I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve welding. How would you join these stringers? I searched and searched and could not find anything like my situation. I believe most builders would have put a 4'x4' landing between the two sets. This guy put a not quite double depth step in the middle because he didn't realize he was doing it until he put on the treads. I plan on cutting that one extra step and sliding the lower set of stringers forward to properly meet the upper stringers. A 4x4 landing is not possible, the steps would extend too far into the driveway. If you have a picture that would be great although I'm not sure where we could post them, I assume they aren't allowed here.
Thanks,
Tony

On 05/31/2016 5:55 PM, wrote:
....

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve
welding. How would you join these stringers? ...

Measure perpendicular from the straight edge of a stringer to the inside
corner of a tread and riser notch. Cut a piece of 3/4-inch plywood 48"
inches long the same width.

Use 1/2" hot dip galvanized or SS machine bolts w/ flat washer on both
sides and bolt thru at pairs of holes at 6" intervals from end to end on
the plywood. Use an additional pair of holes 2 inches each way of the
seam where the stringers butt together.

I'd augment with a good-quality construction adhesive on assembly as well.

Alternatively, if you can, remove the treads and use the full-width ply
flange and saw out the notches. Add an additional bolt in the mid of
each riser.

--

On 5/31/2016 6:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Sounds like a terrible way of doing something, but I'm sure it can be
fixed. The method dpb suggested would work. He suggested 48", but I'd
go even longer.

You mention they are supported in the middle of the run. Do you mean
something from the stringer to the ground? I'd do that.

You can post a photo at various web sites and post a link. tinypic.com
is one.

On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 8:04:37 PM UTC-4, dpb wrote:
On 05/31/2016 5:55 PM, wrote:
...

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve
welding. How would you join these stringers? ...

Measure perpendicular from the straight edge of a stringer to the inside
corner of a tread and riser notch. Cut a piece of 3/4-inch plywood 48"
inches long the same width.

Use 1/2" hot dip galvanized or SS machine bolts w/ flat washer on both
sides and bolt thru at pairs of holes at 6" intervals from end to end on
the plywood. Use an additional pair of holes 2 inches each way of the
seam where the stringers butt together.

I'd augment with a good-quality construction adhesive on assembly as well..

Alternatively, if you can, remove the treads and use the full-width ply
flange and saw out the notches. Add an additional bolt in the mid of
each riser.

--

Sounds like we're heading in the right direction, but I only have 5.5" there, is that enough? I'd do it on both sides but he has the 4x4 support posts notched 1/2 way for the stringer to sit on and the other half of the 4x4 (2x4) goes up and back to 4x4 up to the railings. Also the balusters would have to come off and put back on the outside of the plywood. Not a deal breaker though. That is on one side (the side that shows of course) the other side the 4x4 is notched and sits on the outside of the stringer so I could do the same with the plywood but on the inside where it will only be seen through the open risers. They goofed up at the top with the 4x4's so one railing hangs over the outside edge, and the other side the railing hangs on the inside where you walk. I'll have to give this a look again tomorrow in the light. Also I assume I will still need support under the middle to the ground? (there are small footers for the vertical 4x4's but I don't know if they will still line up, I may have to dig some new ones.) Then again, the support posts may not need to be perfectly centered with the plywood on there. Another thing to look at tomorrow. Great Start though!! Thanks! Oh, I was curious but forgot to measure until now, they aren't 7:11, they are 7:10 stringers. Not bad since I have a short 5 step set going up to the front porch that are 8:10, so I'm used to it. I'd like to tear off all the railings and start over but he used a nail gun with ring shanked nails. Hmm, I wonder if they are even made for use with pressure treated wood? He dropped one thing of nails, how do I know if they are for pressure treated wood?

On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 9:24:27 PM UTC-4, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 5/31/2016 6:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Sounds like a terrible way of doing something, but I'm sure it can be
fixed. The method dpb suggested would work. He suggested 48", but I'd
go even longer.

You mention they are supported in the middle of the run. Do you mean
something from the stringer to the ground? I'd do that.

You can post a photo at various web sites and post a link. tinypic.com
is one.

