As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box, or
subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by Comet
who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.


http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

In message , Agamemnon
writes



Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with
built-in Freeview.

Maybe he would need a SCART lead to feed the TV video output to a VCR or
DVD recorder?

--
Ian

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

You're welcome to this one from last autumn, probably with heavy editing.

I was in Surbiton over the weekend at the in-laws. At a birthday get
together I got chatting to their elderly neighbour who several months ago
had a shiny new Triax Unix 52A on a 10' mast fitted to his chimney. The mast
has a Fringe box which I has assumed was a splitter or filter as signal
strength is high there, being barely 10 miles from Crystal Palace.

My in-laws are still using an Aerialite 10A on their chimney with the
original 40 year old co-ax. Sometimes there's an odd blip but 99% of the
time DTTV reception is rock solid.

Ghosting is an issue here on analogue, and the neighbour had an Aerialite
Supreme group A directed at CP and a large Wolsey B (the one with the bow
tie shaped elements) directed at Guildford. When those were removed, the
neighbour told the rigger that the chimney they were on had offered much
better reception in the past, and the chimney above the lounge had provided
poor reception. Mr Rigger (who was recommended by the local Panasonic
dealer) assured neighbour that he can get him perfect digital pictures for
his new Freeview Panasonic TV with the aerial on the lounge chimney. This
chimney
offers much easier access (although he had to remove the scrap from the
other one)
and a much shorter cable run to the TV.

Two hours later Mr Rigger is struggling with ghosty analogue, and severe
pixilation on DTTV. He blames it on traffic, as from this chimney the aerial
looks along the A3 (from almost the same height) straight at CP. Mr Rigger
still claims this is the best chimney to use, although as far as neighbour
could see no readings were taken anywhere else on the house. Mr Rigger then
fits a Fringe masthead amplifier and shows neighbour some solid DTTV. He
claims £550 (yes, five hundred and fifty pounds) from neighbour and scoots.

Neighbour then spends some time setting up his new TV and discovers dreadful
analogue with severe patterning and unwatchable DTTV on four muxes.
Amazingly, AFAIK
Mr Rigger has not been asked to return and neighbour is back to watching the
free channels
provided by his old cable (Telewest, now Virgin) socket.

On Feb 13, 10:05*am, "Doctor D" wrote:

I was in Surbiton over the weekend at the in-laws. At a birthday get
together I got chatting to their elderly neighbour who several months ago
had a shiny new Triax Unix 52A on a 10' mast fitted to his chimney. The mast
has a Fringe box which I has assumed was a splitter or filter as signal
strength is high there, being barely 10 miles from Crystal Palace.

My in-laws are still using an Aerialite 10A on their chimney with the
original 40 year old co-ax. Sometimes there's an odd blip but 99% of the
time DTTV reception is rock solid.

Ghosting is an issue here on analogue, and the neighbour had an Aerialite
Supreme group A directed at CP and a large Wolsey B (the one with the bow
tie shaped elements) directed at Guildford. When those were removed, the
neighbour told the rigger that the chimney they were on had offered much
better reception in the past, and the chimney above the lounge had provided
poor reception. Mr Rigger (who was recommended by the local Panasonic
dealer) assured neighbour that he can get him perfect digital pictures for
his new Freeview Panasonic TV with the aerial on the lounge chimney. This
chimney
offers much easier access (although he had to remove the scrap from the
other one)
and a much shorter cable run to the TV.

Two hours later Mr Rigger is struggling with ghosty analogue, and severe
pixilation on DTTV. He blames it on traffic, as from this chimney the aerial
looks along the A3 (from almost the same height) straight at CP. Mr Rigger
still claims this is the best chimney to use, although as far as neighbour
could see no readings were taken anywhere else on the house. Mr Rigger then
fits a Fringe masthead amplifier and shows neighbour some solid DTTV. He
claims £550 (yes, five hundred and fifty pounds) from neighbour and scoots.

