I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot be properly capped. Is there some sort of flashing there?

Here is the house:
http://www.dongardner.com/images.asp...ront1.jpg&f =

The leak seems to lead up to the roof where that single 2nd level
window on the main living area is shown in this picture.

On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:
I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

Flashing is an art form. Slapping some roofing cement on what you're
describing is just as likely to trap water and make the leak worse.
If you posted some pictures of your house, not the generic house, and
the specific location where you are having a problem, you'd get more
constructive responses and advice.

R

On Oct 17, 1:07*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:

I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

Flashing is an art form. *Slapping some roofing cement on what you're
describing is just as likely to trap water and make the leak worse.
If you posted some pictures of your house, not the generic house, and
the specific location where you are having a problem, you'd get more
constructive responses and advice.

R

Also consider any plumbing vents. Since it's over a bathroom, it
could be from a vent if there is one there. The rubber boots fail
over time. Why not climb into the attic during a rain and take a
look up there?

On Oct 17, 12:07*am, RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:

I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

Flashing is an art form. *Slapping some roofing cement on what you're
describing is just as likely to trap water and make the leak worse.
If you posted some pictures of your house, not the generic house, and
the specific location where you are having a problem, you'd get more
constructive responses and advice.

R

Your description of the loation of the leak doesn't make any sense. "
single 2nd level
window on the main living area is shown in this picture". There are 3
windows on the 2nd level on the front and one on the side, assuming
that the two-story building in the back is not what you're talking
about. If you have to use a generic photo, put an arrow pointing to
where the leak is!!!

It's the side window -- the "single window on the 2nd level".

Below that window is a bay window that is apart of the bath.

I don't think I can very easily get to that location. I have not
tried yet, but there is not going to be much, if any, headroom in the
attic at that location.

On Oct 17, 9:07*pm, coloradotrout wrote:
It's the side window -- the "single window on the 2nd level".

Below that window is a bay window that is apart of the bath.

Why not post a thumbnail so we could have an even smaller less
detailed picture to guess at?

R

On Oct 17, 10:16*pm, RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 17, 9:07*pm, coloradotrout wrote:

It's the side window -- the "single window on the 2nd level".

Below that window is a bay window that is apart of the bath.

Why not post a thumbnail so we could have an even smaller less
detailed picture to guess at?

R

Agreed, the description from the OP would make more sense if he showed
a photo of what he saw when he looked out the window.

How do I post a photo?

In article , coloradotrout wrote:
How do I post a photo?

http://tinyurl.com/yf2r3jl

You can't. Not here, anyway -- this is a text-only newsgroup.

On Oct 22, 1:06*pm, coloradotrout wrote:
How do I post a photo?

Post the pictures on a free hosting site like Flickr or TinyPic. Then
post the link here with your question.

R

http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.

On Fri, 23 Oct 2009 12:27:34 -0700 (PDT), coloradotrout
wrote:

http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.


For now, tar the nailhead.

Henry's roofing cement (at home depot) ?

or what's the best?

On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 13:11:38 -0700 (PDT), coloradotrout
wrote:

Henry's roofing cement (at home depot) ?

or what's the best?

Bulldog WetStick fibrated roofing cement has always worked for me.

On Oct 24, 10:30*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 13:11:38 -0700 (PDT), coloradotrout

wrote:
Henry's roofing cement (at home depot) ?

or what's the best?

Bulldog WetStick fibrated roofing cement has always worked for me.

Which ones haven't?

R

On Oct 23, 12:27 pm, coloradotrout wrote:
http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.

First, make sure there's some flashing under the siding, and out onto
the shingles. Also, check the step flashing going up that wall to the
right of the window in the photo. I await your response. Tom

On Oct 23, 3:27*pm, coloradotrout wrote:
http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. *About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.