Yes there are 3 4x4's from the joint in the stringer to the ground (small concrete pads) The pic to prevent sway was my fist concern so I tore it off and added 2 2x4's to make an X. Then I was looking at the bad cuts and didn't even realize at first how the upper stringer support basically gave it about 1" of support if the wood were to split. I put temporary braces under that because I had to get up to the loft with some heavy stuff. I couldn't believe he left the middle stringer like that when he left for the day. The next morning by the time I got out there he had all the treads on. I showed it to him and he looked at the kid helping him and said "tear off all those steps". I already saw the mess he made pulling out one step and didn't want him to do more harm than good, so I told him to take a sawzall between the stringer and the treads and cut the nails, then move it over, and it's still crooked!

I had paid for the materials since I had a special 10% off offer from Lowes and at first I paid him for the labor. After realizing just how poor things were I canceled the check, then called him and told him. He said he would fix it all and sent 3 guys here this morning but he didn't show. I told them to start with making the middle step the same as the rest. They said no, they would fix other stuff I didn't even show here. One more time I told them to fix the middle step, they said no so I told them to leave.

On 5/31/2016 11:26 PM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:

Yes there are 3 4x4's from the joint in the stringer to the ground (small concrete pads) The pic to prevent sway was my fist concern so I tore it off and added 2 2x4's to make an X. Then I was looking at the bad cuts and didn't even realize at first how the upper stringer support basically gave it about 1" of support if the wood were to split. I put temporary braces under that because I had to get up to the loft with some heavy stuff. I couldn't believe he left the middle stringer like that when he left for the day. The next morning by the time I got out there he had all the treads on. I showed it to him and he looked at the kid helping him and said "tear off all those steps". I already saw the mess he made pulling out one step and didn't want him to do more harm than good, so I told him to take a sawzall between the stringer and the treads and cut the nails, then move it over, and it's still crooked!

I had paid for the materials since I had a special 10% off offer from Lowes and at first I paid him for the labor. After realizing just how poor things were I canceled the check, then called him and told him. He said he would fix it all and sent 3 guys here this morning but he didn't show. I told them to start with making the middle step the same as the rest. They said no, they would fix other stuff I didn't even show here. One more time I told them to fix the middle step, they said no so I told them to leave.






OMG. I'd consider starting over. What a mess.

On 05/31/2016 04:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

I looked at your pics. My opinion is to hire a contractor that knows WTF they are doing.
I'd be worried the insurance company would refuse to renew my policy when it expires.

On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 11:26:21 PM UTC-4, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 9:24:27 PM UTC-4, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 5/31/2016 6:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Sounds like a terrible way of doing something, but I'm sure it can be
fixed. The method dpb suggested would work. He suggested 48", but I'd
go even longer.

You mention they are supported in the middle of the run. Do you mean
something from the stringer to the ground? I'd do that.

You can post a photo at various web sites and post a link. tinypic.com
is one.

Yes there are 3 4x4's from the joint in the stringer to the ground (small concrete pads) The pic to prevent sway was my fist concern so I tore it off and added 2 2x4's to make an X. Then I was looking at the bad cuts and didn't even realize at first how the upper stringer support basically gave it about 1" of support if the wood were to split. I put temporary braces under that because I had to get up to the loft with some heavy stuff. I couldn't believe he left the middle stringer like that when he left for the day. The next morning by the time I got out there he had all the treads on. I showed it to him and he looked at the kid helping him and said "tear off all those steps". I already saw the mess he made pulling out one step and didn't want him to do more harm than good, so I told him to take a sawzall between the stringer and the treads and cut the nails, then move it over, and it's still crooked!

I had paid for the materials since I had a special 10% off offer from Lowes and at first I paid him for the labor. After realizing just how poor things were I canceled the check, then called him and told him. He said he would fix it all and sent 3 guys here this morning but he didn't show. I told them to start with making the middle step the same as the rest. They said no, they would fix other stuff I didn't even show here. One more time I told them to fix the middle step, they said no so I told them to leave.





....and thus the reason most places have building codes.

What is that second image? It sure isn't your stairs.

Aside from all the other issues, that middle step is a major tripping hazard. It's not wide enough to
be considered a landing, so it's really nothing more than a step that's wider than the others. As
my grandfather the mason used to say regarding steps: "The feet remember".

Take tons of pictures, get a a couple of written estimates from other contractors, hopefully saying
that is must be taken down and rebuilt, and go to small claims court.

On 05/31/2016 8:59 PM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
....

Sounds like we're heading in the right direction, but I only have
5.5" there, is that enough? I'd do it on both sides but he has the
4x4 support posts notched 1/2 way for the stringer to sit on ...

I also looked at the picture -- while it would be "stout-enough" with
some effort such as described that it wouldn't be an imminent hazard I
must agree with the others that it's so cobbled up it's not worth trying
to salvage imo.

