Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
http://www.informationisbeautiful.ne...l-supplements/

On Nov 10, 9:53*am, Bill who putters wrote:
*Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures. *
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
*Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? *Gas stove with all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
*Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad. *
May be cleaner and use less water too.

--
Bill *S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade gardenhttp://www.informationisbeautiful.net/play/snake-oil-supplements/

Welcome to the machine. When ever I take out a bad circuit board I
like to take it under the sun and scrutinize it with my jewelers
lenses. I have seen everything from what looked like snot to pubic
hair. Thank you Chinese quality control. You should get a new handy-
person. I always tell my clients to stick to what they got as long as
possible because the new ones stink.

On 11/10/2010 4:27 PM, Molly Brown wrote:
On Nov 10, 9:53 am, Bill who wrote:
Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade gardenhttp://www.informationisbeautiful.net/play/snake-oil-supplements/

Welcome to the machine. When ever I take out a bad circuit board I
like to take it under the sun and scrutinize it with my jewelers
lenses. I have seen everything from what looked like snot to pubic
hair. Thank you Chinese quality control. You should get a new handy-
person. I always tell my clients to stick to what they got as long as
possible because the new ones stink.

Most of the problems I find with circuit boards are due to cold solder
joints.

TDD

"Bill who putters" wrote in message
...
Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
http://www.informationisbeautiful.ne...l-supplements/

A couple of years ago I was looking for a gas range with no electronics. We
bought a Bertazzoni as it had none. Amana washers I think are still
mechanical. I've not seen a dishwasher without electronics though.

On Nov 10, 9:43*pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
"Bill who putters" wrote in ...

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? *Gas stove with all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

--
Bill *S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
http://www.informationisbeautiful.ne...l-supplements/

A couple of years ago I was looking for a gas range with no electronics. We
bought a Bertazzoni *as it had none. *Amana washers I think are still
mechanical. *I've not seen a dishwasher without electronics though.

I refuse to buy stuff with electronic controls for a mechanical
function. Panasonic microwave only exception to that rule.

"Bill who putters" wrote in message
Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with
all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.


Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use electricity to
power them. When I can't find something with an old fashioned on/off
switch (uses NO electricity when off), I add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them lately.
They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock when snapped
together. (They want to make darn sure you always use a little
electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an external switch so I
can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make electric
company power generation equipment. I would imagine that if millions
of people fill their homes with gadgets which always use electricity,
then the electric companies would need to add on more power generating
capacity/equipment? $$

On Nov 11, 8:37*am, "Bill" wrote:
"Bill who putters" *wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? *Gas stove with
all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use electricity to
power them. When I can't find something with an old fashioned on/off
switch (uses NO electricity when off), I add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them lately.
They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock when snapped
together. (They want to make darn sure you always use a little
electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an external switch so I
can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make electric
company power generation equipment. I would imagine that if millions
of people fill their homes with gadgets which always use electricity,
then the electric companies would need to add on more power generating
capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

"hr(bob) " wrote in message
...
On Nov 11, 8:37 am, "Bill" wrote:
"Bill who putters" wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with
all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use electricity to
power them. When I can't find something with an old fashioned on/off
switch (uses NO electricity when off), I add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them lately.
They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock when snapped
together. (They want to make darn sure you always use a little
electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an external switch so I
can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make electric
company power generation equipment. I would imagine that if millions
of people fill their homes with gadgets which always use electricity,
then the electric companies would need to add on more power generating
capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

But is he wrong??

In article ,
"Worn Out Retread" wrote:

"hr(bob) " wrote in message
...
On Nov 11, 8:37 am, "Bill" wrote:
"Bill who putters" wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic failures.
Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries 300.)
Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas stove with
all
the heat is just waiting to fail.
Upside washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use electricity to
power them. When I can't find something with an old fashioned on/off
switch (uses NO electricity when off), I add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them lately.
They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock when snapped
together. (They want to make darn sure you always use a little
electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an external switch so I
can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make electric
company power generation equipment. I would imagine that if millions
of people fill their homes with gadgets which always use electricity,
then the electric companies would need to add on more power generating
capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

But is he wrong??

The amount of quiescent power consumed by electronic appliances is
negligible.

On Thu, 11 Nov 2010 06:37:11 -0800, Bill wrote:
Some of the companies which make these products also make electric
company power generation equipment. I would imagine that if millions of
people fill their homes with gadgets which always use electricity, then
the electric companies would need to add on more power generating
capacity/equipment? $$

I think you can buy a tin-foil hat which runs just from cranial heat.
;-)

On 11/12/2010 8:13 AM Smitty Two spake thus:

In article , "Worn Out Retread"
wrote:

"hr(bob) " wrote in message
...

