My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

On Aug 22, 9:06*pm, ransley wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

When this happened to my 1991 Lennox, it was the timing board. That
particular board delayed turning the thing on for 5 minutes once it
was told to by the thermostat. This was to make sure the old mercury
therms had time to settle and prevented on-off-on-off. The tech said
it was pretty obvious that the board burned out. One possibility?

On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

On Aug 22, 10:06*pm, ransley wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.


Is there some specific reason you want to keep fiddling with a unit
that is 24 years old and now using a substitute refrigerant for what
it was originally charged with ?

After fixing a leak the unit stops working completely ?

I would say you got your 24 years out of the unit and its time to
update your installation... Not only will a newer unit of the same
size use less energy, they also have better control systems for
them now...

~~ Evan

On Aug 23, 5:04*am, Evan wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:06*pm, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

Is there some specific reason you want to keep fiddling with a unit
that is 24 years old and now using a substitute refrigerant for what
it was originally charged with ?

After fixing a leak the unit stops working completely ?

I would say you got your 24 years out of the unit and its time to
update your installation... *Not only will a newer unit of the same
size use less energy, they also have better control systems for
them now...

~~ Evan

My mistake its a 96, only the second time it broke, its 13 seer and I
could not get a new one this year, so its fix it or get a window unit
for the room I sleep in.

On Aug 22, 10:01*pm, The Daring Dufas the-daring-
wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.

On Aug 22, 10:01*pm, The Daring Dufas the-daring-
wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

Wouldnt the fan run even with a bad capacitor

On Aug 22, 9:33*pm, Bryan Scholtes wrote:
On Aug 22, 9:06*pm, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

When this happened to my 1991 Lennox, it was the timing board. That
particular board delayed turning the thing on for 5 minutes once it
was told to by the thermostat. This was to make sure the old mercury
therms had time to settle and prevented on-off-on-off. The tech said
it was pretty obvious that the board burned out. One possibility?

That sounds logical

On Aug 23, 6:40*am, ransley wrote:
On Aug 23, 5:04*am, Evan wrote:





On Aug 22, 10:06*pm, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

Is there some specific reason you want to keep fiddling with a unit
that is 24 years old and now using a substitute refrigerant for what
it was originally charged with ?

After fixing a leak the unit stops working completely ?

I would say you got your 24 years out of the unit and its time to
update your installation... *Not only will a newer unit of the same
size use less energy, they also have better control systems for
them now...

~~ Evan

My mistake its a 96, only the second time it broke, its 13 seer and I
could not get a new one this year, so its fix it or get a window unit
for the room I sleep in.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'd start by seeing if you have 240v coming into the outside condenser
unit. It comes into a relay that gets closed to turn on the
compressor. If so, then see if the relay closes and you get 240v on
the other side going to the compressor when the system is turned on

ransley wrote:
If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.

It's the only (usually) relay-looking-gizmo in the outside unit. It supplies
power to both the fan (120) and the compressor (240). If both are not
working, the obvious culprit is the only thing they have in common - the
relay.

That said, it could be the relay itself is broken (fried, etc.) or the
voltage that activates the relay (24V) is missing.

If the relay, they're not TOO expensive and, if your hand fits a
screwdriver, you should be able to replace it. Label the wires - taking
several pictures is better - and take the old one to Graingers. Say "gimme
one like this".

Remember to wear eye and ear protection when working around electricity and,
um, er... one other saftey precaution, but I forget...

On Aug 23, 6:47*am, ransley wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01*pm, The Daring Dufas the-daring-





wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

Yeah, we can't tell him the other safety precaution. It's too
complicated.

I think he will find that the condensor fan is also 220 VAC. And has a
run cap.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub"
wrote in message
...


It's the only (usually) relay-looking-gizmo in the outside unit. It
supplies
power to both the fan (120) and the compressor (240). If both are not
working, the obvious culprit is the only thing they have in common -
the
relay.

That said, it could be the relay itself is broken (fried, etc.) or the
voltage that activates the relay (24V) is missing.

If the relay, they're not TOO expensive and, if your hand fits a
screwdriver, you should be able to replace it. Label the wires -
taking
several pictures is better - and take the old one to Graingers. Say
"gimme
one like this".

