I live in a tenement building in Scotland and there are 16 flats which all
share a communal garden.

Over the years a few people have placed garden sheds in the area but all in
a line up along a piece of ground which can only be described as waste land.
J have no problem with that even though permission was not obtained.

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

It`s gone too far this time. Soon there will be no garden area left.

Surely no-one can claim a piece of communal garden for their own personal
use?

Can I complain about this and which council department would I contact ? Or
does it have nothing to do with the council and would a private civil action
need to be taken? Or a small claims action?

Any advice appreciated.

Harry Syme wrote:

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

Any advice appreciated.

What Would Adam Do[TM]?

Accidental spillage of red hot cinders from bins?

On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 06:53:05 +0100, Harry Syme wrote:

Surely no-one can claim a piece of communal garden for their own
personal use?

Can I complain about this and which council department would I contact ?

Is the block owned by the council? If not they won't be interested
(unless Scottish Law about sheds is different to English).

If the block is privately owned and the flats owned or rented by the
residents you'll have to find the deeds and see what they say about
use of the communal areas. You may find there is nothing specific
about sheds so it would then be up to any residents association to
decide if sheds are allowed and what can or can't be done etc.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
o.uk...
Harry Syme wrote:

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

Any advice appreciated.

What Would Adam Do[TM]?

Accidental spillage of red hot cinders from bins?

lol ,,,,rather go the legal route!

On 08/07/2010 06:53, Harry Syme wrote:
I live in a tenement building in Scotland and there are 16 flats which all
share a communal garden.


What is the tenure of the individual and the whole - social (HA/LA),
private rent or owned lease? it matters.

On 08/07/2010 06:53, Harry Syme wrote:
I live in a tenement building in Scotland and there are 16 flats which all
share a communal garden.

Over the years a few people have placed garden sheds in the area but all in
a line up along a piece of ground which can only be described as waste land.
J have no problem with that even though permission was not obtained.

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

It`s gone too far this time. Soon there will be no garden area left.

Surely no-one can claim a piece of communal garden for their own personal
use?

Can I complain about this and which council department would I contact ? Or
does it have nothing to do with the council and would a private civil action
need to be taken? Or a small claims action?

Any advice appreciated.



Ask the question on Newsgroup uk.legal.moderated
You might get a more considered view there.
Cheers
Don

In article , Harry
Syme writes
I live in a tenement building in Scotland and there are 16 flats which all
share a communal garden.

Over the years a few people have placed garden sheds in the area but all in
a line up along a piece of ground which can only be described as waste land.
J have no problem with that even though permission was not obtained.

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

You need to have a look at the titles (deeds in old money) for your
property to see what it says there about the common areas. You can get a
copy he www.ros.gov.uk very cheaply and if you live in Glasgow or
Edinburgh you can go in person to their offices and walk out with a copy
10mins later and only 2 odd quid lighter. You'll need ID if not paying
by credit card.

My own titles describe the back court to be 'solely for the purposes of
drying washing' and I would expect yours to have some similar
restriction to avoid someone taking it over. With a restriction like
that the builder should not have gone ahead without the permission of
the flat owners.

It is likely that the ownership of the area is common with the other
flat owners so it's not really a council matter. Is the building
factored? If so then a complaint through them may be the way to proceed
although a savvy individual may realise that the factors are actually
powerless to act without the consent of the majority of owners. That
consent may be difficult to achieve if the other shed owners see their
own buildings being threatened.

Given that someone has gone to the bother of building a concrete base
and putting up the shed, I doubt they'll give it up without a fight so I
would expect you would have to make some sort of legal challenge to have
any chance of success (even then not guaranteed). Avoid this route if
possible and try to get support from other flat owners and the factors.

For more help, perhaps post to uk.legal.moderated clearly marking the
subject Scotland so that is clear from the start. There appear to be
only a couple of posters there with any real knowledge of Scots law so
you just have to hope that one of them catches your post.

Good luck.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
o.uk...
Harry Syme wrote:

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

Any advice appreciated.

What Would Adam Do[TM]?


A larger shed appearing overnight around the existing shed would be the
correct thing to do.

Cheers

Adam

ARWadsworth
wibbled on Thursday 08 July 2010 16:55


"Andy Burns" wrote in message
o.uk...
Harry Syme wrote:

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

Any advice appreciated.

What Would Adam Do[TM]?


A larger shed appearing overnight around the existing shed would be the
correct thing to do.

Cheers

Adam

And a scaffolding "cage" around the bloke's car. With the nuts araldited of
course!

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

"fred" wrote in message ...
In article , Harry Syme
writes
I live in a tenement building in Scotland and there are 16 flats which all
share a communal garden.

Over the years a few people have placed garden sheds in the area but all
in
a line up along a piece of ground which can only be described as waste
land.
J have no problem with that even though permission was not obtained.

Now some idiot has built a shed with a concrete base right slap in the
middle of the area used for drying and for keeping the wheely bins.

You need to have a look at the titles (deeds in old money) for your
property to see what it says there about the common areas. You can get a
copy he www.ros.gov.uk very cheaply and if you live in Glasgow or
Edinburgh you can go in person to their offices and walk out with a copy
10mins later and only 2 odd quid lighter. You'll need ID if not paying by
credit card.