Neighbour then spends some time setting up his new TV and discovers dreadful
analogue with severe patterning and unwatchable DTTV on four muxes.
Amazingly, AFAIK
Mr Rigger has not been asked to return and neighbour is back to watching the
free channels
provided by his old cable (Telewest, now Virgin) socket.

Was the new aerial purely for DTV? Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing
the job done how he wanted it (2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer. I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really
been "ripped off" as a result of the analogue switch off.

MBQ

"Man at B&Q" wrote in message
...

Was the new aerial purely for DTV? Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing
the job done how he wanted it (2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer. I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really
been "ripped off" as a result of the analogue switch off.

£550 is a rip off!

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q"
saying something like:

Neighbour then spends some time setting up his new TV and discovers dreadful
analogue with severe patterning and unwatchable DTTV on four muxes.
Amazingly, AFAIK
Mr Rigger has not been asked to return and neighbour is back to watching the
free channels
provided by his old cable (Telewest, now Virgin) socket.

Was the new aerial purely for DTV? Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing
the job done how he wanted it (2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer. I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really
been "ripped off" as a result of the analogue switch off.

Oh yeah, right. The rigger was utterly innocent in all of that, and not
a lazy incompetent ******* at all.

"Ian Jackson" wrote in message
...
In message , Agamemnon
writes



Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.

Maybe he would need a SCART lead to feed the TV video output to a VCR or
DVD recorder?

He didn't buy a VCR or DVD recorder nor did he need a new SCART lead since
he already had one for his old VCR. In fact he's get half a dozen SCART
leads including one from the old STB that connected it to the CRT TV the
Freeview LCD TV was replacing. The salesman in Comet conned him into
thinking it was an HDMI lead after my dad insisted he didn't need a SCART
lead. Even if it had been an HDMI lead, my dad does not have anything with
an HDMI output to connect to the TV in the first place.



--
Ian

On Feb 13, 11:48*am, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Man at B&Q"
saying something like:

Neighbour then spends some time setting up his new TV and discovers dreadful
analogue with severe patterning and unwatchable DTTV on four muxes.
Amazingly, AFAIK
Mr Rigger has not been asked to return and neighbour is back to watching the
free channels
provided by his old cable (Telewest, now Virgin) socket.

Was the new aerial purely for DTV? Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing
the job done how he wanted it (2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer. I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really
been "ripped off" as a result of the analogue switch off.

Oh yeah, right. The rigger was utterly innocent in all of that,

That might be your opinion.

and not a lazy

Insufficient evidence.

incompetent ******* at all.

That may be a reasonable conclusion.

Doesn't absolve the cutomer of all blame, however. In this particular
case the customer seems to have been reasonably clued up and should
have at least got a second opinion.

MBQ

On Feb 13, 11:44*am, "dennis@home"
wrote:
"Man at B&Q" wrote in ...

Was the new aerial purely for DTV? Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing
the job done how he wanted it (2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer. I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really
been "ripped off" as a result of the analogue switch off.

£550 is a rip off!

But I assume that would apply regardless. There's no evidence that the
price was artificially inflated in this case.

MBQ

Bill Wright wrote:
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box, or
subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill


Bill, here's a thought: what about recycling STBs and what have you? I
seem to amass boxen that I end-up stowing somewhere, where all they do
is sleep cosily in their packing. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this
position, having surplus kit that could benefit the elderly/less
fortunate during the DSO, although I suppose what you have in mind isn't
a charity. However, I suspect that there's some HMG edict that stops
people passing on electrical kit on the grounds of safety issues.


Clem

Clem Dye wrote:

Bill Wright wrote:
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned
into buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a
set top box, or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to
receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them
here or contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain
completely anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill
Bill, here's a thought: what about recycling STBs and what have you?
I seem to amass boxen that I end-up stowing somewhere, where all they
do is sleep cosily in their packing. I'm sure I'm not the only one in
this position, having surplus kit that could benefit the elderly/less
fortunate during the DSO, although I suppose what you have in mind
isn't a charity. However, I suspect that there's some HMG edict that
stops people passing on electrical kit on the grounds of safety
issues.


