On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

The PTO drive end is 1-5/8" and has plenty of length to use a standard
pillow block; it's only this inboard end that needs help that I've not
got an answer for at the moment...

http://www.bearingson.com/category/p...locks_bearings
/cast_iron_pillow_block_ucp200_series/ucp_200_series
/1_pillow_block_bearings_ucp205-16.asp?page=1&SortType=0

Like similar w/ just the bearing/housing itself being thin enough to
match the bearing area available. If needs be can get it turned wider
but hoping to do this more-or-less on the cheap and I don't have
lathe/access to one other than commercial machine shops in town.

--

dpb wrote:

On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

The PTO drive end is 1-5/8" and has plenty of length to use a standard
pillow block; it's only this inboard end that needs help that I've not
got an answer for at the moment...

http://www.bearingson.com/category/p...locks_bearings
/cast_iron_pillow_block_ucp200_series/ucp_200_series
/1_pillow_block_bearings_ucp205-16.asp?page=1&SortType=0

Like similar w/ just the bearing/housing itself being thin enough to
match the bearing area available. If needs be can get it turned wider
but hoping to do this more-or-less on the cheap and I don't have
lathe/access to one other than commercial machine shops in town.

--

If you have 3/4" width that is good, can you not grind the rest for
clearance with an angle grinder? Center up the bearing on the precise
part?

On 6/4/2013 11:03 AM, Pete C. wrote:
dpb wrote:
On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...
....[elided for brevity]...


Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

....

If you have 3/4" width that is good, can you not grind the rest for
clearance with an angle grinder? Center up the bearing on the precise
part?

Well, mayhaps I can...was thinking only about a continuation of mating
surface but as you note if can get the collar over and the bearing on
the clean surface that should work.

I'll have to clean up the other end enough to fit a bearing--it was just
on the PTO shaft before w/ the large casting holding the vertical load
whereas now I'll have to support that load w/ a bearing. But, it's 12"
long or so whereas the other end has a 2" OD portion of the driving
roller that fits against the shoulder of the bearing surface and that
must be where it goes--the shaft is too short for there to be enough
length for the key otherwise.

--

On Tue, 04 Jun 2013 10:06:48 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

The PTO drive end is 1-5/8" and has plenty of length to use a standard
pillow block; it's only this inboard end that needs help that I've not
got an answer for at the moment...

http://www.bearingson.com/category/p...locks_bearings
/cast_iron_pillow_block_ucp200_series/ucp_200_series
/1_pillow_block_bearings_ucp205-16.asp?page=1&SortType=0

Like similar w/ just the bearing/housing itself being thin enough to
match the bearing area available. If needs be can get it turned wider
but hoping to do this more-or-less on the cheap and I don't have
lathe/access to one other than commercial machine shops in town.

I thought Misumi would have something, but no joy. They have metric
bearings in inch-dimensioned housings, but no inch bearings. If it's
easier to make a sleeve to adapt the 1" shaft to a 30mm bearing than
it is to turn the shaft you may find something useful here.
http://us.misumi-ec.com/vona2/mech/M...0/M0806000000/

--
Ned Simmons

On Tuesday, June 4, 2013 7:07:13 PM UTC-4, Ned Simmons wrote:


http://us.misumi-ec.com/vona2/mech/M...0/M0806000000/

--

Ned Simmons

Great source, thanks for the link.

--
PaulS

On 6/4/2013 6:07 PM, Ned Simmons wrote:
On Tue, 04 Jun 2013 10:06:48 -0500, wrote:
....

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

....


I thought Misumi would have something, but no joy. They have metric
bearings in inch-dimensioned housings, but no inch bearings. If it's
easier to make a sleeve to adapt the 1" shaft to a 30mm bearing than
it is to turn the shaft you may find something useful here.
http://us.misumi-ec.com/vona2/mech/M...0/M0806000000/

Possibly could take a 25 and work the shaft down. You have any
experience w/ these guys on pricing? I'm guessing one of these would be
about as much as the machining charge to widen the present bearing face
just looking at the site. I didn't bother them w/ a likely
wasted-effort quote.

