In message , Grimly
Curmudgeon writes
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

Huge plot,
right on the coast. Isle of Mull.

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

Even TNP will have to admit there is a place for this.

Right; a windmill, solar panels and a battery bank.
It will cost, but over five years, how much would you have paid for
conventional service anyway? Budget for replacing teh battery bank
every five years or so.

You could run everything on lower voltage - LED lighting is incredibly
effective and efficient and your TV/radio/entertainment can all be
done easily on low voltage supplies.
I'd still keep a gas lamp handy and some paraffin around, just in
case, though.
Most could be run on low voltage and DC thus reducing the need for and
losses in inverters.
--
bert

On Mon, 02 Sep 2013 23:02:59 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

Even TNP will have to admit there is a place for this.

I'm afraid he has already proved his irrationality wrt to this
situation by saying: "nobody needs wind power" - perhaps not if you
produce as much of your own as he does.

However, I think almost everyone else has suggested it, which must
mean something. There have been one or two rather loopy ideas such as
wave power - I suspect it would be cheaper to build a road and bury
an electricity supply along it than get involved in that.

Right; a windmill, solar panels and a battery bank.

And a back-up generator.

It will cost, but over five years, how much would you have paid for
conventional service anyway? Budget for replacing teh battery bank
every five years or so.

You could run everything on lower voltage - LED lighting is incredibly
effective and efficient and your TV/radio/entertainment can all be
done easily on low voltage supplies.

I'd still keep a gas lamp handy and some paraffin around, just in
case, though.

Yes, definitely.

I still think he should look up the Eig installation, and maybe visit
the Alternative Technology Centre in North Wales, if it's not too far.
--
================================================== =======
Please always reply to ng as the email in this post's
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On 03/09/2013 00:04, Java Jive wrote:

Right; a windmill, solar panels and a battery bank.
And a back-up generator.

The problem with wind power in the UK is that whatever the size of the
windmill a backup generator is *always* needed.

On a related note my local paper (Keighley News) has two reports this
week of failed applications by farmers to erect dinky (35m tower)
windmills by local farmers. One denied by Bradford, the other by Craven.
Nimbyism rules where prospective developers are too small to have
politicians in their pockets.

--
Roger Chapman

In article ,
Roger Chapman wrote:
On 03/09/2013 00:04, Java Jive wrote:

Right; a windmill, solar panels and a battery bank.
And a back-up generator.

The problem with wind power in the UK is that whatever the size of the
windmill a backup generator is *always* needed.

In the 1980s the BBC installed a small tv transmitter in the west of
Scotland powered by a combination of solar and wind power - no back up
generator. The IBA retalliated by building one in Cornwall , but did put
in mains power, too. Just as well, since a storm broke off the turbine
blades which fell and shattered the solar panel !

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 23:37:43 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

If it's the place I think it is there is damn big hill behind it so a
decent head shouldn't be a problem. How much water is available at
the top is another matter but even if you can only get enough for a
kW of lecky 24/7 that'll almost be enough with a good sized battery
bank to store the "excess" overnight.

Or, as in my place, with a steady stream, albeit with a low head but
reasonable flow, a scoop-type wheel driving a PM alternator,
unregulated/unrectified, the raw 3-phase AC simply feeding an
immersion heater in a bulk tank.
When I get a round tuit.

On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News wrote:


This is not really a serious question, but your thoughts will be
interesting.

Vaguely house hunting, as you do, we came across a lovely 4 bed cottage,
a mile away from the nearest small town. The house has private water
and drainage, and no other services. No road between the house and
town. No gas, electricity or phone. It is lived in (not a holiday
home), current occupants use stoves, fires, bottled gas lamps, paraffin
lamps etc. Keep in mind no road, so no bulk deliveries of Calor gas or
oil. Sounds idyllic in one way, but a nightmare in another. Huge plot,
right on the coast. Isle of Mull.

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

Living there full time and expecting modern conveniences would be expensive.
There appears to be no appreciable area of land with the property such as a few
acres of forest to harvest so its going to be hard to exist without outside
assistance / fuel.

