Ed Huntress wrote:

(...)

Oh, well, we're going to have all the oil we could possibly want,
after the Republicans win the White House. And gas will be $2.50 a
gallon! Free, if you show your Tea Party ID card!

They'll probably drill in my back yard. I wonder who owns the mineral
rights? d8-)

Situation: All Fracked Up.

--Winston

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message ...
"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 14 Mar 2012 20:25:39 -0700, Winston
wrote:

wrote:
On Mar 14, 4:54 pm, Ecnerwal
wrote:



If it were a one-day deal or the like, I'd agree with you, but I'd
choose refrigeration in a heartbeat for any regular use. I'm intimately
aware of the hassles of salt-ice refrigeration, and I'm quite certain
that if I were making ice cream and sorbet as a busness rather than for
myself, it would be an easy decision to spend the money for a
refrigerated mixer - for home use it's a lot of money, so I use salt
and
ice.


Another approach would be to use a solid state cooler and a bit of
compressed air.

Peltier Junction Thermo Electric Heat Pump


One could refrigerate a jug of water for a few days
then use it as a heat sink for the copper tube.
That'd be inefficient but it might be cheaper
because it would eliminate the trip to the store
for bags of ice.

Who needs a store? I make my own ice in a little stand-up freezer. In
the summer, when I'm fishing, I make about 10 to 20 pounds of it every
couple of days.

Yeah, I took all the shelves out of the freezer in my shop fridge and put a
great big tub under the little ice maker in there. It holds 30-40 pounds of
ice if I remember to turn the tub around so the other side fills. In the
summer when I am fishing a lot that is never a problem. LOL.

It's a lot cheaper than running a compressor at the low efficiencies
of a Hilsch tube...or buying ice.

I would consider using the freezer part of the fridge to pre-cool a coil of
air, but its on the other side of the shop. I actually considered putting
my CNC computers inside a little apartment fridge in the shop. Maybe now is
the time to get a second shop fridge. LOL.


The problem is, for instance, aluminum melts at approximately 1220 deg F and cooling your air supply down by a paltry 60 or so degrees will have a neglible efferct on total heat transfer at best--at worst, no effect or perhaps it could even be negative.

You've intentionally reduced total mass air flow to the part itself by throwing away the heated portion--air which is in all probablilty is say 150 deg F or so--IOW, no where near the temp where there is a significant danger of any cutting tools clogging up and that sort of thing....air which all by itself (though hot to the touch) would be perfectly adequate where the goal is keep the part / chips / temp at some temperature well below the danger zone....

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?

--Winston

"PrecisionmachinisT" fired this volley in
news:2s6dnYwxA5cUG__SnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@scnresearch. com:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I
really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from
the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be
carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow
that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp
directly from the compressor instead.


I'll make the lesson real simple, TMT.

Take a workpiece at 100 degrees.
Pour 100 degree air over it.
How much heat do you remove from the workpiece? Zero.

Reduce the temperature of the air (any amount, but say) to zero degrees.

Pour that air over the workpiece.

Now you answer the question, TMT -- Is any heat removed from the
workpiece?

Now, extrapolate that to other relative temperatures...

I'd love to read your conclusion.

LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley in
. 3.70:

I'll make the lesson real simple, TMT.

sorry... that was rude. I was thinking about something stupid TMT wrote,
and accidently typed that... (duh)

LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message . 3.70...
"PrecisionmachinisT" fired this volley in
news:2s6dnYwxA5cUG__SnZ2dnUVZ_oWdnZ2d@scnresearch. com:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I
really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from
the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be
carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow
that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp
directly from the compressor instead.


I'll make the lesson real simple, TMT.

Take a workpiece at 100 degrees.
Pour 100 degree air over it.
How much heat do you remove from the workpiece? Zero.

Basic thermodynamics..

( yawn )

A workpiece at 100F is in absolutely no danger of causing a problem during machining operations (unless it's something that melts at say 120F ).....


