I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the threaded
rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded rod
when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?

Jon

On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 23:04:00 -0800, Jon Danniken wrote:

I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on
a fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the
threaded rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded
rod when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?

My thought is that red threadlocker will work just fine, as long
as you also drill a 3/8" hole through the nut and rod and put in
a good grade of cross-pin.

--
jiw

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the
threaded rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure)....

Jon

Two nuts tightened against each other should work well, as long as you
remember to turn the lower one for Up and the upper one for Down.

jsw

On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 23:04:00 -0800, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the threaded
rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded rod
when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?

Why take a chance? Run another nut on that puppy and lock it to the
base when you've attained solidity. I hope there's a good grease in
that upper pivot point.

P.S: Where are your vapor barrier and borate pesticide treatments?
And seal up that cracked foundation, will ya?

--
The ultimate result of shielding men from folly
is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer

I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.

i

On 2012-02-17, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 23:04:00 -0800, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the threaded
rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded rod
when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?

Why take a chance? Run another nut on that puppy and lock it to the
base when you've attained solidity. I hope there's a good grease in
that upper pivot point.

P.S: Where are your vapor barrier and borate pesticide treatments?
And seal up that cracked foundation, will ya?

Ignoramus23204 fired this volley in
:

I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.

Well... let's assume he plays piano right over those jacks, and lives 110'
from a railroad track.

THEN he needs thread-locker, but the blue stuff will work just fine.

LLoyd

On 2/17/2012 8:11 AM, Ignoramus23204 wrote:
I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.
....

As I read it, he wants to use it to actually raise/lower the column, not
lock the column in place.

As another said, for that needs either double-nut or to pin
it--threadlock is a "maybe will, maybe won't" depending on how much load
is actually put on it in application which is probably not known a
priori very closely at all.

--

dpb wrote:
On 2/17/2012 8:11 AM, Ignoramus23204 wrote:
I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.
...

As I read it, he wants to use it to actually raise/lower the column,
not lock the column in place.

As another said, for that needs either double-nut or to pin
it--threadlock is a "maybe will, maybe won't" depending on how much
load is actually put on it in application which is probably not known
a priori very closely at all.

Yes, thanks, I didn't do a very good job of explaining the purpose of the
nut.

The actual nut used in raising and lowering the threaded rod is not visible
in the image. The nut that is visible is welded to the threaded rod, and is
only used to give you something to put your wrench on to turn the threaded
rod.

Jon

On 2/17/2012 2:52 PM, Jon Danniken wrote:
dpb wrote:
On 2/17/2012 8:11 AM, Ignoramus23204 wrote:
I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.
...

As I read it, he wants to use it to actually raise/lower the column,
not lock the column in place.

As another said, for that needs either double-nut or to pin
it--threadlock is a "maybe will, maybe won't" depending on how much
load is actually put on it in application which is probably not known
a priori very closely at all.

Yes, thanks, I didn't do a very good job of explaining the purpose of the
nut.

The actual nut used in raising and lowering the threaded rod is not visible
in the image. The nut that is visible is welded to the threaded rod, and is
only used to give you something to put your wrench on to turn the threaded
rod.

OK, so what specific nut _are_ you about asking then?

If you're talking about a jamb/locknut after position is fixed, that
will hold find w/o anything except a good torque'ing when you've got the
column in place. Iggy's right on there in that case...

--

"Jon Danniken" wrote
Yes, thanks, I didn't do a very good job of explaining the purpose of the
nut.

The actual nut used in raising and lowering the threaded rod is not
visible in the image. The nut that is visible is welded to the threaded
rod, and is only used to give you something to put your wrench on to turn
the threaded rod.
Jon

Got it. I'd put two nuts locked together at the top to grip and turn the
threaded rod and another resting on the hole in the top of the column to
support the load. Then pull the wrenches on both the top and support nuts
simultaneously in opposite directions to avoid applying a large sideways
load that might shift the column.

With a rod that large you could probably get away with machining a square
for an open-end wrench on the rod itself. That's what I did on the 3/4-10
track leveling screws he
https://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/...53006429714322
The head lifting screws are double-nutted to the cranks and sprockets at the
top.

jsw

On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 12:52:51 -0800, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

dpb wrote:
On 2/17/2012 8:11 AM, Ignoramus23204 wrote:
I personally do not see any need for any threadlocker, as there is no
vibration or twisting forces that would cause the nut to unscrew.
...

As I read it, he wants to use it to actually raise/lower the column,
not lock the column in place.

As another said, for that needs either double-nut or to pin
it--threadlock is a "maybe will, maybe won't" depending on how much
load is actually put on it in application which is probably not known
a priori very closely at all.

Yes, thanks, I didn't do a very good job of explaining the purpose of the
nut.

The actual nut used in raising and lowering the threaded rod is not visible
in the image. The nut that is visible is welded to the threaded rod, and is
only used to give you something to put your wrench on to turn the threaded
rod.

Jon




I don't know how well Loctite sticks to zinc but when used properly on
steel or stainless steel it grips so well that sometimes the threads
willn be torn off before the Loctite fails. I have experienced this. I
have contacted the makers of Loctite more than once to ask about
specific situations and they were always able to give me an answer
about whether what I wanted to do was possible and what compound to
use.
Eric

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.