Okay, we got a picture, now all we have to do is get a picture that
actually shows in detail the area in question. You are wasting your
and other people's time by being parsimonious with the required
information. We don't need a picture of your very nice house - we
need a detailed, up close and personal picture of the problem area on
your very nice house. That single nail might be the problem, or you
might have a bigger problem. Without better information from you, you
might be getting a useful response or not - you'll never know, and we
won't either.

Use the zoom on your camera, stick the camera out the window and take
some pictures.

R

On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 22:32:07 -0700 (PDT), tom
wrote:

On Oct 23, 12:27 pm, coloradotrout wrote:
http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.

First, make sure there's some flashing under the siding, and out onto
the shingles. Also, check the step flashing going up that wall to the
right of the window in the photo. I await your response. Tom


If it didn't leak before the flashing is likely OK. The popped nail is
enough to cause a minor leak.

On Oct 25, 10:52*am, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 22:32:07 -0700 (PDT), tom
wrote:

On Oct 23, 12:27 pm, coloradotrout wrote:
http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3

Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. *About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.

First, make sure there's some flashing under the siding, and out onto
the shingles. Also, check the step flashing going up that wall to the
right of the window in the photo. I await your response. *Tom

If it didn't leak before the flashing is likely OK. The popped nail is
enough to cause a minor leak.

Any idea how old this roof may be? I saw nothing about that in his
decription. Another idea may be an improperly installed bathroom vent
exhaust. Tom

House built in 2000, so pretty new..

I just see a small spot on the master bath ceiling that sure looks
like some moisture is getting through the roof.

It rains about 40"/year here, though we had about 10" more this
year.

I will definitely putt some roofing cement over that one nail. The
nail actuall is driven through the top shingle.. or the shingle has
lifted up over the nail. Either way, it cannot be good.

tom wrote:
On Oct 25, 10:52 am, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2009 22:32:07 -0700 (PDT), tom
wrote:

On Oct 23, 12:27 pm, coloradotrout wrote:
http://tinypic.com/m/64p9fo/3
Right at the cursor arrow -- along that top row of shingles against
the dormer wall, there is a nail in the shingle that pushed through
the shingle. About straight below that point -- in the master bath on
the 1st floor -- the ceiling is discoloring.
First, make sure there's some flashing under the siding, and out onto
the shingles. Also, check the step flashing going up that wall to the
right of the window in the photo. I await your response. Tom
If it didn't leak before the flashing is likely OK. The popped nail is
enough to cause a minor leak.

Any idea how old this roof may be? I saw nothing about that in his
decription. Another idea may be an improperly installed bathroom vent
exhaust. Tom

If it is right downhill from the window, the window may be the problem.
Some flashing failure around that (usually at the top), and water could
be running down the wall under the siding beside it, and then down the
roof deck under the shingles. I'd start with a dab of tar on the nail,
just to see if that solves it, but spot leaks like this can be a real
needle in a haystack search.

--
aem sends...

Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

On Oct 27, 11:33*am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. * But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R

RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33 am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R

I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems
the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or
replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it
could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to
warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on
the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good,
steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur
a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down
rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing
when gutters are full or not properly aligned.

On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 09:11:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

On Oct 27, 11:33Â*am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. Â* But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R
If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:54:18 -0400, "
wrote:

RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33 am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R

I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems
the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or
replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it
could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to
warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on
the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good,
steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur
a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down
rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing
when gutters are full or not properly aligned.
Thankfully the rain will only run DOWN, not UP, so it makes it a bit
easier to track down.

On Oct 27, 3:46*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 09:11:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour



wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33*am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. * But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. *It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. *That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. *Pictures with actual information of the problem area.


*If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a
while...? Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to
get up on an icy roof? What's the point of dicking around with a
bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly
is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

Yeah, it would be good. Experienced eyeballs can tell from the
outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside.
And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see
if the bleeding stops.

That's like that doctor in A Civil Action that told the parents to
give the kid with leukemia a couple of aspirin, and the kid died the
next day on the way to the hospital.

