We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall, and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience" of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com

"Jeffrey J. Kosowsky" wrote in message
...
We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

R.H.Campbell wrote:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best
to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall,
and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience" of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com

"Jeffrey J. Kosowsky" wrote in message
...
We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

--
Joseph E. Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math

Jeffrey J. Kosowsky wrote:
We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

I have a friend who remodeled and moved the telco demarc inside his garage,
leaving the old one sitting outside (unprotected, as you noted). A few
months later his phone went out, and he called the telephone company for
repair. The telco tech showed up and worked outside for a while, then
finally came to the door and asked "how long has your telephone been out of
service?". The tech had been testing the circuit up to the old
demarc...never thinking that the circuit might have been moved inside.

If it is good enough to fool Bell South, it should be good enough to fool
the thieves.

The phone co raised mine up 15ft for free and made a new high entrance.

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


I'm dealing with the same issues right now, and am still having trouble with
"hardened" or secure phone lines. There will be a weakness somewhere,
whether it is at the entry point to your house or somewhere else between
your house and the phone company. If you're a thorough theif, I assume
you'd find and get into the green access box for the area and kill the line
there. That way, you don't even have to worry about what you encounter at
the premise itself.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Brian.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 18:56:09 -0800, "Brian"
wrote:


It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


I'm dealing with the same issues right now, and am still having trouble with
"hardened" or secure phone lines. There will be a weakness somewhere,
whether it is at the entry point to your house or somewhere else between
your house and the phone company. If you're a thorough theif, I assume
you'd find and get into the green access box for the area and kill the line
there. That way, you don't even have to worry about what you encounter at
the premise itself.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Brian.

Don't these alarms have some sort of backup
system in place. I always assumed if the line
was cut or disconnnected they called a friend or neighbor
to investigate. Something of that nature. My buddy
had his set up so that it also rang his cell phone
if anything suspicious was going on.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 18:56:09 -0800, "Brian"
wrote:


It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


I'm dealing with the same issues right now, and am still having trouble with
"hardened" or secure phone lines. There will be a weakness somewhere,
whether it is at the entry point to your house or somewhere else between
your house and the phone company. If you're a thorough theif, I assume
you'd find and get into the green access box for the area and kill the line
there. That way, you don't even have to worry about what you encounter at
the premise itself.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Brian.

Don't these alarms have some sort of backup
system in place. I always assumed if the line
was cut or disconnnected they called a friend or neighbor
to investigate. Something of that nature. My buddy
had his set up so that it also rang his cell phone
if anything suspicious was going on.

Sir, no, not paranoid; just not being totally realistic given the nature of
residential burglary.

If you were dealing with a commercial warehouse situation containing
hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of valuables, then I might be
inclined to think as you do. However, the average house thief is one step up
from an ant in intelligence and resourcefulness, and is far from a
professional looking for a big commercial score. You give the average house
burglar far too much credit ! He is far more likely to just kick in the weak
strike of your front door, alarm or not, grab what he can, and run like
hell. The alarm only means he might pass you by, or at the very most, spend
less time in the home given that authorities could well be arriving shortly.

Again, nothing in security is absolute ! However, with all of these things,
you are playing the odds ! And if you harden ALL the entrance areas of your
home (and not just the phone line), you are far less likely to be the victim
of a robbery. These idiots are lazy and stupid, and are looking for a way
into anyone's home, not specifically yours. After all, they can find the
same things in just about any house along the street, so why would they
spend time breaking into your home if it's more difficult to get in to at
the onset, and there is a chance of discovery vis a vis a monitored alarm
after that. In most cases, they'll simply move along and look for "easier
pick'ins".....

Move the demarc block inside, or do what the other gentleman suggested, then
stop worrying about that part of the defence system. Spend time and money on
hardening the locks and strikes of your main doors against kickin, secure
your patio door properly, harden your basement and other low lying windows
against easy entry, and that will do far more to keep the thugs out than
unduly worrying about the phone line at locations away from the house (in my
experience and opinion)

Simply walk around your house and see how you would enter if you were a
young burglar looking for an easy score ! You'll probably guess correctly !
Then do something about it right away. Remember, your alarm system is NOT
your first line of defence; it's your second line, and your backup, if they
get past your first line of defence - the physical perimeter of your house !

