viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75479788098690

I want to store a kayak on that spot. It's higher than the beach by
several feet and therefore less susceptible to storm action.

I'm hyper-sensitive to poison ivy, so I need to clear that spot out in
such a way that working there (as in burying a dry-land "Anchor",
placing the support blocks for the kayak, and repeatedly
placing/retrieving the kayak won't leave me with poison ivy.

This is coastal Southern New Jersey - where poison ivy *really*
thrives... I can think of whole areas that seem to be held together by
the stuff.

That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable.

This does not have to happen tomorrow, or next week, or even next month.
Storm season is coming and it's probably best to wait until next spring
to actually place the kayak.

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

Short-term, there's no need for any vegetation at all to survive in that
area.

Long term, I'd try to plant it with beach grass and fertilize it hoping
to maintain a poison ivy-free/erosion-free zone.

Anybody have a plan?
--
Pete Cresswell

On 9/16/2015 5:45 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75479788098690

I want to store a kayak on that spot. It's higher than the beach by
several feet and therefore less susceptible to storm action.

I'm hyper-sensitive to poison ivy, so I need to clear that spot out in
such a way that working there (as in burying a dry-land "Anchor",
placing the support blocks for the kayak, and repeatedly
placing/retrieving the kayak won't leave me with poison ivy.

This is coastal Southern New Jersey - where poison ivy *really*
thrives... I can think of whole areas that seem to be held together by
the stuff.

That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable.

This does not have to happen tomorrow, or next week, or even next month.
Storm season is coming and it's probably best to wait until next spring
to actually place the kayak.

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

I think the only "high probability of success" is likely to be
replacing the "soil" with something in which plants can't grow.
E.g., some asphalt, concrete, etc.

Short-term, there's no need for any vegetation at all to survive in that
area.

Even deploying herbicides will probably only be a temporary measure.
Sands "move" during storms and nominal beach activity. So, any treated
"soil" will eventually move or be overblown.

You might also encounter some regulatory issues trying to deploy certain
strong chemicals on the beachfront (assuming you even have the "right"
to modify the property).

Long term, I'd try to plant it with beach grass and fertilize it hoping
to maintain a poison ivy-free/erosion-free zone.

Anybody have a plan?

"(PeteCresswell)" writes:

viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330

I really don't see any poison ivy there. Is that stuff near the back
all poison ivy?

https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75479788098690

Can't see anything there.

I want to store a kayak on that spot. It's higher than the beach by
several feet and therefore less susceptible to storm action.

Can you mow that? Looks like a beach.
I don't think you can do much with that at all.
Set up some saw horses, put kayak on top?
Wear shoes, socks, long pants and you'll be fine.

--
Dan Espen

On Wednesday, September 16, 2015 at 7:45:25 PM UTC-5, (PeteCresswell) wrote:

This does not have to happen tomorrow, or next week, or even next month.
Storm season is coming and it's probably best to wait until next spring
to actually place the kayak.

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

Short-term, there's no need for any vegetation at all to survive in that
area.

Long term, I'd try to plant it with beach grass and fertilize it hoping
to maintain a poison ivy-free/erosion-free zone.

Anybody have a plan?
--
Pete Cresswell

I don't see definite poison ivy in the pics, but if so I also don't see a good resolution. It takes multiple applications of herbicide to kill it and you would also be killing the grasses, and that's illegal on many shores because grasses control erosion.

Also remember to avoid any poison ivy area during or after a rain. The oils wash off the plant and float on any standing water. I learned that from experience when fishing near a creek bank and sticking my hand in the water.

On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 20:45:20 -0400, "(PeteCresswell)"
wrote:

viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75479788098690

I want to store a kayak on that spot. It's higher than the beach by
several feet and therefore less susceptible to storm action.

I'm hyper-sensitive to poison ivy, so I need to clear that spot out in
such a way that working there (as in burying a dry-land "Anchor",
placing the support blocks for the kayak, and repeatedly
placing/retrieving the kayak won't leave me with poison ivy.

This is coastal Southern New Jersey - where poison ivy *really*
thrives... I can think of whole areas that seem to be held together by
the stuff.

That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable.

This does not have to happen tomorrow, or next week, or even next month.
Storm season is coming and it's probably best to wait until next spring
to actually place the kayak.

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

Short-term, there's no need for any vegetation at all to survive in that
area.

Long term, I'd try to plant it with beach grass and fertilize it hoping
to maintain a poison ivy-free/erosion-free zone.

