On 04/10/2012 07:55 Huge wrote:

On 2012-10-04, Arfa Daily wrote:

So, did anyone see The Beach Boys' dreadful performance on Later with J.H.
at the weekend ? :-)

Yes. Embarassingly bad.

As they were at Silverstone at the 'After the GP Party' a few years ago.

--
F

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:40:33 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as bad-tempered,
arrogant, insanely aggressive white van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are the police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought to teach the
other driver a lesson?


I did not try to enforce any legal rules or regulations. Far from
it, I broke the legal rules and regulations.

I enforced MY rules onto a member of the public that was giving me
**** and whose actions were also not legal.

OIC, its ok to illegally enforce your outrageous illegal rules, but
not for others to even point out infractions of our legal rules. I'm
not sure that there are classes for arrogance.

So what is the correct procedure when a headlight bulb fails? Must you stop
and swap it immediately?
I swapped it at the first convenient and safe place to do so (in the
forecourt of a garage in Thurnscoe) and not in the rain in the dark on a
road that is not safe to pull up on.

And what is the correct procedure when you see a car coming the other way
with a headlight out? Is it to put your main beams on and blind the other
driver?

One stupid ****er got taught a lesson by me. Two if you count the caravan
driver.

--
Adam

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:42:34 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:45:03 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:27:32 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as bad-tempered,
arrogant, insanely aggressive white van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are the
police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought to
teach the other driver a lesson? And have you thought
what might have happened if in her terror she swerved the
other way?

Why have you given the other driver a pair of tits and a
vagina?

You mean you stopped and saw she didn't have them?

The other driver was a he not a she.

It's not possible to even see the driver in an oncoming vehicle at
night unless you stopped. Or did you stop and give an earful then
roar off before they could clock your reg?

The main beams worked. And "she" had a beard.

Not two balls and a penis then; how convenient.

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams. I loved the
adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ****** think again about their
actions against me.

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were exchanged I
would have kicked his head in if he had threatened me.


--
Adam

On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 18:13:50 +0100, "ARW" wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:40:33 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as bad-tempered,
arrogant, insanely aggressive white van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are the police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought to teach the
other driver a lesson?


I did not try to enforce any legal rules or regulations. Far from
it, I broke the legal rules and regulations.

I enforced MY rules onto a member of the public that was giving me
**** and whose actions were also not legal.

OIC, its ok to illegally enforce your outrageous illegal rules, but
not for others to even point out infractions of our legal rules. I'm
not sure that there are classes for arrogance.

So what is the correct procedure when a headlight bulb fails? Must you stop
and swap it immediately?
I swapped it at the first convenient and safe place to do so (in the
forecourt of a garage in Thurnscoe) and not in the rain in the dark on a
road that is not safe to pull up on.

That is a sound course of action.

And what is the correct procedure when you see a car coming the other way
with a headlight out?

The Highway Code http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm has
nothing specific to say on this,

Is it to put your main beams on and blind the other driver?

No. Check especially sections 110, 111, 114, 115 below. There is also quite a lot relating
to your other driving techniques, 147 particularly.

Quote
Rules for drivers and motorcyclists (89-102)

89 Vehicle condition. You MUST ensure your vehicle and trailer comply with the full
requirements of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations and Road Vehicles
Lighting Regulations (see 'The road user and the law').

97 Before setting off. You should ensure that
* ensure your vehicle is legal and roadworthy

110 Flashing headlights. Only flash your headlights to let other road users know that you
are there. Do not flash your headlights to convey any other message or intimidate other
road users.

111 Never assume that flashing headlights is a signal inviting you to proceed. Use your
own judgement and proceed carefully.

Lighting requirements (113-116)

114 You MUST NOT

* use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other road users,
including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

115 You should also

* use dipped headlights, or dim-dip if fitted, at night in built-up areas and in dull
daytime weather, to ensure that you can be seen
* keep your headlights dipped when overtaking until you are level with the other
vehicle and then change to main beam if necessary, unless this would dazzle oncoming road
users
* slow down, and if necessary stop, if you are dazzled by oncoming headlights

General advice (144-158)

144 You MUST NOT

* drive dangerously
* drive without due care and attention
* drive without reasonable consideration for other road users

147 Be considerate. Be careful of and considerate towards all types of road users,
especially those requiring extra care (see Rule 204). You should

* try to be understanding if other road users cause problems; they may be inexperienced
or not know the area well
* be patient; remember that anyone can make a mistake
* not allow yourself to become agitated or involved if someone is behaving badly on the
road. This will only make the situation worse. Pull over, calm down and, when you feel
relaxed, continue your journey
* slow down and hold back if a road user pulls out into your path at a junction. Allow
them to get clear. Do not over-react by driving too close behind to intimidate them
* not throw anything out of a vehicle, for example, cigarette ends, cans, paper or
carrier bags. This can endanger other road users, particularly motorcyclists and cyclists

148 Safe driving and riding needs concentration.

Avoid distractions when driving or riding such as

* loud music (this may mask other sounds)
* trying to read maps
* inserting a cassette or CD or tuning a radio
* arguing with your passengers or other road users
* eating and drinking
* smoking

General rules (159-161)

160 Once moving you should

* keep to the left...
* be aware of other road users... Give them plenty of room...