R

wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:54:18 -0400, "
wrote:

RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33 am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!
You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R
I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems
the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or
replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it
could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to
warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on
the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good,
steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur
a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down
rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing
when gutters are full or not properly aligned.
Thankfully the rain will only run DOWN, not UP, so it makes it a bit
easier to track down.

If the water runs down a rafter or wiring, it can also go across...BTDT.

On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:16:02 -0400, "
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:54:18 -0400, "
wrote:

RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33 am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!
You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R
I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems
the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or
replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it
could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to
warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on
the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good,
steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur
a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down
rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing
when gutters are full or not properly aligned.
Thankfully the rain will only run DOWN, not UP, so it makes it a bit
easier to track down.

If the water runs down a rafter or wiring, it can also go across...BTDT.
Across yes, up no.

On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:49:50 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

On Oct 27, 3:46Â*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 09:11:19 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour



wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33Â*am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. Â* But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. Â*It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. Â*That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Â*Pictures with actual information of the problem area.


Â*If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a
while...? Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to
get up on an icy roof? What's the point of dicking around with a
bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly
is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

Yeah, it would be good. Experienced eyeballs can tell from the
outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside.
And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see
if the bleeding stops.

The "bandaid" will get him through to spring. Not a good time to do
reroofing right now in LARGE parts of North America. I wouldn't trust
a "fall/winter" roof as much as a "summer" roof - wnter roofs have
problems with tabs not sticking down, among other things.

And that "bandaid" may well last longer than the rest of the roof.
Now, I'd likely PULL the nail before tatting it, or better yet tat it,
knock it down, and tar over it to prevent it becoming a problem again,
without losing the holding power of the nail, however little it was..
I've "patched" a lot of roofs over the years with a dab of bulldog
wetstick or other fibrated plastic roofing cement - and it's still
holding years later when the roof finally requires replacement.

That's like that doctor in A Civil Action that told the parents to
give the kid with leukemia a couple of aspirin, and the kid died the
next day on the way to the hospital.

R

wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 18:16:02 -0400, "
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:54:18 -0400, "
wrote:

RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33 am, coloradotrout wrote:
Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!
You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R
I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems
the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or
replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it
could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to
warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on
the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good,
steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur
a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down
rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing
when gutters are full or not properly aligned.
Thankfully the rain will only run DOWN, not UP, so it makes it a bit
easier to track down.
If the water runs down a rafter or wiring, it can also go across...BTDT.
Across yes, up no.

Do you feel compelled to state the obvious?

On Oct 27, 7:02*pm, wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 3:46*pm, wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33*am, coloradotrout wrote:

Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. * But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. *It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. *That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. *Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

*If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a
while...? *Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to
get up on an icy roof? *What's the point of dicking around with a
bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly
is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

Yeah, it would be good. *Experienced eyeballs can tell from the
outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside.
And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see
if the bleeding stops.

The "bandaid" will get him through to spring. Not a good time to do
reroofing right now in LARGE parts of North America. I wouldn't trust
a "fall/winter" roof as much as a "summer" roof - wnter roofs have
problems with tabs not sticking down, among other things.

And that "bandaid" may well last longer than the rest of the roof.
Now, I'd likely PULL the nail before tatting it, or better yet tat it,
knock it down, and tar over it to prevent it becoming a problem again,
without losing the holding power of the nail, however little it was..
I've "patched" a lot of roofs over the years with a dab of bulldog
wetstick or other fibrated plastic roofing cement - and it's still
holding years later when the roof finally requires replacement.

Just keep digging. Yeah, a dab of roofing cement will outlast a new
roof. Right. I do appreciate that you put patched in quotes, because
we both know it's not a legitimate repair except in remote
circumstances. General roofing rule of thumb is if you see roof
cement up on a roof, or worse yet, on flashing, whoever put the crap
up there was a hack.