Remember to wear eye and ear protection when working around
electricity and,
um, er... one other saftey precaution, but I forget...

As others have suggested. You can check to see if the outdoor unit has
220 VAC. You can also check to see if the contactor is getting the 24
VAC signal, and if the contactor is making connection.

The fan and compressor have different capacitors. Possible but not
likely that they are both bad at the same time.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"ransley" wrote in message
...
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

On Aug 23, 7:50*am, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 23, 6:47*am, ransley wrote:





On Aug 22, 10:01*pm, The Daring Dufas the-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". *The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. *It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). *The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. *The inside half sends the
24vac. *It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. *The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. *If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. *Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. *Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. *Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I can hear the wires "Rattle" inside the conduit and the breaker on
the main panel makes a zip noise when it powers on, I bet it should
have been a larger gauge but they had no more room in the conduit. I
mentioned it to them on install and they said 'its ok", but I know it
would have been rejected by an inspector. I didnt get a permit or an
inspection for the install, In 96 I didnt think permits-inspectors
were a help. Thats why I wonder is I have any power since nothing
works, but im no electrician.

On Aug 23, 7:06*am, wrote:
On Aug 23, 6:40*am, ransley wrote:





On Aug 23, 5:04*am, Evan wrote:

On Aug 22, 10:06*pm, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

Is there some specific reason you want to keep fiddling with a unit
that is 24 years old and now using a substitute refrigerant for what
it was originally charged with ?

After fixing a leak the unit stops working completely ?

I would say you got your 24 years out of the unit and its time to
update your installation... *Not only will a newer unit of the same
size use less energy, they also have better control systems for
them now...

~~ Evan

My mistake its a 96, only the second time it broke, its 13 seer and I
could not get a new one this year, so its fix it or get a window unit
for the room I sleep in.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'd start by seeing if you have 240v coming into the outside condenser
unit. * It comes into a relay that gets closed to turn on the
compressor. *If so, then see if the relay closes and you get 240v on
the other side going to the compressor when the system is turned on- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes AC power is where I will start at, I cant even find my meter
today, but its only 72 out.

It sounds like you're not very experienced with electricity. Do you
have a friend, or relative you can call, who has some electrical
experience? Some things are best learned from an experienced teacher,
rather than on the internet. This is one such.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"ransley"
wrote in message
...

Yes AC power is where I will start at, I cant even find my meter
today, but its only 72 out.

On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 19:06:51 -0700 (PDT), ransley
wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

My HVAC took a time-out a few weeks back. Nothing would work at all.
The fan would not even run, like yours.

I presume the fan blower gets its 110V power from a light switch box
in the attic. The switch had failed and no power was getting to the
blower fan.

YMMV

On Aug 23, 1:35*pm, Oren wrote:
On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 19:06:51 -0700 (PDT), ransley

wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

My HVAC took a time-out a few weeks back. *Nothing would work at all.
The fan would not even run, like yours.

I presume the fan blower gets its 110V power from a light switch box
in the attic. *The switch had failed and no power was getting to the
blower fan.

YMMV

If the inside unit is not working then it's likely that the 24 vac
transformer is not getting power and that will explain why the outside
unit doesn;t work. The op was not very clear about the inside half
but I got the impression it was ok. I could easily be mistaken.

On Aug 23, 9:49*am, ransley wrote:
On Aug 23, 7:50*am, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 23, 6:47*am, ransley wrote:

On Aug 22, 10:01*pm, The Daring Dufas the-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". *The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. *It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). *The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. *The inside half sends the
24vac. *It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. *The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. *If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. *Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. *Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. *Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I can hear the wires "Rattle" inside the conduit and the breaker on
the main panel makes a zip noise when it powers on, I bet it should
have been a larger gauge but they had no more room in the conduit. I
mentioned it to them on install and they said 'its ok", but I know it
would have been rejected by an inspector. I didnt get a permit or an
inspection for the install, In 96 I didnt think permits-inspectors
were a help. Thats why I wonder is I have any power since nothing
works, but im no electrician.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Wires will never move due to being energized in this application.
They will get hot if they are too small but they won't "rattle". You
are hearing something else.

"ransley" wrote in message
...
On Aug 23, 12:55 pm, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 23, 1:35 pm, Oren wrote:


- Show quoted text -

The air handler does work, and when I push in the relay on the outside
compressor unit it runs, so I guess next I check for 24v to the
compressor relay?

