My house was on the market starting early September 2013. I signed a nice offer in late October 2013. All inspections were completed and objections resolved. Then days before closing in late November, the lender disqualified the buyer. I put the house back on the market in May. I had another decent offer by late July. Per the contract terms and the buyer's request, the buyer was to receive and consider the old (2013) inspection report. Relevant dates:

July 26, buyer and seller signed puchase agreement.

August 11, inspections to be completed. Contract states in caps that the buyer is to order the home inspection. [Buyer still has not ordered either any home inspection or re-inspection. Buyer pays for the home inspection up front. Seller is to reimburse this cost at closing. No closing, no reimbursement.]

August 13, home inspection objections due.

August 14, seller receives objections amendment. The buyer had signed this on Aug 4.

August 29, currently scheduled closing date.

The Aug 4 signing date was the tip-off to the seller (= me) that communications had gone awry. My realtor ultimately explained that the buyer's realtor and he had messed up with what email addresses they were to use to exchange documents. This resulted in the missed deadlines and 10 days where activity required by the buyer, going towards completing the sale, was zero.

My realtor (= the seller's realtor) has said he needs me to sign the objections amendment. Because the dates are now inconsistent with the contract, I said no. It would make me look like I had dropped the ball. Technically I think I may be in my rights to say the buyer has now waived his right to have a home inspection and the accompanying home warranty. But it was both realtors who appeared to have screwed up, and I do want to sell the house. On the third hand, I am pretty angry I have more inspections to deal with, all while I am trying to pack up and make arrangements etc. I have met every deadline required of me, the seller. I emailed my realtor that I wanted him to provide the following response to the buyer's proposed objections amendment, inserted in the appropriate place in the proposed amendment:

///
Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug 4] until Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications between buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days of delay, and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home warranty, seller requests (1) an extension to Monday, August 25 to complete home re-inspection; (2) an extension to Wednesday, August 27 for buyer to provide objections to home inspection report; (3) a change of the closing date to Friday, September 5 [currently its Friday, August 29].
///


What would be your response to your realtor, if you were the seller?

If there is a real estate google group that might be more appropriate for this question, please share the group's name.

Thank you.

On 08/17/2014 12:41 PM, wrote:
....

Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug
4] until Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications
between buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days
of delay, and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home
warranty, ...

What requires any re-inspection and what was/were the content of the
objections filed?

You indicated all objections of prior were satisfied and were using the
previously-completed inspection so what's up with anything else? As per
usual, "the devil is in the details" and any short summary can't likely
do them justice.

Is the buyer trying to close the deal too, or are they looking for a way
out? If both buyer/seller are looking to close the deal, seems like
should be able to just pick up where are and go on, actual dates be
da[...]'ed...

--

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 1:41:42 PM UTC-4, wrote:
My house was on the market starting early September 2013. I signed a nice offer in late October 2013. All inspections were completed and objections resolved. Then days before closing in late November, the lender disqualified the buyer. I put the house back on the market in May. I had another decent offer by late July. Per the contract terms and the buyer's request, the buyer was to receive and consider the old (2013) inspection report. Relevant dates:



July 26, buyer and seller signed puchase agreement.



August 11, inspections to be completed. Contract states in caps that the buyer is to order the home inspection. [Buyer still has not ordered either any home inspection or re-inspection. Buyer pays for the home inspection up front. Seller is to reimburse this cost at closing. No closing, no reimbursement.]



August 13, home inspection objections due.



August 14, seller receives objections amendment. The buyer had signed this on Aug 4.



August 29, currently scheduled closing date.



The Aug 4 signing date was the tip-off to the seller (= me) that communications had gone awry. My realtor ultimately explained that the buyer's realtor and he had messed up with what email addresses they were to use to exchange documents. This resulted in the missed deadlines and 10 days where activity required by the buyer, going towards completing the sale, was zero.



My realtor (= the seller's realtor) has said he needs me to sign the objections amendment. Because the dates are now inconsistent with the contract, I said no. It would make me look like I had dropped the ball. Technically I think I may be in my rights to say the buyer has now waived his right to have a home inspection and the accompanying home warranty. But it was both realtors who appeared to have screwed up, and I do want to sell the house.. On the third hand, I am pretty angry I have more inspections to deal with, all while I am trying to pack up and make arrangements etc. I have met every deadline required of me, the seller. I emailed my realtor that I wanted him to provide the following response to the buyer's proposed objections amendment, inserted in the appropriate place in the proposed amendment:



///

Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug 4] until Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications between buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days of delay, and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home warranty, seller requests (1) an extension to Monday, August 25 to complete home re-inspection; (2) an extension to Wednesday, August 27 for buyer to provide objections to home inspection report; (3) a change of the closing date to Friday, September 5 [currently its Friday, August 29].

///





What would be your response to your realtor, if you were the seller?


What you don't tell us is one critical piece of information, which is what
are the defects that they are asking you to fix? If it's typical small,
reasonable stuff that you can fix yourself or have someone else fix,
the what's the big deal? I also don't understand why the stuff wasn't fixed
before. From the sequence, it sounds like the new buyer never had an
inspection done and is instead relying on the old inspection report that
you've had since last year. Why wasn't that stuff fixed?

Technically, you're in the right, because they did not notify you of
their objections by the deadline, they missed by one day. But the
question you have to ask yourself is, what's the point? If there is
reasonable stuff that needs to be fixed, just fix it. Otherwise you're
heading into the unknown. For example, do they have a mortgage committment?
IF not, they could manage to screw that, then use that as excuse not to
buy it, etc. It could take months to resolve, tying up the house in the
meantime. Is it worth escalating this, instead of just doing what
needs to be done?

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:57:08 AM UTC-6, dpb wrote:
On 08/17/2014 12:41 PM, honda.lioness wrote:
stuff snipped
Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug
4] until Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications
between buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days
of delay, and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home
warranty, ...



What requires any re-inspection and what was/were the content of the
objections filed?

In 2013 there was no re-inspection to confirm the repairs I did post-inspection. Also almost ten months have passed since the October 2013 home inspection. I figure the buyer is justified in having the option to have another inspection.

You indicated all objections of prior were satisfied and were using the
previously-completed inspection so what's up with anything else? As per
usual, "the devil is in the details" and any short summary can't likely
do them justice.



Is the buyer trying to close the deal too, or are they looking for a way
out?

The buyer fronted the money for the home appraisal on August 11. Results are not back yet. If the deal closes, I reimburse the buyer for the cost of the appraisal. I tend to think the buyer wants the deal to go through.

If both buyer/seller are looking to close the deal, seems like
should be able to just pick up where are and go on, actual dates be

My realtor keeps pressuring me to ignore the deadlines saying things cannot always go per same. This is fine, but I expect buyer and seller to agree to new deadlines, in writing per amendment procedures. Else there is no deadline, and both buyer and seller can play games. I am not. I hope my buyer is not. But I do not know the buyer from Adam. Last year was a morass, with the lender takign up to a few days before closing to disqualify the buyer. I need to rely on the dates to make moving plans. I want them in writing.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:59:06 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
What you don't tell us is one critical piece of information, which is what
are the defects that they are asking you to fix? If it's typical small,
reasonable stuff that you can fix yourself or have someone else fix,
the what's the big deal? I also don't understand why the stuff wasn't fixed
before. From the sequence, it sounds like the new buyer never had an
inspection done and is instead relying on the old inspection report that
you've had since last year. Why wasn't that stuff fixed?



Technically, you're in the right, because they did not notify you of
their objections by the deadline, they missed by one day. But the
question you have to ask yourself is, what's the point? If there is
reasonable stuff that needs to be fixed, just fix it. Otherwise you're
heading into the unknown. For example, do they have a mortgage committment?
IF not, they could manage to screw that, then use that as excuse not to
buy it, etc. It could take months to resolve, tying up the house in the
meantime. Is it worth escalating this, instead of just doing what
needs to be done?


The buyer has not asked for anything to be fixed yet. The proposed amendment dated Aug 4 requested a list of what I (the seller) had repaired from the shortcomings identified in the 2013 inspection report. I repaired almost everything, but no re-inspection was done to confirm this. I had already a list of what I repaired to my realtor on Aug 3.

My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection (re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in realtor-to-realtor communications.

wrote in message
...
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:59:06 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

I often wonder about some of the realtors. About 35 years ago I bought my
first house and did not have much of a credit record , but it was good.
Everything went smooth.

Went to buy a house about 10 years ago. As far as the deal went I had cash
money. Seems there was some kind of a mixup on the sellers end. Not that
they did not want to sell the house, but more so with the bank or something.
Not sure . We met at the lawyers office about 9:30. The sellers and the
realitors and lawyers went to a back room for about 4 hours for some reason.
Had I not been looking for a house for about 6 months like I wanted , I
would have walked out after the first hour. They finally came out and I did
buy the house.

Went to sell my dad's house after he passed away. It was payed for and I
was an only child and had a will so everything was ok on my end. The buyers
showed up about 2 hours late. It was not their fault, but the realitor had
something about the loan and did not let the buyers know about it to that
morning. They had to scramble around to take care of that.

Being fed up with the realitors I decided to sell the house I was living in
myself. Put up a sign and an ad in the paper. Showed it to about 6 people
and got an offer I liked. Downloaded a contract from somewhere on the
internet and we signed it. Had a home inspection done and the buyer got an
OK from the bank. Went to a lawyer and he did all the paper work. No
problem and saved the 6 % realitor fee.

On 08/17/2014 1:14 PM, wrote:
....

My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

Surely nothing wrong with adding a revised set of dates but I don't see
any point in while doing that not doing whatever signatures are needed
to keep things moving along (after all, as trader says, it was only a
day, not two weeks after some deadline).

I'd ask the buyer to accept the house inspection as was done w/ items as
repaired as itemized if there wasn't anything of any real significance
that wasn't taken care of. That would expedite the process if they
agree; can't be any worse than if they don't. Maybe they get a little
money back besides if they've already paid for but haven't had
accomplished another (seemingly useless) inspection. Again, this
presumes you've not trashed the place or had some other major
catastrophe that has materially altered the condition of the property
since the previous.

--

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 15:00:38 -0400, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:59:06 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

I often wonder about some of the realtors. About 35 years ago I bought my
first house and did not have much of a credit record , but it was good.
Everything went smooth.

Went to buy a house about 10 years ago. As far as the deal went I had cash
money. Seems there was some kind of a mixup on the sellers end. Not that
they did not want to sell the house, but more so with the bank or something.
Not sure . We met at the lawyers office about 9:30. The sellers and the
realitors and lawyers went to a back room for about 4 hours for some reason.
Had I not been looking for a house for about 6 months like I wanted , I
would have walked out after the first hour. They finally came out and I did
buy the house.

Went to sell my dad's house after he passed away. It was payed for and I
was an only child and had a will so everything was ok on my end. The buyers
showed up about 2 hours late. It was not their fault, but the realitor had
something about the loan and did not let the buyers know about it to that
morning. They had to scramble around to take care of that.

Being fed up with the realitors I decided to sell the house I was living in
myself. Put up a sign and an ad in the paper. Showed it to about 6 people
and got an offer I liked. Downloaded a contract from somewhere on the
internet and we signed it. Had a home inspection done and the buyer got an
OK from the bank. Went to a lawyer and he did all the paper work. No
problem and saved the 6 % realitor fee.