There is a possible line of sight to the south at local noon for a few months of
the year, but not all year round and maybe not all day even in summer. So a
possible fit of Solar PV on the rear aspect preferably the rear garden as solar
on the roof will be vulnerable to wind damage. Wind turbine, or even two, the
biggest you can afford or are permitted to erect, preferably on high ground. DC
sources feeding a battery bank sized for 'essentials' A diesel generator for
when wind doesn't blow, given the remote location and the fuel supply logistics
this emphatically should **NOT** be auto start, you need to reduce generator run
time and fuel burn to an absolute minimum. Could be once a week for a battery
top up followed by a bath etc. Maybe have heat recovery from the generator to
preheat water. Maybe solar thermal too. Run all lighting off DC to avoid
inverter losses. Install silly amounts of insulation so heating demand is very
low, come to an arrangement with nearby farmer / forestry owner to hack a few
trees down, maybe a woodburning stove for heat and cooking.

Or run a cable in

Or simply forget it

Or for half the price get a decent (40ft ish) sized yacht and admire the scenery
from the water, no midges, you carry your own home comforts and can sample
'civilisation' in various ports.


--

On Sun, 01 Sep 2013 10:47:13 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

I would've thought that some form of solar panels and batteries would
be the obvious choice.
Not in winter. Useless.

Asshole.

you'd need wind power, too

nobody needs wind power

Asshole.

On Sun, 1 Sep 2013 15:12:04 +0100, News
wrote:

Indeed. Most people seem to have found it :-)

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-...136.html/svr/3
105

I'm not really serious, but on some levels it is attractive.

Heh...
"Outside the buzz of Tobermory"
Aye, you want to stay away from the 'mory, hellish pit of spawn and
Satan it is; why they even allow dancing there - on Mondays, too, the
jezebels.

The access is easily negotiated with a trail bike and small trailer,
iwt. Also, I'd look seriously at widening the 'footpath' with a
mini-digger. Likely only needs a foot or two and not enough to alarm
anyone if done discreetly.

On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News wrote:


This is not really a serious question, but your thoughts will be
interesting.

Vaguely house hunting, as you do, we came across a lovely 4 bed cottage,
a mile away from the nearest small town. The house has private water
and drainage, and no other services. No road between the house and
town. No gas, electricity or phone. It is lived in (not a holiday
home), current occupants use stoves, fires, bottled gas lamps, paraffin
lamps etc. Keep in mind no road, so no bulk deliveries of Calor gas or
oil. Sounds idyllic in one way, but a nightmare in another. Huge plot,
right on the coast. Isle of Mull.

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel farm. there are ones that track
the sun for best performance along with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel
building kit a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build and set up.

there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive one on some tv show a while
back that produced enough electricity for use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.


--

mhm x v i x i i i

happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel farm. there are ones that track
the sun for best performance along with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel
building kit a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.

there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive one on some tv show a while
back that produced enough electricity for use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.

If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living, so
would I.

Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply and broadband
problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the village. A quad bike
and small trailer could take care of gas bottles in the Winter, and
stock up on oil in the Summer by boat to the jetty

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article ,
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Sun, 1 Sep 2013 15:12:04 +0100, News
wrote:

Indeed. Most people seem to have found it :-)

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-...136.html/svr/3
105

I'm not really serious, but on some levels it is attractive.

Heh...
"Outside the buzz of Tobermory"
Aye, you want to stay away from the 'mory, hellish pit of spawn and
Satan it is; why they even allow dancing there - on Mondays, too, the
jezebels.

The access is easily negotiated with a trail bike and small trailer,
iwt. Also, I'd look seriously at widening the 'footpath' with a
mini-digger. Likely only needs a foot or two and not enough to alarm
anyone if done discreetly.

It's pretty solid rock there, with next to no soil on top. I reckon you'd
need something a bit more powerful than "a mini digger". And how about the
land owner? They might not want things tampered with.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 14:09:03 +0100, John Williamson wrote:

happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel farm. there are ones that track
the sun for best performance along with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel
building kit a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.

that is unfortunate.

there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive one on some tv show a while
back that produced enough electricity for use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.

