (with a repair 'putty') that I (and the driver) thought had been
made by something coming up from the road. It turned out it was the
con-rod trying to get out. ;-(

Once some oil was put back in the engine did still run (on 3) and no
oil leaked ... but it still ended up going off for scrap.

Cheers, T i m

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 09:21:31 GMT, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

T i m presented the following explanation :
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the saying
'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for tightening a
sump nut (especially where they are known to be 'fragile') or testing
a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would be
beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

For tightening a fixing, you are best avoiding using sockets and a
ratchet - better to use a correct sized spanner. A correctly sized
spanner will normally be shorter for the smaller sizes, at least giving
some protection from applying to much torque.


Agreed, and for sump nuts (where two handed access may not be easy),
also more likely to 1) stay on the nut and 2) offer a more 'direct'
turning moment (so less likely to slip and damage you / the nut or put
strange loads on the thread).

Cheers, T i m

jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


Gasket goo, like Hylomar?

In article ,
T i m wrote:
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

Spanners are a different length according to size. Generally on a car for
things that don't matter using that sort of spanner and a decent pull will
tighten things OK. The problem comes with sockets with one size handle for
them all. The trick is to hold the handle closer to the pivot for small
sizes. Anyone who needs a torque wrench for everything needs to practice a
bit more. ;-)

Sump plugs are usually the sort of thing with a very wide range of
acceptable torque. After all it's not holding things together. But
obviously relies on the correct sealing washer in good condition.

--
*Venison for dinner again? Oh deer!*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 15/12/2016 19:18, jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA

RTV Silicon.

Mike

T i m Wrote in message:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 11:02:31 +0200, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

snip

Re the sump plug ... depending on the age, value and general condition
of the vehicle and the lack of any 'better' solutions and based on the
idea the thread is stripping in the sump itself ... I might get a new
sump plug (nice fresh thread) and drill and tap the middle as large as
possible (on my lathe g) to take a bolt and copper washer and then
bond the plug back into the chemically cleaned sump hole using
something like 'Liquid metal' epoxy.

You could first drain the sump with the drain hole at the lowest point
then jack the car to raise the hole and leave it a while before
cleaning the sump threads out with some acetone on a cotton rag.


Novel solution that should actually work.

Thanks and yes, I wouldn't offer it as a solution if I wasn't pretty
sure it would work (all things considered).

Yes seen that idea on sale - along with various inserts helicoil
etc, retaps, self-tapping nasties, and something that looks good
and comparatively easy - "Dowty washers"...

Anyone care to critique?
TIA
--
Jim K

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

Spanners are a different length according to size. Generally on a car for
things that don't matter using that sort of spanner and a decent pull will
tighten things OK. The problem comes with sockets with one size handle for
them all. The trick is to hold the handle closer to the pivot for small
sizes. Anyone who needs a torque wrench for everything needs to practice a
bit more. ;-)

Sump plugs are usually the sort of thing with a very wide range of
acceptable torque. After all it's not holding things together. But
obviously relies on the correct sealing washer in good condition.

We are told that this one *doesn't* use a washer, but uses the threads
to seal. Which firstly means it has to be tight, and secondly that it
will probably be tightened more each time until it strips. Hence the
OP.
--

Roger Hayter

jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the case
that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical' thread, and no
shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems an odd way to do it,
though. What model is it? Easy to search ebay for 'VW whatever sump
plug washer', just to see if they exist.

In article ,
Roger Hayter wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

Spanners are a different length according to size. Generally on a car for
things that don't matter using that sort of spanner and a decent pull will
tighten things OK. The problem comes with sockets with one size handle for
them all. The trick is to hold the handle closer to the pivot for small
sizes. Anyone who needs a torque wrench for everything needs to practice a
bit more. ;-)

Sump plugs are usually the sort of thing with a very wide range of
acceptable torque. After all it's not holding things together. But
obviously relies on the correct sealing washer in good condition.

We are told that this one *doesn't* use a washer, but uses the threads
to seal. Which firstly means it has to be tight, and secondly that it
will probably be tightened more each time until it strips. Hence the
OP.

It has no shoulder it tightens onto? So is a form of grub screw? Only way
I could see that working is with taper threads. Which tend to be a one off
application - rather than something designed to be removed/replaced many
times.