In the old days, they didn't put moats and walls around castle communities
for nothing....

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com


"Brian" wrote in message
...

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they
have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


I'm dealing with the same issues right now, and am still having trouble
with
"hardened" or secure phone lines. There will be a weakness somewhere,
whether it is at the entry point to your house or somewhere else between
your house and the phone company. If you're a thorough theif, I assume
you'd find and get into the green access box for the area and kill the
line
there. That way, you don't even have to worry about what you encounter at
the premise itself.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Brian.

"R.H.Campbell" writes:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall, and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience" of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com


Perhaps I have misunderstood your answer, but the problem is that the
wire comes in from above -- i.e my concern is the "drop" from where
the line reaches my house at about 15 ft off the ground and then drops
to the level of the basement. My question is about hardening this run
by encasing it in conduit.

Remounting the network interface device internally won't help because
an exposed wire still runs down the side of the house.

"Joseph Meehan" writes:

R.H.Campbell wrote:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best
to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall,
and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience" of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.

Not sure what underground has to do with it. The real problem in my
mind is not the location of the box but the fact that a clearly
exposed wire runs down the side of the house from the telephone cable
above to the place where the wire enters the basement (independent of
whether the network interface device is inside or outside). Does that
makes any sense?




R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com

Yes, I see that on a lot of older homes. I don't have a proper answer to
give you, nor a good way to actually harden the line in that situation. My
only suggestion would be to reroute the cable into the house higher up at
the second floor, but then you have the added difficulty of going from the
upper floor to the basement inside the home.

Perhaps your best bet would be to consider one of the wireless backup
communication solutions...

RHC

"Jeffrey J. Kosowsky" wrote in message
...
"Joseph Meehan" writes:

R.H.Campbell wrote:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be
best
to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement
wall,
and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local
loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience"
of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they
have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.

Not sure what underground has to do with it. The real problem in my
mind is not the location of the box but the fact that a clearly
exposed wire runs down the side of the house from the telephone cable
above to the place where the wire enters the basement (independent of
whether the network interface device is inside or outside). Does that
makes any sense?




R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com

ender (Jeffrey J. Kosowsky) writes:

]"R.H.Campbell" writes:
] Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best to
] dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall, and
] remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
] inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
] from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience" of
] being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......
]
] R.H.Campbell
] Home Security Metal Products
] Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
] www.homemetal.com
]

]Perhaps I have misunderstood your answer, but the problem is that the
]wire comes in from above -- i.e my concern is the "drop" from where
]the line reaches my house at about 15 ft off the ground and then drops
]to the level of the basement. My question is about hardening this run
]by encasing it in conduit.

]Remounting the network interface device internally won't help because
]an exposed wire still runs down the side of the house.

Well, you could have the line go into the house right at the strain relief
attachment to the house. However, the perp with a long pole tree trimmer
could probably still cut it. A cell phone hookup is another possibility,
until they come in with a jammer.

This subject comes up from time to time. The following is culled from
earlier posts I made in reply to similar questions.

You can "harden" the line by enclosing it in galvanized, threaded pipe from
a point that is difficult to reach if it's an aerial drop or from a cement
pad if it's an "underground aerial" (strange, but that's what many telco's
call
a buried drop). The DIYer (or technician) can install some means of backup
such as a cellular or control channel transmitter or even long range radio.