Clem

A lot of the old digital terrestrial boxes have/ will have problems
because of split NITs and 8k transmissions.

--
Ashley
For Windsor Weather see www.snglinks.com/wx

"Clem Dye" wrote in message
om...
Bill Wright wrote:

Bill, here's a thought: what about recycling STBs and what have you? I
seem to amass boxen that I end-up stowing somewhere, where all they do is
sleep cosily in their packing. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this
position, having surplus kit that could benefit the elderly/less fortunate
during the DSO, although I suppose what you have in mind isn't a charity.
However, I suspect that there's some HMG edict that stops people passing
on electrical kit on the grounds of safety issues.


Off the top of my head I'd say the best thing to do was test any unwanted
kit, make sure the correct fuse is fitted, check the mains lead is intact,
then take it to the Church Fayre or similar. Help the Aged etc might have
systems for dealing with s/h electronics, or they might not.

Alternatively, place the item directly. Find a deserving case. I don't think
the cost of the gear is usually an issue, it's getting it installed without
getting ripped off.

Bill

Was the new aerial purely for DTV?
No.

Was the neighbour "vulnerable"?
In what way? He was vulnerable to being ripped off to the tune of £550 by a
"a lazy incompetent *******" to quote my learned friend with his excellent
description.

Sounds to me like he knew his stuff and (1) didn't insist in haveing the job
done how he wanted it
He's an elderly man who relied upon someone to do a job they held themself
out to be an expert at, and came recommended by the Panny dealer. He raised
concerns and was reassured that everything would be okay. He knows nothing
about aerial rigging, having never (as far as I know) met him what makes
you think "He knows his stuff?"

(2) hasn't followed up the problems with
the installer.
For which he's a a twit.

I would say he's as much to blame and hasn't really been "ripped off" as a
result of the analogue switch off.
I would disagree with you and say he's only to blame for not pursuing the
crook. Would you only expect your car to be serviced properly if you knew a
fair bit about cars yourself and told the mechanic what to do?

On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 17:28:45 GMT, Clem Dye wrote:

Bill, here's a thought: what about recycling STBs and what have you? I
seem to amass boxen that I end-up stowing somewhere, where all they do
is sleep cosily in their packing. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this
position, having surplus kit that could benefit the elderly/less
fortunate during the DSO

Problem is that many 'older' STBs use far more electricity than modern
equivalents. A recycled STB may be free but it could end up using more
electricity in the first year or two than the cost of a more efficient
unit.

--

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

How about an aerial firm (very well known) trying to sell people aerials
they do not need? damaging existing installations in order to secure and
justify work not required? A company not able to name those they accuse
of poor work in fear of being sued?
You should look closer instead of spamming newsgroups with your
advertising rubbish for you and your friends.

"Agamemnon" wrote in message
...

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic
channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.



Bill


That was nothing to do with it. That was some old fool who AGREED to BUY
a SCART lead when he did not require one to connect to an external device.
I remember his son moaning on and on about how stupid his dad was, but in
this case the shop was NOT at fault. The man requested a lead, then agreed
to
buy it. He wasn't conned in any way.

"Ian Jackson" wrote in message
...
In message , Agamemnon
writes



Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.

Maybe he would need a SCART lead to feed the TV video output to a VCR or
DVD recorder?

--
Ian

It was some stupid story about a man going in to a shop one day to buy a TV.
He bought the TV and *ASKED* for a lead to connect to his VCR, he was
sold a SCART lead as *THAT IS WHAT HE WANTED*. His VCR did not
have an HDMI connection!
His son was furious with him because he had bought another SCART lead
when he already had one. His dad seemed to think he would need a new one
so agreed to buy it for a price his son said was unreasonable. It is a
shame his
son took little interest in his shop visit or he might have gone with him to
the
shop!
There was no con, no deception, no forcing people to buy. The man wanted
the SCART lead so he bought it. If his son has such a big problem with what
his dad buys then that is an argument between the two of them, nothing to do
with a newsgroup or a shop. Maybe that is why his dad went to the shop
without him!
As far as I know this was never followed up with the shop, his son just kept
crying on newsgroups to anyone who would listen. Unfortunately no one did.