The only thing controlling the 24 volt system before it gets to the outside
unit is thermostat. Are you sure it is good? Find the two wire cable and
test for 24V there first.

Many of the 1995 and later models have a low pressure switch wired into the
24 volt system inside the condenser unit. This part might also be the
problem. Just mentioning these two things BEFORE you run out and buy a
non-returnable contactor.

Follow the 24V wires and test for current after each part. Entry point, low
pressure switch and at the contactor. Actually working that in reverse is
the smarter way to do it. I just wanted you to see the path.


--
Colbyt
Please come visit http://www.househomerepair.com

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Yeah, we can't tell him the other safety precaution. It's too
complicated.

I think he will find that the condensor fan is also 220 VAC. And has a
run cap.

Ah, right. I forgot.

ransley wrote:

It's the only (usually) relay-looking-gizmo in the outside unit. It
supplies power to both the fan (120) and the compressor (240). If
both are not working, the obvious culprit is the only thing they
have in common - the relay.

That said, it could be the relay itself is broken (fried, etc.) or
the voltage that activates the relay (24V) is missing.

If the relay, they're not TOO expensive and, if your hand fits a
screwdriver, you should be able to replace it. Label the wires -
taking several pictures is better - and take the old one to
Graingers. Say "gimme one like this".

Remember to wear eye and ear protection when working around
electricity and, um, er... one other saftey precaution, but I
forget...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

When I push in the relay it runs, so now I will go back out and see if
its getting 24v.

Yep. It's either not getting the 24v OR unable to use the voltage cause the
relay itself has given up the ghost, taken a dirt nap, singing in the
heavenly choir, or passed this way only once to brighten our lives, provide
endearing memories, and let us chill.

On Mon, 23 Aug 2010 07:33:49 -0500, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Remember to wear eye and ear protection when working around electricity and,
um, er... one other saftey precaution, but I forget...


I know... keep one hand in your pocket!

What do I win?

On 8/23/2010 12:34 PM, ransley wrote:
On Aug 23, 12:55 pm, wrote:
On Aug 23, 1:35 pm, wrote:





On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 19:06:51 -0700 (PDT), ransley

wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

My HVAC took a time-out a few weeks back. Nothing would work at all.
The fan would not even run, like yours.

I presume the fan blower gets its 110V power from a light switch box
in the attic. The switch had failed and no power was getting to the
blower fan.

YMMV

If the inside unit is not working then it's likely that the 24 vac
transformer is not getting power and that will explain why the outside
unit doesn;t work. The op was not very clear about the inside half
but I got the impression it was ok. I could easily be mistaken.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The air handler does work, and when I push in the relay on the outside
compressor unit it runs, so I guess next I check for 24v to the
compressor relay?

Squirrels and other critters have been known to enjoy a meal of insulation.

Happens to the best of us. We all forget something or

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Yeah, we can't tell him the other safety precaution. It's too
complicated.

I think he will find that the condensor fan is also 220 VAC. And has
a
run cap.

Ah, right. I forgot.

On 8/23/2010 1:32 PM, ransley wrote:
On Aug 23, 7:33 am, wrote:
ransley wrote:
If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.

It's the only (usually) relay-looking-gizmo in the outside unit. It supplies
power to both the fan (120) and the compressor (240). If both are not
working, the obvious culprit is the only thing they have in common - the
relay.

That said, it could be the relay itself is broken (fried, etc.) or the
voltage that activates the relay (24V) is missing.

If the relay, they're not TOO expensive and, if your hand fits a
screwdriver, you should be able to replace it. Label the wires - taking
several pictures is better - and take the old one to Graingers. Say "gimme
one like this".

Remember to wear eye and ear protection when working around electricity and,
um, er... one other saftey precaution, but I forget...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

When I push in the relay it runs, so now I will go back out and see if
its getting 24v.

The low voltage wires going to the contactor coil are usually yellow in
color, sometimes one is blue which is the common.