If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living, so
would I.

Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply and broadband
problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the village. A quad bike
and small trailer could take care of gas bottles in the Winter, and
stock up on oil in the Summer by boat to the jetty

its a damn shame everything comes down to money.


--

mhm x v i x i i i

In article , charles
scribeth thus
In article ,
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Sun, 1 Sep 2013 15:12:04 +0100, News
wrote:

Indeed. Most people seem to have found it :-)

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-...136.html/svr/3
105

I'm not really serious, but on some levels it is attractive.

Heh...
"Outside the buzz of Tobermory"
Aye, you want to stay away from the 'mory, hellish pit of spawn and
Satan it is; why they even allow dancing there - on Mondays, too, the
jezebels.

The access is easily negotiated with a trail bike and small trailer,
iwt. Also, I'd look seriously at widening the 'footpath' with a
mini-digger. Likely only needs a foot or two and not enough to alarm
anyone if done discreetly.

It's pretty solid rock there, with next to no soil on top. I reckon you'd
need something a bit more powerful than "a mini digger". And how about the
land owner? They might not want things tampered with.


If its that firm no need to dig just chuck and compact some type 1 on
it...

--
Tony Sayer

In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel
farm. there are ones that track the sun for best performance along with
ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel building kit
a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.

there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive
one on some tv show a while back that produced enough electricity for
use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry
about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.

If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living, so
would I.

Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply and broadband
problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the village.

It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be excessive.
You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you have to be a
very big lot richer beforehand.


A quad bike and small trailer could take care of gas bottles in the
Winter, and stock up on oil in the Summer by boat to the jetty

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On 03/09/13 15:16, charles wrote:
In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?
if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel
farm. there are ones that track the sun for best performance along with
ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel building kit
a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.
there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive
one on some tv show a while back that produced enough electricity for
use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry
about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.
If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living, so
would I.
Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply and broadband
problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be excessive.
You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you have to be a
very big lot richer beforehand.

run it at 11KV and have yer own transformer.

As I said probably cost not as much as you think, esp on overheads


A quad bike and small trailer could take care of gas bottles in the
Winter, and stock up on oil in the Summer by boat to the jetty


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 03/09/13 15:16, charles wrote:
In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time?
Or would you not bother?
if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel
farm. there are ones that track the sun for best performance along
with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel
building kit a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build
and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.
there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive
one on some tv show a while back that produced enough electricity for
use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry
about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.
If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living,
so would I. Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply
and broadband problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the
village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be
excessive. You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you
have to be a very big lot richer beforehand.

run it at 11KV and have yer own transformer.

would you be allowed to on land that you don't own?

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On 03/09/2013 14:26, charles wrote:

The access is easily negotiated with a trail bike and small trailer,
iwt. Also, I'd look seriously at widening the 'footpath' with a
mini-digger. Likely only needs a foot or two and not enough to alarm
anyone if done discreetly.

It's pretty solid rock there, with next to no soil on top. I reckon you'd
need something a bit more powerful than "a mini digger". And how about the
land owner? They might not want things tampered with.

Looking at the contours the path traverses some pretty steep hillside so
getting the width might be very difficult in places. OTOH the path is
called the old road so might have the width in the first place.

The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.

--
Roger Chapman

On 03/09/2013 15:16, charles wrote:
Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply and broadband
problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be excessive.
You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you have to be a
very big lot richer beforehand.


It is a little over 1 mile following the path and only half a mile from
the nearest habitation, Erray House.

--
Roger Chapman

In message , at 16:01:26 on
Tue, 3 Sep 2013, Roger Chapman remarked:
It is a little over 1 mile following the path and only half a mile from
the nearest habitation, Erray House.

