On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:31:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 12:15:17 AM UTC-5, Jim Joyce wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

That's 600ma, nothing to sneeze at. It's not going to charge it quickly, but
to maintain it where there is sunlight it would be perfect. Like if you have a
car you're going to leave somewhere for a month or more. It also will charge
it if you have enough time.

It doesn't do squat for a dead battery but they should be charged if
you drove it much at all the last time you used it. This has solved my
dead battery problems in seldom used vehicles.
I should sell one of the cars but I like mine, my wife likes hers and
we still need a truck now and then.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:37:43 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Wednesday, January 27, 2021 at 11:35:43 PM UTC-5, Xeno wrote:
On 28/1/21 2:51 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 00:11:15 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 27/1/21 8:39 am, trader_4 wrote:
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:59:21 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?
Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/

URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos. 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps

If he wants something that's low amp, that's the kind of thing I would get,
ie a charger/maintainer that you can leave on to keep unused batteries
fully charged, eg over winter. The other choice is a higher amp one that
is more useful for quickly charging a dead battery, getting a car going, etc.
I have an old sears one that does 2A/10A/50A, the latter is short term to
start. IDK if there are higher amp ones like that which can also be left
on indefinitely and have the functionality to safely maintain, thought there
is no reason they could not.

If you want a charger that can be left on indefinitely then you need one
that is capable of trickle charging. The one you have is *capable* of
trickle charging on the lowest setting and a normal charge is the mid
setting. The high setting should never be used to charge a battery if
you want a good life from it.
Not if you want any life from the charger either. It's goof dor about
60 seconds )for cranking smaller displacement engines with geared
starters) 50 amps for any length of time melts the ammeters.
sharging a low battery at 50 amps won't hurt the battery - in the car
it can charge at 100 amps on many of tofay's cars (150 amp alternators
are not uncommon)

Whilst the alternator is capable of charging at rates of 30amps and
upwards, It is never recommended that you let the alternator charge the
battery if it has been flattened to any degree.

Maybe it's not idea, but millions of people do it. Battery drained, they
get a jump start and drive off. I bet most of them don't get it charged
by other methods. Even if it shortens the life by a small amount, the
cost of that seems insignificant. Certainly is for those that can't charge
it themselves and would have to go somewhere, pay them, have the car
sit there for the charging duration, etc.


If you took it to a mechanic shop they would hook it to their fast
charger so it is a wash.

On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.


The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:35:34 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 28/1/21 2:51 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 00:11:15 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 27/1/21 8:39 am, trader_4 wrote:
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:59:21 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?
Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/

URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos. 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps

If he wants something that's low amp, that's the kind of thing I would get,
ie a charger/maintainer that you can leave on to keep unused batteries
fully charged, eg over winter. The other choice is a higher amp one that
is more useful for quickly charging a dead battery, getting a car going, etc.
I have an old sears one that does 2A/10A/50A, the latter is short term to
start. IDK if there are higher amp ones like that which can also be left
on indefinitely and have the functionality to safely maintain, thought there
is no reason they could not.

If you want a charger that can be left on indefinitely then you need one
that is capable of trickle charging. The one you have is *capable* of
trickle charging on the lowest setting and a normal charge is the mid
setting. The high setting should never be used to charge a battery if
you want a good life from it.
Not if you want any life from the charger either. It's goof dor about
60 seconds )for cranking smaller displacement engines with geared
starters) 50 amps for any length of time melts the ammeters.
sharging a low battery at 50 amps won't hurt the battery - in the car
it can charge at 100 amps on many of tofay's cars (150 amp alternators
are not uncommon)

Whilst the alternator is capable of charging at rates of 30amps and
upwards, It is never recommended that you let the alternator charge the
battery if it has been flattened to any degree. The rule I was taught
back in the 60s was you remove the battery from the car and charge it at
the *safe charging rate* which was, IIRC, 10% of the amp hour rating of
the battery. That ensures a long life. The alternator is designed to run
the car electrics and it is not designed as a charger per se. That's why
it is recommended that the car battery be occasionally put on a trickle
charger now and then to remove sulphation and top it off to the correct
voltages.
True - but every time a battery goes low and the car gets a boost,
the alternator charges that battery and they still last an average of
7 years. And with today's charging systems no float charge is required
because they caharge at up to 14.2 or 14.3 volts.