Another possibility (one which is significantly less expensive) is to harden
the phone line. This is done either by moving the incoming line and the
telco "demarc" (gray box on the side of the house) inside or protecting it
with a heavy metal enclosure. C&C Products makes a fairly secure, tampered
enclosure called VoiceLok for this purpose. Here's a link (my website) to
the VoiceLok.

http://www.bassburglaralarms.com/product_8323.htm

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================
Bass Home Electronics
2291 Pine View Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34231
877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================

Well, you could have the line go into the house right at the strain relief
attachment to the house. However, the perp with a long pole tree trimmer
could probably still cut it. A cell phone hookup is another possibility,
until they come in with a jammer.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 19:49:22 GMT, ender (Jeffrey
J. Kosowsky) wrote:

We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

Generally threaded iron pipe is used, though normal EMT conduit should
be okay. Most monitored systems respond in the phone line is dead,
and an external alarm bell can be used as well. The best is a
cell/radio backup of course.

Jeff

Jeffrey J. Kosowsky wrote:
"Joseph Meehan" writes:

R.H.Campbell wrote:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best
to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall,
and
remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience"
of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box and
run a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they
have it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.

Not sure what underground has to do with it. The real problem in my
mind is not the location of the box but the fact that a clearly
exposed wire runs down the side of the house from the telephone cable
above to the place where the wire enters the basement (independent of
whether the network interface device is inside or outside). Does that
makes any sense?




My father, the locksmith had an answer that seems to make sense to all
security issues.

The bad guys are lazy. That is why they are the bad guys. You only
need to make your home less of a target than the home next door to avoid the
problem. That means make it look like it will not be all the profitable to
rob (no nice looking things visible) or make it look harder to get in
safely.

I had a wealthy neighbor with lots of valuable art pieces etc in his
home. However you could not see any of it from the outside and the outside
of his home always showed considerable need of maintenance. Outside it was
the shabbiest home around, but inside it was a wonderland. He never got
hit.

I have been hit twice in 50 years. Someone store some tools out of my
car (I was working on it under the dash at the time) and once they tried to
get in a window. My cat jumping out of bed and into the hallway did the
trick that time. I saw the flash light shine on the cat and everything got
quiet. I called the cops who caught up with them at the next corner and
found the minor damage to the widow. That window was the most hidden
possible entrance to the home.


--
Joseph E. Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math

Jeffrey J. Kosowsky wrote:
"R.H.Campbell" writes:
Depending upon where the inside hydro panel is located, it might be best
to
dig down about two feet underground and drill through the basement wall,
and remount everything inside the house. Although this can cause some
inconvenience later when the telco has to visit to repair the local loop
from the GWI to the house, it's nothing compared to the "inconvenience"
of
being broken into and having the monitoring non functional......

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com


Perhaps I have misunderstood your answer, but the problem is that the
wire comes in from above -- i.e my concern is the "drop" from where
the line reaches my house at about 15 ft off the ground and then drops
to the level of the basement. My question is about hardening this run
by encasing it in conduit.

Remounting the network interface device internally won't help because
an exposed wire still runs down the side of the house.


Ask for an underground line or add a cell phone device added to your
security system. As also noted you may be able to have the line enter the
home at some point out of reach.

--
Joseph E. Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math

m Ransley wrote:
The phone co raised mine up 15ft for free and made a new high
entrance.

Fine if the utilities are above ground. Here they are underground.

We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

My understanding is that, if your alarm system is actually monitored,
then cutting the line will cause the alarm co. to react as if the alarm
had gone off, so hardening it is pointless. Is there some reason why
you don't trust the alarm company to answer these questions?

Sir, if you are using a conventional telephone line for monitoring, that is
NOT the case. Your alarm panel is a passive device, only using the phone
line when it needs to send test signals, alarms or other signals such as
openings and closings. Cutting the phone line doesn't send anything to the
central station because there is no phone line to do so.

Your alarm can be programmed to actually trigger the alarm in the event of
loss of dial tone, but this is nothing but a "local" alarm. The central
station doesn't know your alarm may not be working until the panel fails to
send in its programmed daily or weekly test signal. If you are using some
means of wireless backup, then the above doesn't apply, and your CS could
well know of a line cut.

So hardening the phone lines CAN be a measure of additional security worth
doing depending upon your particular situation...