I've owned ~ 8 houses in four states. None ever had a "re inspection"
for things fixed. Just documented that I fixed them or refused to fix
them.

I had two problems over the years. Told I needed to fix a sewer line.
Found out the wrong home inspection was in my file. The other (present
house), I was about ten minutes for arrival to close. The agent
called and said there was a problem. The husband had been placed in a
mental care facility - ordered in another state. It took a few extra
days and an order from a judge in that state to approve the sale by
the wife.

Not related. Had one house measured for tax purposes, the guy measured
the side wall foundation diagonally while walking down the hill, added
X feet to the house - taxes would be raised - they came back to
measure correctly when I explained the footprint of the house had
never changed and they could talk to my lawyer if it was necessary.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 1:27:48 PM UTC-6, dpb wrote:
On 08/17/2014 1:14 PM, honda.lioness wrote:
My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

Surely nothing wrong with adding a revised set of dates but I don't see
any point in[,] while doing that[,] not doing whatever signatures are needed
to keep things moving along (after all, as trader says, it was only a
day, not two weeks after some deadline).

My take at present is that the buyer has been waiting almost two weeks now for a response to their Aug 4 objection amendment, the one that was not submitted to me until Aug 14. I think the buyer took no steps towards ordering a home (re-?)inspection because the buyer heard nothing from me, via our realtors. I suspect the buyer is as confused as I am about where things stand regarding the home inspection and objections.

I agree it's fine if the buyer wants to get this home inspection scheduled without any signed documents. Per the documents, I am not allowed to order the home (re-?)inspection, though. Everything else (HOA disclosure, termite inspection, appraisal) is either done or in line with the contract's terms..

I'd ask the buyer to accept the house inspection as was done w/ items as
repaired as itemized if there wasn't anything of any real significance
that wasn't taken care of. That would expedite the process if they
agree; can't be any worse than if they don't. Maybe they get a little
money back besides if they've already paid for but haven't had
accomplished another (seemingly useless) inspection. Again, this
presumes you've not trashed the place or had some other major
catastrophe that has materially altered the condition of the property
since the previous.

I have knocked myself out keeping it up and even added further improvements (new window; new washing machine; a bit more). But the buyer does not have proof of this firsthand, so it's understandable to me that the buyer wants another inspection. Also no home warranty is issued unless a (re-)inspection occurs. For a house as tiny as mine, I think the home warranty and inspection are baloney, like you. But I know less handy people feel otherwise.

The buyer himself seems to be a reasonable person. The realtors are mucking things up and inconveniencing me and the buyer, though. Hopefully it will be water under the bridge soon.

I appreciate the input.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 1:00:38 PM UTC-6, Ralph Mowery wrote:
[stuff snipped for brevity]
Being fed up with the realitors I decided to sell the house I was living in
myself. Put up a sign and an ad in the paper. Showed it to about 6 people
and got an offer I liked. Downloaded a contract from somewhere on the
internet and we signed it. Had a home inspection done and the buyer got an
OK from the bank. Went to a lawyer and he did all the paper work. No
problem and saved the 6 % realitor fee.

Thanks for sharing the anecdotes. This realtor of mine also miscalculated my net-out to the tune of 3%. That is, he missed a major expense and had me netting about 3% more than what a proper estimate would say. I just reported the facts to him and he owned it. Still one would think the guy would use a spreadsheet for calculations like this. I too am inclined to say forego the realtors next time, go FSBO, adjust the price down, and get an attorney for closing etc. Or if this deal falls through, I will ask to terminate the contract I have with my current realtor, on grounds of unsat service yada.. I cannot afford to be so generous to mess-ups like his and the other realtor's.

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 13:26:47 -0700, wrote:

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 1:00:38 PM UTC-6, Ralph Mowery wrote:
[stuff snipped for brevity]
Being fed up with the realitors I decided to sell the house I was
living in
myself. Put up a sign and an ad in the paper. Showed it to about 6
people
and got an offer I liked. Downloaded a contract from somewhere on the
internet and we signed it. Had a home inspection done and the buyer
got an
OK from the bank. Went to a lawyer and he did all the paper work. No
problem and saved the 6 % realitor fee.

Thanks for sharing the anecdotes. This realtor of mine also
miscalculated my net-out to the tune of 3%. That is, he missed a major
expense and had me netting about 3% more than what a proper estimate
would say. I just reported the facts to him and he owned it. Still one
would think the guy would use a spreadsheet for calculations like this.
I too am inclined to say forego the realtors next time, go FSBO, adjust
the price down, and get an attorney for closing etc. Or if this deal
falls through, I will ask to terminate the contract I have with my
current realtor, on grounds of unsat service yada. I cannot afford to be
so generous to mess-ups like his and the other realtor's.

and your realtor expects you to pay 'full' commission for services 'not
rendered'?

I found the title companies for escrow only too helpful to enable buyer
sellers to work directly, too.

wrote in message
...
I have knocked myself out keeping it up and even added further
improvements (new window; new washing machine; a bit more). But the
buyer does not have proof of this firsthand, so it's understandable to me
that the buyer wants another inspection. Also no home warranty is issued
unless a (re-)inspection occurs. For a house as tiny as mine, I think the
home warranty and inspection are baloney, like you. But I know less handy
people feel otherwise.

Those home warranties are just a waste of money for the most part. If you
really look over what they cover and how much they cost, you get very little
in return. Sort of like the warranties on most things they try to sell you
in stores on electronics now. Usually if they last the first week you will
not
have any problems for the warrentied period.

I bought a house about 10 years ago and they tried to push the warranty on
me. Those realitors must get a kickback or something.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 2:14:34 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:59:06 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:

What you don't tell us is one critical piece of information, which is what

are the defects that they are asking you to fix? If it's typical small,

reasonable stuff that you can fix yourself or have someone else fix,

the what's the big deal? I also don't understand why the stuff wasn't fixed

before. From the sequence, it sounds like the new buyer never had an

inspection done and is instead relying on the old inspection report that

you've had since last year. Why wasn't that stuff fixed?







Technically, you're in the right, because they did not notify you of

their objections by the deadline, they missed by one day. But the

question you have to ask yourself is, what's the point? If there is

reasonable stuff that needs to be fixed, just fix it. Otherwise you're

heading into the unknown. For example, do they have a mortgage committment?

IF not, they could manage to screw that, then use that as excuse not to

buy it, etc. It could take months to resolve, tying up the house in the

meantime. Is it worth escalating this, instead of just doing what

needs to be done?





The buyer has not asked for anything to be fixed yet. The proposed amendment dated Aug 4 requested a list of what I (the seller) had repaired from the shortcomings identified in the 2013 inspection report. I repaired almost everything, but no re-inspection was done to confirm this. I had already a list of what I repaired to my realtor on Aug 3.



My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection (re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in realtor-to-realtor communications.

There's a lot here we;re not privy too, like what exactly the "objections
ammendment" is. It sounds like they signed a standard contract that says
they were to do inspections by Aug 11 and give any objections you by the 13th.
Then the buyer sent some "objections ammendment" on Aug 4, that you didn't
receive until Aug 14. Not clear what exactly that was about, but the buyer
is pretty dumb, because they are bound by the original contract that both
parties signed. Did you even know that they were planning on sending this
ammendment? They can propose anything they want, but there is no
guarantee you'd accept it. Presumably that ammendment concerned doing the
inspection, whatever, but they and the realtors involved should know that
the original contract is what governs, unless you want to accept the ammendment.
There was no ammendment and the two deadlines passed.

So, from what is given, looks like you have two choices:

A - Rework that ammendment agreement into what is agreeable to both of
you regarding inspections, new dates, etc and both parties sign it.


B - Tell them that the inspection window has passed, they missed two
explicit deadlines, one for the inspection to be done by Aug 11 and
the other for any list of fixes to be provided to you by Aug 13.

I think my position would be to tell them in a letter, in a nice way,
that they missed the deadlines, the opportunity for an inspection has
passed, but that
you've fixed X, Y, Z etc from the previous report, which they have and
if they want to verify that, they can do it themselves or hire an inspector
of their own. Again, we don't know what the defects were. If it's
stuff like a dripping faucet, downspouts need spash-blocks, dishwasher not
working, they should be satsified to just see those things themselves.
If the defect is that the roof is falling in, well that's another story.
And I'd tell them in the letter that if they want to accept the opportunity
to reinspect, they only have until Aug X, to do so.

If they push back on B, you could still agree to A later.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 3:27:38 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
There's a lot here we;re not privy too, like what exactly the "objections
ammendment" is. It sounds like they signed a standard contract that says
they were to do inspections by Aug 11 and give any objections you by the 13th.

Your dates are correct. The standard contract the buyer and I (the seller) signed in late July also has an added, non-standard clause stating "existing home inspection will be reviewed for buyer to accept or decline." I went in knowing the buyer might want another inspection. Also in the standard contract I agreed to pay for a home warranty at closing. I do not like home warranties but my paying for one was a part of the three rounds of negotiation in late July. All the damn realtors push them around here, to largely unsuspecting clientele.

Then the buyer sent some "objections ammendment" on Aug 4, that you didn't
receive until Aug 14. Not clear what exactly that was about, but the buyer
is pretty dumb, because they are bound by the original contract that both
parties signed.

I hope what I wrote above clarifies that the buyer did not do anything wrong, at least in my eyes.

Did you even know that they were planning on sending this
ammendment? They can propose anything they want, but there is no
guarantee you'd accept it.

Agreed, but the 10-day delay that (1)resulted in a deadline not being met; and (2) was neither the buyer's nor the seller's fault, has put the rush on, in my view. I feel like one never knows what home inspectors will come up with. For example, my roof had around 25 sq. feet of new shingles added last year, per the 2013 inspection, but the next inspection may yield an inspector who says this is not good enough.

Presumably that amendment concerned doing the
inspection, whatever, but they and the realtors involved should know that
the original contract is what governs, unless you want to accept the amendment.

Agreed, with the caveat that I know it is in both the buyer's and my interest to be cooperative and have some flexibility, assuming both still want the sale to happen.

There was no ammendment and the two deadlines passed.

The buyer did send the amendment a week+ before all deadlines. The problem is that, due to the two realtors' being slovenly (IMO), I did not get the amendment until 10 days later and after the deadlines passed.

I will be calling my realtor regularly now, believe me, whenever anything is due, and making him call the other realtor or the other realtor's company whenever communications seem frozen.

So, from what is given, looks like you have two choices:

A - Rework that ammendment agreement into what is agreeable to both of
you regarding inspections, new dates, etc and both parties sign it.





B - Tell them that the inspection window has passed, they missed two
explicit deadlines, one for the inspection to be done by Aug 11 and
the other for any list of fixes to be provided to you by Aug 13.

I think my position would be to tell them in a letter, in a nice way,
that they missed the deadlines, the opportunity for an inspection has
passed, but that
you've fixed X, Y, Z etc from the previous report, which they have and
if they want to verify that, they can do it themselves or hire an inspector
of their own. Again, we don't know what the defects were. If it's
stuff like a dripping faucet, downspouts need spash-blocks, dishwasher not
working, they should be satsified to just see those things themselves.

They were minor and nearly all fixed. The one item I did not address was cracked [plastic?] glazings at the window. I do not know if this is really repairable.

If the defect is that the roof is falling in, well that's another story.

Right. It's not. It's in good shape but old, for sure.

And I'd tell them in the letter that if they want to accept the opportunity
to reinspect, they only have until Aug X, to do so.