Does the latter have electrickery?
--
Roland Perry

On Saturday, August 31, 2013 11:37:43 PM UTC+1, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 22:26:24 +0100, Java Jive wrote:


Paraffin as in pressure or wick? Gas lanterns give a better light
than a wick oil lamp and are less smelly unless you use an
(expensive) refined lamp oil.

'Aladdin lamps' use a (circular) wick and ordinary paraffin but have a mantle. No smell, no noise and a good light. i sued them when I lived without electricity on a boat.

Robert

On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 14:26:37 +0100, charles
wrote:

It's pretty solid rock there, with next to no soil on top. I reckon you'd
need something a bit more powerful than "a mini digger". And how about the
land owner? They might not want things tampered with.

**** off, you sarky ****.

On 03/09/2013 16:22, Roland Perry wrote:

In message , at 16:01:26 on
Tue, 3 Sep 2013, Roger Chapman remarked:

It is a little over 1 mile following the path and only half a mile
from the nearest habitation, Erray House.

Does the latter have electrickery?

Yes. I followed the road on streetview to the end and there are 2 wooden
poles in view carrying a single phase. I was wrong in that what I
thought was a single farm turns out to be a cluster of buildings with a
large house and a cottage the far side of Erray House. The small cottage
seems to be directly under the final span of the single phase line. I
can just make out part of the penultimate span but not the next pole
down the line which is hidden by Erray House itself. Back down the road
and just past Erray house's private access the supply line can be seen
again, this time HV with a pole transformer for a little cluster of
cottages so the HV line must terminate somewhere out of view behind
Erray House.

--
Roger Chapman

In article , charles
scribeth thus
In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 03/09/13 15:16, charles wrote:
In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time?
Or would you not bother?
if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel
farm. there are ones that track the sun for best performance along
with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a diy solar panel
building kit a while back, it didn't seem very complcated to build
and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.
there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather impressive
one on some tv show a while back that produced enough electricity for
use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need worry
about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.
If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a living,
so would I. Then again, (a) could take care of the electricity supply
and broadband problems, as I could afford to run a cable from the
village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be
excessive. You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you
have to be a very big lot richer beforehand.

run it at 11KV and have yer own transformer.

would you be allowed to on land that you don't own?

Generally yes, they the power distribution company pay wayleave's for
the rights to have their cables cross someone else's land...


--
Tony Sayer

On 03/09/2013 15:16, charles wrote:
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be excessive.
You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then you have to be a
very big lot richer beforehand.

During the three day week my school decided to show films during cuts.
They could do this because they could feed a very long cable from a
building which happened to be in the next-door block and on a different
schedule for cuts. Voltage drop addressed by a simple variable
transformer which fed the projector with an adequate voltage.

--
Rod

In article , tony sayer
wrote:
In article , charles
scribeth thus
In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 03/09/13 15:16, charles wrote:
In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full
time? Or would you not bother?
if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar
pannel farm. there are ones that track the sun for best
performance along with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a
diy solar panel building kit a while back, it didn't seem very
complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.
there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather
impressive one on some tv show a while back that produced enough
electricity for use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need
worry about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.
If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a
living, so would I. Then again, (a) could take care of the
electricity supply and broadband problems, as I could afford to run
a cable from the village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be
excessive. You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then
you have to be a very big lot richer beforehand.

run it at 11KV and have yer own transformer.

would you be allowed to on land that you don't own?

Generally yes, they the power distribution company pay wayleave's for
the rights to have their cables cross someone else's land...

I know power companies do. I read the suggestion as "run your own cable".

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

"Dave Liquorice" writes:

On Sun, 01 Sep 2013 14:01:30 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full
time?

If I didn't have a stream for hydro power, obviously I'd have a
wood-burning steam engine driving a generator.

And where does thewood come from?

In this case imported from main land Scotland and either carried
overland along the mountain path or if still in good sized logs made
into a raft and floated around the coast when the weather allows.
they would then need moved up to the cottage, cut and split.

Or you could burn peat - someone has I think tried that.

Another thought is one of the small CHP plants and a big battery bank
to to buffer any excess lecky. Still need to carry in the fuel
though...

