What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want to
use it.

that is polybutylene

"habbi" wrote in message
...
What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want
to
use it.

"habbi" wrote in message
...
that is polybutylene

"habbi" wrote in message
...
What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want
to
use it.
Are you sure it's not polyethylene? Polybutylene is usually grey, PEX
whitish or brightly colored.

Schedule-40 PVC is adequate for shop air, so long as the pipes are either
buried, or far enough away from human contact so that bursting wouldn't
endanger anyone.

LLoyd

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 12:54:35 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
"habbi" quickly quoth:

that is polybutylene

"habbi" wrote in message
...
What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want
to
use it.

100psi. g Bury it housed in PVC pipe so you can replace it easily
when it bursts on you.

--
"Most Folks Are As Happy As They Make Up Their Minds To Be"
-Abraham Lincoln
-----------------------------------------------------------
www.diversify.com - Happy Website Development

A couple of thoughts, but not an answer to your question.

One is that plastic strength depends a lot on temperature. The part
that is buried is less likely to burst that the bits that are exposed.
So you might want to use stronger pipe where it would be exposed.

Also I think that plastic pipe tends to age and become more brittle
with age. I am not sure that being pressurized accelerates the aging,
but it might. So if you don't need an air line between your house and
shop all the time, I would put in a ball valve so the pipe is
pressurized only when needed.

If you have a lot of it, you might bury two runs so if one bursts, you
already have another run buried. And if that happens, consider adding
a regulator to keep the pressure lower the second time. Also think
about what else you might want to run at the same time. Telephone
line?

Dan

In article ,
"habbi" wrote:

What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want to
use it.



I used that stuff for some outdoor water faucets in the garden. All of
it eventually failed (split) at the barb connections. I only run 40 psi
water pressure.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 20:37:59 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"habbi" wrote:

What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want to
use it.



I used that stuff for some outdoor water faucets in the garden. All of
it eventually failed (split) at the barb connections. I only run 40 psi
water pressure.

Actually it depends on which stuff he has. The newer poly pipes are
very good especially if he's got gas service rated. It's about all the
gas companies are putting in the ground now days.

Wayne Cook
Shamrock, TX
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/index.htm

Habbi, a better choice would be to use inexpensive copper water pipe,

Then too, that's just my opinion.

Harry C.

How far is the house from the shop? Might want something larger than
1/2".

dennis
in nca

Sorry, but Sched. 40 PVC IS NOT NOW OR HAS EVER BEEN RATED FOR GASEOUS
USAGE... Read the friggin spec before you spout off that it is
acceptable for usage in air service. PVC an CPVC are rated for
INCOMPRESSIBLE FLUID SERVICE ONLY. The pressure value thatis printed
on the side fo the pipe that you are lookig at is ONLY FOR WATER. Take
the time to use the pressure burst calculations for gaseous usage and
plug in the allowable stress for PVC and it will tell you differently.
If you run the calculations you will find that 1/2" PVC can SAFELY
carry something around 4...YES FOUR PSI.

There are plastic pipe materials that are rated for gaseous usage, but
PVC and CPVC are not and anyone that uses them for air service has
basically installed a hair triggered bomb in their shop. When it goes,
and it's not a question of will it go, but when it goes, it will do so
violently and with all sorts of shrapnel that can do significant
damage.

Do yourself a favor and Google the subject before you decide to plant a
bomb in your shop. If you go ahead and use PVC, tell us where your shop
is so that we can aviod coming anywhere close to it.

Craig C.

"Wayne Cook" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 20:37:59 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"habbi" wrote:

What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi. I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I want
to
use it.



I used that stuff for some outdoor water faucets in the garden. All of
it eventually failed (split) at the barb connections. I only run 40 psi
water pressure.

Actually it depends on which stuff he has. The newer poly pipes are
very good especially if he's got gas service rated. It's about all the
gas companies are putting in the ground now days.