Battery technologyAND charging systems have changed significantly
since the 60s.. The biggest problem was with the small-frame GM
alternatoe the high ampersge ones would fry themselves trying to
charge the dead battery at 135 amps - - - -

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 20:55:13 -0600, bud-- wrote:

On 1/27/2021 12:18 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:51:55 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/26/2021 7:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

I don't have that brand but it does have a feature older chargers don't:

https://www.chargingchargers.com/tut...sulfation.html

That link is pushing their own chargers but the technology is the same.

Reports are that the "pulse tech" charging concept is nonsense.


Also from Home Despot

Internet #310342966
Model # HW6000015

50/10/2 amp analog $68


I have not seen a reliable source that says pulse desulfation works.

A source I think is reliable for all types of batteries is battery
university

https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it
which says
"Several companies offer anti-sulfation devices that apply pulses to the
battery terminals to prevent and reverse sulfation. Such technologies
will lower the sulfation on a healthy battery, but they cannot
effectively reverse the condition once present. It’s a “one size fits
all” approach and the method is unscientific."

--------------------
Comments?


Note what it says - Such technologies will lower the sulfation on a
healthy battery.

So the idea is sound - and it DOES work - to a point. Once a battery
is SEVERELY sulphared, virtually NOTHING will remve the sulphate.
Pulse charge can extend the life of a battery that has been left
partially charged for a little longer than it should have been but it
can't "raise the dead"

On 1/27/2021 12:18 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:51:55 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/26/2021 7:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

I don't have that brand but it does have a feature older chargers don't:

https://www.chargingchargers.com/tut...sulfation.html

That link is pushing their own chargers but the technology is the same.

Reports are that the "pulse tech" charging concept is nonsense.


Also from Home Despot

Internet #310342966
Model # HW6000015

50/10/2 amp analog $68


I have not seen a reliable source that says pulse desulfation works.

A source I think is reliable for all types of batteries is battery
university

https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it
which says
"Several companies offer anti-sulfation devices that apply pulses to the
battery terminals to prevent and reverse sulfation. Such technologies
will lower the sulfation on a healthy battery, but they cannot
effectively reverse the condition once present. Its a €œone size fits
all€� approach and the method is unscientific."

--------------------
Comments?

On 29/1/21 12:44 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:35:34 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 28/1/21 2:51 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 00:11:15 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 27/1/21 8:39 am, trader_4 wrote:
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:59:21 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?
Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/

URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos. 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps

If he wants something that's low amp, that's the kind of thing I would get,
ie a charger/maintainer that you can leave on to keep unused batteries
fully charged, eg over winter. The other choice is a higher amp one that
is more useful for quickly charging a dead battery, getting a car going, etc.
I have an old sears one that does 2A/10A/50A, the latter is short term to
start. IDK if there are higher amp ones like that which can also be left
on indefinitely and have the functionality to safely maintain, thought there
is no reason they could not.

If you want a charger that can be left on indefinitely then you need one
that is capable of trickle charging. The one you have is *capable* of
trickle charging on the lowest setting and a normal charge is the mid
setting. The high setting should never be used to charge a battery if
you want a good life from it.
Not if you want any life from the charger either. It's goof dor about
60 seconds )for cranking smaller displacement engines with geared
starters) 50 amps for any length of time melts the ammeters.
sharging a low battery at 50 amps won't hurt the battery - in the car
it can charge at 100 amps on many of tofay's cars (150 amp alternators
are not uncommon)

Whilst the alternator is capable of charging at rates of 30amps and
upwards, It is never recommended that you let the alternator charge the
battery if it has been flattened to any degree. The rule I was taught
back in the 60s was you remove the battery from the car and charge it at
the *safe charging rate* which was, IIRC, 10% of the amp hour rating of
the battery. That ensures a long life. The alternator is designed to run
the car electrics and it is not designed as a charger per se. That's why
it is recommended that the car battery be occasionally put on a trickle
charger now and then to remove sulphation and top it off to the correct
voltages.
True - but every time a battery goes low and the car gets a boost,
the alternator charges that battery and they still last an average of
7 years. And with today's charging systems no float charge is required
because they caharge at up to 14.2 or 14.3 volts.