163 Overtake only when it is safe and legal to do so. You should

* not get too close to the vehicle you intend to overtake
* ... do not cut in

168 Being overtaken. If a driver is trying to overtake you, maintain a steady course and
speed, slowing down if necessary to let the vehicle pass. Never obstruct drivers who wish
to pass. Speeding up or driving unpredictably while someone is overtaking you is
dangerous. Drop back to maintain a two-second gap if someone overtakes and pulls into the
gap in front of you.

Road users requiring extra care (204-225)

204 The most vulnerable road users are pedestrians, cyclists, motorcyclists and horse
riders. It is particularly important to be aware of children, older and disabled people,
and learner and inexperienced drivers and riders.

216 Older drivers. Their reactions may be slower than other drivers. Make allowance for
this.

217 Learners and inexperienced drivers. They may not be so skilful at anticipating and
responding to events. Be particularly patient with learner drivers and young drivers.
Drivers who have recently passed their test may display a ‘new driver’ plate or sticker
(see 'Safety code for new drivers').

/Quote

One stupid ****er got taught a lesson by me. Two if you count the caravan
driver.

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q383.htm Q383: I have been the victim of road rage
what will the police do?


--
Phil Addison

On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW" wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:42:34 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:45:03 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:27:32 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as bad-tempered,
arrogant, insanely aggressive white van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are the
police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought to
teach the other driver a lesson? And have you thought
what might have happened if in her terror she swerved the
other way?

Why have you given the other driver a pair of tits and a
vagina?

You mean you stopped and saw she didn't have them?

The other driver was a he not a she.

It's not possible to even see the driver in an oncoming vehicle at
night unless you stopped. Or did you stop and give an earful then
roar off before they could clock your reg?

The main beams worked. And "she" had a beard.

Not two balls and a penis then; how convenient.

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams. I loved the
adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ****** think again about their
actions against me.

See The Highway Code http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were exchanged I
would have kicked his head in if he had threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline rush is comonly known
as 'losing it'. One day that part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret that.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your electrical threads, until you
started ranting about the way you treat your team.

--
Phil Addison

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 21:10:18 +0100, Lee wrote:

On 02/10/2012 20:31, ARW wrote:

What I do not need is some knobhead travelling the other way putting his
main beams on to tell me there is a headlight out on my van. I know that
there is a headlight out, what does the daft **** want me to do?


This is why I never try to tell anyone they have a brake/head/tail light
out or if they have a seriously flat tyre - I figure they already know
and what's the point?

A few years back I did flash a Capri which had a small fire starting
underneath and got the finger. 500m up the road it was a ball of flame -
they got out ok but looked somewhat shaken

I hope you stopped and said "I told you so".

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

"You, you, and you ... panic. The rest of you, come with me." - U.S. Marine Corp Gunnery Sgt.

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 20:31:02 +0100, ARW wrote:

Driving down the A365 tonight and a headlight lamp blew. 2nd time in one
year, opposite headlight to the last one but it happens.

The bulb blew between Marr and Hickleton.

What I do not need is some knobhead travelling the other way putting his
main beams on to tell me there is a headlight out on my van. I know that
there is a headlight out, what does the daft **** want me to do?

Me? I stuck my main beams on and moved across to the other side of the road
and scared the **** ****less. I swerved back in at the last second but I
loved it when he mounted the grass verge to avoid me.

Feel free to call me insane.

I'd call that quite sensible.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

"You, you, and you ... panic. The rest of you, come with me." - U.S. Marine Corp Gunnery Sgt.

On Wed, 03 Oct 2012 08:46:17 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 21:39:29 GMT, DerbyBorn wrote:

I don't by flashing lights whilst on the move but if we've both parked
up reasonably close to each other I'll wander over and tell them.

...and hear tales like, "Its been like that for ages" or " I know, but
it is going for an MOT in a couple of months time, it will get fixed
then."

'tis true but I've done my bit. If they get stopped by the boys in blue
and knicked that's not my problem. Remember that the duff light is just
an excuse for them to stop you, once they have they'll check everything
else, like tyres, tax, insurance, your dox etc...

A missing exhaust, a non-functional handbrake, a bald tyre, a soft tyre, and a split tyre got me off a speeding offence of 95 in a 70. It's good to have a ****ed car.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

An old black-and-white photograph of a man milking a cow was sent to a photo-finishing company.
The man was sitting behind the cow, and all that was visible of him were his legs and feet.
A note accompanying the order read: "This is the only picture I have of my great grandfather. Please move the cow so I can see what he looked like."