Wayne Cook
Shamrock, TX

That would be HDPE, high density polyethylene, also used for the jacket on
direct bury primary cable.

On 3 Oct 2005 07:00:33 -0700, "
wrote:

A couple of thoughts, but not an answer to your question.

One is that plastic strength depends a lot on temperature. The part
that is buried is less likely to burst that the bits that are exposed.
So you might want to use stronger pipe where it would be exposed.

Also I think that plastic pipe tends to age and become more brittle
with age. I am not sure that being pressurized accelerates the aging,
but it might. So if you don't need an air line between your house and
shop all the time, I would put in a ball valve so the pipe is
pressurized only when needed.

If you have a lot of it, you might bury two runs so if one bursts, you
already have another run buried. And if that happens, consider adding
a regulator to keep the pressure lower the second time. Also think
about what else you might want to run at the same time. Telephone
line?

Dan
I just finished replacing the gray plastic supply tubes on the main
bathroom sink after about 20 years. I originally installed them
because of their flexibility (~2" radius) allowed for the builder's
latitude in cabinetry. The cold line developed three lateral cracks,
and being in a concealed location, the leak wasn't noticed for a
couple days, so I have quite a mess downstairs, hopefully the carpet
will dry. My point being, I don't trust bent plastic any longer.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On 3 Oct 2005 17:43:17 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
quickly quoth:


Sorry, but Sched. 40 PVC IS NOT NOW OR HAS EVER BEEN RATED FOR GASEOUS
USAGE... Read the friggin spec before you spout off that it is
acceptable for usage in air service. PVC an CPVC are rated for
INCOMPRESSIBLE FLUID SERVICE ONLY. The pressure value thatis printed
on the side fo the pipe that you are lookig at is ONLY FOR WATER. Take
the time to use the pressure burst calculations for gaseous usage and
plug in the allowable stress for PVC and it will tell you differently.
If you run the calculations you will find that 1/2" PVC can SAFELY
carry something around 4...YES FOUR PSI.

I's tremblin', I is.


There are plastic pipe materials that are rated for gaseous usage, but
PVC and CPVC are not and anyone that uses them for air service has
basically installed a hair triggered bomb in their shop. When it goes,
and it's not a question of will it go, but when it goes, it will do so
violently and with all sorts of shrapnel that can do significant
damage.

Methinks you've taken this a wee bit OVERBOARD, C. Man, I'll bet you
even ground your PVC dust collector lines, don't you? titter


Do yourself a favor and Google the subject before you decide to plant a
bomb in your shop. If you go ahead and use PVC, tell us where your shop
is so that we can aviod coming anywhere close to it.

Wuss! I worked around it for several years with no mishaps. Flynn's
new body shop was built with 1.5" PVC pipe for air and had 25cfm going
through it for most of the day. A few times, guys caught their hose
on the cars they were backing out. The end of the pipe broke off with
the air hose attached. Nobody ever got hit by any shrapnel nor were
pieces found at the end of the day when they swept up. It was DAMNED
noisy, though. g

That said, I wouldn't plumb the shop with PVC now that I've seen the
OSHA letters where the Plastic Pipe Industry recommends against it,
but everyone should remember to wear goggles ALWAYS when using the air
hose, but that's mainly from blown debris. (It's awfully hard to do
good woodworking with only one eye.)

Read this and relax a bit, eh?
http://www.osha.gov/dts/hib/hib_data/hib19880520.html


P.S: Do I translate "cvairwerks" to "Corvair Works" properly? I had
a couple '62 convertibles and adored the little beasties. I took one
on flying jumps with my dirt-bike-riding friends.

--
"Most Folks Are As Happy As They Make Up Their Minds To Be"
-Abraham Lincoln
-----------------------------------------------------------
www.diversify.com - Happy Website Development

Larry Jaques wrote:
On 3 Oct 2005 17:43:17 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
quickly quoth:

lots snipped here and there....