Battery technologyAND charging systems have changed significantly
since the 60s.. The biggest problem was with the small-frame GM
alternatoe the high ampersge ones would fry themselves trying to
charge the dead battery at 135 amps - - - -

Not to mention many alternators are now controlled by the engine
management system.

--

Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 14:24:24 -0800, Bob F
wrote:

On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.


The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

Well, my 2005 car has the clock in the car radio,
the fob receiver,
there must be some voltage applied to the engine computer since they
say it forgets what it learned if you take the battery out, but despite
that, I think the current used has to be very small, and
what amounts to a burglar alarm sentry, that monitors the doors if
they are opened by reaching in and unlatching one of them, without using
the key or the fob.

Do new cars have more electronics that run when the car is off?


When I used a solar charger, I had numbers 1 and 3, plus I'd put in my
own 4, but no fob. IIRC I also had a crummy battery but it was fine in
the summer, so I used the charger, about 12" by 8" including a 3/4"
frame, during the winter, and it got me through 2 winters in good shape.
Bought it at a hamfest.

On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

"micky" wrote in message
...
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 14:24:24 -0800, Bob F
wrote:

On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski
wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally
died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that
jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car
battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used
at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be
nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger
online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them
from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my
boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously
refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but
nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the
battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an
unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in
direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery
Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.


The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

Well, my 2005 car has the clock in the car radio,
the fob receiver,
there must be some voltage applied to the engine computer since they
say it forgets what it learned if you take the battery out, but despite
that, I think the current used has to be very small, and
what amounts to a burglar alarm sentry, that monitors the doors if
they are opened by reaching in and unlatching one of them, without using
the key or the fob.

Do new cars have more electronics that run when the car is off?

Yep, some have lots of cameras that are used for all sorts
of things like lane keeping and collision avoidance etc and
use them when the car is parked as a dash cam so you have
a record of some scrote that trys to break into your car etc.

When I used a solar charger, I had numbers 1 and 3, plus I'd put in my
own 4, but no fob. IIRC I also had a crummy battery but it was fine in
the summer, so I used the charger, about 12" by 8" including a 3/4"
frame, during the winter, and it got me through 2 winters in good shape.
Bought it at a hamfest.

"trader_4" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski
wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger
finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that
jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car
battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used
at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be
nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery
charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them
from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my
boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously
refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but
nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the
battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an
unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day
if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in
direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery
Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered
up when the car is just sitting. Alarm, entry system.

There is more than just those two now, most obviously
with the cameras which can be useful when its just sitting.

The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma when sitting,
it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design
or some small fault somewhere. That's an order of
magnitude less than Fretwell's solar charger puts out.

But the solar charger doesnt work in the garage, stupid.

On Sat, 30 Jan 2021 03:37:19 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

03:37??? LOL And it's trolling time for you, yet again, you subnormal senile
swine?

--
"Who or What is Rod Speed?
Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
man" on the InterNet."
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

On Sat, 30 Jan 2021 03:44:54 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

03:44 in Australia??? Is your unbearable loneliness not letting you sleep in
again, you abnormal trolling senile swine?

--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 86-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 14:24:24 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.


The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

That panel keeps the battery up in my wife's Lincoln. I do know some
Cadillacs a few years ago had a software problem that would kill a
battery in a few days tho. The answer they had was they would give you
a trickle charger. That is not much help if your car was parked at the
airport tho. My FIL had the Cadillac dealer buying him a new battery
every 6 months or so. Finally they made him a deal he couldn't refuse
on a new one that did not have the problem. I am sure they sold the
other one to some poor sucker a couple states away.

On 1/28/2021 7:52 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 20:55:13 -0600, bud-- wrote:

On 1/27/2021 12:18 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:51:55 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/26/2021 7:36 PM, rbowman wrote:

I don't have that brand but it does have a feature older chargers don't:

https://www.chargingchargers.com/tut...sulfation.html

That link is pushing their own chargers but the technology is the same.

