My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

On Nov 26, 6:06 pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

That's the way it is in my county.. No exceptions. At least if you
want to call it finished living space. There's probably no reason you
can't put a couch and a big screen TV in a "storage room".

On Nov 26, 6:06�pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. �I find this hard to
believe. �Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

very likely, for escape in a fire. thats what egreess ingress windows
are for. good news once you add the extra access space can be called a
bedroom.

this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

On 11/26/2007 5:24 PM, The Reverend Natural Light wrote:
On Nov 26, 6:06 pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

That's the way it is in my county.. No exceptions. At least if you
want to call it finished living space. There's probably no reason you
can't put a couch and a big screen TV in a "storage room".


When did this ridiculous rule get passed? All new houses have to have 2
stairways from the basement?

On 11/26/2007 5:26 PM, wrote:
On Nov 26, 6:06�pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. �I find this hard to
believe. �Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

very likely, for escape in a fire. thats what egreess ingress windows
are for. good news once you add the extra access space can be called a
bedroom.

this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off the
ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

"Jeef" wrote in message
...
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel his
basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J


Maybe. How does that county define "auxiliary exit"?

When your brother called the county office, what did they tell him?

Oh...wait. He didn't call. He wants to get this information from you, who
got it from a newsgroup.

"Jeef" wrote in message
...
On 11/26/2007 5:26 PM, wrote:
On Nov 26, 6:06?pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. ?I find this hard to
believe. ?Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

very likely, for escape in a fire. thats what egreess ingress windows
are for. good news once you add the extra access space can be called a
bedroom.

this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off the
ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

You have basement bedroom windows, which are 30 feet off the ground?

Jeef wrote:
this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off
the ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

Rope ladder.

wrote:
On Nov 26, 6:06�pm, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't
remodel his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. �I find
this hard to believe. �Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

very likely, for escape in a fire. thats what egreess ingress windows
are for. good news once you add the extra access space can be called a
bedroom.

and likely pay the increased property tax due to the increased
valuation of your home.




this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

On Nov 26, 7:19 pm, "HeyBub" wrote:
Jeef wrote:
this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off
the ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

Rope ladder.

Codes Are Online, for Chicago for Rentals two points can be a seperate
area, for residential I do not know but for a house it should be less
stringent for fixing up. I think you have leeway, try a different
inspectors idea.

"Jeef" wrote in message
this rule has spread across the US after so many died in basement
fires, Its a excellent rule

How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off the
ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

At 30 feet, the firemen can put a ladder or you can just jump. They also
make rope ladders you can drop out a window.

At 8 feet below grade and having a heater, maybe an oil tank near you, the
risk is greater. Statistically speaking, basement fires are ranked #1 or
#2. Kitchen fires are right up there also. Am I over reacting? Many years
ago my brother accidentally started a fire in our basement. He had an exit
by a door, no one injured.
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

Here's from the 2000 IRC, the 2006 is roughly the same.



SECTION R310

EMERGENCY ESCAPE AND RESCUE OPENINGS

R310.1 Emergency escape and rescue required. Basements

with habitable space and every sleeping room shall have at least

one openable emergency escape and rescue windowor exterior

door opening for emergency escape and rescue. Where openings

are provided as a means of escape and rescue they shall

have a sill height of not more than 44 inches (1118 mm) above

the floor. Where a door opening having a threshold below the

adjacent ground elevation serves as an emergency escape and

rescue opening and is provided with a bulkhead enclosure, the

bulkhead enclosure shall comply with Section R310.3. The net

clear opening dimensions required by this section shall be obtained

by the normal operation of the window or door opening

from the inside. Escape and rescue windowopenings with a finished

sill height below the adjacent ground elevation shall be

provided with a window well in accordance with Section

R310.2.

R310.1.1 Minimum opening area. All emergency escape

and rescue openings shall have a minimum net clear opening

of 5.7 square feet (0.530 m2).

Exception: Grade floor openings shall have a minimum

net clear opening of 5 square feet (0.465 m2).

R310.1.2 Minimum opening height. The minimum net

clear opening height shall be 24 inches (610 mm).

R310.1.3 Minimum opening width. The minimum net

clear opening width shall be 20 inches (508 mm).

R310.1.4 Operational constraints. Emergency escape and

rescue openings shall be operational from the inside of the

room without the use of keys or tools.

R310.2Window wells.Window wells required for emergency

escape and rescue shall have horizontal dimensions that allow

the door or window of the emergency escape and rescue opening

to be fully opened. The horizontal dimensions of the window

well shall provide a minimum net clear area of 9 square

feet (0.84m2) with a minimum horizontal projection and width

of 36 inches (914 mm).