TDD

On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 23, 6:47 am, wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-





wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD

On 8/23/2010 5:48 AM, ransley wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-
wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

Wouldnt the fan run even with a bad capacitor

It may turn slowly while making an unhappy whirring sound or just
hum angrily. HVAC equipment can get emotional at times. 8-)

TDD

On 8/23/2010 8:00 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
As others have suggested. You can check to see if the outdoor unit has
220 VAC. You can also check to see if the contactor is getting the 24
VAC signal, and if the contactor is making connection.

The fan and compressor have different capacitors. Possible but not
likely that they are both bad at the same time.


If it's a combo capacitor with 3 terminals, the top will pop up
when it fails, killing both the fan and compressor.

TDD

On 8/23/2010 1:34 PM, ransley wrote:
On Aug 23, 12:55 pm, wrote:
On Aug 23, 1:35 pm, wrote:





On Sun, 22 Aug 2010 19:06:51 -0700 (PDT), ransley

wrote:
My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

My HVAC took a time-out a few weeks back. Nothing would work at all.
The fan would not even run, like yours.

I presume the fan blower gets its 110V power from a light switch box
in the attic. The switch had failed and no power was getting to the
blower fan.

YMMV

If the inside unit is not working then it's likely that the 24 vac
transformer is not getting power and that will explain why the outside
unit doesn;t work. The op was not very clear about the inside half
but I got the impression it was ok. I could easily be mistaken.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

The air handler does work, and when I push in the relay on the outside
compressor unit it runs, so I guess next I check for 24v to the
compressor relay?

Did you happen to run a weed eater around the condensing unit? I see
that activity cut the control wire to the condenser quite often.

TDD

On 8/23/2010 2:18 PM, Colbyt wrote:
wrote in message
...
On Aug 23, 12:55 pm, wrote:
On Aug 23, 1:35 pm, wrote:


- Show quoted text -

The air handler does work, and when I push in the relay on the outside
compressor unit it runs, so I guess next I check for 24v to the
compressor relay?

The only thing controlling the 24 volt system before it gets to the outside
unit is thermostat. Are you sure it is good? Find the two wire cable and
test for 24V there first.

Many of the 1995 and later models have a low pressure switch wired into the
24 volt system inside the condenser unit. This part might also be the
problem. Just mentioning these two things BEFORE you run out and buy a
non-returnable contactor.

Follow the 24V wires and test for current after each part. Entry point, low
pressure switch and at the contactor. Actually working that in reverse is
the smarter way to do it. I just wanted you to see the path.



He did mention that it's a 13 SEER unit and it may very well have a low
pressure cutout switch. The builder grade units, even the newest of them
don't have a factory installed low or high pressure cutout.

TDD

On Aug 23, 9:36*pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 23, 6:47 am, *wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-

*wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling..
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". *The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. *It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). *The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. *The inside half sends the
24vac. *It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. *The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. *If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. *Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. *Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. *Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

On 8/24/2010 7:18 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 23, 9:36 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 23, 6:47 am, wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

I only have four decades experience in the field and I see it all
the time. In an industrial environment I've come across it a lot
where there are a numerous high current starting loads for motors.
The wire can actually change length under heavy load. I've seen
insulation rubbed of a wire because of this movement. The OP can
hear the #10 wires jump inside the conduit when his AC unit stars.
When you get your PhD in know-it-allogy, come back and call me names.

TDD

I'm reminded of a joke, I'm about to make up. Bill Gates, a pollack,
an engineer, and a meterologist are sitting in a room. The one of them
asks if it's raining. Bill Gates whips out a PDA, connects to the
internet, and looks at a radar map. Says it's not raining. The
engineer takes a large piece of plastic. Builds a frame, balance
point, and connects the other end of the support to a reverse reading
mass scale. He extends this out the window. The liner acceleration of
gravitational impulses of descending precipitation are negligible. So,
he concludes it is not raining. The meterologist calls the NOAA phone
number, listens through the recorded message. And concludes it is not
raining. The pollack opens the door, steps outside, and comes back in
wet. He brings back in the engineer's device (which was under the
eaves). Reports that it is raining. The other three gang up and pound
the stuffing out of the pollack, while calling him a liar.