On Thu, 04 Oct 2012 08:48:47 +0100, wrote:

On Oct 3, 8:58 am, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 21:39:29 GMT, DerbyBorn wrote:
I don't by flashing lights whilst on the move but if we've both parked
up reasonably close to each other I'll wander over and tell them.

...and hear tales like, "Its been like that for ages" or " I know, but
it is going for an MOT in a couple of months time, it will get fixed
then."

'tis true but I've done my bit. If they get stopped by the boys in blue
and knicked that's not my problem. Remember that the duff light is just
an excuse for them to stop you, once they have they'll check everything
else, like tyres, tax, insurance, your dox etc...

--
Cheers
Dave.

Tax, Insurance, MOT are all on databases the police have access these
days and most traffic police have ANPR equipment. So you'll get
stopped if you don't have any of the above anyway. If you're driving
around on bald tyres you deserve the fine.

Or you just aren't OCD enough to check them regularly. I change mine at the MOT, or if I think they're skidding more than they should, or when a pig gives me a pink slip.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

I once got the stuffing beat out of me fighting for a girl's honour.
She wanted to keep it.

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 23:34:52 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Lee wrote:
On 02/10/2012 20:31, ARW wrote:

What I do not need is some knobhead travelling the other way putting his
main beams on to tell me there is a headlight out on my van. I know that
there is a headlight out, what does the daft **** want me to do?


This is why I never try to tell anyone they have a brake/head/tail light
out or if they have a seriously flat tyre - I figure they already know
and what's the point?

A few years back I did flash a Capri which had a small fire starting
underneath and got the finger. 500m up the road it was a ball of flame -
they got out ok but looked somewhat shaken


I had an XJS that dropped a reae lamp. Being an XJS there was a warning
lamp to tell me.

At the next set of lights a fukimng cyclist pulled up alongside me and
tapped on te window
"Did you KNOWy our TAIL LIGHT was out". I gestured at the dash "Yes. The
car already told me that" and shut the window in his face.

Pompous ass.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

Does a pedometer detect child molesters?

On Wed, 03 Oct 2012 13:44:12 +0100, Scion wrote:

Grimly Curmudgeon spake thus:

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 23:34:52 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

At the next set of lights a fukimng cyclist pulled up alongside me and
tapped on te window "Did you KNOWy our TAIL LIGHT was out". I gestured
at the dash "Yes. The car already told me that" and shut the window in
his face.

Bless, they really get upset over the slightest things, don't they?

I pulled up alongside a white Sierra once (it was a while ago) casually
leaned over and asked the driver if he knew his car was on fire.
Turned out he didn't and we both had a look underneath, where a fair old
bit of oil smoke and the odd flame was licking. Don't know exactly what
it was, but luckily he had an extinguisher - a decent sized one too.

I was walking past a pub when I noticed a parked car smoking quite
impressively. Went in and said "anyone got a white Ford Orion parked
outside?". A guy said, "yeah, me" and put his pint down. I said "you'll
want to bring that..."

Did it extinguish it?

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

Lysdexia: a peech imspediment we live to learn with...

On Tue, 02 Oct 2012 22:15:59 +0100, ARW wrote:

alan wrote:
On 02/10/2012 20:31, ARW wrote:

what does the daft **** want me to do?

slow down, there is a mobile speed trap ahead?

No. That's when you flash the lights. It's a well know warning against a
speed trap and you give a thumbs down sign when you pass the other driver

This one was a **** and he just put the main beams on.

I get the L shape.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

Top Tip. If someone shoves your feet in a fire, quickly put your head in a bucket of iced water. On average, you will be pretty comfortable.

On Wed, 03 Oct 2012 07:46:48 +0100, Phamer wrote:

On 02/10/2012 22:15, ARW wrote:
alan wrote:
On 02/10/2012 20:31, ARW wrote:

what does the daft **** want me to do?

slow down, there is a mobile speed trap ahead?

No. That's when you flash the lights. It's a well know warning against a
speed trap and you give a thumbs down sign when you pass the other driver

This one was a **** and he just put the main beams on.


So what does that make you? Your words:

"Me? I stuck my main beams on and moved across to the other side of the
road and scared the **** ****less. I swerved back in at the last second
but I loved it when he mounted the grass verge to avoid me."

Who's the bigger "C*NT", him or you? At least he wasn't guilty of
dangerous driving!

Not dangerous driving, but sweet revenge.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

Top Tip. If someone shoves your feet in a fire, quickly put your head in a bucket of iced water. On average, you will be pretty comfortable.