Anybody have a plan?

Ortho Brush B Gone will whack the poison ivy and a lot of grasses are
pretty much immune to it. I would just put some in a spray bottle and
test a small patch.
I know the Cogan grass here (an invasive exotic) just laughs at BB
gone. All of the leafy stuff dies. I target air potato, Brazilian
pepper and carrot wood trees with it.

Be very careful with any burning. The smoke is poison

(PeteCresswell) wrote, on Wed, 16 Sep 2015 20:45:20 -0400:

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

I'm an expert in poison oak, by now (if your jeans aren't blackened like
tar, then you have never been in "real" poison oak). Poison ivy is
similar, only a lot easier most of the time, to deal with in some ways
(but harder in others).

I have pictures of everything I say below, if you want to see them.

Bear in mind that the chemistry is similar between Poison Oak and Poison
Ivy (the urushiol for poison ivy is only a few carbons different than for
poison oak); therefore, the immunology is similar, as is the protection &
cleanup.

A lot depends on you though.

Do you want to risk getting urushiol on your skin? How clean are you with
your aseptic technique? Are you sloppy with cleaning your tools, etc.

I have personally cleaned out (i.e., eradicated, as in a genocidal
maniac) probably many thousands of poison oak vines and cut probably
thousands more (just today, I cut perhaps fifty thick ones, as thick as
your wrist and two or three today were too thick to cut with my loppers).

What "I" do, is cover myself in long-sleeved clothes (t-shirt + sweat
shirt) and jeans and calf-length socks and boots and tig-welder's gloves.

Sometimes I wear a hat, but, my hair protects my head from poison oak.

When you're done, if those clothes don't have obvious spit-sized spots of
black ALL OVER THEM, then, you are just toying with poison ivy; if your
clothes aren't blackened, you're not really being exposed to anything.

What I do, at least with poison oak, is cut the vines as close as I
can to the ground, and then spray undiluted (usually 41%) glyphosate
(aka Roundup Concentrate) on the cut stem. If it's my property, I pull
the cut portion and pile it up away from where I'm cleaning out; but if
it's on open land (I kill poison oak wherever I see it - I'm a genocidal
maniac), I let the vines lie where they lay.

It's best to spray the glyphosate concentrate within a few minutes (I
generally do it within fifteen or thirty seconds); but I have found
research papers which intimate you have plenty of time (hours, and maybe
even a day or two). Most Internet web sites say to do it right away
though, so, that's why I bring the time frame up.

I've researched the literature, and for a variety of reasons, now (late
summer) is a GREAT time to use such translocation herbicides, which will
diffuse downward through the phloem to systemically starve the plant (by
preventing the plant from building aromatic amino acids).

Bear in mind that you can't possibly avoid getting the urushiol on your
skin. It's nearly impossible, unless you wear a space suit or if you wash
up every fifteen minutes (which is impractical, and counter productive in
various ways).

The urushiol only takes about fifteen minutes to diffuse through the
outer layers of your skin, just as the glyphosate does the same thing
through the cutin when foliarly applied to leaves. You just have to deal
with it, by cleaning up afterward, and knowing EXACTLY what you're doing.

When you're done murdering the plants, you wash your clothes in normal
detergent, taking no other special precautions with the clothes. For the
tools and boots and gloves, you liberally cover with Dawn or Palmolive &
wash with a garden hose. Same thing with your body. I generally do a set
of 3 washes, covering myself in Dawn until I'm white as a ghost, and then
rinsing in nice hot shower water.

If I know I'm going to be thoroughly contaminated, I bother with the
driller's clay (bentonite); but generally that's just too much trouble.

If I have been already contaminated especially heavily, I add a bit of
finesse to the full-body cleanup, which is to add five ingredients to the
shower routine, namely (1) big surfactant, aka, Dawn; (2) oxidizer, aka
bleach, (3) surface tension reducer, aka rubbing alcohol, (4) abrasive,
aka toothpaste, and, if I planned ahead, (5) really small surfactant, aka
spermicidal cream.

I can explain why this mix, as each ingredient does its job, but, I don't
really have to explain, as if you look at the professional creams that
sell for $40/ounce, you'll see those five ingredients. Only government
workers can afford to slather on $40/ounce cleaners, so, that's why I use
the common ingredients listed above when I'm really badly contaminated.

BTW, the net is filled with idiotic wives tales on how to handle not
getting the rash from poison oak/ivy (I should write a book), so if you
have any questions, just ask.