If they push back on B, you could still agree to A later.

I think maybe one other option that is a bit tempting is to tell the two realtors they can now pay for the home inspection and warranty, or the deal is off. I know they do not get 6% commission; their companies do, and they get a tiny slice of this.

Thank you for thinking this through.

On 8/17/2014 4:19 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 1:27:48 PM UTC-6, dpb wrote:
On 08/17/2014 1:14 PM, honda.lioness wrote:
My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

Surely nothing wrong with adding a revised set of dates but I don't see
any point in[,] while doing that[,] not doing whatever signatures are needed
to keep things moving along (after all, as trader says, it was only a
day, not two weeks after some deadline).

My take at present is that the buyer has been waiting almost two weeks now for a response to their Aug 4 objection amendment, the one that was not submitted to me until Aug 14. I think the buyer took no steps towards ordering a home (re-?)inspection because the buyer heard nothing from me, via our realtors. I suspect the buyer is as confused as I am about where things stand regarding the home inspection and objections.

I agree it's fine if the buyer wants to get this home inspection scheduled without any signed documents. Per the documents, I am not allowed to order the home (re-?)inspection, though. Everything else (HOA disclosure, termite inspection, appraisal) is either done or in line with the contract's terms.

I'd ask the buyer to accept the house inspection as was done w/ items as
repaired as itemized if there wasn't anything of any real significance
that wasn't taken care of. That would expedite the process if they
agree; can't be any worse than if they don't. Maybe they get a little
money back besides if they've already paid for but haven't had
accomplished another (seemingly useless) inspection. Again, this
presumes you've not trashed the place or had some other major
catastrophe that has materially altered the condition of the property
since the previous.

I have knocked myself out keeping it up and even added further improvements (new window; new washing machine; a bit more). But the buyer does not have proof of this firsthand, so it's understandable to me that the buyer wants another inspection. Also no home warranty is issued unless a (re-)inspection occurs. For a house as tiny as mine, I think the home warranty and inspection are baloney, like you. But I know less handy people feel otherwise.

The buyer himself seems to be a reasonable person. The realtors are mucking things up and inconveniencing me and the buyer, though. Hopefully it will be water under the bridge soon.

I appreciate the input.

With the last house I sold, there were several things that the buyer
wanted fixed, based on the inspection. For several of them, eg
electrical or larger repairs, I provided a copy of the receipts. For
smaller items, the buyer and agents did a walk through to see that they
had been done.

One thought - if any of this delay caused by the agents is going to cost
you money, I might be inclined to strongly suggest that *they* pay for
it and/or reduce their commission.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 5:58:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 3:27:38 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:

There's a lot here we;re not privy too, like what exactly the "objections

ammendment" is. It sounds like they signed a standard contract that says

they were to do inspections by Aug 11 and give any objections you by the 13th.



Your dates are correct. The standard contract the buyer and I (the seller) signed in late July also has an added, non-standard clause stating "existing home inspection will be reviewed for buyer to accept or decline." I went in knowing the buyer might want another inspection. Also in the standard contract I agreed to pay for a home warranty at closing. I do not like home warranties but my paying for one was a part of the three rounds of negotiation in late July. All the damn realtors push them around here, to largely unsuspecting clientele.



I still don't understand what the "objections ammendment" was all about.
They had a date to get an inspection done by, another date to get to you any
issues regarding things to be fixed. The contract also states that the
buyer gets the less than a year old inspection to accept or decline. You
provided that, right? I would say the fact that they did nothing about
another inspection, is acceptance of the existing inspection report.
And failure to notify anyone of any defect list based on it by the Aug 13
deadline, closes the window for that too.

From the above, if they got
nothing signed, then they had to Aug 11 to get a new inspection and they
had till Aug 13 to get you the fix-it list based on either that new
inspection, if done, or anything off the old inspection they want to
check, oject to, etc. Both those deadlines passed.

So, what exactly was the purpose of this objections ammendment that
got lost and never exectuted? Why wasn't whatever it concerns included
in the signed contract from day 1?





Then the buyer sent some "objections ammendment" on Aug 4, that you didn't

receive until Aug 14. Not clear what exactly that was about, but the buyer

is pretty dumb, because they are bound by the original contract that both

parties signed.



I hope what I wrote above clarifies that the buyer did not do anything wrong, at least in my eyes.



I think they did do something wrong, which is to drop the ball. They were
the ones wanting an ammendment of some kind, right? It was up to them to
make sure they got some response. If I was a buyer and I got no response,
I'd be calling, checking, especially as deadlines approached. What they
did wrong has only resulted in them screwing themselves.




Did you even know that they were planning on sending this

ammendment? They can propose anything they want, but there is no

guarantee you'd accept it.



Agreed, but the 10-day delay that (1)resulted in a deadline not being met; and (2) was neither the buyer's nor the seller's fault, has put the rush on, in my view.

Who exactly did drop the ball? Better if it's their realtor. And did you
know for sure that they were sending a proposed ammendment and what it was
supposed to contain?



I feel like one never knows what home inspectors will come up with. For example, my roof had around 25 sq. feet of new shingles added last year, per the 2013 inspection, but the next inspection may yield an inspector who says this is not good enough.



Yes, that's always the risk. Which is why I suggested telling them that
they missed their inspection window, you've fixed X, Y, Z per the less than
a year old inspection. They can either accept that, come look, or hire an
inspector at their own cost. I'm starting to think the last part is not
the best idea either, for reasons you poiont out later.....




Presumably that amendment concerned doing the

inspection, whatever, but they and the realtors involved should know that

the original contract is what governs, unless you want to accept the amendment.



Agreed, with the caveat that I know it is in both the buyer's and my interest to be cooperative and have some flexibility, assuming both still want the sale to happen.



There was no ammendment and the two deadlines passed.



The buyer did send the amendment a week+ before all deadlines. The problem is that, due to the two realtors' being slovenly (IMO), I did not get the amendment until 10 days later and after the deadlines passed.



If it's their realtor fault, better for you. But I'd say even if your realtor
dropped the ball, it's tough luck for them. They signed the contract, with
the deadlines for inspections. It was up to them, their realtor, their
lawyer, if they have one, etc to keep track of their contractual obligations.





I will be calling my realtor regularly now, believe me, whenever anything is due, and making him call the other realtor or the other realtor's company whenever communications seem frozen.



So, from what is given, looks like you have two choices:



A - Rework that ammendment agreement into what is agreeable to both of

you regarding inspections, new dates, etc and both parties sign it.











B - Tell them that the inspection window has passed, they missed two

explicit deadlines, one for the inspection to be done by Aug 11 and

the other for any list of fixes to be provided to you by Aug 13.



I think my position would be to tell them in a letter, in a nice way,

that they missed the deadlines, the opportunity for an inspection has

passed, but that

you've fixed X, Y, Z etc from the previous report, which they have and

if they want to verify that, they can do it themselves or hire an inspector

of their own. Again, we don't know what the defects were. If it's

stuff like a dripping faucet, downspouts need spash-blocks, dishwasher not

working, they should be satsified to just see those things themselves.



They were minor and nearly all fixed. The one item I did not address was cracked [plastic?] glazings at the window. I do not know if this is really repairable.



If the defect is that the roof is falling in, well that's another story..



Right. It's not. It's in good shape but old, for sure.



And I'd tell them in the letter that if they want to accept the opportunity

to reinspect, they only have until Aug X, to do so.



If they push back on B, you could still agree to A later.



I think maybe one other option that is a bit tempting is to tell the two realtors they can now pay for the home inspection and warranty, or the deal is off. I know they do not get 6% commission; their companies do, and they get a tiny slice of this.



Thank you for thinking this through.

I don't think you want to do that option. So far, from what you've told us
so far, you're 100% in the right.
If you now interject some new condition, then you're breaching the solid,
existing contract, by altering the existing terms. The existing contract
is clear and the deadlines have passed.

You shouldn't feel sorry for them here. Deadlines are there for a
purpose. You want the house sold, it's costing you money, taxes, etc. They
missed the deadlines and it wasn't your fault, so I don;t see the need to pay for an inspection to possibly let them out of a solid deal. They could do
an inspection, then bitch about thousands worth of crap.

What other possible outs do they have at this point? Are they getting
a mortgage with a mortgage contigency? If yes, then do you have a
committment letter yet? If they have that as an out, you need to
proceed more cautiously, because they could queer the mortgage deal
to get out of the purchase. If you have a committment letter, then
you're in a much better position.

One other thing worth considering is that maybe this miss isn't so
innocent. Maybe they are having cold feet, want out, etc. You never
know for sure what people are up to......

Oren wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 15:00:38 -0400, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


wrote in message
...
On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:59:06 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
My biggest concern right now is that no deadlines for home inspection
(re-inspection?) and objections are in place, due to the snafu in
realtor-to-realtor communications.

I often wonder about some of the realtors. About 35 years ago I bought my
first house and did not have much of a credit record , but it was good.
Everything went smooth.

Went to buy a house about 10 years ago. As far as the deal went I had cash
money. Seems there was some kind of a mixup on the sellers end. Not that
they did not want to sell the house, but more so with the bank or something.
Not sure . We met at the lawyers office about 9:30. The sellers and the
realitors and lawyers went to a back room for about 4 hours for some reason.
Had I not been looking for a house for about 6 months like I wanted , I
would have walked out after the first hour. They finally came out and I did
buy the house.

Went to sell my dad's house after he passed away. It was payed for and I
was an only child and had a will so everything was ok on my end. The buyers
showed up about 2 hours late. It was not their fault, but the realitor had
something about the loan and did not let the buyers know about it to that
morning. They had to scramble around to take care of that.

Being fed up with the realitors I decided to sell the house I was living in
myself. Put up a sign and an ad in the paper. Showed it to about 6 people
and got an offer I liked. Downloaded a contract from somewhere on the
internet and we signed it. Had a home inspection done and the buyer got an
OK from the bank. Went to a lawyer and he did all the paper work. No
problem and saved the 6 % realitor fee.


I've owned ~ 8 houses in four states. None ever had a "re inspection"
for things fixed. Just documented that I fixed them or refused to fix
them.

I had two problems over the years. Told I needed to fix a sewer line.
Found out the wrong home inspection was in my file. The other (present
house), I was about ten minutes for arrival to close. The agent
called and said there was a problem. The husband had been placed in a
mental care facility - ordered in another state. It took a few extra
days and an order from a judge in that state to approve the sale by
the wife.

Not related. Had one house measured for tax purposes, the guy measured
the side wall foundation diagonally while walking down the hill, added
X feet to the house - taxes would be raised - they came back to
measure correctly when I explained the footprint of the house had
never changed and they could talk to my lawyer if it was necessary.

Hi,
I never deal with a buyer who isn't already pre-approved for a mortgage.
Sounds like both realtors are little too lazy doing their job proper.
Main thing is the buyer really want to buy your house or not, that is
the question.

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 17:05:33 -0600, Tony Hwang
wrote:

I never deal with a buyer who isn't already pre-approved for a mortgage.
Sounds like both realtors are little too lazy doing their job proper.
Main thing is the buyer really want to buy your house or not, that is
the question.

Plus I want closing in 30 days or less. You find the true players.
Pre-approved or cash has made me happy

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 18:14:54 -0400, Lee B
wrote:

With the last house I sold, there were several things that the buyer
wanted fixed, based on the inspection. For several of them, eg
electrical or larger repairs, I provided a copy of the receipts. For
smaller items, the buyer and agents did a walk through to see that they
had been done.

