Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

In message , Stephen
wrote
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.


You can un-screened and fully screened TV aerial face plates
http://www.triax.co.uk/Products/Wall...eened%20Outlet
s.aspx

You can get 100% copper screened aerial down-lead cables and cable with
barely any screening at all.
http://www.amac.f2s.com/cable2/
http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/articles/coax-cable-quality-hmdi-m.html

Terrestrial digital TV can suffer from local electrical interference so
the 'safe' distance between a mains socket and an aerial wall plate
socket may be dependant on the quality of cable and face plate being
used.
--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

In article ,
Stephen wrote:
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

--
*Don't squat with your spurs on *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Stephen wrote:
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...

That's likely radiated rather than carried by the cabling. Don't your
neighbours complain?

--
*Plagiarism saves time *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Stephen wrote:

Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference?

Considering the jumble of cables, both mains and signal, all in close
proximity behind the average TV set I doubt if the distance between the
sockets is significant at all.

--
Mike Clarke

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stephen wrote:
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

--
*Don't squat with your spurs on *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

It depends what the interference is being caused by. The coax can be a
number of wavelengths long and resonate on certain frequencies.
At VHF & UHF the coax can act as a number of wavelengths and with
increased gain, on MW and SW bands the coax can be one wavelength.
Interference is usually picked up on the braid/screen. The same goes
for mains wiring and phone wiring. If he meant mains spikes being picked
up by being inductively coupled, then that is possible if the coax runs
along
side mains wiring for any length.
A mains and RF socket can be right next to each other, but I wouldn't run
cables alongside each other.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...

That's likely radiated rather than carried by the cabling. Don't your
neighbours complain?

--
*Plagiarism saves time *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

You completely misunderstand how and what interference is. Some basic
theory on RF and mains via Google should get you started. Then you can
progress to understanding how coax works and why it can pick up other
signals! Then you can look at mains filtering, RF filtering, inductive
coupling
and whatever else you want to read up on.
I take it you would have difficulty understanding how a new all singing
digital system would be affected by "interference" when all the adverts seem
to state anything "digital" is "interference free".
The man's neighbours are on a different phase so that is why they would
not have the thermostat problem and it would be too weak a few houses
away. You might like to look at mains distribution systems too.
I think you're in for a busy weekend, at least you have admitted you have
little knowledge.

On 22 Feb, 15:40, Stephen wrote:
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

As I understand it the OSG is about safety, not interference. If you
follow the rules in there you are not guaranteed an interference-free
life, but you are less likely to get 240v down your lughole when aunty
Maureen gives you a tinkle.

"Stephen" wrote in message
...
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.


To reduce interference you should either used a screen aerial socket or make
you own using F Plugs and an F barrel - as described in some of the
technical documents on the CAI web site.

--
Michael Chare

In article ,
James R wrote:
That's likely radiated rather than carried by the cabling. Don't your
neighbours complain?

You completely misunderstand how and what interference is. Some basic
theory on RF and mains via Google should get you started.

Oh dear. Another pompous ****.

--
*Pride is what we have. Vanity is what others have.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

James R wrote:

Some basic
theory on RF and mains via Google should get you started.

How do I get "the mains" via Google? How much do they charge per kWh? Is
it free like their other services.

Oh and is this - . a piece of your brain? Or is it all of it?

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...

I'd say I've got the normal number of thermostats here and perhaps more
than the normal amount of AV equipment - and have never heard or seen a
thermostat operate on any of it.

If you do something is very wrong. Are you in a very poor signal area for
TV and radio?

--
*Hard work pays off in the future. Laziness pays off now *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Huge wrote:
On 2009-02-23, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to
cause problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well
screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make
rude wounds on every radio and TV...

I'd say I've got the normal number of thermostats here and perhaps
more than the normal amount of AV equipment - and have never heard or
seen a thermostat operate on any of it.

If you do something is very wrong. Are you in a very poor signal area
for TV and radio?

More likely the arc suppression capacitor across the thermostat contacts
has failed.

Or non existent. But on all of them?

But most recent ones should conform to pretty strict regs as regards
interference.

--
*How's my driving? Call 999*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
James R wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stephen wrote:
Is there a recommended distance to keep between a tv aerial socket and
a mains socket? I'm thinking if they are too close would the aerial
pick up interference? I had a quick flick through the OSG but all I
coul;d find was something about keeping telephone lines 50mm away from
mains cables, which IMO seemed a very small separation but entirely
irrelevant to my original question! TIA, Stephen.

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

Thought I'd just read this again...

It depends what the interference is being caused by. The coax can be a
number of wavelengths long and resonate on certain frequencies.

So what signals are being radiated by mains that this might apply to?

At VHF & UHF the coax can act as a number of wavelengths and with
increased gain, on MW and SW bands the coax can be one wavelength.

Co-ax in use for MW and SW? My AM aerial uses a balanced feeder. For a
very good reason.

Interference is usually picked up on the braid/screen. The same goes
for mains wiring and phone wiring.

Mains and telephone wiring has a braid/screen?

If he meant mains spikes being picked up by being inductively coupled,
then that is possible if the coax runs along side mains wiring for any
length.

That at least is reasonable.

A mains and RF socket can be right next to each other, but I
wouldn't run cables alongside each other.

It's against regs anyway.

--
*Does fuzzy logic tickle? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sun, 22 Feb 2009 17:12:08 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

Thanks. When I drafted my post I did add "or is the 50Hz frequency of
the mains too low to affect UHF" (or words to that effect) but I had
last minute nerves that there might be higher frequency harmonics or
something, so I deleted it. The other posts contain valid points about
screening, F connectors, etc. Like someone said, mains and uhf are
next to each other in the tv so this has reassured me. Thanks again.

