Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

stryped wrote:
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

Turn the needles in till seated, then back them out 2.5 turns. That is
usually a good starting point.
Get it started and then adjust it for the dead spots at idle and wide
open. (adjust the low needle in till the engine starts to run poor and
then back it out till it smooths out, then throttle up gently to high
speed and adjust the high needle by turning it in till the engine starts
to die, then back it out till it acts the same way. Now turn it so it is
halfway between those two.
Now to finish the low speed, drop the speed back to idle and adjust that
needle if needed until you can snap the throttle open without the engine
bogging down as you do it.


I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

WAY LOW. However all is not lost. Pull the plug, hold the throttle open
while taking your reading. Then shoot a couple shots of engine oil in
the cylinder and take another reading with the throttle wide open.


When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

May be the needle has a broken tip. Check the seat or a new needle.


Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Once you get it running again put a load on it so that it has to work a
bit. That will seat the rings faster.

--
Steve W.

timing - did you shear the key between flywheel and crank?
valves - do they seal - backfire must be either timing or valves
points - properly adjusted? on B&S they are under the flywheel
sounds like an air leak, are you sure manifolds, head gasket, etc are not
leaking?



"stryped" wrote in message
...
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

Bill Noble wrote:
timing - did you shear the key between flywheel and crank?
valves - do they seal - backfire must be either timing or valves
points - properly adjusted? on B&S they are under the flywheel
sounds like an air leak, are you sure manifolds, head gasket, etc are not
leaking?

Did you line up the dots on the cam gear with the dots on the crank
gear? I don't recall you asking about it...

On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:02:58 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

I collect and restore old garden tractors. There are two particular
pitfalls to these old cast iron Tecumsehs.

One is the Walbro carb. During manufacturing, the main jet is
installed in the carb body and THEN the passages are drilled through
the body and the side of the jet. Then the external hole is sealed
with a welch plug.

If you remove the jet, it is almost impossible to reinstall it with
the holes lined up. Replacement jets have a groove machined around the
jet so orientation isn't critical. You can file a groove in your jet
or chuck it in a lathe and machine one. Or get the replacement jet.

To clean the passages, some simply remove the welch plug, clear the
passage and install a new plug. That way the jet is undisturbed.

Number two is valve clearance. Specifically the exhaust valve. These
engines have compression releases on the cam that prevent the exhaust
valve from completely seating below about 600 rpm. This allows them to
be started with the small starter motors or ropes. Too much valve
clearance and the compression release can't do its job. It only cracks
the valve about 0.005".

With this info, you can see how your compression reading can be low.
To get an accurate reading you have to increase the valve clearance so
the compression release can't lift the valve. Better yet is a leakdown
test.

Give us the model and serial numbers and I can get you specs for your
engine.

Or join the Tecumseh group on Yahoo.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tecums...yguid=34062665

--Andy Asberry--
------Texas-----

Andy Asberry writes:


Number two is valve clearance. Specifically the exhaust valve. These
engines have compression releases on the cam that prevent the exhaust
valve from completely seating below about 600 rpm.

How does that work?


--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

On Jan 12, 11:01*am, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:02:58 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

I collect and restore old garden tractors. There are two particular
pitfalls to these old cast iron Tecumsehs.

One is the Walbro carb. During manufacturing, the main jet is
installed in the carb body and THEN the passages are drilled through
the body and the side of the jet. Then the external hole is sealed
with a welch plug.

If you remove the jet, it is almost impossible to reinstall it with
the holes lined up. Replacement jets have a groove machined around the
jet so orientation isn't critical. You can file a groove in your jet
or chuck it in a lathe and machine one. Or get the replacement jet.

To clean the passages, some simply remove the welch plug, clear the
passage and install a new plug. That way the jet is undisturbed.

Number two is valve clearance. Specifically the exhaust valve. These
engines have compression releases on the cam that prevent the exhaust
valve from completely seating below about 600 rpm. This allows them to
be started with the small starter motors or ropes. Too much valve
clearance and the compression release can't do its job. It only cracks
the valve about 0.005".

With this info, you can see how your compression reading can be low.
To get an accurate reading you have to increase the valve clearance so
the compression release can't lift the valve. Better yet is a leakdown
test.

Give us the model and serial numbers and I can get you specs for your
engine.

Or join the Tecumseh group on Yahoo.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tecums...yguid=34062665

--Andy Asberry--
------Texas------ Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

My model number is HH60 105116H ser 23230.

I am frustrated to the point of almost giving up. I cleaned the carb
twice but I did not take the welch plug out. I am starting to wonder
if it is just that the compression is not adequate. I honed the
cylinder and put new rings on. But I did not use ring expanders under
the 2nd compression ring. When I took the engine apart it did not have
them. I tried to install them but somethign did not seem right, the
piston did not want to go in the bore.