On Wed, 03 Oct 2012 09:43:27 +0100, Lobster wrote:

On 03/10/2012 09:19, Another John wrote:

Looking at many drivers on the road, it's a bloody miracle that they
know which side the petrol cap is on

Notwithstanding the fact that I am an utterly *brilliant* driver, I have
no clue which side the petrol cap is, courtesy of the fact that it's
different on the the two vehicles I drive regularly. However, I have no
incentive to try to remember, as whichever side of the petrol pump I
park, the hose is always more than amply long enough to reach the tank
even if it's on the far side of the car, with no risk of damage etc to
pump/hose/car.

I always find it bizarre when there are two or three vehicles with
right-side petrol caps queuing on the left side of the pump, but nobody
using the right side... I pull up, fill my tank using the hose over to
the far side of the car, and have left the forecourt before these people
have even reached the pump...

Bizarre, but satisfying. I always make sure I give them a rude gesture as I leave.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

It's an age-old truism. Men will quickly fall asleep after having sex.
And I know why, too.
It's because they've been up half the night begging for it.

On 04/10/2012 20:02, ARW wrote:
Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:42:34 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:45:03 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:27:32 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as bad-tempered,
arrogant, insanely aggressive white van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are the
police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought to
teach the other driver a lesson? And have you thought
what might have happened if in her terror she swerved the
other way?

Why have you given the other driver a pair of tits and a
vagina?

You mean you stopped and saw she didn't have them?

The other driver was a he not a she.

It's not possible to even see the driver in an oncoming vehicle at
night unless you stopped. Or did you stop and give an earful then
roar off before they could clock your reg?

The main beams worked. And "she" had a beard.

Not two balls and a penis then; how convenient.

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams. I loved the
adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ****** think again about their
actions against me.

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were exchanged I
would have kicked his head in if he had threatened me.


Oh let it go. The other driver had probably had a bad day too. It is
what it is, it's only a battle in your head.

On Fri, 05 Oct 2012 09:45:54 +0100, Tim Streater wrote:

In article op.wlof0swhytk5n5@i7-940, "Lieutenant Scott"
wrote:

I hope you stopped and said "I told you so".

Are you the unshiftable loo stain that's being discussed in another
thread.

Go and join the children in the other thread then.

--
http://petersparrots.com
http://petersphotos.com

I do not think it is necessary to believe that the same god who has given us our senses, reason, and intelligence wished us to abandon their use, giving us by some other means the information that we could gain through them -- Galileo Galilei

"Lieutenant Scott" wrote in message
newsp.wlphe2eyytk5n5@i7-940...
On Fri, 05 Oct 2012 09:45:54 +0100, Tim Streater
wrote:

In article op.wlof0swhytk5n5@i7-940, "Lieutenant Scott"
wrote:

I hope you stopped and said "I told you so".

Are you the unshiftable loo stain that's being discussed in another
thread.

Go and join the children in the other thread then.

You could always **** off back to demon.local with the other *******.
HTH.

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 19:42:34 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:45:03 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 18:27:32 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Wed, 3 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Another John wrote:
In article ,
"ARW" wrote:


[1] Though nowhere near as dangerous as
bad-tempered, arrogant, insanely aggressive white
van drivers.

Or indeed members of the public who think they are
the police.

Isn't that what you thought you were when you sought
to teach the other driver a lesson? And have you
thought what might have happened if in her terror she
swerved the other way?

Why have you given the other driver a pair of tits and a
vagina?

You mean you stopped and saw she didn't have them?

The other driver was a he not a she.

It's not possible to even see the driver in an oncoming
vehicle at night unless you stopped. Or did you stop and give
an earful then roar off before they could clock your reg?

The main beams worked. And "she" had a beard.

Not two balls and a penis then; how convenient.

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams. I
loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ****** think
again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were
exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline
rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that part of your brain
could make you could kill someone without the real you knowing what
you are doing. You might regret that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll often take
risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in danger other than me.


Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way you treat
your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after very well.
It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go and work for lesser
firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I care. If I spot a glint of hope in
one then I do try to help them.

--
Adam

On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW" wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams. I
loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ****** think
again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were
exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline
rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that part of your brain
could make you could kill someone without the real you knowing what
you are doing. You might regret that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll often take
risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports and the like also cause
it as well as any of the original natural threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the
body's animal reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes your body
and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our normal behaviour. When in charge of a
lethal weapon one should take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way you treat
your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after very well.
It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go and work for lesser
firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I care. If I spot a glint of hope in
one then I do try to help them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs so many crap ones in the
first place. Where I worked apprentice were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of.
I don't know how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were paid a wage,
albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to take these?

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if you think of them with
contempt. Find out how to recruit decent prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at
the local college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the college some
handout that explains what they will be expected to do and what they will learn - try to
encourage good ones to apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a competitive challenge. Look at
the Bloodhound SSC site and see what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those posts - and I still
think you'd do well to look into anger management. Its part of being assertive, that's the
skill being able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying off the
handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you for being an expert they expect
to learn from.