Bingo. I put a floor in to divide a cathedral ceiling at the second
floor level. No permit. Which was required.

I was able to provide a proposal, a materials list, a statement of
work, etc from a licensed contractor. The Agent (Realtor) bought the
house based on that. Or I could have paid a penalty for not having a
permit for the construction and sold it anyway.

On 08/17/2014 3:19 PM, wrote:
....

My take at present is that the buyer has been waiting almost two
weeks now for a response to their Aug 4 objection amendment, the one
that wasnot submitted to me until Aug 14. ...

And there's the rub in the "who's right" part -- if push comes to shove
he'll point at the timestamp on the signature. Your initial posting
indicates "the two realtors had a misunderstanding regarding addresses
for communication". To settle that, either one has to concede he/she
was in error or you've got a two-lawyer deal there. That can't be good
to getting something going from the status quo.

If new dates are a subject of negotiations, then you've got the choice
of whether to just sign the document now to try to get the ball rolling
as it sounds like it is in your court and express concern to both
realtors that somebody ought to be minding the kitchen. It's always
possible, I presume, to make your position known to note that your
signature of X date is within Y date of time or receipt of document to
indicate the delay wasn't on your part. Don't know that it would have
any effect or any legal standing but it might make you feel better...

Meanwhile, work on the other dates as a side issue...doesn't seem that
it could muck anything up; all they can do is try to push the schedule
one way or the other but if were amenable to the original one would
think they'd still be agreeable to holding as close as feasible given
the current status. Meanwhile, you could have your agent deliver the
message to them that the holdup was an oversight and not intentional on
your part to try to assure them as buyers you're not holding out...

It's the problem of not being allowed to just talk--could probably work
it out in five minutes face-to-face, but they'll never let you do it I'd
guess....maybe aren't even allowed to.

--

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 8:05:40 PM UTC-4, dpb wrote:
On 08/17/2014 3:19 PM, wrote:

...



My take at present is that the buyer has been waiting almost two

weeks now for a response to their Aug 4 objection amendment, the one

that wasnot submitted to me until Aug 14. ...



And there's the rub in the "who's right" part -- if push comes to shove

he'll point at the timestamp on the signature. Your initial posting

indicates "the two realtors had a misunderstanding regarding addresses

for communication". To settle that, either one has to concede he/she

was in error or you've got a two-lawyer deal there. That can't be good

to getting something going from the status quo.



We still don't know what is in this "objection ammendment, why it was
proposed by the seller, what it's about, etc. Is this a list of alleged
"defects"? If so, then it's not an ammendment, it's a list of stuff they
want fixed, pursuant to
the signed contract, and I agree with you, it could turn into did it get lost in
the mail, we sent it, you didn't get it controversy. But if it truly is
a proposed ammendment to the existing contract, then there is no controversy.
They have a contract signed by both parties that's in force. If someone
wants to ammend that, ie change it, add to it, whatever, then they need
to get it signed. Otherwise they have nothing and it doesn't matter in
terms of the existing contract who dropped the ball. And it's up to
those seeking the ammendment to follow through, not the seller. It sounds
like he was OK with the signed contract. The buyer might have
a legitimate claim against one of the realtors, but that doesn't change
the fact that the existing contract, existing deadlines are what govern.





If new dates are a subject of negotiations, then you've got the choice

of whether to just sign the document now to try to get the ball rolling

as it sounds like it is in your court and express concern to both

realtors that somebody ought to be minding the kitchen. It's always

possible, I presume, to make your position known to note that your

signature of X date is within Y date of time or receipt of document to

indicate the delay wasn't on your part. Don't know that it would have

any effect or any legal standing but it might make you feel better...



Meanwhile, work on the other dates as a side issue...doesn't seem that

it could muck anything up; all they can do is try to push the schedule

one way or the other but if were amenable to the original one would

think they'd still be agreeable to holding as close as feasible given

the current status.

They could muck it up by doing an inspection and finding a lot of new
stuff that they want fixed. As of right now, the deadline for an
inspection has passed and the deadline for giving a list of items based
on that inspection has also passed. He has to decide if he wants to
open the door to an inspection again or leave it closed.

I asked him previously if there are any other contingencies, eg a
mortgage contigency. That comes into play, because if he says tough,
deadline passed, deal proceeds pursuant to the contract, and they
haven't given him a committment letter yet,
and they want out, they could screw up the mortgage deliberately, so they
don't get it, and have that out. If he has a committment letter and
there are no other contingencies, then he's in much better position.
IDK for sure what I would do. If he says window is closed, they may
try to get out. If he says go ahead, get an inspector, then it could
wind up costing him bucks not just for the inspection, but to fix stuff,
where as of now, there is no stuff to fix. If I were to allow the
inspection now, I probably would not pay for it. Let those that dropped
the ball, ie buyer, realtors, figure it out.




Meanwhile, you could have your agent deliver the

message to them that the holdup was an oversight and not intentional on

your part to try to assure them as buyers you're not holding out...



It's the problem of not being allowed to just talk--could probably work

it out in five minutes face-to-face, but they'll never let you do it I'd

guess....maybe aren't even allowed to.



How can anyone possibly stop you? Presumably he has the buyers info
and he can contact them anytime he pleases. Seems especially appropriate
under the circumstances, with stuff apparently not getting through.




--

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 17:32:39 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

We still don't know what is in this "objection ammendment, why it was
proposed by the seller, what it's about, etc. Is this a list of alleged
"defects"? If so, then it's not an ammendment, it's a list of stuff they
want fixed,

I've never heard the term until now - "objection amendment"

I think the OP is talking about counter offers - you fix this based on
this inspection - a way to negotiate what does or does not get fixed.

I've refused to fix stuff before because it was nit picking. When I
agreed, I fixed it. Documented it and advised my agent.

We all know how inspectors play - CYA.

Ralph Mowery wrote:

Those home warranties are just a waste of money for the most part. If you
really look over what they cover and how much they cost, you get very little
in return. Sort of like the warranties on most things they try to sell you
in stores on electronics now. Usually if they last the first week you will
not
have any problems for the warrentied period.

I bought a house about 10 years ago and they tried to push the warranty on
me. Those realitors must get a kickback or something.

Hi,
I never bought a pre-owned house. Always had one built per my specs. and
sold one I was living in via realtors. Like I mentioned, no prospective
buyer without pre-approved financing. Price the house couple grand less
than going price in the neighborhood. Never took more than a month to
sell the house. Brand new houses always come with government backed
warranty.(mandatory for every house builder here)
One example, a new house was built in a brand new sub division. The
house started sinking dangerously after less than 2 year's occupancy
to a point of beyond remedy. Research found out that spot was farm's
trash dump 100 years ago. House was demolished, rebuilt with
properly reinforced foundation by the warranty program.

Oren wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 17:32:39 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

We still don't know what is in this "objection ammendment, why it was
proposed by the seller, what it's about, etc. Is this a list of alleged
"defects"? If so, then it's not an ammendment, it's a list of stuff they
want fixed,

I've never heard the term until now - "objection amendment"

I think the OP is talking about counter offers - you fix this based on
this inspection - a way to negotiate what does or does not get fixed.

I've refused to fix stuff before because it was nit picking. When I
agreed, I fixed it. Documented it and advised my agent.

We all know how inspectors play - CYA.

Hi,
Some so called certified inspectors never had any experience in house
building trades, LOL! I know some who are retired ex-contractors with
good reputation.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 9:21:37 PM UTC-4, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 17:32:39 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

wrote:



We still don't know what is in this "objection ammendment, why it was

proposed by the seller, what it's about, etc. Is this a list of alleged

"defects"? If so, then it's not an ammendment, it's a list of stuff they

want fixed,



I've never heard the term until now - "objection amendment"



Agree, and we still don't know what that means.




I think the OP is talking about counter offers - you fix this based on

this inspection - a way to negotiate what does or does not get fixed.


If that's what he's talking about, then I'd call it a list of items
from the inspection report that the buyer wants fixed. It's not an
ammendment at all. But that wouldn't
seem to make sense, because he's talking about allowing the buyer to have
another inspection, even though the deadline has past. If they in fact
sent a list of items they wanted fixed, then it means they accepted the
previous inspection and came up with their list. All he has to do is
agree to fix whatever they have on the list, give them something off,
whatever. IF he's OK with that, I don't see what the problem is or
why there is talk of allowing another inspection after the deadline, etc.

Maybe the "ammendment" says they want to have their own inspection?

IDK, very confusing. Key is what exactly is in this objection ammendment?






I've refused to fix stuff before because it was nit picking. When I

agreed, I fixed it. Documented it and advised my agent.



We all know how inspectors play - CYA.

On Sun, 17 Aug 2014 18:53:43 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

I've never heard the term until now - "objection amendment"



Agree, and we still don't know what that means.




I think the OP is talking about counter offers - you fix this based on

this inspection - a way to negotiate what does or does not get fixed.


If that's what he's talking about, then I'd call it a list of items
from the inspection report that the buyer wants fixed. It's not an
ammendment at all. But that wouldn't
seem to make sense, because he's talking about allowing the buyer to have
another inspection, even though the deadline has past. If they in fact
sent a list of items they wanted fixed, then it means they accepted the
previous inspection and came up with their list. All he has to do is
agree to fix whatever they have on the list, give them something off,
whatever. IF he's OK with that, I don't see what the problem is or
why there is talk of allowing another inspection after the deadline, etc.

Maybe the "ammendment" says they want to have their own inspection?

IDK, very confusing. Key is what exactly is in this objection ammendment?



OP should tell us verbatim what the contract with the realtor agent
(seller agent) says. If we knew what state we could try to figure out
the laws that apply. He could check those.

After ~ 8 houses, I never had an inspection after the first one.
Buyers have never asked for another inspection. I've never offered
another one.

"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...
Hi,
I never bought a pre-owned house. Always had one built per my specs. and
sold one I was living in via realtors. Like I mentioned, no prospective
buyer without pre-approved financing. Price the house couple grand less
than going price in the neighborhood. Never took more than a month to sell
the house. Brand new houses always come with government backed
warranty.(mandatory for every house builder here)
One example, a new house was built in a brand new sub division. The house
started sinking dangerously after less than 2 year's occupancy
to a point of beyond remedy. Research found out that spot was farm's trash
dump 100 years ago. House was demolished, rebuilt with
properly reinforced foundation by the warranty program.


I wanted to build a house like I wanted, but searched 6 months for some land
like I wnated and could afford. Could not find any , so started looking at
houses and land for another 6 months before I found a house that was about
25 years old that met most of what the wife and I were looking for.

I don't think the realitors around here were too serious about looking for
things. I had seen 3 differant companies and not one contacted us about
anything in that period of time. I did find 3 houses during that time that
would have met most of the specs I gave the realitors. Finally found this
house on the internet using the MLS search. Then had a lot of problems
buying it even though I had the cash in hand for it.

I made an offer much less than the asking price as I knew it had been on the
market for over a year. I did not even get a counter offer,but just a flat
no.
I waited 2 months and nothing else came open that I wanted. I then put in a
more reasonable offer and was taken up on it. While in closing I said
something to the owners and they said they did not even get the first offer
I made.

I am going to try to address all points made since my last post, starting with trader 4's.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 5:01:19 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
I still don't understand what the "objections amendment" was all about.