I used all new gaskets, torgued the head in sequence, cleaned
everythign, cleaned and gapped the points, timed the engine at .080
BTDC with a dial indicator. I put so much work into this. I dont want
to give up but I am wondering if I should just buy a new engine.

It seemed to run decent in the video once I got it warmed up. But it
took a battery with a battery charger hooked up and lots of cranking a
fooling around with the choke to get it going.

I feel defeated....

On Jan 12, 11:01*am, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:02:58 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

I collect and restore old garden tractors. There are two particular
pitfalls to these old cast iron Tecumsehs.

One is the Walbro carb. During manufacturing, the main jet is
installed in the carb body and THEN the passages are drilled through
the body and the side of the jet. Then the external hole is sealed
with a welch plug.

If you remove the jet, it is almost impossible to reinstall it with
the holes lined up. Replacement jets have a groove machined around the
jet so orientation isn't critical. You can file a groove in your jet
or chuck it in a lathe and machine one. Or get the replacement jet.

To clean the passages, some simply remove the welch plug, clear the
passage and install a new plug. That way the jet is undisturbed.

Number two is valve clearance. Specifically the exhaust valve. These
engines have compression releases on the cam that prevent the exhaust
valve from completely seating below about 600 rpm. This allows them to
be started with the small starter motors or ropes. Too much valve
clearance and the compression release can't do its job. It only cracks
the valve about 0.005".

With this info, you can see how your compression reading can be low.
To get an accurate reading you have to increase the valve clearance so
the compression release can't lift the valve. Better yet is a leakdown
test.

Give us the model and serial numbers and I can get you specs for your
engine.

Or join the Tecumseh group on Yahoo.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tecums...yguid=34062665

--Andy Asberry--
------Texas------ Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

On Jan 12, 1:46*pm, "David Courtney" wrote:
* * I got sick of f'ing around with mine (HH60) and bought a brand new $92
carb fromhttp://MandD.com
* * It runs like a charm with absolutely no carb tuning... bolted it on and
started it up (no electric start) in the 30 degree garage.

"stryped" wrote in message

news:68acf36a-cb89-42bf-9c0f-
My model number is HH60 105116H ser 23230.

I am frustrated to the point of almost giving up. I cleaned the carb
twice but I did not take the welch plug out. I am starting to wonder
if it is just that the compression is not adequate. I honed the
cylinder and put new rings on. But I did not use ring expanders under
the 2nd compression ring. When I took the engine apart it did not have
them. I tried to install them but somethign did not seem right, the
piston did not want to go in the bore.

I used all new gaskets, torgued the head in sequence, cleaned
everythign, cleaned and gapped the points, timed the engine at .080
BTDC with a dial indicator. I put so much work into this. I dont want
to give up but I am wondering if I should just buy a new engine.

It seemed to run decent in the video once I got it warmed up. But it
took a battery with a battery charger hooked up and lots of cranking a
fooling around with the choke to get it going.

I feel defeated....

*Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
---------------------------------------------------------- * *
* * * * * * * *http://www.usenet.com

I would buy one in a heartbeat if I knew it would fix my problem. What
worries me is the low compression.

stryped wrote:
On Jan 12, 1:46 pm, "David Courtney" wrote:

I got sick of f'ing around with mine (HH60) and bought a brand new $92
carb fromhttp://MandD.com
It runs like a charm with absolutely no carb tuning... bolted it on and
started it up (no electric start) in the 30 degree garage.

"stryped" wrote in message

news:68acf36a-cb89-42bf-9c0f-
My model number is HH60 105116H ser 23230.

I am frustrated to the point of almost giving up. I cleaned the carb
twice but I did not take the welch plug out. I am starting to wonder
if it is just that the compression is not adequate. I honed the
cylinder and put new rings on. But I did not use ring expanders under
the 2nd compression ring. When I took the engine apart it did not have
them. I tried to install them but somethign did not seem right, the
piston did not want to go in the bore.

I used all new gaskets, torgued the head in sequence, cleaned
everythign, cleaned and gapped the points, timed the engine at .080
BTDC with a dial indicator. I put so much work into this. I dont want
to give up but I am wondering if I should just buy a new engine.

It seemed to run decent in the video once I got it warmed up. But it
took a battery with a battery charger hooked up and lots of cranking a
fooling around with the choke to get it going.

I feel defeated....

Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
http://www.usenet.com


I would buy one in a heartbeat if I knew it would fix my problem. What
worries me is the low compression.

Are you trying to run it without an air filter?. Some small engines use
an oiled foam filter and don't start well if the filter is missing or
has gotten dry and in need of a re-oiling.

On Jan 12, 2:05*pm, David Billington
wrote:
stryped wrote:
On Jan 12, 1:46 pm, "David Courtney" wrote:

* * I got sick of f'ing around with mine (HH60) and bought a brand new $92
carb fromhttp://MandD.com
* * It runs like a charm with absolutely no carb tuning... bolted it on and
started it up (no electric start) in the 30 degree garage.