Reduce the temperature of the air (any amount, but say) to zero degrees.

Pour that air over the workpiece.


60 degrees worth of difference in air temp is a drop in the bucket, considering that the melting point of the workpiece is nearly 1000 F above the air temp in either case...


Now you answer the question, TMT -- Is any heat removed from the
workpiece?

Now, extrapolate that to other relative temperatures...

I'd love to read your conclusion.

LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message . 3.70...
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley in
. 3.70:

I'll make the lesson real simple, TMT.

sorry... that was rude. I was thinking about something stupid TMT wrote,
and accidently typed that... (duh)

LLoyd

No prob--it's just something I visited my self many years ago....been there done it..

Even got a near-new exo-air vortex tube sitting in a vidmar that's been used "for evaluation purposes only", to prove it....

"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:49:46 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

Maybe that. I think it has something to do with Schrödinger's cat.
Maybe they're really the cat's rectangular hairballs.

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:49:46 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

Maybe that. I think it has something to do with Schrödinger's cat.

Not cat, box--that, may, or may not, have contained said cat....

Maybe they're really the cat's rectangular hairballs.

For theories, likely conspiratory...

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:10:47 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:49:46 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message ...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

Maybe that. I think it has something to do with Schrödinger's cat.

Not cat, box--that, may, or may not, have contained said cat....

Maybe they're really the cat's rectangular hairballs.

For theories, likely conspiratory...

Well, sooner or later, one of them will fall right through the other
and pass out the other side. Or maybe they'll get stuck in the middle.

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:10:47 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:49:46 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
m...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message
...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various
vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is
carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a
vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same
amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a
standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor
instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might
condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement
amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at
all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

Maybe that. I think it has something to do with Schrödinger's cat.

Not cat, box--that, may, or may not, have contained said cat....

Maybe they're really the cat's rectangular hairballs.

For theories, likely conspiratory...

Well, sooner or later,
one of them will fall right through the other
and pass out the other side. Or maybe they'll get stuck in the middle.


All of which already happened, an infinate number of times, as a matter of
fact--only thing still unresolved being which universe and when exactly, was
all.....

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 20:30:22 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 19:10:47 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:49:46 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
om...
On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message
...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various
vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is
carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a
vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same
amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a
standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor
instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might
condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement
amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at
all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)


Shared orbit

Maybe that. I think it has something to do with Schrödinger's cat.

Not cat, box--that, may, or may not, have contained said cat....

Maybe they're really the cat's rectangular hairballs.

For theories, likely conspiratory...

Well, sooner or later,
one of them will fall right through the other
and pass out the other side. Or maybe they'll get stuck in the middle.


All of which already happened, an infinate number of times, as a matter of
fact--only thing still unresolved being which universe and when exactly, was
all.....

Really? Damn, 'missed it again. It must be happening when I'm
watching Hannity. I always feel like I'm on another planet when he
comes on.

--
Ed Huntress

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 21:45:19 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

--
Cheers,

John B.

John B. fired this volley in
:

The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)



The last I heard, they had solved it.

According to what I read, it functions by the same method Gecko feet do --
by having structures so small or close together that atomic binding forces
come into play.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 06:48:23 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)



The last I heard, they had solved it.

According to what I read, it functions by the same method Gecko feet do --
by having structures so small or close together that atomic binding forces
come into play.

I read a sci-fi book about very thing that recently. They put the
stuff on a small RC truck's tires and it would pull chunks of painted
drywall out of the wall if you tried to remove the truck, which could
climb the wall and proceed onto the ceiling without any trouble.