The precise wording of the boilerplate document the buyer (electronically) signed on Aug 4, but did not email to me (via the realtors) until Aug 14, is as follows:

Title: "Objection, Resolution, and Waiver Amendment to Purchase Agreement." Underlined and in bold an inch from the top is the statement "This amendment is subject to all existing deadlines in the Purchase Agreement."
Section 2 is titled ""Objections and Requested Cures"
Section 2 A. is titled "Reports and/or Documents referenced in this Amendment." The buyer typed in "Home inspection dated Oct 30 2013." I had provided the 2013 home inspection report to my realtor on July 25, before signing the Purchase Agreement." I do not know when my realtor sent the report to the buyer's realtor.
Section 2 B. is again titled "Objections and Requested Cures." The buyer typed, "Buyer requests a list of items repaired or replaced by Seller based on inspection findings." Nothing more was written; no list of defects they wanted cured, nothing but the one request for me to provide a list as quoted here. Said list of what I had done having been provided to my realtor the day before (Aug 3).

I see also in the Purchase Agreement under the section titled "Inspections - Buyer's Objections," is the sentence "If no written objection is delivered to the Seller in writing by the Objection deadline, the contingency shall be deemed waived." Under "Inspections - Resolution," the Purchase Agreement states, "If the objections are not resolved by the Resolution Deadline [Aug 15], this Agreement shall terminate."

The whole exchange and timeline since July 26 about the home inspection (re-inspection? who knows?) does not make sense to me. Hence my comment earlier today that I do not know where things stand. Though I am getting a pretty good idea at this point.

They had a date to get an inspection done by, another date to get to you any
issues regarding things to be fixed. The contract also states that the
buyer gets the less than a year old inspection to accept or decline. You
provided that, right?

I provided the 2013 inspection report to my realtor on July 25, during negotiations. I provided the list of corrections I had performed on Aug 3. In this list I elaborated and stated where I had receipts and other proof, offering same to the buyer. I also stated at the end of the list that the buyer was welcome to inspect any and all items above on sufficient notice. Based on the Aug 4 proposed amendment document, it appears the buyer did receive the inspection report in a timely fashion.

I would say the fact that they did nothing about
another inspection, is acceptance of the existing inspection report.
And failure to notify anyone of any defect list based on it by the Aug 13
deadline, closes the window for that too.
From the above, if they got
nothing signed, then they had to Aug 11 to get a new inspection and they
had till Aug 13 to get you the fix-it list based on either that new
inspection, if done, or anything off the old inspection they want to
check, oject to, etc. Both those deadlines passed.

Thank you for the above clarity. What you wrote makes sense.

So, what exactly was the purpose of this objections amendment that
got lost and never executed?

At this time I think the proposed amendment's only value is to demonstrate that the buyer's realtor is so new to this that he neither knows how to handle a buyer's questions nor subsequently execute a Purchase Agreement.

Why wasn't whatever it concerns included in the signed contract from day 1?

My best guess is that it is another blunder on the buyer's realtor's part.

snip, hopefully without loss of context
Referring to the buyer and buyer's realtor --
I think they did do something wrong, which is to drop the ball. They were
the ones wanting an amendment of some kind, right?

Yes. I was waiting for a call to set up another inspection, or else a document stating the buyer had accepted the old inspection. Per the Purchase Agreement, the ball was in the buyer's court.

It was up to them to
make sure they got some response. If I was a buyer and I got no response,
I'd be calling, checking, especially as deadlines approached. What they
did wrong has only resulted in them screwing themselves.

I suspect the buyer's biggest mistake was in trusting his realtor. Same for me. Especially as my realtor tries to strong arm me on this matter, in favor of the buyer. My realtor knows I am angry about this. I think I did a pretty good job of restricting my exchange with him to the facts of the blunders and my inconvenience. When he tried what seemed to me to be double talk, I informed him I believed I had the right to back out of the contract at this point. My realtor did finally admit that the realtors dropped the ball, with the communications snafu.

Who exactly did drop the ball?

So far all I know is that the buyer's realtor was using two different email addresses. My realtor said the email address that he used at one point was 'the wrong one' for sending docs to the buyer's realtor, and so the buyer's realtor did not get some information until late. I am not clear on which information this was. It does seem clear that the buyer the 2013 home inspection report and my list of correction by Aug 4.

Shortly after both buyer and seller signed the Purchase Agreement, my realtor also complained that, the buyer's realtor was neither returning phone calls for several days (if at all) nor responding to emails.

Better if it's their realtor. And did you
know for sure that they were sending a proposed ammendment and what it was
supposed to contain?

No. This was a surprise.

I feel like one never knows what home inspectors will come up with. For example, my roof had around 25 sq. feet of new shingles added last year, per the 2013 inspection, but the next inspection may yield an inspector who says this is not good enough.

Yes, that's always the risk. Which is why I suggested telling them that
they missed their inspection window, you've fixed X, Y, Z per the less than
a year old inspection. They can either accept that, come look, or hire an
inspector at their own cost. I'm starting to think the last part is not
the best idea either, for reasons you poiont out later.....
snip
If it's their realtor fault, better for you. But I'd say even if your realtor
dropped the ball, it's tough luck for them. They signed the contract, with
the deadlines for inspections. It was up to them, their realtor, their
lawyer, if they have one, etc to keep track of their contractual obligations.
Thanks again for the clarity.
snip

I think maybe one other option that is a bit tempting is to tell the two realtors they can now pay for the home inspection and warranty, or the deal is off. I know they do not get 6% commission; their companies do, and they get a tiny slice of this.

I don't think you want to do that option. So far, from what you've told us
so far, you're 100% in the right.
If you now interject some new condition, then you're breaching the solid,
existing contract, by altering the existing terms. The existing contract
is clear and the deadlines have passed.
You shouldn't feel sorry for them here. Deadlines are there for a
purpose.

Thank you! My realtor keeps insisting the dates may be played loosely. Here I am trying to make plans around specific dates, recognizing that requests for amendments might happen so I need some flexibility depending upon what I want, and my realtor is saying the dates count for nothing.

You want the house sold, it's costing you money, taxes, etc. They
missed the deadlines and it wasn't your fault, so I don;t see the need to pay for an inspection to possibly let them out of a solid deal. They could do
an inspection, then bitch about thousands worth of crap.

What other possible outs do they have at this point? Are they getting
a mortgage with a mortgage contigency?

Yes. If the lender disqualifies the buyer prior to Aug 25, then the buyer keeps his earnest money. Also the buyer has until Aug 25 to "object" to the HOA disclosure.

If yes, then do you have a committment letter yet?

No. I have a pre-approval letter only. Friday my realtor said the mortgage company told him that day that all was on track. Though this counts for nothing legally. The buyer could still queer the deal, keep his earnest money, and be out only the cost of the appraisal inspection completed on Aug 11. The appraisal itself is not in yet.

If they have that as an out, you need to
proceed more cautiously, because they could queer the mortgage deal
to get out of the purchase. If you have a committment letter, then
you're in a much better position.

Understood.

One other thing worth considering is that maybe this miss isn't so
innocent. Maybe they are having cold feet, want out, etc. You never
know for sure what people are up to......

I agree. Since the buyer has at least two ways to get out of this without losing his earnest money, I would rather he call it quits sooner rather than later.

Regarding comments from others about communicating with the buyer effectively: First I tend to think that my contacting the buyer directly at this time is a violation of my contract with my realtor. Second I do not trust my realtor or the other realtor to convey honestly what happened here. They might. They might not. I have no way of telling. My best bet is to insist on certain wording in any legal document that requires both the buyer's and seller's signatures.

I have signed nothing amending the Purchase Agreement. Thanks all for compelling further thought on this. I think I have to decide whether to risk losing this buyer or put up with the incompetence of the realtors here and make the sale happen. I keep in mind more mistakes are likely, based on what has transpired so far. Plus I feel like not calling the realtors out on this now means they may try more foolishness, and I will regret bending further and further to their mediocrity.

On Sunday, August 17, 2014 11:55:53 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I am going to try to address all points made since my last post, starting with trader 4's.



And you did. Now I think we have a much better idea of what's going on.



On Sunday, August 17, 2014 5:01:19 PM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:

I still don't understand what the "objections amendment" was all about.



The precise wording of the boilerplate document the buyer (electronically) signed on Aug 4, but did not email to me (via the realtors) until Aug 14, is as follows:



Title: "Objection, Resolution, and Waiver Amendment to Purchase Agreement.." Underlined and in bold an inch from the top is the statement "This amendment is subject to all existing deadlines in the Purchase Agreement."

Section 2 is titled ""Objections and Requested Cures"

Section 2 A. is titled "Reports and/or Documents referenced in this Amendment." The buyer typed in "Home inspection dated Oct 30 2013." I had provided the 2013 home inspection report to my realtor on July 25, before signing the Purchase Agreement." I do not know when my realtor sent the report to the buyer's realtor.

Section 2 B. is again titled "Objections and Requested Cures." The buyer typed, "Buyer requests a list of items repaired or replaced by Seller based on inspection findings." Nothing more was written; no list of defects they wanted cured, nothing but the one request for me to provide a list as quoted here. Said list of what I had done having been provided to my realtor the day before (Aug 3).



Based on the above, I'd say they accepted the inspection report you
gave them and gave no indication that they wanted a separate inspection of
their own. And whoever drew this up, did a poor job. It's not 100% clear
if they are accepting the inspection, but I'd say it looks like they are.
Even worse, it's totally unclear if they are demanding that everything
on the inspection report be fixed, or if they are just seeking more info at
that point. If I were in their position, I would have said that based on
the inspection report you provided, I want X, Y, Z either fixed or a credit
given to me to cover the cost of the repairs, if they have not been fixed.
That way, I specifically identify what I care about and what I don't. For
example, an inspection report could say that the HVAC system is near the
end of it's life. Some buyers might try to use that to get you to put in
a new one. Others might not. If they said in that document that they
want X, Y, X done, then it's clear those are the only things left, all
else is accepted. It's bad for you for them to not specifically
make the identification of what they want fixed or credited and it leaves
it open for them to come back at you with later.



I see also in the Purchase Agreement under the section titled "Inspections - Buyer's Objections," is the sentence "If no written objection is delivered to the Seller in writing by the Objection deadline, the contingency shall be deemed waived." Under "Inspections - Resolution," the Purchase Agreement states, "If the objections are not resolved by the Resolution Deadline [Aug 15], this Agreement shall terminate."



So, since that date has now passed, potentially they have an out, by claiming
they provided their objections on Aug 4 and you didn't respond by the Aug 15
deadline. I think the wording of just "objections" in the original contract
is poor too. I would have said something like "Buyer has until Aug 13 to
provide seller a list of any specific items that are identified in
the inspection report that are not acceptable to buyer."





The whole exchange and timeline since July 26 about the home inspection (re-inspection? who knows?) does not make sense to me. Hence my comment earlier today that I do not know where things stand. Though I am getting a pretty good idea at this point.



They had a date to get an inspection done by, another date to get to you any

issues regarding things to be fixed. The contract also states that the

buyer gets the less than a year old inspection to accept or decline. You

provided that, right?



I provided the 2013 inspection report to my realtor on July 25, during negotiations. I provided the list of corrections I had performed on Aug 3. In this list I elaborated and stated where I had receipts and other proof, offering same to the buyer. I also stated at the end of the list that the buyer was welcome to inspect any and all items above on sufficient notice. Based on the Aug 4 proposed amendment document, it appears the buyer did receive the inspection report in a timely fashion.