"James R" wrote in message
...

"Ian Jackson" wrote in message
...
In message , Agamemnon
writes



Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.

Maybe he would need a SCART lead to feed the TV video output to a VCR or
DVD recorder?

--
Ian

It was some stupid story about a man going in to a shop one day to buy a
TV.
He bought the TV and *ASKED* for a lead to connect to his VCR, he was

He asked for nothing of the kind. He's already got half a dozen SCART leads.

sold a SCART lead as *THAT IS WHAT HE WANTED*. His VCR did not
have an HDMI connection!
His son was furious with him because he had bought another SCART lead

You are a LIAR!

The con man in the shop tried to force my father to buy a SCART lead by
falsely telling him the Freeview TV needed on. My dad told him no. Then the
con man made him think the SCART lead was an HDMI lead. Neither did the TV
require and HDMI lead buy my father has nothing with an HDMI output to
connect to the TV. It's a rip-off scam practiced by Comet since they more a
greater commission and profit on selling SCART leads worth £2 for £20 than
they do selling television. Before SCART leads it was extended guarantees
which cost more than the item that you actually bought would have been worth
after the manufactures guarantee expired, and even still they are doing that
one.

"James R" wrote in message
...

"Agamemnon" wrote in message
...

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top
box, or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic
channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being ripped of by
Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need for a LCD TV with built-in
Freeview.



Bill


That was nothing to do with it. That was some old fool who AGREED to BUY
a SCART lead when he did not require one to connect to an external device.
I remember his son moaning on and on about how stupid his dad was, but in
this case the shop was NOT at fault. The man requested a lead, then
agreed to
buy it. He wasn't conned in any way.

He requested nothing of the kind. He was conned into buying a SCART lead he
didn't need by the salesman, who when my dad told him he didn't need a SCART
lead conned him into thinking he was being given a discount on an HDMI lead,
which he didn't need either since he has nothing with an HDMI output.

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Here's another one.

My dad went and bought a universal remote control to replace the broken
remote on my sisters Virgin/NTL cable box thinking because it said cable on
the packaging it would work with the box. The remote doesn't even have an
EPG/Guide button on it and has no codes whatsoever for either Virgin, NTL or
Samsung who make the Virgin/NTL box. Another ****ing digital rip-off. These
remotes should not be allowed to be sold or advertised in the UK as
replacements for cable TV in the UK unless they can full control all
Virgin/NTL boxes.


Bill

Agamemnon wrote:


Here's another one.

My dad went and bought a universal remote control to replace the broken
remote on my sisters Virgin/NTL cable box thinking because it said cable
on the packaging it would work with the box. The remote doesn't even
have an EPG/Guide button on it and has no codes whatsoever for either
Virgin, NTL or Samsung who make the Virgin/NTL box. Another ****ing
digital rip-off. These remotes should not be allowed to be sold or
advertised in the UK as replacements for cable TV in the UK unless they
can full control all Virgin/NTL boxes.

See:

http://www.redremote.co.uk/

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

In article , Agamemnon
wrote:
My dad went and bought a universal remote control to replace the broken
remote on my sisters Virgin/NTL cable box

Why? What's wrong with buying the right thing for the job?

Rod.
--
Virtual Access V6.3 free usenet/email software from
http://sourceforge.net/projects/virtual-access/

On 13 Feb, 01:16, "Bill Wright" wrote:
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off.

Parents became bored with their analogue TV about 3 years ago and
decided to replace it after a minor fault. Shop sold them a digital,
on the reasonable grounds that it would have a longer useful life.
OK, so £500 for the world's smallest flatscreen TV doesn't look such a
good deal today, but it wasn't out of line at the time.