"stryped" wrote in message

news:68acf36a-cb89-42bf-9c0f-
My model number is HH60 105116H ser 23230.

I am frustrated to the point of almost giving up. I cleaned the carb
twice but I did not take the welch plug out. I am starting to wonder
if it is just that the compression is not adequate. I honed the
cylinder and put new rings on. But I did not use ring expanders under
the 2nd compression ring. When I took the engine apart it did not have
them. I tried to install them but somethign did not seem right, the
piston did not want to go in the bore.

I used all new gaskets, torgued the head in sequence, cleaned
everythign, cleaned and gapped the points, timed the engine at .080
BTDC with a dial indicator. I put so much work into this. I dont want
to give up but I am wondering if I should just buy a new engine.

It seemed to run decent in the video once I got it warmed up. But it
took a battery with a battery charger hooked up and lots of cranking a
fooling around with the choke to get it going.

I feel defeated....

*Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
---------------------------------------------------------- * *
* * * * * * * *http://www.usenet.com

I would buy one in a heartbeat if I knew it would fix my problem. What
worries me is the low compression.

Are you trying to run it without an air filter?. Some small engines use
an oiled foam filter and don't start well if the filter is missing or
has gotten dry and in need of a re-oiling.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, I have ran it with out a filter just to see if it will start. Do
I need to replace it and do I need this for the compression test?

On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 10:17:27 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 12, 11:01*am, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:02:58 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

I collect and restore old garden tractors. There are two particular
pitfalls to these old cast iron Tecumsehs.

One is the Walbro carb. During manufacturing, the main jet is
installed in the carb body and THEN the passages are drilled through
the body and the side of the jet. Then the external hole is sealed
with a welch plug.

If you remove the jet, it is almost impossible to reinstall it with
the holes lined up. Replacement jets have a groove machined around the
jet so orientation isn't critical. You can file a groove in your jet
or chuck it in a lathe and machine one. Or get the replacement jet.

To clean the passages, some simply remove the welch plug, clear the
passage and install a new plug. That way the jet is undisturbed.

Number two is valve clearance. Specifically the exhaust valve. These
engines have compression releases on the cam that prevent the exhaust
valve from completely seating below about 600 rpm. This allows them to
be started with the small starter motors or ropes. Too much valve
clearance and the compression release can't do its job. It only cracks
the valve about 0.005".

With this info, you can see how your compression reading can be low.
To get an accurate reading you have to increase the valve clearance so
the compression release can't lift the valve. Better yet is a leakdown
test.

Give us the model and serial numbers and I can get you specs for your
engine.

Or join the Tecumseh group on Yahoo.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tecums...yguid=34062665

--Andy Asberry--
------Texas------ Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

My model number is HH60 105116H ser 23230.

I am frustrated to the point of almost giving up. I cleaned the carb
twice but I did not take the welch plug out. I am starting to wonder
if it is just that the compression is not adequate. I honed the
cylinder and put new rings on. But I did not use ring expanders under
the 2nd compression ring. When I took the engine apart it did not have
them. I tried to install them but somethign did not seem right, the
piston did not want to go in the bore.

I used all new gaskets, torgued the head in sequence, cleaned
everythign, cleaned and gapped the points, timed the engine at .080
BTDC with a dial indicator. I put so much work into this. I dont want
to give up but I am wondering if I should just buy a new engine.

It seemed to run decent in the video once I got it warmed up. But it
took a battery with a battery charger hooked up and lots of cranking a
fooling around with the choke to get it going.

I feel defeated....

First, a correction: the mechanical compression release raises the
valve 0.050", not 0.005".

I don't have a manual for anything less than a 10 hp. The manual
doesn't give a psi reading for compression. They say to roll the
engine backwards. If it bumps against compression, that is enough to
run. I suspect they use this method rather than try to explain the how
and why of the compression release.

Have you tried cranking with the plug out? Does it spin easier? If so,
that indicates the compression release is not working. (A pin holds
the exhaust valve open until a centrifugal weight pulls it aside.) The
pin can be worn down.

Did you check the end gap of the new rings?

Are there numbers or letters on the carb?

stryped wrote:
Been working on this engine. Took the carb apart as others have said.
Let it soak in mineral spirits and sprayed carb cleaner in passages.
Used can air to blow out passages. Had a heck of a time once I put it
on to get it to start. It seems that once it warmed up, I was able to
get it to finally run without choke after adjusting the carb what
seems to be hundreds of times. It helped that I had a battery charge
connected to my battery. (Once I disconnect the charger it seems to
not want to start).

I have a feeling that after it sits overnight, I wil not be sucessful
getting it started when it is dead cold. Also, it ocassionally
backfires and once made a loud pop out the exhaust.