Yeah, I'm sure the wires wiggle. Heck, it only makes sense.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
On 8/24/2010 7:18 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:


You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

I only have four decades experience in the field and I see it all
the time. In an industrial environment I've come across it a lot
where there are a numerous high current starting loads for motors.
The wire can actually change length under heavy load. I've seen
insulation rubbed of a wire because of this movement. The OP can
hear the #10 wires jump inside the conduit when his AC unit stars.
When you get your PhD in know-it-allogy, come back and call me names.

TDD

The stormin MORON.. had this to say.

I'm reminded of a joke, I'm about to
make up. Bill Gates, a pollack, an
engineer, and a meterologist are sitting
in a room.

Did you mean? Polock? Which is a racist word for our fine Polish
countrymen...

You.....! My friend, are a pure bred racist

How do you get off calling yourself a MORMON? HUH? Do all Mormons use
racial epitaphs, like you?

On 8/24/2010 12:07 PM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 24, 2:46 pm, wrote:
On 8/24/2010 10:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 24, 12:31 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-
wrote:
On 8/24/2010 7:18 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:

On Aug 23, 9:36 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:

On Aug 23, 6:47 am, wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

I only have four decades experience in the field and I see it all
the time. In an industrial environment I've come across it a lot
where there are a numerous high current starting loads for motors.
The wire can actually change length under heavy load. I've seen
insulation rubbed of a wire because of this movement. The OP can
hear the #10 wires jump inside the conduit when his AC unit stars.
When you get your PhD in know-it-allogy, come back and call me names.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Go ahead give us the science behind it then?

High current -- wires heat -- heat causes expansion -- expansion
causes movement (not exactly "rattle" perhaps, but insulation sliding
against insulation could probably approximate a squeak)

Am I missing something? What's so hard to understand?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

A piece of 10 guage wire is not going to heat up fast enough to move
at a rate you could observe with the naked eye at these currents.

First, you haven't quantified the surge current.

Second, he didn't see it, he heard it. Things that appear still can
make noise -- consider a piezo speaker.

Third, the other poster has offered an alternative explanation.

On Tue, 24 Aug 2010 15:11:56 -0600, (Paddy
Waggin) wrote:

The stormin MORON.. had this to say.

I'm reminded of a joke, I'm about to
make up. Bill Gates, a pollack, an
engineer, and a meterologist are sitting
in a room.

Did you mean? Polock? Which is a racist word for our fine Polish
countrymen...


No he was talking about a fish -- the pollock fish.

You.....! My friend, are a pure bred racist

How's that webtv working out for you

How do you get off calling yourself a MORMON? HUH? Do all Mormons use
racial epitaphs, like you?

Did you join a perfect church? If so, it's not perfect anymore.

I've met some hot Mormon females. It was Shock -n-Awe.

On 8/24/2010 1:21 PM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 24, 1:48 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 8/24/2010 11:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 24, 12:31 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-
wrote:
On 8/24/2010 7:18 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:

On Aug 23, 9:36 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:

On Aug 23, 6:47 am, wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

I only have four decades experience in the field and I see it all
the time. In an industrial environment I've come across it a lot
where there are a numerous high current starting loads for motors.
The wire can actually change length under heavy load. I've seen
insulation rubbed of a wire because of this movement. The OP can
hear the #10 wires jump inside the conduit when his AC unit stars.
When you get your PhD in know-it-allogy, come back and call me names.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Go ahead give us the science behind it then?

You don't know how to use a library? I don't need to give you the
science, I have directly observed the phenomenon. Direct observation
makes up most science. I did find a document online that has some
equations if that will help you understand but if you know anything
about electricity, you can visualize that a length of wire has a
magnetic field when energized. Take a look at page 3 of the PDF:

http://www.pppl.gov/eshis/ESHD_MANUAL/safety/es7.0.pdf

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know something about electricity. I know it takes a great very deal
of current to make a strong magnetic field in a straight wire.
Possible in a commercial setting with high pulsed current, yes. In a
home ac compressor, I doubt it. Go ahead, hold your ferrous
screwdriver blade near the 10 guage wire with the compressor running.
Feel any pull?

You obviously didn't understand, the wire movement happens when the
compressor starts, not continuously. The compressor starts, you can
hear the breaker buzz and the wires in a conduit jump, rattle for
a split second, not during normal run operation. GEEZ!