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com


wrote in message ...
We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

My understanding is that, if your alarm system is actually monitored,
then cutting the line will cause the alarm co. to react as if the alarm
had gone off, so hardening it is pointless. Is there some reason why
you don't trust the alarm company to answer these questions?

My understanding is that, if your alarm system is
actually monitored, then cutting the line will
cause the alarm co. to react as if the alarm had
gone off, so hardening it is pointless.

Unfortunately, that is not the case with any but a very few high end systems
for banks and such. Residential alarms are typically monitored using the
switched telephone network. In somple terms, the alarm makes a phone call
to the central monitoring station's alarm receiver. If the line is cut no
call is made and the alarm company does not know it.

Many years ago it was common to build systems with "line security." A
dedicated copper pair was connected from the protected premises, through the
telephone company central office to the alarm central station. A voltage
was applied to the cable. Two different resistors were wired between the
circuit and earth ground. Shorting one resistor meant burglary or holdup.
Shorting the other meant fire. A line cut showed as a trouble condition.

In another ancient system a loop of cable was connected from the alarm
company, through the C.O. and then through an alarm Mc Cullough (I forget
how it was spelled) transmitter at each protected premises. Upon alarm a
motorized cam wheel would close and open a switch, creating a series of
interruptions in current on the loop. At the alarm company office this was
translated into a series of marks or holes in a tape designating the account
number. A clerk then looked up the account called the local authorities.
If the line was cut an alarm company agent would be dispatched to
investigate. The problem is these loops were long and many properties were
often connected to each loop. It could take many hours just to find which
property has a fault.

Another problem with leased line security is most telco's don't want to
provide the dedicated copper pairs any more. They can make far more
profitable use of that single pair as part of the dial-up system. Finally,
new outside plant lines are gradually switching over to fiber optic which
does not support inexpensive line security devices.

Is there some reason why you don't trust the alarm
company to answer these questions?

No offense, but the primary purpose of this newsgroup is to provide a place
where people can share information on alarms. The gentleman's query is
on-topic and appropriate.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================
Bass Home Electronics
2291 Pine View Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34231
877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================

ender (Jeffrey J. Kosowsky) wrote in message ...
Not sure what underground has to do with it. The real problem in my
mind is not the location of the box but the fact that a clearly
exposed wire runs down the side of the house from the telephone cable
above to the place where the wire enters the basement (independent of
whether the network interface device is inside or outside). Does that
makes any sense?

I would suggest leaving the existing wiring exposed.

Add a conduit from box to house to carry the real, "live" phone wires.
A burglar may be smart enough to cut the phone line first, but it
won't be the actual phone line.

cyberdock wrote:

Don't these alarms have some sort of backup
system in place. I always assumed if the line
was cut or disconnnected they called a friend or neighbor
to investigate. Something of that nature. My buddy
had his set up so that it also rang his cell phone
if anything suspicious was going on.

If the line's cut, how's it gonna call?

(P.J. Hartman) writes:

(Jeffrey J. Kosowsky) wrote in message ...
] Not sure what underground has to do with it. The real problem in my
] mind is not the location of the box but the fact that a clearly
] exposed wire runs down the side of the house from the telephone cable
] above to the place where the wire enters the basement (independent of
] whether the network interface device is inside or outside). Does that
] makes any sense?

]I would suggest leaving the existing wiring exposed.

]Add a conduit from box to house to carry the real, "live" phone wires.
] A burglar may be smart enough to cut the phone line first, but it
]won't be the actual phone line.

Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Even one better is to have a pair of wires going to the old demarc and put
them on a 24 hour tamper zone. It can be made to look just like the real
phone lines..

"Travis Jordan" wrote in message
. ..
Jeffrey J. Kosowsky wrote:
We are installing a centrally monitored, wired alarm system in our
house.

I noticed that the Network Interface device sits unprotected at waist
level on the outside of the house. Even more concerning, the phone
line enters and exits the box unprotected.

Other than paying for a radio link backup, what is the best way to
"harden" the phone line?

- Would it make sense to encase it in electrical conduit at least
until the wire is out of reach?