Do you know if the buyer ever got the list of corrections that you provided
to your realtor? That would be very important, because that is all the
buyer wanted in their Aug 4 objection letter.




I would say the fact that they did nothing about

another inspection, is acceptance of the existing inspection report.

And failure to notify anyone of any defect list based on it by the Aug 13

deadline, closes the window for that too.

From the above, if they got

nothing signed, then they had to Aug 11 to get a new inspection and they

had till Aug 13 to get you the fix-it list based on either that new

inspection, if done, or anything off the old inspection they want to

check, oject to, etc. Both those deadlines passed.



Thank you for the above clarity. What you wrote makes sense.



So, what exactly was the purpose of this objections amendment that

got lost and never executed?



At this time I think the proposed amendment's only value is to demonstrate that the buyer's realtor is so new to this that he neither knows how to handle a buyer's questions nor subsequently execute a Purchase Agreement.



For sure the vast majority of this rests with the buyer's realtor. It's
their client's clock that is ticking toward the deadline and they should
be on top of it. If I were the realtor, I'd probably put the relevant
deadlines in my phone or PC calendar so that a few days before, I could
check to make sure they are complied with.




Why wasn't whatever it concerns included in the signed contract from day 1?



My best guess is that it is another blunder on the buyer's realtor's part..


Since the "objection ammendment" is what I'd call an "objection list" or
"fix-it list", I now understand why it couldn't be in the original contract..
This is normal, the poor way it's been handled is the problem.




snip, hopefully without loss of context

Referring to the buyer and buyer's realtor --

I think they did do something wrong, which is to drop the ball. They were

the ones wanting an amendment of some kind, right?



Yes. I was waiting for a call to set up another inspection, or else a document stating the buyer had accepted the old inspection. Per the Purchase Agreement, the ball was in the buyer's court.



The bad part here is that you still really don't have that. Per my
comments above, from what they've said, it looks like they have accepted
the previous report, but it's not 100% clear. Worse, it's not stated
what on that inspection report they are objecting to and what they are
not. As I said above, inspection reports can say all kinds of vague things,
like "pool deck will need to be resurfaced soon". If
you don't have an actual specific list of the items THEY deem important
and object to, you're in no mans land. How much stuff like that there
could be depends on what's in the report.




It was up to them to

make sure they got some response. If I was a buyer and I got no response,

I'd be calling, checking, especially as deadlines approached. What they

did wrong has only resulted in them screwing themselves.



I suspect the buyer's biggest mistake was in trusting his realtor. Same for me. Especially as my realtor tries to strong arm me on this matter, in favor of the buyer. My realtor knows I am angry about this. I think I did a pretty good job of restricting my exchange with him to the facts of the blunders and my inconvenience. When he tried what seemed to me to be double talk, I informed him I believed I had the right to back out of the contract at this point. My realtor did finally admit that the realtors dropped the ball, with the communications snafu.



From what I've heard so far, I don't think you have any basis for backing
out. The only thing that's happened so far, is the
deadlines for the inspection/objections have passed. If the buyer is
willing to continue on, accept the list you've provided of the repairs
you previously made, etc, then as I see it the contract is in force and
you have no out.





Who exactly did drop the ball?



So far all I know is that the buyer's realtor was using two different email addresses. My realtor said the email address that he used at one point was 'the wrong one' for sending docs to the buyer's realtor, and so the buyer's realtor did not get some information until late. I am not clear on which information this was. It does seem clear that the buyer the 2013 home inspection report and my list of correction by Aug 4.



OK, if you know that the buyer got your list of correction on Aug 4, then
you're in a real good position. You did respond to their objections list
and heard nothing more from them and the deadlines have now passed.




Shortly after both buyer and seller signed the Purchase Agreement, my realtor also complained that, the buyer's realtor was neither returning phone calls for several days (if at all) nor responding to emails.



Which means from then on your realtor should have been keeping real good
track, asking for confirmation that things were received, etc. When this is
over you might want to call up the owner of the other realty firm and register
a complaint and see what they have to say.




Better if it's their realtor. And did you

know for sure that they were sending a proposed ammendment and what it was

supposed to contain?



No. This was a surprise.



I don't see why it would be a surprise. You gave them the previous inspection
report. They had a window to respond to it, get their own inspection, etc.
then get back to you by Aug 13. BTW, those dates 11, 13, 15 are awfully
close together. I would have spaced them out a little more.




I feel like one never knows what home inspectors will come up with. For example, my roof had around 25 sq. feet of new shingles added last year, per the 2013 inspection, but the next inspection may yield an inspector who says this is not good enough.



Yes, that's always the risk. Which is why I suggested telling them that

they missed their inspection window, you've fixed X, Y, Z per the less than

a year old inspection. They can either accept that, come look, or hire an

inspector at their own cost. I'm starting to think the last part is not

the best idea either, for reasons you poiont out later.....

snip

If it's their realtor fault, better for you. But I'd say even if your realtor

dropped the ball, it's tough luck for them. They signed the contract, with

the deadlines for inspections. It was up to them, their realtor, their

lawyer, if they have one, etc to keep track of their contractual obligations.

Thanks again for the clarity.

snip



I think maybe one other option that is a bit tempting is to tell the two realtors they can now pay for the home inspection and warranty, or the deal is off. I know they do not get 6% commission; their companies do, and they get a tiny slice of this.



I don't think you want to do that option. So far, from what you've told us

so far, you're 100% in the right.

If you now interject some new condition, then you're breaching the solid,

existing contract, by altering the existing terms. The existing contract

is clear and the deadlines have passed.

You shouldn't feel sorry for them here. Deadlines are there for a

purpose.



Thank you! My realtor keeps insisting the dates may be played loosely. Here I am trying to make plans around specific dates, recognizing that requests for amendments might happen so I need some flexibility depending upon what I want, and my realtor is saying the dates count for nothing.



When your realtor and/or a client loses $10K because they missed some
deadline, maybe they will learn. Suppose the buyer misses some deadline
that gives the seller an out and the seller now has an all cash buyer or
a buyer offering $20K more.....



You want the house sold, it's costing you money, taxes, etc. They

missed the deadlines and it wasn't your fault, so I don;t see the need to pay for an inspection to possibly let them out of a solid deal. They could do

an inspection, then bitch about thousands worth of crap.



What other possible outs do they have at this point? Are they getting

a mortgage with a mortgage contigency?



Yes. If the lender disqualifies the buyer prior to Aug 25, then the buyer keeps his earnest money. Also the buyer has until Aug 25 to "object" to the HOA disclosure.



Which complicates things. IDK why you'd give them such a long period
to object to the HOA disclosure, unless that's required by law.




If yes, then do you have a committment letter yet?



No. I have a pre-approval letter only. Friday my realtor said the mortgage company told him that day that all was on track. Though this counts for nothing legally. The buyer could still queer the deal, keep his earnest money, and be out only the cost of the appraisal inspection completed on Aug 11.. The appraisal itself is not in yet.



Agree




If they have that as an out, you need to

proceed more cautiously, because they could queer the mortgage deal

to get out of the purchase. If you have a committment letter, then

you're in a much better position.



Understood.



One other thing worth considering is that maybe this miss isn't so

innocent. Maybe they are having cold feet, want out, etc. You never

know for sure what people are up to......



I agree. Since the buyer has at least two ways to get out of this without losing his earnest money, I would rather he call it quits sooner rather than later.



Regarding comments from others about communicating with the buyer effectively: First I tend to think that my contacting the buyer directly at this time is a violation of my contract with my realtor.

Why? Does it specifically say that? If it did, I would have insisted
that be struck out.



Second I do not trust my realtor or the other realtor to convey honestly what happened here. They might. They might not. I have no way of telling. My best bet is to insist on certain wording in any legal document that requires both the buyer's and seller's signatures.



I have signed nothing amending the Purchase Agreement. Thanks all for compelling further thought on this. I think I have to decide whether to risk losing this buyer or put up with the incompetence of the realtors here and make the sale happen. I keep in mind more mistakes are likely, based on what has transpired so far. Plus I feel like not calling the realtors out on this now means they may try more foolishness, and I will regret bending further and further to their mediocrity.

I don't see why this can't be salvaged, unless the buyer actually wants
out. I would talk to your realtor and find out exactly what the buyer's
position is at this point, ie:

1 - They have the list of repairs you made? (you think they do)

2 - Those repairs are acceptable?

3 - Inspection/repair contingency is now removed?

If the answers are yes, then I would send the buyer a letter stating
that you provided the requested list of repairs on Aug XX and
that you want them to confirm that the inspection/repair contigency
is now removed. Then you're 100% back on track.
If they say no to #3, then you have to figure out what it takes to
resolve it.

On Monday, August 18, 2014 6:53:52 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:
Based on the above, I'd say they accepted the inspection report you
gave them and gave no indication that they wanted a separate inspection of
their own.

My realtor informed me that specifically, he "sent the Sellers Disclosure, repairs and the termite to the wrong email address. The buyer's realtor has received all of them at this point." The Seller's Disclosure delivery he referenced was due Jul 25. Objections to same due Jul 28. Resolution due Aug 14. From piecing things together with the timeline, I suspect the buyer's realtor did not get any of the above until this past week, about Aug 13-15. That the two realtors did not follow up to confirm receipt of whatever or find out why such-and-such did not happen by the Purchase Agreement dates seems to remain the problem.

And whoever drew this up, did a poor job. It's not 100% clear
if they are accepting the inspection,

I agree the wording regarding inspections has been consistently poor. Throw in communications flat-out not being received from one realtor to the other, and it is a morass with legal, but still salvag-able implications. I could have been more vigilant on the dates. I relied too much on my realtor to check on the reasonableness of the dates. My bad. And as another kind poster pointed out, for what purpose am I paying these two realtors 3% each? Not for this shabby service. At least my realtor is owning the snafus, though not their cost. Yet.

So, since that date has now passed, potentially they have an out, by claiming
they provided their objections on Aug 4 and you didn't respond by the Aug 15
deadline.

Yes.

Do you know if the buyer ever got the list of corrections that you provided
to your realtor? That would be very important, because that is all the
buyer wanted in their Aug 4 objection letter.

From my realtor's latest communication, it appears that the buyer did not get the list of corrections until about Aug 13-15. The termite inspection was done on Aug 11, with me mailing all termite docs early the afternoon of Aug 11 to my realtor. As I noted above, my realtor sent the termite and other docs to the wrong (= a secondary) email address. My realtor must have learned this around Aug 12.

This still begs the question of who dropped the ball regarding the Aug 4 Objections Amendment not reaching me until Aug 14. I sent the list of corrections on Aug 3 because the buyer's realtor asked my realtor on the phone about then to submit these. My realtor then either phoned me or emailed me about Aug 3 to send the list or corrections per the buyer's request. I saved my Aug 3 email sending the list of corrections, among other emails.

For sure the vast majority of this rests with the buyer's realtor. It's
their client's clock that is ticking toward the deadline and they should
be on top of it. If I were the realtor, I'd probably put the relevant
deadlines in my phone or PC calendar so that a few days before, I could
check to make sure they are complied with.

Now having re-constructed and studied the timeline (and resenting all this labor because a couple of realtors' mistakes), I tend to think both realtors were careless about communications in a few ways. But for the grace of god there go I. OTOH this is costing me.