A nail that has already lost it's grip won't magically reacquire it
when you swat it with a hammer. Nobody is talking about reroofing,
and patching a roof is not a problem at this time of the year - it's
done all of the time. But when snow and ice build up on the roof, and
that little dab of roof cement turns out to not _quite_ have done the
trick, patching the roof becomes a major PITA. Tabs not sticking is
not a problem - that's one place that a dab or roofing cement will
come in handy and won't be a bandaid.

You're coming up with a whole procedure of how you'd fix it, and you
don't even know what you need to fix. You've stated your guesstimate
case, "put a dab of roofing cement on it, and hope for the best", and
told the guy what he was _hoping_ to hear - that it's no big deal and
a five minute repair. Do you think that's the only nail that has a
problem? Based on what - your gut feeling?

Let's go back to what the OP asked in the beginning, before you side-
tracked him with your, "ah, it's nothing, dab a little roof snot on
the nail."

He wrote:
" What else do I need to look for? How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot be properly capped. Is there some sort of flashing there?"

Those are legitimate questions. Your answers addressed none of
these. To address those questions we need more information, which the
OP was trying to provide until you played on his hopes of it being a
trivial repair. Maybe it is, and maybe it's not, but we need
information to figure out what's going on, not a bandaid "patch" based
on your guesses.

R

On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 16:37:39 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour
wrote:

On Oct 27, 7:02Â*pm, wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 3:46Â*pm, wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33Â*am, coloradotrout wrote:

Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. Â* But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. Â*It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. Â*That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. Â*Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

Â*If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a
while...? Â*Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to
get up on an icy roof? Â*What's the point of dicking around with a
bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly
is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

Yeah, it would be good. Â*Experienced eyeballs can tell from the
outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside.
And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see
if the bleeding stops.

The "bandaid" will get him through to spring. Not a good time to do
reroofing right now in LARGE parts of North America. I wouldn't trust
a "fall/winter" roof as much as a "summer" roof - wnter roofs have
problems with tabs not sticking down, among other things.

And that "bandaid" may well last longer than the rest of the roof.
Now, I'd likely PULL the nail before tatting it, or better yet tat it,
knock it down, and tar over it to prevent it becoming a problem again,
without losing the holding power of the nail, however little it was..
I've "patched" a lot of roofs over the years with a dab of bulldog
wetstick or other fibrated plastic roofing cement - and it's still
holding years later when the roof finally requires replacement.

Just keep digging. Yeah, a dab of roofing cement will outlast a new
roof. Right. I do appreciate that you put patched in quotes, because
we both know it's not a legitimate repair except in remote
circumstances. General roofing rule of thumb is if you see roof
cement up on a roof, or worse yet, on flashing, whoever put the crap
up there was a hack.

A nail that has already lost it's grip won't magically reacquire it
when you swat it with a hammer. Nobody is talking about reroofing,
and patching a roof is not a problem at this time of the year - it's
done all of the time. But when snow and ice build up on the roof, and
that little dab of roof cement turns out to not _quite_ have done the
trick, patching the roof becomes a major PITA. Tabs not sticking is
not a problem - that's one place that a dab or roofing cement will
come in handy and won't be a bandaid.

You're coming up with a whole procedure of how you'd fix it, and you
don't even know what you need to fix. You've stated your guesstimate
case, "put a dab of roofing cement on it, and hope for the best", and
told the guy what he was _hoping_ to hear - that it's no big deal and
a five minute repair. Do you think that's the only nail that has a
problem? Based on what - your gut feeling?

Let's go back to what the OP asked in the beginning, before you side-
tracked him with your, "ah, it's nothing, dab a little roof snot on
the nail."

He wrote:
" What else do I need to look for? How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot be properly capped. Is there some sort of flashing there?"

Those are legitimate questions. Your answers addressed none of
these. To address those questions we need more information, which the
OP was trying to provide until you played on his hopes of it being a
trivial repair. Maybe it is, and maybe it's not, but we need
information to figure out what's going on, not a bandaid "patch" based
on your guesses.