- If so, What type of conduit and fittings should one use so that it
is both sufficiently tamper-proof and weather resistant?

- Any other suggestions?

I have a friend who remodeled and moved the telco demarc inside his
garage,
leaving the old one sitting outside (unprotected, as you noted). A few
months later his phone went out, and he called the telephone company for
repair. The telco tech showed up and worked outside for a while, then
finally came to the door and asked "how long has your telephone been out
of
service?". The tech had been testing the circuit up to the old
demarc...never thinking that the circuit might have been moved inside.

If it is good enough to fool Bell South, it should be good enough to fool
the thieves.

"Robert Bass" writes:


]Another problem with leased line security is most telco's don't want to
]provide the dedicated copper pairs any more. They can make far more
]profitable use of that single pair as part of the dial-up system. Finally,
]new outside plant lines are gradually switching over to fiber optic which
]does not support inexpensive line security devices.

Except that now they can actually use that copper pair for far far higher
data transmission rates-- eg ADSL modems, etc. Thus one could imagine
putting an ADSL type signal on the line to the phone company-- or if the
user uses ADSL via the user's ISP-- and monitoring that for disruption.

Most homes have two lines (ie two sets of twisted pair) coming in anyway

Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 19:31:24 -0800 "alarman"
used 12 lines of text to write in newsgroup: alt.security.alarms


Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js


I'm trying to figure out how Mexicans use water "hydro" for
electricity.


--
-Graham

Remove the 'snails' from my email

Except that now they can actually use that copper pair
for far far higher data transmission rates-- eg ADSL
modems, etc. Thus one could imagine putting an ADSL
type signal on the line to the phone company-- or if
the user uses ADSL via the user's ISP-- and monitoring
that for disruption.

Quite right. As more people start using ADSL and even SDSL, perhaps the
alarm industry will begin to take advantage of its capabilities.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================
Bass Home Electronics
2291 Pine View Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34231
877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================

"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 19:31:24 -0800 "alarman"
used 12 lines of text to write in newsgroup: alt.security.alarms


Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there
is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they
really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js


I'm trying to figure out how Mexicans use water "hydro" for
electricity.

It's called a "dam"

"Mark Leuck" wrote in message
news:J3Bmd.620465$8_6.59494@attbi_s04...

Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there
is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they
really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js


I'm trying to figure out how Mexicans use water "hydro" for
electricity.

It's called a "dam"


Damn. That's funny.

"alarman" writes:
Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js

Not sure what part of the above you are referring to, but in much of
the Northeast telephone wires come in on "telephone poles" and the
wire goes aerially to the drop on the side of the house...

Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

........or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro

RHC

"Jeffrey J. Kosowsky" wrote in message
...
"alarman" writes:
Bill Unruh wrote
Around here the "box" is high up on a "telphone pole" (well it carries
hydro-- electricity to those south of the border-- as well). Ie, there
is
no ground level box. You have to run the phone line either down the
telephone pole, which is the telephone company's property and they
really
do not like you fooling with it-- or down the house.

Where do you live, Hooterville??
js

Not sure what part of the above you are referring to, but in much of
the Northeast telephone wires come in on "telephone poles" and the
wire goes aerially to the drop on the side of the house...

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 10:46:04 -0500 "R.H.Campbell"
used 32 lines of text to write in newsgroup: alt.security.alarms

Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

.......or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro


So what do you call water, electricity?

Hydro and electricity don't mix.....





--
-Graham

Remove the 'snails' from my email

"R.H.Campbell" wrote in message
...
Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

.......or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro

RHC

How do they get the water in those little wires? What do yous guys call that
blue water in the crapper? Besides a good acid trip....
LOL

Jack

Damn ! For once I don't have a good come back....))...good one guy....))

RHC

"jackcsg" wrote in message
. com...
"R.H.Campbell" wrote in message
...
Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

.......or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro

RHC

How do they get the water in those little wires? What do yous guys call
that
blue water in the crapper? Besides a good acid trip....
LOL

Jack

"G. Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 10:46:04 -0500 "R.H.Campbell"
used 32 lines of text to write in newsgroup: alt.security.alarms

Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

.......or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro


So what do you call water, electricity?