But, is interesting to know they're there if were to have budget for a
project.

--

"dpb" wrote in message ...
On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

The PTO drive end is 1-5/8" and has plenty of length to use a standard
pillow block; it's only this inboard end that needs help that I've not
got an answer for at the moment...

http://www.bearingson.com/category/p...locks_bearings
/cast_iron_pillow_block_ucp200_series/ucp_200_series
/1_pillow_block_bearings_ucp205-16.asp?page=1&SortType=0

Like similar w/ just the bearing/housing itself being thin enough to
match the bearing area available. If needs be can get it turned wider
but hoping to do this more-or-less on the cheap and I don't have
lathe/access to one other than commercial machine shops in town.

Am I missing something? Can't you just use a standard PTO shaft, and bore
and pin one end to match the drive on your mixer. I have three implements
that use a PTO, and I have a PTO drive shaft I leave on each one. They were
not particularly expensive.

On 6/5/2013 10:30 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.

....

Am I missing something? Can't you just use a standard PTO shaft, and
bore and pin one end to match the drive on your mixer. I have three
implements that use a PTO, and I have a PTO drive shaft I leave on each
one. They were not particularly expensive.

Yeah, what you're missing is that this is a solid PTO shaft extension
and the mixer drum is friction-driven by resting a tire on the roller
(outboard) end of this extension, not a direct drive. That eliminates
all gearing that would otherwise be necessary to let the drum tip for
dumping.

Originally this shaft was supported by the large casting w/ the inboard
end (driven end) supported by a matching ring that fit against the rear
housing around the tractor PTO to keep the load off the PTO shaft but
there's not enough clearance for that. So, I need a way to support the
drive shaft w/o the former casting.

Unfortunately, I don't have current pictures; best I've found on web is at

http://www.ntractorclub.com/manuals/misc/
/implementsTransmix%20Utility%20Mixer%20-%20Dealer%20Ad%20Brochure%20-
%20Other%20Mfg%27s.pdf

The picture from the rear on an International 300 is best view of way it
was mounted on the Farmall 2-pt "quick-tach" -- the Farmall (looks like
an old "M", maybe, in the picture?) isn't quite the same altho we had it
on the 560; it was later "styled" w/ the squared-up front grill and the
2-pt. That one appears to be w/ external hydraulic cylinders attached
on to the swinging drawbar support as near as I can tell.

--

On Wed, 05 Jun 2013 11:12:37 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 6/4/2013 6:07 PM, Ned Simmons wrote:
On Tue, 04 Jun 2013 10:06:48 -0500, wrote:
...

Now to the problem/question...

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

...


I thought Misumi would have something, but no joy. They have metric
bearings in inch-dimensioned housings, but no inch bearings. If it's
easier to make a sleeve to adapt the 1" shaft to a 30mm bearing than
it is to turn the shaft you may find something useful here.
http://us.misumi-ec.com/vona2/mech/M...0/M0806000000/

Possibly could take a 25 and work the shaft down. You have any
experience w/ these guys on pricing? I'm guessing one of these would be
about as much as the machining charge to widen the present bearing face
just looking at the site. I didn't bother them w/ a likely
wasted-effort quote.

But, is interesting to know they're there if were to have budget for a
project.

I have a love-hate relationship with Misumi. Love when I can specify a
complicated shaft (for example) instead of modelling it and making it
myself, hate when I've spent 45 minutes trying to generate a Misumi
p/n for said shaft, can't get exactly what I need, and end up drawing
it after all.

But I do buy stuff from them regularly. If you pick a part and go thru
the configuration process the page will display a real time quote as
well as generate a CAD model of the part. I'd guess a simple 25mm
pillow block would be about $60.

--
Ned Simmons

On 6/6/2013 7:37 AM, dpb wrote:
....

Unfortunately, I don't have current pictures; best I've found on web is at

http://www.ntractorclub.com/manuals/misc/
/implementsTransmix%20Utility%20Mixer%20-%20Dealer%20Ad%20Brochure%20-
%20Other%20Mfg%27s.pdf

The picture from the rear on an International 300 is best view of way it
was mounted on the Farmall 2-pt "quick-tach"...