Reports are that the "pulse tech" charging concept is nonsense.


Also from Home Despot

Internet #310342966
Model # HW6000015

50/10/2 amp analog $68


I have not seen a reliable source that says pulse desulfation works.

A source I think is reliable for all types of batteries is battery
university

https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/sulfation_and_how_to_prevent_it
which says
"Several companies offer anti-sulfation devices that apply pulses to the
battery terminals to prevent and reverse sulfation. Such technologies
will lower the sulfation on a healthy battery, but they cannot
effectively reverse the condition once present. Its a €œone size fits
all€� approach and the method is unscientific."

--------------------
Comments?


Note what it says - Such technologies will lower the sulfation on a
healthy battery.

So the idea is sound - and it DOES work - to a point. Once a battery
is SEVERELY sulphared, virtually NOTHING will remve the sulphate.
Pulse charge can extend the life of a battery that has been left
partially charged for a little longer than it should have been but it
can't "raise the dead"


IMHO it is implied that pulse chargers are more effective than they
actually are.
Patents tend to claim that their pulse process is better than all the
other processes. Hype - they can't all be better.

I suggest a 3-stage charger
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IUoU_battery_charging
"The purpose is to fully charge the battery in a relatively short time
without reducing its life span and to indefinitely keep the battery
charged as long as the charger is connected."

I have a couple of them
Schummacher SSC-1000A
Schummacher SC-1200A
The second one was too cheap at a garage sale to not buy. They are
switch-mode powered and don't have a heavy power transformer (cf BobF
post). The seller likely didn't know how good the charger was.
If the battery is AGM or gel-cell a 3-stage charger should have a
setting for it - the voltage/current transition points are different.
One of my cars is AGM or gel-cell. The car manufacturer also wants that
charge rate somewhere under 5A.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.

On Sat, 30 Jan 2021 03:44:54 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"trader_4" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski
wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger
finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that
jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car
battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used
at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be
nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery
charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them
from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my
boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously
refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but
nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the
battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an
unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day
if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in
direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery
Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered
up when the car is just sitting. Alarm, entry system.

There is more than just those two now, most obviously
with the cameras which can be useful when its just sitting.

The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma when sitting,
it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design
or some small fault somewhere. That's an order of
magnitude less than Fretwell's solar charger puts out.

But the solar charger doesnt work in the garage, stupid.

Unless you put the collector outside. I have one on the roof of my
shed for the mower.

On 1/29/2021 6:18 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.


You really think a solar cell sitting in one window of a car is really
going to get anywhere near the ideal possible sun from the solar charts.
I sure do not.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 18:57:52 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 29/1/21 12:44 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:35:34 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 28/1/21 2:51 pm, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 00:11:15 +1100, Xeno
wrote:

On 27/1/21 8:39 am, trader_4 wrote:
On Tuesday, January 26, 2021 at 2:59:21 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?
Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/

URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos. 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps

If he wants something that's low amp, that's the kind of thing I would get,
ie a charger/maintainer that you can leave on to keep unused batteries
fully charged, eg over winter. The other choice is a higher amp one that
is more useful for quickly charging a dead battery, getting a car going, etc.
I have an old sears one that does 2A/10A/50A, the latter is short term to
start. IDK if there are higher amp ones like that which can also be left
on indefinitely and have the functionality to safely maintain, thought there
is no reason they could not.

If you want a charger that can be left on indefinitely then you need one
that is capable of trickle charging. The one you have is *capable* of
trickle charging on the lowest setting and a normal charge is the mid
setting. The high setting should never be used to charge a battery if
you want a good life from it.
Not if you want any life from the charger either. It's goof dor about
60 seconds )for cranking smaller displacement engines with geared
starters) 50 amps for any length of time melts the ammeters.
sharging a low battery at 50 amps won't hurt the battery - in the car
it can charge at 100 amps on many of tofay's cars (150 amp alternators
are not uncommon)

Whilst the alternator is capable of charging at rates of 30amps and
upwards, It is never recommended that you let the alternator charge the
battery if it has been flattened to any degree. The rule I was taught
back in the 60s was you remove the battery from the car and charge it at
the *safe charging rate* which was, IIRC, 10% of the amp hour rating of
the battery. That ensures a long life. The alternator is designed to run
the car electrics and it is not designed as a charger per se. That's why
it is recommended that the car battery be occasionally put on a trickle
charger now and then to remove sulphation and top it off to the correct
voltages.
True - but every time a battery goes low and the car gets a boost,
the alternator charges that battery and they still last an average of
7 years. And with today's charging systems no float charge is required
because they caharge at up to 14.2 or 14.3 volts.