I was worried maybe it did not have good compression was the reason
for trouble not starting. I did a test. Cranking with the choke closed
I got a reading of 50 psi, choke open 45 psi. Is this normal?

When I did take the carb apart the side adjustment needle with the
spring I noticed the end was flat. I can turn that screw with it
running and it seems to have no effect on the engine. Everything else
seemed ok the best I could tell.

Where can I go from here? It is starting to get frustrating.

Here is a short video of when I had it running. DOes everything "look"
like it is right?

SO do you think my 31380c rod in place of the 34750 rod was a sucess?

Here is a video of when it was warm and running: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h92ZPUMEB3Q

Stryped, have you rebuilt the carb using a kit? I have a Tecumseh on a
chipper-shredder and it begin to run erratically and would do the
popping sound that you mention. This is an afterfire condition where
excess gasoline enters the hot muffler and ignites. I put a new carb
kit in and it ran fine. There was no discernible wear to the parts of
the carb that were replaced.

--
Gary Brady
Austin, TX
www.powdercoatoven.4t.com

"stryped" wrote in message
...
What worries me is the low compression.

I would not worry about 50 PSI compression on this engine. As someone else
pointed out there is a compression release on the exhaust valve so it is
hard to get a real compression reading.
Greg

"stryped" wrote in message
...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

I am now getting 55-60 psi with a fully charged battery. I did
nothing to the valves, assuming that they were ok because it ran fine
until the rod broke last summer. I guess I need to check valve
clearance. I poured some oil down the spark plug hole and it seemed
to increase compression about 5-7 or so psi. Does this mean bore is
worn? Is there anythign I can do if that is the case other than
reboreing? It does not smoke when I can get it to run. Wouldnt it
smoke if the bore was the culprit?

One thing, when re-ringing I did not use the expander behind the 2nd
compression ring. I did this for two reasons, 1. There were no
expanders on the rings I took off the piston when I disassembled it.
2. I tired to put the expander on and soemthign did not feel right.
It was hard to get into the bore even with a ring compressor. Shoudl
I try to install this ring?

I did hone out the cylinder with a rigid hone. Maybe I went too far?
I was careful and slow with it.

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

By the way I did switch direction on that pancake filter and it did
not change much.

Last night I fooled with it some more. It seems once I get it running,
it will run. But if it dies or I kill it, it takes endless cranking
and playing with throttle/choke to get it started, even when warm.

Also, when it died, I tried spray startign fluid in it to restart it.
It had no effect on helping it start.

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

As far as the compression realease, My manual covers other models that
have a contraption on the cam, mine did not have this.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

By the way, to the guy that asked here are the numbers on my carb:
8082L12

stryped fired this volley in news:9a5eaff4-2c3e-
:

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.


Sounds like a float level issue. That, and the fact that adjusting what
sounds like the main jet won't affect the run characteristics.

LLoyd

On Jan 13, 8:21*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:9a5eaff4-2c3e-
:

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

Sounds like a float level issue. *That, and the fact that adjusting what
sounds like the main jet won't affect the run characteristics.

LLoyd

Will this cause the symptoms i am having and caus eit to run once
started but be very difficult to start?

stryped fired this volley in news:f695924a-2115-
:
Will this cause the symptoms i am having and caus eit to run once
started but be very difficult to start?

Ayup. The compression is low, but from the beginning of this latest
update, your symptoms sounded like fuel delivery.

LLoyd

On Jan 13, 9:16*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:f695924a-2115-
: Will this cause the symptoms i am having and caus eit to run once
started but be very difficult to start?

Ayup. *The compression is low, but from the beginning of this latest
update, your symptoms sounded like fuel delivery.

LLoyd

Is there somethign I can do to pinpoint if this is the exact problem?
I am willing to buy a new carb if that fixes it but I want to be sure.
I was going to pull the engine this weekend and check valve clearance.

If it was the carb, when I tried to restart it while warm why would it
not start with startign fluid?

stryped fired this volley in news:79438d95-be3c-
:

If it was the carb, when I tried to restart it while warm why would it
not start with startign fluid?

Soft spark, too?

(sigh...too few skills, so much time to waste)

LLoyd

stryped fired this volley in news:79438d95-
:

If it was the carb, when I tried to restart it while warm why would
it
not start with startign fluid?

BTW... if your fuel level in the bowl is high, it would completely
prevent the motor from starting when hot.

The fact that you had fuel leaking out is a good indication that
either you bent the float tang while messing with it, or that the
needle valve is sticking open, due to dirt or a burr on the seat or
needle face.

Excessively high fuel level in the bowl can actually start leaking
fuel into the bowl vents, acting like a super-rich jet needle setting.

I don't have a clue where the Tecumsah level should be (exactly), but
half to two-thirds full is a great place to start.