TDD

On 8/24/2010 1:46 PM, cjt wrote:
On 8/24/2010 10:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:
On Aug 24, 12:31 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-
wrote:
On 8/24/2010 7:18 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:





On Aug 23, 9:36 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 8/23/2010 7:50 AM, jamesgangnc wrote:

On Aug 23, 6:47 am, wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:01 pm, The Daring Dufasthe-daring-

wrote:
On 8/22/2010 9:06 PM, ransley wrote:

My 1986 Lennox AC compressor unit just stopped running, the fan
isnt
running and no noise comes from the unit, I reset the breakers
and the
thermostat is the old round analog Honywell, its calling for
cooling.
Ive never worked on this but is there anything I can test with a V
meter before I call a pro. 3 weeks ago I lost all freon from a big
leak and had it fixed, all has been fine until today. I would
think at
least the fan would run.

If there was a thunderstorm, a voltage spike could have blown the
run capacitor. If your air handler fan doesn't run, it's a power
problem there because the 24 volt control voltage comes from the
furnace/air handler. Without the 24 volts AC, the condensing unit
where the compressor is will not come on. If you can push in the
insulated contact carrier on the condenser contactor and the fan
and compressor run, you'll know it's not getting control voltage
from the furnace/air handler.

TDD

What does the condensor contactor look like where do I find it, I
wonder if the tech left a wire loose since it seems like it just has
no power. I do know I dont think it was installed with proper gauge
wiring , Its about a 60 ft run of 2 pieces of 10 ga and it
rattles in
the pipe and at the breaker on turn on. All these years of rattling
could have loosened something.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've never heard of a wire or a breaker "rattling". The freon lines
on some units can be noisy and that might be what you hear.

You can check for 240vac at the unit. It should be easy to trace to
the contactor (a big relay). The contactor is a 24vac activated relay
that supplies 240vac to the entire unit. The inside half sends the
24vac. It is possible to manually activate a contactor by pushing it
down carefully with something. The compressor and it's fan are both
activated by the contactor. If there are any additional controls such
as the startup delay board they will most likely be on the 24vac
side. Both the compressor and the fan will use run capacitors but
they may be combined in a single can. Ther may also be a start
capacitor on the compressor. Since nothing is running I doubt it's a
capacitor.

It's not unusual for wires to move or rattle inside a conduit even if
the wire is properly sized for the load. The starting current of an AC
compressor can easily be several time the run current of the whole
unit.
Wires can and will dance under the right set of circumstances.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You're an idiot. Wires do not move in this example.

I only have four decades experience in the field and I see it all
the time. In an industrial environment I've come across it a lot
where there are a numerous high current starting loads for motors.
The wire can actually change length under heavy load. I've seen
insulation rubbed of a wire because of this movement. The OP can
hear the #10 wires jump inside the conduit when his AC unit stars.
When you get your PhD in know-it-allogy, come back and call me names.

TDD- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Go ahead give us the science behind it then?

High current -- wires heat -- heat causes expansion -- expansion
causes movement (not exactly "rattle" perhaps, but insulation sliding
against insulation could probably approximate a squeak)

Am I missing something? What's so hard to understand?

The inductive kick of a high current motor/compressor start can cause
wire inside a metal conduit to make noise. I've heard the telltale
racket a million times in many different settings. It sounds a lot
like somebody shaking a metal fish tape inside an empty conduit.

TDD

On 8/24/2010 3:36 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I'm reminded of a joke, I'm about to make up. Bill Gates, a pollack,
an engineer, and a meterologist are sitting in a room. The one of them
asks if it's raining. Bill Gates whips out a PDA, connects to the
internet, and looks at a radar map. Says it's not raining. The
engineer takes a large piece of plastic. Builds a frame, balance
point, and connects the other end of the support to a reverse reading
mass scale. He extends this out the window. The liner acceleration of
gravitational impulses of descending precipitation are negligible. So,
he concludes it is not raining. The meterologist calls the NOAA phone
number, listens through the recorded message. And concludes it is not
raining. The pollack opens the door, steps outside, and comes back in
wet. He brings back in the engineer's device (which was under the
eaves). Reports that it is raining. The other three gang up and pound
the stuffing out of the pollack, while calling him a liar.

Yeah, I'm sure the wires wiggle. Heck, it only makes sense.


A walking, talking fish is too valuable to beat up.

TDD