--
*I got a sweater for Christmas. I really wanted a screamer or a moaner*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 15/12/2016 19:18, jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

I'd be inclined to check that it's not just a matter of your being sold
a sump plug without the washer that's meant to be used with it. But
then I don't do "belief"



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the case
that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical' thread, and no
shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems an odd way to do it,
though. What model is it? Easy to search ebay for 'VW whatever sump
plug washer', just to see if they exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is
b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)

--
Jim K

On 12/16/2016 1:22 PM, jim wrote:
T i m Wrote in message:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 11:02:31 +0200, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

snip

Re the sump plug ... depending on the age, value and general condition
of the vehicle and the lack of any 'better' solutions and based on the
idea the thread is stripping in the sump itself ... I might get a new
sump plug (nice fresh thread) and drill and tap the middle as large as
possible (on my lathe g) to take a bolt and copper washer and then
bond the plug back into the chemically cleaned sump hole using
something like 'Liquid metal' epoxy.

You could first drain the sump with the drain hole at the lowest point
then jack the car to raise the hole and leave it a while before
cleaning the sump threads out with some acetone on a cotton rag.


Novel solution that should actually work.

Thanks and yes, I wouldn't offer it as a solution if I wasn't pretty
sure it would work (all things considered).

Yes seen that idea on sale - along with
various inserts helicoil
etc, retaps, self-tapping nasties, and something that looks good
and comparatively easy - "Dowty washers"...

Anyone care to critique?
TIA


I have had this problem in the past, I would endorse Dowty washers (or
Dowty seals) as being worth a try. Plenty on eBay.

On 12/16/2016 2:39 PM, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Roger Hayter wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
T i m wrote:
I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

Spanners are a different length according to size. Generally on a car for
things that don't matter using that sort of spanner and a decent pull will
tighten things OK. The problem comes with sockets with one size handle for
them all. The trick is to hold the handle closer to the pivot for small
sizes. Anyone who needs a torque wrench for everything needs to practice a
bit more. ;-)

Sump plugs are usually the sort of thing with a very wide range of
acceptable torque. After all it's not holding things together. But
obviously relies on the correct sealing washer in good condition.

We are told that this one *doesn't* use a washer, but uses the threads
to seal. Which firstly means it has to be tight, and secondly that it
will probably be tightened more each time until it strips. Hence the
OP.

It has no shoulder it tightens onto? So is a form of grub screw? Only way
I could see that working is with taper threads. Which tend to be a one off
application - rather than something designed to be removed/replaced many
times.


+1. You can't expect parallel threads to seal (without additional
sealant), for one thing the basic design of threads means there is a tip
to root clearance which in turn means there are two clear helical paths
between the fluid and the shoulder (and I have never seen a sump plug
without a shoulder). The purpose of the traditional copper washer is to
behave like the olive in a compression fitting, with a 360 degree ring
of plastic deformation so that there is real metal to metal contact
completely blocking any leak path. Fibre washers behave the same way
(the deforming material means that there are no flow paths, at least
until you get close to the molecular level).

jim k Wrote in message:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the case
that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical' thread, and no
shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems an odd way to do it,
though. What model is it? Easy to search ebay for 'VW whatever sump
plug washer', just to see if they exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is

£50 new (ebay) plus fitting of course.

b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)


--
Jim K

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 08:24:08 -0000, T i m wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the saying
'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for tightening a
sump nut (especially where they are known to be 'fragile') or testing
a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would be
beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then it may
be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

It can't be that simple, or I wouldn't keep hearing of garages misthreading them.

--
If I said you had a beautiful body, would you hold it against me? -- Monty Python, Episode 25

jim wrote:
jim k Wrote in message:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the case
that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical' thread, and no
shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems an odd way to do it,
though. What model is it? Easy to search ebay for 'VW whatever sump
plug washer', just to see if they exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is

£50 new (ebay) plus fitting of course.

b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)



I personally wouldn't replace the sump, just because the plug is
leaking, unless it is very obvious that the thread is nackered. I
wouldn't tighten it any more, either. I'd take the plug out (oil will
fly out!), clean the hole and the plug threads, and put it back with
something really viscous. Hylomar is my favourite.

Note that the sump plug is also the natural place for a leak from
anywhere else to run to. Oil can creep slowly around the outside
surface of the engine, and still look like it's dripping from the plug.
Unless you can get it on ramps and get under it, it's very hard to be
sure. Maybe put some chalk dust on it and leave it for a few hours, and
see if a track is left in it.

Unless it's really obvious that it /is/ coming from the plug?

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 08:24:08 -0000, T i m wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire
wrote:
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil
myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the
saying 'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for
tightening a sump nut (especially where they are known to be
'fragile') or testing a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would
be beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then it may
be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

It can't be that simple, or I wouldn't keep hearing of garages
misthreading them.

I've lost count of the amount of times I've changed engine oil.
Sometimes flat on my back, sometimes with the car jacked up, sometimes with
the front wheels on ramps ---------- yes I know about a bit of the old oil
not being drained out.
I have Never cross threaded a sump plug. Easiest job in the world.