Exception: The ladder or steps required by Section

R310.2.1 shall be permitted to encroach a maximum of 6

inches (152 mm) into the required dimensions of the window

well.

R310.2.1 Ladder and steps.Window wells with a vertical

depth greater than 44 inches (1118 mm) below the adjacent

ground level shall be equipped with a permanently affixed

ladder or steps usable with the window in the fully open position.

Ladders or steps required by this section shall not be

required to comply with Sections R314 and R315. Ladders

or rungs shall have an inside width of at least 12 inches (305

mm), shall project at least 3 inches (76 mm) from the wall

and shall be spaced not more than 18 inches (457 mm) on

center vertically for the full height of the window well.

R310.3 Bulkhead enclosures. Bulkhead enclosures shall provide

direct access to the basement. The bulkhead enclosure

with the door panels in the fully open position shall provide the

minimum net clear opening required by Section R310.1.1.

Bulkhead enclosures shall also comply with Section R314.9.

R310.4 Bars, grills, covers and screens. Bars, grills, covers,

screens or similar devices are permitted to be placed over emergency

escape and rescue openings, bulkhead enclosures, or

windowwells that serve such openings, provided the minimum

net clear opening size complies with Sections R310.1.1 to

R310.1.3, and such devices shall be releasable or removable

from the inside without the use of a key, tool or force greater

than that which is required for normal operation of the escape

and rescue opening.

"Jeef" wrote in message
...
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel his
basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

On Nov 26, 10:20�pm, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:06:31 -0600, Jeef wrote:
My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. �I find this hard to
believe. �Can anyone confirm this?

TIA, J

Would a sprinkler system soften that rule? Your insurance company
might give you a discount that would pay for it in a couple years. I
put one in my Md house because I had a couple choke points near the
utilities that scared me. The parts were actually pretty cheap.

I dubt a sprinkler would help, and in any case getting out, and
firemen getting in is job one

On Nov 27, 5:33 pm, "Cshenk" wrote:
"cp" wrote

NO. Only if the space is used as living space, then there must be other
means of egress. Stairs/windows/door......pick your choice. I believe
windows have to be no more than 4 ft. off the ground, and at least
2'x4'.... I'm sure someone will come along and give the exact sizing, but
that figure is stuck in my head for some reason.

Matches my memory but may not be that exact number of inches. I remember it
as 'suitable for a person of 4ft5in to be able to egress without having to
drag any furniture over. A built in sort of window-seat was acceptable in
1972-4 in VA. There is also a memory of having to have that window-seat
able to hold up to 300lbs or something like that. Window-seat could not be
obstructed (like, used to hold a 70 gallon fish tank).

Oh! The window size obviously had to be big enough *and* on the other side,
there had to be some way to get down savely to ground level. Since on the
outside this window we adapted wasnt but a foot above ground level, it was
not an issue. We couldnt have any plants though that would block egress.
Inspector quibbled over the tulips but we won that one. We'd have lost had
it been a rose bush I think?

Let's see...Code requires a platform so a 4' 5" person can egress and
the platform has to support 300 lbs.

How many 300 lb 4' 5" people do you know? ;-)

On Nov 27, 6:10 pm, "Cshenk" wrote:
"DerbyDad03" wrote

as 'suitable for a person of 4ft5in to be able to egress without having
to
drag any furniture over. A built in sort of window-seat was acceptable
in
able to hold up to 300lbs or something like that. Window-seat could not
be
obstructed (like, used to hold a 70 gallon fish tank).
Let's see...Code requires a platform so a 4' 5" person can egress and
the platform has to support 300 lbs.

How many 300 lb 4' 5" people do you know? ;-)

Grin, it does look funny. Its actually 2 separate issues there. 1 was the
height and the 'other' was the load bearing as our window was high enough it
couldnt count as an egress without the 'built in step' (window-seat in our
case).

Think of it as a kid and his mother trying to escape. The kid is 4ft5in and
the momma is pregnant with another one g.

Yeah...I considered the whole fireman's carry thing and all that, but
the visual of a 300 lb 4' 5" escapee was just to much to pass up. g

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
Yeah...I considered the whole fireman's carry thing and all that, but
the visual of a 300 lb 4' 5" escapee was just to much to pass up. g

Does the code state "must be large enough for a big ball to roll through"?

"Jeef" wrote

My brother lives in Waukesha County, Wisc and told me he can't remodel
his basement without putting in an auxiliary exit. I find this hard to
believe. Can anyone confirm this?

When did this ridiculous rule get passed? All new houses have to have 2
stairways from the basement?