R
You are right - more info required - but the flashing is LIKELY not
the problem as it didn't leak the first couple of years - and the
popped nail WOULD cause a leak. When you hear hoofbeats, think horses,
not wildebeast unless you are on the sarengetti.

De's been told just about everything to check for by the "sky is
falling crew".

Goober the popped nail head and keep checking for the rest.
Absolutely, without question, a popped nail coming through a shingle
WILL leak - so look after that first. (horses)

THEN start looking for Zebras and Wildebeast.

On Oct 27, 10:14*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 27 Oct 2009 16:37:39 -0700 (PDT), RicodJour



wrote:
On Oct 27, 7:02*pm, wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 3:46*pm, wrote:
*RicodJour wrote:
On Oct 27, 11:33*am, coloradotrout wrote:

Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing
into it. * But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in
the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath
will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on
the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. *It might
temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the
leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it
will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really
bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are
heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided
another real estate listing picture. *That is odd since it would be
very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post
them. *Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

*If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to
be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem..

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a
while...? *Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to
get up on an icy roof? *What's the point of dicking around with a
bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly
is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped
- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

Yeah, it would be good. *Experienced eyeballs can tell from the
outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside.
And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see
if the bleeding stops.

The "bandaid" will get him through to spring. Not a good time to do
reroofing right now in LARGE parts of North America. I wouldn't trust
a "fall/winter" roof as much as a "summer" roof - wnter roofs have
problems with tabs not sticking down, among other things.

And that "bandaid" may well last longer than the rest of the roof.
Now, I'd likely PULL the nail before tatting it, or better yet tat it,
knock it down, and tar over it to prevent it becoming a problem again,
without losing the holding power of the nail, however little it was..
I've "patched" a lot of roofs over the years with a dab of bulldog
wetstick or other fibrated plastic roofing cement - and it's still
holding years later when the roof finally requires replacement.

Just keep digging. *Yeah, a dab of roofing cement will outlast a new
roof. *Right. *I do appreciate that you put patched in quotes, because
we both know it's not a legitimate repair except in remote
circumstances. *General roofing rule of thumb is if you see roof
cement up on a roof, or worse yet, on flashing, whoever put the crap
up there was a hack.

A nail that has already lost it's grip won't magically reacquire it
when you swat it with a hammer. *Nobody is talking about reroofing,
and patching a roof is not a problem at this time of the year - it's
done all of the time. *But when snow and ice build up on the roof, and
that little dab of roof cement turns out to not _quite_ have done the
trick, patching the roof becomes a major PITA. *Tabs not sticking is
not a problem - that's one place that a dab or roofing cement will
come in handy and won't be a bandaid.

You're coming up with a whole procedure of how you'd fix it, and you
don't even know what you need to fix. *You've stated your guesstimate
case, "put a dab of roofing cement on it, and hope for the best", and
told the guy what he was _hoping_ to hear - that it's no big deal and
a five minute repair. *Do you think that's the only nail that has *a
problem? *Based on what - your gut feeling?

Let's go back to what the OP asked in the beginning, before you side-
tracked him with your, "ah, it's nothing, dab a little roof snot on
the nail."

He wrote:
" What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?"

Those are legitimate questions. *Your answers addressed none of
these. *To address those questions we need more information, which the
OP was trying to provide until you played on his hopes of it being a
trivial repair. *Maybe it is, and maybe it's not, but we need
information to figure out what's going on, not a bandaid "patch" based
on your guesses.

R

*You are right - more info required - but the flashing is LIKELY not
the problem as it didn't leak the first couple of years - and the
popped nail WOULD cause a leak. When you hear hoofbeats, think horses,
not wildebeast unless you are on the sarengetti.

De's been told just about everything to check for by the "sky is
falling crew".

Goober the popped nail head and keep checking for the rest.
Absolutely, without question, a popped nail coming through a shingle
WILL leak - so look after that first. (horses)

THEN start looking for Zebras and Wildebeast.