Unfortunate, but I think your only real recourse to get anything
satisfactory in the end at this point is to start over; it's just got
too too many "issues" to ever be put to rights.

I presumed it was simply a case where there was a joist joint that
needing some strengthening; this is incredible where nothing fits and
there's no symmetry or anything. Being made "functional" would still
leave an eyesore that won't ever go away.

shanked nails. Hmm, I wonder if they are even made for use with
pressure treated wood? He dropped one thing of nails, how do I know
if they are for pressure treated wood?

Basically need to know the manufacturer's spec...for ACQ it's either
stainless or hot-dipped galvanized that are approved.

--

On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 6:55:51 PM UTC-4, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve welding. How would you join these stringers? I searched and searched and could not find anything like my situation. I believe most builders would have put a 4'x4' landing between the two sets. This guy put a not quite double depth step in the middle because he didn't realize he was doing it until he put on the treads. I plan on cutting that one extra step and sliding the lower set of stringers forward to properly meet the upper stringers. A 4x4 landing is not possible, the steps would extend too far into the driveway. If you have a picture that would be great although I'm not sure where we could post them, I assume they aren't allowed here.
Thanks,
Tony

I will try to get another contractor out here and do an estimate or suggest it needs to be torn down and started over, but it's really hard to find one these days, I don't know the reason, but this guy has lots of work and 3 crews!

Surprisingly, the stairway and landing are very solid. Yes I know that is hard to believe from the little I've shown. I just remembered what that second picture was suppose to be, it was were he nailed a 2x4 horizontally across the middle supports to keep it from swaying left and right. I tore that off and made a large X with PT 2x4 which made it very tight. I really believe if I can't get someone to do an estimate, that using the plywood as suggested, AND adding quite a few metal hangers and such, that it will do. No it will never be the Tag Mahal but it will work and be safe. First I will try other contractors. Are any of you from East TN?

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 9:20:00 AM UTC-4, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 6:55:51 PM UTC-4, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve welding. How would you join these stringers? I searched and searched and could not find anything like my situation. I believe most builders would have put a 4'x4' landing between the two sets. This guy put a not quite double depth step in the middle because he didn't realize he was doing it until he put on the treads. I plan on cutting that one extra step and sliding the lower set of stringers forward to properly meet the upper stringers. A 4x4 landing is not possible, the steps would extend too far into the driveway. If you have a picture that would be great although I'm not sure where we could post them, I assume they aren't allowed here.
Thanks,
Tony

I will try to get another contractor out here and do an estimate or suggest it needs to be torn down and started over, but it's really hard to find one these days, I don't know the reason, but this guy has lots of work and 3 crews!

Surprisingly, the stairway and landing are very solid. Yes I know that is hard to believe from the little I've shown. I just remembered what that second picture was suppose to be, it was were he nailed a 2x4 horizontally across the middle supports to keep it from swaying left and right. I tore that off and made a large X with PT 2x4 which made it very tight. I really believe if I can't get someone to do an estimate, that using the plywood as suggested, AND adding quite a few metal hangers and such, that it will do.. No it will never be the Tag Mahal but it will work and be safe. First I will try other contractors. Are any of you from East TN?

Oh and I forgot to add, from 20' it doesn't look bad, really! Well maybe to you it will look bad? And it is in the rear of my garage where anyone else rarely goes.
He had also dumped more quick-crete at the bottom, high enough to partially bury the grade 2 PT. I took the tag off a piece, called the lumber company and asked if it should be buried in concrete and the answer was a flat out NO. When it began to rain I shoveled the quick crete out of there. I asked the lumber company about burying the green higher quality PT and he said it's just OK. He said set in concrete it will last about 20 years. (none of mine is buried)

On 06/01/2016 8:19 AM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
....

Surprisingly, the stairway and landing are very solid. Yes I know
that is hard to believe from the little I've shown. I just
remembered what that second picture was suppose to be, it was were he
nailed a 2x4 horizontally across the middle supports to keep it from
swaying left and right. I tore that off and made a large X with PT
2x4 which made it very tight. I really believe if I can't get
someone to do an estimate, that using the plywood as suggested, AND
adding quite a few metal hangers and such, that it will do. No it
will never be the Tag Mahal but it will work and be safe. First I
will try other contractors. Are any of you from East TN?