Battery technologyAND charging systems have changed significantly
since the 60s.. The biggest problem was with the small-frame GM
alternatoe the high ampersge ones would fry themselves trying to
charge the dead battery at 135 amps - - - -

Not to mention many alternators are now controlled by the engine
management system.
Like I said - SIGNIFICANT improvement

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 03:03:43 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 28 Jan 2021 14:24:24 -0800, Bob F
wrote:

On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.


The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

Well, my 2005 car has the clock in the car radio,
the fob receiver,
there must be some voltage applied to the engine computer since they
say it forgets what it learned if you take the battery out, but despite
that, I think the current used has to be very small, and
what amounts to a burglar alarm sentry, that monitors the doors if
they are opened by reaching in and unlatching one of them, without using
the key or the fob.

Do new cars have more electronics that run when the car is off?

Actually a LOT LESS current draw than in 1990. The computer memory
draws virtually no current - it just requires a minimum voltage. The
clock would run all year on a cr1220 cell. Radio memory again is not a
current hog. The reciever for the key fob is such a low power unit it
only draws about 12 ua - that's 12 MICRO Amps - 1r 12 MILLIONTHS of an
amp. Moisture on the top of a clean battery likely leaks more than
that. To consume 1 amp hour of power from your nominally 50 Ah
battery would take a long time .
1/1000000 of a year is 13 seconds, more or less. You don't even need
to do any calcs to know that 12 microamps is not going to kill your
battery in 6 months.


When I used a solar charger, I had numbers 1 and 3, plus I'd put in my
own 4, but no fob. IIRC I also had a crummy battery but it was fine in
the summer, so I used the charger, about 12" by 8" including a 3/4"
frame, during the winter, and it got me through 2 winters in good shape.
Bought it at a hamfest.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 19:47:32 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 6:18 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.


You really think a solar cell sitting in one window of a car is really
going to get anywhere near the ideal possible sun from the solar charts.
I sure do not.

Dunno but it seems to be plenty here. Maybe not so much in the Pac NW.

On Friday, January 29, 2021 at 10:47:38 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/29/2021 6:18 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.

You really think a solar cell sitting in one window of a car is really
going to get anywhere near the ideal possible sun from the solar charts.
I sure do not.

Funny, I thought you libs were all excited about the enormous capability
of solar energy. Here we have a good application, using a small solar
charger to keep a starting battery fully charged when the vehicle isn't
in use, and all you do is complain. Fretwell should replace them all with
an AC plug-in battery tender to make you happy.

Always unhook the battery if away for longer than a month or so:
-------------------

https://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/...ever-make.html

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 29 Jan 2021 19:47:32 -0800, Bob F
wrote:


I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.


You really think a solar cell sitting in one window of a car is really
going to get anywhere near the ideal possible sun from the solar charts.
I sure do not.

My normal parking place is facing almost east, and even pointed up hill
a tiny bit, and the solar panel, about 12"x7" with a 3/4" non-solar
frame around the whole thing, and the car started all winter at 7:30AM
when it's still cold, 2, maybe even 3 winters.

Because the windshield tilts back the sunlight hits the panel evven at
noon, but soon after that the roof starts to get in the way.

Of course the sun is lower in the sky in the winter, to I guess it shone
on the solar panel from the side, (but I don't think any got to it from
the side window).

And IIUC Baltimore doesn't get sun as directly as Florida does.

And before I used it, several times it was too dead to start. I'd have
to go get the 10-amp charger and charge for a little while.


(I may have mistakenly been powering two separate car burglar alarms
then, and draining my old weak batter even faster.)

On Sat, 30 Jan 2021 20:19:00 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 29 Jan 2021 19:47:32 -0800, Bob F
wrote:


I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.