In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
James R wrote:

Some basic
theory on RF and mains via Google should get you started.

How do I get "the mains" via Google? How much do they charge per kWh? Is
it free like their other services.

Oh and is this - . a piece of your brain? Or is it all of it?

He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright says.
Know which one I'd believe.

--
*Do infants enjoy infancy as much as adults enjoy adultery?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright says.
Know which one I'd believe.

Me2 and sneering at your knowledge of RF was umm foolish.

In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright says.
Know which one I'd believe.

Me2 and sneering at your knowledge of RF was umm foolish.

Not really - my expertise if you can call it that is at rather lower
frequencies. ;-)

--
*Proofread carefully to see if you any words out or mispeld something *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright says.
Know which one I'd believe.

Me2 and sneering at your knowledge of RF was umm foolish.

Not really - my expertise if you can call it that is at rather lower
frequencies. ;-)

It's all relative Dave, you know much more than he does.

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright
says.
Know which one I'd believe.

Me2 and sneering at your knowledge of RF was umm foolish.

Not really - my expertise if you can call it that is at rather lower
frequencies. ;-)

It's all relative Dave, you know much more than he does.

The chocolate biscuit in front of me knows more than he does, but has the
distinct advantage of being edible and tasty.

James R wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...
That's likely radiated rather than carried by the cabling. Don't your
neighbours complain?

--
*Plagiarism saves time *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

You completely misunderstand how and what interference is. Some basic
theory on RF and mains via Google should get you started. Then you can
progress to understanding how coax works and why it can pick up other
signals! Then you can look at mains filtering, RF filtering, inductive
coupling
and whatever else you want to read up on.
I take it you would have difficulty understanding how a new all singing
digital system would be affected by "interference" when all the adverts seem
to state anything "digital" is "interference free".
The man's neighbours are on a different phase

I don't have any neighbours. Not for 200 meters anway..

And I have my very own personal substation, straight off 11KV.

Luvverly!


so that is why they would
not have the thermostat problem and it would be too weak a few houses
away. You might like to look at mains distribution systems too.
I think you're in for a busy weekend, at least you have admitted you have
little knowledge.

:-)

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...

I'd say I've got the normal number of thermostats here and perhaps more
than the normal amount of AV equipment - and have never heard or seen a
thermostat operate on any of it.

If you do something is very wrong. Are you in a very poor signal area for
TV and radio?

Not particularly, no. They are just crap thermostats running inductive
loads - fan blown water convector heaters.

One day I'll get some better ones...

Huge wrote:
On 2009-02-23, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

It certainly does...my thermostats cause horrendous arcing and make rude
wounds on every radio and TV...
I'd say I've got the normal number of thermostats here and perhaps more
than the normal amount of AV equipment - and have never heard or seen a
thermostat operate on any of it.

If you do something is very wrong. Are you in a very poor signal area for
TV and radio?

More likely the arc suppression capacitor across the thermostat contacts has
failed.


I don't think they have any...Crappy Newlec units

Stephen wrote:
On Sun, 22 Feb 2009 17:12:08 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

I'd be most surprised if mains carried frequencies high enough to cause
problems - and in any case decent cable should be pretty well screened.

Thanks. When I drafted my post I did add "or is the 50Hz frequency of
the mains too low to affect UHF" (or words to that effect) but I had
last minute nerves that there might be higher frequency harmonics or
something, so I deleted it. The other posts contain valid points about
screening, F connectors, etc. Like someone said, mains and uhf are
next to each other in the tv so this has reassured me. Thanks again.
If you can shove 75Mbs of network round a mains circuit, its clear that
whilst not designed for it, mains can carry RF pretty well, and up to at
least MW frequencies.

I should add that somewhat mischeviously, my arcing thermostats are
probably NOT so much generating UHF, as putting massive spikes on teh
power supply of the house.

HOWEVER the microwave in the kitchen destroys a radio on the same ring,
but on on others..

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I should add that somewhat mischeviously, my arcing thermostats are
probably NOT so much generating UHF, as putting massive spikes on teh
power supply of the house.

Ever heard of a spark transmitter? ;-)

I'd guess it's a combination of both - especially if you're on a
relatively high impedance power supply.

--
*Why is it that doctors call what they do "practice"?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Steve Firth wrote:
He's the RF 'expert' who tends to rubbish everything Bill Wright says.
Know which one I'd believe.

Me2 and sneering at your knowledge of RF was umm foolish.

Not really - my expertise if you can call it that is at rather lower
frequencies. ;-)

But if you apply it often enough, it's a high frequency usage


--
geoff

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I should add that somewhat mischeviously, my arcing thermostats are
probably NOT so much generating UHF, as putting massive spikes on teh
power supply of the house.

Ever heard of a spark transmitter? ;-)

I'd guess it's a combination of both - especially if you're on a
relatively high impedance power supply.

Its very low actually..


But it gets into everything. Even makes the PABX ring the phones...

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
I should add that somewhat mischeviously, my arcing thermostats are
probably NOT so much generating UHF, as putting massive spikes on teh
power supply of the house.

Ever heard of a spark transmitter? ;-)

I'd guess it's a combination of both - especially if you're on a
relatively high impedance power supply.

Its very low actually..


But it gets into everything. Even makes the PABX ring the phones...

Think I'd have fixed it by now, then.

--
*Few women admit their age; fewer men act it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.