The batteries are the problem. It's said that the old NiFe cells are
almost indestructible if the electrolyte is replenished properly (only
at long intervals), but you only get back about half of the power you
put in, the voltage is only 1.1 volts so you need more cells, and last
time I looked, large NiFe cells were only obtainable from China, and
only in large quantities.


--
Windmill, Use t m i l l
J.R.R. Tolkien:- @ S c o t s h o m e . c o m
All that is gold does not glister / Not all who wander are lost

On 3 Sep 2013 21:27:38 GMT, Huge wrote:

On 2013-09-03, happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News wrote:


This is not really a serious question, but your thoughts will be
interesting.

Vaguely house hunting, as you do, we came across a lovely 4 bed cottage,
a mile away from the nearest small town. The house has private water
and drainage, and no other services. No road between the house and
town. No gas, electricity or phone. It is lived in (not a holiday
home), current occupants use stoves, fires, bottled gas lamps, paraffin
lamps etc. Keep in mind no road, so no bulk deliveries of Calor gas or
oil. Sounds idyllic in one way, but a nightmare in another. Huge plot,
right on the coast. Isle of Mull.

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar pannel farm. there are ones that track
the sun

Not been to Mull, have you?

nope. been to scotland once and that was to just outside of peebles where my friend is a laird.


--

mhm x v i x i i i

On 03/09/13 15:54, Roger Chapman wrote:
On 03/09/2013 14:26, charles wrote:

The access is easily negotiated with a trail bike and small trailer,
iwt. Also, I'd look seriously at widening the 'footpath' with a
mini-digger. Likely only needs a foot or two and not enough to alarm
anyone if done discreetly.

It's pretty solid rock there, with next to no soil on top. I reckon you'd
need something a bit more powerful than "a mini digger". And how about
the
land owner? They might not want things tampered with.

Looking at the contours the path traverses some pretty steep hillside so
getting the width might be very difficult in places. OTOH the path is
called the old road so might have the width in the first place.

The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.

Looking at the map on the downloadable brochure there is an area edged
in blue that extends alonng the shore to Tobermory. If that is the 80
acres then the path/road is all on the land.



--
djc

On Tuesday 03 September 2013 23:22 happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote in
uk.d-i-y:


nope. been to scotland once and that was to just outside of peebles where
my friend is a laird.

Your friend is Edmund Blackadder?

--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://squiddy.blog.dionic.net/

http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

Reading this on the web? See:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Usenet

On 04/09/2013 00:21, djc wrote:
The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.

Looking at the map on the downloadable brochure there is an area edged
in blue that extends alonng the shore to Tobermory. If that is the 80
acres then the path/road is all on the land.

I missed the downloadable brochure and couldn't be bothered to register
for more detail. :-(

That blue border does seem to contain about 80 acres but it stops short
of the town and the last quarter mile or so of the track is outside of
the area. It is not clear from the 1:25000 exactly where the track
leaves the built up area. On the face of it the path heading diagonally
up the hill by the road end at the pier as seen in streetview shouldn't
be it but it could be.

--
Roger Chapman

On Wednesday 04 September 2013 08:29 Roger Chapman wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On 04/09/2013 00:21, djc wrote:
The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.

Looking at the map on the downloadable brochure there is an area edged
in blue that extends alonng the shore to Tobermory. If that is the 80
acres then the path/road is all on the land.

I missed the downloadable brochure and couldn't be bothered to register
for more detail. :-(

That blue border does seem to contain about 80 acres but it stops short
of the town and the last quarter mile or so of the track is outside of
the area. It is not clear from the 1:25000 exactly where the track
leaves the built up area. On the face of it the path heading diagonally
up the hill by the road end at the pier as seen in streetview shouldn't
be it but it could be.


It goes as far as he

http://goo.gl/maps/k5kXS

There's a road with power lines 20m away. I wonder how the electricity
company would view putting a supply in to a small brick outhouse in those
woods (convenient for them to read the meter).

From there you add your own transformer[1] and private distribution lines
entirely across your land.

[1] And not necessarily HV - perhaps just an autotransformer to boost it
enough to balance the losses and drop a LV line in. Might be reasonable all
things said and done to trench a bit of SWA in - at least you will have no
lines to blow over.
--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://squiddy.blog.dionic.net/

http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

Reading this on the web? See:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Usenet

On 04/09/13 10:20, Tim Watts wrote:
On Wednesday 04 September 2013 08:29 Roger Chapman wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On 04/09/2013 00:21, djc wrote:
The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.
Looking at the map on the downloadable brochure there is an area edged
in blue that extends alonng the shore to Tobermory. If that is the 80
acres then the path/road is all on the land.
I missed the downloadable brochure and couldn't be bothered to register
for more detail. :-(

That blue border does seem to contain about 80 acres but it stops short
of the town and the last quarter mile or so of the track is outside of
the area. It is not clear from the 1:25000 exactly where the track
leaves the built up area. On the face of it the path heading diagonally
up the hill by the road end at the pier as seen in streetview shouldn't
be it but it could be.

It goes as far as he

http://goo.gl/maps/k5kXS

There's a road with power lines 20m away. I wonder how the electricity
company would view putting a supply in to a small brick outhouse in those
woods (convenient for them to read the meter).

typically long distance will be 11KV single or 3 phase. piece of **** to
couple that to a ground based transformer. Then its up to the
householder to dig a trench to the house..


From there you add your own transformer[1] and private distribution lines
entirely across your land.

[1] And not necessarily HV - perhaps just an autotransformer to boost it
enough to balance the losses and drop a LV line in. Might be reasonable all
things said and done to trench a bit of SWA in - at least you will have no
lines to blow over.

indeed.

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%...ower%20cut.png

dropped through the door yesterday.

Why? CUTTING TREES.

As I said t they are not putting in any more 11KV overheads here.



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

In message , John Williamson
writes
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 22:41:07 +0100, Bill wrote:

Being pedantic, why "auto start/stop"? There is no other supply.
So the set isn't running, wasting fuel, when there is no demand.
Bearing in mind that generators can run off red diesel it could be a
cheapish first move.
How much do you think red costs?

I just paid 90p/litre retail at the boatyard pump. If you're buying a
tankful, it'll likely be cheaper if you can get the tanker to it.

Is that *averaged* to take account of fuel tax used for
transport/heating etc.?


--
Tim Lamb

On Wed, 04 Sep 2013 10:42:19 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%...ower%20cut.png

dropped through the door yesterday.

Why? CUTTING TREES.

Trees have a habit of growing... We'ved had a few of those this year,
first time for tree cutting in the 14 odd years we've been here.
Unless admitting it's for tree cutting is a new thing rather than
"essential network maintenace".

As I said t they are not putting in any more 11KV overheads here.

They don't round here either but the existing overhead they do
maintain rather than underground. One section going over the fell
tops so from an "enviromental" and exposer POV would have been a
prime candidate to undergrpund has just had virtually all its poles,
stays(*), iron work, insulators etc replaced.

Haveing heard the fuss that English Nature made when the water board
moled a 6" main over the same fell top a few years back I'm not
surprised the DNO took the easy "maintenance" route rather than go
through planning, approvals, enviromental impact, wildlife assements,
etc to underground it. Fing stupid, 6 months after the water main had
been moled in you had to know where it was to notice it. Now you
can't tell. Similar fuss was made about 2 x 8" pipes feeding a small
(700 kW ish) hydro station from an old (1850's) fellside reservoir,
they where open trenched in but again you can't tell where they are
now.

(*) Did I say this lilne was exposed? Every pole has two stays at 90
degrees to the line. Those with extra kit such as an air switch have
four stays.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 04/09/2013 10:20, Tim Watts wrote:
I missed the downloadable brochure and couldn't be bothered to register
for more detail.:-(

That blue border does seem to contain about 80 acres but it stops short
of the town and the last quarter mile or so of the track is outside of
the area. It is not clear from the 1:25000 exactly where the track
leaves the built up area. On the face of it the path heading diagonally
up the hill by the road end at the pier as seen in streetview shouldn't
be it but it could be.