I want to see a picture because I have a feeling that the "roofer" put
a cap piece of shingle on top of the flashing and nailed through it.

OP - cough up some more pictures.

R

On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:
I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

I am a professsional roofer located in CT. The leak is probably at
the pitch change between the upper steeply pitched roof and the lower
"moderately" pitched roof. The step flashing in this area is two
small to handle the backwash of the pitch change. We usually cover
the entire lower pitched are with self adhesive ice & water barrier
and install an oversized flashing detail at the pitch change the
covers the last two sourse of the low pitched roof. Good luck!

On Oct 28, 5:30*pm, "
wrote:
On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:

I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

I am a professsional roofer located in CT. *The leak is probably at
the pitch change between the upper steeply pitched roof and the lower
"moderately" pitched roof. *The step flashing in this area is two
small to handle the backwash of the pitch change. *We usually cover
the entire lower pitched are with self adhesive ice & water barrier
and install an oversized flashing detail at the pitch change the
covers the last two sourse of the low pitched roof. *Good luck!

I don't know about that. It's possible, but the OP's sorry picture
has the arrow pointing to a spot that's a distance away from the step
flashing on the pitched part of the roof running along that wall, and
under the window. There's no up-slope area, just the wall and
window. We need better pictures! Coloradotrout, provide them
forthwith!

R

On Oct 28, 5:30*pm, "
wrote:
On Oct 17, 12:46*am, coloradotrout wrote:

I must have a small roof leak in my 1.5 story, 2 dormer, roof.

There is a small darkening spot, about 6" in diameter, on our 1st
level bathroom. *It's about right at the point where the 1.5 story
dormer meets the roofline. *From that bedroom I looked out onto the
roof and see the shingles as they come up to the roof nailed at the
very top where the roof meets the dormer. *The top row of shingles are
nailed and the nails are exposed. *One nail in particular seems to
have broken through the shingle. *I'm thinking I need to start there
and somehow seal that nail. *How should I do that?

What else do I need to look for? * How should the roof shingles as
they meet the dormer walls be installed? *It just seems like that is a
leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it
cannot *be properly capped. *Is there some sort of flashing there?

I am a professsional roofer located in CT. *The leak is probably at
the pitch change between the upper steeply pitched roof and the lower
"moderately" pitched roof. *The step flashing in this area is two
small to handle the backwash of the pitch change. *We usually cover
the entire lower pitched are with self adhesive ice & water barrier
and install an oversized flashing detail at the pitch change the
covers the last two sourse of the low pitched roof. *Good luck!

I don't know about that. It's possible, but the OP's sorry picture
has the arrow pointing to a spot that's a distance away from the step
flashing on the pitched part of the roof running along that wall, and
under the window. There's no up-slope area, just the wall and
window. We need better pictures! Coloradotrout, provide them
forthwith!

R

Ok.. got some pics..

http://tinypic.com/3ia2f08y

Most of them are taken below the window which is nearly above the area
that is leaking into the bathroom below. Some, however, are taken in
other areas of the roof to give you a general idea of the roof and
roofing work that was done. I see flashing pretty much everywhere.
But I also see a lot of exposed nail heads on the ridges and along the
top where the shingles meet the dormers.

My apologies -- I sorely lack the proper vocabulary on this topic.

On the first row of images..
image 1 is the upper left-hand corner of that window -- above the trip
seems pretty well caulked, but what I show here is the gap between
face of the window and the trim
image 2 , 3, and 4 are just other areas of the roof to give an idea of
the condition -- they are in fact along the front of the house whereas
the trouble spot seems to be along the side of the house

On the 2nd row..
image 1 is that sunken nail head that is nearly directly above the
leak on the 1st level bathroom
image 2 , 3, and 4 are in the area where the cursor is for the last
image showing a couple shots of the surrounding area

Hope this helps.

I really cannot find something that stands out. All those exposed
nail heads really bug me. If that nail extends down into the roof --
which of course it must -- that has to be a leak potential.