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 16:52:06 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 08:24:08 -0000, T i m wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire
wrote:
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil
myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the
saying 'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for
tightening a sump nut (especially where they are known to be
'fragile') or testing a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I have
often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought would
be beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a spanner).

Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then it may
be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

It can't be that simple, or I wouldn't keep hearing of garages
misthreading them.

I've lost count of the amount of times I've changed engine oil.
Sometimes flat on my back, sometimes with the car jacked up, sometimes with
the front wheels on ramps ---------- yes I know about a bit of the old oil
not being drained out.
I have Never cross threaded a sump plug. Easiest job in the world.

Maybe older cars have the problem, even with decent care taken? Or maybe there's a few garages that don't know what they're doing. The times I've heard it is one garage complaining the last one damaged the thread. Never on my car though, friend's and colleagues, I guess I've been lucky. Or maybe at some time in the past one of those owners tried it himself without a torque wrench. Do you use a torque wrench?

--
Mary had a little lamb, it walked into a pylon. 10,000 volts went up its arse, and turned its wool to nylon.

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 16:52:06 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire
wrote:
James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 08:24:08 -0000, T i m wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:29:11 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 19:26:16 -0000, Mr Pounder Esquire
wrote:
jim wrote:
vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Which is why I don't do as Mr Pounder suggests and change the oil
myself.

I was asked to advise a lad who was considering doing his own car
servicing about the tools he would need and I put 'torque wrench'
right up there. The point is, if you are 'new' to that game you may
have no idea what 20 ft/lb feels like and therefore there is a good
chance you could damage something.

But just like any subject there are 'tools for the job' and the
saying 'you can manage what you can measure is no less true for
tightening a sump nut (especially where they are known to be
'fragile') or testing a battery or broadband speed.

Now, *when* you know what you are doing you can sometimes get away
using less than optimal tools (especially needs-must etc) and I
have often tested my Leatherman PST II Multitool to what I thought
would be beyond it's limits (including where I should have used a
spanner). Now, if you don't have any patience or are 'cack handed' then
it
may be best to bend over and leave it to the professionals. ;-)

It can't be that simple, or I wouldn't keep hearing of garages
misthreading them.

I've lost count of the amount of times I've changed engine oil.
Sometimes flat on my back, sometimes with the car jacked up,
sometimes with the front wheels on ramps ---------- yes I know about
a bit of the old oil not being drained out.
I have Never cross threaded a sump plug. Easiest job in the world.

Maybe older cars have the problem, even with decent care taken? Or
maybe there's a few garages that don't know what they're doing. The
times I've heard it is one garage complaining the last one damaged
the thread. Never on my car though, friend's and colleagues, I guess
I've been lucky. Or maybe at some time in the past one of those
owners tried it himself without a torque wrench. Do you use a torque
wrench?

All the cars I used to service were old. I don't do that stuff anymore.
Can't understand how anybody can cross thread a sump plug.
Main dealers are "probably" expected to use a torque wrench. My garage uses
one, he is not a main dealer.
I just used a socket and tightened until it felt right. I never changed the
seal and the plug never leaked oil.

"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:
jim k Wrote in message:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the case
that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical' thread, and no
shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems an odd way to do it,
though. What model is it? Easy to search ebay for 'VW whatever sump
plug washer', just to see if they exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is

£50 new (ebay) plus fitting of course.

b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)



I personally wouldn't replace the sump, just because the plug is
leaking, unless it is very obvious that the thread is nackered. I
wouldn't tighten it any more, either. I'd take the plug out (oil will
fly out!), clean the hole and the plug threads, and put it back with
something really viscous. Hylomar is my favourite.

Note that the sump plug is also the natural place for a leak from
anywhere else to run to. Oil can creep slowly around the outside
surface of the engine, and still look like it's dripping from the plug.
Unless you can get it on ramps and get under it, it's very hard to be
sure. Maybe put some chalk dust on it and leave it for a few hours, and
see if a track is left in it.

Unless it's really obvious that it /is/ coming from the plug?


Yup been under and watched & wiped :-)

--
Jim K

jim wrote:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:
jim k Wrote in message:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the
case that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical'
thread, and no shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems
an odd way to do it, though. What model is it? Easy to search
ebay for 'VW whatever sump plug washer', just to see if they
exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is

£50 new (ebay) plus fitting of course.

b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal
washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)



I personally wouldn't replace the sump, just because the plug is
leaking, unless it is very obvious that the thread is nackered. I
wouldn't tighten it any more, either. I'd take the plug out (oil
will fly out!), clean the hole and the plug threads, and put it back
with something really viscous. Hylomar is my favourite.