The brochure map is a bit clearer than the OS map but even on that I
can't be sure that path is more than a footpath for more than the short
distance the map indicates some width.

It goes as far as he

http://goo.gl/maps/k5kXS

There's a road with power lines 20m away. I wonder how the electricity
company would view putting a supply in to a small brick outhouse in those
woods (convenient for them to read the meter).

Are you sure about that. ISTM that the south-west tip of the property is
some distance from a public road and the pole that shows up in
streetview looks like telephone to me.


From there you add your own transformer[1] and private distribution lines
entirely across your land.

[1] And not necessarily HV - perhaps just an autotransformer to boost it
enough to balance the losses and drop a LV line in. Might be reasonable all
things said and done to trench a bit of SWA in - at least you will have no
lines to blow over.

The (presumably) 11KV line to Erray House would be closer if the
electricity company would put the supply in and IIRC they would do the
necessary provided the client paid a substantial part of the cost.


--
Roger Chapman

Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , John Williamson
writes
Dave Liquorice wrote:
How much do you think red costs?

I just paid 90p/litre retail at the boatyard pump. If you're buying a
tankful, it'll likely be cheaper if you can get the tanker to it.

Is that *averaged* to take account of fuel tax used for
transport/heating etc.?

Some boatyards average the VAT and duty according to an approved
formula, others don't. I didn't bother asking, as I had an unknown
quantity of fuel in the tank, and needed at least 4 hours cruising reserve.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

News wrote:


This is not really a serious question, but your thoughts will be
interesting.

Vaguely house hunting, as you do, we came across a lovely 4 bed
cottage,
a mile away from the nearest small town. The house has private water
and drainage, and no other services. No road between the house and
town. No gas, electricity or phone. It is lived in (not a holiday
home), current occupants use stoves, fires, bottled gas lamps, paraffin
lamps etc. Keep in mind no road, so no bulk deliveries of Calor gas or
oil. Sounds idyllic in one way, but a nightmare in another. Huge
plot,
right on the coast. Isle of Mull.

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full time? Or
would you not bother?

Before thinking about electricity I'd want to know more about the sea and
tides there. It looks very near sea level. I believe Tobermory has had
tidal flooding in recent years.

Edgar

On 04/09/13 13:09, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 04 Sep 2013 10:42:19 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%...ower%20cut.png

dropped through the door yesterday.

Why? CUTTING TREES.
Trees have a habit of growing... We'ved had a few of those this year,
first time for tree cutting in the 14 odd years we've been here.
Unless admitting it's for tree cutting is a new thing rather than
"essential network maintenace".

As I said t they are not putting in any more 11KV overheads here.
They don't round here either but the existing overhead they do
maintain rather than underground. One section going over the fell
tops so from an "enviromental" and exposer POV would have been a
prime candidate to undergrpund has just had virtually all its poles,
stays(*), iron work, insulators etc replaced.

Haveing heard the fuss that English Nature made when the water board
moled a 6" main over the same fell top a few years back I'm not
surprised the DNO took the easy "maintenance" route rather than go
through planning, approvals, enviromental impact, wildlife assements,
etc to underground it. Fing stupid, 6 months after the water main had
been moled in you had to know where it was to notice it. Now you
can't tell. Similar fuss was made about 2 x 8" pipes feeding a small
(700 kW ish) hydro station from an old (1850's) fellside reservoir,
they where open trenched in but again you can't tell where they are
now.

yes. when I bult te house 90% of the garden got trashed. It was
bulldozed mud everywere. I said to my wife who was in tears 'it will be
weeds in 2 months, grass in 6', and it was.,

I think environmental assem,ents area great idea BUT the problem is its
just money for consultants. In a case like that you should say 'bugger
that: its one digger running a mile cutting a 9" wide trench, how much
of a disaster could that be?' and waive the environmental ********.


