Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Tim Wescott wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

I've recently had good results with the 65W CFL floodlight fixtures that
'Depot sells. Mounted at 18' on opposing sides of a 50'x50' area in a
metal building (white insulation facing) just four of them provide good
overall illumination for general work. Eight of them would be really
good. They are only $50 and include the lamp.

On 8/4/2014 3:00 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).


I have been using the 2 tube 48" fluorescents, and replaced a couple
with similar sized LED fixtures. The light level seems about the same,
but it has been so hot in the shop, that I have not been out to do any
machine work, so I am waiting to see how it goes with things like
strobing. They are really expensive at about $70 a fixture from the
bigbox hardware store.

BobH

On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:30:34 -0700, BobH wrote:

On 8/4/2014 3:00 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures,
only a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one
with these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with
cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess
with fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste,
omigod), or mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED
bulbs (which is about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but
labor-intensive).


I have been using the 2 tube 48" fluorescents, and replaced a couple
with similar sized LED fixtures. The light level seems about the same,
but it has been so hot in the shop, that I have not been out to do any
machine work, so I am waiting to see how it goes with things like
strobing. They are really expensive at about $70 a fixture from the
bigbox hardware store.

I figure the payback will come if I never have to replace a tube or
ballast ever again.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:33:45 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Tim Wescott wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

I've recently had good results with the 65W CFL floodlight fixtures that
'Depot sells. Mounted at 18' on opposing sides of a 50'x50' area in a
metal building (white insulation facing) just four of them provide good
overall illumination for general work. Eight of them would be really
good. They are only $50 and include the lamp.

I installed (1 acre back yard) one of those for a client and they
loved it. I think I'd prefer to go with LED nowadays, though.
The CRI is only 78 on the Lithonia above, but it's a 4000K light, so
it's more toward the real white color that I love. I still see the
yellow with metal halides. Don't get me started with ****-yellow warm
white bulbs... g

--
Aim for success, not perfection. Never give up your right
to be wrong, because then you will lose the ability to
learn new things and move forward with your life.
-- Dr. David M. Burns

On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:00:14 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).
The leather shop where I spend 2 afternoons a week just completely
re-did the factory and warehouse with LEDs replacing high pressure
vapout and flourescent lights - and last week replaced the high
pressure sodium lighting in the parking area with LEDs as well. They
couldn't be happier. It will take 10 years to pay for the re-lamp with
power savings at todays prices - but take off the cost of replacing
failed ballasts and bulbs, and it looks a LOT more attractive..

300,000 sq ft, high ceiling production area (task lighting) and
warehouse.

I have a LED strip light installed in my office.

Already half of the LEDs burned out on one bulb in less than a month.

Aside from that, they produce good light.

In my home, I finally decide to replace one of the sucky T12's, with a
high output T5. The result is nothing short of amazing. A lot of light
of the most pleasant kind.

i

On 2014-08-04, Tim Wescott wrote:
Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

Tim Wescott wrote:

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

Can you get good (high efficiency) ballasts to fit the existing fixtures?
A modern ballast should run dead cold and last longer than you're apt to
care. If it's high frequency the lamp will last longer than with a 60 Hz
ballast as well.

As other have noted, a very low failure rate with LEDs negates all savings
unless they come with free replacement essentially forever.

bob prohaska

On 8/4/2014 9:28 PM, Ignoramus12659 wrote:
I have a LED strip light installed in my office.

Already half of the LEDs burned out on one bulb in less than a month.

Aside from that, they produce good light.

In my home, I finally decide to replace one of the sucky T12's, with a
high output T5. The result is nothing short of amazing. A lot of light
of the most pleasant kind.

i

On 2014-08-04, Tim Wescott wrote:
Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).

I put in 2 fixtures of 4 T5's in the kitchen. Wow is there light! Wife
loves it. Can see everything. Easier to read books... Wish I had them
split, but they were not so they are all on or off.

Martin

Tim Wescott wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710
WHOA, those are expensive! I have retrofitted 2 2-lamp fluorescent
fixtures in our kitchen, and am pretty happy with them. They've been
running for over 6 months, now. The kitchen lights get a LOT of
use in our house, so those are the ones I've done first.