They then discover that the reason the old TV had "failed" was
actually because the aerial had blown down (alu mast corroded) So they
call out an aerial installer. He tells them not that the mast has
failed and the antenna is OK, but that they need a whole new aerial
and downlead to be "digital compatible" and their new analogue /
digital set won't work otherwise. So he installs one. Presumably
because he's shifting old stock while he still can, this new aerial is
an _analogue_ antenna.

It works fine - a short line of sight to a major transmitter means
that any piece of wet string gets a good signal. But doubling the size
of the job needlessly and then not even supplying the same part that
you claimed is shoddy.

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 22:03:20 +0000, James R wrote:

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top
box, or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic
channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

How about an aerial firm (very well known) trying to sell people aerials
they do not need? damaging existing installations in order to secure
and justify work not required? A company not able to name those they
accuse of poor work in fear of being sued?
You should look closer instead of spamming newsgroups with your
advertising rubbish for you and your friends.


Umm.. I'm sure all that does go on. However.

The article the link points to has lots of decent information written in
a nice clear way, most of which says 'you probably don't need anything
doing, and if you do here's the simplest and cheapest way to do it'.

Also, it's anonymous. No company names are mentioned or recommended at
all. There isn't even a form for getting a quote for work, only to ask
questions for free.

James R, I think you may be pointing your bile at the wrong place. This
wasn't Spam, it was useful advice. In fact, they appear to be on your
side, but actually doing something about it instead of whining.


Disclaimer: I'm not connected with PARAS and don't have any industry
connections at all. This is the first I've seen of it. I just actually
RTFA'd.

Andy Dingley wrote:

snip
They then discover that the reason the old TV had "failed" was
actually because the aerial had blown down (alu mast corroded) So they
call out an aerial installer. He tells them not that the mast has
failed and the antenna is OK, but that they need a whole new aerial
and downlead to be "digital compatible" and their new analogue /
digital set won't work otherwise. So he installs one. Presumably
because he's shifting old stock while he still can, this new aerial is
an _analogue_ antenna.

What do you mean by, an _analogue_ antenna?
--
There's probably no god, so stop worrying and enjoy your life.

"Agamemnon" wrote in message
. uk...

"James R" wrote in message
...

The correct response to a post by "James R" is "**** off you tedious ****".
OTOH your dad does sound like a bit of a victim...

On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 08:37:59 -0000, "Agamemnon"
wrote:

My dad went and bought a universal remote control to replace the broken
remote on my sisters Virgin/NTL cable box

Cost of phone call to Virgin/NTL to request fix/replacement: £0.

--

On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 12:16:19 +0000, Clive George wrote:

"Agamemnon" wrote in message
. uk...

"James R" wrote in message
...

The correct response to a post by "James R" is "**** off you tedious
****". OTOH your dad does sound like a bit of a victim...

Seconded. Twice.

You go to Comet to buy things when you know *exactly* what you want and
they are cheapest.

If you want advice, go to a shop with staff who know something.

In article , Agamemnon
scribeth thus

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
.. .
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top box,
or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Here's another one.

My dad went and bought a universal remote control to replace the broken
remote on my sisters Virgin/NTL cable box thinking because it said cable on
the packaging it would work with the box. The remote doesn't even have an
EPG/Guide button on it and has no codes whatsoever for either Virgin, NTL or
Samsung who make the Virgin/NTL box. Another ****ing digital rip-off. These
remotes should not be allowed to be sold or advertised in the UK as
replacements for cable TV in the UK unless they can full control all
Virgin/NTL boxes.


Is he or you capable to taking it back to from where he bought it?.

And..

If its a VM cable one why didn't he ask then for another one?...

--
Tony Sayer

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On 13 Feb, 01:16, "Bill Wright" wrote:
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off.

Parents became bored with their analogue TV about 3 years ago and
decided to replace it after a minor fault. Shop sold them a digital,
on the reasonable grounds that it would have a longer useful life.
OK, so £500 for the world's smallest flatscreen TV doesn't look such a
good deal today, but it wasn't out of line at the time.