Actually, you can visualize pretty well the problem from the "numbered
selling points" diagram/picture at top of second page in the brochure.

Pt 8 highlights the PTO extension and altho it's a little tough to see
'cuz they left a white square in the image between the 6 and the 8 you
can just make out the open end of the drive hub on the end of the shaft
by the dark shadow. At that point that #6 is a tire mounted on a rim
welded to the bottom end of the drum and it rests on that outboard end
of the shaft.

The shaft is supported originally by a solidly-mounted casting w/ a
bearing at the outboard end for load support there and the casting
mounting was adapted to the particular tractor such that it carried the
load at the drive end to avoid transferring the drum load to the tractor
PTO bearing.

Since I can't use the casting on present tractor(s), I'll have to
construct a replacement structure for it and mount it on drawbar hanger
and whatever else works out to be convenient attachment point. I'm
thinking rather than try to make such a heavy mount and rely totally on
the one rear bearing I'll just add a support bearing at both ends of the
shaft on my new support.

One I've got this, then I'll have final dimensions from which to work to
adapt the cradle from the 2-pt arrangement to use the 3-pt arms and then
it looks like can use the rollbar mounting brackets for the upper
supports w/o too much effort--turns out they're in at least same
ballpark of the same width as the existing axle support mounts and
roughly same height.

--

On 6/6/2013 9:04 AM, Ned Simmons wrote:
....

I have a love-hate relationship with Misumi. Love when I can specify a
complicated shaft (for example) instead of modelling it and making it
myself, hate when I've spent 45 minutes trying to generate a Misumi
p/n for said shaft, can't get exactly what I need, and end up drawing
it after all.

But I do buy stuff from them regularly. If you pick a part and go thru
the configuration process the page will display a real time quote as
well as generate a CAD model of the part. I'd guess a simple 25mm
pillow block would be about $60.

I spent at least half that long trying to figure out how to get the
configurator to work and gave it up.

I think I can get the shaft turned for that, roughly, probably, and go
w/ a standard pillow block. If could get the inch ID on the bearing I'd
consider it, but when still have to either shim or pare down the shaft
anyway, then it just doesn't seem any real strong advantage.

But, as another noted, it is surely a resource to add to the save
links...and thanks for that and the suggestion.

--

dpb wrote:
On 6/5/2013 10:30 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
"dpb" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2013 3:40 PM, dpb wrote:

Background...

Have old (as in late 50s/very early 60s) utility mixer that was mounted
on old Farmall 560 w/ the two-point connection system and two other
brackets around the rear axles. No longer have the 560; am adapting
mount on little JD 955 utility tractor.

Have pulled the PTO shaft from the humongous casting that was mounted to
the rear PTO cover plate on the 560 but that is far too big in outside
dimensions to fit into the area around a PTO on any even recently modern
tractor...so the plan was/is to build another support structure to mount
from the drawbar hanger and whatever else can find that is convenient
and planned on bolting just some pillow blocks to it for the
bearings/support.


How about making a simple drive.

Tractor - PTO yoke - to a bearing cross to a section of steel car drive
shaft - end of shaft cut at correct length to allow drum to operate -
self aligning bearing pressed into a collar welded into end of drive
shaft section- bearing attached to fabricated support that can attach to
lower drawbar point or with a yoke to the lower guard bolts (or both for
stability)


--
Steve W.

On 6/6/2013 4:41 PM, Steve W. wrote:
....

How about making a simple drive.

Tractor - PTO yoke - to a bearing cross to a section of steel car drive
shaft - end of shaft cut at correct length to allow drum to operate -
self aligning bearing pressed into a collar welded into end of drive
shaft section- bearing attached to fabricated support that can attach to
lower drawbar point or with a yoke to the lower guard bolts (or both for
stability)

'Cuz that's definitely more than simply turning another inch on the
existing shaft for the bearing clearance...

I don't have an extra yoke, nor an old drive shaft laying around--I do
have the existing shaft that only needs either a mount the same
thickness as the bearing or to have the shaft turned back a little more
to clear a standard pillow block. And, the support arrangement I need
is essentially the same as that so there's no real difference there.