Note that the sump plug is also the natural place for a leak from
anywhere else to run to. Oil can creep slowly around the outside
surface of the engine, and still look like it's dripping from the
plug. Unless you can get it on ramps and get under it, it's very
hard to be sure. Maybe put some chalk dust on it and leave it for a
few hours, and see if a track is left in it.

Unless it's really obvious that it /is/ coming from the plug?


Yup been under and watched & wiped :-)

Like I suggested, PTFE tape.
Drain the oil, clean the plug.
Make a seal with the tape on the shoulder of the plug.
Must be worth a go?

Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
jim wrote:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:
jim k Wrote in message:
"Dan S. MacAbre" Wrote in message:
jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

This one drips even with a new sump plug.

Much goggling warns of stripping threads in sump body through
overtightening and dropped/damaged sump plugs wearing the
threads of the sump and causing the leaks...

Any tried & tested solutions to this?

Ultimately a new sump is indicated, but until then anything worth
trying?

TIA


BTW, if the plug does have a shoulder, then maybe it's just the
case that the washer is missing? OTOH, if it has a 'conical'
thread, and no shoulder, then your assumption is correct. Seems
an odd way to do it, though. What model is it? Easy to search
ebay for 'VW whatever sump plug washer', just to see if they
exist.


Ah well put like that I dug some mo-

a: sump is
steel not alloy, new sump part is

£50 new (ebay) plus fitting of course.

b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal
washer.

I got under for a look/fiddle & tbh I don't want to tighten it
anymore than I have done! :-)



I personally wouldn't replace the sump, just because the plug is
leaking, unless it is very obvious that the thread is nackered. I
wouldn't tighten it any more, either. I'd take the plug out (oil
will fly out!), clean the hole and the plug threads, and put it back
with something really viscous. Hylomar is my favourite.

Note that the sump plug is also the natural place for a leak from
anywhere else to run to. Oil can creep slowly around the outside
surface of the engine, and still look like it's dripping from the
plug. Unless you can get it on ramps and get under it, it's very
hard to be sure. Maybe put some chalk dust on it and leave it for a
few hours, and see if a track is left in it.

Unless it's really obvious that it /is/ coming from the plug?


Yup been under and watched & wiped :-)

Like I suggested, PTFE tape.
Drain the oil, clean the plug.
Make a seal with the tape on the shoulder of the plug.
Must be worth a go?


Definitely.

On 16/12/16 13:22, jim wrote:
Dowty washers

They'd work *provided* the thread still holds firm.

Robin wrote:

On 15/12/2016 19:18, jim wrote:

vw sump plug slow drippy leak....

I believe these vw plugs seal on the thread rather than the
"crushable/copper washer against the sump body" style....

I'd be inclined to check that it's not just a matter of your being sold
a sump plug without the washer that's meant to be used with it. But
then I don't do "belief"

Suitable copper or aluminium washers are available as a generic part (by
diameter of course) and I would certainly try one of these before
resorting to anything else. If for no other reason than that the washer
is easier to seal than the thread if it is a parallel one.

--

Roger Hayter

Tim Watts Wrote in message:
On 16/12/16 13:22, jim wrote:
Dowty washers

They'd work *provided* the thread still holds firm.


Spose so. It's cranked up with a 8" adjustable as far as I want to
take it, & still drips a bit.

Beginning to wonder - if the sump's steel & the plug's steel, how
much can I give it before really buggering it up?

What's the failure mode? Sudden catastrophic loosening whilst
tightening?

I did read someat about dowty washers not needing as much torque
to work as compared to metal crush washers...

--
Jim K

jim wrote:
Tim Watts Wrote in message:
On 16/12/16 13:22, jim wrote:
Dowty washers

They'd work *provided* the thread still holds firm.


Spose so. It's cranked up with a 8" adjustable as far as I want to
take it, & still drips a bit.

Beginning to wonder - if the sump's steel & the plug's steel, how
much can I give it before really buggering it up?

What's the failure mode? Sudden catastrophic loosening whilst
tightening?

I did read someat about dowty washers not needing as much torque
to work as compared to metal crush washers...

PTFE............ as I said.

"What's the failure mode? Sudden catastrophic loosening whilst
tightening?"

Nice troll, well done.

jim explained :
b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal washer.

Then it is a single use alloy washer. Sometimes they are not solid, but
are semi-hollow, designed to crush down.

Harry Bloomfield wrote:
jim explained :
b: sump plug is steel & does have a "silvery" not copper, metal
washer.

Then it is a single use alloy washer. Sometimes they are not solid,
but are semi-hollow, designed to crush down.

Yes Harry.
But a wind of PTFE will do the job.
I suspect wind up here.