You really think a solar cell sitting in one window of a car is really
going to get anywhere near the ideal possible sun from the solar charts.
I sure do not.

My normal parking place is facing almost east, and even pointed up hill
a tiny bit, and the solar panel, about 12"x7" with a 3/4" non-solar
frame around the whole thing, and the car started all winter at 7:30AM
when it's still cold, 2, maybe even 3 winters.

Both my vehicles sit facing south in front of the garage here in
Ontario and sometimes sit 2 weeks without starting with NO charger and
they always start unless my wife leaves the lights on. Still the
original battery in the 2014 Kia and the battery in the '96 Ranger is
5 years old. -18 friday night and they both started like it was +20
(Degrees C)
Because the windshield tilts back the sunlight hits the panel evven at
noon, but soon after that the roof starts to get in the way.

Of course the sun is lower in the sky in the winter, to I guess it shone
on the solar panel from the side, (but I don't think any got to it from
the side window).

And IIUC Baltimore doesn't get sun as directly as Florida does.

And before I used it, several times it was too dead to start. I'd have
to go get the 10-amp charger and charge for a little while.


(I may have mistakenly been powering two separate car burglar alarms
then, and draining my old weak batter even faster.)

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 22:55:19 -0500, Clare Snyder posted for all of us to
digest...


On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:15:31 -0500, Tekkie©
wrote:


On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 01:22:03 -0500, Clare Snyder posted for all of us to
digest...


On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:51:55 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/26/2021 7:36 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 01/26/2021 12:59 PM, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps
cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at
6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger
online?

Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/



URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos.* 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps


I don't have that brand but it does have a feature older chargers don't:

https://www.chargingchargers.com/tut...sulfation.html

That link is pushing their own chargers but the technology is the same.

Reports are that the "pulse tech" charging concept is nonsense.
Harbor Fright has a Centec 2/6 amp unit on clearance for $30.
SKU 56744, 56799
Classic steel case with plastic front, analog meter,and chintzy slide
switch straight out of the 'seventies

Do the cables melt and burn your hand or does the unit blow first?

I I see I reposted a the link in here to Schumacher. I think they are made in
China now but not positive.
At 6 amps the cables won't even get warm. They are roughly 14 gauge
minimum. The ones with the 50 amp boost WILL warm the cables - duty
cycle is about 30 seconds and 10%. 30 seconds on and 5 minutes off.

I didn't know what cable size was used. Just trying to be funny..

--
Tekkie

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 16:51:01 -0500, posted for all of us to
digest...


On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:31:58 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 12:15:17 AM UTC-5, Jim Joyce wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

That's 600ma, nothing to sneeze at. It's not going to charge it quickly, but
to maintain it where there is sunlight it would be perfect. Like if you have a
car you're going to leave somewhere for a month or more. It also will charge
it if you have enough time.

It doesn't do squat for a dead battery but they should be charged if
you drove it much at all the last time you used it. This has solved my
dead battery problems in seldom used vehicles.
I should sell one of the cars but I like mine, my wife likes hers and
we still need a truck now and then.

It is depressing when you reduce the fleet. REALLY depressing when they yank
the keys...

--
Tekkie

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021 16:47:30 -0500, posted for all of us to
digest...


On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

Clare can correct me but I think the baseline for parasitic draw is 50ma.

--
Tekkie

On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 21:18:06 -0500, posted for all of us to
digest...


On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.

You mean you didn't use a dryer plug? Shame...

--
Tekkie

On Mon, 1 Feb 2021 17:13:18 -0500, Tekkie© wrote:


On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 21:18:06 -0500, posted for all of us to
digest...


On Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:32:20 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/29/2021 5:59 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, January 28, 2021 at 5:24:29 PM UTC-5, Bob F wrote:
On 1/28/2021 1:47 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:15:13 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:52:11 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:03:16 -0600, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:56:57 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 20:36:10 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 1/26/2021 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at 6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger online?

Chargers are good for dead batteries but battery tenders keep them from
going dead. The new AGM betteries and all the electronics are more
touchy than ever.