But, yes, I did ask for any other ideas, so thanks...

--

On Jun 6, 9:09*am, dpb wrote:
On 6/6/2013 7:37 AM, dpb wrote:
...

Unfortunately, I don't have current pictures; best I've found on web is at

http://www.ntractorclub.com/manuals/misc/
/implementsTransmix%20Utility%20Mixer%20-%20Dealer%20Ad%20Brochure%20-
%20Other%20Mfg%27s.pdf

The picture from the rear on an International 300 is best view of way it
was mounted on the Farmall 2-pt "quick-tach"...

Actually, you can visualize pretty well the problem from the "numbered
selling points" diagram/picture at top of second page in the brochure.

Pt 8 highlights the PTO extension and altho it's a little tough to see
'cuz they left a white square in the image between the 6 and the 8 you
can just make out the open end of the drive hub on the end of the shaft
by the dark shadow. *At that point that #6 is a tire mounted on a rim
welded to the bottom end of the drum and it rests on that outboard end
of the shaft.

The shaft is supported originally by a solidly-mounted casting w/ a
bearing at the outboard end for load support there and the casting
mounting was adapted to the particular tractor such that it carried the
load at the drive end to avoid transferring the drum load to the tractor
PTO bearing.

Since I can't use the casting on present tractor(s), I'll have to
construct a replacement structure for it and mount it on drawbar hanger
and whatever else works out to be convenient attachment point. *I'm
thinking rather than try to make such a heavy mount and rely totally on
the one rear bearing I'll just add a support bearing at both ends of the
shaft on my new support.

One I've got this, then I'll have final dimensions from which to work to
adapt the cradle from the 2-pt arrangement to use the 3-pt arms and then
it looks like can use the rollbar mounting brackets for the upper
supports w/o too much effort--turns out they're in at least same
ballpark of the same width as the existing axle support mounts and
roughly same height.

--

Sounds like this mixer:
http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com...c.php?t=821491

On 6/6/2013 5:41 PM, Denis G. wrote:
....


Sounds like this mixer:
http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com...c.php?t=821491

Yep. Same outfit; that one's on a Ford 8N so support is a fair amount
different but basic idea is the same. The PTO support casting for it is
very evident in the pictures--quite a bit smaller than the one for the
Farmall 560 I have.

That one and manual are pretty widespread--I found it at several
locations on the web.

--

On Thu, 06 Jun 2013 09:16:36 -0500, dpb wrote:


I spent at least half that long trying to figure out how to get the
configurator to work and gave it up.

That's the new and improved interface. g But as frustrating as it
is, it's pretty impressive considering that they allow you to specify
quite a few parameters for a part, price it, create a downloadable 3D
model, then manufacture and deliver it in a few days to 2 weeks. And
the print catalog is the same size as a McMaster catalog.

--
Ned Simmons

On 6/4/2013 10:06 AM, dpb wrote:
....

The rear end of the shaft (1" D) bearing surface turns out to be only a
3/4" width. A standard pillow block is much thicker owing to the lock
collar, etc. So, question is, anybody got an idea for an inexpensive
bearing mount to save having to have the shaft turned? Any other idears
accepted as well...

The PTO drive end is 1-5/8" and has plenty of length to use a standard
pillow block; it's only this inboard end that needs help that I've not
got an answer for at the moment...

....

Well, ended up just taking the shaft to town to machine shop and had
them turn it--got it back yesterday.

The 1" pillow block now has enough clearance and will work just
peachy-keen....only thing is I discovered I got my bifocals crossed when
looking at the calipers and the inboard end is 1-3/8" instead of 1-5/8"
(+) so now I'm waiting on the right-sized block to arrive--the no-name
online was enough cheaper that having spent the $$ on the shop bill I
was cheap.

(+) Actually, this is _a_good_thing_ (tm) as the 1-3/8" bearing will be
closer in height to CL relative the 1" so won't need so much offset shim
on the support. (Too bad there's no magic to turn a 1" portion on the
other end and get the bearing there of same size! )

--