LLoyd

On Jan 13, 10:14*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:79438d95-
:



If it was the carb, when I tried to restart it while warm why would
it
not start with startign fluid?

BTW... if your fuel level in the bowl is high, it would completely
prevent the motor from starting when hot.

The fact that you had fuel leaking out is a good indication that
either you bent the float tang while messing with it, or that the
needle valve is sticking open, due to dirt or a burr on the seat or
needle face.

Excessively high fuel level in the bowl can actually start leaking
fuel into the bowl vents, acting like a super-rich jet needle setting.

I don't have a clue where the Tecumsah level should be (exactly), but
half to two-thirds full is a great place to start.

LLoyd

The spark seemed ok on my spark tester.

The thing is I have fooled with this thing over a week. It just last
night started leaking fuel.

It is hard to start when cold and hot.

One last thing I got to thinking, The valve cover hose that goes from
the valve cover to the carb is missing. (It never had one). Would this
cause a low compression reading?

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 12, 9:39Â*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

I am now getting 55-60 psi with a fully charged battery. I did
nothing to the valves, assuming that they were ok because it ran fine
until the rod broke last summer. I guess I need to check valve
clearance. I poured some oil down the spark plug hole and it seemed
to increase compression about 5-7 or so psi. Does this mean bore is
worn? Is there anythign I can do if that is the case other than
reboreing? It does not smoke when I can get it to run. Wouldnt it
smoke if the bore was the culprit?

One thing, when re-ringing I did not use the expander behind the 2nd
compression ring. I did this for two reasons, 1. There were no
expanders on the rings I took off the piston when I disassembled it.
2. I tired to put the expander on and soemthign did not feel right.
It was hard to get into the bore even with a ring compressor. Shoudl
I try to install this ring?

I did hone out the cylinder with a rigid hone. Maybe I went too far?
I was careful and slow with it.

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

By the way I did switch direction on that pancake filter and it did
not change much.

Last night I fooled with it some more. It seems once I get it running,
it will run. But if it dies or I kill it, it takes endless cranking
and playing with throttle/choke to get it started, even when warm.

Also, when it died, I tried spray startign fluid in it to restart it.
It had no effect on helping it start.

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

As far as the compression realease, My manual covers other models that
have a contraption on the cam, mine did not have this.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!


My guess is your carb is bad and you are flooding the engine when
starting - quick-start will not start a flooded low compression
engine. The compression you are getting is not the problem - 99.99%
sure.

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 08:33:02 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 13, 10:14Â*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:79438d95-
:



If it was the carb, when I tried to restart it while warm why would
it
not start with startign fluid?

BTW... if your fuel level in the bowl is high, it would completely
prevent the motor from starting when hot.

The fact that you had fuel leaking out is a good indication that
either you bent the float tang while messing with it, or that the
needle valve is sticking open, due to dirt or a burr on the seat or
needle face.

Excessively high fuel level in the bowl can actually start leaking
fuel into the bowl vents, acting like a super-rich jet needle setting.

I don't have a clue where the Tecumsah level should be (exactly), but
half to two-thirds full is a great place to start.

LLoyd

The spark seemed ok on my spark tester.

The thing is I have fooled with this thing over a week. It just last
night started leaking fuel.

It is hard to start when cold and hot.

One last thing I got to thinking, The valve cover hose that goes from
the valve cover to the carb is missing. (It never had one). Would this
cause a low compression reading?
NO

On Jan 13, 12:18*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

....

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

I am now getting 55-60 psi with a fully charged battery. I did
nothing to the valves, assuming that they were ok because it ran fine
until the rod broke last summer. I guess I need to check valve
clearance. I poured some oil down the spark plug hole and it seemed
to increase compression about 5-7 or so psi. Does this mean bore is
worn? Is there anythign I can do if that is the case other than
reboreing? It does not smoke when I can get it to run. Wouldnt it
smoke if the bore was the culprit?

One thing, when re-ringing I did not use the expander behind the 2nd
compression ring. I did this for two reasons, 1. There were no
expanders on the rings I took off the piston when I disassembled it.
2. I tired to put the expander on and soemthign did not feel right.
It was hard to get into the bore even with a ring compressor. Shoudl
I try to install this ring?

I did hone out the cylinder with a rigid hone. Maybe I went too far?
I was careful and slow with it.

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

By the way I did switch direction on that pancake filter and it did
not change much.

Last night I fooled with it some more. It seems once I get it running,
it will run. But if it dies or I kill it, it takes endless cranking
and playing with throttle/choke to get it started, even when warm.

Also, when it died, I tried spray startign fluid in it to restart it.
It had no effect on helping it start.

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

As far as the compression realease, My manual covers other models that
have a contraption on the cam, mine did not have this.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

My guess is your carb is bad and you are flooding the engine when
starting - quick-start will not start a flooded low compression
engine. The compression you are getting is not the problem - 99.99%
sure.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks. But why would it be hard to start when the engien sits
overnight? Wouldnt there be exhaust smoke if it were flooded?