At least initially, I'm not surprised. As the PT dries out and shrinks
it'll undoubtedly "loosen-up" a bit. If nothing else, I'd add blocking
where the supports were miscut on the center post so the stringer does
have a solid rest instead of hanging only on the nails and then as well
as the ply gusset I'd bolt fully-thru the posts and the stringers.

Were in the Oak Ridge/Clinton area for 25+ yr, but that was now 15+ yr
ago, sorry. Wasn't Frank Shetterly by any chance't...looks like
something he'd've done when built the spec house we bought there...but
I'm sure he must be long deceased by now; that was '78.

--

On 5/31/2016 3:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Lets say you have an idea that uses wood and doesn't involve welding. How would you join these stringers? I searched and searched and could not find anything like my situation. I believe most builders would have put a 4'x4' landing between the two sets. This guy put a not quite double depth step in the middle because he didn't realize he was doing it until he put on the treads. I plan on cutting that one extra step and sliding the lower set of stringers forward to properly meet the upper stringers. A 4x4 landing is not possible, the steps would extend too far into the driveway. If you have a picture that would be great although I'm not sure where we could post them, I assume they aren't allowed here.
Thanks,
Tony

You don't join stringers, you ****ing idiot.

On Tue, 31 May 2016 20:26:17 -0700 (PDT), Tony Botchagaloop
wrote:

On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 9:24:27 PM UTC-4, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 5/31/2016 6:55 PM, wrote:
I have this botched job a "pro" did for me. Unfortunately there are no building codes here so the only option is to sue in small claims court, and that is not a sure thing either due to the lack of codes here.

The stairway is 18 steps long, outside up to the attic/loft of my garage. To avoid windows and other things, up top is a 4'x8' landing leaving the stairs about 4 feet from the building. Instead of ordering special order stringers long enough, he used 2 sets and he did a number on how they join and are supported in the middle of the run. I've been going through multiple idea's on how to fix it (multiple problems) and I've gotten to the point where I'm thinking of making something out of steel U channel that would fit the 2x12 stringers at the bottom edge, centered at the stringer joints, not sure how far to extend it, an I'd weld upside down U's to fit 4x4 posts to set on and be bolted to. Without you seeing this I suppose this is hard or impossible thing to picture?

Sounds like a terrible way of doing something, but I'm sure it can be
fixed. The method dpb suggested would work. He suggested 48", but I'd
go even longer.

You mention they are supported in the middle of the run. Do you mean
something from the stringer to the ground? I'd do that.

You can post a photo at various web sites and post a link. tinypic.com
is one.

Yes there are 3 4x4's from the joint in the stringer to the ground (small concrete pads) The pic to prevent sway was my fist concern so I tore it off and added 2 2x4's to make an X. Then I was looking at the bad cuts and didn't even realize at first how the upper stringer support basically gave it about 1" of support if the wood were to split. I put temporary braces under that because I had to get up to the loft with some heavy stuff. I couldn't believe he left the middle stringer like that when he left for the day. The next morning by the time I got out there he had all the treads on. I showed it to him and he looked at the kid helping him and said "tear off all those steps". I already saw the mess he made pulling out one step and didn't want him to do more harm than good, so I told him to take a sawzall between the stringer and the treads and cut the nails, then move it over, and it's still crooked!

I had paid for the materials since I had a special 10% off offer from Lowes and at first I paid him for the labor. After realizing just how poor things were I canceled the check, then called him and told him. He said he would fix it all and sent 3 guys here this morning but he didn't show. I told them to start with making the middle step the same as the rest. They said no, they would fix other stuff I didn't even show here. One more time I told them to fix the middle step, they said no so I told them to leave.




Not able to see the second picture, but is it possible to "sister"
the stringers, overlapping the joint 100% with the second stringer?
I'd do all 3, full lenth. Splice the new lumber in the middle of the 2
old peices on each stringer. Screw and glue.

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:11:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:





Not able to see the second picture, but is it possible to "sister"
the stringers, overlapping the joint 100% with the second stringer?
I'd do all 3, full lenth. Splice the new lumber in the middle of the 2
old peices on each stringer. Screw and glue.

There is still the problem of the middle step being a different tread
depth than the others.

As Tony said in his OP, the contractor put "not quite double depth step"
where the 2 stringers meet. Even a double depth step would probably be safer
since the user would be (might be?) able to take an extra step just like
they would on a landing. A "not quite double depth step" sounds like a fall
just waiting to happen, especially when carrying things down the stairs.