Actually if you check, it probably says '2 exits' as in your first query.
One can probably be a window if it's of a certain size and and can be
reached by something built in to use as an exit in an emegency.

Emergency exit would be the reason and quite common to require such. An
older house may not have it but to officially 'upgrade' you have to add
them. That said, it depends on what he means by 'remodel his basement' as
to how far he needs to go.

When redoing a basement once in Virginia, we didnt have to knock any holes
as the back side had several windows within codespc for exits. We did have
to replace one of them so it could be flipped out but that was due to the
huge size of the basement (1,800sqft). Center had staircase to main house,
far back corner had exterior ground level door, and we added the escapable
window along the far back furthest from the door. Built a little 'window
seat' under it (opened for storage) that made that wndow reachable for
egress for a 4.5ft tall person (VA Code then). Using the existing posts, we
separated that far side with the window from stairwell to wall into 3 rooms
and an ajacent bathroom. False walls i guess you would call them as we
didnt mess with the existing posts, just framed around them and left
doorways (2 per room). The 3rd room was a sortof 1 room apartment with
egress on one side to the huge pool table room (had 2 doors to the huge
family room where the window was) and egress on the other side to the rest
of the unfinished basement where the exterior door was. The under stairwell
was made into a walk in closet, and a wall conjoined the bathroom
(mini-kitchen on that wall and sink, bathroom on other side with shower and
a toilet with a sink in the top tank such as you see in Japan).

They made us change one thing for code. We had to add more lights in the
unfinished part as it was now an egress point. We didnt have a wall switch
on the 'bedroom side' so added some lights then put in one of those battery
charger types that go on in a power outage but keep charging when power is
on. Neat huh! Now, we had to go that far because we were truely
'renovating' and clearly making a true 'living space'.

"cp" wrote in message
...

"Jeef" wrote

When did this ridiculous rule get passed?

To be on the conservative side, I'd say it's been this way for at least 25
years.

All new houses have to have 2 stairways from the basement?

NO. Only if the space is used as living space, then there must be other
means of egress. Stairs/windows/door......pick your choice. I believe
windows have to be no more than 4 ft. off the ground, and at least
2'x4'.... I'm sure someone will come along and give the exact sizing, but
that figure is stuck in my head for some reason.

"cp" wrote
NO. Only if the space is used as living space, then there must be other
means of egress. Stairs/windows/door......pick your choice. I believe
windows have to be no more than 4 ft. off the ground, and at least
2'x4'.... I'm sure someone will come along and give the exact sizing, but
that figure is stuck in my head for some reason.

Matches my memory but may not be that exact number of inches. I remember it
as 'suitable for a person of 4ft5in to be able to egress without having to
drag any furniture over. A built in sort of window-seat was acceptable in
1972-4 in VA. There is also a memory of having to have that window-seat
able to hold up to 300lbs or something like that. Window-seat could not be
obstructed (like, used to hold a 70 gallon fish tank).

Oh! The window size obviously had to be big enough *and* on the other side,
there had to be some way to get down savely to ground level. Since on the
outside this window we adapted wasnt but a foot above ground level, it was
not an issue. We couldnt have any plants though that would block egress.
Inspector quibbled over the tulips but we won that one. We'd have lost had
it been a rose bush I think?

"Jeef" wrote
How do I get out of my bedroom? All I have are windows 30 feet off the
ground. This safety culture is making me ill.

Grin, you get a buy-off on older constuction and there are special rules for
2nd floor and above.

How much remodeling is your brother thinking of? That will narrow down
what's needed. BTW, being to 'code' is a big issue on house sales. I can
not technically sell my house as a 4BR because the 4th one is an enclosed
porch and isnt code spec for bedroom. Close but not quite. Issues are
insulation and window type (plexiglass single pane) as well as the floor has
to be raised 1 inch.

"DerbyDad03" wrote
as 'suitable for a person of 4ft5in to be able to egress without having
to
drag any furniture over. A built in sort of window-seat was acceptable
in

able to hold up to 300lbs or something like that. Window-seat could not
be
obstructed (like, used to hold a 70 gallon fish tank).

Let's see...Code requires a platform so a 4' 5" person can egress and
the platform has to support 300 lbs.

How many 300 lb 4' 5" people do you know? ;-)

Grin, it does look funny. Its actually 2 separate issues there. 1 was the
height and the 'other' was the load bearing as our window was high enough it
couldnt count as an egress without the 'built in step' (window-seat in our
case).

Think of it as a kid and his mother trying to escape. The kid is 4ft5in and
the momma is pregnant with another one g.