I bear in mind that the indications are that this buyer wants this deal to happen. So do I. I think the buyer being baffled about non-response and things not coming from my end (due to the communications snafu) for a few weeks now is likely. I resent that they may want to take it out on me, when it is not my fault. Unless one wants to argue that I should have asked to be cc'd in all realtor-to-realtor communications and permitted to badger the other realtor to get a response.

Since the "objection ammendment" is what I'd call an "objection list" or
"fix-it list", I now understand why it couldn't be in the original contract.
This is normal, the poor way it's been handled is the problem.

Agreed.

From what I've heard so far, I don't think you have any basis for backing
out. The only thing that's happened so far, is the
deadlines for the inspection/objections have passed. If the buyer is
willing to continue on, accept the list you've provided of the repairs
you previously made, etc, then as I see it the contract is in force and
you have no out.

The buyer wants the home warranty, as agreed in the purchase agreement. This requires the inspection (re-inspection?). The inspection hinged upon (emphatically in the Purchase Agreement) the buyer ordering same; meeting certain deadlines; and certain communications regarding corrections.

Like you noted, poor wording in the PA etc. has messed this up.

OK, if you know that the buyer got your list of correction on Aug 4, then
you're in a real good position.

No. I now stand corrected. It appears the buyer did not get the list of corrections until Aug 13-15, due to my realtor using a secondary email address that the buyer's realtor does not check regularly.

You did respond to their objections list
and heard nothing more from them and the deadlines have now passed.

I responded to their objections list, but the two realtors failed to ensure the buyer received same until Aug 13-15, by my estimate. Then I do not get word that the buyer has been waiting on this list of corrections from Aug 4 to about Aug 13-15. My realtor sent me the Aug 4 Objections Amendment on Aug 14, and contractual chaos has ensued. Not to be dramatic. But sorting this out so I am legally protected is now tricky.

Regarding comments from others about communicating with the buyer effectively: First I tend to think that my contacting the buyer directly at this time is a violation of my contract with my realtor.

Why? Does it specifically say that? If it did, I would have insisted
that be struck out.

Respectfully, the wording of my contract with my realtor under "Seller Obligations" seems to argue against my doing any communications with the Buyer or Buyer's realtor directly. In my experience of two home purchases and 1.5 other home sales, the other party never communicated with me directly. this make sense to me.

I don't see why this can't be salvaged, unless the buyer actually wants
out. I would talk to your realtor and find out exactly what the buyer's
position is at this point, ie:

1 - They have the list of repairs you made?

They appear to have received these around Aug 13-15.

2 - Those repairs are acceptable?

By phone call this weekend, my realtor said the other realtor said all seems fine regarding the repairs done. Nothing is in writing nor signed.

3 - Inspection/repair contingency is now removed?

The buyer wants the home warranty, and this requires another home inspection (re-inspection). This home inspection having been the responsibility of the buyer to arrange, and having been due by Aug 11, all per the Purchase Agreement.

This will be the focus of today's discussions, assuming all still want this to happen.

If they say no to #3, then you have to figure out what it takes to
resolve it.

Yes.

Thank you for your time. It has given me clarity here. I am putting together what I want; how much I am willing to give up to get what I want; and what is necessary to protect myself legally to get what I want. I will post an update.

On Monday, August 18, 2014 10:34:01 AM UTC-4, wrote:


Regarding comments from others about communicating with the buyer effectively: First I tend to think that my contacting the buyer directly at this time is a violation of my contract with my realtor.



Why? Does it specifically say that? If it did, I would have insisted

that be struck out.



Respectfully, the wording of my contract with my realtor under "Seller Obligations" seems to argue against my doing any communications with the Buyer or Buyer's realtor directly.

I would never sign such a contract.

In my experience of two home purchases and 1.5 other home sales, the other party never communicated with me directly. this make sense to me.



They don't have to and typically the communication is through the brokers.
But this is a good example of a case where I would pick up the phone and
call the buyer myself.




I don't see why this can't be salvaged, unless the buyer actually wants

out. I would talk to your realtor and find out exactly what the buyer's

position is at this point, ie:



1 - They have the list of repairs you made?



They appear to have received these around Aug 13-15.



2 - Those repairs are acceptable?



By phone call this weekend, my realtor said the other realtor said all seems fine regarding the repairs done. Nothing is in writing nor signed.



3 - Inspection/repair contingency is now removed?



The buyer wants the home warranty, and this requires another home inspection (re-inspection). This home inspection having been the responsibility of the buyer to arrange, and having been due by Aug 11, all per the Purchase Agreement.



I think you said the broker is the one that convinced you to pay for and
give a warranty. I haven't seen that done here, in NJ, at all. And for
sure, being in the position where you have a recent home inspection, you've
fixed that stuff, I would not have put something in the contract that
requires another inspection. It appears absent that warranty, the buyer
was satisfied with the previous inspection. That warranty just set you up
for a guaranteed additional inspection and the opportunity for the inspector
to squawk more stuff. Hopefully that won't happen.



This will be the focus of today's discussions, assuming all still want this to happen.



If they say no to #3, then you have to figure out what it takes to

resolve it.



Yes.



Thank you for your time. It has given me clarity here. I am putting together what I want; how much I am willing to give up to get what I want; and what is necessary to protect myself legally to get what I want. I will post an update.

I'd have a new set of dates ready for them to have the inspection done by,
any objections given to you. Get them to agree to it. I'd put that in a letter to the buyer, send it myself and tell them all future communication to copy you on. If your broker doesn't like that, tough. I'd also insist that I be on
the call discussing the above today. And if he/she bitches at all about it,
I'd call the owner of the realty company and tell them how this has been
mishandled.

On Mon, 18 Aug 2014 05:53:52 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:


Which means from then on your realtor should have been keeping real good
track, asking for confirmation that things were received, etc. When this is
over you might want to call up the owner of the other realty firm and register
a complaint and see what they have to say.

If there is a valid complaint, skip the realtors, broker, etc., and
file with the state's licensing board. It puts another set on eyes on
the matter, better chances of a resolution than an office manager
giving the agent a tiny slap on the wrist. You be a "good little"
boy/girl now, ya hear.

Agents do not want complaints against them. It may just give them a
wake up call. Maybe some remedial training

wrote in message
...
My house was on the market starting early September 2013. I signed a nice
offer in late October 2013. All inspections were completed and objections
resolved. Then days before closing in late November, the lender disqualified
the buyer. I put the house back on the market in May. I had another decent
offer by late July. Per the contract terms and the buyer's request, the
buyer was to receive and consider the old (2013) inspection report. Relevant
dates:

July 26, buyer and seller signed puchase agreement.

August 11, inspections to be completed. Contract states in caps that the
buyer is to order the home inspection. [Buyer still has not ordered either
any home inspection or re-inspection. Buyer pays for the home inspection up
front. Seller is to reimburse this cost at closing. No closing, no
reimbursement.]

August 13, home inspection objections due.

August 14, seller receives objections amendment. The buyer had signed this
on Aug 4.

August 29, currently scheduled closing date.

The Aug 4 signing date was the tip-off to the seller (= me) that
communications had gone awry. My realtor ultimately explained that the
buyer's realtor and he had messed up with what email addresses they were to
use to exchange documents. This resulted in the missed deadlines and 10 days
where activity required by the buyer, going towards completing the sale, was
zero.

My realtor (= the seller's realtor) has said he needs me to sign the
objections amendment. Because the dates are now inconsistent with the
contract, I said no. It would make me look like I had dropped the ball.
Technically I think I may be in my rights to say the buyer has now waived
his right to have a home inspection and the accompanying home warranty. But
it was both realtors who appeared to have screwed up, and I do want to sell
the house. On the third hand, I am pretty angry I have more inspections to
deal with, all while I am trying to pack up and make arrangements etc. I
have met every deadline required of me, the seller. I emailed my realtor
that I wanted him to provide the following response to the buyer's proposed
objections amendment, inserted in the appropriate place in the proposed
amendment:

///
Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug 4] until
Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications between
buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days of delay,
and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home warranty,
seller requests (1) an extension to Monday, August 25 to complete home
re-inspection; (2) an extension to Wednesday, August 27 for buyer to provide
objections to home inspection report; (3) a change of the closing date to
Friday, September 5 [currently its Friday, August 29].
///


What would be your response to your realtor, if you were the seller?

If there is a real estate google group that might be more appropriate for
this question, please share the group's name.

Thank you.

(((

Not familiar with the licensing requirements in your area and this is NOT
legal advice.

Were I you I'd look to both realtors' Errors and Omission insurance carriers
(or the local equilivant)

On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 1:39:17 PM UTC-4, NotMe wrote:




Were I you I'd look to both realtors' Errors and Omission insurance carriers

(or the local equilivant)

Look to the insurance carriers for what exactly? As of right now he has
no real damages, tbe buyer is indicating they want to go through with the deal.
It might have cost him a week in the sales process, but even that is highly questionable and difficult to prove. For example, there is no mortgage committment yet, the agents could argue that is another gating factor that is proceeding on it's own, so their fumble didn't even result in any overall
delay of the closing at all.

On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 11:39:17 AM UTC-6, NotMe wrote:
Were I you I'd look to both realtors' Errors and Omission insurance carriers

I wonder if insurance exists to cover what seems to me to be at a minimum, pretty negligent conduct on the realtors' part.

Update: I thought about this long and hard. If I let these two realtors set schedules unrelated to the contract; frankly, lie to the buyer and me; repeatedly not follow instructions to communicate xyz to the buyer's realtor; and more; I figured I would be miserable for some months. My realtor worked on me all of Monday, talking past me like the deal was going forward; saying I had to agree to pay for the home inspection and warranty; and other double talk IMO. I said I believed per the contract's terms that either the contract was terminated due to no resolution of objections by Aug 15; or no "specific objections" (language the contract uses on this point, like many here seem to know) had been presented nor inspection scheduled by Aug 13 and 11th, so I did not have to do any inspections or address any objections. I said I would not continue unless the two realtors agreed to pay for the home inspection and warranty. My money says my unspoken "contribution" to this sub-deal is to not expose them to the buyer for mishandling communications and scheduling inspections. My outward contribution is to put up with another inspection and new deadlines, hustling like hell in the last week, to keep the buyer happy and go forward. If the objections are ridiculous, I can still back out. My realtor gave in, though I am still waiting for the paperwork he promised on same. I am ready for the worst and decided it would be better than not defending myself from two realtors who are not earning their commission, and likely would continue with their slovenly approach if gone unchecked, in my opinion. I think no winning happens in situations like this. But good enough.

Every single post here was contemplated and helped me figure and feel comfortable with a plan of action to follow. Every single one. Thank you gfre..aol.com, dpb, trader_4, Ralph Mowery, Oren, Robert Macy, Lee B, Tony Hwang, and NotMe for your time. I hope to pass on my good luck in having your advice to someone else in the future.

On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 11:39:17 AM UTC-6, NotMe wrote:
Were I you I'd look to both realtors' Errors and Omission insurance carriers
snip for brevity

I wonder if insurance exists to cover what seems to me to be at a minimum, pretty negligent conduct on the realtors' part.