As I mentioned, I have a picture of everything, if you want it.

RedAlt5 wrote, on Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:29:12 -0700:

avoid any poison ivy area during or after a rain.
The oils wash off the plant and float on any standing water.

This is an interesting observation, because urushiol is not really an
"oil" in the strict sense of the word.

The urushiol is (sort of) an alcohol (specifically a catechol, which is a
diol of benzene, which is simply benzene with two OH groups) suspended in
an oily sap (a plant oleoresin).

The catechol alone is actually rapidly soluble in water because the two
OH groups allow hydrogen bonding, and, in fact, sulfonic acid catechols
are commonly dissolved in human urine, by way of example.

But urushiol has an attached aliphatic hydrocarbon chain, which then
makes the molecule partially hydrophobic (and slightly "oily").

Given all that, I guess the oily oleoresin containing urushiol could
"float" on water, in which case, it would do what you said. I will need
to look that up though, as much of what people say about poison oak is
based on "bro logic", but not science.

I must admit though, until you said that it floats on water, that I had
never thought of that - so - I will need to look it up further before I
can say, either way, whether urushiol floats on water, or not.

Danny D. wrote, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 04:06:02 +0000:

As I mentioned, I have a picture of everything, if you want it.

I just uploaded these pics for Oren.... who taught me all about
huckleberries when they're in season... so I'm repaying the favor ...

Cut poison oak vine with black oxidized urushiol stains in the phloem:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/598/21...0253181129.jpg

Thick poison oak vines, as thick as your wrist or larger:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/626/21...914087715a.jpg

Tig-welding gloves covered in urushiol stains:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/626/21...c6133030_c.jpg

Bluejeans with spit-sized black splotches of urushiol:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/704/21...af7f6e9f_z.jpg

Washing everything, including the climbing rope, in the washing machine:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5758/2...3afbdea81a.jpg

Washing boots and loppers outside with Dawn and a garden hose:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5807/2...39b05153_c.jpg

On 09/17/2015 12:32 AM, Danny D. wrote:
RedAlt5 wrote, on Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:29:12 -0700:

avoid any poison ivy area during or after a rain.
The oils wash off the plant and float on any standing water.

This is an interesting observation, because urushiol is not really an
"oil" in the strict sense of the word.


I've done some informal testing on myself and I've found that I can rub poison ivy leaves on most areas of my arms and legs, wait 90 minutes and
wash it off with no reaction. Unfortunately, two hours gets me the expected nasty reaction.

50% roundup...... 50% poision ivy killer sprayed from a small spray bottle applied to actively growing poision ivy will kill it dead. DO NOT PRUNE or remove any vegation / leaves the killer stuff is absorbed thru the leaves!

this will be a lifetime project, poision ivy will over time grow back.

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and store you kayack at a different location.

incidently the roots, even if dead can give you the rash too.

its best to stock up on steroids before proceeding

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 05:13:48 -0400, Ron
wrote:

On 09/17/2015 12:32 AM, Danny D. wrote:
RedAlt5 wrote, on Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:29:12 -0700:

avoid any poison ivy area during or after a rain.
The oils wash off the plant and float on any standing water.

This is an interesting observation, because urushiol is not really an
"oil" in the strict sense of the word.


I've done some informal testing on myself and I've found that I can rub poison ivy leaves on most areas of my arms and legs, wait 90 minutes and
wash it off with no reaction. Unfortunately, two hours gets me the expected nasty reaction.

Very interesting. Maybe I'll be more diligent about washing my legs
when I think they may have gotten PI on them.

A couple weeks ago, for what I think is the first time, I foud a row of
poke weed growing behind my next-door neighbor's townhouse. One guy on
the web said he got fiercely itchy from its touching his ankle, though
no one else complains about that (except whoever warned him not to touch
it.) . Eating it, however, is poisonous, all parts. Unless cooked
right, and that's just the leaves and I'm not going to try it.

On Wednesday, September 16, 2015 at 9:17:51 PM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
On 9/16/2015 5:45 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75479788098690

I want to store a kayak on that spot. It's higher than the beach by
several feet and therefore less susceptible to storm action.

I'm hyper-sensitive to poison ivy, so I need to clear that spot out in
such a way that working there (as in burying a dry-land "Anchor",
placing the support blocks for the kayak, and repeatedly
placing/retrieving the kayak won't leave me with poison ivy.

This is coastal Southern New Jersey - where poison ivy *really*
thrives... I can think of whole areas that seem to be held together by
the stuff.

That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable.

This does not have to happen tomorrow, or next week, or even next month.
Storm season is coming and it's probably best to wait until next spring
to actually place the kayak.

Meanwhile, I'd like to kill that poison ivy, have it stay killed, and
not get a case of the stuff preparing/using the site.

I think the only "high probability of success" is likely to be
replacing the "soil" with something in which plants can't grow.
E.g., some asphalt, concrete, etc.

Short-term, there's no need for any vegetation at all to survive in that
area.

Even deploying herbicides will probably only be a temporary measure.
Sands "move" during storms and nominal beach activity. So, any treated
"soil" will eventually move or be overblown.

You might also encounter some regulatory issues trying to deploy certain
strong chemicals on the beachfront (assuming you even have the "right"
to modify the property).


Or even if removing/changing natural vegetation that close to the beach is
allowed at all. NJ is one of the places with a lot of regulations and
with both environmental concerns, leaving nature in place to help prevent
storm surges, etc, I wouldn't be surprised that there are restrictions.

Assuming it is OK, then I would use one of the brush killers that
are available.

On Wednesday, September 16, 2015 at 9:49:30 PM UTC-4, net cop wrote:
"(PeteCresswell)" writes:

viz:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1081497...75476664699330

I really don't see any poison ivy there. Is that stuff near the back
all poison ivy?


That's a good point too. I don't see anything either, but the pics aren't
that detailed, I was assuming there is in fact poison ivy there.

On 9/17/2015 12:32 AM, Danny D. wrote:
Given all that, I guess the oily oleoresin containing urushiol could
"float" on water, in which case, it would do what you said. I will need
to look that up though, as much of what people say about poison oak is
based on "bro logic", but not science.

I must admit though, until you said that it floats on water, that I had
never thought of that - so - I will need to look it up further before I
can say, either way, whether urushiol floats on water, or not.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urushiol
Density 0.96, so it's pretty close to density of water.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 03:55:55 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

50% roundup...... 50% poision ivy killer sprayed from a small spray bottle applied to actively growing poision ivy will kill it dead. DO NOT PRUNE or remove any vegation / leaves the killer stuff is absorbed thru the leaves!

this will be a lifetime project, poision ivy will over time grow back.

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

And even before it kills you, when your lungs itch, how do you scratch
them? How do you put calamine lotion inside your lungs? It sounds
like worse than anything I've ever had to have poison ivy in my lungs.

Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I
don't have to touch the skin and make the itching start up again. I
used to use rHuli-Spray, but they don't make that anymore.

This is what they call it now, Johnson and Johnson Calamine Spray.
When I looked this up a few years ago, it was also by J&J but it was
called First Aid spray or something like that.
https://www.mooremedical.com/index.c...ID=20335&spx=1

"
Calamine Spray works on contact to provide fast, cooling relief of the
itching and pain associated with many minor skin irritations. Calamine
based formula dries the oozing and weeping of poison ivy, oak & sumac"
I don't care about the oozing and weeping, only the itching. I'm not
sure this really is rhuli-spray. I have a can or tube somwhere. I'll
try to see whether it contains calamine.


its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and store you kayack at a different location.

incidently the roots, even if dead can give you the rash too.

its best to stock up on steroids before proceeding

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 09:29:34 -0400, micky
wrote:


Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I

It uses benzocaine. If you don't have benzocaine, you can use your
benzene cigarette lighter for the same effect, maybe.

don't have to touch the skin and make the itching start up again. I
used to use rHuli-Spray, but they don't make that anymore.

trader_4 wrote, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 04:42:28 -0700:

Assuming it is OK, then I would use one of the brush killers that are
available.

Glyphosate alone, while not the best for killing ivy with a foliar spray
method, dissolves well in water, and is rather biodegradable, so, it's
approved for use within so many (hundreds?) of feet of a drinking water
supply.

The problem with any herbicide, including glyphosate mixtures, is that
the adjuvants added to aid in surface wetting are generally as bad, or
worse, to the environment and to you.

I'm not saying it's at the critical level - but - my point is only that
you have to look at ALL the ingredients, when you worry about collateral
damage danger.

Ron wrote, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 05:13:48 -0400:

I've done some informal testing on myself and I've found that I can rub
poison ivy leaves on most areas of my arms and legs, wait 90 minutes and
wash it off with no reaction. Unfortunately, two hours gets me the
expected nasty reaction.

I generally have the urushiol on me for five to eight hours, when I'm
working in the field on a big volunteer project, and I follow the *same*
regimen every time, which is to wash, wash, wash.

I find that I can even wash days later, especially when I use the very
light abrasive (toothpaste and toothbrush on isolated rashes), and then
coat with the spermicide (which, reputedly, trades places with the
quinone hapten that forms in the Langerhans cells).

Dunno if this belated scratch-and-switch method actually works so late in
the process (I didn't run a controlled study); but I at least *hope* it
works, so late in the process, since urushiol clearly gets through your
skin to the Langerhans cells within fifteen minutes.

On 9/17/2015 9:33 AM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 09:29:34 -0400, micky
wrote:


Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I

It uses benzocaine. If you don't have benzocaine, you can use your
benzene cigarette lighter for the same effect, maybe.


I'm curious what is a benzene cigarette lighter?

I've seen sun burn spray with lidocaine.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

Per Dan Espen:
I really don't see any poison ivy there. Is that stuff near the back
all poison ivy?

The photo's detain is not all that good, but the stuff is everywhere -
thick enough to show up green in the right foreground.

I'd expect a huge case of poison ivy if I tried to mow it - having had
total coverage on both legs once just by standing downwind of burning
poison ivy...... mower spraying a mist of sap and all that.
--
Pete Cresswell

Per :
Also remember to avoid any poison ivy area during or after a rain. The oils wash off
the plant and float on any standing water. I learned that from experience when fishing near a
creek bank and sticking my hand in the water.

Ouch!... that's good to know.

I guess it's the flip side of the advice I have heard to wash any
suspectedly-exposed body parts in plenty of cold water.

--
Pete Cresswell

Per bob haller:
its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and store you kayack at a different location.

Sounds like that is the most logical course of action.

This little plot was calling out to me because of it's 2-3' elevation
above the garden-variety lunar tide/storm surge.
--
Pete Cresswell

Per micky:
Very interesting. Maybe I'll be more diligent about washing my legs
when I think they may have gotten PI on them.

Maybe somebody who really knows can confirm or disprove, but my
impression is that it is important to NOT use soap..... so replace
"wash" with "rinse".
--
Pete Cresswell

Per Danny D.:
If I have been already contaminated especially heavily, I add a bit of
finesse to the full-body cleanup, which is to add five ingredients to the
shower routine, namely (1) big surfactant, aka, Dawn; (2) oxidizer, aka
bleach, (3) surface tension reducer, aka rubbing alcohol, (4) abrasive,
aka toothpaste, and, if I planned ahead, (5) really small surfactant, aka
spermicidal cream.

Well, so much for my ill-informed comment about avoiding soap and using
fresh water....
--
Pete Cresswell

(PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Dan Espen:
I really don't see any poison ivy there. Is that stuff near the back
all poison ivy?

The photo's detain is not all that good, but the stuff is everywhere -
thick enough to show up green in the right foreground.

I'd expect a huge case of poison ivy if I tried to mow it - having had
total coverage on both legs once just by standing downwind of burning
poison ivy...... mower spraying a mist of sap and all that.

I'm REALLY surprised to see this, after you previosly wrote:

"That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable."

Want to inhale that into your lungs? And do the same to anyone nearby?

On 9/17/2015 3:55 AM, bob haller wrote:
50% roundup...... 50% poision ivy killer sprayed from a small spray bottle
applied to actively growing poision ivy will kill it dead. DO NOT PRUNE or
remove any vegation / leaves the killer stuff is absorbed thru the leaves!

this will be a lifetime project, poision ivy will over time grow back.

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if
your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

This is true of many plants. E.g., here, folks tend to use oleander
as a hedge around their homes. It grows quickly, densely, etc.
Each time I see some forest fire burning, I wonder what would happen
*here* for those folks whose homes are surrounded by the stuff!

its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and store
you kayack at a different location.

incidently the roots, even if dead can give you the rash too.

its best to stock up on steroids before proceeding

(PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per bob haller:
its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and
store you kayack at a different location.

Sounds like that is the most logical course of action.

This little plot was calling out to me because of it's 2-3' elevation
above the garden-variety lunar tide/storm surge.

Which is probably a result of the stabilizing plant growth.

On 9/17/2015 6:29 AM, micky wrote:
Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I don't
have to touch the skin and make the itching start up again. I used to
use rHuli-Spray, but they don't make that anymore.

I was "lucky" enough (frown) to "catch" chicken pox for a second time
a few years back (I now am leary of which OTHER of those childhood
diseases can "strike twice"?! I had assumed NONE of them were worth
my attention as I'd had -- or been innoculated against -- all of them,
already!). The calamine lotion (also caladryl) only provides the very
*briefest* relief.

The trick I've used over the years for mosquito bites and other persisitent
iches is to run the afflicted area under very hot water (i.e., almost to
the point of inflicting damage!) for as long as you can tolerate.

Of course, this burns while you are doing it. But, it seems to
overwhelm the "itch receptors" -- at least as long as any topical
lotion would! So, as long as you don't "stimulate" that are
(by scratching at it), you have some relief.

[Apparently, "itch" is conducted via different nerve pathways than "pain".
I guess evolution decided that some threats needed to be treated via
a different mechanism]

In my case, my hands were afflicted. Ever try to "scratch" your palms??
Or, the sides of your fingers? The webbing between them? frown

OTOH, 10 or 20 seconds under hot water gave me instant relief.
Impossible to describe how *great* that heat felt! SWMBO thought I was
having an "affair" with the kitchen faucet! :-/

[The skin on your palms is so thick that it took a full four
weeks for the "blisters" to reach the top surface. By then,
the disease had long since run its course and the blisters
were already "drained" when they appeared.]

Cortisone cream/ointment is nowhere near as effective (esp
on the palms... doesn't "absorb" well). Benadryl cream
seems to be a good alternative (for other areas). I keep a
tube of it in the car for just that reason.

its probably easier to pick a area not infected with poision ivy and store you kayack at a different location.



Sounds like that is the most logical course of action.
This little plot was calling out to me because of it's 2-3' elevation
above the garden-variety lunar tide/storm surge.



How big an area do you need cleared ?

I've been noting the spread of the invasive Phragmites australis
http://www.invasiveplants.net/phragmites/
and wishing that someone would discover a good use for it ..

I propose that you gather a couple truckloads of it ;
weave it into thick mats ; lay the mats over your area.
Smothering the poison ivy & everything else -
.... an all-natural biodegradable ground cover !
... repeat every few years ?
... patent pending :-)
John T.


--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 10:08:35 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 9/17/2015 9:33 AM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 09:29:34 -0400, micky
wrote:


Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I

It uses benzocaine. If you don't have benzocaine, you can use your
benzene cigarette lighter for the same effect, maybe.


I'm curious what is a benzene cigarette lighter?

I guess I was thinking of propane and butane fuels. Maybe there is
nothing that burns benzene.

I've seen sun burn spray with lidocaine.

Maybe it used to use lidocaine. My main point is that it's an
anestheitic spray and that's what matters to me. Not the calamine.

One spraying can last for 4 hours iirc. as long as I don't touch the
part with the rash.

-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 07:53:41 -0700, Don Y
wrote:

On 9/17/2015 6:29 AM, micky wrote:
Actually, i never got any good results from calamine lotion. I use an
aerosol anesthtic, I think with lydocaine. Spraying it on means I don't
have to touch the skin and make the itching start up again. I used to
use rHuli-Spray, but they don't make that anymore.

I was "lucky" enough (frown) to "catch" chicken pox for a second time
a few years back (I now am leary of which OTHER of those childhood

I can't remember if I ever had chicken pox, and my older brother doesn't
remember either. I think not, but I still got the shingles vaccine.

You know about that don't you, that if you've had chicken pox you're at
clear risk of shingles? To get the vaccine you have to get a
prescription from a doctor and then you can probably get vaccinated at a
pharmacy, even a supermarket one, and other places. I think it cost
me $75. I don't remember if insurance paid any of that or before that.

Shingles can be horrible and it's never good.

diseases can "strike twice"?! I had assumed NONE of them were worth
my attention as I'd had -- or been innoculated against -- all of them,
already!). The calamine lotion (also caladryl) only provides the very
*briefest* relief.

The trick I've used over the years for mosquito bites and other persisitent
iches is to run the afflicted area under very hot water (i.e., almost to
the point of inflicting damage!) for as long as you can tolerate.

Of course, this burns while you are doing it. But, it seems to
overwhelm the "itch receptors" -- at least as long as any topical
lotion would! So, as long as you don't "stimulate" that are
(by scratching at it), you have some relief.

[Apparently, "itch" is conducted via different nerve pathways than "pain".

Interesting. One radio progrram on public radio, the guy said that
itching might be the lowest level of pain. But that was 10 years ago.
they could have changed their mind by now, or they could disagree.

I guess evolution decided that some threats needed to be treated via
a different mechanism]

In my case, my hands were afflicted. Ever try to "scratch" your palms??
Or, the sides of your fingers? The webbing between them? frown

Yes on the first two. I don't have webbing any more since the plastic
surgeon did the Duck Treatment on me.

OTOH, 10 or 20 seconds under hot water gave me instant relief.
Impossible to describe how *great* that heat felt! SWMBO thought I was
having an "affair" with the kitchen faucet! :-/

[The skin on your palms is so thick that it took a full four
weeks for the "blisters" to reach the top surface. By then,
the disease had long since run its course and the blisters
were already "drained" when they appeared.]

Cortisone cream/ointment is nowhere near as effective (esp
on the palms... doesn't "absorb" well). Benadryl cream
seems to be a good alternative (for other areas). I keep a
tube of it in the car for just that reason.

I don't think I've ever used cortisone or benadryl.

You're going to hate me but I haven't gotten noticeable mosquito bites
since I've been 21. I think they stil bite me but nothing happens
afterwards. I shoudl go volunteer at a mosquito lab, if I knew where
one was. Okay I looked. Some people hardly ever get bitten. Maybe
that's my advantage

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 10:26:17 -0400,
"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:

Per micky:
Very interesting. Maybe I'll be more diligent about washing my legs
when I think they may have gotten PI on them.

Maybe somebody who really knows can confirm or disprove, but my
impression is that it is important to NOT use soap..... so replace
"wash" with "rinse".

No kildding? "Oil" sounds like it needs soap.

Ron? You said "wash". Did that include soap?

On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 20:45:20 -0400, "(PeteCresswell)"
wrote:

That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable.

Burning it produces toxic fumes ...avoid doing so.

2 cents.

On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 05:04:00 +0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

Danny D. wrote, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 04:06:02 +0000:

As I mentioned, I have a picture of everything, if you want it.

I just uploaded these pics for Oren.... who taught me all about
huckleberries when they're in season... so I'm repaying the favor ...

Cut poison oak vine with black oxidized urushiol stains in the phloem:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/598/21...0253181129.jpg

Thick poison oak vines, as thick as your wrist or larger:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/626/21...914087715a.jpg

Tig-welding gloves covered in urushiol stains:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/626/21...c6133030_c.jpg

Bluejeans with spit-sized black splotches of urushiol:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/704/21...af7f6e9f_z.jpg

Washing everything, including the climbing rope, in the washing machine:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5758/2...3afbdea81a.jpg

Washing boots and loppers outside with Dawn and a garden hose:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5807/2...39b05153_c.jpg

Glad to see you are still kicking and alive, Danny. Been awhile since
you posted. I thought you may have fell out of the tree house G

I'm still your huckleberry.

On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 09:29:34 -0400, micky
wrote:

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

And even before it kills you, when your lungs itch, how do you scratch
them? How do you put calamine lotion inside your lungs? It sounds
like worse than anything I've ever had to have poison ivy in my lungs.

Boy Scouts are taught not to wipe with the wrong leaf. It can be a
PITA.

On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 07:40:09 -0700, Don Y
wrote:

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if
your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

This is true of many plants. E.g., here, folks tend to use oleander
as a hedge around their homes. It grows quickly, densely, etc.
Each time I see some forest fire burning, I wonder what would happen
*here* for those folks whose homes are surrounded by the stuff!

In my last community, Oleander was prohibited for landscaping material
-- apparently some folks are allergic to the pollen.

I've never had a reaction from poison ivy. Melaleuca did give me
trouble, perhaps anaphylactic shock as a child camping under them when
they flowered. Pollen got in my lungs.

http://pesticide.ifas.ufl.edu/course.../Melaleuca.pdf

On 9/17/2015 11:31 AM, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 07:40:09 -0700, Don Y
wrote:

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if
your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

This is true of many plants. E.g., here, folks tend to use oleander
as a hedge around their homes. It grows quickly, densely, etc.
Each time I see some forest fire burning, I wonder what would happen
*here* for those folks whose homes are surrounded by the stuff!

In my last community, Oleander was prohibited for landscaping material
-- apparently some folks are allergic to the pollen.

There are many plants that are "banned" here -- Olive and Mulberry
come to mind -- for similar reason. We have essentially a year round
growing season so *something* is ALWAYS in bloom.

I've never had a reaction from poison ivy. Melaleuca did give me
trouble, perhaps anaphylactic shock as a child camping under them when
they flowered. Pollen got in my lungs.