On Nov 11, 8:37 am, "Bill" wrote:

"Bill who putters" wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic
failures. Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries
300.) Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas
stove with all the heat is just waiting to fail. Upside
washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use
electricity to power them. When I can't find something with an
old fashioned on/off switch (uses NO electricity when off), I
add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them
lately. They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock
when snapped together. (They want to make darn sure you always
use a little electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an
external switch so I can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make
electric company power generation equipment. I would imagine
that if millions of people fill their homes with gadgets which
always use electricity, then the electric companies would need
to add on more power generating capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

But is he wrong??

The amount of quiescent power consumed by electronic appliances is
negligible.

Wrong.

According to the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, "vampire power"
(technically known as "standby power") accounts for 5-10% of usage in
the U.S.:

How much power is used for standby in the US?...Worldwide?

Nobody knows for sure, but it's typically 5-10% of residential
electricity use in most developed countries and a rising fraction in the
developing countries (especially in the cities). Standby power in
commercial buildings is smaller but still significant. Altogether,
standby power use is roughly responsible for 1% of global CO2 emissions.

(http://standby.lbl.gov/faq.html)

Regarding the previous poster's assertions regarding utility company
conspiracy, he was right about standby power being a significant
fraction of usage, but his claims of collusion between utilities and
makers of electric products seems a bit outlandish.

Even the greedy lying *******s at PG&E have been airing a series of TV
commercials urging utility customers to unplug their "vampire power"
devices to reduce their bills. It's easy to see why they're doing this:
one of the biggest problems we have here in California with our utility
companies, PG&E in particular, is that they're so bottom-line obsessed
that they're allowed their infrastructure to rot to pieces. In addition
to the recent catastrophic San Bruno gas line explosion, there are
numerous incidents of transformer vaults exploding under streets in
downtown San Francisco, as well as lots of other equipment and line
failures. The last thing they want to do is invest in expensive new
capital equipment; they just want to gouge us with their old
falling-apart stuff and keep patching it. And even if demand for
electricity were somehow to flag, which is unlikely, they could always
do what they always do, which is to get their compliant lapdog, the
Public Utilities Commission, to grant them a rate increase.


--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

In article ,
David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 11/12/2010 8:13 AM Smitty Two spake thus:

In article , "Worn Out Retread"
wrote:

"hr(bob) " wrote in message
...

On Nov 11, 8:37 am, "Bill" wrote:

"Bill who putters" wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic
failures. Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries
300.) Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas
stove with all the heat is just waiting to fail. Upside
washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use
electricity to power them. When I can't find something with an
old fashioned on/off switch (uses NO electricity when off), I
add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them
lately. They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock
when snapped together. (They want to make darn sure you always
use a little electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an
external switch so I can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make
electric company power generation equipment. I would imagine
that if millions of people fill their homes with gadgets which
always use electricity, then the electric companies would need
to add on more power generating capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

But is he wrong??

The amount of quiescent power consumed by electronic appliances is
negligible.

Wrong.



Sez you. Then you quoted a source saying "nobody knows for sure." And,
as far as I'm concerned, 5% *is* negligible, since it represents less
than a month-to-month deviation, anyway. 10%, absolutely, positively is
pure fiction. But g'head, run around with yer goofy kill-o-watt and
fret. Meanwhile, I'll turn off one light in one room for a couple of
hours once a week and save more than you will by unplugging every gadget
every time you're not using it.

On 11/12/2010 7:40 PM Smitty Two spake thus:

In article ,
David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 11/12/2010 8:13 AM Smitty Two spake thus:

In article , "Worn Out Retread"
wrote:

"hr(bob) " wrote in message
...

On Nov 11, 8:37 am, "Bill" wrote:

"Bill who putters" wrote in message

Seems lately my appliance failures are due to electronic
failures. Dish washer now gone bad twice (Maytag quietseries
300.) Anyone know of appliances with mechanical control? Gas
stove with all the heat is just waiting to fail. Upside
washing dishes by hand not so bad not quick but not too bad.
May be cleaner and use less water too.

Also electronic controls *always* are on and always use
electricity to power them. When I can't find something with an
old fashioned on/off switch (uses NO electricity when off), I
add a switch.

Then some things can't be taken apart without destroying them
lately. They make the plastic parts so they permanently lock
when snapped together. (They want to make darn sure you always
use a little electricity!) In those cases, I plug it into an
external switch so I can totally turn it off when not in use.

Some of the companies which make these products also make
electric company power generation equipment. I would imagine
that if millions of people fill their homes with gadgets which
always use electricity, then the electric companies would need
to add on more power generating capacity/equipment? $$

Boy, are you cynicalG.

But is he wrong??

The amount of quiescent power consumed by electronic appliances is
negligible.

Wrong.

Sez you.

Nope, sez Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory. I assume they know a
little bit more about the subject than I do.

Then you quoted a source saying "nobody knows for sure." And, as far
as I'm concerned, 5% *is* negligible, since it represents less than a
month-to-month deviation, anyway. 10%, absolutely, positively is pure
fiction.

I see; you're a better authority than LBNL. Just wanted to make sure I
got that right.

By the way, the link you snipped was http://standby.lbl.gov/faq.html.


--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)