I have used a string of 20 Cree XPEBWT-01-0000-00CC2 LEDs to
replace two 48" fluorescent tubes. These things are $1.75
each, total $35. I buy them from Digi-Key. For a power supply,
I use a Thomas Research Products LED25W-72-C0350, also from
Digi-Key, part # 1121-1052, about $27. So, total cost is about $62. The
output is supposed to be about 4580 lumens. I used a photometer, and
it SEEMS to be actually brighter than the two 48" fluorescent
tubes, but the light is a bit more concentrated in a single
line, so both my eyes and the photometer could be fooled. Anyway,
it appears to be quite good at illuminating the kitchen. You DO
need a diffuser over the LEDs, they are seriously blindingly bright!

I measured the power draw of the ANCIENT ballast, it was 101 W.
The LED system with the mentioned power supply was 21 W. This
was measured with an actual power meter.

These LEDs are rated at 101 Lm/W, which is quite good. Any higher
efficiency and the cost goes WAY up. The power supply is supposed
to be 86% efficient, I think.

The LEDs are surface mount, so I got some strips of 2" wide PC board
material, and cut narrow slits in the copper at 2" intervals. I soldered
the LEDs across the slits. The copper material acts as a heat sink to
keep the LEDs cool. Then, I suspended the PC board strip in the middle
of the fixture with some loops of insulated wire.

I will probably so more fixtures as I get time.

Jon

wrote:

On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:00:14 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).
The leather shop where I spend 2 afternoons a week just completely
re-did the factory and warehouse with LEDs replacing high pressure
vapout and flourescent lights - and last week replaced the high
pressure sodium lighting in the parking area with LEDs as well. They
couldn't be happier. It will take 10 years to pay for the re-lamp with
power savings at todays prices - but take off the cost of replacing
failed ballasts and bulbs, and it looks a LOT more attractive..

300,000 sq ft, high ceiling production area (task lighting) and
warehouse.

Reduced A/C costs as well in many cases. LEDs aren't heat free, but they
certainly produce less than HID fixtures and many fluro fixtures.

On Tue, 05 Aug 2014 07:20:26 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


wrote:

On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:00:14 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess with
fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste, omigod), or
mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED bulbs (which is
about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but labor-intensive).
The leather shop where I spend 2 afternoons a week just completely
re-did the factory and warehouse with LEDs replacing high pressure
vapout and flourescent lights - and last week replaced the high
pressure sodium lighting in the parking area with LEDs as well. They
couldn't be happier. It will take 10 years to pay for the re-lamp with
power savings at todays prices - but take off the cost of replacing
failed ballasts and bulbs, and it looks a LOT more attractive..

300,000 sq ft, high ceiling production area (task lighting) and
warehouse.

Reduced A/C costs as well in many cases. LEDs aren't heat free, but they
certainly produce less than HID fixtures and many fluro fixtures.
My "morning job" found replacing over 100 MR16s with LEDs has reduced
the power bill and the AC .

On 8/4/2014 5:43 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:30:34 -0700, BobH wrote:

On 8/4/2014 3:00 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
Anyone used 'em?

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures,
only a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one
with these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with
cash:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

The alternatives are to buy a bunch of ballasts and continue to mess
with fluorescents (and tubes that are now considered toxic waste,
omigod), or mount light sockets onto 2x6's and put in screw-in LED
bulbs (which is about $50 per fixture cheaper for the same light, but
labor-intensive).


I have been using the 2 tube 48" fluorescents, and replaced a couple
with similar sized LED fixtures. The light level seems about the same,
but it has been so hot in the shop, that I have not been out to do any
machine work, so I am waiting to see how it goes with things like
strobing. They are really expensive at about $70 a fixture from the
bigbox hardware store.

I figure the payback will come if I never have to replace a tube or
ballast ever again.


Yes, that is my take on it as well. For some reason, fluorescent lamps
in one corner of my shop seem to last about 6 months. I replaced the
fixture and the life did not change. Hoping the LED's do better.

BobH

On 2014-08-06, BobH wrote:
On 8/4/2014 5:43 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:

[ ... ]

I figure the payback will come if I never have to replace a tube or
ballast ever again.


Yes, that is my take on it as well. For some reason, fluorescent lamps
in one corner of my shop seem to last about 6 months. I replaced the
fixture and the life did not change. Hoping the LED's do better.