Hydro and electricity don't mix.....

Keep digging that hole deeper.....

I'm even laughing to hard to rub it in....flush

Jack

"R.H.Campbell" wrote in message
...
Damn ! For once I don't have a good come back....))...good one
guy....))

RHC

"jackcsg" wrote in message
. com...
"R.H.Campbell" wrote in message
...
Up here in Canada, we refer to "hydro" as the electrical plant

ie: "How much was our hydro bill this month...."

.......or...........

"where does the hydro come in the house...."

And our power supplier is called Ottawa Hydro

RHC

How do they get the water in those little wires? What do yous guys call
that
blue water in the crapper? Besides a good acid trip....
LOL

Jack

co-worker got woke a week ago by his neibor, someone had cut the neibors
phoneline an attempted to break in to a window. The husband was away on
business, I guess they may have though both were gone. Luckly she had a cell
phone and called 911 when she heard a noise outside.


"R.H.Campbell" wrote in message
...
Sir, no, not paranoid; just not being totally realistic given the nature
of
residential burglary.

If you were dealing with a commercial warehouse situation containing
hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of valuables, then I might be
inclined to think as you do. However, the average house thief is one step
up
from an ant in intelligence and resourcefulness, and is far from a
professional looking for a big commercial score. You give the average
house
burglar far too much credit ! He is far more likely to just kick in the
weak
strike of your front door, alarm or not, grab what he can, and run like
hell. The alarm only means he might pass you by, or at the very most,
spend
less time in the home given that authorities could well be arriving
shortly.

Again, nothing in security is absolute ! However, with all of these
things,
you are playing the odds ! And if you harden ALL the entrance areas of
your
home (and not just the phone line), you are far less likely to be the
victim
of a robbery. These idiots are lazy and stupid, and are looking for a way
into anyone's home, not specifically yours. After all, they can find the
same things in just about any house along the street, so why would they
spend time breaking into your home if it's more difficult to get in to at
the onset, and there is a chance of discovery vis a vis a monitored alarm
after that. In most cases, they'll simply move along and look for "easier
pick'ins".....

Move the demarc block inside, or do what the other gentleman suggested,
then
stop worrying about that part of the defence system. Spend time and money
on
hardening the locks and strikes of your main doors against kickin, secure
your patio door properly, harden your basement and other low lying windows
against easy entry, and that will do far more to keep the thugs out than
unduly worrying about the phone line at locations away from the house (in
my
experience and opinion)

Simply walk around your house and see how you would enter if you were a
young burglar looking for an easy score ! You'll probably guess correctly
!
Then do something about it right away. Remember, your alarm system is NOT
your first line of defence; it's your second line, and your backup, if
they
get past your first line of defence - the physical perimeter of your house
!

In the old days, they didn't put moats and walls around castle communities
for nothing....

R.H.Campbell
Home Security Metal Products
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
www.homemetal.com


"Brian" wrote in message
...

It is likely bet to check with your phone company first. However I
suggest rather just moving it all in side, that it would be better to
leave
it all there. Bring the hot line inside as you suggest to a new box
and
run
a new wire underground to nowhere. That way someone would think they
have
it and stop looking when in reality they just killed a dead line.


I'm dealing with the same issues right now, and am still having trouble
with
"hardened" or secure phone lines. There will be a weakness somewhere,
whether it is at the entry point to your house or somewhere else between
your house and the phone company. If you're a thorough theif, I assume
you'd find and get into the green access box for the area and kill the
line
there. That way, you don't even have to worry about what you encounter
at
the premise itself.

Or maybe I'm just paranoid.

Brian.

Jeffrey J. Kosowsky wrote
Where do you live, Hooterville??
js

Not sure what part of the above you are referring to, but in much of
the Northeast telephone wires come in on "telephone poles" and the
wire goes aerially to the drop on the side of the house...

I had this image of you climbing up the pole with a butt set to make phone
calls a la Green Acres.
js