They then discover that the reason the old TV had "failed" was
actually because the aerial had blown down (alu mast corroded) So they
call out an aerial installer. He tells them not that the mast has
failed and the antenna is OK, but that they need a whole new aerial
and downlead to be "digital compatible" and their new analogue /
digital set won't work otherwise. So he installs one. Presumably
because he's shifting old stock while he still can, this new aerial is
an _analogue_ antenna.

Really? It might have been an inappropriate group or size/weight,
but it wasn't an analogue one.

I suggest you start here before you are conned yourself.
http://www.paras.org.uk/02-myths.shtml



--
Graham.

%Profound_observation%

Agamemnon wrote:
"James R" wrote in message
...

"Agamemnon" wrote in message
...

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances
in which vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result
of the analogue switch-off. These could be cases in which
people have been conned into buying an unneccessary aerial,
buying a new TV rather than a set top box, or subscribing
to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post
them here or contact PARAS on the website. All incidents
will remain completely anonymous.

Ok. Add the incident I reported last year of my dad being
ripped of by Comet who sold him a SCART lead he didn't need
for a LCD TV with built-in Freeview.
Bill


That was nothing to do with it. That was some old fool who
AGREED to BUY a SCART lead when he did not require one to
connect to an external device. I remember his son moaning on
and on about how stupid his dad was, but in this case the
shop was NOT at fault. The man requested a lead, then agreed
to buy it. He wasn't conned in any way.

He requested nothing of the kind. He was conned into buying a
SCART lead he didn't need by the salesman..

Ignore him, he's usenet's version of a village idiot.

On 15 Feb, 11:01, "Adrian" wrote:

What do you mean by, an _analogue_ antenna?

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough, this
isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is "digital", but if
you're being sold something you don't need, and a new sort of
something at that, then you do at least expect to have one of that
particular new sort supplied, as promised.

Andy Dingley wrote:
On 15 Feb, 11:01, "Adrian" wrote:

What do you mean by, an _analogue_ antenna?

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough, this
isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is "digital", but if
you're being sold something you don't need, and a new sort of
something at that, then you do at least expect to have one of that
particular new sort supplied, as promised.

A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a wideband
when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like you need to learn
more too.
--
There's probably no god, so stop worrying and enjoy your life.

PCPaul wrote:
On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 22:03:20 +0000, James R wrote:

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
As part of the PARAS campaign we need to collect instances in which
vulnerable people have been ripped off as a result of the analogue
switch-off. These could be cases in which people have been conned into
buying an unneccessary aerial, buying a new TV rather than a set top
box, or subscribing to a pay-TV service in order to receive the basic
channels.

If you have any examples of this sort of thing please post them here or
contact PARAS on the website. All incidents will remain completely
anonymous.

http://www.paras.org.uk/01-intro.shtml

Bill

How about an aerial firm (very well known) trying to sell people aerials
they do not need? damaging existing installations in order to secure
and justify work not required? A company not able to name those they
accuse of poor work in fear of being sued?
You should look closer instead of spamming newsgroups with your
advertising rubbish for you and your friends.


Umm.. I'm sure all that does go on. However.


Disclaimer: I'm not connected with PARAS and don't have any industry
connections at all. This is the first I've seen of it. I just actually
RTFA'd.

I would second that. If James would take the time to actually read the
site, he would learn that what he just posted makes him look like a
complete muppet!


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"Adrian" wrote in message
om...
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 15 Feb, 11:01, "Adrian" wrote:

What do you mean by, an _analogue_ antenna?

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough, this
isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is "digital", but if
you're being sold something you don't need, and a new sort of
something at that, then you do at least expect to have one of that
particular new sort supplied, as promised.

A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a
wideband when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like you
need to learn more too.

And what if there are new digital multiplexes placed on the channels outside
the band the aerial was designed for after the spectrum is sold off? He'll
have to have yet another new aerial installed. Rip-off.

On 15 Feb, 21:15, "Adrian" wrote:

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough, this
isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is "digital", but if
you're being sold something you don't need, and a new sort of
something at that, then you do at least expect to have one of that
particular new sort supplied, as promised.

A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a wideband
when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like you need to learn
more too.