--
Phil Addison

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams.
I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ******
think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were
exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had threatened
me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline
rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that part of your
brain could make you could kill someone without the real you
knowing what you are doing. You might regret that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll often
take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in danger
other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports and
the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural threats
it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal reaction to
suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes your body and
mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our normal behaviour. When
in charge of a lethal weapon one should take care of actions that
invoke adrenaline rush because you are effectively deiberately
letting go of control, and may then do things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way you
treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I care.
If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs so
many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice were
highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know how it
works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were paid a wage,
albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17 year
old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local college
so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the college some
handout that explains what they will be expected to do and what they
will learn - try to encourage good ones to apply. When they do, give
them meaningful jobs give them positive feedback on how they are
doing. Put them in teams so they a competitive challenge. Look at the
Bloodhound SSC site and see what they are doing to encourage young
engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO). It takes more
than an interview to find them.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being able
to get people to do what you need them to do without flying off the
handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you for being
an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would lose his
temper with them.

--
Adam

"ARW" wrote in message
...
Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams.
I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ******
think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were
exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had threatened
me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline
rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that part of your
brain could make you could kill someone without the real you
knowing what you are doing. You might regret that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll often
take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in danger
other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports and
the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural threats
it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal reaction to
suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes your body and
mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our normal behaviour. When
in charge of a lethal weapon one should take care of actions that
invoke adrenaline rush because you are effectively deiberately
letting go of control, and may then do things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way you
treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I care.
If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs so
many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice were
highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know how it
works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were paid a wage,
albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17 year
old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local college
so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the college some
handout that explains what they will be expected to do and what they
will learn - try to encourage good ones to apply. When they do, give
them meaningful jobs give them positive feedback on how they are
doing. Put them in teams so they a competitive challenge. Look at the
Bloodhound SSC site and see what they are doing to encourage young
engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO). It takes
more than an interview to find them.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being able
to get people to do what you need them to do without flying off the
handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you for being
an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would lose
his temper with them.

--
Adam


The missus tries to employ kids, but after starting out ok, they invariably
start turning up late / half ****ed from the night before, or are so tired
from whatever they do at night, that they can hardly stand up or keep their
eyes open. Then comes the lame excuses texted in about 10 minutes before
they are due to start work. These include "doctor's appointment", "hospital
appointment", "the dog's run off and we're out looking for it", "my lift has
not turned up", "my dad's had an accident in the car so can't bring me",
"I'm stuck in Manchester because the trains are on strike" and many many
more. Some are so ludicrous that they really must think that they are
cleverer than we are to even try to use them. They honestly think that you
came down in the last shower of rain. Then they offer to "come in to make
the time up" at some other time that they don't normally work anyway because
you don't need them at that time. Then they get all ****y when you dock
their money ...

As for mobile phones, they are confiscated when they come in, and only
allowed back to them at break times and when they go home. You can see the
sweat break out on their troubled little brows and their hands start shaking
as it disappears into the holding box ...

So I'm with Adam on this one. Good ones are very hard to find no matter what
interview techniques you use, and even if you *do* get one, it's hard to
stop them deteriorating into a waste of space within six months ...

Arfa

On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW" wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main beams.
I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a ******
think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words were
exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had threatened
me.

You really should take an anger management course. That adrenaline
rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that part of your
brain could make you could kill someone without the real you
knowing what you are doing. You might regret that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll often
take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in danger
other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports and
the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural threats
it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal reaction to
suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes your body and
mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our normal behaviour. When
in charge of a lethal weapon one should take care of actions that
invoke adrenaline rush because you are effectively deiberately
letting go of control, and may then do things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way you
treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I care.
If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs so
many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice were
highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know how it
works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were paid a wage,
albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17 year
old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into the future, and most
folks considered themselves well off if they had a landline (or telephone as it was
called). Apprenticeships appear to have deteriorated, why is that?.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local college
so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the college some
handout that explains what they will be expected to do and what they
will learn - try to encourage good ones to apply. When they do, give
them meaningful jobs give them positive feedback on how they are
doing. Put them in teams so they a competitive challenge. Look at the
Bloodhound SSC site and see what they are doing to encourage young
engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being able
to get people to do what you need them to do without flying off the
handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you for being
an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would lose his
temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing temper. The hint is in the
word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that outline the principles fairly well

http://www.mindtools.com/pages/artic...ertiveness.htm
http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/
http://www.impactfactory.com/gate/as...102-18850.html
http://www.queendom.com/tests/access...idRegTest=2289

--
Phil Addison

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called). Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

Because they spend all day on Facebook? Dom Jolly Trigger Happy TV was on TV
in 1999. I bought my first brick back in around 1994.



Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Why would I want to? They are interested in what they do.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing
temper. The hint is in the word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that
outline the principles fairly well

http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/

is the most interesting. I will give the link to one of our failing
appentices.


--
Adam

Arfa Daily wrote:
"ARW" wrote in message
...
Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.
Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO). It
takes more than an interview to find them.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

--
Adam


The missus tries to employ kids, but after starting out ok, they
invariably start turning up late / half ****ed from the night before,
or are so tired from whatever they do at night, that they can hardly
stand up or keep their eyes open. Then comes the lame excuses texted
in about 10 minutes before they are due to start work. These include
"doctor's appointment", "hospital appointment", "the dog's run off
and we're out looking for it", "my lift has not turned up", "my dad's
had an accident in the car so can't bring me", "I'm stuck in
Manchester because the trains are on strike" and many many more. Some
are so ludicrous that they really must think that they are cleverer
than we are to even try to use them. They honestly think that you
came down in the last shower of rain. Then they offer to "come in to
make the time up" at some other time that they don't normally work
anyway because you don't need them at that time. Then they get all
****y when you dock their money ...
As for mobile phones, they are confiscated when they come in, and only
allowed back to them at break times and when they go home. You can
see the sweat break out on their troubled little brows and their
hands start shaking as it disappears into the holding box ...

So I'm with Adam on this one. Good ones are very hard to find no
matter what interview techniques you use, and even if you *do* get
one, it's hard to stop them deteriorating into a waste of space
within six months ...

The best excuse ever was because his Uncle was about to be read the last
rites and that he was close to his Uncle and so needed to attend.

I knew that his Uncle had actually died 2 days before the phonecall.

--
Adam

On Sat, 06 Oct 2012 16:54:26 +0100, Tim Streater wrote:

In article ,
Phil Addison wrote:

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing temper. The
hint is in the word 'lose'.

If the hint is in the word 'lose', why do you say 'loosing'? Eh, eh?

Are you trying to be clever? It didn't work - Adam said "Even Jesus would lose his ..."

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would lose his
temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing temper. The hint is in the
word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that outline the principles fairly well

--
Phil Addison

On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 19:57:27 +0100, "ARW" wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called). Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

Because they spend all day on Facebook? Dom Jolly Trigger Happy TV was on TV
in 1999. I bought my first brick back in around 1994.

I was thinking more 60's than 90's.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Why would I want to? They are interested in what they do.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing
temper. The hint is in the word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that
outline the principles fairly well

http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/

is the most interesting. I will give the link to one of our failing
appentices.

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is enough. It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good teacher. I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

--
Phil Addison

"Phil Addison" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 19:57:27 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called). Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

Because they spend all day on Facebook? Dom Jolly Trigger Happy TV was on
TV
in 1999. I bought my first brick back in around 1994.

I was thinking more 60's than 90's.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Why would I want to? They are interested in what they do.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing
temper. The hint is in the word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that
outline the principles fairly well

http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/

is the most interesting. I will give the link to one of our failing
appentices.

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is enough.
It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good teacher.
I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert
conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

--
Phil Addison

Hmmmm, this is very interesting, I'll give it a whirl when I've finished
punishing the wife.
Passive, Aggresive, Passive-Aggressive, Assertive, blimey, I doubt that my
grandfather would understand (or care about) this ****.
Still, if you've got ****-all better to do...........

"brass monkey" wrote in message
eb.com...

"Phil Addison" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 19:57:27 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called). Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

Because they spend all day on Facebook? Dom Jolly Trigger Happy TV was
on TV
in 1999. I bought my first brick back in around 1994.

I was thinking more 60's than 90's.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Why would I want to? They are interested in what they do.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing
temper. The hint is in the word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that
outline the principles fairly well

http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/

is the most interesting. I will give the link to one of our failing
appentices.

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is
enough. It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good
teacher. I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert
conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

--
Phil Addison

Hmmmm, this is very interesting, I'll give it a whirl when I've finished
punishing the wife.
Passive, Aggresive, Passive-Aggressive, Assertive, blimey, I doubt that my
grandfather would understand (or care about) this ****.
Still, if you've got ****-all better to do...........

Perhaps I should qualify this, if you don't have the nouse to be able to
interact with people, give it up as a bad job as you're obviously without
clue. Much like the current guvmint (who live on a different planet).

"Tim Streater" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Phil Addison wrote:

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing temper.
The hint is in the word 'lose'.

If the hint is in the word 'lose', why do you say 'loosing'? Eh, eh?

--
Tim


You beat me to it, Tim ... :-)

Arfa

"brass monkey" wrote in message
eb.com...