My own titles describe the back court to be 'solely for the purposes of
drying washing' and I would expect yours to have some similar restriction
to avoid someone taking it over. With a restriction like that the builder
should not have gone ahead without the permission of the flat owners.

It is likely that the ownership of the area is common with the other flat
owners so it's not really a council matter. Is the building factored? If
so then a complaint through them may be the way to proceed although a
savvy individual may realise that the factors are actually powerless to
act without the consent of the majority of owners. That consent may be
difficult to achieve if the other shed owners see their own buildings
being threatened.

Given that someone has gone to the bother of building a concrete base and
putting up the shed, I doubt they'll give it up without a fight so I would
expect you would have to make some sort of legal challenge to have any
chance of success (even then not guaranteed). Avoid this route if possible
and try to get support from other flat owners and the factors.

For more help, perhaps post to uk.legal.moderated clearly marking the
subject Scotland so that is clear from the start. There appear to be only
a couple of posters there with any real knowledge of Scots law so you just
have to hope that one of them catches your post.

Good luck.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete) foundations for
a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for planning permission.
I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it is likely
you would have received a letter to see if you objected to it.

SS
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 12:24


As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete) foundations
for a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for planning permission.
I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it is
likely you would have received a letter to see if you objected to it.

That's not true.


--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

Tim Watts wrote:
SS
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 12:24


As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete)
foundations for a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for
planning permission. I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it is
likely you would have received a letter to see if you objected to it.

That's not true.

Agreed for E&W. Scotland?

Clot
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 19:55

Tim Watts wrote:
SS
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 12:24


As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete)
foundations for a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for
planning permission. I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it is
likely you would have received a letter to see if you objected to it.

That's not true.

Agreed for E&W. Scotland?

Fair enough - forgot we were talking about Scotland (despite it being in the
quoted text! - I'll get me coat...)

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

Tim Watts wrote:
Clot
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 19:55

Tim Watts wrote:
SS
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 12:24


As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete)
foundations for a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for
planning permission. I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it
is likely you would have received a letter to see if you objected
to it.

That's not true.

Agreed for E&W. Scotland?

Fair enough - forgot we were talking about Scotland (despite it being
in the quoted text! - I'll get me coat...)

No problem. I have one beside me - just in case!

I guees that you are feeling quite warm wearing it at present!

"Clot" wrote in message
news:aso_n.108280$sD7.25566@hurricane...
Tim Watts wrote:
SS
wibbled on Sunday 11 July 2010 12:24


As far as I am aware if you do `proper` brick (or concrete)
foundations for a wooden shed or garage then you must apply for
planning permission. I am not sure if there is a size implecation.
This being the case if they had applied for planning permission it is
likely you would have received a letter to see if you objected to it.

That's not true.

Agreed for E&W. Scotland?


which part isnt true ?

i do know that according to edinburgh council you do indeed need planning
permission for foundations?

does anyone know for certain what the legal situation is....dont they need
permission from all the people who share/own the communal garden?

does anyone know for certain what the legal situation is....dont they need
permission from all the people who share/own the communal garden?

Forget the planning permission bits, any land that is owned (or has
license
to be occupied) requires the permission of the land owners (occupiers)
for
something to happen to it, just through natural law. If you are the
sole
owner (occupier), then implicitly automatically give yourself
permission to
do whatever you want with it, but if others are involved, all need to
be involved.
Imagine if you were half of a couple who owned a house and the other
half
decided - by themselves - to sell it. They can't, unless in some cases
they
own more than 50% of it.

In your case, there are more than one owner (occupier), so all persons
permission is needed. If shed-man hasn't got the permission of all the
people involved he is breaking some sort of law, maybe joint ownership
law of some sort. What would happen in the above case if hubby sold
a shared house without wifie's consent?

"jgharston" wrote in message
...
does anyone know for certain what the legal situation is....dont they
need
permission from all the people who share/own the communal garden?

Forget the planning permission bits, any land that is owned (or has
license
to be occupied) requires the permission of the land owners (occupiers)
for
something to happen to it, just through natural law. If you are the
sole
owner (occupier), then implicitly automatically give yourself
permission to
do whatever you want with it, but if others are involved, all need to
be involved.
Imagine if you were half of a couple who owned a house and the other
half
decided - by themselves - to sell it. They can't, unless in some cases
they
own more than 50% of it.

In your case, there are more than one owner (occupier), so all persons
permission is needed. If shed-man hasn't got the permission of all the
people involved he is breaking some sort of law, maybe joint ownership
law of some sort. What would happen in the above case if hubby sold
a shared house without wifie's consent?

so does anyone know the answer to my original question..

Can I complain about this and which council department would I contact ?
Or
does it have nothing to do with the council and would a private civil action
need to be taken? Or a small claims action?

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Harry Syme"
saying something like:

so does anyone know the answer to my original question..

Can I complain about this and which council department would I contact ?
Or

I doubt if the council will be interested, as a garden shed wouldn't
fall within their remit.

does it have nothing to do with the council and would a private civil action
need to be taken? Or a small claims action?

I think you'd be in the realm of getting the Factor off his arse and
then going to see a solicitor, if necessary. You have to knock on every
door in the close to get all the other neighbours' take on it. Some of
them might not care or shy away from potential legal costs.