There are plastic pipe materials that are rated for gaseous usage, but
PVC and CPVC are not and anyone that uses them for air service has
basically installed a hair triggered bomb in their shop. When it goes,
and it's not a question of will it go, but when it goes, it will do so
violently and with all sorts of shrapnel that can do significant
damage.

Methinks you've taken this a wee bit OVERBOARD, C. Man, I'll bet you
even ground your PVC dust collector lines, don't you? titter

Don't have a dust collector system and if I did it wouldn't be in PVC
anyway. I get a little freaky over this subjuct because since the last
big discussion on this I had to take a fellow employee to the hospital
for over 50 stiches to his face when a 1" PVC air line with less than
30 psig on it exploded in his face. The shop owner was like you and poo
pooed the safety problem with air and PVC. By the time we got back from
the hospital, the entire PVC air system had been torn out of the shop
and a temp system with tons of hoses and pigs had been set up. I left
the company before the OSHA fine came down, but I know it wsa pretty
hefty.

I get a little anal about certain safety controlled items. Where I
work, even a minute mistake with the work procedures can at minimum
cause huge hazmat cleanup bills all the way to killing numerous people.
I've still got all my body parts and they all work and there are very
few extral holes in me that shouldn't be there and I intend on keeping
it that way for another few decades.


Don't have anyting to do with Corvairs...neat cars, but I play
airplanes for a hobby and a living. The cv comes from my first name and
my wife's.

Craig C.

Screen name has nothing to do with

On 4 Oct 2005 11:37:19 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
quickly quoth:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On 3 Oct 2005 17:43:17 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
quickly quoth:

lots snipped here and there....


There are plastic pipe materials that are rated for gaseous usage, but
PVC and CPVC are not and anyone that uses them for air service has
basically installed a hair triggered bomb in their shop. When it goes,
and it's not a question of will it go, but when it goes, it will do so
violently and with all sorts of shrapnel that can do significant
damage.

Methinks you've taken this a wee bit OVERBOARD, C. Man, I'll bet you
even ground your PVC dust collector lines, don't you? titter

Don't have a dust collector system and if I did it wouldn't be in PVC

(Sorry, I thought this message was over on the Wreck.) mea culpa


anyway. I get a little freaky over this subjuct because since the last
big discussion on this I had to take a fellow employee to the hospital
for over 50 stiches to his face when a 1" PVC air line with less than
30 psig on it exploded in his face. The shop owner was like you and poo
pooed the safety problem with air and PVC. By the time we got back from
the hospital, the entire PVC air system had been torn out of the shop
and a temp system with tons of hoses and pigs had been set up. I left
the company before the OSHA fine came down, but I know it wsa pretty
hefty.

So it was -5° in the building and he smacked it with a big WHAT?


Condolences to your friend. That couldn't have been any fun. You're
the first person I've ever talked to who has experienced anything
negative with pvc air lines. But like I said, I wouldn't do it again.
We all survived numerous breaks with no flak whatsoever, and that was
at 125psig.


I get a little anal about certain safety controlled items. Where I
work, even a minute mistake with the work procedures can at minimum
cause huge hazmat cleanup bills all the way to killing numerous people.
I've still got all my body parts and they all work and there are very
few extral holes in me that shouldn't be there and I intend on keeping
it that way for another few decades.

Yeah, I don't blame you, especially at a lethal workplace like that.


Don't have anyting to do with Corvairs...neat cars, but I play
airplanes for a hobby and a living. The cv comes from my first name and
my wife's.

Gotcha. Ever fly a Corsair? They look like a lot of fun. After I
finished the Basic Aviation course in high school, Dad (retired USAF
pilot) let me take off in the rented Cherokee C, fly it from
Oceanside, CA to Catalina Island and back, then line it up for
landing. He took the controls then but I (at the ripe old age of 17)
was sure I could have landed her safely.