Ger something like this
https://www.stingrayforums.com/threa...-charger.7036/

It is hard to beat a solar battery maintainer. I have one on my boat,
one for my lawn tractor and one for the truck we seldom use. I am
going to get one for my wife's car now that she isn't driving much.

"solar battery maintainer" doesn't tell me much. Solar obviously refers to
the less important aspect of how power comes into the charger, but nothing
about the more critical aspect of how power is applied to the battery. Not
only that, it sounds like it may not work well at night or in an unlighted
garage. I guess I'll pass on that idea.

I agree in a garage, maybe not so much but the sun shines every day if
your vehicle is outside.
It is plenty to keep a battery up with the advantage that it works
without needing AC power where you are. No extension cords to screw
with when you drive away.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

7.5 watts? That doesn't sound good at all. That would be midday in direct
sun, so even less before and after that. I'll stick with my Battery Tender,
which has been working well for more than a decade now.

Whatever works for you but 7.5w (0.625a) 5 hours a day (How solar
collectors are rated) is plenty to replace the parasitic losses in a
battery that is just sitting there.

The losses are probably higher in any modern car with all the
electronics they have consuming power.

What would those be? Very little needs to be powered up when the car is
just sitting. Alarm, entry system. The BMW X5 here is supposed to pull 45ma
when sitting, it actually pulls about 70ma, IDK if that is due to design or some
small fault somewhere. That's an order of magnitude less than Fretwell's solar
charger puts out.


But his solar charger probably only gets the equivalent of a couple
hours of full sun a day if he parks it in the sun. Sure, it should do he
job.

I said earlier, according to the solar folks here, you count on your
collectors getting about 5 hours a day at the rating in full sun. That
is how they are rated anyway.
If it is a 12v collector, rated at putting out 0.625a that is 5 x
0.625 x 12 or 37.5 w/hr per day.
That also assumes Wong Dong in China was honest on the rating of his
collector.
I just know it works in my driveway and the one on my boat works out
on the dock. The mower stays charged from the collector in the roof of
the shed. I finally got around to putting a lighter plug on the mower
to make it a fast connection.

You mean you didn't use a dryer plug? Shame...

I have power down there but I shut it off from the house to make my
boat a little harder to steal. There is still light from the screen
cage mounted floods but nothing you can plug the lift into.

On 2/1/2021 2:03 PM, Tekkie� wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 22:55:19 -0500, Clare Snyder posted for all of us to
digest...


On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:15:31 -0500, Tekkie©
wrote:


On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 01:22:03 -0500, Clare Snyder posted for all of us to
digest...


On Tue, 26 Jan 2021 21:51:55 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 1/26/2021 7:36 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 01/26/2021 12:59 PM, wrote:
On 1/26/21 2:44 PM, alan wrote:
My 40 year old steel case 6 amp automotive battery charger finally died.
I only want to replace it (and I don't want a contraption that jumps
cars).

I just want a new 120VAC simple sturdy 12VDC automotive car battery
charger.
And I don't get out to the stores much lately.

Mine had an analog meter, and a 6V/12V switch (which I never used at
6V).
If they still come with an analog amperage needle, that would be nice.

Any advice where to get a good simple sturdy 12VDC battery charger
online?

Here is Amazon least expensive charger with meter

https://www.amazon.com/Automotive-Ba...dp/B07NVHBPDV/



URL says motorcycle but it's also for autos.Â* 5 amp w/digital meter for
more than just amps


I don't have that brand but it does have a feature older chargers don't:

https://www.chargingchargers.com/tut...sulfation.html

That link is pushing their own chargers but the technology is the same.

Reports are that the "pulse tech" charging concept is nonsense.
Harbor Fright has a Centec 2/6 amp unit on clearance for $30.
SKU 56744, 56799
Classic steel case with plastic front, analog meter,and chintzy slide
switch straight out of the 'seventies

Do the cables melt and burn your hand or does the unit blow first?

I I see I reposted a the link in here to Schumacher. I think they are made in
China now but not positive.
At 6 amps the cables won't even get warm. They are roughly 14 gauge
minimum. The ones with the 50 amp boost WILL warm the cables - duty
cycle is about 30 seconds and 10%. 30 seconds on and 5 minutes off.

I didn't know what cable size was used. Just trying to be funny..


ha ha.