Why do you think this engine has such low compression after rebuild?

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 10:47:02 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 13, 12:18Â*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39Â*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

I am now getting 55-60 psi with a fully charged battery. I did
nothing to the valves, assuming that they were ok because it ran fine
until the rod broke last summer. I guess I need to check valve
clearance. I poured some oil down the spark plug hole and it seemed
to increase compression about 5-7 or so psi. Does this mean bore is
worn? Is there anythign I can do if that is the case other than
reboreing? It does not smoke when I can get it to run. Wouldnt it
smoke if the bore was the culprit?

One thing, when re-ringing I did not use the expander behind the 2nd
compression ring. I did this for two reasons, 1. There were no
expanders on the rings I took off the piston when I disassembled it.
2. I tired to put the expander on and soemthign did not feel right.
It was hard to get into the bore even with a ring compressor. Shoudl
I try to install this ring?

I did hone out the cylinder with a rigid hone. Maybe I went too far?
I was careful and slow with it.

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

By the way I did switch direction on that pancake filter and it did
not change much.

Last night I fooled with it some more. It seems once I get it running,
it will run. But if it dies or I kill it, it takes endless cranking
and playing with throttle/choke to get it started, even when warm.

Also, when it died, I tried spray startign fluid in it to restart it.
It had no effect on helping it start.

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

As far as the compression realease, My manual covers other models that
have a contraption on the cam, mine did not have this.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

My guess is your carb is bad and you are flooding the engine when
starting - quick-start will not start a flooded low compression
engine. The compression you are getting is not the problem - 99.99%
sure.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks. But why would it be hard to start when the engien sits
overnight? Wouldnt there be exhaust smoke if it were flooded?

Why do you think this engine has such low compression after rebuild?
First of all, you did NOT rebuild the engine. You replaced the rings.
You do not know if the valves are sealing properly. You don't know if
they are adjusted right, You don't know if it has a compression
release.
To properly test compression the engine needs to make at least 4 full
turns at sufficient speed with the choke and throttle BOTH wide open.

If you use the pull starter, does it give a definite jerk as it goes
over-center? If so, the compression is LIKELY OK.

On Jan 13, 1:47*pm, stryped wrote:
On Jan 13, 12:18*pm, wrote:

My guess is your carb is bad and you are flooding the engine when
starting - quick-start will not start a flooded low compression
engine. The compression you are getting is not the problem - 99.99%
sure.
Thanks. But why would it be hard to start when the engien sits
overnight? Wouldnt there be exhaust smoke if it were flooded?

Why do you think this engine has such low compression after rebuild?

5-7 PSI isn't much, and might be only the oil reducing the combustion
chamber volume.

The B&S manual doesn't give compression numbers, it says if you can
start it, compression is OK. My mid-1950's lawnmower's compression is
barely noticeable but it almost always starts on the second pull,
often with last year's gas.

If the float is soldered brass, see if it's filling with gas. That
will cause strange intermittent problems and a carb gas leak. It isn't
easy to tell by shaking it and the gas may not drip out. The leaky
float on my HH55 didn't even bubble under water in a vacuum chamber.
Because of it I paid only $200 for a log splitter with a brand-new
(defective) engine.

Jim Wilkins

stryped fired this volley in news:302a1d47-e137-
:
One last thing I got to thinking, The valve cover hose that goes from
the valve cover to the carb is missing. (It never had one). Would this
cause a low compression reading?

No, but it could cause a problem with atomization of the fuel.

Think "vacuum leak" on a carbureted car.

No... don't.

LLoyd

stryped fired this volley in news:5b8d0d21-6cf9-
:

Why do you think this engine has such low compression after rebuild?


Because you did it wrong? (nah...)

LLoyd

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message


Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

On Jan 13, 11:25*pm, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.



I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . *That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!

On Jan 13, 4:51*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 10:47:02 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
On Jan 13, 12:18*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

...

Oh, I dont think mine had compression release and I left the valves as
is. (Other than cleaning the tops of them.). Also have a new head
gasket.

Pretty much all small engines have some sort of compression release.. Some as
odd ball as a slight ramp machined in the exhaust lobe that always pops the
exhaust valve slightly, (seems not to bother at higher RPM), to a actual
mechanical release that drops out when the engine comes up to idle speed.
Greg

I am now getting 55-60 psi with a fully charged battery. I did
nothing to the valves, assuming that they were ok because it ran fine
until the rod broke last summer. I guess I need to check valve
clearance. I poured some oil down the spark plug hole and it seemed
to increase compression about 5-7 or so psi. Does this mean bore is
worn? Is there anythign I can do if that is the case other than
reboreing? It does not smoke when I can get it to run. Wouldnt it
smoke if the bore was the culprit?

One thing, when re-ringing I did not use the expander behind the 2nd
compression ring. I did this for two reasons, 1. There were no
expanders on the rings I took off the piston when I disassembled it.
2. I tired to put the expander on and soemthign did not feel right.
It was hard to get into the bore even with a ring compressor. Shoudl
I try to install this ring?

I did hone out the cylinder with a rigid hone. Maybe I went too far?
I was careful and slow with it.

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

By the way I did switch direction on that pancake filter and it did
not change much.

Last night I fooled with it some more. It seems once I get it running,
it will run. But if it dies or I kill it, it takes endless cranking
and playing with throttle/choke to get it started, even when warm.

Also, when it died, I tried spray startign fluid in it to restart it.
It had no effect on helping it start.

At the end of the night, gas started leakign from somewhere on the
carb and disgusted I took of the line and went in for the night.

As far as the compression realease, My manual covers other models that
have a contraption on the cam, mine did not have this.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

My guess is your carb is bad and you are flooding the engine when
starting - quick-start will not start a flooded low compression
engine. The compression you are getting is not the problem - 99.99%
sure.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks. But why would it be hard to start when the engien sits
overnight? Wouldnt there be exhaust smoke if it were flooded?

Why do you think this engine has such low compression after rebuild?

*First of all, you did NOT rebuild the engine. You replaced the rings.
You do not know if the valves are sealing properly. You don't know if
they are adjusted right, You don't know if it has a compression
release.
To properly test compression the engine needs to make at least 4 full
turns at sufficient speed with the choke and throttle BOTH wide open.

If you use the pull starter, does it give a definite jerk as it goes
over-center? If so, the compression is LIKELY OK.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not quite sure what you mean "over center" I have been mostly using
the electic starter, I will say when I first assembled the engine, it
started with the ropw starter on about the 3rd pull but I had to work
the choke to get it running. Since then very hard to start if at all
with the rope.

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 23:25:11 -0600, the infamous Andy Asberry
scrawled the following:

On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 12, 9:39*pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message


Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Does anyone make adapters for small incremental shifts in shaft size
such as this?

--
A great preservative against angry and mutinous thoughts, and all
impatience and quarreling, is to have some great business and
interest in your mind, which, like a sponge shall suck up your
attention and keep you from brooding over what displeases you.
-- Joseph Rickaby

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009 05:50:05 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 13, 11:25=A0pm, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39=A0pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.



I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . =A0That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!
Since you are going to lap the valves I have a suggestion. Instead of
buying a valve lapping tool just clean the valve heads well and super
glue the heads together. Apply grinding compound to one valve face and
insert into the engine. Now rotate the valve stem sticking up between
the palms of your hands back and forth while exerting a little downn
pressure. You wil need to lift the valve up a little no and then to
let the grinding compound get between the valve and seat. Try the fine
compound first and see if it's enough. You just want to seat the
valves, not change the valve grind angles. The ground area will be
visible as a mat finish. Tapping the valves on a hard surface will
usually break the glue bond. Heat (don't breath the fumes!) will also
cause the super glue to let go.
ERS

On Jan 14, 11:31*am, wrote:
On Wed, 14 Jan 2009 05:50:05 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
On Jan 13, 11:25=A0pm, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39=A0pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . =A0That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!

Since you are going to lap the valves I have a suggestion. Instead of
buying a valve lapping tool just clean the valve heads well and super
glue the heads together. Apply grinding compound to one valve face and
insert into the engine. Now rotate the valve stem sticking up between
the palms of your hands back and forth while exerting a little downn
pressure. You wil need to lift the valve up a little no and then to
let the grinding compound get between the valve and seat. Try the fine
compound first and see if it's enough. You just want to seat the
valves, not change the valve grind angles. The ground area will be
visible as a mat finish. Tapping the valves on a hard surface will
usually break the glue bond. Heat (don't breath the fumes!) will also
cause the super glue to let go.
ERS- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is a dumb question, but does the head have to be on to take a
stem to lifter measurement? If I need to grind some of the valve to
increase gap, do I have to remove the valve? What do I grind it with?

I would be willing to bet that it does have a compression release.
Page 84 of the manual you posted describes 3 different compression
release mechanisms. One is "mechanical" but the other two are just "bumps"
ground into the exhaust lobe of the camshaft.
The cams for almost every HH60 listed in the parts breakdowns at M&D say
"Camshaft (Compression release) or "Camshaft (Mechanical compression
release" ": http://www.m-and-d.com/pdfs/Tecumseh/HH60-105096E.pdf
The few that I saw that don't specifically say "Compression release" all
use #33156 camshaft which is also listed as "Camshaft (Compression release)"
he http://www.m-and-d.com/pdfs/Tecumseh/HH60-105064D.pdf
The parts lists are here if you know your specific model HH60:
http://www.m-and-d.com/Tecumseh_parts.html


"stryped" wrote in message
...
On Jan 13, 11:25 pm, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39 pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.