I don't think loc-tite red is listed as permanent. Just as for larger
bolts. I break it loose with a wrench whenever I need to.

On 2012-02-17, Jon Danniken wrote:
I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the threaded
rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded rod
when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?

Go for the bearing mount version -- which is also red, IIRC. It
will set up better in threads which may be as loose as these 1.25x7
threads may be.

But an alternative would be a cross hole with a dowel pin in it
to keep the nut from turning on the thread.

Is that thread an Acme thread? I would consider that better
than a normal V thread for the task.

Good Luck
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

DoN. Nichols wrote:

Go for the bearing mount version -- which is also red, IIRC. It
will set up better in threads which may be as loose as these 1.25x7
threads may be.

Yeah, I was kind of surprised how loose the threads were, but everything is
in spec so I guess that's just the way it is with larger fasteners. I think
I'll drop them a line and see what they say about it, thanks for the
suggestion.

But an alternative would be a cross hole with a dowel pin in it
to keep the nut from turning on the thread.

Someone else suggested this, but I don't want to weaken the assembly any
more than I can get away with.

Is that thread an Acme thread? I would consider that better
than a normal V thread for the task.

I couldn't get any tensile strength ratings on ACME threaded fasteners, and
the cost was quite a bit more. If I was going to push this assembly to
anything approaching load limits I would reconsider, but for now It'll be
UNC.

Thanks,

Jon

xJim Wilkins wrote:
"Jon Danniken" wrote
Yes, thanks, I didn't do a very good job of explaining the purpose
of the nut.

The actual nut used in raising and lowering the threaded rod is not
visible in the image. The nut that is visible is welded to the
threaded rod, and is only used to give you something to put your
wrench on to turn the threaded rod.
Jon

Got it. I'd put two nuts locked together at the top to grip and turn
the threaded rod and another resting on the hole in the top of the
column to support the load.

Interesting; I had planned on having the load bear on the top of the
threaded rod (which seems to be the way the ones in the image are built) but
perhaps it would be better to spread it out on the bearing surface of the
nut instead....

Jon

On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 23:04:00 -0800, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

I'm thinking about using the red threadlocker (the "permanent" type) on a
fastener to avoid flashing off the zinc coating through welding.

An example of the application can be seen in this image:
http://i.imgur.com/YHH7P.jpg

In that image, the nut at the top is welded to the threaded rod, and its
purpose is to rotate the threaded up and down to extend/retract the threaded
rod against a heavy load (generally, a house structure).

The thread size in my application will be 1.25" x 7 TPI.

Do you think that the red threadlock will hold the nut to the threaded rod
when the threaded rod has significant weight bearing down on it?


I don't know if this is anything like you are proposing:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/2768312...in/photostream

The double nut at the top has been replaced with a single nut held by
Loctite 262 (red threadlocker). I have had no problems so far.

I also use the 680 retaining compound (or rather its Vibratite
equivalent) on non-threaded parts and it, too, has been more than
satisfactory.

Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

wrote:
I don't know if this is anything like you are proposing:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/2768312...in/photostream

The double nut at the top has been replaced with a single nut held by
Loctite 262 (red threadlocker). I have had no problems so far.

I also use the 680 retaining compound (or rather its Vibratite
equivalent) on non-threaded parts and it, too, has been more than
satisfactory.

That looks to be a similar concept, even if the loadpoint is different. I
did consider the double nut approach, but I don't have the room for two
nuts, and will just be using one.

After considering red threadlocker vs. welding the nut, I have come across a
third possibility, and that is to JB Weld the nut to the threaded rod. It's
thick enough to fill in all the gaps between the threads, especially since
this is not an assembly which is intended to be threadlocked with a force
acting on the fastener.

Using JBWeld would obviously be a permanent solution, but then so would
welding (for the most part).


Jon

"Jon Danniken" wrote

That looks to be a similar concept, even if the loadpoint is
different. I did consider the double nut approach, but I don't have
the room for two nuts, and will just be using one.
...
Jon

Hire a Dutchman to hold it:
http://www.roton.com/eng_bul_964.aspx

jsw

On Mon, 20 Feb 2012 13:48:34 -0800, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:

wrote:
I don't know if this is anything like you are proposing:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/2768312...in/photostream

The double nut at the top has been replaced with a single nut held by
Loctite 262 (red threadlocker). I have had no problems so far.

I also use the 680 retaining compound (or rather its Vibratite
equivalent) on non-threaded parts and it, too, has been more than
satisfactory.

That looks to be a similar concept, even if the loadpoint is different. I
did consider the double nut approach, but I don't have the room for two
nuts, and will just be using one.

After considering red threadlocker vs. welding the nut, I have come across a
third possibility, and that is to JB Weld the nut to the threaded rod. It's
thick enough to fill in all the gaps between the threads, especially since
this is not an assembly which is intended to be threadlocked with a force
acting on the fastener.

Using JBWeld would obviously be a permanent solution, but then so would
welding (for the most part).



Just a caveat:

JB Weld is no stronger than the 680 compound (I have not tested it
against the 262). When the JB Weld fails the failure is catastrophic,
i.e. the parts are now free to rotate within each other. The 680 fails
at a certain point but retains its strength below this point.

In my applications the latter is infinitely preferable.

Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC