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#1
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Can't understand plat
A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision.
There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? |
#2
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Can't understand plat
A picture of the plat would make more sense than your description.
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#3
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Can't understand plat
On Wed, 13 May 2015 20:15:37 -0700, micky wrote:
A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? Here in AZ, rural area, EVERY road is private, similar plat plan showing strips I can't build on. Turns 1 acre into 0.79 acre. Explains why when we were looking at houses we kept finding weird lot areas. It is my understanding from a neighbor who has combined 1 acrea with other lots to make a single 6 acre lot that these lands were govt origin and they defined strips along at least two side to be allocated for 'public access' roadways. Confirmed by thorough explanation from Zoning employees at County. |
#4
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Can't understand plat
micky wrote:
A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. Some cut. Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? A trip down to the county courthouse might be the best bet. Plus she'd see the history of the ground back to when it was first platted. |
#5
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Can't understand plat
On 5/13/2015 11:15 PM, micky wrote:
A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? Where I live is something like that. When we moved in, the road was private and maintained by a maintenance corporation owned by the community. Several lots were oddly shaped along the road, particularly those at the entrance to the state road. I've got a neighbor in back of me, outside our community, who has a pipe shaped lot where the pipe stem runs ~700 ft from the main plot where the house is for his drive to get to the state road. |
#6
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Can't understand plat
On 5/13/2015 11:15 PM, micky wrote: A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? I am not sure I am following, but could you be looking at easements? The lot owner owns the areas in question, but untility companies have the right to those strips for underground pipes (gas, water) and underground wires (cable, phone, power) and possibly even above ground poles and wires. |
#7
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Can't understand plat
Many jurisdictions require lots to have frontage on a public road.
What you describe gives everyone frontage (10 foot strip ) to that road. Ivan Vegvary |
#8
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Can't understand plat
On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 11:15:39 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? I don't see how anyone is going to give you an answer worth anything without seeing it. It doesn't even seem to fit together, eg: " Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) " What does her lot being 4 sided have to do with what's going on down the private road that goes past other lots?. Seems to me it would be irrelevant. Her lot could be totally irregular, have 7 sides, what would it matter if the question is about something on the edge of the private road? |
#9
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Can't understand plat
On Thu, 14 May 2015 08:09:12 -0400, Frank "frank wrote:
On 5/13/2015 11:15 PM, micky wrote: A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? Where I live is something like that. When we moved in, the road was private and maintained by a maintenance corporation owned by the community. Several lots were oddly shaped along the road, particularly those at the entrance to the state road. I've got a neighbor in back of me, outside our community, who has a pipe shaped lot where the pipe stem runs ~700 ft from the main plot where the house is for his drive to get to the state road. Yeah, that's it. So she really does own the land. I was going to say: although of course it has to be used for the road, but I think the road is no more than 20 feet wide and the pipe stems total 52 feet wide, she owns 10 feet of one side of neighbor's yard, the side that abuts the private road. Interesting, since he's trying to claim 3 feet of her yard on the side where their two yards meet. Last fall he started mowing it and just now he was about to plant bushes on it. She's probably going to have to get a survey done. $1400, I think she said. I'm sure her pipe-stem doesn't really help her, but I wanted us both to understand the situation. The plat refers to a separate document about maintaining the prviate road, but the pipestems probably indicate how the cost is apportioned. She has to pay 1/5 of the her 600 feet (only 300 of which is stem), her neighbor to the right pays the same as she does plus 1/4 of his 300 additional feet. The next neighbor pays the same as #2 plus 1/3 of his 400 additional feet.... and the last one pays what the one to his left does plus the all of his 100 feet. I've wondered about that in the past and this is the only thing that is really fair. Even though the plat shows 10 feet wide strips, in practice they probably divide the width of the road by 5 where there are 5 lots using it, or at least they bill it that way. Even if her 10 feet is all covered by grass. |
#10
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Can't understand plat
On Thu, 14 May 2015 08:41:39 -0400, Pat wrote:
On 5/13/2015 11:15 PM, micky wrote: A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? I am not sure I am following, but could you be looking at easements? The lot owner owns the areas in question, but untility companies have the right to those strips for underground pipes (gas, water) and underground wires (cable, phone, power) and possibly even above ground poles and wires. Besides utility easements there also exist walkway, driveway, and drainage easements, and though this plat doesn't mark any easements, not even utilities**, either the other document about the road goes into the driveway easement, or maybe it's in the deed, which I haven't read. **The plat for my townhouse n'hood marks all of them, except I guess the cable tv runs in the back of the houses and that's not mentioned on the plat. I'm pretty sure they had cable tv when the project was planned, about 1974. Right? Maybe they thought it would be in the front of the houses where it's just called a utility easement, and what utilities are not specified, or maybe they just forgot about cable. Anyhow, there is also a 6' wide walkway easement in the back and the cable company used/uses that space. But no, I wasn't talking about strips for utilities. Frank and Ivan have it right. Thanks anyhow. |
#11
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Can't understand plat
On Thu, 14 May 2015 06:15:23 -0500, Dean Hoffman
wrote: A trip down to the county courthouse might be the best bet. Plus she'd see the history of the ground back to when it was first platted. I found my Plat on the local county web site. Home built in ~1997. |
#12
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Can't understand plat
What others are referring to as pipestem lots are called "flag lots" here in IL. the flagpole gives access to a road while the lot is set back from the road by the length of the flagpole up to the bottom of the flag.
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#13
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Can't understand plat
On 5/14/2015 11:37 AM, micky wrote:
On Thu, 14 May 2015 08:09:12 -0400, Frank "frank wrote: On 5/13/2015 11:15 PM, micky wrote: A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? Where I live is something like that. When we moved in, the road was private and maintained by a maintenance corporation owned by the community. Several lots were oddly shaped along the road, particularly those at the entrance to the state road. I've got a neighbor in back of me, outside our community, who has a pipe shaped lot where the pipe stem runs ~700 ft from the main plot where the house is for his drive to get to the state road. Yeah, that's it. So she really does own the land. I was going to say: although of course it has to be used for the road, but I think the road is no more than 20 feet wide and the pipe stems total 52 feet wide, she owns 10 feet of one side of neighbor's yard, the side that abuts the private road. Interesting, since he's trying to claim 3 feet of her yard on the side where their two yards meet. Last fall he started mowing it and just now he was about to plant bushes on it. She's probably going to have to get a survey done. $1400, I think she said. I'm sure her pipe-stem doesn't really help her, but I wanted us both to understand the situation. The plat refers to a separate document about maintaining the prviate road, but the pipestems probably indicate how the cost is apportioned. She has to pay 1/5 of the her 600 feet (only 300 of which is stem), her neighbor to the right pays the same as she does plus 1/4 of his 300 additional feet. The next neighbor pays the same as #2 plus 1/3 of his 400 additional feet.... and the last one pays what the one to his left does plus the all of his 100 feet. I've wondered about that in the past and this is the only thing that is really fair. Even though the plat shows 10 feet wide strips, in practice they probably divide the width of the road by 5 where there are 5 lots using it, or at least they bill it that way. Even if her 10 feet is all covered by grass. Our deed restrictions called for us to be members of the maintenance association which took care of the road with annual dues and assessments. Fortunately we were able to give the road to the state to maintain and it is no longer a concern. |
#14
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Can't understand plat
"micky" wrote in message ... A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? To easiest way to understand the way it is done in your community is to talk to the town clerk or contact the surveyor who laid out the lots and streets. These people know how they do things in their own area, not opinions from areas that are operated differently. The surveyor can translate what is your property, what is your neighbors and what is owned or controlled by the local government and how he laid it out. |
#15
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Can't understand plat
On Fri, 15 May 2015 14:01:50 -0400, "EXT"
wrote: To easiest way to understand the way it is done in your community is to talk to the town clerk or contact the surveyor who laid out the lots and streets. These people know how they do things in their own area, not opinions from areas that are operated differently. The surveyor can translate what is your property, what is your neighbors and what is owned or controlled by the local government and how he laid it out. True, though surveyors can be off target. (bombs missing target on a test range) On my present old foggy lot, I am the second owner after the developer. My Plat tells fence line on block walls, who owns or is responsible for repair of the wall. One time I did have a lawyer do a Title search. Two inches thick back to native American trails that crossed the land. It was a good read of land, ownership and tranfer. No Mohawk Indians sued me. Not part of 5 nations |
#16
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Can't understand plat
Oren posted for all of us...
On Fri, 15 May 2015 14:01:50 -0400, "EXT" wrote: To easiest way to understand the way it is done in your community is to talk to the town clerk or contact the surveyor who laid out the lots and streets. These people know how they do things in their own area, not opinions from areas that are operated differently. The surveyor can translate what is your property, what is your neighbors and what is owned or controlled by the local government and how he laid it out. True, though surveyors can be off target. (bombs missing target on a test range) And they often are. Much better since using GPS. The older stuff was fudge it a little until we close the plat. Distances weren't the problem so much but angle between lines was. On my present old foggy lot, I am the second owner after the developer. My Plat tells fence line on block walls, who owns or is responsible for repair of the wall. One time I did have a lawyer do a Title search. Two inches thick back to native American trails that crossed the land. It was a good read of land, ownership and tranfer. No Mohawk Indians sued me. Not part of 5 nations -- Tekkie *Please post a follow-up* |
#17
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Can't understand plat
On Fri, 15 May 2015 16:28:56 -0400, Tekkie®
wrote: To easiest way to understand the way it is done in your community is to talk to the town clerk or contact the surveyor who laid out the lots and streets. These people know how they do things in their own area, not opinions from areas that are operated differently. The surveyor can translate what is your property, what is your neighbors and what is owned or controlled by the local government and how he laid it out. True, though surveyors can be off target. (bombs missing target on a test range) And they often are. Much better since using GPS. The older stuff was fudge it a little until we close the plat. Distances weren't the problem so much but angle between lines was. In my best Nick the 'Blade Philly' accent, "dis guy I know" worked on Area 51 and was involved in military 'stuff'. Targets, survey, arithmetic, pencils, paper and computer calculations on double top-secret, extra probation and all. He found the "bug" in software after doing his numbers over It was not his fault the bomb missed by 15 feet. |
#18
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Can't understand plat
On Thu, 14 May 2015 13:44:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote: What others are referring to as pipestem lots are called "flag lots" here in IL. the flagpole gives access to a road while the lot is set back from the road by the length of the flagpole up to the bottom of the flag. Yeah, that's exactly it. I hadn't heard either term before, even though I myself sort of have a lot like this. My flag pole / pipe stem is only about 20 feet long, so it doesn't look so weird or worth commenting on. (although I think my next door neighbor on my right thinks he owns it.) My next-door neigbhor on my left also has such a lot, but his pipe-stem is only 8 feet long or less and barely noticeable, except that it's on the other side of the sidewalk that goes from townhouse to townhouse. I think he doesn't even know that he owns the land. (Unless I told him, but I forget if I did or not.) A neighborhood volunteer mows it when he mows his own lawn and 2 adjoining neighbors . cc: homeowner |
#19
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Can't understand plat
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#20
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Can't understand plat
On Fri, 15 May 2015 14:01:50 -0400, "EXT"
wrote: "micky" wrote in message .. . A friend moved to a more rural area, to a new subdivision. There are one or more parts of her plat we don't understand. She and 4 neighbors live on a private road, which comes from a newly built road. I guess this bigger road has been given to the county, but she seems to share responsibility for maintaining the private road. There is a little "bulge" in the public road at the end of it. Not as big as a cul de sac, and barely big enough to make a u-turn in. Even though her lot is basically 4-sided, the plat shows 5 bands, each about 10 feet wide, going side-by-side down the private rood, to where it meets the public road (which has a bulge at its end.) OTOH, if one starts at the public road, each band ends when it reached the lot it is attached to. Each band is either 10.25', 11,04', or 10.02' for a total of 52.6 feet. The private road is not that wide, so some of this land is off the road and looks like it belongs to lot owners along the way. Do I have to explain further, because I'm having trouble describing this, or does some one here already know what I'm talking about? Does she really own a strip of land reaching all the way to the bulge, or do they all share the road and the plat just represents it that way? To easiest way to understand the way it is done in your community is to talk to the town clerk or contact the surveyor who laid out the lots and streets. The name of the original surveyor is in big print on the plats, from about 2007. Maybe he has enough information stored at his office that he can do the survey more cheaply, or maybe he'll think of her as a returning customer and she'll get a discount for that reason. OTOH, maybe, maybe not. :-) These people know how they do things in their own area, not opinions from areas that are operated differently. The surveyor can translate what is your property, what is your neighbors and what is owned or controlled by the local government and how he laid it out. |
#21
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Can't understand plat bout here
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#22
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Can't understand plat bout here
"Tekkie®" wrote in message ... posted for all of us... On Fri, 15 May 2015 12:54:49 -0700, Oren wrote: On my present old foggy lot, I am the second owner after the developer. My Plat tells fence line on block walls, who owns or is responsible for repair of the wall. There have been 3 surveys of the lot next to my house over the years and there are 3 different "corner pins" driven in the dirt. The spread is about a foot. Why don't you average it out and drive your own? G Because **I** own that "no man's land". |
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