(*) Did I say this lilne was exposed? Every pole has two stays at 90
degrees to the line. Those with extra kit such as an air switch have
four stays.



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

In article , The Natural Philosopher
scribeth thus
On 04/09/13 10:20, Tim Watts wrote:
On Wednesday 04 September 2013 08:29 Roger Chapman wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On 04/09/2013 00:21, djc wrote:
The particulars say the property has 80 acres of land which could easily
be the steep land between the cottage and Tobermory. Contrary to what
has been suggested previously most of this land is wooded so wood for
fuel would not seem to be a problem nor would widening the track should
it be on the property.
Looking at the map on the downloadable brochure there is an area edged
in blue that extends alonng the shore to Tobermory. If that is the 80
acres then the path/road is all on the land.
I missed the downloadable brochure and couldn't be bothered to register
for more detail. :-(

That blue border does seem to contain about 80 acres but it stops short
of the town and the last quarter mile or so of the track is outside of
the area. It is not clear from the 1:25000 exactly where the track
leaves the built up area. On the face of it the path heading diagonally
up the hill by the road end at the pier as seen in streetview shouldn't
be it but it could be.

It goes as far as he

http://goo.gl/maps/k5kXS

There's a road with power lines 20m away. I wonder how the electricity
company would view putting a supply in to a small brick outhouse in those
woods (convenient for them to read the meter).

typically long distance will be 11KV single or 3 phase. piece of **** to
couple that to a ground based transformer. Then its up to the
householder to dig a trench to the house..


From there you add your own transformer[1] and private distribution lines
entirely across your land.

[1] And not necessarily HV - perhaps just an autotransformer to boost it
enough to balance the losses and drop a LV line in. Might be reasonable all
things said and done to trench a bit of SWA in - at least you will have no
lines to blow over.

indeed.

http://vps.templar.co.uk/Odds%20and%...ower%20cut.png

dropped through the door yesterday.

Why? CUTTING TREES.


Cheer up you miserable odle sod! at least their doing some maintenance
thats more then what they do on a bit of 11 kV line that causes us
grief;!..


And they told you too, eh!, thats Luxury that is!..




As I said t they are not putting in any more 11KV overheads here.




--
Tony Sayer

In article , charles
scribeth thus
In article , tony sayer
wrote:
In article , charles
scribeth thus
In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 03/09/13 15:16, charles wrote:
In article , John Williamson
wrote:
happy zombie jebus on the cross wrote:
On Sat, 31 Aug 2013 20:41:31 +0100, News
wrote:

How would you generate electricity, if you lived there, full
time? Or would you not bother?
if it has a lot of land, you could easily accomodate a solar
pannel farm. there are ones that track the sun for best
performance along with ones for the roof if you wanted. i found a
diy solar panel building kit a while back, it didn't seem very
complcated to build and set up.

It's on the dark side of a north facing hill, unfortunately.
there is also the option of a wind turbine, i saw a rather
impressive one on some tv show a while back that produced enough
electricity for use even on a light breazy day.

as long as you have a decent battery system, you'll never need
worry about electricity.

i'd be very tempted by the place to be quite honest.
If I were (a) a lot richer and (b) not needing to work for a
living, so would I. Then again, (a) could take care of the
electricity supply and broadband problems, as I could afford to run
a cable from the village.
It's the best part of 2 miles! I think the voltage drop would be
excessive. You have to get the electricity supply so invoved. Then
you have to be a very big lot richer beforehand.

run it at 11KV and have yer own transformer.

would you be allowed to on land that you don't own?

Generally yes, they the power distribution company pay wayleave's for
the rights to have their cables cross someone else's land...

I know power companies do. I read the suggestion as "run your own cable".

Yes but running your own is quite an undertaking over that distance. Be
interesting to see the power companies take on doing that as we needed
power at a site and we had a quote for £8 big 'uns to add in another
supply very close to two others both hardly used either, we only needed
around 30 bl^^dy watts!.

But regs are regs and if they couldn't supply IIRC us with 80 or 100
amps then no go...

--
Tony Sayer