I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!

On Wed, 14 Jan 2009 10:49:51 -0800 (PST), stryped
wrote:

On Jan 14, 11:31=A0am, wrote:
On Wed, 14 Jan 2009 05:50:05 -0800 (PST), stryped





wrote:
On Jan 13, 11:25=3DA0pm, Andy Asberry wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39=3DA0pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . =3DA0That 6.5 h=
p at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!

Since you are going to lap the valves I have a suggestion. Instead of
buying a valve lapping tool just clean the valve heads well and super
glue the heads together. Apply grinding compound to one valve face and
insert into the engine. Now rotate the valve stem sticking up between
the palms of your hands back and forth while exerting a little downn
pressure. You wil need to lift the valve up a little no and then to
let the grinding compound get between the valve and seat. Try the fine
compound first and see if it's enough. You just want to seat the
valves, not change the valve grind angles. The ground area will be
visible as a mat finish. Tapping the valves on a hard surface will
usually break the glue bond. Heat (don't breath the fumes!) will also
cause the super glue to let go.
ERS- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is a dumb question, but does the head have to be on to take a
stem to lifter measurement? If I need to grind some of the valve to
increase gap, do I have to remove the valve? What do I grind it with?
No, the head can be on to measure the valve to lifter gap. Be sure the
engine is on the compression stroke when measuring. If the clearance
is too small then you will need to remove the head and valve and then
grind the end of the valve stem. I'm still betting you have issues
with the carb. Can you go to the place where you bought your other
parts and borrow a used carb?
ERS

On Jan 14, 12:51*pm, "David Courtney" wrote:
* * I would be willing to bet that it does have a compression release..
* * Page 84 of the manual you posted describes 3 different compression
release mechanisms. *One is "mechanical" but the other two are just "bumps"
ground into the exhaust lobe of the camshaft.
* * The cams for almost every HH60 listed in the parts breakdowns at M&D say
"Camshaft (Compression release) or "Camshaft (Mechanical compression
release" ":http://www.m-and-d.com/pdfs/Tecumseh/HH60-105096E.pdf
* * The few that I saw that don't specifically say "Compression release" all
use #33156 camshaft which is also listed as "Camshaft (Compression release)"
hehttp://www.m-and-d.com/pdfs/Tecumseh/HH60-105064D.pdf
* * The parts lists are here if you know your specific model HH60:http://www.m-and-d.com/Tecumseh_parts.html

"stryped" wrote in message

...
On Jan 13, 11:25 pm, Andy Asberry wrote:





On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:02:19 -0800 (PST), stryped

wrote:
On Jan 12, 9:39 pm, "Greg O" wrote:
"stryped" wrote in message

Also, I mixed up the lifters as they fell out before I could figure
out which one went with which lifter. They have no itendifiable
marking on them.

If you got those in the wrong hole, the valves are NOT adjusted.

I appreciate your help. This is my first rebuild and I want it to be
a sucess but I am tempted to go down to the harbor freight store and
buy that 6 horse engine for 160 bucks!

Check your engine shaft diameter. I think it is 7/8" . That 6.5 hp at
harbor Freight has a 3/4.

Ok, cut me a little slack, like I said this is my first rebuild. I was
very careful in everythign I did, I bought a manual, I cleaned
everythign meticulously. And I was tryign to be nice when I said "I
dont think this has a compression release". I am rewording that now
to, "This does not have a compression release."

I was careful to hone and try to get an appropriate cross hatch
pattern. I cleaned the points, gapped to .020. Bought a new plug with
the numbers in the manual. Gapped to .030. Brought piston to TDS on
the compression stroke and backed down then back up to reach .080 to
BTDC. Then using a continuity meter rotated the stator plate untill
the points just gap.

My mistake and part of the my learnign process was my lack of
knowledge about valves. I assumed, because last year it ran well that
they were ok. Upon asking all my "questions" I learned I should have
checked the gap between the lifter and top of the valve stem. So, I am
going to take the engine off this weekend and the head off, rotate
again to TDC with a dial indicator and check gap. (After first lapping
the valves after buying a valve lapper and compound).

Guys I am just tryign to learn here. This is a hobby of mine I want to
get better at.

1. Can anyone tell me if this is a compression problem why it will
run, just not start well?

2. If the valves are off spec, how much compression can I gain by
fixing that?

3. Can anyone tell me if I should try to re-install a expander behind
the 2nd compression ring while I have it off? The manual is not clear
that I remember and just said somethign about "using them if called
for"

Here is an online copy of my manual if anyone sees anythign I missed:http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

Thanks you to all that have helped!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

My part number is : Hh60 105116H

It is possible but bothe camshaft lobes looked identical with no bump
that I remember.