--
The greatest justice in life is that your vision and looks tend to go simultaneously.
-- Kevin Bacon

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:15:18 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 21:45:19 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Mar 2012 18:25:23 -0700, "PrecisionmachinisT"
wrote:


"Winston" wrote in message ...
PrecisionmachinisT wrote:

When it comes down to it, despite the claims of the various vendors, I really do have serious doubts that any more heat is carried away from the workpiece by using the cold air out of a vortex tube than would be carried away by simply using the same amout of total of mass air flow that would have been output into a standard air nozzle at room temp directly from the compressor instead.

I imagine that ambient humidity in front of the nozzle might condense
and create the world's finest spray mist.
That'd carry away some heat, I'd think.

Any physics majors care to weigh in on the question?


What is interesting...

--is that last I checked, there still is no definitive agreement amoung the scientific community about how the damned things work at all, period...

If you want to hear another surprising mystery, no one knows why gage
blocks wring. At least, as of 2003 or so.

(Here come the theories... g)

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Some years ago I posted here an article I
wrote about it over a decade ago, based on an interview with NIST's
scientist in charge of gage blocks and dimensional standards. He
basically said "Nobody has a clue." g

--
Ed Huntress

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 06:48:23 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)



The last I heard, they had solved it.

According to what I read, it functions by the same method Gecko feet do --
by having structures so small or close together that atomic binding forces
come into play.

It could be. My interviews with the experts on the subject are about a
decade old now.

--
Ed Huntress

On 2012-03-16, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:15:18 +0700, John B.
wrote:

[ ... ]

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

Would that not be "cohesion", not "adhesion" since it is between
two pieces of the same metal?

BTW I've never had a chance to try this, but do steel and
carbide and ceramic gauge blocks all wring together cross-species? (All
I have are steel ones.) If so, then we can eliminate cohesion as a
requirement. :-)

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Some years ago I posted here an article I
wrote about it over a decade ago, based on an interview with NIST's
scientist in charge of gage blocks and dimensional standards. He
basically said "Nobody has a clue." g

An honest answer.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 16 Mar 2012 23:58:35 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2012-03-16, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:15:18 +0700, John B.
wrote:

[ ... ]

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

Would that not be "cohesion", not "adhesion" since it is between
two pieces of the same metal?
\
I don't remember. It's Friday night, and I've about done thinking for
the week. d8-)



BTW I've never had a chance to try this, but do steel and
carbide and ceramic gauge blocks all wring together cross-species? (All
I have are steel ones.) If so, then we can eliminate cohesion as a
requirement. :-)

Yes, they will all wring together. I've done it. I ran a photo of a
mixed stack in _Machine Shop Guide_ many years ago.

--
Ed Huntress

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Some years ago I posted here an article I
wrote about it over a decade ago, based on an interview with NIST's
scientist in charge of gage blocks and dimensional standards. He
basically said "Nobody has a clue." g

An honest answer.

Enjoy,
DoN.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 20:03:21 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On 16 Mar 2012 23:58:35 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2012-03-16, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:15:18 +0700, John B.
wrote:

[ ... ]

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

Would that not be "cohesion", not "adhesion" since it is between
two pieces of the same metal?
\
I don't remember. It's Friday night, and I've about done thinking for
the week. d8-)



BTW I've never had a chance to try this, but do steel and
carbide and ceramic gauge blocks all wring together cross-species? (All
I have are steel ones.) If so, then we can eliminate cohesion as a
requirement. :-)

Yes, they will all wring together. I've done it. I ran a photo of a
mixed stack in _Machine Shop Guide_ many years ago.

Let me amend that: I ran a photo of a stack of ceramic and steel
blocks wrung together. No carbide.

Tungsten carbide doesn't wring very well. Chromium carbide gage blocks
wring better. Tungsten carbide blocks are usually the square ones with
the hole in the middle, for a clamp screw. But regular ones are
available, or they were.

--
Ed Huntress

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 06:48:23 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)



The last I heard, they had solved it.

According to what I read, it functions by the same method Gecko feet do --
by having structures so small or close together that atomic binding forces
come into play.