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:34:50 PM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:11:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:





Not able to see the second picture, but is it possible to "sister"
the stringers, overlapping the joint 100% with the second stringer?
I'd do all 3, full lenth. Splice the new lumber in the middle of the 2
old peices on each stringer. Screw and glue.

There is still the problem of the middle step being a different tread
depth than the others.

As Tony said in his OP, the contractor put "not quite double depth step"
where the 2 stringers meet. Even a double depth step would probably be safer
since the user would be (might be?) able to take an extra step just like
they would on a landing. A "not quite double depth step" sounds like a fall
just waiting to happen, especially when carrying things down the stairs.

I'll be taking care of that mis cut end, well 95% of it then I will add blocks in the little space. I actually had cut pieces to fit in that void but took them out before they came to fix things.

Anyway I thought I said it but maybe not. I plan on cutting the lower stringers horizontally from the 2nd from top step. Cutting out the 4x4 more and at an angle, then sliding the entire lower section forward to fit exactly under the top stringers and on top of its new footer. I'll have everything braced and 2 helpers. Then comes the plywood and bolts. I had also given the thought of short stringers centered over the joint, but it would be that much more the balusters would stick out. I assume the plywood will be pressure treated, hate to think of what that will cost. Should I leave it out in the sun for a while before installing ... or never mind I guess I could use Gorilla glue on wet wood?

On 06/01/2016 2:02 PM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
....

Anyway I thought I said it but maybe not. I plan on cutting the
lower stringers horizontally from the 2nd from top step. Cutting out
the 4x4 more and at an angle, then sliding the entire lower section
forward to fit exactly under the top stringers and on top of its new
footer. I'll have everything braced and 2 helpers. Then comes the
plywood and bolts. I had also given the thought of short stringers
centered over the joint, but it would be that much more the balusters
would stick out. I assume the plywood will be pressure treated, hate
to think of what that will cost. Should I leave it out in the sun
for a while before installing ... or never mind I guess I could use
Gorilla glue on wet wood?

Absolutely forget the "gorilla glue"; it's terrible for the purpose
(actually, it's not _much_ good for anything, when get right down to it
other than cash cow for Gorilla Glue Co.).

It will only bond well on well-fitted fresh wood surfaces and under
clamping pressure; the vaunted "gap filling" properties of polyurethane
glues (which it is) is nonsense; it just foams and leaves a worthless
blob which has absolutely no strength whatsoever.

Use something like
http://www.liquidnails.com/products/construction-adhesive-LN940 or
similar instead.

Exterior ply isn't particularly expensive, and there's no advantage in
leaving it out first; unlike construction lumber, it's dry already
(altho you _can_ get dried PT lumber one can be sure a bunch of bozo's
like this didn't use it ).

--


Use

Ed Pawlowski posted for all of us...



On 5/31/2016 11:26 PM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:

Yes there are 3 4x4's from the joint in the stringer to the ground (small concrete pads) The pic to prevent sway was my fist concern so I tore it off and added 2 2x4's to make an X. Then I was looking at the bad cuts and didn't even realize at first how the upper stringer support basically gave it about 1" of support if the wood were to split. I put temporary braces under that because I had to get up to the loft with some heavy stuff. I
couldn't believe he left the middle stringer like that when he left for the day. The next morning by the time I got out there he had all the treads on. I showed it to him and he looked at the kid helping him and said "tear off all those steps". I already saw the mess he made pulling out one step and didn't want him to do more harm than good, so I told him to take a sawzall between the stringer and the treads and cut the nails, then move it over,
and it's still crooked!

I had paid for the materials since I had a special 10% off offer from Lowes and at first I paid him for the labor. After realizing just how poor things were I canceled the check, then called him and told him. He said he would fix it all and sent 3 guys here this morning but he didn't show. I told them to start with making the middle step the same as the rest. They said no, they would fix other stuff I didn't even show here. One more time I
told them to fix the middle step, they said no so I told them to leave.






OMG. I'd consider starting over. What a mess.

I agree. The first picture really brought out the incompetence. The stairs
probably don't have same rise and tread.

The only method other than stringer replacement is to install posts and
splices under the existing splice point. You will have to install extra
framing to x-brace to knit the top and bottom sections together. It's not
worth it. Or put a landing in which will be more work.

--
Tekkie

DerbyDad03 posted for all of us...



What is that second image? It sure isn't your stairs.


It's spam for some s/w

--
Tekkie

On 06/01/2016 01:37 PM, Tekkie® wrote:
DerbyDad03 posted for all of us...