I have rather intense seasonal allergies. When I finally tried to do something
about it (because I couldn't *breathe*), the MD started with a "scratch test"
on my back (check sensitivities to specific irritants). Of the ~48 (?)
seasonal allergens tested, I produced a strong response to 42 of them.

"Oh, my!"

As a result of that testing, I started an SLT program. It *appeared* to
have a marked impact on my "allergies". After a few years (SLT is a
daily routine that is ongoing, in perpetuity!), I stopped the treatments.
It appears that this was a mistake -- I hadn't "lost" my allergies but,
rather, had just trained my body to suppress them while on the SLT.

So, I'll start that again.

Of course, as with many treatments, medicines, etc., you never know
if it is working. Does my lack of symptoms mean the treatment is
working? Or, are conditions such that I simply WOULDN'T have
symptoms, today??

(sort of like taking those elephant repellant pills... is the fact
that there are no elephants around a consequence of the pills?
Or, just that there *are* no elephants to be repelled??)

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 17 Sep 2015 11:53:57 -0700, Don Y
wrote:

On 9/17/2015 11:31 AM, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 17 Sep 2015 07:40:09 -0700, Don Y
wrote:

NEVER BURN POISION IVY, the smoke can give you poision ivy in your lungs. if
your very sensitive to it this can kill you.

This is true of many plants. E.g., here, folks tend to use oleander
as a hedge around their homes. It grows quickly, densely, etc.
Each time I see some forest fire burning, I wonder what would happen
*here* for those folks whose homes are surrounded by the stuff!

In my last community, Oleander was prohibited for landscaping material
-- apparently some folks are allergic to the pollen.

There are many plants that are "banned" here -- Olive and Mulberry
come to mind -- for similar reason. We have essentially a year round
growing season so *something* is ALWAYS in bloom.

I've never had a reaction from poison ivy. Melaleuca did give me

I'm not allergic to any food or drug, but poison ivy can really get me.
The rash just drags on and on, and after 18 years in Chicago and NYC,
when I got it and it just didn't go away, I went to the doctor. Boy was
I embarrassed when he said what it was, And it was even worse that it
subsided markedly within 20 minutes of leaving his office. If I'd only
waited another hour.

But then 5 years later, after it lasted what seemed like weeks, I did
the same thing again, and again it subsided before I could fill the
prescription.

trouble, perhaps anaphylactic shock as a child camping under them when
they flowered. Pollen got in my lungs.

I have rather intense seasonal allergies. When I finally tried to do something
about it (because I couldn't *breathe*), the MD started with a "scratch test"
on my back (check sensitivities to specific irritants). Of the ~48 (?)
seasonal allergens tested, I produced a strong response to 42 of them.

"Oh, my!"

As a result of that testing, I started an SLT program. It *appeared* to
have a marked impact on my "allergies". After a few years (SLT is a

SLT?

daily routine that is ongoing, in perpetuity!), I stopped the treatments.
It appears that this was a mistake -- I hadn't "lost" my allergies but,
rather, had just trained my body to suppress them while on the SLT.

So, I'll start that again.

Of course, as with many treatments, medicines, etc., you never know
if it is working. Does my lack of symptoms mean the treatment is

Just talking about this 2 days ago. That's why people stop taking their
high blood pressure pills -- they think they've been cured -- and that's
when they have a stroke.

working? Or, are conditions such that I simply WOULDN'T have
symptoms, today??

(sort of like taking those elephant repellant pills... is the fact
that there are no elephants around a consequence of the pills?
Or, just that there *are* no elephants to be repelled??)

Per Bob F:
I'm REALLY surprised to see this, after you previosly wrote:

"That's a hotel in the background so burning is probably not an option -
although if somebody says liberal application of a flame weeder will do
the trick that might be doable."

Want to inhale that into your lungs? And do the same to anyone nearby?


I have never used a flame weeder and figured there was at least a
possibility that it simply cooked the target rather than setting it on
fire.

Now I know...
--
Pete Cresswell

Per micky:

No kildding? "Oil" sounds like it needs soap.

Ron? You said "wash". Did that include soap?

The account I read claimed that soap emulsified the "Oil" and spread it
around on the skin as one washed with it while plain cold water
dissolved it and carried it away as the rinse water flowed away.

But I would put a lot more cred in whatever Ron says.... who knows who
wrote the stuff I was reading?
--
Pete Cresswell