--------------------------------------------------------
Murphy was an Optimist
----------------------------
http://diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development

The black poly pipe used for gas service is polyethylene, and it usually
handles less than 100 PSI. Polybutylene is crap, and it cost the
original manufacturers $hundreds of millions to settle lawsuits as it
failed in water service lines all over the country. It is initially very
strong and flexible, but with age it loses strength and develops stress
cracks. Go ahead and use PB if you like the idea of digging trenches and
re plumbing everything in a couple of years.

As others have mentioned, using rigid plastic pipes for air service is a
really, really dumb idea born from desperation or ignorance. Spend a
couple of bucks more and use metal tubing.

Actually it must be polyethylene, it is black with a blue strip and rated
for 100psi, I have seen gold stripe which is rated for 160psi I think. It
comes in rolls and is quite flexible. Anyway I also saw this on one of the
websites for other uses and I read somewhere else that the burst strength is
usually 3 times the working pressure.
"Transportation of Natural/Coal/Gobar gas " I will try it and if it goes
bang so what.



"ATP*" wrote in message ...

"Wayne Cook" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 20:37:59 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"habbi" wrote:

What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for 100psi.
I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so
it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I
want
to
use it.



I used that stuff for some outdoor water faucets in the garden. All of
it eventually failed (split) at the barb connections. I only run 40 psi
water pressure.

Actually it depends on which stuff he has. The newer poly pipes are
very good especially if he's got gas service rated. It's about all the
gas companies are putting in the ground now days.

Wayne Cook
Shamrock, TX

That would be HDPE, high density polyethylene, also used for the jacket on
direct bury primary cable.

"habbi" wrote in message
...
Actually it must be polyethylene, it is black with a blue strip and rated
for 100psi, I have seen gold stripe which is rated for 160psi I think. It
comes in rolls and is quite flexible. Anyway I also saw this on one of the
websites for other uses and I read somewhere else that the burst strength
is
usually 3 times the working pressure.
"Transportation of Natural/Coal/Gobar gas " I will try it and if it goes
bang so what.

Only High Density Poly is good for natural gas. All of the HDPE I've seen
used in New York is yellow. High pressure services here are around 60 psi,
AFAIK from conversations with the gas utility. It is fairly thick walled and
not quite as flexible as the type you are talking about, which sounds like
the stuff we use to install sprinkler systems.

"ATP*" wrote in message
...

"Wayne Cook" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 20:37:59 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"habbi" wrote:

What is the burst pressure of 1/2" black poly tubing rated for
100psi.
I
want to bury it as an air line between my house and work building so
it
will
have up to 125 psi in it. I have a lot of it for free that is why I
want
to
use it.



I used that stuff for some outdoor water faucets in the garden. All of
it eventually failed (split) at the barb connections. I only run 40
psi
water pressure.

Actually it depends on which stuff he has. The newer poly pipes are
very good especially if he's got gas service rated. It's about all the
gas companies are putting in the ground now days.

Wayne Cook
Shamrock, TX

That would be HDPE, high density polyethylene, also used for the jacket
on
direct bury primary cable.

In article ,
says...

"habbi" wrote in message
...
Actually it must be polyethylene, it is black with a blue strip and rated
for 100psi, I have seen gold stripe which is rated for 160psi I think. It
comes in rolls and is quite flexible. Anyway I also saw this on one of the
websites for other uses and I read somewhere else that the burst strength
is
usually 3 times the working pressure.
"Transportation of Natural/Coal/Gobar gas " I will try it and if it goes
bang so what.

Only High Density Poly is good for natural gas. All of the HDPE I've seen
used in New York is yellow. High pressure services here are around 60 psi,
AFAIK from conversations with the gas utility. It is fairly thick walled and
not quite as flexible as the type you are talking about, which sounds like
the stuff we use to install sprinkler systems.

The black stuff is also available in higher pressure
ratings and is often used in drilled wells with submersible
pumps. I think the pump in our well hangs down about 250
feet on 1" 200 PSI black PE, which means it's been subject
to about 150 PSI continuously for almost 20 yrs. Smaller
polyethylene tubing, up to about 1/2" OD, is common in
industrial pneumatic controls.