What is that second image? It sure isn't your stairs.

It's spam for some s/w


Or it might be more BGP if ya know what I mean.

On Wed, 1 Jun 2016 11:34:46 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:11:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:





Not able to see the second picture, but is it possible to "sister"
the stringers, overlapping the joint 100% with the second stringer?
I'd do all 3, full lenth. Splice the new lumber in the middle of the 2
old peices on each stringer. Screw and glue.

There is still the problem of the middle step being a different tread
depth than the others.

As Tony said in his OP, the contractor put "not quite double depth step"
where the 2 stringers meet. Even a double depth step would probably be safer
since the user would be (might be?) able to take an extra step just like
they would on a landing. A "not quite double depth step" sounds like a fall
just waiting to happen, especially when carrying things down the stairs.
Missed that. Definite;ly need mto correct that too - so likely easier
to just start over and do it right. I can't figure out how some guys
think they can call themselves "CONTRACTORS" or even "HANDYMEN"

On Wed, 1 Jun 2016 12:02:15 -0700 (PDT), Tony Botchagaloop
wrote:

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:34:50 PM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 2:11:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:





Not able to see the second picture, but is it possible to "sister"
the stringers, overlapping the joint 100% with the second stringer?
I'd do all 3, full lenth. Splice the new lumber in the middle of the 2
old peices on each stringer. Screw and glue.

There is still the problem of the middle step being a different tread
depth than the others.

As Tony said in his OP, the contractor put "not quite double depth step"
where the 2 stringers meet. Even a double depth step would probably be safer
since the user would be (might be?) able to take an extra step just like
they would on a landing. A "not quite double depth step" sounds like a fall
just waiting to happen, especially when carrying things down the stairs.

I'll be taking care of that mis cut end, well 95% of it then I will add blocks in the little space. I actually had cut pieces to fit in that void but took them out before they came to fix things.

Anyway I thought I said it but maybe not. I plan on cutting the lower stringers horizontally from the 2nd from top step. Cutting out the 4x4 more and at an angle, then sliding the entire lower section forward to fit exactly under the top stringers and on top of its new footer. I'll have everything braced and 2 helpers. Then comes the plywood and bolts. I had also given the thought of short stringers centered over the joint, but it would be that much more the balusters would stick out. I assume the plywood will be pressure treated, hate to think of what that will cost. Should I leave it out in the sun for a while before installing ... or never mind I guess I could use Gorilla glue on wet wood?
Put the "sisters" on the inside and there is no effect on the
ballisters. I'd use PL Plus to glue it, and I'd want the wood pretty
dry.

On Wed, 01 Jun 2016 14:26:29 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 06/01/2016 2:02 PM, Tony Botchagaloop wrote:
...

Anyway I thought I said it but maybe not. I plan on cutting the
lower stringers horizontally from the 2nd from top step. Cutting out
the 4x4 more and at an angle, then sliding the entire lower section
forward to fit exactly under the top stringers and on top of its new
footer. I'll have everything braced and 2 helpers. Then comes the
plywood and bolts. I had also given the thought of short stringers
centered over the joint, but it would be that much more the balusters
would stick out. I assume the plywood will be pressure treated, hate
to think of what that will cost. Should I leave it out in the sun
for a while before installing ... or never mind I guess I could use
Gorilla glue on wet wood?

Absolutely forget the "gorilla glue"; it's terrible for the purpose
(actually, it's not _much_ good for anything, when get right down to it
other than cash cow for Gorilla Glue Co.).

It will only bond well on well-fitted fresh wood surfaces and under
clamping pressure; the vaunted "gap filling" properties of polyurethane
glues (which it is) is nonsense; it just foams and leaves a worthless
blob which has absolutely no strength whatsoever.

Use something like
http://www.liquidnails.com/products/construction-adhesive-LN940 or
similar instead.

Exterior ply isn't particularly expensive, and there's no advantage in
leaving it out first; unlike construction lumber, it's dry already
(altho you _can_ get dried PT lumber one can be sure a bunch of bozo's
like this didn't use it ).
PT ply can be pretty well saturated with water too. I've cut it with
a circular saw and had a plume of more water than sawdust.

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 5:42:10 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Put the "sisters" on the inside and there is no effect on the
ballisters. I'd use PL Plus to glue it, and I'd want the wood pretty
dry.

If the right side was the same as the left, that would be no problem. But it's not, so it is.