My knowledge of TV aerials is almost zero - I've never owned a TV,
I've never had need to own an aerial.

However in this case my parents were ripped off twice, if not three
times: They were sold an entire aerial and downlead replacement when
it was merely a failed mast. They were promised something particular,
then not delivered it (but charged for it). Now they obviously didn't
need a different type (it works without) but they were either advised
one in good faith (although not delivered) or they were up-sold one
needlessly (a 3rd rip-off).

Andy Dingley wrote:
On 15 Feb, 21:15, "Adrian" wrote:

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough,
this isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is
"digital", but if you're being sold something you don't need, and a
new sort of something at that, then you do at least expect to have
one of that particular new sort supplied, as promised.

A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a
wideband when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like
you need to learn more too.

My knowledge of TV aerials is almost zero - I've never owned a TV,
I've never had need to own an aerial.

However in this case my parents were ripped off twice, if not three
times: They were sold an entire aerial and downlead replacement when
it was merely a failed mast. They were promised something particular,
then not delivered it (but charged for it). Now they obviously didn't
need a different type (it works without) but they were either advised
one in good faith (although not delivered) or they were up-sold one
needlessly (a 3rd rip-off).

The chances are, if the mast was in such a bad state then the aerial would
have been too so both would have needed replacing. The old downlead most
likely would not have been digital quality so susceptable to interference,
if the new downlead has copper foil and copper braid then that is what is
required. I doubt that your parents have been ripped off in any way.
--
There's probably no god, so stop worrying and enjoy your life.

Andy Dingley wrote:
On 15 Feb, 21:15, "Adrian" wrote:

Well to split hairs over it, a non-wideband antenna. Fair enough,
this isn't any more "analogue" than a wideband antenna is
"digital", but if you're being sold something you don't need, and a
new sort of something at that, then you do at least expect to have
one of that particular new sort supplied, as promised.

A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a
wideband when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like
you need to learn more too.

My knowledge of TV aerials is almost zero - I've never owned a TV,
I've never had need to own an aerial.

However in this case my parents were ripped off twice, if not three
times: They were sold an entire aerial and downlead replacement when
it was merely a failed mast. They were promised something particular,
then not delivered it (but charged for it). Now they obviously didn't
need a different type (it works without) but they were either advised
one in good faith (although not delivered) or they were up-sold one
needlessly (a 3rd rip-off).

I would have thought that if a mast was old enough to fail, it would be
false economy not to replace cheap components like the aerial at the same
time (which was probably the same age as the mast). If the downlead was
brittle and cracking then I'd want that replaced too.

Tim

"Adrian" wrote in message
om...
A grouped aerial is what is needed nearly every time, being sold a
wideband when it is unnecessary is being ripped off. It looks like
you need to learn more too.

The old downlead most likely would not have been digital quality so
susceptable to interference, if the new downlead has copper foil and
copper braid then that is what is required.

In some cases, the digital muxes are on a variety of UHF channels dotted
around the spectrum, whereas the analogue channels are grouped in one place.
The Oxford transmitter has analogue at the high end, but digital all over
the place so a wideband aerial is needed AFAIK - certainly it's what
Wolfbane's site says. In contrast, Bilsdale has the analogue at the low end
and all the muxes in the same part of the spectrum with the exception of one
which is just slightly out of the range of a normal analogue aerial for that
transmitter, so you replace one grouped aerial with another of a slightly
wider range.

I hadn't realised that digital required higher-standard cable. Is that
mainly because muxes at present are transmitted at such low power relative
to analogue and other forms of interference to the mux?

How is the allocation of UHF channels changing with digital switchover? Will
there be any examples of people buying one new aerial to allow them to
receive muxes at the moment and then needing yet another new aerial when DSO
happens?

Presumably the whole point of DSO is that it frees up part of the UHF
spectrum nationally so other equipment can be made which uses this freed-up
spectrum. In that case people whose analogue and digital currently use that
part of the spectrum will need new aerials tuned to the part of the spectrum
that is ued after DSO.