Update: I thought a lot about how to proceed. If I let these two realtors set schedules unrelated to the contract; repeatedly not follow instructions to communicate xyz to the buyer's realtor; and more; I figured I would be miserable for some months. My realtor worked on me most of Monday, talking past me like the deal was going forward; saying I had to agree to pay for the home inspection and warranty; and what sounded to me like double talk. I said I believed per the contract's terms that either the contract was terminated due to no resolution of objections by Aug 15; or no "specific objections" (language the contract uses on this point, like many here seem to know) had been presented nor inspection scheduled by Aug 13 and 11th, so I did not have to do any inspections or address any objections. I said I would not continue unless the two realtors agreed to pay for the home inspection and warranty. My realtor finally consented and is preparing paperwork now. I am ready for the worst and decided it would be better than not defending myself from two realtors who are not earning their commission, and likely would continue with their unsupportable-by-contract approach if gone unchecked, in my opinion. I think no winning happens in situations like this. But good enough. The buyer has said she is going forward and wants to close this deal.

Interestingly starting today, and with the understanding that paperwork has to be signed before any inspection takes place, my realtor has been trying to get an appointment for an inspection. The earliest one available with the inspection company selected is Sep 2, past the scheduled closing. We're trying to squeeze into any slot that opens because of a cancellation. This requires daily checking by my realtor. Objections, resolution and cure require several more days. I am trying to be as accommodating as possible. So now, and it seems to me because the buyer's realtor made no effort to schedule an inspection per the contract deadline, closing is indeterminate. I remain ready for the deal to fall through, though I hope it does not.

Also interestingly: My realtor called the other realtor twice today. No return call, here in the throes of what looks like a closing that will have to be changed and with much that has to be done still. My realtor said he is irritated once again with the other realtor regarding communications and wanted me to know. Indeed.

Every post to this thread was contemplated and helped me figure and feel comfortable with a plan of action to follow. Thank you gfre..aol.com, dpb, trader_4, Ralph Mowery, Oren, Robert Macy, Lee B, Tony Hwang, and NotMe for your time. I hope to pass on my good luck in having your advice to someone else in the future.

wrote in message
...
My house was on the market starting early September 2013. I signed a nice
offer in late October 2013. All inspections were completed and objections
resolved. Then days before closing in late November, the lender disqualified
the buyer. I put the house back on the market in May. I had another decent
offer by late July. Per the contract terms and the buyer's request, the
buyer was to receive and consider the old (2013) inspection report. Relevant
dates:

July 26, buyer and seller signed puchase agreement.

August 11, inspections to be completed. Contract states in caps that the
buyer is to order the home inspection. [Buyer still has not ordered either
any home inspection or re-inspection. Buyer pays for the home inspection up
front. Seller is to reimburse this cost at closing. No closing, no
reimbursement.]

August 13, home inspection objections due.

August 14, seller receives objections amendment. The buyer had signed this
on Aug 4.

August 29, currently scheduled closing date.

The Aug 4 signing date was the tip-off to the seller (= me) that
communications had gone awry. My realtor ultimately explained that the
buyer's realtor and he had messed up with what email addresses they were to
use to exchange documents. This resulted in the missed deadlines and 10 days
where activity required by the buyer, going towards completing the sale, was
zero.

My realtor (= the seller's realtor) has said he needs me to sign the
objections amendment. Because the dates are now inconsistent with the
contract, I said no. It would make me look like I had dropped the ball.
Technically I think I may be in my rights to say the buyer has now waived
his right to have a home inspection and the accompanying home warranty. But
it was both realtors who appeared to have screwed up, and I do want to sell
the house. On the third hand, I am pretty angry I have more inspections to
deal with, all while I am trying to pack up and make arrangements etc. I
have met every deadline required of me, the seller. I emailed my realtor
that I wanted him to provide the following response to the buyer's proposed
objections amendment, inserted in the appropriate place in the proposed
amendment:

///
Seller was not emailed buyer's objection etc. amendment [dated Aug 4] until
Thursday evening, Aug 14. Due to apparent missed communications between
buyer's realtor and seller's realtor, resulting in some ten days of delay,
and the apparent necessity of a home re-inspection for a home warranty,
seller requests (1) an extension to Monday, August 25 to complete home
re-inspection; (2) an extension to Wednesday, August 27 for buyer to provide
objections to home inspection report; (3) a change of the closing date to
Friday, September 5 [currently its Friday, August 29].
///


What would be your response to your realtor, if you were the seller?

If there is a real estate google group that might be more appropriate for
this question, please share the group's name.

-------------

I didn't take the time to follow the chronology well, but I would certainly
NOT sign anything with wrong dates. I like your approach to try to keep the
sale in motion by setting a new set of dates. If I were the seller, I would
tell the realtor contracts have meanings, and if there are errors made in
the contract it could come back to bite you. You don't want to figure out
all the scenarios, you just want to set new dates and move forward, thereby
solving the realtor's problem. Otherwise the sale might fall through and he
would have a malpractice action to deal with. This is, after all, really a
realtor's problem. You are just trying to solve it for him in a manner that
does no further harm to buyer or seller.

On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 6:47:16 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 11:39:17 AM UTC-6, NotMe wrote:

Were I you I'd look to both realtors' Errors and Omission insurance carriers

snip for brevity



I wonder if insurance exists to cover what seems to me to be at a minimum, pretty negligent conduct on the realtors' part.


The first question with any such claim would be what are the damages you can prove and is it material enough to pursue. If the deal still closes within a couple weeks of the closing data, I don't think it's likely you have something
worth the trouble.




Update: I thought a lot about how to proceed. If I let these two realtors set schedules unrelated to the contract; repeatedly not follow instructions to communicate xyz to the buyer's realtor; and more; I figured I would be miserable for some months. My realtor worked on me most of Monday, talking past me like the deal was going forward; saying I had to agree to pay for the home inspection and warranty; and what sounded to me like double talk. I said I believed per the contract's terms that either the contract was terminated due to no resolution of objections by Aug 15;

I'd be careful there. The seller did respond with objections to you, but
they were delayed due to one or both realtors dropping the ball. But the
only material thing I see
in what they wanted was that they wanted a list of the repairs you had made
pursuant to the previous inspection report. You had sent that list of
repairs to your realtor and it apparently made it to the buyer before the
Aug 15 deadline. So, as I see it, the buyer could say they were OK with
your response to the objections, they want to proceed with the contract,
and you have no out. In essence, the buyer could say they are satisfied with
the previous inspection, your fixes, and they want to proceed and I don't
think you have an out. Nor do I think you want one, you want it sold right?





or no "specific objections" (language the contract uses on this point, like many here seem to know) had been presented nor inspection scheduled by Aug 13 and 11th, so I did not have to do any inspections or address any objections.

As I said above, you seem to have met what they brought up in the "objections",
which was just a list of repairs you made pursuant to the previous inspection.
You actually sent it before, without even knowing what they were going to ask
for, but you did send it, they have it. I'd say that closes the "objections
window". But..... this isn't the normal deal, because of that home warranty,
you now have another inspection and unless someone has stated otherwise, it
sounds like you are still open to another possible round of "objections"




I said I would not continue unless the two realtors agreed to pay for the home inspection and warranty. My realtor finally consented and is preparing paperwork now. I am ready for the worst and decided it would be better than not defending myself from two realtors who are not earning their commission, and likely would continue with their unsupportable-by-contract approach if gone unchecked, in my opinion. I think no winning happens in situations like this. But good enough. The buyer has said she is going forward and wants to close this deal.



Good for you. And good for you for getting the broker to eat some of the cost.
I hope you also told your realtor that you want to be copied
on every email sent/recvd, regular mail, informed of every material phone call from here on out, etc.





Interestingly starting today, and with the understanding that paperwork has to be signed before any inspection takes place,

I'd make sure what that new paperwork says, particularly with regard to
new "objections". Best thing would be for it to say that the buyer accepts
the original inspection report and the list of repairs you made. But you're
probably not going to get that. It's probably going to set up dates for the
whole inspection, objection thing again.


my realtor has been trying to get an appointment for an inspection.

That's interesting and another sign of amature hour. It's actually in
your favor for your broker to be handling that, but WTF is the buyer
and their broker doing? That is *their responsibility*, not yours.
When I'v bought houses, I picked the inspector, hired them, etc. Last
thing I want is the seller, or the seller's realtor to be hiring the
inspector. For them, Sgt Schultz would be a good deal. And as seller,
I wouldn't want my broker screwing around with even the scheduling.
The buyer already missed dates, next they could have the excuse that
*your broker* didn't schedule the inspetcion, etc. It's the seller's
option, they own it.

The earliest one available with the inspection company selected is Sep 2, past the scheduled closing. We're trying to squeeze into any slot that opens because of a cancellation. This requires daily checking by my realtor. Objections, resolution and cure require several more days.

I'd put a week in there, if it was my house. Maybe you don't need it,
because you've been through the inspection and the house is OK. But in
general, what seller wants some buyer to hand them a list of beefs and only
have 2 days to figure out WTF to do? It seems a good idea to at least have
the time to call a couple contractors for quotes, opinions, etc.


I am trying to be as accommodating as possible. So now, and it seems to me because the buyer's realtor made no effort to schedule an inspection per the contract deadline, closing is indeterminate. I remain ready for the deal to fall through, though I hope it does not.



Closing is indeterminate in the vast majority of deals due to one factor or
another.





Also interestingly: My realtor called the other realtor twice today. No return call, here in the throes of what looks like a closing that will have to be changed and with much that has to be done still. My realtor said he is irritated once again with the other realtor regarding communications and wanted me to know. Indeed.


Your realtor should have the realty owner call the owner of the other
brokerage to explain how this is being mishandled. Your broker telling
you isn't going to solve anything.




Every post to this thread was contemplated and helped me figure and feel comfortable with a plan of action to follow. Thank you gfre..aol.com, dpb, trader_4, Ralph Mowery, Oren, Robert Macy, Lee B, Tony Hwang, and NotMe for your time. I hope to pass on my good luck in having your advice to someone else in the future.

It sounds like you're back on track. Let us know how it works out.

"Pico Rico" wrote in message
...



What would be your response to your realtor, if you were the seller?


From what I am getting out of this, it was your agent that messed things up.

To recover it looks like you need to do things to make the buyer happy.

If this falls through, I would change realitors. I would also ask, but not
expect him to pay for the second inspection if it was done.

On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 16:43:12 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:

I didn't take the time to follow the chronology well, but I would certainly
NOT sign anything with wrong dates. I like your approach to try to keep the
sale in motion by setting a new set of dates. If I were the seller, I would
tell the realtor contracts have meanings, and if there are errors made in
the contract it could come back to bite you. You don't want to figure out
all the scenarios, you just want to set new dates and move forward, thereby
solving the realtor's problem. Otherwise the sale might fall through and he
would have a malpractice action to deal with. This is, after all, really a
realtor's problem. You are just trying to solve it for him in a manner that
does no further harm to buyer or seller.

I mentioned earlier about my present home in Nevada. House in husband
& wife's name. Husband was in a mental facility in Utah. A judge in
California had to sign an order to allow the sale to proceed. We were
a ten minute from the closing at the Title company. My Agent called
us crying, apologetic, etc. I told her not to worry, I'd wait for the
Judge's Order to be signed. It was expedited and we closed about five
days later. It wasn't the Agent's fault but the fault of the Title
company for not catching it earlier.

Oh. She was the Seller's Agent and the Buyer's Agent. I waived this
using a Rider (?) She never had to split the commission with another
agent. I just waited for the Order to be signed in California. I love
this house and got it $25,000 below the asking price. A firm contract
date - things can change?