"Phil Addison" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 19:57:27 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Fri, 5 Oct 2012 18:42:13 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Thu, 4 Oct 2012 20:02:23 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

I saw the whites of his eyes.

I don't care what you believe you can see with your main
beams. I loved the adrenaline rush and the chance to make a
****** think again about their actions against me.

See The Highway Code
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/index.htm
section 147

I won my battle against that bearded ******.

No. Your demons won the battle. You lost.

I can assure you that if I had stopped the van and words
were exchanged I would have kicked his head in if he had
threatened me.

You really should take an anger management course. That
adrenaline rush is comonly known as 'losing it'. One day that
part of your brain could make you could kill someone without
the real you knowing what you are doing. You might regret
that.

Are you sure the adrenaline rush is only from losing it? I'll
often take risks and enjoy it where no-one is threatened or in
danger other than me.

Nope, never said that was the only way, obviously extreme sports
and the like also cause it as well as any of the original natural
threats it evolved to help us survive. Its the body's animal
reaction to suddenly being in a dangerous situation, and primes
your body and mind for 'flight or fight'. It over-rides our
normal behaviour. When in charge of a lethal weapon one should
take care of actions that invoke adrenaline rush because you are
effectively deiberately letting go of control, and may then do
things you regret.

Such a shame, I had great respect for you from reading your
electrical threads, until you started ranting about the way
you treat your team.

They are only apprentices. The good apprentices are looked after
very well. It's my job to get rid of the crap ones - they can go
and work for lesser firms or **** of to McDonalds for all I
care. If I spot a glint of hope in one then I do try to help
them.

Glad to hear it, but its a strange recruiting policy that employs
so many crap ones in the first place. Where I worked apprentice
were highly valued and rarely had to be got rid of. I don't know
how it works these days, but when I was an apprentice we were
paid a wage, albeit not a lot. Does the gov't pay your firm to
take these?

All of them were highly valued? When did you last work with a 16/17
year old? I'll bet it was before mobile phones were commonplace.

Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called). Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

Because they spend all day on Facebook? Dom Jolly Trigger Happy TV was
on TV
in 1999. I bought my first brick back in around 1994.

I was thinking more 60's than 90's.

Why 'only apprentices'? There's little point in recruiting them if
you think of them with contempt. Find out how to recruit decent
prospects in the first place. Maybe give talks at the local
college so you get to know some of them in advance. Give the
college some handout that explains what they will be expected to
do and what they will learn - try to encourage good ones to
apply. When they do, give them meaningful jobs give them positive
feedback on how they are doing. Put them in teams so they a
competitive challenge. Look at the Bloodhound SSC site and see
what they are doing to encourage young engineers.

ATM we have two of the best apprentices in the country (IMHO).
It takes more than an interview to find them.

That's great; for chrisake don't scare 'em away.

Why would I want to? They are interested in what they do.

Having said that, your anger and rage still shows through in those
posts - and I still think you'd do well to look into anger
management. Its part of being assertive, that's the skill being
able to get people to do what you need them to do without flying
off the handle and alienating them. Instead they will respect you
for being an expert they expect to learn from.

Trust me. Spend a week working with some of them. Even Jesus would
lose his temper with them.

There is a huge difference between being assertive and loosing
temper. The hint is in the word 'lose'. Here's a few sites that
outline the principles fairly well

http://www.ndsu.edu/counseling/self_...veness_skills/

is the most interesting. I will give the link to one of our failing
appentices.

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is
enough. It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good
teacher. I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert
conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

--
Phil Addison

Hmmmm, this is very interesting, I'll give it a whirl when I've finished
punishing the wife.
Passive, Aggresive, Passive-Aggressive, Assertive, blimey, I doubt that my
grandfather would understand (or care about) this ****.
Still, if you've got ****-all better to do...........



Well, it *is* American ... :-)

Arfa

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 01:05:46 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is enough. It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good teacher. I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

"Grimly Curmudgeon" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 01:05:46 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is enough.
It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good teacher.
I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert
conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."


And I'm not sure that it doesn't result in even more resentment further down
the line, when the person on the receiving end realises that they've been
manipulated, and possibly made to look a fool in front of colleagues, peers
or friends ...

Arfa

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 12:14:05 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 01:05:46 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is enough. It works much
better with several of you in an interactive tutorial with a good teacher. I've been
through these and its most satisfying afterwards to be able to divert conversations away
from confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without even raising your
voice. Works with family and friends too, not just in work.

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

Ohhh to C-word, you're such an assertive man, give me a kiss ducky.

--
Phil Addison

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called).


Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

I have had another think about that one today.

The first thing you have to often do with the apprentices is teach them
basic skills that should have been taught at school or at home. Basic stuff
like time keeping, manners and how to behave and conduct yourself when with
the public would be a good start. It would be nice if schools (or Dad if
there is one around) actually still taught kids how to use tools or at least
teach them the names of the common ones.