I wouldn't hesitate to use the higher rated polyethylene
for a buried air line. I'd keep the transition to the
indoor piping in a protected, but accessible, location.

Ned Simmons

On Wed, 05 Oct 2005 23:47:37 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
"habbi" quickly quoth:

Actually it must be polyethylene, it is black with a blue strip and rated
for 100psi, I have seen gold stripe which is rated for 160psi I think. It

Call your local irrigation supply store and ask them to look it up.
Most stock tens of thousands of feet of it and know all about it.

BUT, since it's chewable by gophers, I'd put in galvanized line (or
wrapped black iron piping) and forget about it...unless you _like_
trenching every year or two. If you want to use that hose, hang it,
don't bury it. Or perhaps bury it encloded in PVC pipe to keep the
gophers away?


--------------------------------------------------------
Murphy was an Optimist
----------------------------
http://diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
BUT, since it's chewable by gophers, I'd put in galvanized line (or
wrapped black iron piping) and forget about it...unless you _like_
trenching every year or two. If you want to use that hose, hang it,
don't bury it. Or perhaps bury it encloded in PVC pipe to keep the
gophers away?

Gophers or moles? I am probably mistaken, but thought that gophers dug
primarily to build nests (dens, whatever). Moles, on the other hand, dig in
pursuit of food, and chew through almost anything in their paths.

Around here, it's a problem (moles & underground wires, etc), so we bury
everything at least 12" deep, and that solves it. Moles only work near the
surface.

LLoyd

According to Lloyd E. Sponenburgh :

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
BUT, since it's chewable by gophers, I'd put in galvanized line (or
wrapped black iron piping) and forget about it...unless you _like_
trenching every year or two.

[ ... ]

Gophers or moles? I am probably mistaken, but thought that gophers dug
primarily to build nests (dens, whatever). Moles, on the other hand, dig in
pursuit of food, and chew through almost anything in their paths.

Hmm ... How far would 100+ PSI shoot a mole back its hole before
it burst the hole through to the top of the ground? :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 7 Oct 2005 02:51:30 GMT, (DoN. Nichols) wrote:

According to Lloyd E. Sponenburgh :

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
BUT, since it's chewable by gophers, I'd put in galvanized line (or
wrapped black iron piping) and forget about it...unless you _like_
trenching every year or two.

[ ... ]

Gophers or moles? I am probably mistaken, but thought that gophers dug
primarily to build nests (dens, whatever). Moles, on the other hand, dig in
pursuit of food, and chew through almost anything in their paths.

Hmm ... How far would 100+ PSI shoot a mole back its hole before
it burst the hole through to the top of the ground? :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.
I can see the headline "Mole visits space station"
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 15:56:00 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Lloyd
E. Sponenburgh" quickly quoth:


"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
BUT, since it's chewable by gophers, I'd put in galvanized line (or
wrapped black iron piping) and forget about it...unless you _like_
trenching every year or two. If you want to use that hose, hang it,
don't bury it. Or perhaps bury it encloded in PVC pipe to keep the
gophers away?

Gophers or moles?

Yes. g


I am probably mistaken, but thought that gophers dug
primarily to build nests (dens, whatever). Moles, on the other hand, dig in
pursuit of food, and chew through almost anything in their paths.

Whatever. I meant "underground chewing critters of all types".


Around here, it's a problem (moles & underground wires, etc), so we bury
everything at least 12" deep, and that solves it. Moles only work near the
surface.

So, do you run the verticals in pipe?


--
Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life.
---- --Unknown

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
Around here, it's a problem (moles & underground wires, etc), so we bury
everything at least 12" deep, and that solves it. Moles only work near
the
surface.

So, do you run the verticals in pipe?

Yep, but Sch-80 PVC seems to fare well.

LLoyd