Hmm ... did you by any chance try measuring the voltage at each
fixture? Compare them to see whether any are lower. Assuming that they
are all on one switch, it might be that the connection from one to the
next is poor (bad or corroded wire nuts or something like that) and it
is thus running from lower voltage, so it is harder to start with the
lower voltage.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Monday, August 4, 2014 3:00:14 PM UTC-7, Tim Wescott wrote:

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:


http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

It isn't clear that the electrical connections (8foot fluorescents use
240VAC) are compatible, from home depot's laughable "specifications".

With modern electronic ballasts, fluorescent is still quite efficient. Heck,
most of white LED light is fluorescence, as well (not the spike in the blue).
At end-of-life (six years?) the LEDs are expected to be dimmer, and
that means zero efficiency improvement instead of '31%'. Relamping
is a nuisance of the fluorescents that you'll have to judge for yourself.

Replace any old non-electronic ballasts, and try a fresh batch of tubes.
There's plenty of time to switch to LED when its price stops dropping
and reliability has some engineering experience to back it up.

On Tue, 5 Aug 2014 23:29:00 -0700 (PDT), whit3rd
wrote:

On Monday, August 4, 2014 3:00:14 PM UTC-7, Tim Wescott wrote:

I've got a high-bay shop with about a dozen 8' florescent fixtures, only
a few of which work. I'm thinking of replacing them one-by-one with
these things, whenever the planets align and I'm extra flush with cash:


http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia-...-LED-High-Bay-
Light-IBH-11L-MV/203812710

It isn't clear that the electrical connections (8foot fluorescents use
240VAC) are compatible, from home depot's laughable "specifications".

277 volts actually. They often WILL run on 240..but not always.


With modern electronic ballasts, fluorescent is still quite efficient. Heck,
most of white LED light is fluorescence, as well (not the spike in the blue).
At end-of-life (six years?) the LEDs are expected to be dimmer, and
that means zero efficiency improvement instead of '31%'. Relamping
is a nuisance of the fluorescents that you'll have to judge for yourself.

Replace any old non-electronic ballasts, and try a fresh batch of tubes.
There's plenty of time to switch to LED when its price stops dropping
and reliability has some engineering experience to back it up.

--
"Living in the United States now is like being a Tampon.
We're in a great place, just at a bad time."

Buy ballasts? I've found fixtures only cost couple dollars than ballasts,
and if you prep them properly are easier and faster to change out. All of
the 8' flourescents in my shop are hanging from 2/0 dog chain with a high
flex appliance cord to a J-box.

So far I haven't burnt a bulb or a ballast (now half of them will fail
tomorrow) and I put my shop lights up about 6 years ago. However I have a
couple spare fixtures with chains and cords already attached, and a case of
spare tubes on a top shelf. If I need to change a fixture I can probably do
it start to finish with a cordless drill (screw driver tip) and my scissor
lift in 5 minutes or less.

On Fri, 8 Aug 2014 22:47:40 +0000 (UTC), (Edward A.
Falk) wrote:

In article ,
BobH wrote:
On 8/4/2014 5:43 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
On Mon, 04 Aug 2014 17:30:34 -0700, BobH wrote:

On 8/4/2014 3:00 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:

I figure the payback will come if I never have to replace a tube or
ballast ever again.


Yes, that is my take on it as well. For some reason, fluorescent lamps
in one corner of my shop seem to last about 6 months.

That's a little disturbing. Could there be something wrong? I've had
the same flourescent lamp over my workbench for over 20 years. I don't
think it's ever failed.

That was my experienced longevity for fluor bulbs until I moved up
here.

I got a box of 20 tubes and 4 new cheapie 4' dual fluor fixtures and
went through the 20 tubes in 3 years. I bought two new fixtures,
electronic design, and the same bulbs have lasted 4 years so far. I'll
scrap the other two bogus fixtures before wasting another bulb in one.
I doublechecked the grounds, tightened the screws on the breaker, etc.
All voltages were good and no wire-to-screw voltage was present, etc.
I even tried different wattage bulbs and one starter to see if it was
some small mismatch, but all died prematurely. I'm guessing that it
was just bad ballasts. The ancient 8' fixture still has the same bulb
that came in it when I got the house 12 years ago, so absolutely
everything points to the cheapie fixtures.

--
Aim for success, not perfection. Never give up your right
to be wrong, because then you will lose the ability to
learn new things and move forward with your life.
-- Dr. David M. Burns