The last I read - years ago - was the attraction theory seemed to be
about all that was left after the other ideas had been proved wrong,
but at the time no one had demonstrated any definitive proof of the
theory..... but they were still working on it :-)

Here is an abstract of the modern theory:

A method is presented for calcg. van der Waals forces in systems with
nonlocal cond. The fluctuating fields in the electromagnetic stress
tensor are obtained by applying the fluctuation-dissipation theorem to
the response of the system to an external polarization. As an example,
the method is used to calc. the contribution of conduction electrons
to the interaction of 2 blocks of metal. When the electrons are
described in a simple hydrodynamic approxn. keeping only the lowest
order nonlocal terms, the interaction force is the same as that
obtained by Lif****z assuming local cond. At sepns. large compared to
the London penetration depth c/wp the interaction is due to
electromagnetic waveguide, modes, while at distances small compared to
c/wp, the force is due to surface plasmons. As a 2nd example, the
method is applied to the interaction of 2 graphitelike blocks. With a
quantum mech. derived description of the electron motion, the
resulting force differs from Lif****z expression both because of the
anisotropy of the system and because of the nonlocal cond.



By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--
Cheers,

John B.

John B. fired this volley in
:

By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--

Been done... but machined by electron beams.

They're using the materials for experimental applications, but I know of no
practical ones, yet.

LLoyd

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 20:10:00 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--

Been done... but machined by electron beams.

They're using the materials for experimental applications, but I know of no
practical ones, yet.

LLoyd

A robotic fly catcher, perhaps?

--
Ed Huntress

On 2012-03-17, Ed Huntress wrote:
On 16 Mar 2012 23:58:35 GMT, "DoN. Nichols"
wrote:

On 2012-03-16, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:15:18 +0700, John B.
wrote:

[ ... ]

Well, the air pressure theory was disproved. The last I read they were
theorizing about inter molecular adhesion and wondering about how to
prove it :-)

Would that not be "cohesion", not "adhesion" since it is between
two pieces of the same metal?
\
I don't remember. It's Friday night, and I've about done thinking for
the week. d8-)

:-)

BTW I've never had a chance to try this, but do steel and
carbide and ceramic gauge blocks all wring together cross-species? (All
I have are steel ones.) If so, then we can eliminate cohesion as a
requirement. :-)

Yes, they will all wring together. I've done it. I ran a photo of a
mixed stack in _Machine Shop Guide_ many years ago.

O.K. That eliminates the need for cohesion, but adhesion is
still a possibility.

Thanks,
DoN.

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On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 20:10:00 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--

Been done... but machined by electron beams.

They're using the materials for experimental applications, but I know of no
practical ones, yet.

LLoyd


Over here they sell some stuff called "Tokay feet". I believe y'all
call it velcro :-)

"Tokay" (I believe they may be called "Tokay Geckos by foreigners) are
about 12 inches long, walk up walls, and eat other lizards, small
birds, etc., as opposed to the smaller geckos that eat bugs.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 21:19:33 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 20:10:00 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
m:

By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--

Been done... but machined by electron beams.

They're using the materials for experimental applications, but I know of no
practical ones, yet.

LLoyd

A robotic fly catcher, perhaps?

We have self duplicating, mobile, bug catchers over here. We call then
chinchoks you may call them geckos :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

"John B." wrote in message ...
On Fri, 16 Mar 2012 20:10:00 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
m:

By the way, machining all those tiny gecko feet is going to be a
bitch.
--

Been done... but machined by electron beams.

They're using the materials for experimental applications, but I know of no
practical ones, yet.

LLoyd


Over here they sell some stuff called "Tokay feet". I believe y'all
call it velcro :-)

"Tokay" (I believe they may be called "Tokay Geckos by foreigners) are
about 12 inches long, walk up walls, and eat other lizards, small
birds, etc., as opposed to the smaller geckos that eat bugs.


Probably excellent smoked, or slow-roasted on a spit....