I don't quite remember when schools decided that pupils should no longer be
competitive and aim to be better than other pupils instead of treating them
all equally (ie dragging everyone down to the lowest level), but it was
happening when I left school in 1987.

And I have no idea when mothers decided to breast feed their kids until they
left school (and carry on doing so through their apprentiship in some
cases).

The best apprentice I have ever had never applied to be an apprentice
electrician. I found him labouring on a building site and I took him on.

It's not appreniceship schemes that have deteriorated, it's the youngsters
that leave school and apply for the apprenticeships that have deteriorated.

The shortest interview I ever gave to a wannbe apprentice went along the
lines of

"Why are your hands in your pockets?"
"Dunno"
"You best **** Off then, goodbye"

--
Adam

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 16:02:10 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

Ohhh to C-word, you're such an assertive man, give me a kiss ducky.

******.

On Sun, 7 Oct 2012 15:49:15 +0100, "Arfa Daily"
wrote:

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."


And I'm not sure that it doesn't result in even more resentment further down
the line, when the person on the receiving end realises that they've been
manipulated, and possibly made to look a fool in front of colleagues, peers
or friends ...

Exactly. The ******* who think they're being clever by being
manipulative only end up with everyone being dead wary of them and not
trusting them an inch. Arseholes don't realise it, of course, because
they think they're so smart.

Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 01:05:46 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is
enough. It works much better with several of you in an interactive
tutorial with a good teacher. I've been through these and its most
satisfying afterwards to be able to divert conversations away from
confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your voice. Works with family and friends too, not
just in work.

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

Sometimes apprentices just need a good bollocking. It's often good for them.
The smart ones will learn from it and use it when they are on their own at
work and need to stand up for themselves.

Once the bollocking is over then they are working with me and the bollocking
is history (unless they did not learn from it)

--
Adam

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 19:19:02 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 16:02:10 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

Ohhh to C-word, you're such an assertive man, give me a kiss ducky.

******.

Oooh and such a wonderful conversationalist, will you marry me?.

--
Phil Addison

On Sun, 7 Oct 2012 20:01:22 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Sun, 07 Oct 2012 01:05:46 +0100, Phil Addison
wrote:

Seriously, I recommend trying it, but I doubt reading the links is
enough. It works much better with several of you in an interactive
tutorial with a good teacher. I've been through these and its most
satisfying afterwards to be able to divert conversations away from
confrontation to get people to accept what you want them to without
even raising your voice. Works with family and friends too, not
just in work.

We used to call that "Being a manipulative ****."

Sometimes apprentices just need a good bollocking. It's often good for them.
The smart ones will learn from it and use it when they are on their own at
work and need to stand up for themselves.

Once the bollocking is over then they are working with me and the bollocking
is history (unless they did not learn from it)

Nowt wrong with a good bollocking so long as it is delivered in a fair
controlled manner, explaining why they are getting it (they are likely
from what you say, not to realise), and what you expect in future (I'm
assuming this is 'just' a bollicking not a sacking). Not like the one
you described about the interviewee with hands in pockets.

--
Phil Addison

On Sun, 7 Oct 2012 17:48:14 +0100, "ARW"
wrote:

Phil Addison wrote:
On Sat, 6 Oct 2012 08:28:22 +0100, "ARW"
Commonplace??? You know that brick Dom Joly uses; That was way into
the future, and most folks considered themselves well off if they had
a landline (or telephone as it was called).


Apprenticeships appear to
have deteriorated, why is that?.

I have had another think about that one today.

The first thing you have to often do with the apprentices is teach them
basic skills that should have been taught at school or at home. Basic stuff
like time keeping, manners and how to behave and conduct yourself when with
the public would be a good start. It would be nice if schools (or Dad if
there is one around) actually still taught kids how to use tools or at least
teach them the names of the common ones.

I don't quite remember when schools decided that pupils should no longer be
competitive and aim to be better than other pupils instead of treating them
all equally (ie dragging everyone down to the lowest level), but it was
happening when I left school in 1987.

And I have no idea when mothers decided to breast feed their kids until they
left school (and carry on doing so through their apprentiship in some
cases).

The best apprentice I have ever had never applied to be an apprentice
electrician. I found him labouring on a building site and I took him on.

It's not appreniceship schemes that have deteriorated, it's the youngsters
that leave school and apply for the apprenticeships that have deteriorated.

I tend to agree. I think it started in the 70's with namby-pamby
schooling. Trouble is, now its getting locked in to the next
generation as they bring up their of kids the same way. Did you see
the way some of them behaved on the Jamie Oliver School program -
incredible.

The shortest interview I ever gave to a wannbe apprentice went along the
lines of

"Why are your hands in your pockets?"
"Dunno"
"You best **** Off then, goodbye"

See previous.

--
Phil Addison